Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Doug Franklin]

On 2010-03-31 17:32, John Sessoms wrote:

From: Doug Franklin

On 2010-03-30 12:30, John Sessoms wrote:

> From: Doug Franklin

>> On 2010-03-30 2:32, P. J. Alling wrote:

>>> > I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year
and at

>>> least

>>> > 60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily

>>> changing

>>> > Atlanta into LA East.

>>
>> And don't forget the rust-belters trying to turn it into Detroit
South
>> and the nor'easters who'd rather it were Bahston or New Yawk south.

>
> Atlanta doesn't need outside help for screwing up traffic.


Who said anything about traffic? Not that one couldn't ... :-) But
we've got plenty of local talent for screwing up traffic without
blaming the transplants.


That's what I said.


It's all the other stuff.  Like, can you believe it, there are places in 
Atlanta now that serve /unsweetened/ iced tea by default!?  Holy crap. 
That's like Mint Julep without the Mint! :-)


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: Doug Franklin

On 2010-03-30 12:30, John Sessoms wrote:

> From: Doug Franklin

>> On 2010-03-30 2:32, P. J. Alling wrote:

>>> > I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at

>>> least

>>> > 60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily

>>> changing

>>> > Atlanta into LA East.

>>
>> And don't forget the rust-belters trying to turn it into Detroit South
>> and the nor'easters who'd rather it were Bahston or New Yawk south.

>
> Atlanta doesn't need outside help for screwing up traffic.


Who said anything about traffic?  Not that one couldn't ...  :-)   But 
we've got plenty of local talent for screwing up traffic without blaming 
the transplants.


That's what I said.

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Doug Franklin]

On 2010-03-30 12:30, John Sessoms wrote:

From: Doug Franklin

On 2010-03-30 2:32, P. J. Alling wrote:

> I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at
least
> 60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily
changing
> Atlanta into LA East.


And don't forget the rust-belters trying to turn it into Detroit South
and the nor'easters who'd rather it were Bahston or New Yawk south.


Atlanta doesn't need outside help for screwing up traffic.


Who said anything about traffic?  Not that one couldn't ... :-)  But 
we've got plenty of local talent for screwing up traffic without blaming 
the transplants.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/30/2010 11:30 AM, John Sessoms wrote:

From: Doug Franklin

On 2010-03-30 2:32, P. J. Alling wrote:
> I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at 
least
> 60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily 
changing

> Atlanta into LA East.


And don't forget the rust-belters trying to turn it into Detroit 
South and the nor'easters who'd rather it were Bahston or New Yawk 
south.


Atlanta doesn't need outside help for screwing up traffic.

One of the few natives I knew there once told me, "All the bad drivers 
in the world have come to Atlanta, not that the ones that were here were 
any good to begin with."


I once saw a one vehicle rollover happen at approximately 12mph on I 
285. Now that takes talent!


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: Doug Franklin

On 2010-03-30 2:32, P. J. Alling wrote:

> I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at least
> 60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily changing
> Atlanta into LA East.


And don't forget the rust-belters trying to turn it into Detroit South 
and the nor'easters who'd rather it were Bahston or New Yawk south.


Atlanta doesn't need outside help for screwing up traffic.

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Doug Franklin]

On 2010-03-30 2:32, P. J. Alling wrote:


I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at least
60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily changing
Atlanta into LA East.


And don't forget the rust-belters trying to turn it into Detroit South 
and the nor'easters who'd rather it were Bahston or New Yawk south.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Madame RD]

Le 30/03/10 07:42, Larry Colen a écrit :


I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at 
least 60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily 
changing Atlanta into LA East.



yeah, but how many of them actually grew up, much less were born here?





--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est


the same can be said  of Parisians : most of us were born somewhere else 
. :-)))
There are very few Paris -born parisians and most people saying they're 
from Paris actually live in the suburbs   ... lol ..



by the way , parisian waiters in the cafés were born surly  and are 
unpleasant to us too .


dominique



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Larry Colen]

On Mar 29, 2010, at 11:32 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:


On 3/30/2010 12:24 AM, Larry Colen wrote:


On Mar 28, 2010, at 4:36 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:


On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face  
and no expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent,  
perhaps?


We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more  
than our share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t  
love me back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it  
weren't for Californians...


It's not the Californians, it's all the foreigners who moved here  
from points east.



--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est


I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at  
least 60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily  
changing Atlanta into LA East.


yeah, but how many of them actually grew up, much less were born here?





--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/30/2010 12:24 AM, Larry Colen wrote:


On Mar 28, 2010, at 4:36 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:


On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and 
no expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than 
our share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love 
me back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it 
weren't for Californians...


It's not the Californians, it's all the foreigners who moved here from 
points east.



--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est


I wish that were true, but I lived in Atlanta GA for a year and at least 
60% of the people I met there were Californian refugees busily changing 
Atlanta into LA East.











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\viewkind4\uc1\pard\f0\fs20 I've just upgraded to Thunderbird 3.0 and the 
interface subtly weird.\par
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Larry Colen]

On Mar 28, 2010, at 4:36 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:


On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and  
no expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than  
our share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love  
me back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it  
weren't for Californians...


It's not the Californians, it's all the foreigners who moved here from  
points east.



--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Larry Colen]

On Mar 27, 2010, at 10:18 AM, Bob W wrote:

Nevertheless, even if Londoners are occasionally a little terse with  
their
guests, please be assured that you are all honoured and very  
welcome. I'm
sure the Parisians (and indeed New Yorkers) feel the same way, and  
my own

experiences of Parisians have been generally positive.


I live in one of those vacation destination areas.  When I was a kid a  
popular bumper sticker in our area was the terse and to the point:

Tourists Suck

Another popular one is
Why do they call it tourist season if we can't shoot them?

I appreciate that there is lovely scenery along our roads. I also  
understand that if you are used to roads that measure miles per turn  
rather than turns per mile, ours can be a bit intimidating. But,  
Please, use the pullouts and let the folks who use these roads for  
transportation get to where we need to go.


As an aside, the rudest people on the road, when it comes to pulling  
over and letting traffic by, without a doubt, worse than drivers of  
Priuses or Volvos, are the Harley riders, just a bunch of wanking MBAs  
playing dressup.



--
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bran Everseeking]

On Mon, 29 Mar 2010 15:29:42 -0500
"P. J. Alling"  wrote:

> > Goddam hippy - get your hair cut!
> >
> 
> What hair?

the odd long one in the left nostril 

-- 
"Love" is that condition in which the happiness of another person is
essential to your own... Jealousy is a disease, love is a healthy
condition.- Robert Heinlein

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/29/2010 2:09 PM, Bob W wrote:
   

As I lived there for 14 years, and a PDMLer, I guess yes.
   

California is
 

definitely different.
   

Lived there 1967 to 1976. Speaks volumes about me!

 

Goddam hippy - get your hair cut!
   


What hair?




   



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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> >As I lived there for 14 years, and a PDMLer, I guess yes. 
> California is 
> >definitely different.
> 
> Lived there 1967 to 1976. Speaks volumes about me!
> 

Goddam hippy - get your hair cut!



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

I lived in LA for most of a year, I never found a person who could 
manage a conversation that wasn't about themselves, or a driver who knew 
the rules of the road in their own state, (though truth to tell, any 
place that /allows/ Motorcycles make a third lane between cars stopped 
in traffic, probably doesn't have any reason to expect drivers to care).


On 3/29/2010 11:26 AM, John Mullan wrote:
As I lived there for 14 years, and a PDMLer, I guess yes. California 
is definitely different.


--
From: "paul stenquist" 
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:07 PM
To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation



On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:57 PM, John Mullan wrote:

California is like a box of cereal.  Take out the fruits and the 
nuts and you still have the flakes.


Tired old joke. Are you including our numerous California PDML 
members in that cereal box?

Paul


--
From: "P. J. Alling" 
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 7:36 PM
To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation


On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face 
and no expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more 
than our share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love 
me back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it 
weren't for Californians...


--
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Cotty]

On 29/3/10, John Mullan, discombobulated, unleashed:

>As I lived there for 14 years, and a PDMLer, I guess yes. California is
>definitely different.

Lived there 1967 to 1976. Speaks volumes about me!

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  Cotty


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--  http://www.cottysnaps.com
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Keith Whaley]

John Mullan wrote:
As I lived there for 14 years, and a PDMLer, I guess yes. California is 
definitely different.


--
From: "paul stenquist" 
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:07 PM
To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation



On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:57 PM, John Mullan wrote:

California is like a box of cereal.  Take out the fruits and the nuts 
and you still have the flakes.


Tired old joke. Are you including our numerous California PDML members 
in that cereal box?

Paul


I've lived in California since 1958, and am quite fond of it.
It didn't start going to hell until some 5 years after I arrived. So, I can't 
claim I had anything to do with it becoming overtly liberalized and such...


Nevertheless, some darned fine folks live here, just like almost every other 
place, if you have the time to root them out. 


keith whaley
--


--
From: "P. J. Alling" 
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 7:36 PM
To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation


On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and 
no expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than 
our share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn�t love 
me back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it 
weren't for Californians...




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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Mullan]

As I lived there for 14 years, and a PDMLer, I guess yes. California is 
definitely different.


--
From: "paul stenquist" 
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 9:07 PM
To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation



On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:57 PM, John Mullan wrote:

California is like a box of cereal.  Take out the fruits and the nuts and 
you still have the flakes.


Tired old joke. Are you including our numerous California PDML members in 
that cereal box?

