Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on the SqueakJS virtual machine (was "PharoJS")

[Craig Latta]

Hi Aik-Siong--

> Great news for Pharo. I presume it will be after you are done with
> Squeak running on SqueakJS.

 Now that I've gotten a release of Caffeine out[1], and written some
blog posts about it[2], I've turned my attention to Pharo in web
browsers. I also want Squeak and Pharo in web browsers to communicate
with their native counterparts, and with other Smalltalks. My goal is a
federation of live collaborating Smalltalk nodes on the net. I also have
SqueakJS controlling and reprogramming NodeJS instances.

> Do you have a roadmap?

 Bert and I worked on it a bit at ESUG 2016, and it was going
alright. Very conservatively, I expect to have it finished this year
sometime.

> How will WebAssembly help or not with project?

 I think WebAssembly will enable us to run Cog, with the usual web
security compromises. That's also something I'm interested in working
on. It may make the SqueakJS virtual machine obsolete.


 thanks,

-C

[1] https://caffeine.js.org
[2] https://thiscontext.com

--
Craig Latta
Black Page Digital
Amsterdam :: San Francisco
cr...@blackpagedigital.com
+31   6 2757 7177 (SMS ok)
+ 1 415  287 3547 (no SMS)

[Pharo-users] Logging in with VNC

[sergio ruiz]

Hey, all..

I need to be able to log in to my production image with VNC until i am 
comfortable with the command line interface. I know that every time i have had 
to do it, it seems like i used a different package.

Which package is everyone using these days for remote GUI access?

Thanks!



peace,
sergio
photographer, journalist, visionary

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[Pharo-users] Custom Glamour browser for Dr. Geo scripting

[Hilaire]

Hi,

I try to build a dedicated browser for user scripting on DrGeo. I am
learning from the Deep into Pharo Glamour chapter, extending the given
example.

Regarding the method category pane, I need both instance and class side,
so I write it like this:

categoriesIn: constructor
constructor list
   title: 'Methods';
   display: [ :scriptClass | scriptClass organization categories].
constructor list
   title: 'Script data';
   display: [ :scriptClass | scriptClass class organization categories]


The browser is defined as:


buildBrowser
   browser := GLMTabulator new.
   browser
  column: #scripts;
  column: #categories;
  column: #methods.
browser transmit to: #scripts; andShow: [ :a | self scriptsIn: a ].
browser transmit from: #scripts; to: #categories; andShow: [ :a | self
categoriesIn: a ].
browser transmit from: #scripts; from: #categories; to: #methods;
   andShow: [:a | self methodsIn: a  ].
browser transmit from: #scripts; from: #categories; to: #methods;
   andShow: [:a | self classMethodsIn: a  ].
browser transmit from: #scripts; toOutsidePort: #selectedScript.
browser transmit from: #methods; toOutsidePort: #selectedMethod.
^ browser


but something is missing to get the listed method right depending on the
category is instance or class side. I don't how to do it.

Any tips?

Thanks

Hilaire

-- 
Dr. Geo
http://drgeo.eu

[Pharo-users] Anyone in Oslo ?

[Alexandre Bergel]

Hi!

I am in Oslo for a couple of days. Anyone up for a beer ?

Cheers,
Alexandre

-- 
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel  http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

[Pharo-users] Question about writeStream

[Jérémie Regnault]

Hi,

I am writing tests with streams, and I noticed that a stream opened on a 
string doesn't close, but FileStreams do close. Is it normal ?

-- 
Jérémie Regnault

Re: [Pharo-users] Question about writeStream

[Sven Van Caekenberghe]

> On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:07, Jérémie Regnault  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I am writing tests with streams, and I noticed that a stream opened on a 
> string doesn't close, but FileStreams do close. Is it normal ?

How do you mean that ? That FileStreams close automatically ? 

That is indeed the case, that they are closed as a finalization action (i.e. 
when they become garbage), but that I consider that a fail safe thing, not 
something you should rely on. They should be properly closed, like 
#readStreamDo: and #writeStreamDo: do.

Streams over collections such as Strings do not need closing, as there is no 
opening either. But general stream code better does.

> -- 
> Jérémie Regnault
> 

[Pharo-users] Pharo6 playground saving semantics and .changes?

[Tim Mackinnon]

Hi - I really like the playground metaphor, it really is such a nice way to 
experiment.

