Re: ot- windows malware

[mike havens]

Yipe!

On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 10:33 PM, Eric Cope  wrote:

> It was helpful for me!
> Any other good tools out there?
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 9:29 PM, mike havens  wrote:
>
>> sorry just trying to be helpful to others.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 9:19 PM, Technomage wrote:
>>
>>> Mike,
>>> that is but 1 of many tools I used on clients machines (I know, just
>>> found a new trojan this week
>>> on a box). malwarebytes, spybot S&D, cccleaner and a host of linux based
>>> live cd scanners
>>> are at my beck and call. typical length of service call is about 6 hours
>>> per machine (can
>>> run multiple in parallel to cut down on "serial" time).
>>>
>>> I make about $65.00/hour doing my own thing. its still cheaper than
>>> having them go to
>>> geek squad (ugh).
>>>
>>> - Eric
>>>
>>> mike havens wrote:
>>> > Or those of you trapped in someway in the world of windows and you have
>>> > spyware and don't  know what to do try http://malwarebytes.org/ .
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> 
>>> >
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>>
>>
>>
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Re: ot- windows malware

[mike havens]

sorry just trying to be helpful to others.

On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 9:19 PM, Technomage wrote:

> Mike,
> that is but 1 of many tools I used on clients machines (I know, just
> found a new trojan this week
> on a box). malwarebytes, spybot S&D, cccleaner and a host of linux based
> live cd scanners
> are at my beck and call. typical length of service call is about 6 hours
> per machine (can
> run multiple in parallel to cut down on "serial" time).
>
> I make about $65.00/hour doing my own thing. its still cheaper than
> having them go to
> geek squad (ugh).
>
> - Eric
>
> mike havens wrote:
> > Or those of you trapped in someway in the world of windows and you have
> > spyware and don't  know what to do try http://malwarebytes.org/ .
> >
> >
> > 
> >
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ot- windows malware

[mike havens]

Or those of you trapped in someway in the world of windows and you have
spyware and don't  know what to do try http://malwarebytes.org/ .

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Linux BOX

[mike havens]

Yipe
I bought a keyboard and I bought a mouse and I now have a linux box that
works. Now I just need to get internet to it! (right now I'm working off of
somebodies unsecured wi-fi on this windows laptop) I suppose I could save
files onto a USB drive and move it over. Is there a way to use a wireless
router as a wireless card?

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cat5 cable

[mike havens]

I have no problems with Superior but don't even think of getting Mohawk
cable. I was installing that cable at a job site and could not get it to
pass the tests. The guy I was assisting that day said not to worry about it
because it was cheap cable and that was why it would not pass our tester.

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OT: BOOKS

[mike havens]

Could someone point out a website that is like a public library where we can
read books online? Google has proven to give me too much junk.

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Re: Routers

[mike havens]

so how did you fix it?

On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 12:46 AM, Steve Phariss  wrote:

> I had a wrt-600n that I flashed with a wrong version of dd-wrt... It seemed
> to be bricked permanently...  I was able to find instructions online that
> allowed me to reflash to a good version.  router is now up and running
> fine.  All in All it was a pretty easy fix, the hard part was the timing.
> Steve
>
> On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 3:02 PM, Jason Hayes  wrote:
>
>> On Thursday 28 January 2010 01:16:58 pm JD Austin wrote:
>> > On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 1:06 PM, John  wrote:
>> > > You are brave. I'd be scared I'd brick a brand new router.
>> >
>> > Nah :)  DD-WRT is very stable at this point.
>> > It's possible but no more possible than it would be later.
>> > Always do such a thing plugged directly into the router.
>> > Never do it over wireless.
>> >
>> > Tomato is great also
>>
>> Would have to give a thumbs up for DD-WRT as well. Had a Linksys WRT54G go
>> completely haywire on me about a year ago. No amount of fiddling or
>> reseting or
>> upgrading would get it to work. I flashed it with DD-WRT and the router
>> was
>> stable and happy for about another year before it completely calved and
>> died.
>>
>> Haven't had the guts to flash the new WRT320N yet.
>>
>> --
>> Jason Hayes
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Re: off topic

[mike havens]

it is dumping snow in the hills... that is what matters.

On Sat, Jan 23, 2010 at 4:45 PM, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:

>  they say we havent had this much in 17 years.  This might officially
> end the drought I dont know... jmz
>
> On Sat, Jan 23, 2010 at 4:33 PM, mike havens  wrote:
> > what do you all think of all the rain we've gotten?
> >
> > --
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off topic

[mike havens]

what do you all think of all the rain we've gotten?

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Re: quiet

[mike havens]

Well, you can all be relieved. The board is no longer going to be quiet! I
got a new box and a new monitor. On the cpu is Ubuntu and you can all help
me get it on the internet when I get my own place. Hmm I guess this
really means that you can all be terrified :!) When I get my own place I'm
going to have a house-warming party and you're all invited! It will be a day
long thing so you can come as you please and leave when you get bored. So,
I'll be your excuse to go to Sedona.

On Tue, Jan 12, 2010 at 8:16 AM, Stephen  wrote:

> because it has root access and cleans up after itself.
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 7:35 PM, mike havens  wrote:
> > this thread eludes my senses
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 1:37 PM, Stephen  wrote:
> >>
> >> This whole thread made me think. if you cant detect your keyboard...
> >> remove the mittens... you should be able to detect it just fine
> >>
> >> :-)
> >>
> >> On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Ed  wrote:
> >> > Mike - bad news,  "my comodore64" sounds like you are - sorry  :(
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 2:18 AM, mike havens 
> wrote:
> >> >> I could on my comodore64 that was like a giant laptop.
> >> >>
> >> >> 2010/1/10 Ryan Rix 
> >> >>>
> >> >>> On Sun 10 January 2010 9:43:56 pm mike havens wrote:
> >> >>> > I can't disconnect the keyboard laptop.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>>
> >> >>> I can on my thinkpad :^)
> >> >>>
> >> >>> --
> >> >>> Ryan Rix
> >> >>> Fedora KDE SIG Member, Phoenix AZ Ambassador, News KDE Beat writer
> >> >>>
> >> >>> New Mail address: phrkonale...@gmail.com -> r...@n.rix.si !!
> >> >>> http://hackersramblings.wordpress.com |
> http://identi.ca/phrkonaleash
> >> >>> XMPP: phrkonale...@gmail.com  | MSN: phrkonale...@yahoo.com
> >> >>> AIM:  phrkonaleash| Yahoo: phrkonaleash
> >> >>> IRC:  phrkon...@irc.freenode.net/#srcedit,#plugaz,#fedora-kde and
> >> >>>  countless other FOSS channels.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> ---
> >> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >> >>
> >> >> ---
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> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> >> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
> >>
> >> Stephen
> >> ---
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>
>
> --
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> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
> Stephen
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Re: quiet

[mike havens]

this thread eludes my senses

On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 1:37 PM, Stephen  wrote:

> This whole thread made me think. if you cant detect your keyboard...
> remove the mittens... you should be able to detect it just fine
>
> :-)
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Ed  wrote:
> > Mike - bad news,  "my comodore64" sounds like you are - sorry  :(
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 2:18 AM, mike havens  wrote:
> >> I could on my comodore64 that was like a giant laptop.
> >>
> >> 2010/1/10 Ryan Rix 
> >>>
> >>> On Sun 10 January 2010 9:43:56 pm mike havens wrote:
> >>> > I can't disconnect the keyboard laptop.
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>> I can on my thinkpad :^)
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Ryan Rix
> >>> Fedora KDE SIG Member, Phoenix AZ Ambassador, News KDE Beat writer
> >>>
> >>> New Mail address: phrkonale...@gmail.com -> r...@n.rix.si !!
> >>> http://hackersramblings.wordpress.com | http://identi.ca/phrkonaleash
> >>> XMPP: phrkonale...@gmail.com  | MSN: phrkonale...@yahoo.com
> >>> AIM:  phrkonaleash| Yahoo: phrkonaleash
> >>> IRC:  phrkon...@irc.freenode.net/#srcedit,#plugaz,#fedora-kde and
> >>>  countless other FOSS channels.
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >>
> >> ---
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>
>
> --
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
> Stephen
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Re: quiet

[mike havens]

I could on my comodore64 that was like a giant laptop.

2010/1/10 Ryan Rix 

> On Sun 10 January 2010 9:43:56 pm mike havens wrote:
> > I can't disconnect the keyboard laptop.
> >
>
> I can on my thinkpad :^)
>
> --
> Ryan Rix
> Fedora KDE SIG Member, Phoenix AZ Ambassador, News KDE Beat writer
>
> New Mail address: phrkonale...@gmail.com -> r...@n.rix.si !!
> http://hackersramblings.wordpress.com | http://identi.ca/phrkonaleash
> XMPP: phrkonale...@gmail.com  | MSN: phrkonale...@yahoo.com
> AIM:  phrkonaleash| Yahoo: phrkonaleash
> IRC:  phrkon...@irc.freenode.net/#srcedit,#plugaz,#fedora-kde and
>  countless other FOSS channels.
>
> ---
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Re: quiet

[mike havens]

I can't disconnect the keyboard laptop.

2010/1/10 Ryan Rix 

> On Sun 10 January 2010 8:56:56 pm mike havens wrote:
> > i'M NOT A GEEK AND i DON'T HAVE A LIFE.
> >
>
> 1) press caps lock key
> 2) press back space until previous message is gone
> 3) retype message
> 4) disconnect keyboard
> 5) ???
> 6) profit!
>
> --
> Ryan Rix
> Fedora KDE SIG Member, Phoenix AZ Ambassador, News KDE Beat writer
>
> New Mail address: phrkonale...@gmail.com -> r...@n.rix.si !!
> http://hackersramblings.wordpress.com | http://identi.ca/phrkonaleash
> XMPP: phrkonale...@gmail.com  | MSN: phrkonale...@yahoo.com
> AIM:  phrkonaleash| Yahoo: phrkonaleash
> IRC:  phrkon...@irc.freenode.net/#srcedit,#plugaz,#fedora-kde and
>  countless other FOSS channels.
>
> ---
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Re: OT: shocking Arizona nazi movement

[mike havens]

I remember the week or so I moved to Phoenix in october of 90. That week
there was an article in the new times about the nazi movement.

On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 7:39 PM, Elliot Moore  wrote:

> Marco's got a point.  Where were these people during Reagan, Bush I and
> Bush II's wild spending escapades?  Those three presidents put our country
> into more debt than all the others COMBINED.  The silence was defining in
> those years...
>
> On Sat, Jan 9, 2010 at 5:30 AM, Marco Savo  wrote:
>
>> My apologize this wasn't the right place for this, just wonted to show it.
>>
>> For Jason: Al Jazeera English is the most free news channel at the moment.
>> Marco
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 9, 2010 at 12:30 AM, Jason Hayes 
>> wrote:
>> > On Friday 08 January 2010 04:33:11 pm Joshua Zeidner wrote:
>> >>   wow Marco, thanks for that highly inflammatory propaganda designed
>> >> to convert fiscal conservative movements into racism and fascism
>> >> movements.  Well done.  And very on topic.
>> >>
>> >>  -jmz
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 3:15 PM, Marco Savo 
>> wrote:
>> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXFuZwqGrCU&feature=player_embedded
>> >
>> > Al-Jazeera reporting on fascism and racism in the US?!? The irony is so
>> thick
>> > you can cut it with a knife.
>> >
>> > Tempted to add more, but I'll stick with "what Joshua said" and go sweat
>> the
>> > rest out in my Kempo class. Good grief!
>> >
>> > Jason Hayes
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>>
>>
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>>
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Re: quiet

[mike havens]

i'M NOT A GEEK AND i DON'T HAVE A LIFE.

On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 8:32 PM, Alan Dayley  wrote:

> There is a stereotype that geeks "don't have a life" and so always
> have weekends open.  If you watch the traffic on this and other "geek"
> lists, you will see that emails drop dramatically during the weekend.
> I think this shows that we geeks to have lives and use the weekend to
> focus on them.
>
> Alan
>
> On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 8:22 PM, keith smith 
> wrote:
> > But I was thinking of Linux!
> > 
> > Keith Smith
> >
> >
> > --- On Sun, 1/10/10, Stephen  wrote:
> >
> >> From: Stephen 
> >> Subject: Re: quiet
> >> To: "Main PLUG discussion list" 
> >> Date: Sunday, January 10, 2010, 8:17 PM
> >> Wifes birthday weekend.
> >>
> >> On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 5:56 PM, mike havens 
> >> wrote:
> >> > what evil plots are being schemed!
> >> >
> >> > On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 4:26 PM, David Huerta 
> >> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 3:41 PM, mike havens
> >> 
> >> wrote:
> >> >> > kinda quiet out there in PLUG land!
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> Too quiet...
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> [.dh]
> >> >>
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> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >> >
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will
> >> prevent you from
> >> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the
> >> snooze button.
> >>
> >> Stephen
> >> ---
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> >
> >
> >
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> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
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Re: quiet

[mike havens]

what evil plots are being schemed!