Paul


--
From: "P. J. Alling" 
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 7:36 PM
To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation


On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than our 
share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me 
back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it 
weren't for Californians...


--
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Courier New;}}
\viewkind4\uc1\pard\f0\fs20 I've just upgraded to Thunderbird 3.0 and 
the interface subtly weird.\par

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:57 PM, John Mullan wrote:

> California is like a box of cereal.  Take out the fruits and the nuts and you 
> still have the flakes.

Tired old joke. Are you including our numerous California PDML members in that 
cereal box?
Paul
> 
> --
> From: "P. J. Alling" 
> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 7:36 PM
> To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
> Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation
> 
>> On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:
>>> P N Stenquist wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
>>>> expectations of problems.
>>>> 
>>>> Paul
>>> 
>>> Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?
>>> 
>>> We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than our 
>>> share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.
>>> 
>>> Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me 
>>> back...
>>> 
>>> keith
>>> 
>>> 
>> Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it weren't 
>> for Californians...
>> 
>> -- 
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>> Courier New;}}
>> \viewkind4\uc1\pard\f0\fs20 I've just upgraded to Thunderbird 3.0 and the 
>> interface subtly weird.\par
>> }
>> 
>> 
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Mullan]

California is like a box of cereal.  Take out the fruits and the nuts and 
you still have the flakes.


--
From: "P. J. Alling" 
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 7:36 PM
To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation


On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than our 
share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me 
back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it weren't 
for Californians...


--
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Courier New;}}
\viewkind4\uc1\pard\f0\fs20 I've just upgraded to Thunderbird 3.0 and the 
interface subtly weird.\par

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 28, 2010, at 7:36 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:

> On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:
>> P N Stenquist wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
>>> expectations of problems.
>>> 
>>> Paul
>> 
>> Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?
>> 
>> We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than our 
>> share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.
>> 
>> Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me back...
>> 
>> keith
>> 
>> 
> Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it weren't for 
> Californians...
> 
I guess I'm a misfit. I like California as well. Spent most of my summers in 
Santa Monica for a dozen years or more. Good times.
Paul

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/28/2010 3:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than 
our share of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me 
back...


keith


Paris is like California, which would be a wonderful place, if it 
weren't for Californians...


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[drd1135]

My friend(who is a very experienced traveller) went to Barcelona on a pleasure 
and was stunned at how bad she was treated. I kept sendind her useful phrases 
by email such as "if I wanted this treatment I would have gone to Paris". This 
surprised me as she is very interested in and respectful of other cultures. 
-Original Message-
From: paul stenquist 
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 16:40:38 
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation


On Mar 28, 2010, at 4:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

> P N Stenquist wrote:
> 
> 
>> Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
>> expectations of problems.
>> Paul
> 
> Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

No. I speak American English. Politely.
Paul
> 
> We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than our share 
> of surly waiters and counter help here and there.
> 
> Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me back...
> 
> keith
> 
> 
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 28, 2010, at 4:05 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

> P N Stenquist wrote:
> 
> 
>> Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
>> expectations of problems.
>> Paul
> 
> Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

No. I speak American English. Politely.
Paul
> 
> We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than our share 
> of surly waiters and counter help here and there.
> 
> Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me back...
> 
> keith
> 
> 
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Keith Whaley]

P N Stenquist wrote:


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
expectations of problems.


Paul


Do you speak any French? Or English with a Canadian accent, perhaps?

We never expect or anticipate problems, but have run into more than our share 
of surly waiters and counter help here and there.


Just my run of luck, I guess... I love Paris, it just doesn‘t love me back...

keith


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Keith Whaley]

William Robb wrote:


- Original Message - From: "David Parsons" Subject: Re: question 
for the brits American to English translation



That has been my experience in NYC, very nice people and willing to
give directions if you ask, even the Subway attendants.


If you want to visit a rude city, apparently Toronto is a good pick.

William Robb



I suspect that's because it's on the wrong (north) side of Lake Erie! 

keith  <=== born and raised east of Cleveland, along the lake...

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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> 
> That has been my experience in NYC, very nice people and willing to
> give directions if you ask, even the Subway attendants.
> 
> 
> If you want to visit a rude city, apparently Toronto is a good pick.
> 

You should visit Phuc Hu sometime...



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[William Robb]

- Original Message - 
From: "David Parsons" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation



That has been my experience in NYC, very nice people and willing to
give directions if you ask, even the Subway attendants.


If you want to visit a rude city, apparently Toronto is a good pick.

William Robb

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[David Parsons]

That has been my experience in NYC, very nice people and willing to
give directions if you ask, even the Subway attendants.

On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 9:00 PM, paul stenquist  wrote:

> As a former New Yorker, I have to say that the folks in the big city  are 
> generally very friendly and will go out of their way to help tourists if they 
> recognize the need. Unfortunately, New York spins at 100 mph, so they rarely 
> recognize the need.  With elbow to elbow subways, a shortage of cabs, 
> sidewalk traffic jams and the demands of daily life, it's tough for the 
> locals to keep up . New Yorkers aren't rude, they're just busy. The upside of 
> New York is the white noise of human existence. It has a way of keeping one 
> sane -- believe it or not.
>
> Paul
>> On the other hand, our visits in London were generally positive and a lot of 
>> fun. We know folks all over the Isles, including Wales and Scotland, and get 
>> along with them very well.
>>
>> The only time I ever felt Parisians were helpful or even recognized we were 
>> alive, is when we had our 16-year-old daughter with us. She was an attentive 
>> 3rd year French language student, being taught by a Parisian citizen. So, 
>> she knew the language reasonably well and spoke it with the proper accent.
>>
>> THEN they smiled at us! When they deigned to look at us at all...
>>
>> None of our family are stereo-typical Americans, loud, brash in manner or 
>> dress, or demanding in demeanor. Long time travelers, we are respectful, 
>> quiet and usually quite easy going.
>>
>> As such, we find those who act as tho’ we ARE undesirable or otherwise 
>> gauche travelers, more than a bit puzzling...
>>
>> 2 1/2 trips in Paris without our daughter confirms our opinion.
>>
>> Best,  keith
>>
>>
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob Sullivan]

I have to be fair.  My wife and 25 year old daughter went to Paris
with an old sorority sister of my wife's.  Nobody spoke French but
everyone was very cordial to them.  They were quite pleased.  They
came back singing the praises of the Parisians.
Regards,  Bob S.

On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 6:39 PM, Keith Whaley  wrote:
> Bob W wrote:

 Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous photo
 ops, and, for the most part, nice people.   Paul
>
>>> Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?
>
>> These things are probably all relative. I know some non-Parisian French
>> people who think that Parisians are so far up their own culs they can see
>> the Eiffel Tower from above.
>
> My wife and I talked, in soft-spoken English, to a number of French folks
> all over the countryside, south and east of Paris, who felt exactly that
> way. Even THEY were treated as 2nd class citizens and frequently snubbed by
> Parisians.
>
>> However, as a Londoner who sometimes has to
>> struggle to get through the tourist crowds, I can certainly sympathise if
>> a
>> Parisian is occasionally, er, more assertive shall we say than the tourist
>> is used to. Especially when faced with crowds of Italian schoolkids
>> blocking
>> a doorway or standing fifteen deep right at the foot of a crowded
>> escalator...
>
> Yessir, I tried to take that into account.
>
>> Nevertheless, even if Londoners are occasionally a little terse with their
>> guests, please be assured that you are all honoured and very welcome. I'm
>> sure the Parisians (and indeed New Yorkers) feel the same way, and my own
>> experiences of Parisians have been generally positive.
>>
>> Bob
>
> Good for you, Bob.
>
> To be fair, we sometimes feel the same way about New Yorkers, and sometimes
> even those in downtown Boston, for that matter!
> On the other hand, our visits in London were generally positive and a lot of
> fun. We know folks all over the Isles, including Wales and Scotland, and get
> along with them very well.
>
> The only time I ever felt Parisians were helpful or even recognized we were
> alive, is when we had our 16-year-old daughter with us. She was an attentive
> 3rd year French language student, being taught by a Parisian citizen. So,
> she knew the language reasonably well and spoke it with the proper accent.
>
> THEN they smiled at us! When they deigned to look at us at all...
>
> None of our family are stereo-typical Americans, loud, brash in manner or
> dress, or demanding in demeanor. Long time travelers, we are respectful,
> quiet and usually quite easy going.
>
> As such, we find those who act as tho’ we ARE undesirable or otherwise
> gauche travelers, more than a bit puzzling...
>
> 2 1/2 trips in Paris without our daughter confirms our opinion.
>
> Best,  keith
>
>
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 27, 2010, at 7:39 PM, Keith Whaley wrote:

> Bob W wrote:
 Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous photo 
 ops, and, for the most part, nice people.   Paul
> 
>>> Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?
> 
>> These things are probably all relative. I know some non-Parisian French
>> people who think that Parisians are so far up their own culs they can see
>> the Eiffel Tower from above. 
> 
> My wife and I talked, in soft-spoken English, to a number of French folks all 
> over the countryside, south and east of Paris, who felt exactly that way. 
> Even THEY were treated as 2nd class citizens and frequently snubbed by 
> Parisians.
> 
>> However, as a Londoner who sometimes has to
>> struggle to get through the tourist crowds, I can certainly sympathise if a
>> Parisian is occasionally, er, more assertive shall we say than the tourist
>> is used to. Especially when faced with crowds of Italian schoolkids blocking
>> a doorway or standing fifteen deep right at the foot of a crowded
>> escalator...
> 
> Yessir, I tried to take that into account.
> 
>> Nevertheless, even if Londoners are occasionally a little terse with their
>> guests, please be assured that you are all honoured and very welcome. I'm
>> sure the Parisians (and indeed New Yorkers) feel the same way, and my own
>> experiences of Parisians have been generally positive.
>> Bob
> 
> Good for you, Bob.
> 
> To be fair, we sometimes feel the same way about New Yorkers, and sometimes 
> even those in downtown Boston, for that matter!

