Re: Spot Metering Question
I'll do that. In case like this, I'd be best off shooting with a print film, correct? Doesn't print film have a wider exposure range (but less density) than slide film? Thanks, Dan Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Two stops over a spot meter reading of the white area only should give you white with subtle details. But for an important shot like that I would bracket from about 2 1/2 over to 1 1/2 over if you're not real familiar with the highlight characteristics of the film you're using. I shot a Snow Fountain Weeping Cherry Tree that was in blossom yesterday. The blossoms dominated the frame, but there was some grass in the foreground and some yellow daffodils and tulips under the tree. The blossoms are snow white, of course. I used Ektachrome 100VS and exposed two stops over, which gave me great blossoms. I also exposed some frames 1 and 1 1/2 over. The blossoms in the 1 over frames were definitely too gray. In the 1 1/2 over frames the blossoms were acceptable but slightly dull, however the grass in the foreground was, of course, more saturated than in the 2 over frames. I haven't looked at them all with a loupe yet, but the 2 over exposures appear to be the best overall. Dan Scott wrote: Hi Paul, Is this white white with subtle details or white as in blown out highlights? My reason for asking is Prickly Poppies (large white blossoms on gray grey foliage) are fixing to be in season here, and I'd like to get good detail in the blossoms. Thanks, Dan Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Meters think everything is 18% gray. So, yes, if you want white to look white, you add two stops more exposure to the meter reading you get on a white subject. If you want black to look black, you subtract approximately two stops from the meter reading you get on a black object. You can see what the ambient light is by reading an 18% gray card with the meter. It should approximate your calculated exposures. In other words the reading from the white dress plus two stops should be close to the reading you take on the gray card in the same light (with the gray card held at the same angle to the light source as the white dress). Paul - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Spot Metering Question
I want to thank the group for some good responces on spot metering. My next question would be how do you determine a gray equivilent? Would a red be the same as black? Would a light blue be medium gray? Please excuse my lack of knowledge, I just want to fine tune my skills! Thanks..Craig
Re: Spot Metering Question
Ah... no. There really is no color equivalent to 18% gray. Red is not equivalent to black. There are all sorts of blues with varying degrees of reflectance. I've thought about what I do with a spot meter and now realize that I have no real method whatsoever. I suspect this may be a bad thing. Over time I've simply become used to what the film the equipment does. I may use the spot meter on something I know I would want to be about like my 18% gray cardif I was shooting BW. I may point the meter at what I think is an important part of the image or a part of the image whose effect on the film I know, take a reading and adjust exposure with the idea that I know I want it darker or lighter than the card would be - although I don't actually think about an actual card. Sometimes I shoot both the lighter parts and the darker partsthat I want some detail in and adjust to keep this range within the latitude of the film. Mostly, I just adjust the camera for what my experience is for the conditions and adjust for changes and to hell with the meter. Actually, I can do better with a center weighted meter because it's _consistent_ in what it does. It always reacts the same way. Then I make adjustments for the scene or subject or whatever knowing (now intuitively)why the CW meter told me what it did. Keep in mind that I'm just a hack, but I do believe that there is no substitute for burning copious amounts offilm, taking notes on each shot (as possible) and making notes on the results. This implies that one retains control over exposure. Maybe I need help. Regards,Bob... Give blood. Play hockey. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2001 8:35 AM Subject: Re: Spot Metering Question I want to thank the group for some good responces on spot metering. My next question would be how do you determine a gray equivilent? Would a red be the same as black? Would a light blue be medium gray? Please excuse my lack of knowledge, I just want to fine tune my skills! Thanks..Craig
Re: Spot Metering Question
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: April 25, 2001 9:35 AM Subject: Re: Spot Metering Question I want to thank the group for some good responces on spot metering. My next question would be how do you determine a gray equivilent? Would a red be the same as black? Would a light blue be medium gray? Please excuse my lack of knowledge, I just want to fine tune my skills! Thanks..Craig Unfortunately, no. With a few exceptions (in camera spot meters are not one of them) light meters are not colour blind. For example, my beloved LX's (all three) share a particularly disturbing trait. The meters are exceptionally sensitive to yellow, and if yellow predominates in the scene, it will underexpose the film. Note this is after taking the film manufacturers speed loss into consideration. Here is how you can check your meter. Load a roll of real black and white film (Tri-X, FP-4, etc) into your camera. Now, go out and photograph colours. Fill the frame completely with them. Use the same lens and leave the lens at infinity focus, you are not looking for detail anyway. Use the light meters reccomended settings. Point the camera at the north sky on a clear day and make an exposure. Point it at a red barn and do the same thing. Do you have a big green bath towel? Photograph it. Try this experiment with at least a dozen different colours. When you process the film, look at the densities of the negatives. If they are all the same, your meter is colour neutral. More likely, the densities of the negatives will be all over the place. If you have access to a densitometer (most good photolabs have one), you can repeat the test with colour negative film. Get your friendly lab tech to read the visual (colour integrated) negative densities. William Robb - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Spot Metering Question