On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 4:26 PM, David Huerta  wrote:

> On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 3:41 PM, mike havens  wrote:
> > kinda quiet out there in PLUG land!
> >
>
> Too quiet...
>
> --
> [.dh]
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quiet

[mike havens]

kinda quiet out there in PLUG land!

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Re: Hey.

[mike havens]

I live in Cornville, Arizona now.

On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 10:54 PM, Lisa Kachold wrote:

> Happy New Years Mike! 2010 is going to be GREAT!
>
> Check out my new Arizona Wiki Satire Page, rewritten for the New Year:
> http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Arizona
>
> In case you miss Arizona!
>
> On 12/31/09, mike havens  wrote:
> > Happy new year geeks and geeketes (and you geek wanabees).
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
>
>
> --
> Skype: (623)239-3392
> AT&T: (503)754-4452
> www.it-clowns.com
> http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/User:LisaKachold
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Hey.

[mike havens]

Happy new year geeks and geeketes (and you geek wanabees).

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Re: fixing laptop jack

[mike havens]

well cool beans it looks like the job my soldier did was half the
battle!

On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 5:54 PM, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:

>  its not always so simple.  If you don't soldier correctly, the
> soldier will actually give off heat when a current goes through it,
> and in some cases it can get so hot the soldier will melt, cause
> shorts, and destroy your equipment.  knowing is half the battle.  -jmz
>
> On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 5:47 PM, mike havens  wrote:
> > just make sure you heat up both metal parts before applying the soldier!
> >
> > On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 2:46 PM, Joshua Zeidner 
> wrote:
> >>
> >>  your sales skills are also the suck.  ;)
> >>
> >>  given that engineers are notoriously self deprecating Im willing to
> >> overlook that if you convince me you can fix my precious Toshiba.
> >> soldering is much more difficult than many think.
> >>
> >>  -jmz
> >>
> >> On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 2:41 PM, Stephen  wrote:
> >> > I know how, but my soldering skills are the suck.
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 2:36 PM, Joshua Zeidner 
> >> > wrote:
> >> >> Hello,
> >> >>
> >> >>  does anyone here know how to fix a laptop DC power jack?  its a
> >> >> toshiba satellite.
> >> >>
> >> >>  would be willing to pay...
> >> >>
> >> >> -jmz
> >> >> ---
> >> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> >> > rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
> >> >
> >> > Stephen
> >> > ---
> >> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >> >
> >> ---
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> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
> > ---
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Re: fixing laptop jack

[mike havens]

just make sure you heat up both metal parts before applying the soldier!

On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 2:46 PM, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:

>  your sales skills are also the suck.  ;)
>
>  given that engineers are notoriously self deprecating Im willing to
> overlook that if you convince me you can fix my precious Toshiba.
> soldering is much more difficult than many think.
>
>  -jmz
>
> On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 2:41 PM, Stephen  wrote:
> > I know how, but my soldering skills are the suck.
> >
> > On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 2:36 PM, Joshua Zeidner 
> wrote:
> >> Hello,
> >>
> >>  does anyone here know how to fix a laptop DC power jack?  its a
> >> toshiba satellite.
> >>
> >>  would be willing to pay...
> >>
> >> -jmz
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> > rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
> >
> > Stephen
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
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Re: In need of Linux computer

[mike havens]

Thanks to the Gentlemen who were gracious enough to give me equipment. This
list is great, if anyone has a need it will be fulfilled; all you need to do
is ask. The guy giving me a monitor has 4 others available to give away
all you need to do is ask.

On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 3:33 PM, mike havens  wrote:

> Hey all; as you may know I am trapped in the world of windows at the moment
> but would like to break free of the M$ shackles. Would anyone happen to have
> a computer on which Linux will work they would be willing to part with? It
> can be a Windows 98 box for all I care! I gave my b rother a ride home today
> and he gave me his non working computer. So I brought it home and plugged it
> in. Nothing! No post... no beep... not even the flicker of a light
> indicating life. I'm thinking that it could be the power supply (he was
> having power surges) but it might be the 'soft switch' (this computer is
> from '99). If it might be power supply and someone has one could I test out
> my theory?
> specs:
> compaq power supply
> part number: 124892-001
> input= 115V~/9A, 230V~/5A
> output= +5V===/22A, +3.3V===/14A
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>



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Re: In need of Linux computer

[mike havens]

it can even be monochrome!

On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 5:06 PM, mike havens  wrote:

> The one my brother had started clicking and buzzing after I plugged it in.
>
>
> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:57 PM, mike havens  wrote:
>
>> Thanks Stephen! Anyone have a spare monitor they are willing to give up?
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:32 PM, Stephen  wrote:
>>
>>> I have an IBM netvista ( i think) P4 533fsb 1.5gb pc133 ram and some sort
>>> of HDD
>>>
>>> it does need an optical drive, I can even stuff a Linux install on it
>>> if you want.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:26 PM, Lisa Kachold 
>>> wrote:
>>> > I will setup a website for it on my drupal on it-clowns.com!
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On 12/26/09, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:
>>> >>  I'd be interested in starting a barter network...  jmz
>>> >>
>>> >> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:22 PM, Lisa Kachold <
>>> lisakach...@obnosis.com>
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >>> Toss it on the junkheap!
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Can't help you right now!
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Too bad they don't have a freegeek.org here?
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On 12/26/09, mike havens  wrote:
>>> >>>> Hey all; as you may know I am trapped in the world of windows at the
>>> >>>> moment
>>> >>>> but would like to break free of the M$ shackles. Would anyone happen
>>> to
>>> >>>> have
>>> >>>> a computer on which Linux will work they would be willing to part
>>> with?
>>> >>>> It
>>> >>>> can be a Windows 98 box for all I care! I gave my b rother a ride
>>> home
>>> >>>> today
>>> >>>> and he gave me his non working computer. So I brought it home and
>>> plugged
>>> >>>> it
>>> >>>> in. Nothing! No post... no beep... not even the flicker of a light
>>> >>>> indicating life. I'm thinking that it could be the power supply (he
>>> was
>>> >>>> having power surges) but it might be the 'soft switch' (this
>>> computer is
>>> >>>> from '99). If it might be power supply and someone has one could I
>>> test
>>> >>>> out
>>> >>>> my theory?
>>> >>>> specs:
>>> >>>> compaq power supply
>>> >>>> part number: 124892-001
>>> >>>> input= 115V~/9A, 230V~/5A
>>> >>>> output= +5V===/22A, +3.3V===/14A
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> --
>>> >>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> --
>>> >>> Skype: (623)239-3392
>>> >>> AT&T: (503)754-4452
>>> >>> www.it-clowns.com
>>> >>> Only the dead have seen the end of war. -Plato
>>> >>> ---
>>> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>> >>>
>>> >> ---
>>> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > Skype: (623)239-3392
>>> > AT&T: (503)754-4452
>>> > www.it-clowns.com
>>> > Only the dead have seen the end of war. -Plato
>>> > ---
>>> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
>>> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>>>
>>> Stephen
>>> ---
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>



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Re: In need of Linux computer

[mike havens]

The one my brother had started clicking and buzzing after I plugged it in.

On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:57 PM, mike havens  wrote:

> Thanks Stephen! Anyone have a spare monitor they are willing to give up?
>
> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:32 PM, Stephen  wrote:
>
>> I have an IBM netvista ( i think) P4 533fsb 1.5gb pc133 ram and some sort
>> of HDD
>>
>> it does need an optical drive, I can even stuff a Linux install on it
>> if you want.
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:26 PM, Lisa Kachold 
>> wrote:
>> > I will setup a website for it on my drupal on it-clowns.com!
>> >
>> >
>> > On 12/26/09, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:
>> >>  I'd be interested in starting a barter network...  jmz
>> >>
>> >> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:22 PM, Lisa Kachold > >
>> >> wrote:
>> >>> Toss it on the junkheap!
>> >>>
>> >>> Can't help you right now!
>> >>>
>> >>> Too bad they don't have a freegeek.org here?
>> >>>
>> >>> On 12/26/09, mike havens  wrote:
>> >>>> Hey all; as you may know I am trapped in the world of windows at the
>> >>>> moment
>> >>>> but would like to break free of the M$ shackles. Would anyone happen
>> to
>> >>>> have
>> >>>> a computer on which Linux will work they would be willing to part
>> with?
>> >>>> It
>> >>>> can be a Windows 98 box for all I care! I gave my b rother a ride
>> home
>> >>>> today
>> >>>> and he gave me his non working computer. So I brought it home and
>> plugged
>> >>>> it
>> >>>> in. Nothing! No post... no beep... not even the flicker of a light
>> >>>> indicating life. I'm thinking that it could be the power supply (he
>> was
>> >>>> having power surges) but it might be the 'soft switch' (this computer
>> is
>> >>>> from '99). If it might be power supply and someone has one could I
>> test
>> >>>> out
>> >>>> my theory?
>> >>>> specs:
>> >>>> compaq power supply
>> >>>> part number: 124892-001
>> >>>> input= 115V~/9A, 230V~/5A
>> >>>> output= +5V===/22A, +3.3V===/14A
>> >>>>
>> >>>> --
>> >>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> Skype: (623)239-3392
>> >>> AT&T: (503)754-4452
>> >>> www.it-clowns.com
>> >>> Only the dead have seen the end of war. -Plato
>> >>> ---
>> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>> >>>
>> >> ---
>> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Skype: (623)239-3392
>> > AT&T: (503)754-4452
>> > www.it-clowns.com
>> > Only the dead have seen the end of war. -Plato
>> > ---
>> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
>> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>>
>> Stephen
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>



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Re: In need of Linux computer

[mike havens]

Thanks Stephen! Anyone have a spare monitor they are willing to give up?

On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:32 PM, Stephen  wrote:

> I have an IBM netvista ( i think) P4 533fsb 1.5gb pc133 ram and some sort
> of HDD
>
> it does need an optical drive, I can even stuff a Linux install on it
> if you want.
>
> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:26 PM, Lisa Kachold 
> wrote:
> > I will setup a website for it on my drupal on it-clowns.com!
> >
> >
> > On 12/26/09, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:
> >>  I'd be interested in starting a barter network...  jmz
> >>
> >> On Sat, Dec 26, 2009 at 4:22 PM, Lisa Kachold 
> >> wrote:
> >>> Toss it on the junkheap!
> >>>
> >>> Can't help you right now!
> >>>
> >>> Too bad they don't have a freegeek.org here?
> >>>
> >>> On 12/26/09, mike havens  wrote:
> >>>> Hey all; as you may know I am trapped in the world of windows at the
> >>>> moment
> >>>> but would like to break free of the M$ shackles. Would anyone happen
> to
> >>>> have
> >>>> a computer on which Linux will work they would be willing to part
> with?
> >>>> It
> >>>> can be a Windows 98 box for all I care! I gave my b rother a ride home
> >>>> today
> >>>> and he gave me his non working computer. So I brought it home and
> plugged
> >>>> it
> >>>> in. Nothing! No post... no beep... not even the flicker of a light
> >>>> indicating life. I'm thinking that it could be the power supply (he
> was
> >>>> having power surges) but it might be the 'soft switch' (this computer
> is
> >>>> from '99). If it might be power supply and someone has one could I
> test
> >>>> out
> >>>> my theory?
> >>>> specs:
> >>>> compaq power supply
> >>>> part number: 124892-001
> >>>> input= 115V~/9A, 230V~/5A
> >>>> output= +5V===/22A, +3.3V===/14A
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Skype: (623)239-3392
> >>> AT&T: (503)754-4452
> >>> www.it-clowns.com
> >>> Only the dead have seen the end of war. -Plato
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>>
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Skype: (623)239-3392
> > AT&T: (503)754-4452
> > www.it-clowns.com
> > Only the dead have seen the end of war. -Plato
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>
>
>
> --
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
> Stephen
> ---
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
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In need of Linux computer

[mike havens]

Hey all; as you may know I am trapped in the world of windows at the moment
but would like to break free of the M$ shackles. Would anyone happen to have
a computer on which Linux will work they would be willing to part with? It
can be a Windows 98 box for all I care! I gave my b rother a ride home today
and he gave me his non working computer. So I brought it home and plugged it
in. Nothing! No post... no beep... not even the flicker of a light
indicating life. I'm thinking that it could be the power supply (he was
having power surges) but it might be the 'soft switch' (this computer is
from '99). If it might be power supply and someone has one could I test out
my theory?
specs:
compaq power supply
part number: 124892-001
input= 115V~/9A, 230V~/5A
output= +5V===/22A, +3.3V===/14A

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Hey.

[mike havens]

Merry Christmas everyone!

If you don't like Christmas happy whatever.

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Re: sort of OT: 40 free computers and assorted peripherals

[mike havens]

you have ti be a charity to get these items I'm a charity case!

On 12/8/09, Eric Cope  wrote:
>
> are they divisible?
>
> On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 9:11 PM, Jason Hayes  wrote:
>
>> Just came across this ad on throwplace.com -
>> http://www.throwplace.com/take/item.php?id=3051
>>
>> 40 - PIII & P4 computers and peripherals (printers, routers, etc.) for
>> free -
>> in Prescott.
>> --
>> Jason Hayes
>> ---
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> Eric Cope
> http://cope-et-al.com
>
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Re: party Thursday

[mike havens]

If I didn't work the next morning I'd be there. Anyone up north want to get
together?