As a former New Yorker, I have to say that the folks in the big city  are 
generally very friendly and will go out of their way to help tourists if they 
recognize the need. Unfortunately, New York spins at 100 mph, so they rarely 
recognize the need.  With elbow to elbow subways, a shortage of cabs, sidewalk 
traffic jams and the demands of daily life, it's tough for the locals to keep 
up . New Yorkers aren't rude, they're just busy. The upside of New York is the 
white noise of human existence. It has a way of keeping one sane -- believe it 
or not.

Paul
> On the other hand, our visits in London were generally positive and a lot of 
> fun. We know folks all over the Isles, including Wales and Scotland, and get 
> along with them very well.
> 
> The only time I ever felt Parisians were helpful or even recognized we were 
> alive, is when we had our 16-year-old daughter with us. She was an attentive 
> 3rd year French language student, being taught by a Parisian citizen. So, she 
> knew the language reasonably well and spoke it with the proper accent.
> 
> THEN they smiled at us! When they deigned to look at us at all...
> 
> None of our family are stereo-typical Americans, loud, brash in manner or 
> dress, or demanding in demeanor. Long time travelers, we are respectful, 
> quiet and usually quite easy going.
> 
> As such, we find those who act as tho’ we ARE undesirable or otherwise gauche 
> travelers, more than a bit puzzling...
> 
> 2 1/2 trips in Paris without our daughter confirms our opinion.
> 
> Best,  keith
> 
> 
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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> >> I've shot a lot of people on the street and have experienced fewer 
> >> problems over there than  right here in Michigan.
> >
> > MARK!
> 
> In France the tend to not shoot back.
> 

They shrug their shoulders, say "Bof!" and the bullet falls to the ground
through the force of their disdain.



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Keith Whaley]

Bob W wrote:
Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, 
fabulous photo ops, and, for the most part, nice people.   Paul



Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?



These things are probably all relative. I know some non-Parisian French
people who think that Parisians are so far up their own culs they can see
the Eiffel Tower from above. 


My wife and I talked, in soft-spoken English, to a number of French folks all 
over the countryside, south and east of Paris, who felt exactly that way. Even 
THEY were treated as 2nd class citizens and frequently snubbed by Parisians.



However, as a Londoner who sometimes has to
struggle to get through the tourist crowds, I can certainly sympathise if a
Parisian is occasionally, er, more assertive shall we say than the tourist
is used to. Especially when faced with crowds of Italian schoolkids blocking
a doorway or standing fifteen deep right at the foot of a crowded
escalator...


Yessir, I tried to take that into account.


Nevertheless, even if Londoners are occasionally a little terse with their
guests, please be assured that you are all honoured and very welcome. I'm
sure the Parisians (and indeed New Yorkers) feel the same way, and my own
experiences of Parisians have been generally positive.

Bob


Good for you, Bob.

To be fair, we sometimes feel the same way about New Yorkers, and sometimes 
even those in downtown Boston, for that matter!
On the other hand, our visits in London were generally positive and a lot of 
fun. We know folks all over the Isles, including Wales and Scotland, and get 
along with them very well.


The only time I ever felt Parisians were helpful or even recognized we were 
alive, is when we had our 16-year-old daughter with us. She was an attentive 
3rd year French language student, being taught by a Parisian citizen. So, she 
knew the language reasonably well and spoke it with the proper accent.


THEN they smiled at us! When they deigned to look at us at all...

None of our family are stereo-typical Americans, loud, brash in manner or 
dress, or demanding in demeanor. Long time travelers, we are respectful, quiet 
and usually quite easy going.


As such, we find those who act as tho’ we ARE undesirable or otherwise gauche 
travelers, more than a bit puzzling...


2 1/2 trips in Paris without our daughter confirms our opinion.

Best,  keith


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/27/2010 5:49 PM, Ken Waller wrote:
I've shot a lot of people on the street and have experienced fewer 
problems over there than  right here in Michigan.


MARK!


In France the tend to not shoot back.



Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - From: "P N Stenquist" 



Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation




On Mar 27, 2010, at 8:20 AM, Keith Whaley wrote:


paul stenquist wrote:

[...]

Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous  
photo ops,

and, for the most part, nice people. Paul


Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?
keith


I've always enjoyed Paris. I love a good meal, and I've found that  
when I show interest in a Paris restaurant's offerings, the wait  
people are usually very anxious to please. I've shot a lot of people  
on the street and have experienced fewer problems over there than  
right here in Michigan. I shot one couple at an outdoor cafe, and 
they  invited me to join them for a beer. The employees of my former 
company  who I worked with there were always pleased to work with me 
and my  associates. They were good collaborators.


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
expectations of problems.


Paul






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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Ken Waller]

I've shot a lot of people on the street and have experienced fewer problems 
over there than  right here in Michigan.


MARK!

Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - 
From: "P N Stenquist" 


Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation




On Mar 27, 2010, at 8:20 AM, Keith Whaley wrote:


paul stenquist wrote:

[...]

Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous  photo 
ops,

and, for the most part, nice people. Paul


Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?
keith


I've always enjoyed Paris. I love a good meal, and I've found that  when I 
show interest in a Paris restaurant's offerings, the wait  people are 
usually very anxious to please. I've shot a lot of people  on the street 
and have experienced fewer problems over there than  right here in 
Michigan. I shot one couple at an outdoor cafe, and they  invited me to 
join them for a beer. The employees of my former company  who I worked 
with there were always pleased to work with me and my  associates. They 
were good collaborators.


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no 
expectations of problems.


Paul



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Ken Waller]

Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - 
From: "Keith Whaley" 


Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation



paul stenquist wrote:

[...]

Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous photo 
ops,

and, for the most part, nice people. Paul


Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?


Must mean Paris Kentucky.



keith



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P N Stenquist]

On Mar 27, 2010, at 8:20 AM, Keith Whaley wrote:


paul stenquist wrote:

[...]

Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous  
photo ops,

and, for the most part, nice people. Paul


Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?
keith


I've always enjoyed Paris. I love a good meal, and I've found that  
when I show interest in a Paris restaurant's offerings, the wait  
people are usually very anxious to please. I've shot a lot of people  
on the street and have experienced fewer problems over there than  
right here in Michigan. I shot one couple at an outdoor cafe, and they  
invited me to join them for a beer. The employees of my former company  
who I worked with there were always pleased to work with me and my  
associates. They were good collaborators.


Perhaps it works for me, because I go with a smile on  my face and no  
expectations of problems.


Paul







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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> 
> > Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, 
> fabulous photo 
> > ops, and, for the most part, nice people. Paul
> 
> Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?
> 

These things are probably all relative. I know some non-Parisian French
people who think that Parisians are so far up their own culs they can see
the Eiffel Tower from above. However, as a Londoner who sometimes has to
struggle to get through the tourist crowds, I can certainly sympathise if a
Parisian is occasionally, er, more assertive shall we say than the tourist
is used to. Especially when faced with crowds of Italian schoolkids blocking
a doorway or standing fifteen deep right at the foot of a crowded
escalator...

Nevertheless, even if Londoners are occasionally a little terse with their
guests, please be assured that you are all honoured and very welcome. I'm
sure the Parisians (and indeed New Yorkers) feel the same way, and my own
experiences of Parisians have been generally positive.

Bob



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Keith Whaley]

paul stenquist wrote:

[...]


Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous photo ops,
and, for the most part, nice people. Paul


Uhhh, nice people? Which Paris is that, Paul?

keith



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[eckinator]

2010/3/26 mike wilson :
>
>  Bob W  wrote:
>> > >> I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy
>> > >> cobbles.  But you don't have to go quickly for things to be
>> > >> scary. http://wimp.com/scarytrail
>> > >
>> > >That ain't scary at all. THIS is scary!
>> > >
>> > >http://www.wimp.com/balancingrubiks/
>> >
>> > Um yes. But scary in a very different way.
>> >
>>
>> Bet she can't do it naked.
>
> I can watch it naked.  How scary is that?

good enough to keep me chaste for a week =P
cheers
ecke

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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[mike wilson]

 Bob W  wrote: 
> > >> I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy 
> > >> cobbles.  But you don't have to go quickly for things to be 
> > >> scary. http://wimp.com/scarytrail
> > >
> > >That ain't scary at all. THIS is scary!
> > >
> > >http://www.wimp.com/balancingrubiks/
> > 
> > Um yes. But scary in a very different way.
> > 
> 
> Bet she can't do it naked.

I can watch it naked.  How scary is that?

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[David Mann]

On Mar 26, 2010, at 5:06 AM, mike wilson wrote:
> I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy cobbles.  
> But you don't have to go quickly for things to be scary.
> http://wimp.com/scarytrail

And here I was thinking you were training for the Paris-Roubaix.

Dave
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/25/2010 4:02 PM, Bob W wrote:

I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy
cobbles.  But you don't have to go quickly for things to be
scary. http://wimp.com/scarytrail
 

That ain't scary at all. THIS is scary!

http://www.wimp.com/balancingrubiks/
   

Um yes. But scary in a very different way.

