[GENERAL] Re: anti Christian bias?

2001-04-14 Thread Robert Vogt IV

To all,

Ok, this is ridiculous.

>> On page 29 of the PostgreSQL User's Guide, distributed with version 7.0.3,
>> in table 3-8 Postgres Date Input, the last item in the Example column is
>> January 8, 99 BC.  The corresponding Description item reads "Year 99 before
>> the Common Era".  The author or the editor of this manual is obviously
>> expressing his anti Christian bias in attempting to redefine BC to mean
>>
>> "Common Era".  Throughout history BC, when associated with a date, has
>> always stood for "Before Christ", and it always will.  I challenge the
>> author/editor to tell us exactly what is the significant event in history
>> that marks the boundary of what he chooses to call "Common Era".

BCE (Before the Common Era) is a standard term used in the historical
sciences to keep from offending non-Christians.  I suggest you pull out a
high school textbook _before_ ranting in the future.

Oh - and don't try to say I'm anti-Christian - I'm a Roman Catholic.


Sincerely,


Robert Vogt IV

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Re: [GENERAL] Re: anti Christian bias?

2001-04-14 Thread Brett W. McCoy

On Sat, 14 Apr 2001, Stefan Waidele jun. wrote:

> How specific is BCE?
> 1973 Before the Current Era my birth year,
> but _only_ under that very pro-christian
> assumption that BC = BCE !

This brings up another question nto related to religion but just time
keeping in PostgreSQL: can PostgreSQL handle completely different time
systems, like say that of the Muslims or the Jews?  They don't use BC, CE,
BCE, etc.  How would PostgreSQL handle somehting like that?

-- Brett
   http://www.chapelperilous.net/btfwk/

It is not doing the thing we like to do, but liking the thing we have to do,
that makes life blessed.
-- Goethe


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[GENERAL] Re: anti Christian bias?

2001-04-14 Thread Stefan Waidele jun.

I might not be able to change the standard but:

How specific is BCE?
1973 Before the Current Era my birth year,
but _only_ under that very pro-christian
assumption that BC = BCE !


the last item in the Example column is January 8, 99 BC.
The corresponding Description item reads "Year 99 before the Common Era".


Now in case the era changes, what will the Postgres manual read?
The quote will be wrong, since 99 BC then means 99 year before the 
preceding era.

This was my personal opinion. In my mega-sig, You will find (part of) my 
personal belief.

Stefan

-- 
I now this sig is far too long.

Christ himself promised us a world with anti-christian attitude and 
persecution of christians.
So we should not blame non-christians for moving further away from our 
believes.

Ban of school prayers, change of era, shifting attitudes towards sex, ...
Don't blame the people. Times are changing, but Jesus told us they would, 
2000 years ago.
They will change even further, he also told us that.

Why do we take our saviours birth year as a date-reference?
Not because I believe in Christ!
To be honest I do it, because it is convenient. Everybody does it, so why 
shouldn't I?
And that is also the reason why Muslims, Jews and Hindi take _our_ saviours 
year
as a reference, when talking to people from other cultures.

At 09:22 14.04.2001 -0500, Jan Wieck wrote:
>Bruce Momjian wrote:
>[...]
> Is  it  allowed  to borrow the Cristian rules even if I don't
> believe in God and don't pray?  Do they fall under  the  GPCL
> (General  Public  Christian  License) or are they distributed
> under a BSDish style license?

Martin Luther was the Bible's Richard Stallman.
He claimed the Bible back into the hands of the public.
Open Source vs. Closed Source

>What if I link myself to them -
> does  all  I'm doing then become property of the pope or some
> church?

When the Jews linked them against gods law-library (at run-time, on the run 
from the Egyptians :-),
they became his, but in return he became theirs.
You have to decide if it is worth it.

> I'm not able to find any applicable disclaimers in my copy of
> the  Bible.

That is the good thing about god: No disclaimers
We live, he cares. That is it. He stands up to his word and does not sneak 
out of his guaranties

>   A  quick  look  into  the  Koran didn't show up
> anything either.

