Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-31 Thread Stefan Kaltenbrunner

Peter Eisentraut wrote:

On Thursday 29 January 2009 11:40:48 Stefan Kaltenbrunner wrote:

well from a quick glance there is the bugzilla demo install as well as
pieces of reviewboard and patchwork on the trackerdemo jail.


So what's the URL and where can we sign up?


resurrected the install and subscribed it to pgsql-hackers:

http://trackerdemo.postgresql.org

however it seems that it won't deal with patches that just have
Content-Type: text/plain (like: 
http://archives.postgresql.org/pgsql-hackers/2009-01/msg02586.php) - 
seems not to hard to fix from a quick glance at the code however.



Stefan

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-30 Thread Zdenek Kotala

Stefan Kaltenbrunner píše v čt 29. 01. 2009 v 18:29 +0100:
 Peter Eisentraut wrote:
  On Thursday 29 January 2009 11:40:48 Stefan Kaltenbrunner wrote:
  well from a quick glance there is the bugzilla demo install as well as
  pieces of reviewboard and patchwork on the trackerdemo jail.
  
  So what's the URL and where can we sign up?
 
 note the pieces part of my mail :-) As far as I recall the patchworks 
 install somehow collided with the reviewboard one so it was disabled 
 because Zdenek was still actively using reviewboard.

I don't use it at this moment. You can disable reviewboard if you want.

Zdenek


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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Stefan Kaltenbrunner

Magnus Hagander wrote:



On 29 jan 2009, at 05.35, Bruce Momjian br...@momjian.us wrote:


Peter Eisentraut wrote:

On Tuesday 27 January 2009 23:59:46 Magnus Hagander wrote:

Marko Kreen wrote:

On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:

On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:

Such app already exists:

 http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/

So it's a matter of just setting it up.


I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)


Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
solution it would be good to try existing solution first.


IIRC, we already installed and tried this a while ago. I don't remember
exactly what it failed on, but there was something pretty clear. But
maybe it's been fixed by now.


Details?  I find no public record of this.


I think it was Keystone;  Marc set it up.


Not at all. That was *ages* ago. This was recently, and I was part of 
setting it up myself...


In fact we still have the jail running ...


Stefan

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Magnus Hagander
Stefan Kaltenbrunner wrote:
 Magnus Hagander wrote:


 On 29 jan 2009, at 05.35, Bruce Momjian br...@momjian.us wrote:

 Peter Eisentraut wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 23:59:46 Magnus Hagander wrote:
 Marko Kreen wrote:
 On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:
 Such app already exists:

  http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/

 So it's a matter of just setting it up.

 I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)

 Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
 solution it would be good to try existing solution first.

 IIRC, we already installed and tried this a while ago. I don't
 remember
 exactly what it failed on, but there was something pretty clear. But
 maybe it's been fixed by now.

 Details?  I find no public record of this.

 I think it was Keystone;  Marc set it up.

 Not at all. That was *ages* ago. This was recently, and I was part of
 setting it up myself...
 
 In fact we still have the jail running ...

That's reviewboard AFAIK, or do we also have one with patchwork? Which one?

//Magnus

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Stefan Kaltenbrunner

Magnus Hagander wrote:

Stefan Kaltenbrunner wrote:

Magnus Hagander wrote:


On 29 jan 2009, at 05.35, Bruce Momjian br...@momjian.us wrote:


Peter Eisentraut wrote:

On Tuesday 27 January 2009 23:59:46 Magnus Hagander wrote:

Marko Kreen wrote:

On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:

On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:

Such app already exists:

 http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/

So it's a matter of just setting it up.

I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)

Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
solution it would be good to try existing solution first.

IIRC, we already installed and tried this a while ago. I don't
remember
exactly what it failed on, but there was something pretty clear. But
maybe it's been fixed by now.

Details?  I find no public record of this.

I think it was Keystone;  Marc set it up.

Not at all. That was *ages* ago. This was recently, and I was part of
setting it up myself...

In fact we still have the jail running ...