 

Bet she can't do it naked.
   


Bet she can, but you won't get to see it.




   



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{\rtf1\ansi\ansicpg1252\deff0\deflang1033{\fonttbl{\f0\fnil\fcharset0 Courier 
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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> >> I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy 
> >> cobbles.  But you don't have to go quickly for things to be 
> >> scary. http://wimp.com/scarytrail
> >
> >That ain't scary at all. THIS is scary!
> >
> >http://www.wimp.com/balancingrubiks/
> 
> Um yes. But scary in a very different way.
> 

Bet she can't do it naked.



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Mark Roberts]

John Sessoms wrote:

>From: mike wilson
>> 
>> I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy
>> cobbles.  But you don't have to go quickly for things to be
>> scary. http://wimp.com/scarytrail
>
>That ain't scary at all. THIS is scary!
>
>http://www.wimp.com/balancingrubiks/

Um yes. But scary in a very different way.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: mike wilson

 Mark Roberts  wrote:

Christian Skofteland wrote:


On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 07:22:46PM -, Bob W wrote:


The real question is why would you want
to go to France ?


http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris



Cool ride, but you know damn well if I tried
something like that, we'd be segueing into a thread
about the cooking in FRENCH JAILS.


I forwarded this to a few friends, one of whom replied
with an explanation.

I thought it was a motor bike, but apparently it was a
Ferrari 275 gtb fitted with a gyro-stabilised camera on
the bumper and driven by a F1 driver, whose name has
never been revealed by the director, Lelouch.

Apparently Lelouch was arrested when the film was first
shown in public.

No roads were closed, the driver ran a lot of red lights,
nearly hit a lot of pedestrians, and drove the wrong way
up a lot of one-way streets.

So nothing special for France in the 1970s.


Almost but not quite.  "A photo has surfaced that seems to
reveal an Eclair cam-flex 35mm camera with a wide angle lens,
and a typical "speed rail" hard mount - no gyros - on a
Mercedes... A making-of-the-rendezvous documentary indicates
that Lelouch himself was the driver, that the car driven was
the Mercedes, although the sound track is from a Ferrari."


Definitely dubbed engine sounds and tire squeals. And I don't
think the top speed was anywhere near some of the 200kph people
have speculated. The very low camera position exaggerates the
speed and it still doesn't look very fast to me. Find a copy of
"Pascal's Ride on La Peripherique" for comparison.


I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy
cobbles.  But you don't have to go quickly for things to be
scary. http://wimp.com/scarytrail


That ain't scary at all. THIS is scary!

http://www.wimp.com/balancingrubiks/

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[mike wilson]

 Mark Roberts  wrote: 
> Christian Skofteland wrote:
> 
> >On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 07:22:46PM -, Bob W wrote:
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> >> > > 
> >> > > http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
> >> > 
> >> > Cool ride, but you know damn well if I tried something like 
> >> > that, we'd be segueing into a thread about the cooking in 
> >> > FRENCH JAILS.
> >> 
> >> I forwarded this to a few friends, one of whom replied with an 
> >> explanation. 
> >> 
> >> I thought it was a motor bike, but apparently it was a Ferrari 275 gtb
> >> fitted with a gyro-stabilised camera on the bumper and driven by a F1
> >> driver, whose name has never been revealed by the director, Lelouch. 
> >> 
> >> Apparently Lelouch was arrested when the film was first shown in public. 
> >> 
> >> No roads were closed, the driver ran a lot of red lights, nearly hit a lot
> >> of pedestrians, and drove the wrong way up a lot of one-way streets. 
> >> 
> >> So nothing special for France in the 1970s.
> >
> >Almost but not quite.  "A photo has surfaced that seems to reveal an Eclair 
> >cam-flex 35mm camera with a wide angle lens, and a typical "speed rail" hard 
> >mount - no gyros - on a Mercedes... A making-of-the-rendezvous documentary 
> >indicates that Lelouch himself was the driver, that the car driven was the 
> >Mercedes, although the sound track is from a Ferrari."
> 
> Definitely dubbed engine sounds and tire squeals. And I don't think
> the top speed was anywhere near some of the 200kph people have
> speculated. The very low camera position exaggerates the speed and it
> still doesn't look very fast to me. Find a copy of "Pascal's Ride on
> La Peripherique" for comparison.

I wouldn't fancy doing it on a bike because of the lovely, greasy cobbles.  But 
you don't have to go quickly for things to be scary.
http://wimp.com/scarytrail

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Boris Liberman]

Don't take our little Mediterranean country out of your list ;-).

> Same reason I would want to go to the UK or Italy or Spain or Germany or
> wherever ... to find out what the local booze is like.

-- 
Boris

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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Coyle]

I'd prefer:
Dieu, il est fou!

Or
Crazy brave.


John in Brisbane




-Original Message-
From: pdml-boun...@pdml.net [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of
eckinator
Sent: Wednesday, 24 March 2010 8:05 PM
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation

2010/3/24 Cotty :
> On 23/3/10, Larry Colen, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>> The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
>>
>>http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
>
> Formidable!!!
>
> Encore!!!
>
> --
>
>
> Cheers,
>  Cotty
>
>
> ___/\__
> ||   (O)  |     People, Places, Pastiche
> --      http://www.cottysnaps.com
> _
>
>
>
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follow the directions.
>

midsummer night dawn ride... but I doubt Claude Lelouch has been
anywhere near it - fun to watch and I do hope (and seriously doubt)
there were safety precautions

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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> >>Or try "Climb Dance" not for the speed but for the sheer insanity of
> >the drive
> >>up Pike's Peak in a Group B rally car.
> >>http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3368948773832597270#
> >
> >Nice but I prefer Paris, I mean where you gonna stop for a coffee up 
> >Pike's Peak??
> 
> Surely there's a Starbuck's up there now?
> 

Probably a drive-thru. Even if it didn't start out that way.



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: Cotty

On 24/3/10, Christian Skofteland, discombobulated, unleashed:


>Or try "Climb Dance" not for the speed but for the sheer insanity of

the drive

>up Pike's Peak in a Group B rally car.
>http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3368948773832597270#


Nice but I prefer Paris, I mean where you gonna stop for a coffee up
Pike's Peak??


38.920966,-105.025554

38.875379,-105.072996

38.841334,-105.042199



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: Mark Roberts

Mark Roberts wrote:



>Definitely dubbed engine sounds and tire squeals. And I don't think
>the top speed was anywhere near some of the 200kph people have
>speculated. The very low camera position exaggerates the speed and it
>still doesn't look very fast to me. Find a copy of "Pascal's Ride on
>La Peripherique" for comparison.



Here you go:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5610091068213003526#



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvLtNBm1yyA

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Mark Roberts]

Cotty wrote:

>On 24/3/10, Christian Skofteland, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>Or try "Climb Dance" not for the speed but for the sheer insanity of
>the drive
>>up Pike's Peak in a Group B rally car.
>>http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3368948773832597270#
>
>Nice but I prefer Paris, I mean where you gonna stop for a coffee up
>Pike's Peak??

Surely there's a Starbuck's up there now?


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Cotty]

On 24/3/10, Christian Skofteland, discombobulated, unleashed:

>Or try "Climb Dance" not for the speed but for the sheer insanity of
the drive
>up Pike's Peak in a Group B rally car.
>http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3368948773832597270#

Nice but I prefer Paris, I mean where you gonna stop for a coffee up
Pike's Peak??

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  Cotty


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--  http://www.cottysnaps.com
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Christian Skofteland]

On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 04:07:12PM -0400, Mark Roberts wrote:
> Christian Skofteland wrote:
> 
> >Almost but not quite.  "A photo has surfaced that seems to reveal an Eclair 
> >cam-flex 35mm camera with a wide angle lens, and a typical "speed rail" hard 
> >mount - no gyros - on a Mercedes... A making-of-the-rendezvous documentary 
> >indicates that Lelouch himself was the driver, that the car driven was the 
> >Mercedes, although the sound track is from a Ferrari."
> 
> Definitely dubbed engine sounds and tire squeals. And I don't think
> the top speed was anywhere near some of the 200kph people have
> speculated. The very low camera position exaggerates the speed and it
> still doesn't look very fast to me. Find a copy of "Pascal's Ride on
> La Peripherique" for comparison.
> 

Or try "Climb Dance" not for the speed but for the sheer insanity of the drive
up Pike's Peak in a Group B rally car.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3368948773832597270#
-- 

Christian
-
http://404notfound.blogspot.com
http://birdofthemoment.blogspot.com


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Doug Franklin]

On 2010-03-24 5:25, Cotty wrote:


When you visit France, double your life insurance - at least your mrs
can benefit..;-)


Don't have a Mrs.  So they'd be indirectly contributing to the NRA. :-)

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Mark Roberts]

Mark Roberts wrote:


>Definitely dubbed engine sounds and tire squeals. And I don't think
>the top speed was anywhere near some of the 200kph people have
>speculated. The very low camera position exaggerates the speed and it
>still doesn't look very fast to me. Find a copy of "Pascal's Ride on
>La Peripherique" for comparison.