On 12/7/09, mike havens  wrote:
>
> I sure wish I could come!
>
>
> On 12/7/09, AZ RUNE  wrote:
>>
>> Woo hoo I missed the sun presentation at UAT so this works for a birthday
>> gift I can drag the gf to, woot!
>>
>> Brian
>>
>> On Dec 7, 2009 9:46 AM, "der.hans"  wrote:
>>
>> moin moin,
>>
>> Thursday night is our annual end of year party.
>>
>> Please invite friends and family to attend.
>>
>> Bringing something for the table is encouraged, but not required.
>>
>> Negotiations are taking place in order to obtain a cheesecake from Oma.
>>
>> No booze as we are meeting at a dry site ( school ).
>>
>> We start at 19:00.
>>
>> Sequoia Charter School in Mesa
>>
>> 1460 S. Horne, Mesa
>>
>>
>> http://maps.google.com/maps?q=1460+S.+Horne,Mesa+AZ&ie=UTF8&t=h&om=1&ll=33.38908,-111.814213&spn=0.008546,0.015578&z=16&iwloc=addr
>>
>> Enter by the drive way gate just south of Holmes Ave. Meetings are held on
>> the south end of the fourth building on the left.
>>
>> ciao,
>>
>> der.hans
>> --
>> #  http://www.LuftHans.com/Classeshttp://www.TwoGeekTechs.com/
>> #  Director of Engineering, FonWallet Transaction Solutions, Inc.
>> #   Delicious red tape, like a Twizzler but flat. And adhesive.
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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>>
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>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:




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Re: party Thursday

[mike havens]

I sure wish I could come!

On 12/7/09, AZ RUNE  wrote:
>
> Woo hoo I missed the sun presentation at UAT so this works for a birthday
> gift I can drag the gf to, woot!
>
> Brian
>
> On Dec 7, 2009 9:46 AM, "der.hans"  wrote:
>
> moin moin,
>
> Thursday night is our annual end of year party.
>
> Please invite friends and family to attend.
>
> Bringing something for the table is encouraged, but not required.
>
> Negotiations are taking place in order to obtain a cheesecake from Oma.
>
> No booze as we are meeting at a dry site ( school ).
>
> We start at 19:00.
>
> Sequoia Charter School in Mesa
>
> 1460 S. Horne, Mesa
>
>
> http://maps.google.com/maps?q=1460+S.+Horne,Mesa+AZ&ie=UTF8&t=h&om=1&ll=33.38908,-111.814213&spn=0.008546,0.015578&z=16&iwloc=addr
>
> Enter by the drive way gate just south of Holmes Ave. Meetings are held on
> the south end of the fourth building on the left.
>
> ciao,
>
> der.hans
> --
> #  http://www.LuftHans.com/Classeshttp://www.TwoGeekTechs.com/
> #  Director of Engineering, FonWallet Transaction Solutions, Inc.
> #   Delicious red tape, like a Twizzler but flat. And adhesive.
> ---
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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>
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Re: linux distro

[mike havens]

How do you mean?

On 12/1/09, tship...@deru.com  wrote:
>
> Has anyone noticed a dramatic decrease in the number of viable
> desktop/laptop/netbook distros?  (And Chrome to rule them all.)
> Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Stephen 
> Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 12:06:02
> To: Main PLUG discussion list
> Subject: Re: linux distro
>
> I have liked the Ubuntu for laptops/desktops. Id suggest trying 9.10
> as it has a number of new features and very current hardware.
>
> On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 11:48 AM, mike havens  wrote:
> > Okay guys. I'm ready to plunge into Linux again. Ever since Windows7
> > came out and certain companiesupdated... upgraded up-whatever  they
> did,
> > my laptop (Toshiba Satellite with an Atheros AR5005GS wireless card)
> keeps
> > on needing its registry to be cleaned. Which distro works best out of the
> > box with automatic detection and that kind of stuff?
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>
>
>
> --
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
> Stephen
> ---
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Re: linux distro

[mike havens]

I don't need current hardware... this computer is circa. 93 (about) . This
is why linux rules to run an up-to date distro you don't need current
hardware. It is not like M$ where xp hardware won't run on vista os; and xp
won't run on earlier hardware; etc. I think M$ in in cahoots with hardware
manufacturers!

On 12/1/09, Stephen  wrote:
>
> I have liked the Ubuntu for laptops/desktops. Id suggest trying 9.10
> as it has a number of new features and very current hardware.
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 11:48 AM, mike havens  wrote:
>
> > Okay guys. I'm ready to plunge into Linux again. Ever since Windows7
> > came out and certain companiesupdated... upgraded up-whatever  they
> did,
> > my laptop (Toshiba Satellite with an Atheros AR5005GS wireless card)
> keeps
> > on needing its registry to be cleaned. Which distro works best out of the
> > box with automatic detection and that kind of stuff?
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>
>
>
>
> --
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
>
> Stephen
>
> ---
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linux distro

[mike havens]

Okay guys. I'm ready to plunge into Linux again. Ever since Windows7
came out and certain companiesupdated... upgraded up-whatever  they did,
my laptop (Toshiba Satellite with an Atheros AR5005GS wireless card) keeps
on needing its registry to be cleaned. Which distro works best out of the
box with automatic detection and that kind of stuff?

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Re: DNS

[mike havens]

I figured out that with the internet off of Mingus Mountain if I enter any
ip address it gives the website not found error.

On 11/28/09, mike havens  wrote:
>
> well, I entered the web address in the bar and it wasn't going anywhere...
> I was really just wondering if anything happened to them
>
> On 11/28/09, Bob Elzer  wrote:
>
>>  What are you trying to do ?
>>
>> I get the impression you are trying to do something sneaky.
>>
>> If that's the case, you really don't need to.
>>
>> You can use OpenDNS, or DynDNS, or any of a bunch of others for free.
>>
>> Is there a particular reason you need to use the verizon DNS servers ?
>>
>>
>>
>>  --
>> *From:* plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:
>> plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] *On Behalf Of *mike havens
>> *Sent:* Saturday, November 28, 2009 1:03 PM
>> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list
>> *Subject:* Re: DNS
>>
>> sh don't give them any ideas!
>>
>> yeah... I kinda thought that ns =name server but what about mx?
>>
>> On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 11:51 AM, Eric Shubert  wrote:
>>
>>> mike havens wrote:
>>> > On the webpage I learned they were verizons name servers they were
>>> > harping on about not using them if you are not authorized to do so.
>>> What
>>> > are they talking about? I thought they were in the public domain.
>>> >
>>>
>>> What led you to believe that?
>>>
>>> They are intended for use solely by their customers. Why would/should
>>> they provide DNS resolver services for the whole world?
>>>
>>> Then again, if they want to limit usage of their resolvers to their
>>> customers, it seems reasonable that they take whatever measures are
>>> necessary to enforce that limitation.
>>>
>>> --
>>> -Eric 'shubes'
>>>
>>> ---
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:




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Re: DNS

[mike havens]

well, I entered the web address in the bar and it wasn't going anywhere... I
was really just wondering if anything happened to them

On 11/28/09, Bob Elzer  wrote:
>
>  What are you trying to do ?
>
> I get the impression you are trying to do something sneaky.
>
> If that's the case, you really don't need to.
>
> You can use OpenDNS, or DynDNS, or any of a bunch of others for free.
>
> Is there a particular reason you need to use the verizon DNS servers ?
>
>
>
>  --
> *From:* plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:
> plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] *On Behalf Of *mike havens
> *Sent:* Saturday, November 28, 2009 1:03 PM
> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list
> *Subject:* Re: DNS
>
> sh don't give them any ideas!
>
> yeah... I kinda thought that ns =name server but what about mx?
>
> On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 11:51 AM, Eric Shubert  wrote:
>
>> mike havens wrote:
>> > On the webpage I learned they were verizons name servers they were
>> > harping on about not using them if you are not authorized to do so. What
>> > are they talking about? I thought they were in the public domain.
>> >
>>
>> What led you to believe that?
>>
>> They are intended for use solely by their customers. Why would/should
>> they provide DNS resolver services for the whole world?
>>
>> Then again, if they want to limit usage of their resolvers to their
>> customers, it seems reasonable that they take whatever measures are
>> necessary to enforce that limitation.
>>
>> --
>> -Eric 'shubes'
>>
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
> ---
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Re: DNS

[mike havens]

thanks guys!

On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 1:37 PM, Eric Shubert  wrote:

> Mail eXchange - points to the server which handles incoming mail for the
>  domain.
>
> mike havens wrote:
> > sh don't give them any ideas!
> >
> > yeah... I kinda thought that ns =name server but what about mx?
> >
> > On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 11:51 AM, Eric Shubert  > <mailto:e...@shubes.net>> wrote:
> >
> > mike havens wrote:
> >  > On the webpage I learned they were verizons name servers they were
> >  > harping on about not using them if you are not authorized to do
> > so. What
> >  > are they talking about? I thought they were in the public domain.
> >  >
> >
> > What led you to believe that?
> >
> > They are intended for use solely by their customers. Why would/should
> > they provide DNS resolver services for the whole world?
> >
> > Then again, if they want to limit usage of their resolvers to their
> > customers, it seems reasonable that they take whatever measures are
> > necessary to enforce that limitation.
> >
> > --
> > -Eric 'shubes'
> >
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > <mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
>
>
> --
> -Eric 'shubes'
>
> ---
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Re: DNS

[mike havens]

sh don't give them any ideas!

yeah... I kinda thought that ns =name server but what about mx?

On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 11:51 AM, Eric Shubert  wrote:

> mike havens wrote:
> > On the webpage I learned they were verizons name servers they were
> > harping on about not using them if you are not authorized to do so. What
> > are they talking about? I thought they were in the public domain.
> >
>
> What led you to believe that?
>
> They are intended for use solely by their customers. Why would/should
> they provide DNS resolver services for the whole world?
>
> Then again, if they want to limit usage of their resolvers to their
> customers, it seems reasonable that they take whatever measures are
> necessary to enforce that limitation.
>
> --
> -Eric 'shubes'
>
> ---
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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Re: DNS

[mike havens]

On the webpage I learned they were verizons name servers they were harping
on about not using them if you are not authorized to do so. What are they
talking about? I thought they were in the public domain.

On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 8:49 AM, Lisa Kachold wrote:

> On 11/28/09, Bob Elzer  wrote:
> > You do know that you can use any DNS server you want to, right ?
> >
> > I use openDNS, it's free and I seem to have less problems then I ever had
> > with qwest.
> >
> > http://www.opendns.com/start/  Basic works just fine.
> >  <http://www.opendns.com/>
> > https://store.opendns.com/setup/operatingsystem/ubuntu
> >
>
> OpenDNS is very good.  I used them in their infancy as offsite seconds
> for DNS clusters I engineered for ISP's and startups.
>
> I still use them as additional servers for various things, but use
> dyndns.org, where you can assign dynamic DNS via clients or routers,
> as well as have outbound mailhop, webhop and mail relay services.
> _
> >
> > From: plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > [mailto:plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] On Behalf Of mike
> > havens
> > Sent: Friday, November 27, 2009 11:49 PM
> > To: Main PLUG discussion list
> > Subject: Re: DNS
> >
> >
> > so you think it is pretty safe to stay around?
> >
> >
> > On 11/27/09, Stephen  wrote:
> >
> > Not sure why Verizon is going to kill 2 root hubs...
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:55 PM, mike havens  wrote:
> >> Hey guys what do you think of 4.2.2.2 and 4.2.2.1? From what I've
> read
> >> Verizon bought them and there is speculation they will go away. What do
> > you
> >> think about that?
> >>
> >> On 11/27/09, Dorian Monroe  wrote:
> >>>
> >>> dns1.uson.mx
> >>> sancarlos.noc.uson.mx
> >>> 148.225.1.9
> >>> 148.225.2.9
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my blackberry
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: mike havens 
> >>> Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 20:47:58
> >>> To: Main PLUG discussion list
> >>> Subject: DNS
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> > rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
> >
> >
> > Stephen
> >
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
>
>
> --
> Skype: (623)239-3392
> AT&T: (503)754-4452
> www.it-clowns.com
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Re: DNS

[mike havens]

so you think it is pretty safe to stay around?

On 11/27/09, Stephen  wrote:
>
> Not sure why Verizon is going to kill 2 root hubs...
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:55 PM, mike havens  wrote:
> > Hey guys what do you think of 4.2.2.2 and 4.2.2.1? From what I've
> read
> > Verizon bought them and there is speculation they will go away. What do
> you
> > think about that?
> >
> > On 11/27/09, Dorian Monroe  wrote:
> >>
> >> dns1.uson.mx
> >> sancarlos.noc.uson.mx
> >> 148.225.1.9
> >> 148.225.2.9
> >>
> >>
> >> Sent from my blackberry
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: mike havens 
> >> Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 20:47:58
> >> To: Main PLUG discussion list
> >> Subject: DNS
> >>
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
>
> Stephen
>
> ---
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
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Re: DNS

[mike havens]

Hey guys what do you think of 4.2.2.2 and 4.2.2.1? From what I've read
Verizon bought them and there is speculation they will go away. What do you
think about that?