That's reviewboard AFAIK, or do we also have one with patchwork? Which one?


well from a quick glance there is the bugzilla demo install as well as 
pieces of reviewboard and patchwork on the trackerdemo jail.



Stefan

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Thursday 29 January 2009 11:40:48 Stefan Kaltenbrunner wrote:
 well from a quick glance there is the bugzilla demo install as well as
 pieces of reviewboard and patchwork on the trackerdemo jail.

So what's the URL and where can we sign up?

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Stefan Kaltenbrunner

Peter Eisentraut wrote:

On Thursday 29 January 2009 11:40:48 Stefan Kaltenbrunner wrote:

well from a quick glance there is the bugzilla demo install as well as
pieces of reviewboard and patchwork on the trackerdemo jail.


So what's the URL and where can we sign up?


note the pieces part of my mail :-) As far as I recall the patchworks 
install somehow collided with the reviewboard one so it was disabled 
because Zdenek was still actively using reviewboard.



Stefan



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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Josh Berkus

All,

Thing is, our review/commit process is so peculiar to our project that 
using *any* prebuilt solution would require us to change our process to 
support the tool. And I can't imagine this group doing that.


--Josh

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Joshua D. Drake
On Thu, 2009-01-29 at 10:18 -0800, Josh Berkus wrote:
 All,
 
 Thing is, our review/commit process is so peculiar to our project that 
 using *any* prebuilt solution would require us to change our process to 
 support the tool. And I can't imagine this group doing that.

I am not sure I agree with this.

Someone submits patch
 ticket is created
 reviewer takes ticket
 comments
submitter takes ticket
 fixes based on comments
review takes ticket
 approves
if reviewer is a committers, he commits.
if reviewer isn't he set the ticket to need final review
tickets that are in that state are reviewed by commiters.

Sounds like standard stuff to me.

Joshua D. Drake


 
 --Josh
 
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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Josh Berkus

Josh,


Someone submits patch
 ticket is created
 reviewer takes ticket
 comments
submitter takes ticket
 fixes based on comments
review takes ticket
 approves
if reviewer is a committers, he commits.
if reviewer isn't he set the ticket to need final review
tickets that are in that state are reviewed by commiters.

Sounds like standard stuff to me.


But that's *not* actually how we do things.  So you're making my point.


--Josh

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-29 Thread Tom Lane
Josh Berkus j...@agliodbs.com writes:
 But that's *not* actually how we do things.  So you're making my point.

Well, the stuff around the wiki status board is pretty new and I don't
think anyone feels that it's set in stone yet.  The thing we don't want
to compromise on, IMHO, is that the long-term record of what's happened
is in the mailing list archives and *not* in the internal state of some
tool we happen to be using.  (One obvious reason for not compromising
on that is that we'd be locked into whatever tool we first pick.)
But it doesn't really matter whether the tool thinks it has archival
state, as long as we can make it link to the archives conveniently.

regards, tom lane

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-28 Thread Magnus Hagander
Peter Eisentraut wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 23:59:46 Magnus Hagander wrote:
 Marko Kreen wrote:
 On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:
   Such app already exists:
  
 http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/
  
   So it's a matter of just setting it up.

 I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)
 Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
 solution it would be good to try existing solution first.
 IIRC, we already installed and tried this a while ago. I don't remember
 exactly what it failed on, but there was something pretty clear. But
 maybe it's been fixed by now.
 
 Details?  I find no public record of this.

I don't recall specifically :-( Which in itself might mean it's
worthwhile to make another try. But i recall trying that one and
reviewboard, and none of them was what we needed.

If you look at Berkus' list of required features (if you haven't seen
it, I'm sure he'll be happy to send you a copy), you will see that it
doesn't come close. We can always argue if his list is reasonable :-),
but that's just a fact. It has nothing about round-robin reviewers. It
has no keep-track-of-nagging features. It has no integration with our
mail archives. At least it didn't then - it also appears to have no
online documentation, so I can't easily check now :-P

//Magnus


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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-28 Thread Cédric Villemain
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Magnus Hagander a écrit :
 Peter Eisentraut wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 23:59:46 Magnus Hagander wrote:
 Marko Kreen wrote:
 On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:
   Such app already exists:
  
 http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/
  
   So it's a matter of just setting it up.