However I've noticed that unlike older versions of Smalltalk, it seems that 
DoIt operations in playground don't end up in the .changes file anymore (which 
I guess is a mixed blessing when you want to recover). It seems that the new 
metaphor is that work you do is saved as a page and you can see versions of 
your page in the upper right menu? Well sort of - as I haven't quite understood 
when it saves or doesn't? Often I get duplicate looking pages in that menu and 
often I make a change and want to keep it but find it doesn't save and if I 
accidentally close my playground my changes in a page are lost? 

What are the semantics of page saving?

An example  - if you do a few gofer loads of utilities and the put a comment on 
the first line of the page (which gives it a nice title in the page dropdown), 
sometimes that comment will be saved other times not?

I also think it might be nice to remove page versions to help tidy things up. 
I'm thinking of rolling my sleeves up on this idea - but wanted to understand 
the vision firsts

Tim

Sent from my iPhone


Sent from my iPhone

[Pharo-users] Pharo command line, stdout and integrating with other tools?

[Tim Mackinnon]

Hi - I've been playing with using Pharo with Aws lambda and have got an image 
to launch in that environment.

However now I need to better integrate Pharo with its calling environment - and 
I know there was a concerted effort to make Pharo play better which I should be 
able to leverage.

So I am calling  Pharo from a NodeJS wrapper  (the suggested aws method for 
integrating alternative languages like Ruby, Go etc).

I got this to work - however as an observation, it is rather awkward passing 
parameters to Pharo using the "eval" mechanism as other languages and 
environments frequently use the " character (particularly with Json)  and this 
causes Pharo to fail if you don't \" this. I'm wondering if others have noted 
this and whether we can do this better somehow? For now a little nodeJS regex 
fu gets me past it. 

However my next question is about passing information back to the calling 
application.

I can see that there is a stdout method on Fikestream that I can write to 
(great), however in my ./pharo eval call, which sends to a class method doing 
this - it also returns the result of that method or yourself? I guess this 
convention is great for the "eval 42 factorial" example but not so great of you 
just want to return some Json via stdout in a format of the calling 
environment? 

Is there something simple trick I can do to  stop this extra result and just 
let me use stdout myself? Or do I have to return a Smalltalk string and then 
regex convert it to a new format in my calling language?

I'm wondering if others have done this, or if anyone has some advice?

It feels like a usecase that we might be able to do better somehow?

Tim

Sent from my iPhone

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo6 playground saving semantics and .changes?

[Sven Van Caekenberghe]

One of the more hidden Playground features are named Pages. Double-click the 
page tab title and give it a name, it will then be saved automagically in 
pharo-local/play-stash (and auto saves on changes from then on). I use that all 
the time.

> On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:45, Tim Mackinnon  wrote:
> 
> Hi - I really like the playground metaphor, it really is such a nice way to 
> experiment.
> 
> However I've noticed that unlike older versions of Smalltalk, it seems that 
> DoIt operations in playground don't end up in the .changes file anymore 
> (which I guess is a mixed blessing when you want to recover). It seems that 
> the new metaphor is that work you do is saved as a page and you can see 
> versions of your page in the upper right menu? Well sort of - as I haven't 
> quite understood when it saves or doesn't? Often I get duplicate looking 
> pages in that menu and often I make a change and want to keep it but find it 
> doesn't save and if I accidentally close my playground my changes in a page 
> are lost? 
> 
> What are the semantics of page saving?
> 
> An example  - if you do a few gofer loads of utilities and the put a comment 
> on the first line of the page (which gives it a nice title in the page 
> dropdown), sometimes that comment will be saved other times not?
> 
> I also think it might be nice to remove page versions to help tidy things up. 
> I'm thinking of rolling my sleeves up on this idea - but wanted to understand 
> the vision firsts
> 
> Tim
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on the SqueakJS virtual machine

[Craig Latta]

 Well, that didn't take as long as I thought. :)  Probably due to
progress Bert made since we looked at it at ESUG 2016.

 For more details, see https://tinyurl.com/y727fz4a
(thiscontext.com). Let the bugfixing begin. :)


 thanks again,

-C

--
Craig Latta
Black Page Digital
Amsterdam :: San Francisco
cr...@blackpagedigital.com
+31   6 2757 7177 (SMS ok)
+ 1 415  287 3547 (no SMS)

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on the SqueakJS virtual machine

[Pavel Krivanek]

WOW!!!

Thank you all very much for this effort.