Don't know anything about those, but they are kind of mutually exclusive.
Mixing in this case does not do any good.
Like IE for Linux :-)



TO SUM IT UP:

No offense intended


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Re: [GENERAL] 7.1 dumps with large objects

2001-04-14 Thread Tom Larard

On Sat, 14 Apr 2001, David Wall wrote:
> It seems that 7.1 is able to handle large objects in its dump/restore
> natively now and no longer requires the use of the contrib program to dump
> them.  Large objects are represented by OIDs in the table schema, and I'm
> trying to make sure that I understand the process correctly from what I've
> read in the admin guide and comand reference guide.

Hmmn, as you clearly know how to dump blobs in the old versions, can you
tell me how to do it, or point me in the direction of the 'contrib'
program that you spoke of?

Thanks


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[GENERAL] 7.1 dumps with large objects

2001-04-14 Thread David Wall

Wonderful job on getting 7.1 released.  I've just installed it in place of a
7.1beta4 database, with the great advantage of not even having to migrate
the database.

It seems that 7.1 is able to handle large objects in its dump/restore
natively now and no longer requires the use of the contrib program to dump
them.  Large objects are represented by OIDs in the table schema, and I'm
trying to make sure that I understand the process correctly from what I've
read in the admin guide and comand reference guide.

In my case, the OID does not mean anything to my programs, and they are not
used as keys.  So I presume that I don't really care about preserving OIDs.
Does this just mean that if I restore a blob, it will get a new OID, but
otherwise everything will be okay?

This is my plan of attack:

To backup my database (I have several databases running in a single
postgresql server, and I'd like to be able to back them up separately since
they could move from one machine to another as the loads increase), I'll be
using:

pg_dump -b -Fc dbname > dbname.dump

Then, to restore, I'd use:

pg_restore -d dbname dbname.dump

Is that going to work for me?

I also noted that pg_dump has a -Z level specifier for compression.  When
not specified, the backup showed a compression level of "-1" (using
pg_restore -l).  Is that the highest compression level, or does that mean it
was disabled?  I did note that the -Fc option created a file that was larger
than a plain file, and not anywhere near as small as if I gzip'ed the
output.  In my case, it's a very small test database, so I don't know if
that's the reason, or whether -Fc by itself doesn't really compress unless
the -Z option is used.

And for -Z, is 0 or 9 the highest level compression?  Is there a particular
value that's generally considered the best tradeoff in terms of speed versus
space?

Thanks,
David


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Re: [GENERAL] sets and insert-select with rule

2001-04-14 Thread Tom Lane

"Gyozo Papp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> How can I solve this ? Maybe an upgrade to v7.1 blows the whole thing out?

Possibly.  It's hard to tell what your problem is with such an
incomplete, fuzzily-described example.  But there have been a number
of bugs fixed in that general area.

regards, tom lane

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Re: [GENERAL] 7.1 SRPM woes (Mandrake 7.2)

2001-04-14 Thread Lamar Owen

Len Morgan wrote:
> Am I missing something?  I am assuming that since Mandrake RPMs were done
> before, they are not the same as the RedHat RPMs and I will have to rebuild
> from source.  I tried the build from the RPM directory (as stated above) and
> from the SPECS directory as stated in the "Maximum RPM" book both with the
> same result.

What version of Python does Mandrake 7.2 have? (rpm -qa|grep python).

I have actually found the 'everything' installs sometimes aren't
actually 'everything' -- makesure the python-devel package is installed.

Conversely, build everything but the python package by:
rpm --define "python 0" -ba postgresql.spec
--
Lamar Owen
WGCR Internet Radio
1 Peter 4:11

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[GENERAL] 7.1 SRPM woes (Mandrake 7.2)

2001-04-14 Thread Len Morgan

I'm sure my problem relates more to my ignorance than the srpm set but here
goes:

I am trying to build on a Mandrake 7.2 system (rpm v3.0.5)

The source install (rpm -i postgresql-7.1-1.src.rpm) seemed to do everything
it was supposed to.  I followed the directions in the README.rpm-dist file
as far as they went.  I assume that the "rpm building area" is /usr/src/RPM
on Mandrake and CDed there.

According to "Maximum RPM" page 132, I should only have to type:

rpm -ba postgresql-7.1-1.spec and all will be right with the world.
Instead, I get several pages of messages (I can't seem to |more them or > to
a file) the last one being about a failed dependancy for Python.  When I
installed the Mandrake, I told it to install EVERYTHING so I don't think I
should be missing any compilers/libraries/headers etc.

