Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On 2011-03-16 18:18 , David Parsons wrote: It's called X10. It's been around for a long time. X10 is not the automobile protocol that i was talking about; i have a small pile of unused X10 equipment; it runs at 20 bits per second which would be insufficient to do things like send the data to restore the state of a device that's been turned off, etc.; Insteon is the next step up for home automation, but still pretty slow -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
Any one who has unplugged or cut the power from their cable box with the on off switch will fight tooth and nail to maintain the power down/instant on capability of that system. I will say however that if you go away on holiday or to visit the in-laws (not a holiday in most cases) you should pull the plug on most devices in your home that demand stand-by power. Except maybe the clocks, which now involves the stove, washer/dryer, and the phone(s). A cry perhaps for a central computer in the home to maintain all settings of all appliances, allowing their power to be cut completely when not being used. Therefor allowing complete restoration when each is re-activated. Providing, of course, that the central computer, and the wireless circuitry such a system would demand, was actually a net savings of power. :-) On Mar 15, 2011, at 14:50 , eckinator wrote: 2011/3/15 Rob Studdert distudio.p...@gmail.com: Indeed, it's very easy to oversimplify. The combination of use patterns, utility and power consumption during standby must be considered. Computers are a case in point, in order to be power efficient they need to consume some standby power, in good systems the standby power is now in the order of 1W for off and 2W for standby (instant on). The fact is that people will be happier to set their power saving functionality to power down the system over a shorter period of non-activity if the unit will spring back into action at the touch of the keyboard or power button. I know I will hit the power button now when I walk away from my computer knowing that it will take mere seconds to reactivate. This type of system functionality and user behaviour will generally promote net savings in energy use over a day, so the standby power is worth the expenditure. Everyone should have or have access to a precision power meter so that they can analysis the power consumption of all their electrical equipment. Some items are surprisingly efficient others are woeful but without a proper means of assessment it's all a big guess. good point with regard to more complex systems. different for mere on/off functionality replaced by standby. NVRAM and EEPROM are cheap and fast. saving settings shouldn't be such a big whoop. and there are more energy efficient ways to do that. a simple AA rechargeable. or you could even go one step further and store settings in the remote which has a battery anyway. plus if you take into the equation the additional production footprint for the standby function even a standby that makes sense otherwise may become totally pointless. meaning if the energy saved by using standby instead of just letting the system run is less over the lifetime of the device than the energy spent to add the standby function... Joseph McAllister pentax...@mac.com http://gallery.me.com/jomac -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On 2011-03-16 12:53 , Joseph McAllister wrote: A cry perhaps for a central computer in the home to maintain all settings of all appliances, allowing their power to be cut completely when not being used. Therefor allowing complete restoration when each is re-activated. Providing, of course, that the central computer, and the wireless circuitry such a system would demand, was actually a net savings of power. :-) what would make this possible is a communication protocol for all devices, similar to the protocols being developed for automobile electronics, which vastly simplify the wiring -- any device can be plugged into the power supply anywhere in the vehicle, and it responds to messages on the power line telling it to turn on/off or modulate ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
It's called X10. It's been around for a long time. On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 7:56 PM, steve harley p...@paper-ape.com wrote: On 2011-03-16 12:53 , Joseph McAllister wrote: A cry perhaps for a central computer in the home to maintain all settings of all appliances, allowing their power to be cut completely when not being used. Therefor allowing complete restoration when each is re-activated. Providing, of course, that the central computer, and the wireless circuitry such a system would demand, was actually a net savings of power. :-) what would make this possible is a communication protocol for all devices, similar to the protocols being developed for automobile electronics, which vastly simplify the wiring -- any device can be plugged into the power supply anywhere in the vehicle, and it responds to messages on the power line telling it to turn on/off or modulate ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- David Parsons Photography http://www.davidparsonsphoto.com Aloha Photographer Photoblog http://alohaphotog.blogspot.com/ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On Mar 16, 2011, at 7:56 PM, steve harley wrote: On 2011-03-16 12:53 , Joseph McAllister wrote: A cry perhaps for a central computer in the home to maintain all settings of all appliances, allowing their power to be cut completely when not being used. Therefor allowing complete restoration when each is re-activated. Providing, of course, that the central computer, and the wireless circuitry such a system would demand, was actually a net savings of power. :-) what would make this possible is a communication protocol for all devices, similar to the protocols being developed for automobile electronics, which vastly simplify the wiring -- any device can be plugged into the power supply anywhere in the vehicle, and it responds to messages