-- Pavel



2017-06-29 18:56 GMT+02:00 Craig Latta :

>
>  Well, that didn't take as long as I thought. :)  Probably due to
> progress Bert made since we looked at it at ESUG 2016.
>
>  For more details, see https://tinyurl.com/y727fz4a
> (thiscontext.com). Let the bugfixing begin. :)
>
>
>  thanks again,
>
> -C
>
> --
> Craig Latta
> Black Page Digital
> Amsterdam :: San Francisco
> cr...@blackpagedigital.com
> +31 6 2757 7177 (SMS ok)
> + 1 415 287 3547 (no SMS)
>
>

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on the SqueakJS virtual machine

[Sven Van Caekenberghe]

> On 29 Jun 2017, at 19:14, Pavel Krivanek  wrote:
> 
> WOW!!!

+10

> Thank you all very much for this effort.
> 
> -- Pavel
> 
> 
> 
> 2017-06-29 18:56 GMT+02:00 Craig Latta :
> 
>  Well, that didn't take as long as I thought. :)  Probably due to
> progress Bert made since we looked at it at ESUG 2016.
> 
>  For more details, see https://tinyurl.com/y727fz4a
> (thiscontext.com). Let the bugfixing begin. :)
> 
> 
>  thanks again,
> 
> -C
> 
> --
> Craig Latta
> Black Page Digital
> Amsterdam :: San Francisco
> cr...@blackpagedigital.com
> +31 6 2757 7177 (SMS ok)
> + 1 415 287 3547 (no SMS)
> 
> 

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on the SqueakJS virtual machine

[Pavel Krivanek]

If I understand it well, for a local copy we need:

clone repository:
git clone g...@github.com:ccrraaiigg/ccrraaiigg.github.io.git

inside the clone to run a webserver, e.g.:
python -m SimpleHTTPServer 9090

then go to: http://localhost:9090/pharo/squeakjspharo.html

-- Pavel

2017-06-29 18:56 GMT+02:00 Craig Latta :

>
>  Well, that didn't take as long as I thought. :)  Probably due to
> progress Bert made since we looked at it at ESUG 2016.
>
>  For more details, see https://tinyurl.com/y727fz4a
> (thiscontext.com). Let the bugfixing begin. :)
>
>
>  thanks again,
>
> -C
>
> --
> Craig Latta
> Black Page Digital
> Amsterdam :: San Francisco
> cr...@blackpagedigital.com
> +31 6 2757 7177 (SMS ok)
> + 1 415 287 3547 (no SMS)
>
>

Re: [Pharo-users] Question about writeStream

[Guillermo Polito]

In fact the question comes from the fact that they are not polymorphic and
you should know if you're manipulating a closable stream or not...

Maybe a solution is indeed to use #writeStreamDo:, that should behave well
even for in-memory, collection streams, no?

On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 4:58 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe  wrote:

>
> > On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:07, Jérémie Regnault 
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > I am writing tests with streams, and I noticed that a stream opened on a
> > string doesn't close, but FileStreams do close. Is it normal ?
>
> How do you mean that ? That FileStreams close automatically ?
>
> That is indeed the case, that they are closed as a finalization action
> (i.e. when they become garbage), but that I consider that a fail safe
> thing, not something you should rely on. They should be properly closed,
> like #readStreamDo: and #writeStreamDo: do.
>
> Streams over collections such as Strings do not need closing, as there is
> no opening either. But general stream code better does.
>
> > --
> > Jérémie Regnault
> >
>
>
>


-- 



Guille Polito


Research Engineer

French National Center for Scientific Research - *http://www.cnrs.fr*




*Web:* *http://guillep.github.io* 

*Phone: *+33 06 52 70 66 13

[Pharo-users] [ANN] An evening with Pharo and the ESP32 microcontroller

[Ben Coman]

Nothing too dramatic, but for a hardware hackathon I'm attending I wanted
some online material I could expose to people to who hadn't heard of Pharo
before.   Maybe some Pharo regulars might also find it of interest.  All
comments welcome.

http://blog.openinworld.com/2017/06/evening-with-pharo-esp32/

cheers -ben

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo6 playground saving semantics and .changes?

[Tim Mackinnon]

Cool - I was missing that insight.