On 11/27/09, Dorian Monroe  wrote:
>
> dns1.uson.mx
> sancarlos.noc.uson.mx
> 148.225.1.9
> 148.225.2.9
>
>
> Sent from my blackberry
>
> -Original Message-
> From: mike havens 
> Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2009 20:47:58
> To: Main PLUG discussion list
> Subject: DNS
>
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DNS

[mike havens]

I'm trying to find the DNS in Nogales, Mexico.  I stuck  my terms into
Google and came up with the following web page:
http://www.robtex.com/dns/nogales.uson.mx.html My belief is that the IP
addresses under the heading IP are the DNS settings. Am I correct?

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Re: PLUG Group on Identi.ca

[mike havens]

so why are you on aa canadian site?

On 11/20/09, Bill Lindley  wrote:
>
> Why are we on a Canadian website?
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Re: running Linux on odd devices is SOOO COOL!

[mike havens]

that is so cool!

On 11/13/09, Steven A. DuChene  wrote:
>
> So I am running a special version of Linux on my son's Nintendo DS Lite
> handheld game console!
>
> It is so cool!
>
>
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Re: battery problem

[mike havens]

Yea, sometimes the fan does seem louder than usual.This is a laptop we're
talking about though. Do you think I should crack it open and blow it out or
just replace the brick. I was further thinking that because the brick seems
to fluctuate it's power supply less frequently (the power is more
consistent) that if I were to replace the battery it would fix the problem
because the battery has never been replaced and it is about 5 years old.

On 10/29/09, Dorian Monroe  wrote:
>
> Check the fans to be sure they're blowing and there aren't any obstructions
> or clogged up with dust.  Or if the fans seem to be running on high
> constantly (or spinning up to a higher rpm frequently).
>
> My Thinkpad T60 was overheating and shutting itself down once in a while
> due to overheating, mostly when playing WoW (windows) or anything else that
> did a lot of graphics processing.  I opened it up and cleaned off the old
> heat sink compound and applied some new grease and its been running fine.  I
> also use a laptop cooler whenever possible, that plugs into the usb port
> that allows better air circulation than having it sit flat on a table.
>
>
> Sent from my blackberry
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: mike havens 
> Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2009 11:08:50
> To: Main PLUG discussion list
> Subject: Re: battery problem
>
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Re: battery problem

[mike havens]

not that I am aware of how would I know?

On 10/29/09, Eric Shubert  wrote:
>
> mike havens wrote:
> > recap:
> > computer started turning itself off
> > you advised taking battery out to see if that cleared up the problem
> > it did. for a while
> > now it turns itself off but not as frequently
> > Now I think it is both components. What do you think?
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
>
> Perhaps you should be doing something else? ;)
>
> Seriously though, is it overheating?
>
>
> --
> -Eric 'shubes'
>
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battery problem

[mike havens]

recap:
computer started turning itself off
you advised taking battery out to see if that cleared up the problem
it did. for a while
now it turns itself off but not as frequently
Now I think it is both components. What do you think?
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Re: ot - social security number being used fraudulantly

[mike havens]

I will


On 10/23/09, keith smith  wrote:
>
> Have you made a police report?
>
> 
> Keith Smith
>
>
> --- On Thu, 10/22/09, mike havens  wrote:
>
> > From: mike havens 
> > Subject: ot - social security number being used fraudulantly
> > To: "Main PLUG discussion list" 
> > Date: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 1:23 PM
>
> > I know nowhere else to turn. My social
> > security number is being used fraudulantly (I got a call
> > from a business because I put an alert on my credit report).
> > I do not know what to do so I must ask you. What can I
> > do?
> >
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
>
> > -Inline Attachment Follows-
>
> >
> > ---
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> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
> > settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
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>
>
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Re: First Microsoft Store in Scottsdale

[mike havens]

A protest? They're just trying to make money!

On 10/23/09, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:
>
>
> http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/microsoftpri0/2010120131_first_microsoft_store_opens_in_scottsdale.html
>
> anyone check it out?  should we organize a protest? ;)
>
> -jmz
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Re: laptop battery capacity

[mike havens]

that's a problem in the summer! things are always hot then.

General rule of thumb - if your battery is hot during charging, its probably
> not being charged correctly for long term use.
>

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Re: laptop battery capacity

[mike havens]

that works too

On 10/22/09, Bob Elzer  wrote:
>
>  My HP pavilion is always plugged in, once the battery is fully
> charged, the light goes off telling me it isn't charging any more.
>
>
>  --
>  *From:* plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:
> plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] *On Behalf Of *mike havens
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 22, 2009 7:13 AM
> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list
> *Subject:* Re: laptop battery capacity
>
> For clarification:
> I think you also don't want the battery in if you only run the lap-top
> while the lap-top is plugged in. Isn't one of the deals with rechargeables
> that it only has a certain amount of charge time? Therefore, you don't
> always want to have it plugged in and charging.
>
>
> On 10/22/09, mike havens  wrote:
>>
>> I think you also don't want the battery in if you only run it while it is
>> plugged in.
>>
>>
>> On 10/22/09, Jerry Davis  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 00:44:10 -0700
>>> Nathan England  wrote:
>>>
>>> yes, take it to batteries plus, and get it rebuilt.
>>> i am also guilty of this, but the kind of batteries that are in laptops,
>>> need
>>> to be almost fully discharged once in a while, as lithium ion batteries
>>> need
>>> that.
>>>
>>> periodically, I will unplug, and let it go down to like less than 4 min
>>> left,
>>> and then plug it back in.
>>>
>>> i've had 2 batteries, go out on me because of this.
>>>
>>> jerry
>>>
>>>
>>> >
>>> > I realize batteries lose capacity over time, but this seems rediculous
>>> to me
>>> > as I have never had a laptop battery go as fast as the current one. I
>>> have
>>> > only owned Dell laptops in the past and the batteries have lasted
>>> plenty
>>> > long, but this HP is killing me! Just over a year old and the battery
>>> is less
>>> > than half the capacity at full charge!!! Hardinfo says:
>>> >
>>> > 2592 mAh / 6000 mAh (43.20%)
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Yikes!!!
>>> >
>>> > Isn't there anything that can be done to force a fuller charge ? this
>>> sucks!
>>> >
>>> > nathan
>>> > ---
>>> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Hobbit Name: Pimpernel Loamsdown
>>> Registered Linux User: 275424
>>> K7AZJ
>>>
>>> This email's Fortune:
>>> Life is an exciting business, and most exciting when it is lived for
>>> others.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
> ---
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Re: laptop battery capacity

[mike havens]

how discharged does it need to be for the light to come on again?

On 10/22/09, mike havens  wrote:
>
> that works too
>
>
> On 10/22/09, Bob Elzer  wrote:
>>
>>  My HP pavilion is always plugged in, once the battery is fully
>> charged, the light goes off telling me it isn't charging any more.
>>
>>
>>  --
>>  *From:* plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:
>> plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] *On Behalf Of *mike havens
>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 22, 2009 7:13 AM
>> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list
>> *Subject:* Re: laptop battery capacity
>>
>> For clarification:
>> I think you also don't want the battery in if you only run the lap-top
>> while the lap-top is plugged in. Isn't one of the deals with rechargeables
>> that it only has a certain amount of charge time? Therefore, you don't
>> always want to have it plugged in and charging.
>>
>>
>> On 10/22/09, mike havens  wrote:
>>>
>>> I think you also don't want the battery in if you only run it while it is
>>> plugged in.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 10/22/09, Jerry Davis  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 00:44:10 -0700
>>>> Nathan England  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> yes, take it to batteries plus, and get it rebuilt.
>>>> i am also guilty of this, but the kind of batteries that are in laptops,
>>>> need
>>>> to be almost fully discharged once in a while, as lithium ion batteries
>>>> need
>>>> that.
>>>>
>>>> periodically, I will unplug, and let it go down to like less than 4 min
>>>> left,
>>>> and then plug it back in.
>>>>
>>>> i've had 2 batteries, go out on me because of this.
>>>>
>>>> jerry
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> > I realize batteries lose capacity over time, but this seems rediculous
>>>> to me
>>>> > as I have never had a laptop battery go as fast as the current one. I
>>>> have
>>>> > only owned Dell laptops in the past and the batteries have lasted
>>>> plenty
>>>> > long, but this HP is killing me! Just over a year old and the battery
>>>> is less
>>>> > than half the capacity at full charge!!! Hardinfo says:
>>>> >
>>>> > 2592 mAh / 6000 mAh (43.20%)
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Yikes!!!
>>>> >
>>>> > Isn't there anything that can be done to force a fuller charge ? this
>>>> sucks!
>>>> >
>>>> > nathan
>>>> > ---
>>>> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>>> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Hobbit Name: Pimpernel Loamsdown
>>>> Registered Linux User: 275424
>>>> K7AZJ
>>>>
>>>> This email's Fortune:
>>>> Life is an exciting business, and most exciting when it is lived for
>>>> others.
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>>
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>



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ot - social security number being used fraudulantly

[mike havens]

I know nowhere else to turn. My social security number is being used
fraudulantly (I got a call from a business because I put an alert on my
credit report). I do not know what to do so I must ask you. What can I do?

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Re: laptop battery capacity

[mike havens]

For clarification:
I think you also don't want the battery in if you only run the lap-top while
the lap-top is plugged in. Isn't one of the deals with rechargeables that it
only has a certain amount of charge time? Therefore, you don't always want
to have it plugged in and charging.


On 10/22/09, mike havens  wrote:
>
> I think you also don't want the battery in if you only run it while it is
> plugged in.
>
>
> On 10/22/09, Jerry Davis  wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 00:44:10 -0700
>> Nathan England  wrote:
>>
>> yes, take it to batteries plus, and get it rebuilt.
>> i am also guilty of this, but the kind of batteries that are in laptops,
>> need
>> to be almost fully discharged once in a while, as lithium ion batteries
>> need
>> that.
>>
>> periodically, I will unplug, and let it go down to like less than 4 min
>> left,
>> and then plug it back in.
>>
>> i've had 2 batteries, go out on me because of this.
>>
>> jerry
>>
>>
>> >
>> > I realize batteries lose capacity over time, but this seems rediculous
>> to me
>> > as I have never had a laptop battery go as fast as the current one. I
>> have
>> > only owned Dell laptops in the past and the batteries have lasted plenty
>> > long, but this HP is killing me! Just over a year old and the battery is
>> less
>> > than half the capacity at full charge!!! Hardinfo says:
>> >
>> > 2592 mAh / 6000 mAh (43.20%)
>> >
>> >
>> > Yikes!!!
>> >
>> > Isn't there anything that can be done to force a fuller charge ? this
>> sucks!
>> >
>> > nathan
>> > ---
>> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Hobbit Name: Pimpernel Loamsdown
>> Registered Linux User: 275424
>> K7AZJ
>>
>> This email's Fortune:
>> Life is an exciting business, and most exciting when it is lived for
>> others.
>>
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:




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Re: laptop battery capacity

[mike havens]

I think you also don't want the battery in if you only run it while it is
plugged in.

On 10/22/09, Jerry Davis  wrote:
>
> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 00:44:10 -0700
> Nathan England  wrote:
>
> yes, take it to batteries plus, and get it rebuilt.
> i am also guilty of this, but the kind of batteries that are in laptops,
> need
> to be almost fully discharged once in a while, as lithium ion batteries
> need
> that.
>
> periodically, I will unplug, and let it go down to like less than 4 min
> left,
> and then plug it back in.
>
> i've had 2 batteries, go out on me because of this.
>
> jerry
>
>
> >
> > I realize batteries lose capacity over time, but this seems rediculous to
> me
> > as I have never had a laptop battery go as fast as the current one. I
> have
> > only owned Dell laptops in the past and the batteries have lasted plenty
> > long, but this HP is killing me! Just over a year old and the battery is
> less
> > than half the capacity at full charge!!! Hardinfo says:
> >
> > 2592 mAh / 6000 mAh (43.20%)
> >
> >
> > Yikes!!!
> >
> > Isn't there anything that can be done to force a fuller charge ? this
> sucks!
> >
> > nathan
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>
>
>
>
> --
> Hobbit Name: Pimpernel Loamsdown
> Registered Linux User: 275424
> K7AZJ
>
> This email's Fortune:
> Life is an exciting business, and most exciting when it is lived for
> others.
>
> ---
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Re: ot - I got a call today

[mike havens]

fun stuff!