Here you go:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5610091068213003526#


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Mark Roberts]

Christian Skofteland wrote:

>On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 07:22:46PM -, Bob W wrote:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
>> > > 
>> > > http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
>> > 
>> > Cool ride, but you know damn well if I tried something like 
>> > that, we'd be segueing into a thread about the cooking in 
>> > FRENCH JAILS.
>> 
>> I forwarded this to a few friends, one of whom replied with an explanation. 
>> 
>> I thought it was a motor bike, but apparently it was a Ferrari 275 gtb
>> fitted with a gyro-stabilised camera on the bumper and driven by a F1
>> driver, whose name has never been revealed by the director, Lelouch. 
>> 
>> Apparently Lelouch was arrested when the film was first shown in public. 
>> 
>> No roads were closed, the driver ran a lot of red lights, nearly hit a lot
>> of pedestrians, and drove the wrong way up a lot of one-way streets. 
>> 
>> So nothing special for France in the 1970s.
>
>Almost but not quite.  "A photo has surfaced that seems to reveal an Eclair 
>cam-flex 35mm camera with a wide angle lens, and a typical "speed rail" hard 
>mount - no gyros - on a Mercedes... A making-of-the-rendezvous documentary 
>indicates that Lelouch himself was the driver, that the car driven was the 
>Mercedes, although the sound track is from a Ferrari."

Definitely dubbed engine sounds and tire squeals. And I don't think
the top speed was anywhere near some of the 200kph people have
speculated. The very low camera position exaggerates the speed and it
still doesn't look very fast to me. Find a copy of "Pascal's Ride on
La Peripherique" for comparison.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Christian Skofteland]

On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 07:22:46PM -, Bob W wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> > > 
> > > http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
> > 
> > Cool ride, but you know damn well if I tried something like 
> > that, we'd be segueing into a thread about the cooking in 
> > FRENCH JAILS.
> 
> I forwarded this to a few friends, one of whom replied with an explanation. 
> 
> I thought it was a motor bike, but apparently it was a Ferrari 275 gtb
> fitted with a gyro-stabilised camera on the bumper and driven by a F1
> driver, whose name has never been revealed by the director, Lelouch. 
> 
> Apparently Lelouch was arrested when the film was first shown in public. 
> 
> No roads were closed, the driver ran a lot of red lights, nearly hit a lot
> of pedestrians, and drove the wrong way up a lot of one-way streets. 
> 
> So nothing special for France in the 1970s.

Almost but not quite.  "A photo has surfaced that seems to reveal an Eclair 
cam-flex 35mm camera with a wide angle lens, and a typical "speed rail" hard 
mount - no gyros - on a Mercedes... A making-of-the-rendezvous documentary 
indicates that Lelouch himself was the driver, that the car driven was the 
Mercedes, although the sound track is from a Ferrari."
-- 

Christian
-
http://404notfound.blogspot.com
http://birdofthemoment.blogspot.com


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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> > > 
> > > Why would I want to order "steak" in France? I can get "steak" at 
> > > Golden Corral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's 
> > > going to be just like home? If I want "just like home", I 
> might as 
> > > well STAY home.
> > > 
> > > If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I 
> don't mean 
> > > fries, freedom or otherwise.
> > 
> > Steack frites is the most French of all possible meals - it is the 
> > most popular meal in France, and is as much their national dish as 
> > Chicken Tikka Masala is the British national dish.
> > 
> > However, I do agree with you. I rarely (!) eat steak. The only time 
> > I've ever had steak and chips in France was in 1976 when I worked 
> > there on a building site. We used to go out drinking and would 
> > routinely finish up at the market on the docks at about 4am 
> where we'd 
> > get an enormous steak with several piles of chips the size 
> of the great pyramid of Giza. Great times.
> > What I remember about the steaks was that despite being effectively 
> > raw, they were incredibly tender and easy to eat, like 
> fillet steak, 
> > with a really good flavour.
> > 
> > A French friend hosted a dinner party on Saturday at which we had 
> > Salade Lyonnaise, Beef Bourguignon, a selection of French 
> cheeses plus 
> > English Cheddar, and a clafoutis (which I'd never had 
> before). That's 
> > the kind of food to eat!
> 
> You won't need a headstone; just turn your liver on its end 
> and hammer it into the ground.

The Wellcome Museum has asked me to donate all my internal organs to them.




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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> > > >
> > > > The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> > > 
> > > http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
> > > 
> > 
> > He must have really been pedalling!
> 
> Not really.  Sound track doesn't match the video.  Switch it 
> off and see how fast it appears then.  There are places where 
> the car sounds like it is at peak revs in top but is doing 
> 60-70mph. Allegedly done in either a DS or diesel Merc, 
> rather than the suggested Ferrari.

I paused the video and that showed that he wasn't moving at all!



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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> >> >
> >> > The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> > 
> > http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
> 
> Cool ride, but you know damn well if I tried something like 
> that, we'd be segueing into a thread about the cooking in 
> FRENCH JAILS.

I forwarded this to a few friends, one of whom replied with an explanation. 

I thought it was a motor bike, but apparently it was a Ferrari 275 gtb
fitted with a gyro-stabilised camera on the bumper and driven by a F1
driver, whose name has never been revealed by the director, Lelouch. 

Apparently Lelouch was arrested when the film was first shown in public. 

No roads were closed, the driver ran a lot of red lights, nearly hit a lot
of pedestrians, and drove the wrong way up a lot of one-way streets. 

So nothing special for France in the 1970s.





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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/24/2010 1:42 PM, John Sessoms wrote:

From: eckinator

2010/3/24 Cotty :

> On 24/3/10, eckinator, discombobulated, unleashed:
>

>>fun to watch and I do hope (and seriously doubt)
>>there were safety precautions

>
> Sounds like the engine was rev-limited to about 7,200 rpm


I'd have probably taken 7K as an educated guess but how do you come
out at 7,200?
TIA Ecke


It's because 43% of statistics on the internet are made up on the spot.


The RPM of an engine isn't a statistic...

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: eckinator

2010/3/24 Cotty :

> On 24/3/10, eckinator, discombobulated, unleashed:
>

>>fun to watch and I do hope (and seriously doubt)
>>there were safety precautions

>
> Sounds like the engine was rev-limited to about 7,200 rpm


I'd have probably taken 7K as an educated guess but how do you come
out at 7,200?
TIA Ecke


It's because 43% of statistics on the internet are made up on the spot.

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: Larry Colen

On Mar 23, 2010, at 8:47 PM, Ken Waller wrote:


>
> Kenneth Waller
> http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller
>
> - Original Message - From: "John Sessoms" 
> >

> Subject: RE: question for the brits American to English translation
> rral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's going to be  
> just like home? If I want "just like home", I might as well STAY home.

>>
>> If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I don't  
>> mean fries, freedom or otherwise.

>
> The real question is why would you want to go to France ?


http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris


Cool ride, but you know damn well if I tried something like that, we'd 
be segueing into a thread about the cooking in FRENCH JAILS.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Sessoms]

From: "Ken Waller"
From: "John Sessoms" 


> Why would I want to order "steak" in France? I can get "steak" at Golden 
> Corral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's going to be 
> just like home? If I want "just like home", I might as well STAY home.

>
> If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I don't mean 
> fries, freedom or otherwise.


The real question is why would you want to go to France ?


Same reason I would want to go to the UK or Italy or Spain or Germany or 
wherever ... to find out what the local booze is like.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Charles Robinson]

On Mar 24, 2010, at 10:40, mike wilson wrote:

> 
>  Bob W  wrote: 
 
 The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
>>> 
>>> http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
>>> 
>> 
>> He must have really been pedalling!
> 
> Not really.  Sound track doesn't match the video.  Switch it off and see how 
> fast it appears then.  There are places where the car sounds like it is at 
> peak revs in top but is doing 60-70mph. Allegedly done in either a DS or 
> diesel Merc, rather than the suggested Ferrari.
> 

Plenty of information and speculation here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C'était_un_rendez-vous

 -Charles

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/24/2010 1:52 AM, Brian Walters wrote:

On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 21:45 -0700, "Larry Colen"  wrote:
   

On Mar 23, 2010, at 10:38 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:

 
   

The real question is why would you want to go to France ?


 

Naked young women sunning themselves on the fantails of cigarette
boats.
   

Back to crumpets again?

 

No, no.  In this context 'crumpet' is both singular and plural.
   


As an aside, you can actually see the same thing in Florida, but you 
have to be out of sight of land.





Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/


   

For a thread with such amazing topic drift, it's impressive how it
keeps coming back to home.
 





   



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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[mike wilson]

 Bob W  wrote: 
> > >
> > > The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> > 
> > http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
> > 
> 
> He must have really been pedalling!

Not really.  Sound track doesn't match the video.  Switch it off and see how 
fast it appears then.  There are places where the car sounds like it is at peak 
revs in top but is doing 60-70mph. Allegedly done in either a DS or diesel 
Merc, rather than the suggested Ferrari.

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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[mike wilson]

 Bob W  wrote: 
> > 
> > Why would I want to order "steak" in France? I can get 
> > "steak" at Golden 
> > Corral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's 
> > going to be 
> > just like home? If I want "just like home", I might as well STAY home.
> > 
> > If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I don't mean 
> > fries, freedom or otherwise.
> 
> Steack frites is the most French of all possible meals - it is the most
> popular meal in France, and is as much their national dish as Chicken Tikka
> Masala is the British national dish.
> 
> However, I do agree with you. I rarely (!) eat steak. The only time I've
> ever had steak and chips in France was in 1976 when I worked there on a
> building site. We used to go out drinking and would routinely finish up at
> the market on the docks at about 4am where we'd get an enormous steak with
> several piles of chips the size of the great pyramid of Giza. Great times.
> What I remember about the steaks was that despite being effectively raw,
> they were incredibly tender and easy to eat, like fillet steak, with a
> really good flavour.
> 
> A French friend hosted a dinner party on Saturday at which we had Salade
> Lyonnaise, Beef Bourguignon, a selection of French cheeses plus English
> Cheddar, and a clafoutis (which I'd never had before). That's the kind of
> food to eat!