Am I missing something?  I am assuming that since Mandrake RPMs were done
before, they are not the same as the RedHat RPMs and I will have to rebuild
from source.  I tried the build from the RPM directory (as stated above) and
from the SPECS directory as stated in the "Maximum RPM" book both with the
same result.

Advice?  I'll be more than glad to upload my finished RPMs when I'm done.

Len Morgan


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[GENERAL] sets and insert-select with rule

2001-04-14 Thread Gyozo Papp



Hello,
 
 
First of all: I' m using postgresql v7.0.2 on debian 2.2. (and I have two 
completely different questions)
 
 
i) What is the most effective representation of 
type "set" in postgres?
As I remember there is no attribute type to 
represent definitely sets. (Please, correct me 
if  I'm wrong.)
Arrays  and bitstrings seem to serve this 
purpose, but what about performance regarding to the commonly 
used set operation (is in, union, etc)?
 
ii) When  I execute the following 
query:
 
=> INSERT INTO stat (vendor_id, c_date, c_num) 
SELECT vendor_id, current_date, count(*) FROM device_id in (...) GROUP BY 
vendor_id;
I get an error message something like 
"ExecAggrEval(), aggregate function is not available here". 
(this is surely not what I get back if it's needed 
I post the right message )
 
I know what cause the problem... 
I create a rule on table stat that turns an 
INSERT query into UPDATE if there's already a record with the same vendor_id and 
c_date.
=> CREATE RULE  r_logstat AS ON INSERT TO 
stat 
->  WHERE EXISTS (SELECT * FROM stat 
WHERE vendor_id = new.vendor_id AND c_date= new.c_date)
->  DO INSTEAD UPDATE stat SET c_num = 
c_num + new.c_num WHERE vendor_id = new.vendor_id AND c_date= 
new.c_date;
if the rule is not invoked everything goes fine, 
but if  there is a row that should be updated instead of INSERT the 
query fails.
How can I solve this ? Maybe an upgrade to v7.1 
blows the whole thing out?
- Papp Gyozo - 


Re: [GENERAL] anti Christian bias?

2001-04-14 Thread Brett W. McCoy

On Sat, 14 Apr 2001, Jan Wieck wrote:

> Is  it  allowed  to borrow the Cristian rules even if I don't
> believe in God and don't pray?  Do they fall under  the  GPCL
> (General  Public  Christian  License) or are they distributed
> under a BSDish style license? What if I link myself to them -
> does  all  I'm doing then become property of the pope or some
> church?

I think the Artistic License would apply here.  Larry Wall (another geeky
Christian) would probably approve. :-)

-- Brett
   http://www.chapelperilous.net/btfwk/

The way to a man's heart is through the left ventricle.


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[GENERAL] 7.1RC2->7.1 Final dump/restore needed?

2001-04-14 Thread Konstantinos Agouros

Hi,

I have one machine running 7.1RC2, that I now want to upgrade to 7.1final.
I guess I don't need a dump restore then?

Konstantin
-- 
Dipl-Inf. Konstantin Agouros aka Elwood Blues. Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Otkerstr. 28, 81547 Muenchen, Germany. Tel +49 89 69370185

"Captain, this ship will not sustain the forming of the cosmos." B'Elana Torres

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Re: [GENERAL] Is PostgreSQL database write to cooked files?

2001-04-14 Thread Peter Eisentraut

Raymond Chui writes:

> I am wonder are those files under $PGDATA/data/base/dbname/
> directory cooked files?
> Can I copy or ftp them to other machine running PostgreSQL without
> export/import (pg_dump)?

No.

-- 
Peter Eisentraut  [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://yi.org/peter-e/


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Re: [GENERAL] anti Christian bias?

2001-04-14 Thread Lamar Owen

Jan Wieck wrote:
> I'm not able to find any applicable disclaimers in my copy of
> the  Bible.   A  quick  look  into  the  Koran didn't show up
> anything either.

FWIW, the 1611 King James text is in the Public Domain, as is the source
Hebrew and Greek from which it is translated.  That of course means that
there is no copyright associated with it; thus no license at all.
--
Lamar Owen
WGCR Internet Radio
1 Peter 4:11

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Re: [GENERAL] anti Christian bias?