On 10/21/09, Lisa Kachold  wrote:
>
> You can trivially set your ANI field information using Asterisk or any
> callerId tools running from your desktop using a IAX or SIP trunk.
> Axvoice allows you to set the callerid field to whatever you like when you
> signup for their $9.99 sip service.
>
> Windows based desktop clients allow this also.
>
> On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 8:02 AM, mike havens  wrote:
>
>> This call was from Atlanta, Georgia. 770.999. was the number. After a
>> little research I found out about ID Spoofing. Was this a soofed number? Or
>> else is  a special number or something like that? The call was from
>> someone verifying an application 'I' filled out.I don't think so!
>>
>> --
>> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Skype: (623)239-3392
> AT&T: (503)754-4452
> www.obnosis.com
> http://www.obnosis.com/motivatebytruth/will_work_4_bandwidth.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
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ot - I got a call today

[mike havens]

This call was from Atlanta, Georgia. 770.999. was the number. After a
little research I found out about ID Spoofing. Was this a soofed number? Or
else is  a special number or something like that? The call was from
someone verifying an application 'I' filled out.I don't think so!

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Re: power supply

[mike havens]

Thanks for the info. I think It's the battery. I left it on all day  and got
home from work and it was still humming along. But, as I said before, only
time will tell. I think I'll give it a week and then put the battery back in
to see if it starts crashing again.

On 10/19/09, Jim March <1.jim.ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> There's one more thing about laptop bricks.
>
> The wattage.
>
> You want a replacement with as much or more wattage as what you have.
> Never less.  Common sizes run from 45watt on the low end to the 60 to
> 75 range as the most common, 90 to 120 for the big guys.
>
> It's OK to use a brick with "too much" wattage on a smaller machine,
> so long as the voltage and plug size/pins are correct.  The lappy will
> only draw what it needs.
>
> On the aforementioned Dell brick I used as an example, it doesn't list
> watts directly.  It says 19.5 volts at 3.34 amps.  So take a nice
> little conversion website like:
>
> http://www.supercircuits.com/resources/tools/Volts-Watts-Amps-Converter
>
> Punch in whatever two items you know and it will calculate the third -
> in this case, 65.13 amps, right in the "midsize" range.
>
> So if I was shopping for a replacement brick, I would know a 60 would
> be trouble and a 75 would be fine.
>
> Cool, huh?
>
> Your existing brick will ALWAYS tell you what's going on - both on the
> input (AC) side and output (DC) side.  Unless you peeled the sticker
> off listing all that...
>
>
> Jim
> ---
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> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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Re: power supply

[mike havens]

I figured out why it is called a 'brick'... compared to the rest of the
computer it is 'dumb as a brick'! Hardy har-har.

On 10/19/09, mike havens  wrote:
>
> Thanks for the tutorial. It was very informative! I took the battery out
> the moment you told me to test that . So far no crashes but I've had it go
> days without crashing so I suppose it is just a wait and see type of thing.
>
> On 10/19/09, Jim March <1.jim.ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 8:03 AM, mike havens  wrote:
>>
>> > so the prick is the power supply? Thanks for the help I am so
>> thankful I
>> > found you guys. You all are so helpful and friendly.
>>
>>
>> Well mostly :).  OK, here's how power management really works in a laptop.
>>
>> The "brick" turns AC wall power into DC.  I just picked up a Dell
>> brick off my floor, it's putting out 19.5v DC.  That's the main power
>> supply, what most people just call "the power supply".  Like most of
>> these bricks, my Dell brick can take in foreign-spec AC (220v at 50
>> cycles) in addition to US-spec.
>>
>> Once DC gets into the laptop, a much much smaller DC-to-DC power
>> supply turns it into 12v, 5v and usually 3.3v or so.  Sometimes 2.8v.
>> It's very, VERY uncommon for that part to break, because it's not
>> under as much stress.  The reason the main power supply (AC-to-DC
>> "brick") is external at all is because it heats up from the amount of
>> work it does...and because they blow up a lot, the makers want to be
>> able to quickly swap them with no screwdriver involved.  By the time
>> power gets all the way into the laptop past the brick, a lot of the
>> "heavy lifting" power conversion is already done by the brick.  The
>> laptop is being spoon-fed something very easy to digest.
>>
>> If the DC-to-DC internal power supply blows, you're screwed - it's
>> part of the motherboard most of the time.  But you're also having an
>> astonishingly unlucky day if that happens, I've never seen it myself.
>>
>> There's one more circuit involved: the "battery charge controller".
>> This takes DC in and spoon-feeds it in and out of the batteries,
>> detecting when the batteries are full and chopping power when they
>> are.  Good ones slowly back off the power as it gets close to full.
>> That circuit is built into the battery pack itself, so swap batteries
>> and you swap that.  The laptop can run without it, and if that charge
>> controller goes bonkers it can cause problems such as you're having.
>> Hence as a test run it without the battery, eliminate that as an
>> issue.
>>
>> The reason you have the charge controller in the battery is to allow
>> different capacity battery packs.  You can order three different
>> grades of battery off of Dell for example for my laptop, and each will
>> have different charge controller settings for their respective
>> internal battery arrays.
>>
>> That's how laptop power works.
>>
>> Desktop power supplies are simpler: they take AC in, put out the
>> various DC types the system needs.  Even then most motherboards will
>> have a small DC-to-DC power supply on board to feed very clean and
>> precise stuff to the CPU and in many cases vary the CPU voltage under
>> software control.
>>
>>
>> Jim
>> ---
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>>
>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:




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Re: power supply

[mike havens]

Thanks for the tutorial. It was very informative! I took the battery out the
moment you told me to test that . So far no crashes but I've had it go days
without crashing so I suppose it is just a wait and see type of thing.

On 10/19/09, Jim March <1.jim.ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 8:03 AM, mike havens  wrote:
>
> > so the prick is the power supply? Thanks for the help I am so
> thankful I
> > found you guys. You all are so helpful and friendly.
>
>
> Well mostly :).  OK, here's how power management really works in a laptop.
>
> The "brick" turns AC wall power into DC.  I just picked up a Dell
> brick off my floor, it's putting out 19.5v DC.  That's the main power
> supply, what most people just call "the power supply".  Like most of
> these bricks, my Dell brick can take in foreign-spec AC (220v at 50
> cycles) in addition to US-spec.
>
> Once DC gets into the laptop, a much much smaller DC-to-DC power
> supply turns it into 12v, 5v and usually 3.3v or so.  Sometimes 2.8v.
> It's very, VERY uncommon for that part to break, because it's not
> under as much stress.  The reason the main power supply (AC-to-DC
> "brick") is external at all is because it heats up from the amount of
> work it does...and because they blow up a lot, the makers want to be
> able to quickly swap them with no screwdriver involved.  By the time
> power gets all the way into the laptop past the brick, a lot of the
> "heavy lifting" power conversion is already done by the brick.  The
> laptop is being spoon-fed something very easy to digest.
>
> If the DC-to-DC internal power supply blows, you're screwed - it's
> part of the motherboard most of the time.  But you're also having an
> astonishingly unlucky day if that happens, I've never seen it myself.
>
> There's one more circuit involved: the "battery charge controller".
> This takes DC in and spoon-feeds it in and out of the batteries,
> detecting when the batteries are full and chopping power when they
> are.  Good ones slowly back off the power as it gets close to full.
> That circuit is built into the battery pack itself, so swap batteries
> and you swap that.  The laptop can run without it, and if that charge
> controller goes bonkers it can cause problems such as you're having.
> Hence as a test run it without the battery, eliminate that as an
> issue.
>
> The reason you have the charge controller in the battery is to allow
> different capacity battery packs.  You can order three different
> grades of battery off of Dell for example for my laptop, and each will
> have different charge controller settings for their respective
> internal battery arrays.
>
> That's how laptop power works.
>
> Desktop power supplies are simpler: they take AC in, put out the
> various DC types the system needs.  Even then most motherboards will
> have a small DC-to-DC power supply on board to feed very clean and
> precise stuff to the CPU and in many cases vary the CPU voltage under
> software control.
>
>
> Jim
> ---
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> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
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Re: power supply

[mike havens]

so the prick is the power supply? Thanks for the help I am so thankful I
found you guys. You all are so helpful and friendly.

On 10/19/09, Jim March <1.jim.ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 6:03 AM, mike havens  wrote:
> >
> >
> > On 10/18/09, Jim March <1.jim.ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> If it's still glitching, it's your "brick".  Good source for cheap
> >> replacements at the bottom of this page:
> >
> > Pray, tell! What do you mean by brick?
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
>
> "Brick" means the external power supply - you know, that big black
> square thing in the middle of your power cord unless you own an Apple
> in which case it's white.
>
> It takes AC in, puts DC out.  It will list on it exactly what it can
> take in and put out.  What you care most about is output wattage.
>
> The original factory one only puts out one voltage DC (or sometimes
> two).  The "universal" ones have different tips, each tip "tells" the
> brick what kind of voltage is needed at that tip shape.
>
>
> Jim
> ---
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Re: power supply

[mike havens]

On 10/18/09, Jim March <1.jim.ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> If it's still glitching, it's your "brick".  Good source for cheap
> replacements at the bottom of this page:
>

Pray, tell! What do you mean by brick?
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power supply

[mike havens]

My lap top keeps turning itself off usually right after I start another
application as if it caused too much draw. Sometimes I can go days w/o it
turning itself off while other times it won't stay on 30 seconds. This tells
me it is the power supply. Am I correct? Where would I get a power supply
for a laptop?

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Re: This is what computers do with most users...

[mike havens]

http://www.google.com/search?q=linux+comic&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

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Re: Horked-up system, Fedora 11

[mike havens]

why would you want to relabel everything?

On 10/11/09, Craig White  wrote:
>
> On Sun, 2009-10-11 at 04:30 -0700, Vaughn Treude wrote:
> > Hello all:
> > Recently I upgraded my main Linux desktop to Fedora 11. Everything was
> > great, until a couple nights ago I was woken by a frantic beeping coming
> > from my office. It was my Fedora machine, which was spewing out weird
> > "SELinux troubleshoot" messages. I rebooted the machine, and it was
> > running very slowly, so I shut it down.
> > Today I got time to look at it. The first thing I encountered was an
> > ominous error at login, something about "Gnome power management
> > configuration" being invalid. Then I discovered X would not start; it
> > went to a black screen and appeared to be hung. I could, however, log in
> > in console mode.
> > The first thing I noticed was that my "messages" file in /var/log had
> > become humungous.
> > About the time of the incident, there were several thousand messages of
> > this form:
> >
> > Oct  8 07:41:48 vaughn kernel: [drm:r128_cce_stop] *ERROR* r128_cce_stop
> > called
> > without lock held, held  0 owner f50efd20 f50efd20
> > Oct  8 07:41:48 vaughn kernel: [drm:r128_cce_reset] *ERROR*
> > r128_cce_reset called without lock held, held  0 owner f50efd20 f50efd20
> > Oct  8 07:41:48 vaughn kernel: [drm:r128_cce_start] *ERROR*
> > r128_cce_start called without lock held, held  0 owner f50efd20 f50efd20
> > Oct  8 07:41:48 vaughn kernel: [drm:r128_cce_idle] *ERROR* r128_cce_idle
> > called
> > without lock held, held  0 owner f50efd20 f50efd20
> >
> > I googled this problem and discovered that (duh!) r128_cce refers to my
> > ATI Rage 128 driver. I wondered if this card was getting ready to give
> > up the ghost. (Previously I'd had occasionally lockups when in the
> > screensaver which I decided were probably video-related - when I turned
> > of the screen saver, the problems went away.) So I decided to try
> > rebooting the machine and logging in under my old Centos install
> > (luckily I'd saved that partition.) Centos booted OK, I logged in, and X
> > came up fine. So apparently the card is still working, though perhaps
> > the driver (in Fedora) got hosed.
> >
> > So once again I checked out the /var/log/message file in the Fedora root
> > partition. In today's entry, the message file contains a bunch of error
> > messages of this type:
> > Oct 10 20:09:43 vaughn gdm-simple-greeter[4745]: WARNING: could not get
> > gconf key '/apps/gdm/simple-greeter/recent-languages': Failed to contact
> > configuration server; some possible causes are that you need to enable
> > TCP/IP networking for ORBit, or you have stale NFS locks due to a system
> > crash. See http://projects.gnome.org/gconf/ for information. (Details -
> > 1: Could not send message to gconf daemon: Process /usr/libexec/gconfd-2
> > received signal 6)
> >
> > Followed by some of these:
> > Oct 10 20:09:56 vaughn setroubleshoot: SELinux is preventing
> > console-kit-dae (consolekit_t) "sys_resource" consolekit_t. For complete
> > SELinux messages. run sealert -l 20147317-bf50-4d55-819f-465501e5db55
> > Oct 10 20:10:22 vaughn sedispatch: AVC Message for setroubleshoot,
> > dropping message
> >
> > and then a whole boat load of these:
> > Oct 10 20:31:49 vaughn kernel: Xorg:3937 freeing invalid memtype
> > e0196000-e019a000
> >
> > So I don't know if I have a video problem, a network problem, a security
> > problem, an X problem, or if the machine's just totally hosed.
> > Interestingly enough, I had just tried to run a security update on the
> > system the night before the Incident. For some unknown reason, it
> > aborted. I saved the bug report but it appears to be mostly memory dumps
> > which mean nothing to me.
> > Unfortunately I usually don't bother to back up the root partition on a
> > new install until I've gotten everything configured just right. I'd
> > finally gotten there a few days before, but hadn't gotten around to
> > actually doing the backup.
> >
> > So, any suggestions? Does it sound like it's so badly hosed I have to
> > reinstall?
> > I suppose I could try the "repair" utility on the Fedora install disk,
> > but haven't had much luck with it in the past.
> > I guess I could go back to the console login and try to do a yum update
> > manually. (Yum was working fine for configuring all my media players, so
> > I don't know why the recommended security update failed.)
> > I'd appreciate any suggestions on the best course of  action!
> > Thanks!
> 
> sudo fixfiles onboot
>
> this will relabel everything
>
> Craig
>
>
> --
> This message has been scanned for viruses and
> dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
> believed to be clean.
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This is what computers do with most users...