You won't need a headstone; just turn your liver on its end and hammer it into 
the ground.

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Cotty]

On 24/3/10, eckinator, discombobulated, unleashed:

>I'd have probably taken 7K as an educated guess but how do you come
>out at 7,200?

You're missing the point ;-)

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[eckinator]

2010/3/24 Cotty :
> On 24/3/10, eckinator, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>fun to watch and I do hope (and seriously doubt)
>>there were safety precautions
>
> Sounds like the engine was rev-limited to about 7,200 rpm

I'd have probably taken 7K as an educated guess but how do you come
out at 7,200?
TIA Ecke

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Cotty]

On 24/3/10, eckinator, discombobulated, unleashed:

>fun to watch and I do hope (and seriously doubt)
>there were safety precautions

Sounds like the engine was rev-limited to about 7,200 rpm

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[eckinator]

2010/3/24 Cotty :
> On 23/3/10, Larry Colen, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>> The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
>>
>>http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
>
> Formidable!!!
>
> Encore!!!
>
> --
>
>
> Cheers,
>  Cotty
>
>
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> _
>
>
>
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>

midsummer night dawn ride... but I doubt Claude Lelouch has been
anywhere near it - fun to watch and I do hope (and seriously doubt)
there were safety precautions

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Cotty]

On 23/3/10, Larry Colen, discombobulated, unleashed:

>> The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
>
>http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris

Formidable!!!

Encore!!!

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Cotty]

On 23/3/10, Doug Franklin, discombobulated, unleashed:

>Just because someone has a chef's had doesn't mean
>they get to dictate to me what I eat.

When you visit France, double your life insurance - at least your mrs
can benefit..;-)

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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> >
> > The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> 
> http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris
> 

He must have really been pedalling!



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Joseph McAllister]

Yes...   That's it.   Mad Cow, and an end of the workday Scotch and a  
Cigar...


On Mar 23, 2010, at 12:15 , David Parsons wrote:


Boston Legal?

On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Joseph McAllister  
 wrote:
I think they've become traumatized by outbreaks of "Mad Cow"  
disease. But
look at Will Shatner. On TV*, he extols it as a better way of  
coping with

the day's tribulations.

:-)

* at the moment, I cannot recall the name of the series, tho I  
watched it

religiously for years.

On Mar 23, 2010, at 11:45 , P. J. Alling wrote:


What I find frightening is that she had to sign a release...

On 3/23/2010 8:03 AM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote:


A few years back we spent two weeks in Scandinavia.  My wife got  
tired
of fish every day (I didn't -- certainly not with the quality of  
fish

served there).  She found a restaurant that served "American style
steaks."  She had to sign a release to get it done "rare," and even
then it wasn't anything close to a rare steak in New York.

Dan

On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Brian Walters>

 wrote:


On Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:44 -0600, "William Robb"
wrote:

Some friends of ours had relatives over from England a while  
back. They

made
the tragic error of taking them to one of our finer steak houses.
Apparently they sent their steak back several times to get it  
cooked

more,
the vegetables were not cooked enough and who the heck eats corn
anyway?
They didn't think much of the baked potatos either.


Well I understand their pain when it comes to the steak.

I've stopped ordering steak when I go to a restaurant.  I'm a  
philistine
who like steak well done (ie. not a pink morsel anywhere).  I  
think

that's a task beyond the ability of most chefs.



Joseph McAllister
pentax...@mac.com

“ The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.”
— Kevan Olesen


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Brian Walters]

On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 21:45 -0700, "Larry Colen"  wrote:
> 
> On Mar 23, 2010, at 10:38 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:
> 
> >>>
> >>
> >> The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> >>
> >>
> > Naked young women sunning themselves on the fantails of cigarette  
> > boats.
> 
> Back to crumpets again?
> 

No, no.  In this context 'crumpet' is both singular and plural.



Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/


> For a thread with such amazing topic drift, it's impressive how it  
> keeps coming back to home.





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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/23/2010 11:45 PM, Larry Colen wrote:


On Mar 23, 2010, at 10:38 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:





The real question is why would you want to go to France ?



Naked young women sunning themselves on the fantails of cigarette boats.


Back to crumpets again?

For a thread with such amazing topic drift, it's impressive how it 
keeps coming back to home.


--
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I try my best.

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Larry Colen]

On Mar 23, 2010, at 10:38 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:





The real question is why would you want to go to France ?


Naked young women sunning themselves on the fantails of cigarette  
boats.


Back to crumpets again?

For a thread with such amazing topic drift, it's impressive how it  
keeps coming back to home.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

On 3/23/2010 10:47 PM, Ken Waller wrote:


Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - From: "John Sessoms" 
Subject: RE: question for the brits American to English translation



From: "Bob W"

This thread reminded me of some advice I gave to a friend who
> was going to Europe for the first time:
>
> It is important to realize that in a foreign country, people may 
not > understand your meaning, even if they do speak English.  
There are > certain American expressions that can not 
understandably be translated > into any European language, 
including the varieties of English spoken > in the UK and Ireland.  
Some examples:

>


Isn't the point of going abroad to experience the differences? The 
English
are terrible for this, going to a foreign country and demanding that 
it be

exactly the same as Scunthorpe.


>
> Crispy bacon strips.


Pancetta. You can buy crispy bacon strips in Marks & Spencer.


> Eggs over easy (or sunny side up)


We can probably cook it - we just can't ever remember what it means.


> Rare steak (or a rare hamburger)


These are the ways steak can be cooked in France:

Bleu - the beast's heart is still beating
Saignant - bleeding
A point - pink in the middle
Bien cuit - well done. You may be deported if you ask for this
Americain - any restaurant that's prepared to do this to a steak 
does not

deserve your custom



Why would I want to order "steak" in France? I can get "steak" at 
Golden Corral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's 
going to be just like home? If I want "just like home", I might as 
well STAY home.


If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I don't mean 
fries, freedom or otherwise.


The real question is why would you want to go to France ?



Naked young women sunning themselves on the fantails of cigarette boats.

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Larry Colen]

On Mar 23, 2010, at 8:47 PM, Ken Waller wrote:



Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - From: "John Sessoms" >

Subject: RE: question for the brits American to English translation
rral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's going to be  
just like home? If I want "just like home", I might as well STAY home.


If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I don't  
mean fries, freedom or otherwise.


The real question is why would you want to go to France ?


http://bil-tv.23video.com/video/551798/rendezvous-in-paris


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 23, 2010, at 11:42 PM, Larry Colen wrote:

> 
> On Mar 23, 2010, at 6:43 PM, paul stenquist wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On Mar 23, 2010, at 9:43 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:
>> 
>>> Ah, yes the ol' "Black and Blue".
>>> 
>> The best to be sure. But you need a hellaciously hot fire. I can only get 
>> deep brown and red on my gas grill. Charcoal gives one a fighting chance.
>> 
>> I made some tri-tip steaks tonight. That's poor man's steak. But they were 
>> quite good, grilled rapidly and rare with plenty of salt and pepper. They 
>> don't look good: wrong shape for a steak. And they usually have a bit of 
>> gristle somewhere. But they're well marbled and tender. A bargain at around 
>> $3 a pound.
> 
> 
> Tri-tip is actually a roast.  It's also a regional cut of meat.  Zab wanted 
> to make tri-tip for her dad when she visited last summer and was dismayed to 
> find that it wasn't in the local store.  Many places sell it as, IIRC, bottom 
> sirloin.
> 
> --
Tri-tip is a part of the animal, and like rib, sirloin or round, it can be cut 
as a roast or a steak. Tri-tip steak is rather good, and a tremendous value.
Paul
> Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 23, 2010, at 11:47 PM, Ken Waller wrote:

> 
> Kenneth Waller
> http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller
> 
> - Original Message - From: "John Sessoms" 
> Subject: RE: question for the brits American to English translation
> 
> 
>> From: "Bob W"
>>>> This thread reminded me of some advice I gave to a friend who
>>>> > was going to Europe for the first time:
>>>> >
>>>> > It is important to realize that in a foreign country, people may not > 
>>>> > understand your meaning, even if they do speak English.  There are > 
>>>> > certain American expressions that can not understandably be translated > 
>>>> > into any European language, including the varieties of English spoken > 
>>>> > in the UK and Ireland.  Some examples:
>>>> >
>>> 
>>> Isn't the point of going abroad to experience the differences? The English
>>> are terrible for this, going to a foreign country and demanding that it be
>>> exactly the same as Scunthorpe.
>>> 
>>>> >
>>>> > Crispy bacon strips.
>>> 
>>> Pancetta. You can buy crispy bacon strips in Marks & Spencer.
>>> 
>>>> > Eggs over easy (or sunny side up)
>>> 
>>> We can probably cook it - we just can't ever remember what it means.
>>> 
>>>> > Rare steak (or a rare hamburger)
>>> 
>>> These are the ways steak can be cooked in France:
>>> 
>>> Bleu - the beast's heart is still beating
>>> Saignant - bleeding
>>> A point - pink in the middle
>>> Bien cuit - well done. You may be deported if you ask for this
>>> Americain - any restaurant that's prepared to do this to a steak does not
>>> deserve your custom
>>> 
>> 
>> Why would I want to order "steak" in France? I can get "steak" at Golden 
>> Corral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's going to be just 
>> like home? If I want "just like home", I might as well STAY home.
>> 
>> If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I don't mean fries, 
>> freedom or otherwise.
> 
> The real question is why would you want to go to France ?
> 
Paris is probably my favorite big city. Wonderful food, fabulous photo ops, 
and, for the most part, nice people.
Paul
> 
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Ken Waller]

Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - 
From: "John Sessoms" 

Subject: RE: question for the brits American to English translation



From: "Bob W"

This thread reminded me of some advice I gave to a friend who
> was going to Europe for the first time:
>
> It is important to realize that in a foreign country, people may not 
> understand your meaning, even if they do speak English.  There are 
> certain American expressions that can not understandably be translated 
> into any European language, including the varieties of English spoken 
> in the UK and Ireland.  Some examples:

>


Isn't the point of going abroad to experience the differences? The 
English
are terrible for this, going to a foreign country and demanding that it 
be

exactly the same as Scunthorpe.