2001-04-14 Thread Jan Wieck

Bruce Momjian wrote:
> > On Fri, 13 Apr 2001, Karl DeBisschop wrote:  > As for postgresql
> > having an anit-Christian bias? I think Lamar and > Bruce, among
> > others, could not be accused of an anti-Christian bias.
> >
> > Thanks, Karl.
> >
> > As a matter of fact, I am an ordained Baptist minister.  Don't
> > know about Bruce -- other than I like his catchy .sig... :-)
>
> Wow, pretty cool.  I am just an underling.  :-)
>
> > If anyone asks about my .sig, I witness accordingly.  Otherwise,
> > I'm not pushy -- not in this venue, at least.
>
> Becoming a Christian was the best thing that ever happened to me, and I
> want to share that, but I don't want to make people uncomfortable
> either.

Yeah, another religious thread :-)

Is  it  allowed  to borrow the Cristian rules even if I don't
believe in God and don't pray?  Do they fall under  the  GPCL
(General  Public  Christian  License) or are they distributed
under a BSDish style license? What if I link myself to them -
does  all  I'm doing then become property of the pope or some
church?

I'm not able to find any applicable disclaimers in my copy of
the  Bible.   A  quick  look  into  the  Koran didn't show up
anything either.


Jan

--

#==#
# It's easier to get forgiveness for being wrong than for being right. #
# Let's break this rule - forgive me.  #
#== [EMAIL PROTECTED] #



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[GENERAL] Storing Photographs in Postgres?

2001-04-14 Thread B.N.V. Raman

Hi All,

Is there a way to store photographs in postgres? I'm creating an employee
master kind of thing, so i would like to store photos of my company
employees also. If there is, is there a file size limitation or something?

Regards,

Raman.


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Re: [GENERAL] Order in CREATE VIEW

2001-04-14 Thread Oliver Elphick

Tom Lane wrote:
  >"Oliver Elphick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
  >> A view creates a virtual table; there is no implicit ordering in a table,
  >> so it follows that you should not be able to impose one in a view.
  >
  >This is indeed the pure-SQL attitude, but it may be worth pointing out
  >that Postgres 7.1 does allow ORDER BY in subselects and views anyway.
 
I see I was out of date. Sorry!

-- 
Oliver Elphick[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Isle of Wight  http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver
PGP: 1024R/32B8FAA1: 97 EA 1D 47 72 3F 28 47  6B 7E 39 CC 56 E4 C1 47
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 "Be strong, and let your heart take courage, all you 
  who hope in the Lord."   Psalm 31:24 



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Re: [GENERAL] Backend sent D message without prior T

2001-04-14 Thread Tom Lane

Jeff Eckermann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Based on past posts I have read, this error is usually associated with
> running out of memory for the query result.  Problem is, I am only
> expecting about 30 lines of moderate length to be returned

Have you verified that by doing
select count(*) from ... where ...
Watching psql's memory usage with top(1) is another way to check whether
a memory overrun might be happening.

The 'D message without prior T' followed by unexpected switch into COPY
mode certainly suggests that libpq has lost sync with the backend's
output.  I am not aware of any failure modes that cause that in 7.0.3,
other than the aforementioned out-of-memory problem.

regards, tom lane

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Re: [GENERAL] Order in CREATE VIEW

2001-04-14 Thread Tom Lane

"Oliver Elphick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> A view creates a virtual table; there is no implicit ordering in a table,
> so it follows that you should not be able to impose one in a view.

This is indeed the pure-SQL attitude, but it may be worth pointing out
that Postgres 7.1 does allow ORDER BY in subselects and views anyway.

The main reason that that seems like a good idea (IMHO at least) is that
ORDER BY together with LIMIT allow you to select specific rows in ways
that are difficult to accomplish otherwise.

regards, tom lane

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Re: [GENERAL] Help on PGSQL

2001-04-14 Thread will trillich

On Fri, Apr 13, 2001 at 02:28:29PM +0530, Masood Rezvi wrote:
> We are a firm of web developers in Lucknow, India. We are new
> to PGSQL but have this database on the webserver (Apache
> running on Linux Red Hat). We need help on learning PGSQL
> information on tutorials and also to know whether it is
> available for download. Please help.

if postgresql came without psql as a front-end, i'd venture to
say something got borked during your download. (of course, being
a debian user i'm a bit pampered when it comes to things "working
out of the box"...)

try

psql

and see if it's in your command line. if not, try

locate psql

or

find / -name psql -print

probably the most trouble you'll have, once you can communicate
with the postmaster backend server, is in your first connection.

