Re: qa.perl.org
Please note this is cross posted. 2010/1/2 James E Keenan jkeen_via_goo...@yahoo.com Leo Lapworth wrote: 3) Phalanx Though in one sense it pains me to say it, Phalanx does not need to be a major tab. It can be demoted to a link somewhere. snip history of the project I have put it is as a tab on the right called 'old projects'. I removed the 'Coordination' section and also dropped the link to 'Tasks to be done'. I also added 'finished' to the title. Thanks for the feedback. Leo
Re: qa.perl.org
Hi, Leo :)
A few comments,
Leo Lapworth said:
2010/1/2 James E Keenan jkeen_via_goo...@yahoo.com
3) Phalanx
Though in one sense it pains me to say it, Phalanx does not need to
be a major tab. It can be demoted to a link somewhere.
snip history of the project
I have put it is as a tab on the right called 'old projects'.
I removed the 'Coordination' section and also dropped the link to 'Tasks to
be done'.
I also added 'finished' to the title.
Would you mind changing this to something less final? There are a
few marketing considerations, see:
Old = inactive | established; # Which one?
Major tab = Decision about visibility; # What needs more visibility?
Finished = Nothing more to do; # Sure? Is visibility still useful?
Removing or adding topics/projects from the (any!) frontpage will
quite likely have a major impact on those projects. Before doing so, I
ask you to consider a few things:
1) Do the projects have any worthwhile qualities that makes them good
to keep around (keep visible) even if activity levels are down?
2) To what extent can the webpages be used for recruiting people to
useful projects? Is it better to repurpose a page to make people
want to join/help instead of demoting the page to historical value
only?
3) What context is the most useful one to promote a project within?
(Finished? Current projects? Community efforts?)
I suggest that the qa.perl.org frontpage does NOT link to old
(which in a software context usually is interpreted as defunct,
bad, lacking maintainance or not updated) projects at all.
Instead, be REALLY careful about calling something old and only
reserve words like that for projects that we'd like to kill off.
Pick another phrase instead - preferrably something that communicates
the fact that a project is interesting/worth learning about and
relevant for the reader in some way.
Also, keep in mind that the page needs to stay around for a long time,
and that whenever someone reads it, the pages need to convey the
impression of actuality (updatedness, relevance, that it's current)
no matter if the page is read next week or next year. Avoid
time-related words like still, now, old, upcoming etc..
The point here is to make the pages read as fresh even if
qa.perl.org is a volunteer effort where the volunteers by default have
almost no time to help. (Everyone having jobs/life/family/kids/etc.
should have as little negative impact as possible on the updatedness
of the page. ;)
Hope this is useful! :)
- Salve
--
#!/usr/bin/perl
sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen
getc DATA}$='};{';@_=unpack(C*,unpack(u*,':4@,$'.# s...@foo.no
'2!--5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'.\n));eval {'@_'}; __END__ is near! :)
Re: qa.perl.org
James E Keenan said:
I learned a tremendous amount about testing, code coverage and
writing testable code from the Phalanx project -- knowledge which
has served me well, particularly in the Parrot project. The
approach to 'phalanx'-ing a module can be applied by anyone (and I'm
happy to mentor people on that).
Would you be interested in putting your experiences into a Howto
form? (preferrably as terse as possible)
I think the Phalanx project is still useful as a concept and as a
teaching tool and if we should repurpose the Phalanx page into
something more useful than the mission statement/overview type page
we have now, then this would be it. :)
But, to the best of my knowledge, there's no active Phalanx project
per se at the present time. So it doesn't need to be quite so
prominent on qa.perl.org.
I'd instead decide prominence on the _intention_ of activity, not the
current state or the history of the project. What do we WANT to do is
more important than what has been done (the point here is to convey
the fact that the Perl QA has a future, and that it's more important
than what has been done.)