>
> Crispy bacon strips.


Pancetta. You can buy crispy bacon strips in Marks & Spencer.


> Eggs over easy (or sunny side up)


We can probably cook it - we just can't ever remember what it means.


> Rare steak (or a rare hamburger)


These are the ways steak can be cooked in France:

Bleu - the beast's heart is still beating
Saignant - bleeding
A point - pink in the middle
Bien cuit - well done. You may be deported if you ask for this
Americain - any restaurant that's prepared to do this to a steak does not
deserve your custom



Why would I want to order "steak" in France? I can get "steak" at Golden 
Corral. I mean, what's the point of going anywhere if it's going to be 
just like home? If I want "just like home", I might as well STAY home.


If I'm going to France, I want real FRENCH COOKING, and I don't mean 
fries, freedom or otherwise.


The real question is why would you want to go to France ?


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Larry Colen]

On Mar 23, 2010, at 6:43 PM, paul stenquist wrote:



On Mar 23, 2010, at 9:43 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:


Ah, yes the ol' "Black and Blue".

The best to be sure. But you need a hellaciously hot fire. I can  
only get deep brown and red on my gas grill. Charcoal gives one a  
fighting chance.


I made some tri-tip steaks tonight. That's poor man's steak. But  
they were quite good, grilled rapidly and rare with plenty of salt  
and pepper. They don't look good: wrong shape for a steak. And they  
usually have a bit of gristle somewhere. But they're well marbled  
and tender. A bargain at around $3 a pound.



Tri-tip is actually a roast.  It's also a regional cut of meat.  Zab  
wanted to make tri-tip for her dad when she visited last summer and  
was dismayed to find that it wasn't in the local store.  Many places  
sell it as, IIRC, bottom sirloin.


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Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est





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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Stan Halpin]

> - Original Message - From: "Doug Franklin"
> Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation
> 
> 
>> On 2010-03-23 19:49, William Robb wrote:
>> 
>>> If you are going with the intention of insulting the chef, stay home.
>> 
>> I don't go anywhere with the intention of insulting anyone.  However, if I 
>> go into a restaurant, of whatever fare or cost, and they offer me a menu. 
>> I'll order from the menu.  If they ask me how "well" to cook it, I expect 
>> them to comply.  If they're not going to comply, don't ask. Instead, mark 
>> the menu to tell me what to expect.  But if you go out of your way to ask, 
>> then berate me because you don't like my response, you're an asshole.
> 
> It's a two way street. In my experience, it was more often the customers who 
> were assholes than the cooks.
> Most of the chefs that I worked with wanted to send out food that was edible, 
> and felt that a steak cooked past medium well was a waste of good food.
> See my previous post about the vagaries of well done.
> 
> William Robb 
> 

I occasionally dine at decent mid-to-upper quality restaurants. I think that 
even food cooked as the chef deems appropriate is still a waste of good food 
when served e.g. to drunken slobs paying more attention to their buddies than 
to the food they are wolfing down. Like any artist, chef's cannot expect the 
unwashed masses to understand the nuances of their art. And like any commercial 
artist they need to get over it and serve what the customer wants, and then 
treasure the occasional diner who understands and appreciates their work.

stan
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[William Robb]

- Original Message - 
From: "Doug Franklin"

Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation



On 2010-03-23 19:49, William Robb wrote:


If you are going with the intention of insulting the chef, stay home.


I don't go anywhere with the intention of insulting anyone.  However, if I 
go into a restaurant, of whatever fare or cost, and they offer me a menu. 
I'll order from the menu.  If they ask me how "well" to cook it, I expect 
them to comply.  If they're not going to comply, don't ask. Instead, mark 
the menu to tell me what to expect.  But if you go out of your way to ask, 
then berate me because you don't like my response, you're an asshole.


It's a two way street. In my experience, it was more often the customers who 
were assholes than the cooks.
Most of the chefs that I worked with wanted to send out food that was 
edible, and felt that a steak cooked past medium well was a waste of good 
food.

See my previous post about the vagaries of well done.

William Robb 



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[William Robb]

- Original Message - 
From: "Doug Franklin" <

Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation


OK, I apologize up front.  This got a bit long, so you might want to just 
hit the "delete" key now. :-)




Before I decided I wanted to be a photojournalist, I wanted to be a chef.
I got fairly close to that before I decided I didn't want to be a chef.
I worked in some fairly high end places, keeping in mind that I was working 
in a small city in the middle of nowhere.
While we "offered" steaks cooked to order, we also cringed every time a 
steak was ordered well done.
Believe it or not, well done is just about the most difficult to cook, not 
because it is hard to cook the crap out of a slab of beef, but because one 
never knows in advance if the person wants it cooked until it is just no 
longer pink in the middle, or if he wants it cooked until it resembles the 
sole of a shoe, and this customer was often an unadulterated prick, which 
was apparently the case of the British friends that my acquaintance took to 
Golf's Steak House.


William Robb 



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Doug Franklin]

On 2010-03-23 19:49, William Robb wrote:


If you are going with the intention of insulting the chef, stay home.


I don't go anywhere with the intention of insulting anyone.  However, if 
I go into a restaurant, of whatever fare or cost, and they offer me a 
menu.  I'll order from the menu.  If they ask me how "well" to cook it, 
I expect them to comply.  If they're not going to comply, don't ask. 
Instead, mark the menu to tell me what to expect.  But if you go out of 
your way to ask, then berate me because you don't like my response, 
you're an asshole.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Doug Franklin]

OK, I apologize up front.  This got a bit long, so you might want to 
just hit the "delete" key now. :-)


On 2010-03-23 17:28, John Francis wrote:


My point was more that you *are* paying for the snotty attitude.
That, to some extent, is what differentiates a "chef" from a cook.

>
> A good place will work with you to find something you will like
> that is cooked the way the chef would like to prepare it.  That
> doesn't sound like it would be a steak in your situation.

/Aus les contres/ (I'm sure that's not even grammatically correct, but 
you get my point, I suspect) I'm paying for what I asked for.  A /chef/ 
understands that.  You published a menu.  You asked me what I want.  I 
told you.  That's a promise, and, in some polities, a contract.  If you 
take it upon yourself to deliver something else, your whining about 
"caveman Americans" is pointless, nationalistic road apples (horse 
excrement, if "road apples" is not a phrase you recognize).


I've /never/ had a problem in a truly "haute cuisine" restaurant.  I've 
had no end of trouble with self-elected, self-important little shits who 
think they're chefs.


Personally, I almost never eat at "haute cuisine" restaurants in the US 
for exactly that reason.  I often eat at them outside the US.  In those 
situations, I have a discussion with the waiter, we agree, the waiter 
takes my order, has a discussion with the chef, and I get what I want 
with "reasonable" excursions on the Chef's ideas. I get what I like, 
even though I might not have known or have ever tried it before.  The 
waiter and the chef and I all took the time to communicate, and the chef 
both took the time and knew enough to merge his ideas of a great meal 
with mine.


One particular evening, in about 1994, I went to dinner with some 
friends in the south of France.  I was there on business, with several 
colleagues transiting in and out.  One of my colleagues knew the area 
and drove us up into the hills to some of his favorite haunts.  It was 
maybe fifty or sixty kilometers north of Nice, up in the beginnings of 
the mountains.


For evening meal, we went to this little place with maybe seven or eight 
tables, in a small room of a "castle" from maybe the 13th or 14th 
century, it seemed.  So my colleague has called ahead and placed our 
reservation.  Actually, it was likely more like he told them a party of 
four was an hour or so away.  I say that because, when we arrived, and 
for the entire evening, we were the only party in the place.


Anyway, we get there and settle ourselves.  Almost immediately, a young 
man comes out, takes and delivers our drink orders, and leaves some 
"nibbles" at our table.


So, we sit, we drink, we talk, we nibble the snacks. After maybe ten 
minutes, another young man comes in.  He introduces himself by given 
name, in flawless, unaccented English, French, and German, to suit each 
guest individually.  He asks and is invited to join our table.  After 
ten or fifteen minutes, he surprises the heck out of us by revealing 
that he's not some local roue out to meet foreigners, he's our waiter!


He describes the entrees and the daily specials, then asks our meal 
preferences.  The ensuing discussion consumes about thirty minutes and 
about a bottle of wine, in which our waiter freely participates, at our 
instigation.  When we've all come to a dinner conclusion, our new friend 
excuses himself to discuss our preferences with the chef.


I wanted a specific item, a particularly fresh cut of locally butchered 
beef.  And I wanted it cooked just past the point the middle would have 
been pink.  The waiter told the chef.  Via the waiter, the chef 
expressed his reservations.  Again via the waiter, I expressed my 
confidence that he (the chef) could satisfy my desire for "doneness" 
with his aesthetics, and my further confidence to leave the results in 
his well-earned judgment.