$ su
# su postgres
$ psql

it comes set up to allow user 'postgres' to connect; so once you
connect as postgres, you can set up other users, so you can
connect directly. (clear as mud, right? maybe another iteration
and someone else will help straighten this out.)

also see the documentation in the user lounge at postgresql.org !

-- 
americans should never read anything so subversive as what's at
http://www.salon.com/people/col/pagl/2001/03/21/spring/index1.html

[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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[GENERAL] Re: Access 97/Postgres migration

2001-04-14 Thread Steve Jorgensen

I have significant experience using Access with Microsoft SQL Server,
and the situation is similar.  Even when the server has something like
an Auto-increment or Identity column type, using it will be
problematic.  The best thing you can to is to make your own
auto-increment system.

For each regular table, add a table to the database with a single row
and 2 columns.  The first coumn is a dummy primary key so Access will
allow you to update the table, and the second column is a counter for
the next available primary key value for the associated data table.
To obtain and secure a primary key value for a new record in the
table, begin a transaction, read the value, save the value incremented
by one and commit the transaction.  If an error occurs during the
transaction, roll it back, and don't use the value.

If that sounds like a hassle, it is, but it's not as bad as it sounds,
and it's nothing compared to the hassles you'll encounter if you try
to do it any other way.

On Wed, 11 Apr 2001 15:18:38 GMT, ZHU Jia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>Hi there,
>
>we are considering using Postgres as our new backend DB. But we have a rather 
>complicated Access application which we need to migrate. The idea is to export all 
>the tables from Access to Postgres, then 
>link them back using ODBC so that the Access interface will remain untouched.
>I just wonder how it would work with the auto_increment data type of Access, I've 
>read that Postgres has the data type "Serial" but it doesn't seem that I can insert a 
>value into it because it should be 
>generated automatically. Now the problem is how can I convert the existing IDs 
>(primary key) to serial?
>And would this setup work well at all? Is there anything I should keep in mind from 
>the beginning?
>Any hints or tips would be highly appreciated, and many thanks in advance!
>
>regards
>ZHU Jia
>
>


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[GENERAL] How to get libpq.dll for 7.1 RCs

2001-04-14 Thread Steve Jorgensen

OK, I've decided to get PostgreSQL running on Windows by using the 7.1
RC2 build that is now available through the Cygwin setup.  I was
finally able to build, install, and run it.

Now, I'm going to need to run pgAccess under native Windows and
connect to the PostgreSQL server, but the pgAccess documentation says
I will need the version of libpq that goes with my version of
PostgreSQL.  The PostgreSQL build/install under Cygwin does make a
Cygwin library, "libpq.a", but no "libpg.dll".

Any advice?

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Re: [GENERAL] Order in CREATE VIEW

2001-04-14 Thread will trillich

On Wed, Apr 11, 2001 at 10:25:24AM +0200, Marcin Wasilewski wrote:
> hello everybody,
> Can you help me?
> 
> I have POSTGRESQL 7.0.3,
> I try to create simple view by typing.
> 
> create view "xx" as select "aa.yy", "bb.yy" from "yy" order by "bb.yy"
> 
> the problem is that parameter order is not implemented with create view.
> so how can I create such simple query??

unless your table "yy" has fields "aa.yy" and "bb.yy" (or
something like "first name" or "client's phone") i'd start by
revising that to something like:

create view
"xx" as
select
"aa"."yy",
"bb"."yy"
from
"yy"
order by
"bb"."yy"
;

but even there you still have problems:

table aa field yy
table bb field yy
-> the names will collide (two fields named yy in the view)

plus, there's no definition of how the two tables relate to each
other.

not knowing what your example is based on, how about something
like this...

create view
xx as
-- and here comes a regular old SELECT statement:
select
aa.yy as aa_yy_or_whatever,
bb.yy as bb_yy_you_get_the_idea
from
aa,
bb
where
aa.somefield = bb.otherfield
order by
bb.yy
;


-- 
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