- Salve
--
#!/usr/bin/perl
sub AUTOLOAD{$AUTOLOAD=~/.*::(\d+)/;seek(DATA,$1,0);print# Salve Joshua Nilsen
getc DATA}$='};{';@_=unpack(C*,unpack(u*,':4@,$'.# s...@foo.no
'2!--5-(50P%$PL,!0X354UC-PP%/0\`'.\n));eval {'@_'}; __END__ is near! :)
Re: qa.perl.org
For the record, I'll second Barbie's suggestion. David On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 4:16 AM, Barbie bar...@missbarbell.co.uk wrote: On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 10:10:48PM -0500, David Golden wrote: On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 4:54 PM, Leo Lapworth l...@cuckoo.org wrote: 2) Testing CPAN Shaun, would you mind looking at this? - Just needs a quick review/update The CPAN Testers stuff looks fine to me. The Daily Build section should really go to a new tab Testing Perl or Testing Perl Source or Testing Core Perl or something along those lines. Not sure it needs an extra tab, but perhaps renaming the current tab to TESTING CPAN PERL. There are CPAN Testers that submit test reports to CPAN Testers Reports for blead-perl as well as the Perl Smokers sending reports to the daily-build.reports archive, so although the two are different, and largely have different testers, there is still a slight overlap. Then you could have 2 H2 headings on the page, Testing CPAN and Testing Perl to differentiate the 2. Cheers, Barbie. -- Birmingham Perl Mongers http://birmingham.pm.org Memoirs Of A Roadie http://barbie.missbarbell.co.uk CPAN Testers Blog http://blog.cpantesters.org YAPC Conference Surveys http://yapc-surveys.org
Re: qa.perl.org
Hi, 2010/1/2 Salve J Nilsen s...@pvv.org A few comments, Thanks. Leo Lapworth said: 2010/1/2 James E Keenan jkeen_via_goo...@yahoo.com 3) Phalanx Though in one sense it pains me to say it, Phalanx does not need to be a major tab. It can be demoted to a link somewhere. snip history of the project I have put it is as a tab on the right called 'old projects'. I removed the 'Coordination' section and also dropped the link to 'Tasks to be done'. I also added 'finished' to the title. Would you mind changing this to something less final? There are a few marketing considerations, see: Old = inactive | established; # Which one? Major tab = Decision about visibility; # What needs more visibility? Finished = Nothing more to do; # Sure? Is visibility still useful? I've renamed Old to Archive, but you've not actually told me what would be best for the other stuff. snip Hope this is useful! :) I see your points... but I know nothing about the project/history, so can only be guided by what I'm told on this list :) If you are able please join http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/perl-org-patches and give me specific patches. Hilary is working on a set of 'introduction to testing' type content for the qa site, personally I'd suggest that has far more value to the site than spending too much time on the Phalanx section, but I do understand your points so will happily take patches. Cheers Leo
Re: qa.perl.org
I missed this - apologies. Now uploaded. Cheers Leo 2010/1/2 David Golden xda...@gmail.com For the record, I'll second Barbie's suggestion. David On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 4:16 AM, Barbie bar...@missbarbell.co.uk wrote: On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 10:10:48PM -0500, David Golden wrote: On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 4:54 PM, Leo Lapworth l...@cuckoo.org wrote: 2) Testing CPAN Shaun, would you mind looking at this? - Just needs a quick review/update The CPAN Testers stuff looks fine to me. The Daily Build section should really go to a new tab Testing Perl or Testing Perl Source or Testing Core Perl or something along those lines. Not sure it needs an extra tab, but perhaps renaming the current tab to TESTING CPAN PERL. There are CPAN Testers that submit test reports to CPAN Testers Reports for blead-perl as well as the Perl Smokers sending reports to the daily-build.reports archive, so although the two are different, and largely have different testers, there is still a slight overlap. Then you could have 2 H2 headings on the page, Testing CPAN and Testing Perl to differentiate the 2. Cheers, Barbie. -- Birmingham Perl Mongers http://birmingham.pm.org Memoirs Of A Roadie http://barbie.missbarbell.co.uk CPAN Testers Blog http://blog.cpantesters.org YAPC Conference Surveys http://yapc-surveys.org
Re: qa.perl.org