 I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)
 Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
 solution it would be good to try existing solution first.
 IIRC, we already installed and tried this a while ago. I don't remember
 exactly what it failed on, but there was something pretty clear. But
 maybe it's been fixed by now.
 Details?  I find no public record of this.
 
 I don't recall specifically :-( Which in itself might mean it's
 worthwhile to make another try. But i recall trying that one and
 reviewboard, and none of them was what we needed.
 
 If you look at Berkus' list of required features (if you haven't seen
 it, I'm sure he'll be happy to send you a copy), 

Josh, can you please give the link to this list of feature ?

 you will see that it
 doesn't come close. We can always argue if his list is reasonable :-),
 but that's just a fact. It has nothing about round-robin reviewers. It
 has no keep-track-of-nagging features. It has no integration with our
 mail archives. At least it didn't then - it also appears to have no
 online documentation, so I can't easily check now :-P
 
 //Magnus
 
 


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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Dave Page
On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 1:42 PM, Alvaro Herrera
alvhe...@commandprompt.com wrote:

 As for somewhere to host it, we certainly have some servers; not tons,
 but probably enough.  Some of them even have Postgres running on it.

We can certainly host an app under postgresql.org. The bigger issue
will be speccing it to meet the requirements of the community without
getting bogged down in bike shedding.


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EnterpriseDB UK:   http://www.enterprisedb.com

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Magnus Hagander
Dave Page wrote:
 On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 1:42 PM, Alvaro Herrera
 alvhe...@commandprompt.com wrote:
 
 As for somewhere to host it, we certainly have some servers; not tons,
 but probably enough.  Some of them even have Postgres running on it.
 
 We can certainly host an app under postgresql.org. The bigger issue
 will be speccing it to meet the requirements of the community without
 getting bogged down in bike shedding.

I have started some very trivial work around this a while ago with the
intent to get something simple up and working before too much bike
shedding is done. I'll contact Robert off-list to discuss that. If
somebody else - who actively works with what we have now!! - is
interested in that discussion, let me know.

Will obviously take it on-list before any decisions are made. So far I'm
just talking about discussing a prototype.

//Magnus

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Marko Kreen
On 1/27/09, Alvaro Herrera alvhe...@commandprompt.com wrote:
 Robert Haas escribió:
   I think that it would probably be pretty easy to write a webapp to
   replace the CommitFest web page that basically did the same thing but
   with a bit more structure around it - with database tables like
   commitfest, patch, patch_version, patch_comment, and
   patch_review.  I think I might even be willing to write such a
   webapp if someone would be willing to provide the infrastructure.  The
   CommitFest web page was really useful this time around, but it's not
   conducive to any kind of automated pull.

  Hey, if you're willing to do it, we're certainly accepting proposals.
  The current wiki-based CommitFest is supposed to be just a stop-gap.  It
  was started not only to support 8.4 development, but also as a test of
  the Commitfest idea itself.  This has proven so successful that it's
  clear we should be going somewhere with it.

  As for somewhere to host it, we certainly have some servers; not tons,
  but probably enough.  Some of them even have Postgres running on it.

Such app already exists:

  http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/

So it's a matter of just setting it up.

-- 
marko

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Robert Haas
 I have started some very trivial work around this a while ago with the
 intent to get something simple up and working before too much bike
 shedding is done. I'll contact Robert off-list to discuss that. If
 somebody else - who actively works with what we have now!! - is
 interested in that discussion, let me know.

 Will obviously take it on-list before any decisions are made. So far I'm
 just talking about discussing a prototype.

Sounds good.  I think we will have the best chance of success if we
keep it real simple.  I don't want this to turn into a propaganda war
about using everyone's favorite tool.  I just want to write down a
database schema that mimics the organization of the existing wiki
page, put a thin web interface around it, and call it a day.  It will
take longer to analyze whether some other tool is sufficiently close
to that than it will to write a tool that is exactly that.