[mike havens]

set the date to OCT 10 if you get this after SAT.

http://news.yahoo.com/comics/classic-bloom-county

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Re: AES explained

[mike havens]

(the village idiot speaks) My brain hurts now!

On Tue, Sep 29, 2009 at 9:54 AM, Bob Elzer  wrote:

>  I was even in the story.
>
> I was one of those guys shooting arrows from distributed.net   lol
>
>
>  --
> *From:* plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:
> plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] *On Behalf Of *Dazed_75
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 29, 2009 8:56 AM
> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list
> *Subject:* AES explained
>
> A pretty amazing cartoon strip explains AES encryption.
>
> http://www.moserware.com/2009/09/stick-figure-guide-to-advanced.html
>
> --
> Dazed_75 a.k.a. Larry
>
> The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions,
> that I wish it always to be kept alive.
>  - Thomas Jefferson
>
> ---
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Re: a Karmic Koala Goodness

[mike havens]

it seems to me that distros run better when run live rather than when
installed. That is just my experience though.

On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 2:09 PM, Stephen  wrote:

> interesting tidbit.
>
> thx
>
> On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 1:54 PM, Dazed_75  wrote:
> > Last month I gave a talk at the East Side meeting and talked about
> netbooks
> > and using different distributions.  All seemed to have issues even if
> they
> > were mostly resolvable.  I downloaded the Ubuntu Netbook Remix Alpha 6
> > version of Karmic Koala and made a live USB stick.  That booted up on my
> > ASUS eeePC 1000 and everything worked out of the box including the
> webcam,
> > bluetooth (even for the MS 5000 bluetooth mouse), and touchpad.  While it
> > did not already include anything to totally turn off the touchpad, it
> could
> > turn it off while typing.
> >
> > Now I was able to crash it, but it was still the alpha phase and I only
> ran
> > it from the stick without installing so that was not a surprise.
> >
> > --
> > Dazed_75 a.k.a. Larry
> >
> > The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain
> occasions,
> > that I wish it always to be kept alive.
> >  - Thomas Jefferson
> >
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>
>
>
> --
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
> Stephen
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Re: FS Stammtisch Tempe tonight

[mike havens]

How many people in NOrthern AZ would like to meet for a stammtisch? I would
like to! I'm in Cottonwood. Would the Linux Brother who gets his signal off
of Mingus Mountain (Mike E.) and whoever else lives up here like to get
together. W could meet at starbucks in Sedona. That would be col! Whom,
in the valley, would like to come up here for the linux meeting? YEAH!
Everybody could come on up. That would be even colER.

On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 3:53 PM, der.hans  wrote:

> moin moin,
>
> just a reminder that the Tempe Free Software Stammtisch is tonight at
> Boulders on Broadway.
>
> http://www.LuftHans.com/Free_Software_Stammtisch#Tempe
>
> Boulders on Broadway
> 530 W Broadway Rd
> Tempe, AZ 85282-1311
>
> We start at 19:00.
>
> Tomorrow night is the Free Software Stammtisch in Avondale. Also starts at
> 19:00.
>
> http://www.LuftHans.com/Free_Software_Stammtisch#Avondale
>
> Buffalo Wings and Rings
> 2935 Dysart Rd.
> Avondale, AZ 85323
>
> ciao,
>
> der.hans
> --
> #  http://www.LuftHans.com/http://www.ABLEconf.com/
> #  Director of Engineering, FonWallet Transaction Solutions, Inc.
> #  ABLEconf: Saturday, 2009Okt24, Tempe. Call for Presentations now open.
> #  "Rock 'n' roll might not solve your problems, but it does let you dance
> #  all over them." -- Pete Townsend
> ---
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Re: What is syntax to copy only new files?

[mike havens]

man... you guys are so knowledgable!

On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 2:21 PM, James Mcphee  wrote:

> rsync is built for stuff like this.  I use the following in one of my sync
> routines.  Your flag may vary:
>
> rsync -avvz /path/to/source /path/to/dest
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Josef Lowder  wrote:
>
>> What is the syntax to copy only new files from a CD backup to a hard disk?
>>
>> I make backups of my files onto CDs and copy them onto another computer
>> to maintain redunancy.  Probably there is a better way to do this (sync,
>> etc.)
>> so I would also appreciate knowing what is a better way to do this.
>>
>> What I have been using is this:
>>
>> cp -rp /mnt/cdrom/foldername /home/joe/foldername 
>>
>> That works, but I don't want to re-write files that are unchanged,
>> and I don't want to write over any files that are newer on the
>> destination system.  How should this syntax be changed?
>> ---
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>
>
>
> --
> James McPhee
> jmc...@gmail.com
>
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Firefox won't start gmail in windows

[mike havens]

it tells me:
 We're sorry. It seems there is a problem. Please try using Gmail
 with a supported browser. If you're encountering this error while
 using a supported browser, we suggest alerting your Internet Service
 Provider (ISP) that a proxy is failing to accept cookies on HTTP redirects.

I know it's not the ISP because my dad's firefox will load it. What
can be the problem? (i know... window's stinks--- the computer is SLOW
now)
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Re: Account of Employee owned IT consulting meeting.

[mike havens]

Mister Coleman. This is that cable guy you had out at your place to repair
and bury your cable line a couple of months ago. This message is also going
out to the best *nix mailing list there is and I thought you might like to
get involved to get any *nix questions you have answered and to also help
anybody else with problems they may have. If your interested sign up through
plug.phoenix.az.us and enjoy yourself! This group actually interacts with
one another. I do not know if you are involved with the FLUX (Florida Linux
Users eXchange) group but the Phoenix group is much more vocal or friendly.
Even after are political debates we're still all great friends! We even get
together once a month or so.

PLUG this is a really cool guy.

On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 8:49 PM, unixprgrm...@gmail.com <
unixprgrm...@gmail.com> wrote:

> A few thoughts...
>
> - have a sales person sell the services of the group on a commission
> basis.  this person could be a former sales person from Volt or Manpower or
> whatever Co.  this could provide a steady stream of income to the sales
> person.  a REAL bonus for a commissioned sales person.
> - possibly sell support contracts with set response times, as well as
> project services.  members of the group could take turns being on call for
> various areas of expertise and be paid accordingly from the support contract
> income.
> - answering pages would also provide opportunities for the consultants to
> sell projects as well.
> - the above would leave the members independent, provide steady marketing
> for their skills and very possibly a steady income stream.
>
> Just some thoughts...
>
> Lynn
>
> On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 5:26 PM, Trent Shipley wrote:
>
>> We met to talk about employee owned IT contracting firms, sharing space
>> with PLUG's Installfest.  There were five participants, two were currently
>> independent IT practitioners and one had been and independent practitioner
>> in the past.
>>
>> There was a genuine feeling that small businesses were not getting the
>> quality of IT service that they deserved and that the deficit got more
>> pronounced as businesses got smaller.  Small businesses needed time-share IT
>> services.  Quick response was essential.  The service also needed to be
>> broad.  No single practitioner can be competent to deal with every
>> eventuality that a reasonable customer base of small and medium businesses
>> might present.  One person suggested that someone looking to get into
>> serving small businesses should call dentists, doctors, lawyers, Realtors,
>> construction firms, and so on, to see who is providing their IT service now.
>>
>> Although the initial discussion was about an employee owned consulting
>> firm, the preponderance of successful, independent practitioners drove the
>> conversation to focus on organizational forms that would enhance business
>> for small, independent IT practitioners.  The conversation generally moved
>> from solutions that would reduce independence but give reliable incomes, to
>> solutions that left independent practitioners independent.
>>
>> The employee owned company theoretically keeps its focus on engineering
>> and technology.  It also should provide relatively secure steady incomes for
>> the employees.  The big down side is that the founders take on
>> entrepreneurial risk without the potential reward of becoming
>> disproportionately wealthy if the company succeeds.
>>
>> Another potential form of cooperative is a firm that outsources all the
>> real work to subcontractors.  The virtual IT firm handles contracts,
>> marketing and sales, but the actual work is done by subcontracted
>> (independent) experts.  While this could be an entrepreneurial model, the
>> version envisioned in the discussion would be owned by member IT
>> practitioners and would award subcontracts to members.  The cooperative
>> would be very selective about what IT practitioners or firms could become
>> members.
>>
>> We observed that independent practitioners (which for practical purposes
>> includes IT groups of up to ten or so employees) need to be lean, wear
>> multiple hats, and bridge the people gap.  Marketing and sales can be a
>> challenge for the independent IT practitioner since these skills will not
>> come naturally to most of them.  We thought that the professions--dentistry,
>> medicine, law, and architecture are role models for the IT practice.
>> Construction contracting may be an even better model especially because IT
>> practitioners will have to deal with fraudulent and non-fraudulent
>> non-payment, shady characters, and so on.  The former independent
>> practitioner said that the only resource that delivered value to his
>> practice was the Arizona Small Business Association.  Networking groups were
>> worse than useless because they attracted sales monkeys, dreamers, ne'er do
>> wells, and fraudsters in overwhelming numbers.  Also, one should studiously
>> avoid any trade or barter deals.  Work for real mo

Re: OT: (sorta) Penguin Trivia

[mike havens]

and I was believing you until the singing part!

On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 7:36 PM, Eric Shubert  wrote:

> Did you ever wonder why there are no dead penguins on the ice in
> Antarctica - Where do they go?
> Well, wonder no more!!!
>
> It's a known fact that the penguin is a very ritualistic bird who lives
> an extremely ordered and complex life.
> Also, the penguin is very committed to its family and will mate for
> life, as well as maintaining a form of compassionate contact with its
> offspring throughout its life.
>
> If a penguin is found dead on the ice surface, other members of the
> family and social circle have been known to dig holes in  the ice, using
> their vestigial wings and beaks.  They'll dig until the hole is deep
> enough for the dead bird to be rolled in and buried.
> The male penguins then gather in a circle around the fresh grave and
> they sing..."Freeze a jolly good fellow."
>
> Then they kick him in the ice hole.
> --
> -Eric 'shubes'
>
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Re: Politics/Ethics: Operation PinWale - Obama Administration Seeks Emergency Control of the Internet

[mike havens]

amazing! just the other day I was thinking of this very cartoon.

On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 9:57 AM, James Finstrom  wrote:

> Civics 101 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlka6fTnDnI
>
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Re: OT: Re: Politics/Ethics: Operation PinWale - Obama AdministrationSeeks Emergency Control of the Internet

[mike havens]

CITIZENS who own land should only vote

On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 10:08 AM, Lyle Tuttle  wrote:

>  At 08:49 AM 8/31/2009, you wrote:
>
> In defense of Ryan, the idea that only landowners should be allowed to vote
> is so absurd that many would consider that "racist".  I took Ryan's reply to
> be merely mocking the ignorance (and racist undertone) that only landowners
> should be given the right to vote.  Since we're pointing fingers and all...
>
>
> I fail to see the "racist undertone" in that commentANYONE can be a
> landowner in the USA -- one does not even have to be a citizen to own land
> here.
>
> The truth is, I own land and real estate in several states...and live and
> am allowed to vote in only one of them (none of them are in the Chicago area
> ).  Yet my tax dollars support those other cities, counties and
> states.but I am not allowed to vote on any of the things that determine
> my taxes there...
>
> So, should I be allowed to vote in each of those districts?
>
> Or:
>
> Should those who do not pay property taxes - non-landowners (stop and think
> WHERE that tax money goes; what it is used for), be allowed to vote on those
> very projects that use MY money?
>
> Do "renters" pay school taxes, fire taxes, community college taxes,
> etc...??
>
> It's a little more interesting when you write the checks to the taxing
> authoritiesand it becomes a pretty narrow line on who should pay
> for, or use, or be taxed on some specific things..
>
> Now back to my first line:  ANYONE can own land here -- so, based on my
> argument above, should we allow foreigners to vote because they own land
> here?
>
>
> lyle tuttle
>
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Re: How to make the case for Linux more effective?

[mike havens]

did you write this?

On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Josef Lowder  wrote:

> How can we make the case *for* Linux more effective?
>
> http://www.vsiq.com/soapbox
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Re: Politics/Ethics: Operation PinWale - Obama Administration Seeks Emergency Control of the Internet

[mike havens]

I think only land oners should have the right to vote. I do not own anything
so I would not get to vote.