on the power line telling it to turn on/off or modulate ... Smart appliances and smart electrical meters with in-home control and monitoring panels are already a reality. Our local utility is developing some prototype test circuits in a limited number of communities. They just installed a smart meter on my house. It can communicate with a control center and ultimately with appliances in my house and a control panel. It will bill electricity at different rates depending o the time of day (cheaper at night of course). In conjunction with the control panel,, it can determine when appliances should turn on and shut off. That mans laundry and dishwashing can be done in the middle of the night when rates are lower. Standby electronics can be switched off at certain times of the day and automatically restarted at programmed times. It will also enable the power company to know when and where a failure has occurred. And the network control center will sometimes be able to reroute electricity around the failure. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
It's the X-10 modules themselves that draw power all the time looking for d'code to activate, isn't it? On Mar 16, 2011, at 17:18 , David Parsons wrote: It's called X10. It's been around for a long time. On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 7:56 PM, steve harley p...@paper-ape.com wrote: On 2011-03-16 12:53 , Joseph McAllister wrote: A cry perhaps for a central computer in the home to maintain all settings of all appliances, allowing their power to be cut completely when not being used. Therefor allowing complete restoration when each is re-activated. Providing, of course, that the central computer, and the wireless circuitry such a system would demand, was actually a net savings of power. :-) what would make this possible is a communication protocol for all devices, similar to the protocols being developed for automobile electronics, which vastly simplify the wiring -- any device can be plugged into the power supply anywhere in the vehicle, and it responds to messages on the power line telling it to turn on/off or modulate ... -- It's not that life is too short, it's that you're dead for so long.. — Anon Joseph McAllister pentax...@mac.com http://gallery.me.com/jomac -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
eckinator wrote: 2011/3/15 Dario Bonazza dario.bona...@virgilio.it: On a side note, wouldn't it be time to 'verboten' the sales of standby-equipped devices? Manufactures have all the technology required to get rid of that utter nonsense. since when is omission a technology? =) or are referring to simple on/off switches like they had before all that crap was introduced? but I totally agree. obviously. seeing my previous rant... I meant to be ironic. We all know that plain on/off switches have been available for many decades and of course manufacturers can choose from a plethora of memory devices to retain settings when the damn thing is totally off. Hence no technology to invent/develop is involved for reducing such kind of energy consumption. What are governments waiting for putting standby outlaw like plastic bags? Dario -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On 2011-03-15 11:35 , Dario Bonazza wrote: I meant to be ironic. We all know that plain on/off switches have been available for many decades and of course manufacturers can choose from a plethora of memory devices to retain settings when the damn thing is totally off. Hence no technology to invent/develop is involved for reducing such kind of energy consumption. it can take a while for the systems in a device to boot, which leads to customer dissatisfaction; enabling instant boot is more expensive because more memory and programming are needed to completely restore the state of a system than to simply restore settings i think the figures for overall standby power consumption have a lot to do with older systems, or devices that don't benefit from standby; for systems that do benefit, standby can be engineered to take very low power, perhaps more cheaply than instant-on for complex, computer-based devices -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
2011/3/15 Dario Bonazza dario.bona...@virgilio.it: What are governments waiting for putting standby outlaw like plastic bags? the right campaign donation (or bribe maybe?) from the right people... if the industry can pay off politicos why can greenpeace et al. not do so? greenpeace is a big buck corporation itself after all... hell, even the hells angels's german president is close friends with ex chancellor schröder... I doubt he'd have been above taking money from sea shepherd or peta etc... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On Tue, Mar 15, 2011 at 1:35 PM, Dario Bonazza dario.bona...@virgilio.it wrote: What are governments waiting for putting standby outlaw like plastic bags? While not outlawed, the EU has placed limits on the power consumption of devices in standby. See for example: http://www.dssw.co.uk/blog/2010/02/13/eu-policy-on-stand-by-power-consumption-for-electrical-equipment/ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On 16 March 2011 04:54, steve harley p...@paper-ape.com wrote: it can take a while for the systems in a device to boot, which leads to customer dissatisfaction; enabling instant boot is more expensive because more memory and programming are needed to completely restore the state of a system than to simply restore settings i think the figures for overall standby power consumption have a lot to do with older systems, or devices that don't benefit from standby; for systems that do benefit, standby can be engineered to take very low power, perhaps more cheaply than instant-on for complex, computer-based devices Indeed, it's very easy to oversimplify. The combination of use patterns, utility and power consumption during standby must be considered. Computers are a case in point, in order to be power efficient they need to consume some standby power, in good systems the standby power is now in the order of 1W for off and 2W for standby (instant on). The fact is that people will be happier to set their power saving functionality to power down the system over a shorter period of non-activity if the unit will spring back into action at the touch of the keyboard or power button. I know I will hit the power button now when I walk away from my computer knowing that it will take mere seconds to reactivate. This type of system functionality and user behaviour will generally promote net savings in energy use over a day, so the standby power is worth the expenditure. Everyone should have or have access to a precision power meter so that they can analysis the power consumption of all their electrical equipment. Some items are surprisingly efficient others are woeful but without a proper means of assessment it's all a big guess. -- Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