...Robert

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Brendan Jurd
On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 1:35 AM, Robert Haas robertmh...@gmail.com wrote:
 I have started some very trivial work around this a while ago with the
 intent to get something simple up and working before too much bike
 shedding is done. I'll contact Robert off-list to discuss that. If
 somebody else - who actively works with what we have now!! - is
 interested in that discussion, let me know.

I'm very interested in that discussion.  I don't know whether I am
actively working with what we have now, but that's because since I
wrote the original template structure, it hasn't changed a whole lot.
Most of the tweaking has had to do with presentation, and massaging
mediawiki to do what we wanted.

As Alvaro points out, the wiki approach was intended to provide a
stop-gap solution to patch tracking, and also to help us identify what
we actually needed from a patch tracker, so that we could make a
sensible decision about which tool to use when we did eventually move
forward.


 Will obviously take it on-list before any decisions are made. So far I'm
 just talking about discussing a prototype.

 Sounds good.  I think we will have the best chance of success if we
 keep it real simple.  I don't want this to turn into a propaganda war
 about using everyone's favorite tool.  I just want to write down a
 database schema that mimics the organization of the existing wiki
 page, put a thin web interface around it, and call it a day.  It will
 take longer to analyze whether some other tool is sufficiently close
 to that than it will to write a tool that is exactly that.


I can understand the desire to avoid a propaganda war.  These
discussions have borne little fruit previously, in part because we
haven't had a clear idea of what was actually required from the tool.

I think the picture has started to become more clear during the 8.4
dev cycle.  Most importantly, there was much ado made about the need
for powerful email integration features in previous discussions.  This
severely restricted our choices (possibly to zero?).  I feel that the
commitfest wiki has demonstrated that no such integration is required.
 Everyone wants to keep on using the mailing list for discussion, but
we need somewhere else to keep track of patches and their status.

To my knowledge, authors have been happy to add patches to the wiki
and reviewers have been happy to update their status with no email
integration whatsoever.  We've continued to discuss things on the
lists, while updating the wiki as required.

If we forget about trying to integrate with email, the field opens
right up and we can use pretty much any just-install-the-package
tracking software out there and it will get the job done.  For the
sake of not advocating my favourite tool, I won't name any
particular software, but I can think of several off the top of my head
that could mirror the structure we currently have on the wiki without
stretching.

I think it's possible to skip the roll our own step in all of this
and just move on to using a ready-made solution.  In reality our
requirements are very simple.  Writing a low-fi version of the wiki
would be pretty easy, but just dropping the patch data we already have
into a patch tracker would be even easier.

Cheers,
BJ

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Robert Haas
 I think it's possible to skip the roll our own step in all of this
 and just move on to using a ready-made solution.  In reality our
 requirements are very simple.  Writing a low-fi version of the wiki
 would be pretty easy, but just dropping the patch data we already have
 into a patch tracker would be even easier.

Well, if you're volunteering to set something up... great.  We'll take
a look at it when you have it working.

That's not what I'm volunteering to do, though.

...Robert

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Tom Lane
Brendan Jurd dire...@gmail.com writes:
 I think the picture has started to become more clear during the 8.4
 dev cycle.  Most importantly, there was much ado made about the need
 for powerful email integration features in previous discussions.  This
 severely restricted our choices (possibly to zero?).  I feel that the
 commitfest wiki has demonstrated that no such integration is required.

Hardly --- one of the most critical usability fixes for the wiki was to
make it relatively painless to insert links to the mail list archives
(even for messages that hadn't made it there yet!).  We're still gonna
need that.  I agree that we found out that we don't need to be able to
send mail directly to the patch tracker, although perhaps cc'ing it
would be a nice way to get such links installed.