On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:39 PM, James Lee Bell wrote:

> Jason Spatafore wrote:
> > Until the representatives are removed...we will constantly struggle with
> > this so-called Democracy. Technology has finally caught up to where it
> > can be used for a direct Democratic country with lower costs than
> > running elections every two years. Now is the time to start
> > implementing.
> I rarely get involved in these discussions, preferring to lurk, but this
> is a very intriguing concept that *might* actually be feasible and
> achievable. All we have to do is figure out how to accomplish absolutely
> unhackable authentication without violating every right to privacy we
> hold dear.  Anybody want to hack that up by next Thursday? :-)
>
> > And yes, my first vote is to eliminate paper ballots and bar people
> > without access to computers from elections. Sorry, a computer is
> > available almost everywhere you go. It's time to grow with the times and
> > move on.
> I have to say I find this specific means-testing inappropriate just
> considering simple demographics. Have we even broken the 50% threshold
> of our eligible-to-vote citizens that could have access beyond dial-up?
> Hey, you want to computerize (*securely*) the collection of votes in
> such a way that folks in "flyover country (/sarcasm)" get to use the
> mechanism without owning the device and infrastructure, and without the
> yearly trip to Bethlehem, I'm right there with you. Give it 25 years,
> and maybe every citizen will have some level of computing device to
> participate. Until then...
>
> Just to take a philosophical hitch that'll probably generate a reaction
> to put me back in lurk mode, I absolutely think there should be a simple
> means test to earn voting rights: for the government entity in which you
> are about to vote (fed, state, city), have you paid taxes to that entity
> in x% of your eligible voting life (18+)? (asbestos underwear engaged :-)).
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Re: How to overcome a boot-up endless loop?

[mike havens]

what would happen if he just put a comment  character on the line

On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:09 PM, Josef Lowder  wrote:

> Tried both 'sleep 1' and booting with acpi=off.
> Neither worked.  Still have the same endless error displayed.
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Re: Help or arrogance (Was: Re: How to overcome a boot-up endless loop?)

[mike havens]

good! Now that it is settled back to the original question

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Alan Dayley  wrote:

> A most excellent point, Eric!
>
> I apologize, Mike, if I misinterpreted your statement.
>
> I would agree that people on the whole are snippy, if for no other
> reason than they have things to do.  PLUG is different, the anomaly,
> based on that premise.
>
> Alan
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 4:15 PM, Eric Cope wrote:
> > I thought that is what Mike was saying. The world is snippy. Plug is the
> > anomaly - the anomaly being helpful folks.
> > Perhaps Mike should clarify before this flame war burns down the
> internet.
> > Did we ever figure out the boot problem?
> > Eric
> >
> > On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 4:10 PM, Lisa Kachold 
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 4:02 PM, Alan Dayley
> >> wrote:
> >> > On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 3:56 PM, mike havens wrote:
> >> >> I think PLUG is an anomaly. It seems most people display snippety
> >> >> arrogance
> >> >> rather than help.
> >>
> >> Context is lost in email; often the process of tracking through
> >> incorrect assumptions via limited information provided in PLUG list
> >> email requires communication skills that might seem arrogant and
> >> short, however everyone happily jumps into help, even competing to get
> >> the best answer first. While some lack a certain touchy feely
> >> humanity, others can be petty, and still others downright blunt, but
> >> everyone accepts human limitations and enjoys the association found
> >> via PLUG interactions with even the most beginner of Nixites.
> >>
> >> So, Mike, I have to disagree here also; siding the Alan's appraisal.
> >>
> >> > I strongly disagree.  My experience with PLUG since spring 2000 is
> >> > that it is one of the most helpful and well behaved groups I have ever
> >> > associated with.
> >> >
> >> > YMMV.
> >> >
> >> > Alan
> >> > ---
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> >> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> http://linuxgazette.net/165/kachold.html
> >> (623)239-3392
> >> (503)754-4452 www.obnosis.com
> >> ---
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> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Eric Cope
> > http://cope-et-al.com
> >
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Re: Help or arrogance (Was: Re: How to overcome a boot-up endless loop?)

[mike havens]

Yes I meant that PLUG is helpful.

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 4:15 PM, Eric Cope  wrote:

> I thought that is what Mike was saying. The world is snippy. Plug is the
> anomaly - the anomaly being helpful folks.
> Perhaps Mike should clarify before this flame war burns down the internet.
> Did we ever figure out the boot problem?
> Eric
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 4:10 PM, Lisa Kachold wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 4:02 PM, Alan Dayley
>> wrote:
>> > On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 3:56 PM, mike havens wrote:
>> >> I think PLUG is an anomaly. It seems most people display snippety
>> arrogance
>> >> rather than help.
>>
>> Context is lost in email; often the process of tracking through
>> incorrect assumptions via limited information provided in PLUG list
>> email requires communication skills that might seem arrogant and
>> short, however everyone happily jumps into help, even competing to get
>> the best answer first. While some lack a certain touchy feely
>> humanity, others can be petty, and still others downright blunt, but
>> everyone accepts human limitations and enjoys the association found
>> via PLUG interactions with even the most beginner of Nixites.
>>
>> So, Mike, I have to disagree here also; siding the Alan's appraisal.
>>
>> > I strongly disagree.  My experience with PLUG since spring 2000 is
>> > that it is one of the most helpful and well behaved groups I have ever
>> > associated with.
>> >
>> > YMMV.
>> >
>> > Alan
>> > ---
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>> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>> (623)239-3392
>> (503)754-4452 www.obnosis.com
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>
>
>
> --
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> http://cope-et-al.com
>
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Re: How to overcome a boot-up endless loop?

[mike havens]

I think PLUG is an anomaly. It seems most people display snippety arrogance
rather than help.

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Josef Lowder  wrote:

> In response to the subject problem, someone wrote:
> > Buy a Mac? ;)
>
> That is obviously not helpful.
>
> I did buy a macbook 15" a few weeks ago and found it to be weird and
> totally unsatisfactory for many, many reasons ... beyond its
> over-priced, under-valued, worse than M$ proprietary-ness.
>
> So after a couple of weeks of trying to make some sense out its
> incredibly non-intuitive arbitrariness, I sold it and I certainly will
> not be going down that confusing road again.
>
> macs may be fine for music and videos and just playing around, but I
> could not get even simple serious work tasks to work efficiently or
> reasonably.  Disabling most "normal" CTRL key functions and
> substituting that silly mac "X" key in such an anatomically
> inconvenient location ... and disallowing simple window resizing from
> any side or corner are just two of many dozens of examples.
>
> To each his/her own.
>
> A few mac-types that I encountered during my brief foray into mac-land
> tried to be helpful; however, from far too many others, I found that
> one is more likely to experience snippety arrogance rather than
> constructive help.
>
> At least from most plug friends, one usually gets constructive help.
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Re: correct way to set timezone & clock/date?

[mike havens]

in a shell type 'tz' and hit the tab key. nthe correct selection should be
'tzconfig' but your results may vary

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 1:02 AM, James Mcphee  wrote:

> I use the ntp.org ntp servers.  http://www.pool.ntp.org/
>
> I set my /etc/localtime to America/Phoenix, which will do MST without MDT.
> How you accomplish this is dependent on your setup, of course.
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 11:23 PM, Steven A. DuChene <
> linux-clust...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>> I have a few systems here in my home that are either fedora or opensuse
>> installs.
>> I was setting up ganglia last night to add some monitoring to my home
>> setup
>> and discovered I had some issues with clock skew. When I got to looking I
>> noticed
>> that the timezones were set to MST and most of the systems were off by
>> about
>> a hour. What is the correct way to setup the timezone correctly for
>> systems located
>> here in Phoenix where daylight savings time changes do not take place?
>>
>> Also if you have a small home network what methods do everyone usually use
>> to keep clocks in sync across the network? I.E. if you use NTP what
>> externally
>> reliable NTP server do you use?
>> --
>> Steven DuChene
>>
>>
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>
>
> --
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>
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Re: It is now official

[mike havens]

thanks for the help gentlemen.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 5:33 PM,  wrote:

> Quoting mike havens :
>
> > thanks buddy. Unfortunately I need a 40 gig drive.
>
> http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=ST960815A-R&cat=HDD
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Re: It is now official

[mike havens]

thanks buddy. Unfortunately I need a 40 gig drive.

On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Stephen  wrote:

> I have a couple of old ones.. but they are 20 or 30gb. but im not near
> sedona... sadly... be nice this time of year
>
> On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 10:31 AM, mike havens wrote:
> > I think it is an IDE
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 8:11 AM, Stephen  wrote:
> >>
> >> IDE or SATA?
> >>
> >> On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 7:16 PM, mike havens wrote:
> >> > Well, to the dismay of some and the joy of others I am officially back
> >> > in
> >> > Arizona! Unfortunately, I am in need. I think my laptops HD is
> failing.
> >> > I
> >> > think that mainly because on the first night of my trip the computer
> >> > started
> >> > to sometimes not start and tells me the HD is failing. Would someone
> >> > know
> >> > where I could get one for cheep in the Sedona area? Free would be even
> >> > better!
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >> >
> >> > --- it is a toshiba satellite (if that matters) ---
> >> >
> >> > ---
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> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> >> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
> >>
> >> Stephen
> >> ---
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> >
> >
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> >
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>
>
>
> --
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
> Stephen
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Re: It is now official

[mike havens]

I think it is an IDE

On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 8:11 AM, Stephen  wrote:

> IDE or SATA?
>
> On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 7:16 PM, mike havens wrote:
> > Well, to the dismay of some and the joy of others I am officially back in
> > Arizona! Unfortunately, I am in need. I think my laptops HD is failing. I
> > think that mainly because on the first night of my trip the computer
> started
> > to sometimes not start and tells me the HD is failing. Would someone know
> > where I could get one for cheep in the Sedona area? Free would be even
> > better!
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
> > --- it is a toshiba satellite (if that matters) ---
> >
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>
>
>
> --
> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
>
> Stephen
> ---
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
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It is now official

[mike havens]

Well, to the dismay of some and the joy of others I am officially back in
Arizona! Unfortunately, I am in need. I think my laptops HD is failing. I
think that mainly because on the first night of my trip the computer started
to sometimes not start and tells me the HD is failing. Would someone know
where I could get one for cheep in the Sedona area? Free would be even
better!

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Re: Sonoran Penguin

[mike havens]

I joined the florida LUG and I never get messages from them except for
announcements. So a LOT happens with PLUG.

On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:

>  Which is why practically nothing ever happens :(
>
>  -jmz
>
> On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 5:26 PM, Lisa Kachold
> wrote:
> > Committee?
> >
> > No, we just make improvements.  No one gets to control things.
> >
> > On 8/5/09, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:
> >>  Howdy,
> >>
> >>   ok Im willing to make a professional Drupal template for PLUG.  The
> >> whole process should be a few days work.  I will make design proofs
> >> and the steering committee can decide whatever way they chose (cast
> >> ballots, draw straws, dartboard, etc.).  The designs will be based on
> >> the concept Lisa posted.  PLUG committee must agree to use the
> >> template for at least one year, which includes a small attribution
> >> link in the footer of every page.
> >>
> >>   perhaps this may lead to better efforts to get people to use the
> >> site.  I did discuss with Hans the idea of using web forums to
> >> ameliorate all these listserv problems.  In this scenario it is far
> >> easier to organize technical questions and have them accessible via
> >> search engine.  Also it is easier to manage relations with people whom
> >> you are not interested in reading ,etc.  The problem Hans raised is
> >> that a lot of users only want to use email.  Also putting it on web
> >> allows PLUG to raise money with advertising to fund events, etc.
> >>
> >>  -jmz
> >>
> >> On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 9:29 AM, Stephen wrote:
> >>> im game for it...
> >>>
> >>> and honestly im curious about the process
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 8:42 PM, Joshua Zeidner
> wrote:
>   If everyone likes this, I can offer to write a Drupal template for
>  the PLUG site using this concept.
> 
>   -jmz
> 
> 
>  On Tue, Aug 4, 2009 at 8:03 PM, R P Herrold
> wrote:
> > On Tue, 4 Aug 2009, Joshua Zeidner wrote:
> >
> >>  I made it with GIMP.  How come no one liked it when I posted it
> >>  I need to fire my PR manager.
> >
> > I read email with [al]pine in a monochrome terminal, fast and
> > low, and tossing read pieces out.  If it was in an early
> > email, I missed it.  I cannot say that I saw repetition of a
> > URL where I might view it, although the compliments seem to
> > indicate its worth.
> >
> > -- Russ herrold
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>  ---
>  PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>  To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>  http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> 
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from
> >>> rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button.
> >>>
> >>> Stephen
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>>
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > http://linuxgazette.net/165/kachold.html
> > (623)239-3392
> > (503)754-4452 www.obnosis.com
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
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Re: Handling Politics the plug-discuss way?

[mike havens]

no one will post to it and it won't stop in the general list. if I
remember right none of the other lists get any traffic; just this one, the
one for general discussion.