Yes, print (negative) film is probably the best choice when you're concerned about range. However I generally shoot transparency film, because I don't want to put myself in the hands of a lab tech when it comes to nailing the color, and I don't want a stack of 4x6 prints. But negative film is a good choice when you're dealing with extremes. If you're shooting only the white blossoms and the gray foliage, you should be fine with either transparency film or negative film. Paul Dan Scott wrote: I'll do that. In case like this, I'd be best off shooting with a print film, correct? Doesn't print film have a wider exposure range (but less density) than slide film? Thanks, Dan Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Two stops over a spot meter reading of the white area only should give you white with subtle details. But for an important shot like that I would bracket from about 2 1/2 over to 1 1/2 over if you're not real familiar with the highlight characteristics of the film you're using. I shot a Snow Fountain Weeping Cherry Tree that was in blossom yesterday. The blossoms dominated the frame, but there was some grass in the foreground and some yellow daffodils and tulips under the tree. The blossoms are snow white, of course. I used Ektachrome 100VS and exposed two stops over, which gave me great blossoms. I also exposed some frames 1 and 1 1/2 over. The blossoms in the 1 over frames were definitely too gray. In the 1 1/2 over frames the blossoms were acceptable but slightly dull, however the grass in the foreground was, of course, more saturated than in the 2 over frames. I haven't looked at them all with a loupe yet, but the 2 over exposures appear to be the best overall. Dan Scott wrote: Hi Paul, Is this white white with subtle details or white as in blown out highlights? My reason for asking is Prickly Poppies (large white blossoms on gray grey foliage) are fixing to be in season here, and I'd like to get good detail in the blossoms. Thanks, Dan Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Meters think everything is 18% gray. So, yes, if you want white to look white, you add two stops more exposure to the meter reading you get on a white subject. If you want black to look black, you subtract approximately two stops from the meter reading you get on a black object. You can see what the ambient light is by reading an 18% gray card with the meter. It should approximate your calculated exposures. In other words the reading from the white dress plus two stops should be close to the reading you take on the gray card in the same light (with the gray card held at the same angle to the light source as the white dress). Paul - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Spot Metering Question
I find that medium red, medium green and light blue are all pretty close to 18% gray in terms of reflectivity. Get a gray card and go outside and experiment with meter readings of various colors and the gray card reading. It doesn't take long to develop a feel for what the degree of reflectivity you can expect from various colors and surfaces. Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I want to thank the group for some good responces on spot metering. My next question would be how do you determine a gray equivilent? Would a red be the same as black? Would a light blue be medium gray? Please excuse my lack of knowledge, I just want to fine tune my skills! Thanks..Craig - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Spot Metering Question
Finally found the group after quite a while. I remember somebody posting a correction chart when spot metering. Example, add 2 stops if subject was a white color such as a wedding dress. Is this still the way? I purchased a PZ1p and was wondering if I let the metering system do it, ot do I compensate? Thanks.Craig
Re: Spot Metering Question
At 03:22 PM 4/24/01 EDT, you wrote: Finally found the group after quite a while. I remember somebody posting a correction chart when spot metering. Example, add 2 stops if subject was a white color such as a wedding dress. Is this still the way? I purchased a PZ1p and was wondering if I let the metering system do it, ot do I compensate? Thanks.Craig yep, if SPOT metering, and not metering something aprox 18% grey, then if you meter something white and wnat it white +2 if you meter somehting BLACK and want it BLACK then -2 or use the ZONE SYSTEM - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Spot Metering Question
My first thought is that, no matter the meter, it thinks the subject is 18% gray (or13%, depending on your local guru). [EMAIL PROTECTED] 04/24 12:22 PM Finally found the group after quite a while. I remember somebody posting a correction chart when spot metering. Example, add 2 stops if subject was a white color such as a wedding dress. Is this still the way? I purchased a PZ1p and was wondering if I let the metering system do it, ot do I compensate? Thanks.Craig - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Spot Metering Question
Meters think everything is 18% gray. So, yes, if you want white to look white, you add two stops more exposure to the meter reading you get on a white subject. If you want black to look black, you subtract approximately two stops from the meter reading you get on a black object. You can see what the ambient light is by reading an 18% gray card with the meter. It should approximate your calculated exposures. In other words the reading from the white dress plus two stops should be close to the reading you take on the gray card in the same light (with the gray card held at the same angle to the light source as the white dress). Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Finally found the group after quite a while. I remember somebody posting a correction chart when spot metering. Example, add 2 stops if subject was a white color such as a wedding dress. Is this still the way? I purchased a PZ1p and was wondering if I let the metering system do it, ot do I compensate? Thanks.Craig - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: Spot Metering Question
Hi Paul, Is this white white with subtle details or white as in blown out highlights? My reason for asking is Prickly Poppies (large white blossoms on gray grey foliage) are fixing to be in season here, and I'd like to get good detail in the blossoms. Thanks, Dan Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Meters think everything is 18% gray. So, yes, if you want white to look white, you add two stops more exposure to the meter reading you get on a white subject. If you want black to look black, you subtract approximately two stops from the meter reading you get on a black object. You can see what the ambient light is by reading an 18% gray card with the meter. It should approximate your calculated exposures. In other words the reading from the white dress plus two stops should be close to the reading you take on the gray card in the same light (with the gray card held at the same angle to the light source as the white dress). Paul - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
