Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
Larry Colen wrote: Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? -- The noise they make is way above that audible to average human hearing. As the cost they are is way above the average wallet. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
2010/2/5 eckinator eckina...@gmail.com: yeah and next thing to come after the megapixel race they will advertise lenses based on hsm rpm and gear ratio or perhaps invent stick shift lenses... My bet is an ATP driven linear contraction engine. A true way for a camera maker to show some muscle, at last. Jostein -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 10:13 PM, Anthony Farr farranth...@gmail.com wrote: Yeah, I understood that ring motors were applied in a direct-drive configuration, and that USM micromotors, the rotating types, were used as an alternative to and in the much the same way as conventional motors. But rotating USM motors aren't all just high frequency AC electric motors, they can be a pure USM system where the slider of a linear or annular motor is in the form of a rotor that is spun by the stator when it produces a wave of ultrasonic vibrations. Which types of motor are in what brand of lens... I don't know. It was the third possibility that I was unsure of. That is, if any lens used linear (ie straight not ring or micro) USM motors that simply moved back and forth through a limited range and moved the focusing group directly. If any lens had such a motor, I wondered if it would have the power to do the job in direct-drive configuration, or if it would need to work through a gear-train. I'm not the gearhead that I once was, who knew the specs of every camera in the stores. The insides of most cameras these days are a complete mystery to me. Life's simpler that way :-) regards, Anthony I'll admit my interest here is primarily professional, not gear-geeking. I'm currently working on my B.Eng in Electrical Engineering and this is one area that's particularly interesting to me. As far s I'm aware, micro-motor USM is not using true USM motors, mostly for cost reasons (the main reason wht Micro-motor USM was introduced in the first place). A linear motor would be very interesting in a camera application, I suspect some electronic aperture systems may use them, and wouldn't be shocked to hear that they were being used for In-Body IS, but I doubt they're being used for focusing since you still need the helical for manual focus, although 4/3rds or Micro-4/3rds could as Panasonic and Olympus use focus-by-wire (as does Canon on a couple lenses, the 85L most notably). -- M. Adam Maas http://www.mawz.ca Explorations of the City Around Us. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
On 06/02/2010, Adam Maas a...@mawz.ca wrote: A linear motor would be very interesting in a camera application, I suspect some electronic aperture systems may use them, and wouldn't be shocked to hear that they were being used for In-Body IS, The actual motors used in the SR system are linear to a point but I suspect the hall feedback systems ensure their practical linearity. -- Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Why are they called hypersonic motors?
Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
RE: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? They must do, otherwise how could the marketing team have allowed the term to be used? -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
yeah and next thing to come after the megapixel race they will advertise lenses based on hsm rpm and gear ratio or perhaps invent stick shift lenses... 2010/2/5 Bob W p...@web-options.com: Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? They must do, otherwise how could the marketing team have allowed the term to be used? -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
No, they are driven by ultrasonic/hypersonic vibration of a stator for true ring-type USM. Micro-motor USM uses an ultrasonic AC voltage to power a more conventional motor. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrasonic_motor -Adam On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 6:27 PM, Larry Colen l...@red4est.com wrote: Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- M. Adam Maas http://www.mawz.ca Explorations of the City Around Us. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
The short answer is to read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrasonic_motor My understanding is that USM, HSM, SDM, etc, s shouldn't be likened to conventional electric motors with their armatures and brushes and all the other stuff (I'm sure that's a technical term, I've heard an engineer use it). In the most elegant examples the USM is an annular linear motor that encircles the component to be shifted, be that the focusing helix or the diaphram mechanism. In that application RPM doesn't apply, because the total range of movement is less than 360 degrees. A straight linear motor applying its movement in one location could possibly shift the focusing group directly without a helix, but I'm unsure if any USM systems are powerful enough to directly move the lens without a helix or gear train to step up the torque, and I couldn't be arsed to research it myself. And some USM motors resemble a can motor (one configuration of a standard electric motor) with an output shaft, but differ in that they excite the rotation by a different method which has less mechanical resistance and thus spins more freely. IIRC the first linear drive lenses were in the Rolleiflex SLX 6x6 system, but don't know if USM was used. The technology ~was~ available at the time. regards, Anthony Of what use is lens and light to those who lack in mind and sight (Anon) On 5 February 2010 10:27, Larry Colen l...@red4est.com wrote: Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
IIRC the first linear drive lenses were in the Rolleiflex SLX 6x6 system, but don't know if USM was used. The technology ~was~ available at the time. Of couse that was pre-autofocus, and only the diaphram was being adjusted by the linear motor. regards, Anthony Of what use is lens and light to those who lack in mind and sight (Anon) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