Tim

Sent from my iPhone

> On 29 Jun 2017, at 18:04, Sven Van Caekenberghe  wrote:
> 
> One of the more hidden Playground features are named Pages. Double-click the 
> page tab title and give it a name, it will then be saved automagically in 
> pharo-local/play-stash (and auto saves on changes from then on). I use that 
> all the time.
> 
>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:45, Tim Mackinnon  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi - I really like the playground metaphor, it really is such a nice way to 
>> experiment.
>> 
>> However I've noticed that unlike older versions of Smalltalk, it seems that 
>> DoIt operations in playground don't end up in the .changes file anymore 
>> (which I guess is a mixed blessing when you want to recover). It seems that 
>> the new metaphor is that work you do is saved as a page and you can see 
>> versions of your page in the upper right menu? Well sort of - as I haven't 
>> quite understood when it saves or doesn't? Often I get duplicate looking 
>> pages in that menu and often I make a change and want to keep it but find it 
>> doesn't save and if I accidentally close my playground my changes in a page 
>> are lost? 
>> 
>> What are the semantics of page saving?
>> 
>> An example  - if you do a few gofer loads of utilities and the put a comment 
>> on the first line of the page (which gives it a nice title in the page 
>> dropdown), sometimes that comment will be saved other times not?
>> 
>> I also think it might be nice to remove page versions to help tidy things 
>> up. I'm thinking of rolling my sleeves up on this idea - but wanted to 
>> understand the vision firsts
>> 
>> Tim
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
> 
> 

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo6 playground saving semantics and .changes?

[Esteban A. Maringolo]

Please allow me a little rant here...

I still find disturbing the"autosave" feature without having the
option to explicitly save the contents in the filesystem as I did with
Workspaces. Sometimes I don't want the contents of a file/tab updated
by a criteria different than when to save the image, it is: my own
when I consider appropriate.

It's not I want to disable Playground by complete which I find useful
when integrated with the inlined insector, but I want to keep the
behavior of saving and restoring the contents under my control.

Privacywise I don't like the "history" of previous contents in the
Playground, the history it can be removed but it can't be disabled. I
can condense the changes file, but the Playground history remains.

Regards!


Esteban A. Maringolo


2017-06-29 17:12 GMT-03:00 Tim Mackinnon :
> Cool - I was missing that insight.
>
> Tim
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 18:04, Sven Van Caekenberghe  wrote:
>>
>> One of the more hidden Playground features are named Pages. Double-click the 
>> page tab title and give it a name, it will then be saved automagically in 
>> pharo-local/play-stash (and auto saves on changes from then on). I use that 
>> all the time.
>>
>>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:45, Tim Mackinnon  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi - I really like the playground metaphor, it really is such a nice way to 
>>> experiment.
>>>
>>> However I've noticed that unlike older versions of Smalltalk, it seems that 
>>> DoIt operations in playground don't end up in the .changes file anymore 
>>> (which I guess is a mixed blessing when you want to recover). It seems that 
>>> the new metaphor is that work you do is saved as a page and you can see 
>>> versions of your page in the upper right menu? Well sort of - as I haven't 
>>> quite understood when it saves or doesn't? Often I get duplicate looking 
>>> pages in that menu and often I make a change and want to keep it but find 
>>> it doesn't save and if I accidentally close my playground my changes in a 
>>> page are lost?
>>>
>>> What are the semantics of page saving?
>>>
>>> An example  - if you do a few gofer loads of utilities and the put a 
>>> comment on the first line of the page (which gives it a nice title in the 
>>> page dropdown), sometimes that comment will be saved other times not?
>>>
>>> I also think it might be nice to remove page versions to help tidy things 
>>> up. I'm thinking of rolling my sleeves up on this idea - but wanted to 
>>> understand the vision firsts
>>>
>>> Tim
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

[Pharo-users] Solved: ZdcPluginMissing: SSL/TLS plugin initailization failed (VM plugin missing ? OS libraries missing ?)

[Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas]

Hi,

Thanks Sven. This solves the problem. The issue was the 32 bit library.

I don't know if this should be added as some kind of annotation or
footnode to [1], because the chapter suposse a 32-bit Ubuntu Gnu/Linux
deployment, but some of us are going to try similar stuff in similar
environment, forgetting to install the 32 bits libraries. Anyway, if
there is any room for this, I would be happy to make the edition with
the respective pull request.

[1]
https://github.com/SquareBracketAssociates/EnterprisePharo/blob/master/WebApp/WebApp.pillar

Cheers,

Offray

Ps: Sorry to open a new thread. My mail was having some issues and
didn't get updated threads.

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo6 playground saving semantics and .changes?

[Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas]

Hi,

Tim, I have made a project, called Grafoscopio, that, in its core, is
about saving playgrounds and embed them into bigger context/narratives.
You can see more details and examples here:

[1] http://mutabit.com/grafoscopio/index.en.html

Still needs work to do, for example improving English documentation and
discoverability, as Glenn suggested (Spanish page is better ranked in
search engines), but maybe you find it interesting for what you're
looking for. See the page at [1] and the examples, to see what is
possible at the moment.

Cheers,

Offray

Ps: I share Esteban's concern on privacy and autosave feature, despite
of being useful, sometimes, for me and in the workshops. This behavior
should be disabled by default and turn on on user demand. (Maybe a tool
tip on first launch, like the one on anonymous metrics could help here
too).

On 29/06/17 15:55, Esteban A. Maringolo wrote:
> Please allow me a little rant here...
>
> I still find disturbing the"autosave" feature without having the
> option to explicitly save the contents in the filesystem as I did with
> Workspaces. Sometimes I don't want the contents of a file/tab updated
> by a criteria different than when to save the image, it is: my own
> when I consider appropriate.
>
> It's not I want to disable Playground by complete which I find useful
> when integrated with the inlined insector, but I want to keep the
> behavior of saving and restoring the contents under my control.
>
> Privacywise I don't like the "history" of previous contents in the
> Playground, the history it can be removed but it can't be disabled. I
> can condense the changes file, but the Playground history remains.
>
> Regards!
>
>
> Esteban A. Maringolo
>
>
> 2017-06-29 17:12 GMT-03:00 Tim Mackinnon :
>> Cool - I was missing that insight.
>>
>> Tim
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 18:04, Sven Van Caekenberghe  wrote:
>>>
>>> One of the more hidden Playground features are named Pages. Double-click 
>>> the page tab title and give it a name, it will then be saved automagically 
>>> in pharo-local/play-stash (and auto saves on changes from then on). I use 
>>> that all the time.
>>>
 On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:45, Tim Mackinnon  wrote:

 Hi - I really like the playground metaphor, it really is such a nice way 
 to experiment.

 However I've noticed that unlike older versions of Smalltalk, it seems 
 that DoIt operations in playground don't end up in the .changes file 
 anymore (which I guess is a mixed blessing when you want to recover). It 
 seems that the new metaphor is that work you do is saved as a page and you 
 can see versions of your page in the upper right menu? Well sort of - as I 
 haven't quite understood when it saves or doesn't? Often I get duplicate 
 looking pages in that menu and often I make a change and want to keep it 
 but find it doesn't save and if I accidentally close my playground my 
 changes in a page are lost?

 What are the semantics of page saving?

 An example  - if you do a few gofer loads of utilities and the put a 
 comment on the first line of the page (which gives it a nice title in the 
 page dropdown), sometimes that comment will be saved other times not?

 I also think it might be nice to remove page versions to help tidy things 
 up. I'm thinking of rolling my sleeves up on this idea - but wanted to 
 understand the vision firsts

 Tim

 Sent from my iPhone


 Sent from my iPhone

>>>
>>
>

[Pharo-users] Validate password with PBKDF2

[Francis via Pharo-users]

--- Begin Message ---
Hi folks

I'm playing with the PBKDF2 package of Udo:
http://www.smalltalkhub.com/#!/~UdoSchneider/PBKDF2
(thanks Udo), but I can't find how to validate a stored hash.
Can you point me in the right direction?

Thanks
Francis




--
View this message in context: 
http://forum.world.st/Validate-password-with-PBKDF2-tp4952973.html
Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

--- End Message ---

Re: [Pharo-users] Validate password with PBKDF2

[Paul DeBruicker]

Looks like you'll have to store the salt when making the original hash of the
password.  

With that you can do


| salt originalPassword userInputPassword originalHash  newHash secretKey |
salt:='salt'.
originalPassword:='password'.
userInputPassword:='12345678'.
originalHash:=PBKDF2 derivedKeySHA1Password: originalPassword salt: salt. 
newHash:=PBKDF2 derivedKeySHA1Password: userInputPassword salt: salt.

secretKey:= SecureRandom new nextBytes: 16.

((SHA256 new hmac key: secretKey) digestMessage: originalHash) = ((SHA256
new hmac key: secretKey) digestMessage: newHash).



We do the double SHA256 HMAC signing of the hashes because of
https://www.nccgroup.trust/us/about-us/newsroom-and-events/blog/2011/february/double-hmac-verification/

You can store the #secretKey and each user should get a new #salt every time
they change their password and you shouldn't reuse the salts for other users
or password.  