Between them, they defined and conjured a meal for me, and for each of 
us, that exceeded the wildest expectations. Maybe they were just bored, 
since we were the only party.  Or maybe they were consummate 
professionals who loved their professions /and/ their clients.


To me, the fundamental point was that they were specifically interested 
in what /I/ wanted.  If I'm going to lay out "haute cuisine" prices, I 
expect that level of attention.



If you insist on a well-done steak you're telling the chef that
you don't value his skills.


Well, the chef is certainly able to interpret it that way, but that's 
not the way I'm offering it.  I'm offering it as "if you serve me a 
bleeding hunk of meat, I'm gonna puke on your table".



Would you want to work for a client who insisted on telling you
that he wanted every photograph overexposed by three stops?


If his checks are big enough and don't bounce, I'll do anything he wants 
me to.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Doug Franklin]

On 2010-03-23 17:15, Daniel J. Matyola wrote:


I like my steak (and my tuna) grilled so it is charred on the outside
and purple in the center. The best of both worlds.


Be that as it may, that's not my point.  As far as I'm concerned, if 
they ask me what I want, and I tell them X, and I'm /frickin'/ /paying/ 
/for/ /it/, then they're honor bound to provide me with what I 
requested. If they give me Y instead, then I'm well within my rights to 
be an Ugly American.  Just because someone has a chef's had doesn't mean 
they get to dictate to me what I eat.  Unless I ask them to, it which 
case I shut my yap except to shovel more food in.  If I'm not to be 
offered a choice, don't publish a fraggin' menu, you idolatrous sod.


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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[paul stenquist]

On Mar 23, 2010, at 9:43 PM, P. J. Alling wrote:

> Ah, yes the ol' "Black and Blue".
> 
The best to be sure. But you need a hellaciously hot fire. I can only get deep 
brown and red on my gas grill. Charcoal gives one a fighting chance.

I made some tri-tip steaks tonight. That's poor man's steak. But they were 
quite good, grilled rapidly and rare with plenty of salt and pepper. They don't 
look good: wrong shape for a steak. And they usually have a bit of gristle 
somewhere. But they're well marbled and tender. A bargain at around $3 a pound.
Paul


> On 3/23/2010 4:15 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote:
>> To each his own.
>> 
>> I like my steak (and my tuna) grilled so it is charred on the outside
>> and purple in the center. The best of both worlds.   I also enjoy
>> steak tartare, but that is harder to find.  The last excellent one I
>> found was in Quebec.
>> 
>> Dan MN
>> 
>> On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 4:56 PM, Brian Walters  
>> wrote:
>>   
>>> On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 16:25 -0400, "Doug Franklin"
>>>   wrote:
>>> 
 On 2010-03-23 12:24, John Francis wrote:
   
> On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 08:34:00AM -0400, Doug Franklin wrote:
> 
>> On 2010-03-23 8:04, William Robb wrote:
>> 
>>   
 I've stopped ordering steak when I go to a restaurant. I'm a philistine
 who like steak well done (ie. not a pink morsel anywhere). I think
 that's a task beyond the ability of most chefs.
 
   
>>> Any chef worth of the title would consider that a lack of taste on the
>>> part of the diner.
>>> 
>> F*** the chef, I'm paying for the meal, not a snotty attitude.
>>   
> Then go to a diner.
> 
> When you go to a "fine dining" establishment you are paying for the
> expertise of the chef.  Telling him how to do his job is a dumb idea.
> 
 We'll just have to disagree on this one.  If I'm footing the bill, it
 should be cooked the way I want it, if I specify.  Asking for a steak
 with no pink and receiving a mooing cow, on my dime, is not on.
   
>>> 
>>> Yes!  In any restaurant I've been to the waiter asks how you'd like your
>>> steak cooked.  If I say 'well done', I bloody well mean it!
>>> 
>>> (er, I mean it un-bloodied, actually)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Cheers
>>> 
>>> Brian
>>> 
>>> ++
>>> Brian Walters
>>> Western Sydney Australia
>>> http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> 
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>>>  love email again
>>> 
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>>   
> 
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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[P. J. Alling]

Ah, yes the ol' "Black and Blue".

On 3/23/2010 4:15 PM, Daniel J. Matyola wrote:

To each his own.

I like my steak (and my tuna) grilled so it is charred on the outside
and purple in the center. The best of both worlds.   I also enjoy
steak tartare, but that is harder to find.  The last excellent one I
found was in Quebec.

Dan MN

On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 4:56 PM, Brian Walters  wrote:
   

On Tue, 23 Mar 2010 16:25 -0400, "Doug Franklin"
  wrote:
 

On 2010-03-23 12:24, John Francis wrote:
   

On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 08:34:00AM -0400, Doug Franklin wrote:
 

On 2010-03-23 8:04, William Robb wrote:

   

I've stopped ordering steak when I go to a restaurant. I'm a philistine
who like steak well done (ie. not a pink morsel anywhere). I think
that's a task beyond the ability of most chefs.

   

Any chef worth of the title would consider that a lack of taste on the
part of the diner.
 

F*** the chef, I'm paying for the meal, not a snotty attitude.
   

Then go to a diner.

When you go to a "fine dining" establishment you are paying for the
expertise of the chef.  Telling him how to do his job is a dumb idea.
 

We'll just have to disagree on this one.  If I'm footing the bill, it
should be cooked the way I want it, if I specify.  Asking for a steak
with no pink and receiving a mooing cow, on my dime, is not on.
   


Yes!  In any restaurant I've been to the waiter asks how you'd like your
steak cooked.  If I say 'well done', I bloody well mean it!

(er, I mean it un-bloodied, actually)



Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[William Robb]

- Original Message - 
From: "Doug Franklin" 
Subject: Re: question for the brits American to English translation




We'll just have to disagree on this one.  If I'm footing the bill, it 
should be cooked the way I want it, if I specify.  Asking for a steak 
with no pink and receiving a mooing cow, on my dime, is not on.




If you are going with the intention of insulting the chef, stay home.

William Robb

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RE: question for the brits American to English translation

[Bob W]

> 
> " Steack frites is the most French of all possible meals"
> 
> Really?
> 
> When I was in Paris, about all anyone served for lunch was 
> ham and cheese.  It seemed like every cafe had a dozen 
> varieties of ham and cheese sandwiches on the menu -- croque 
> this, crock o' that, etc.
> What's up with that?
> 
> Dan

That's in cafes. Cafes, bistros, brasseries, restaurants - they all serve
different ranges of food. 

Cafes are for sandwiches (mixte = ham and cheese in a baguette) and toasties
(croque monsieur = toasted ham and cheese in sliced bread; croque madame =
croque monsieur with an egg on top). 


A bistro is a small bar; they usually have a few tables where you can get
old-fashioned comfort food as well. 

In Lyons they have little places called bouchons, which are superb little
bistro-like establishments where you get no-holds-barred peasant grub of the
best sort imaginable.


A restaurant is the full-on eating experience.

Brasseries will do you a steak frites, plus various other bits and bobs like
salads, crudites, usually from a menu that doesn't change much, if at all.
They are something half way between a bistro and a restaurant. Less formal
than a restaurant.
 describes them as 'upscale', but
typically they are not.



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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Larry Colen]

On 3/23/2010 2:28 PM, John Francis wrote:

Would you want to work for a client who insisted on telling you
that he wanted every photograph overexposed by three stops?

   

mark

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[Daniel J. Matyola]

" Steack frites is the most French of all possible meals"

Really?

When I was in Paris, about all anyone served for lunch was ham and
cheese.  It seemed like every cafe had a dozen varieties of ham and
cheese sandwiches on the menu -- croque this, crock o' that, etc.
What's up with that?

Dan

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Re: question for the brits American to English translation

[John Francis]

On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 04:25:40PM -0400, Doug Franklin wrote:
> On 2010-03-23 12:24, John Francis wrote:
>> On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 08:34:00AM -0400, Doug Franklin wrote:
>>> On 2010-03-23 8:04, William Robb wrote:
>>>
> I've stopped ordering steak when I go to a restaurant. I'm a philistine
> who like steak well done (ie. not a pink morsel anywhere). I think
> that's a task beyond the ability of most chefs.
>
 Any chef worth of the title would consider that a lack of taste on the
 part of the diner.
>>>
>>> F*** the chef, I'm paying for the meal, not a snotty attitude.
>>
>> Then go to a diner.
>>
>> When you go to a "fine dining" establishment you are paying for the
>> expertise of the chef.  Telling him how to do his job is a dumb idea.
>
> We'll just have to disagree on this one.  If I'm footing the bill, it  
> should be cooked the way I want it, if I specify.  Asking for a steak  
> with no pink and receiving a mooing cow, on my dime, is not on.

Well, I'll (sort of) agree with you.

My point was more that you *are* paying for the snotty attitude.
That, to some extent, is what differentiates a "chef" from a cook.

A good place will work with you to find something you will like
that is cooked the way the chef would like to prepare it.  That
doesn't sound like it would be a steak in your situation.

If you insist on a well-done steak you're telling the chef that
you don't value his skills.  That's not going to encourage him
to perform to the best of his ability.  If, despite that, you
insist on having it done "your way" you're probably not going
to get the best piece of meat in the house, either.  You could
almost certainly get better value by going elsewhere.


Would you want to work for a client who insisted on telling you
that he wanted every photograph overexposed by three stops?


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