2011/3/15 Rob Studdert distudio.p...@gmail.com: Indeed, it's very easy to oversimplify. The combination of use patterns, utility and power consumption during standby must be considered. Computers are a case in point, in order to be power efficient they need to consume some standby power, in good systems the standby power is now in the order of 1W for off and 2W for standby (instant on). The fact is that people will be happier to set their power saving functionality to power down the system over a shorter period of non-activity if the unit will spring back into action at the touch of the keyboard or power button. I know I will hit the power button now when I walk away from my computer knowing that it will take mere seconds to reactivate. This type of system functionality and user behaviour will generally promote net savings in energy use over a day, so the standby power is worth the expenditure. Everyone should have or have access to a precision power meter so that they can analysis the power consumption of all their electrical equipment. Some items are surprisingly efficient others are woeful but without a proper means of assessment it's all a big guess. good point with regard to more complex systems. different for mere on/off functionality replaced by standby. NVRAM and EEPROM are cheap and fast. saving settings shouldn't be such a big whoop. and there are more energy efficient ways to do that. a simple AA rechargeable. or you could even go one step further and store settings in the remote which has a battery anyway. plus if you take into the equation the additional production footprint for the standby function even a standby that makes sense otherwise may become totally pointless. meaning if the energy saved by using standby instead of just letting the system run is less over the lifetime of the device than the energy spent to add the standby function... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On 16 March 2011 08:50, eckinator eckina...@gmail.com wrote: good point with regard to more complex systems. different for mere on/off functionality replaced by standby. NVRAM and EEPROM are cheap and fast. saving settings shouldn't be such a big whoop. and there are more energy efficient ways to do that. a simple AA rechargeable. or you could even go one step further and store settings in the remote which has a battery anyway. plus if you take into the equation the additional production footprint for the standby function even a standby that makes sense otherwise may become totally pointless. meaning if the energy saved by using standby instead of just letting the system run is less over the lifetime of the device than the energy spent to add the standby function... Honestly these days it's probably cheaper to manufacture a system with soft power control than a physical power switch, power control is built into virtually all modern switch mode power controllers. -- Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
2011/3/15 Rob Studdert distudio.p...@gmail.com: Honestly these days it's probably cheaper to manufacture a system with soft power control than a physical power switch, power control is built into virtually all modern switch mode power controllers. good point, maybe I was wrong there. thanks! -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On 16 March 2011 08:50, eckinator eckina...@gmail.com wrote: good point with regard to more complex systems. different for mere on/off functionality replaced by standby. NVRAM and EEPROM are cheap and fast. saving settings shouldn't be such a big whoop. and there are more energy efficient ways to do that. a simple AA rechargeable. or you could even go one step further and store settings in the remote which has a battery anyway. plus if you take into the equation the additional production footprint for the standby function even a standby that makes sense otherwise may become totally pointless. meaning if the energy saved by using standby instead of just letting the system run is less over the lifetime of the device than the energy spent to add the standby function... I should add too that on my always on systems I allow my spare CPU cycles to mash away at BIONC projects such as http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/research/cep2/overview.do -- Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: pentax to close customer service center etc because ofrollingblackouts in Japan
On Mar 16, 2011, at 6:54 AM, steve harley wrote: it can take a while for the systems in a device to boot, which leads to customer dissatisfaction; enabling instant boot is more expensive because more memory and programming are needed to completely restore the state of a system than to simply restore settings Tell that to the idiots who designed my HDD recorder. The boot time from standby is abysmal. And it has to finish booting before I can even open the DVD tray. Too bad if I'd forgotten to remove the disc - surely it could be made possible to open the tray without activating the whole machine. IMHO consumer devices that need more than a few seconds to switch on are getting it wrong, standby or not. Dave -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