For PBKDF2 there is probably a max (or recommended) salt length but I don't
know it.  

I also don't know anything about the SecureRandom class but it says it on
the tin, so maybe it is.  Maybe not though.  I don't know how to find out.
But I don't know that it matters in this instance as its only used for the
SHA256 HMAC internally in the comparison function.


Hope this helps.  




Francis wrote
> Hi folks
> 
> I'm playing with the PBKDF2 package of Udo:
> http://www.smalltalkhub.com/#!/~UdoSchneider/PBKDF2
> (thanks Udo), but I can't find how to validate a stored hash.
> Can you point me in the right direction?
> 
> Thanks
> Francis





--
View this message in context: 
http://forum.world.st/Validate-password-with-PBKDF2-tp4952973p4952985.html
Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo6 playground saving semantics and .changes?

[Tim Mackinnon]

Hi Offray - I hadn't understood your project was in this area, I'll have a look.

It does sound like some tweaks in playground might be useful.

Like many of these things though - you have to live with them for a while to 
really understand.

Tim

Sent from my iPhone



Sent from my iPhone
> On 29 Jun 2017, at 23:54, Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Tim, I have made a project, called Grafoscopio, that, in its core, is
> about saving playgrounds and embed them into bigger context/narratives.
> You can see more details and examples here:
> 
> [1] http://mutabit.com/grafoscopio/index.en.html
> 
> Still needs work to do, for example improving English documentation and
> discoverability, as Glenn suggested (Spanish page is better ranked in
> search engines), but maybe you find it interesting for what you're
> looking for. See the page at [1] and the examples, to see what is
> possible at the moment.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Offray
> 
> Ps: I share Esteban's concern on privacy and autosave feature, despite
> of being useful, sometimes, for me and in the workshops. This behavior
> should be disabled by default and turn on on user demand. (Maybe a tool
> tip on first launch, like the one on anonymous metrics could help here
> too).
> 
>> On 29/06/17 15:55, Esteban A. Maringolo wrote:
>> Please allow me a little rant here...
>> 
>> I still find disturbing the"autosave" feature without having the
>> option to explicitly save the contents in the filesystem as I did with
>> Workspaces. Sometimes I don't want the contents of a file/tab updated
>> by a criteria different than when to save the image, it is: my own
>> when I consider appropriate.
>> 
>> It's not I want to disable Playground by complete which I find useful
>> when integrated with the inlined insector, but I want to keep the
>> behavior of saving and restoring the contents under my control.
>> 
>> Privacywise I don't like the "history" of previous contents in the
>> Playground, the history it can be removed but it can't be disabled. I
>> can condense the changes file, but the Playground history remains.
>> 
>> Regards!
>> 
>> 
>> Esteban A. Maringolo
>> 
>> 
>> 2017-06-29 17:12 GMT-03:00 Tim Mackinnon :
>>> Cool - I was missing that insight.
>>> 
>>> Tim
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 29 Jun 2017, at 18:04, Sven Van Caekenberghe  wrote:
 
 One of the more hidden Playground features are named Pages. Double-click 
 the page tab title and give it a name, it will then be saved automagically 
 in pharo-local/play-stash (and auto saves on changes from then on). I use 
 that all the time.
 
> On 29 Jun 2017, at 16:45, Tim Mackinnon  wrote:
> 
> Hi - I really like the playground metaphor, it really is such a nice way 
> to experiment.
> 
> However I've noticed that unlike older versions of Smalltalk, it seems 
> that DoIt operations in playground don't end up in the .changes file 
> anymore (which I guess is a mixed blessing when you want to recover). It 
> seems that the new metaphor is that work you do is saved as a page and 
> you can see versions of your page in the upper right menu? Well sort of - 
> as I haven't quite understood when it saves or doesn't? Often I get 
> duplicate looking pages in that menu and often I make a change and want 
> to keep it but find it doesn't save and if I accidentally close my 
> playground my changes in a page are lost?
> 
> What are the semantics of page saving?
> 
> An example  - if you do a few gofer loads of utilities and the put a 
> comment on the first line of the page (which gives it a nice title in the 
> page dropdown), sometimes that comment will be saved other times not?
> 
> I also think it might be nice to remove page versions to help tidy things 
> up. I'm thinking of rolling my sleeves up on this idea - but wanted to 
> understand the vision firsts
> 
> Tim
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> 
>