The other thing that is commonly thought of as email integration
is the ability to generate notification email, which AFAIK the wiki
does have (I haven't felt a need for it, but other people might be
using that).

regards, tom lane

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Josh Berkus

Tom,


The other thing that is commonly thought of as email integration
is the ability to generate notification email, which AFAIK the wiki
does have


Um, no.  It doesn't, and really can't.

Notifying everyone who's updated the page isn't terribly useful.

--Josh


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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Tom Lane
Josh Berkus j...@agliodbs.com writes:
 Tom,
 The other thing that is commonly thought of as email integration
 is the ability to generate notification email, which AFAIK the wiki
 does have

 Um, no.  It doesn't, and really can't.

Oh.  What's that watch this page option do, then?

regards, tom lane

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Josh Berkus

Tom,


Oh.  What's that watch this page option do, then?


Notifies you when anyone makes any change of any kind to *any* patch (or 
piece of text, for that matter) in the commitfest.  Including something 
like changing the number of patches assigned to an RRR.


My inability to systematically send reminder e-mails to submitters and 
reviewers -- or for that matter, even track when they were assigned or 
last updated -- has been a significant drag on the effectiveness of the 
commitfests.  Some patches stalled, and I missed them.


--Josh




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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Tom Lane
Josh Berkus j...@agliodbs.com writes:
 Tom,
 Oh.  What's that watch this page option do, then?

 Notifies you when anyone makes any change of any kind to *any* patch (or 
 piece of text, for that matter) in the commitfest.  Including something 
 like changing the number of patches assigned to an RRR.

Okay, so it does have notification ability and you do want that, you
just want it on a different granularity level.

 My inability to systematically send reminder e-mails to submitters and 
 reviewers -- or for that matter, even track when they were assigned or 
 last updated -- has been a significant drag on the effectiveness of the 
 commitfests.  Some patches stalled, and I missed them.

Agreed, that would be helpful, and the wiki doesn't help you with it.
So we want a patch tracker that can do that.

regards, tom lane

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Tom Lane escribió:
 Josh Berkus j...@agliodbs.com writes:
  Tom,
  The other thing that is commonly thought of as email integration
  is the ability to generate notification email, which AFAIK the wiki
  does have
 
  Um, no.  It doesn't, and really can't.
 
 Oh.  What's that watch this page option do, then?

It allows you to click on a special watched pages link, which then
lists the last few revisions for each of them.  So it has two problems
-- one is the wrong granularity level, and the other is that it's pull
rather than push.

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Alvaro Herrerahttp://www.CommandPrompt.com/
PostgreSQL Replication, Consulting, Custom Development, 24x7 support

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:
 Such app already exists:

   http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/

 So it's a matter of just setting it up.

I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Marko Kreen
On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:
   Such app already exists:
  
 http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/
  
   So it's a matter of just setting it up.


 I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)

Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
solution it would be good to try existing solution first.

-- 
marko

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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Magnus Hagander
Marko Kreen wrote:
 On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:
 On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:
   Such app already exists:
  
 http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/
  
   So it's a matter of just setting it up.


 I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)
 
 Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
 solution it would be good to try existing solution first.

IIRC, we already installed and tried this a while ago. I don't remember
exactly what it failed on, but there was something pretty clear. But
maybe it's been fixed by now.

//Magnus


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Re: Commitfest infrastructure (was Re: [HACKERS] 8.4 release planning)

2009-01-27 Thread Peter Eisentraut
On Tuesday 27 January 2009 23:59:46 Magnus Hagander wrote:
 Marko Kreen wrote:
  On 1/27/09, Peter Eisentraut pete...@gmx.net wrote:
  On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:51:02 Marko Kreen wrote:
Such app already exists:
   
  http://ozlabs.org/~jk/projects/patchwork/
   
So it's a matter of just setting it up.
 
  I was in fact in the process of setting that up just now. :-)
 
  Nice to know. :)   I feel that even if we decide to do our own
  solution it would be good to try existing solution first.

 IIRC, we already installed and tried this a while ago. I don't remember
 exactly what it failed on, but there was something pretty clear. But
 maybe it's been fixed by now.

Details?  I find no public record of this.

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