That's ~so~ much more to-the-point than my ramble. In the future I should just leave the answers to you, Adam. regards, Anthony Of what use is lens and light to those who lack in mind and sight (Anon) On 5 February 2010 12:09, Adam Maas a...@mawz.ca wrote: No, they are driven by ultrasonic/hypersonic vibration of a stator for true ring-type USM. Micro-motor USM uses an ultrasonic AC voltage to power a more conventional motor. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrasonic_motor -Adam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
Ring-type USM motors do not use a gear-train, they are built into the focusing helical, this covers some USM and AF-S and all HSM and SSM motors. Micro-motor USM (which really isn't USM, Sony's Silent AF Motor [SAM] terminology is more correct) uses a gear-train but really is just a conventional motor with non-conventional power as they discovered that micromotors are much quieter when driven by high-frequency AC. -Adam On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 8:31 PM, Anthony Farr farranth...@gmail.com wrote: The short answer is to read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrasonic_motor My understanding is that USM, HSM, SDM, etc, s shouldn't be likened to conventional electric motors with their armatures and brushes and all the other stuff (I'm sure that's a technical term, I've heard an engineer use it). In the most elegant examples the USM is an annular linear motor that encircles the component to be shifted, be that the focusing helix or the diaphram mechanism. In that application RPM doesn't apply, because the total range of movement is less than 360 degrees. A straight linear motor applying its movement in one location could possibly shift the focusing group directly without a helix, but I'm unsure if any USM systems are powerful enough to directly move the lens without a helix or gear train to step up the torque, and I couldn't be arsed to research it myself. And some USM motors resemble a can motor (one configuration of a standard electric motor) with an output shaft, but differ in that they excite the rotation by a different method which has less mechanical resistance and thus spins more freely. IIRC the first linear drive lenses were in the Rolleiflex SLX 6x6 system, but don't know if USM was used. The technology ~was~ available at the time. regards, Anthony Of what use is lens and light to those who lack in mind and sight (Anon) On 5 February 2010 10:27, Larry Colen l...@red4est.com wrote: Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- M. Adam Maas http://www.mawz.ca Explorations of the City Around Us. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Why are they called hypersonic motors?
Yeah, I understood that ring motors were applied in a direct-drive configuration, and that USM micromotors, the rotating types, were used as an alternative to and in the much the same way as conventional motors. But rotating USM motors aren't all just high frequency AC electric motors, they can be a pure USM system where the slider of a linear or annular motor is in the form of a rotor that is spun by the stator when it produces a wave of ultrasonic vibrations. Which types of motor are in what brand of lens... I don't know. It was the third possibility that I was unsure of. That is, if any lens used linear (ie straight not ring or micro) USM motors that simply moved back and forth through a limited range and moved the focusing group directly. If any lens had such a motor, I wondered if it would have the power to do the job in direct-drive configuration, or if it would need to work through a gear-train. I'm not the gearhead that I once was, who knew the specs of every camera in the stores. The insides of most cameras these days are a complete mystery to me. Life's simpler that way :-) regards, Anthony Of what use is lens and light to those who lack in mind and sight (Anon) On 5 February 2010 13:23, Adam Maas a...@mawz.ca wrote: Ring-type USM motors do not use a gear-train, they are built into the focusing helical, this covers some USM and AF-S and all HSM and SSM motors. Micro-motor USM (which really isn't USM, Sony's Silent AF Motor [SAM] terminology is more correct) uses a gear-train but really is just a conventional motor with non-conventional power as they discovered that micromotors are much quieter when driven by high-frequency AC. -Adam On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 8:31 PM, Anthony Farr farranth...@gmail.com wrote: The short answer is to read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultrasonic_motor My understanding is that USM, HSM, SDM, etc, s shouldn't be likened to conventional electric motors with their armatures and brushes and all the other stuff (I'm sure that's a technical term, I've heard an engineer use it). In the most elegant examples the USM is an annular linear motor that encircles the component to be shifted, be that the focusing helix or the diaphram mechanism. In that application RPM doesn't apply, because the total range of movement is less than 360 degrees. A straight linear motor applying its movement in one location could possibly shift the focusing group directly without a helix, but I'm unsure if any USM systems are powerful enough to directly move the lens without a helix or gear train to step up the torque, and I couldn't be arsed to research it myself. And some USM motors resemble a can motor (one configuration of a standard electric motor) with an output shaft, but differ in that they excite the rotation by a different method which has less mechanical resistance and thus spins more freely. IIRC the first linear drive lenses were in the Rolleiflex SLX 6x6 system, but don't know if USM was used. The technology ~was~ available at the time. regards, Anthony Of what use is lens and light to those who lack in mind and sight (Anon) On 5 February 2010 10:27, Larry Colen l...@red4est.com wrote: Do the motors turn at 900,000 RPM (15,000 hz * 60)? -- Larry Colen l...@red4est.com sent from i4est -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- M. Adam Maas http://www.mawz.ca Explorations of the City Around Us. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