# from Leo Lapworth # on Saturday 02 January 2010 08:35: I've renamed Old to Archive, but you've not actually told me what would be best for the other stuff. Archive still implies Old. Why not take the tab out of the navigation bar entirely? Or, at least add one more level and make the tab be History, then history.html is a page which says a href=phalanxPhalanx 100/a started in 2003... Perhaps somebody would like to put together a more comprehensive QA timeline including the development of TAP, Test::Simple, c? --Eric -- It is a mistake to allow any mechanical object to realize that you are in a hurry. --Ralph's Observation --- http://scratchcomputing.com ---
Re: qa.perl.org
How about inactive rather than archive or old. -- Shaun Fryer On Sat, Jan 2, 2010 at 1:36 PM, Eric Wilhelm enoba...@gmail.com wrote: # from Leo Lapworth # on Saturday 02 January 2010 08:35: I've renamed Old to Archive, but you've not actually told me what would be best for the other stuff. Archive still implies Old. Why not take the tab out of the navigation bar entirely? Or, at least add one more level and make the tab be History, then history.html is a page which says a href=phalanxPhalanx 100/a started in 2003... Perhaps somebody would like to put together a more comprehensive QA timeline including the development of TAP, Test::Simple, c? --Eric -- It is a mistake to allow any mechanical object to realize that you are in a hurry. --Ralph's Observation --- http://scratchcomputing.com ---
Re: qa.perl.org
I've renamed to 'inactive' for now. I like Eric's idea about history if someone wants to create that. Cheers Leo 2010/1/2 Shaun Fryer sfr...@sourcery.ca How about inactive rather than archive or old. -- Shaun Fryer On Sat, Jan 2, 2010 at 1:36 PM, Eric Wilhelm enoba...@gmail.com wrote: # from Leo Lapworth # on Saturday 02 January 2010 08:35: I've renamed Old to Archive, but you've not actually told me what would be best for the other stuff. Archive still implies Old. Why not take the tab out of the navigation bar entirely? Or, at least add one more level and make the tab be History, then history.html is a page which says a href=phalanxPhalanx 100/a started in 2003... Perhaps somebody would like to put together a more comprehensive QA timeline including the development of TAP, Test::Simple, c? --Eric -- It is a mistake to allow any mechanical object to realize that you are in a hurry. --Ralph's Observation --- http://scratchcomputing.com ---
Re: qa.perl.org
--- On Sat, 2/1/10, Leo Lapworth l...@cuckoo.org wrote: From: Leo Lapworth l...@cuckoo.org I've renamed to 'inactive' for now. I like Eric's idea about history if someone wants to create that. I'll second that. From a pure marketing perspective, archive, inactive and old all imply dead. History implies more of a narrative. Cheers, Ovid -- Buy the book - http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/perlhks/ Tech blog- http://use.perl.org/~Ovid/journal/ Twitter - http://twitter.com/OvidPerl Official Perl 6 Wiki - http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl6
Re: qa.perl.org
# from Leo Lapworth # on Saturday 02 January 2010 10:57: I've renamed to 'inactive' for now. I like Eric's idea about history if someone wants to create that. add one more level and make the tab be History, then history.html is a page which says a href=phalanxPhalanx 100/a started in 2003... Perhaps somebody would like to put together a more comprehensive QA timeline including the development of TAP, Test::Simple, c? You don't have to have a comprehensive timeline to create a history.html -- just put something on a page. I think we have some concensus on structuring it like that. Here: pa href=phalanx/Phalanx/a started in 2003.../p pPlease a href=siteinfo.htmlcontact the site maintainers/a with updates to this list./p Then we can do away with the $adjective Projects tab (which is incorrectly plural anyway), yes? Thanks, Eric -- The opinions expressed in this e-mail were randomly generated by the computer and do not necessarily reflect the views of its owner. --Management --- http://scratchcomputing.com ---
camels
Hi all, Am I alone here in thinking that we should be using the Onion trademark rather than O'Reilly's trademark camel on the perl.org sites? Thanks, Eric -- But as to modern architecture, let us drop it and let us take modernistic out and shoot it at sunrise. --F.L. Wright --- http://scratchcomputing.com ---
Re: camels
On Saturday 02 January 2010 at 18:59, Eric Wilhelm wrote: Am I alone here in thinking that we should be using the Onion trademark rather than O'Reilly's trademark camel on the perl.org sites? I agree completely. Using someone else's trademark is asking for trouble. (If promissory estoppel even exists with regard to trademark law, I'm not certain perl.org will always continue to have it.) -- c