On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 11:15 AM, Lisa Kachold wrote:

> PLEASE Add a Political LIST for PLUG members interested in such
> discussions.
>
> On 8/3/09, Bob Elzer  wrote:
> > I've just been deleting the topic on sight. But that is more work than
> > should be necessary.
> >
> > This is one reason I thought it would be better to go to a forum.
> >
> > With a forum, if the thread goes off course, it can split and moved to
> the
> > correct Subject.
> >
> > The thread could also be locked if it gets out of hand.
> >
> > But best of all when I go to the forum, I see what's new, and I can
> ignore
> > all the threads I don't have
> > an interest in, and when I'm done mark them all read.
> >
> > Using a forum cuts down on all the unwanted email being sent to everyone.
> >
> > You can still have mail sent to you for topics that you post in.
> >
> > Not sure how everyone else feels, but I would prefer if this was a forum.
> >
> > Then we can get teamspeak going to replace IRC :P   :-)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> [mailto:plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] On
> >> Behalf Of Ryan Rix
> >> Sent: Sunday, August 02, 2009 10:21 PM
> >> To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> Subject: OT: Handling Politics the plug-discuss way?
> >>
> >> Group,
> >>
> >> Are these political discussions (examples: the second half of
> >> Re: Guess What, when I relabelled unsuccesfully, and whatever
> >> happened to the Geeky/entrepreneurial thread) detracting from
> >> the point of this list (which is to discuss GNU/Linux and
> >> Free Software, and not necessarily to discuss the economy,
> >> the government, or conspiracies about whether or not our duly
> >> elected President was an American or not) and in general
> >> daunting for people who may be new listers/Linuxers?
> >>
> >> Hans agrees with me (via a quick discussion in the IRC
> >> channel) that these discussions in general detract from the
> >> list, and make the non-political- flame-war discussions less
> >> active/less... what is the word... visible, so I think that
> >> something should be done, or at least a discussion should
> >> take place about it.
> >>
> >> I see a few options:
> >> 1) We leave it here and do nothing. Most email clients have
> >> the ability to filter on subject/topic of a discussion, so
> >> those who didn't want to see/deal with/get drug into these
> >> discussions could easily filter them out.
> >> We could create a new topic heading, like we have for OT:
> >> (politics: or something, when someone posts something
> >> politically kinda sorta related), allowing those who want to
> >> take part in these discussions to do so, while the others are
> >> safely shielded from them. The problem with this is that new
> >> users will still see these discusions taking place, which
> >> could, imo be very detrimental to their joining this
> >> community/getting the help with a question they may need/just
> >> feeling comfortable. But of course, this is easy enough to do
> >> and leaves the work for the users who don't like said
> >> discussions to take care of.
> >>
> >> 2) Create another list for these mails. The problem with this
> >> idea is that
> >> (imo) mailman has no easy way to control WHERE messages
> >> between two different lists go, so I think that it could be
> >> hard to transition between the two lists when a discussion
> >> does eventually go OT-Political. This would rely mostly on
> >> the good will and rememberance of the posters, which in the
> >> experience of the last few OT-Political threads has given me
> >> the impression that this will NOT work.
> >>
> >> 3) We moderate OT threads. My personal opinion is that the
> >> best way to keep flame wars down is to moderate. Not so much
> >> eliminate the posts that may incite these political
> >> discussions but to put a long enough delay on the posts that
> >> it hampers the quick reply-reply-reply-reply that usually is
> >> what completely derails thoughtful discussion. If users are
> >> given the instant chance to write a quick retort to a
> >> discussion and have that instantly posted to a hundred people
> >> who may or may not have the same idealogy basically causes a
> >> thread to go haywire in a matter of hours. With a sufficient
> >> delay in these posts being sent to the group, this haywiring
> >> can be pushed out to a day or two, hopefully alleviating any
> >> flame wars which may develop. Most of the wars that take
> >> place on p-d are about a day or two long at most anyways.
> >>
> >> 4) We forbid it. I think that this is the WORST option, but
> >> an option nonetheless. I am not in favor of censorship at
> >> all, but if things get bad enough we could do this. It would
> >> probably have to fall back 

Re: ****Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

is this A flame war? I find it kind of educational. Now if each side would
just site some resources we would know who to believe. Neither of the sides
has done so. My opinion is that state health care will not work. Only from
what I've heard do people die in Canada and the UK waiting for treatment. I
don't know if it is true. I hear the people from canada say that it doesn't
work well and I have heard people from the former USSR say that we are going
down the wrong path so that is what I believe.

On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 4:22 PM, Vaughn Treude  wrote:

> Craig White wrote:
> > On Sun, 2009-08-02 at 19:16 -0700, Vaughn Treude wrote:
> >
> >> Lisa Kachold wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 7/30/09, JD Austin  wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
>  The 'other' model isn't working any better.  My wife works in an
> Urgent
>  Care; tons of Canadians come here to get the health care they need.  I
> think
>  the whole industry needs to be more competitive; most things in health
> care
>  shouldn't cost what they do.
> 
> 
> 
> >>> Inefficiency in preventative care, diagnostics, errors in surgery, the
> >>> truth is incredibly expensive.
> >>>
> >>> But just because Canadians come here for care doesn't mean it's not
> working.
> >>>
> >>>
> >> 
> >> If by "working", you mean the majority of Canadians people accept it,
> >> and even think it's a good thing, I suppose it is. They're just very
> >> lucky they have a "safety valve", that is, a large semi-free country
> >> whose borders are within 100 miles of 90% of their population.
> >> Single-payer is, IMHO, the biggest piece of economic foolishness ever
> >> devised. Let's give an absolute monopoly to the most inefficient,
> >> corrupt organization ever invented by humans (government.) As for the
> >> notion that socialized medicine is cheaper, I don't believe it for a
> >> second. Governments can shift their costs to other agencies; the
> >> Pentagon does it all the time. I assume, for example, the cost of having
> >> "premiums" collected by the CRA doesn't get counted in the balance
> >> sheet. Not to mention the fact that a huge portion of the overhead costs
> >> of private insurers in the US is red tape imposed by government
> >> bureaucracies.
> >> Not that I'm necessarily endorsing the current system. There were a lot
> >> of good not-for-profit medical insurers in this country until Richard
> >> Nixon changed the tax laws, causing a massive takeover by greedy HMO's.
> >> I'd like to see a system of decentralized medical cooperatives with
> >> for-profit companies as a supplement.
> >> BTW, I don't blame the immigrants, but I do blame the lawyers. :-)
> >> 
> >>
> >> No offense, just my two cents. :-)
> >> There, I feel so much better.
> >> Vaughn
> >>
> > 
> > seeing as how the political discussions do not die off, I am going to
> > sound off here.
> >
> > The entire premise of the Canadian health care system was to provide a
> > single tier of medical coverage for all and no amount of wealth would
> > provide a better level of health care. You cannot devise a system that
> > is more fundamentally fair to everyone.
> >
> > The people who come here from Canada are doing elective surgeries either
> > not covered by the health care system in Canada or prioritized in a
> > manner that does not suit the person with money to pay elsewhere.
> >
> > The language that you use Vaughn is loaded and inaccurate...
> > - we are not a safety valve, we provide elective medical care to those
> > who want to pay and go elsewhere.
> >
> By that, I mean the proximity of the US ameliorates the biggest flaw in
> the single-player system - the fact that it's a monopoly.
> > - the issue of a monopolized health care run by the government happens
> > to be that which is practiced in all other western nations. We spend
> > more per capita on health care than any other industrialized nation and
> > yet approximately 25% of our citizens do not have coverage.
> >
> >
> No, the UK allows people whose procedures are not covered by National
> Health to pay for it out of pocket, unless that's changed in the last 10
> years or so. (Admittedly, a lot of people think that's "unfair".) I
> suspect they're not the only nation that has this option. In Canada,
> that option is illegal.
> > - the insurance companies do worse managing the health care than
> > government could ever do. They practice murder by spreadsheet. They
> > invent rules for exclusions. Someone in this country WITH health
> > insurance goes bankrupt in this country every 30 seconds because of
> > exclusions, deductibles, etc.
> >
> Socialized medicine "works" only because of rationing. People with heart
> conditions will be told to wait, if government doctors judge this to be
> an acceptable risk. Some will die while waiting. Don't kid yourselves,
> governments do the same thing private insurers do, it's just somehow
> nobler because profit isn't involved.
>
> > - blaming the government red tape for the profits of insurers is a

cabling

[mike havens]

A while ago someone mentioned about needing tv or phone outlets put into his
house. If anyone needs anything like that let me know.

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Re: ****Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

my announcement that I'm coming back to Phoenix turned into this? Alan, I
didn't have any idea the news I was returning would become so devisive..

On Sun, Aug 2, 2009 at 6:49 PM, Lyle Tuttle  wrote:

>  At 02:35 PM 8/2/2009, you wrote:
>
> One of the 2 former posts is typical "party diatribe"; you decide which!
>
> The irony of no health care in our economy is that unless you
> constantly replace people (who die, fail to make it in employment or
> become homeless)  [while also keeping the subset of "healthy"
> individuals completely separate] you win.
>
> The benefit of socialized health care includes research and
> statistics, eradication of diseases like STD's, TB and childhood
> illness, and control of the flu, and geratric survivial (which assists
> our children's children socially).  The system can support it, and in
> 20 years the benefits in advances in technology, industry and spcial
> stability are incredible.
>
> It's humane, and it's required to eradicate smoking, drug and alcohol
> abuse (often self medication for physical and emotional illness)
> alone.
>
> All systems in our society are inefficient - that doesn't mean we
> don't need IT systems for instance, it means we need EFFICIENCY
> (Canada as an example).
> My father would turn over in his grave, since he also wanted a free
> economy, but would agree that people are worth health care.
>
>
> If we REALLY  want to do better with health care, instead of spending
> trillions of dollars to [blatant party diatribe follows] counsel you on
> how to end your life (yes, the new plan proposes to do that if you are 65+
> every 5 years - mandatory), [end, blatant party diatribe] why not spend
> some money here?
>
>  http://www.canaryfoundation.org/index.cfm
>
> lyle
>
>
>
> Now, border control is another issue entirely!
>
>
> On 8/2/09, Craig White  wrote:
> > On Sun, 2009-08-02 at 19:16 -0700, Vaughn Treude wrote:
> >> Lisa Kachold wrote:
> >> > On 7/30/09, JD Austin  wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> The 'other' model isn't working any better.  My wife works in an
> Urgent
> >> >> Care; tons of Canadians come here to get the health care they need.
> I
> >> >> think
> >> >> the whole industry needs to be more competitive; most things in
> health
> >> >> care
> >> >> shouldn't cost what they do.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> > Inefficiency in preventative care, diagnostics, errors in surgery, the
> >> > truth is incredibly expensive.
> >> >
> >> > But just because Canadians come here for care doesn't mean it's not
> >> > working.
> >> >
> >> 
> >> If by "working", you mean the majority of Canadians people accept it,
> >> and even think it's a good thing, I suppose it is. They're just very
> >> lucky they have a "safety valve", that is, a large semi-free country
> >> whose borders are within 100 miles of 90% of their population.
> >> Single-payer is, IMHO, the biggest piece of economic foolishness ever
> >> devised. Let's give an absolute monopoly to the most inefficient,
> >> corrupt organization ever invented by humans (government.) As for the
> >> notion that socialized medicine is cheaper, I don't believe it for a
> >> second. Governments can shift their costs to other agencies; the
> >> Pentagon does it all the time. I assume, for example, the cost of having
> >> "premiums" collected by the CRA doesn't get counted in the balance
> >> sheet. Not to mention the fact that a huge portion of the overhead costs
> >> of private insurers in the US is red tape imposed by government
> >> bureaucracies.
> >> Not that I'm necessarily endorsing the current system. There were a lot
> >> of good not-for-profit medical insurers in this country until Richard
> >> Nixon changed the tax laws, causing a massive takeover by greedy HMO's.
> >> I'd like to see a system of decentralized medical cooperatives with
> >> for-profit companies as a supplement.
> >> BTW, I don't blame the immigrants, but I do blame the lawyers. :-)
> >> 
> >>
> >> No offense, just my two cents. :-)
> >> There, I feel so much better.
> >> Vaughn
> > 
> > seeing as how the political discussions do not die off, I am going to
> > sound off here.
> >
> > The entire premise of the Canadian health care system was to provide a
> > single tier of medical coverage for all and no amount of wealth would
> > provide a better level of health care. You cannot devise a system that
> > is more fundamentally fair to everyone.
> >
> > The people who come here from Canada are doing elective surgeries either
> > not covered by the health care system in Canada or prioritized in a
> > manner that does not suit the person with money to pay elsewhere.
> >
> > The language that you use Vaughn is loaded and inaccurate...
> > - we are not a safety valve, we provide elective medical care to those
> > who want to pay and go elsewhere.
> >
> > - the issue of a monopolized health care run by the government happens
> > to be that which is practiced in all other western nations. We spend
> > more per capita on health care than any other indu

Re: ****Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

I think it's because she sympathizes with the aliens.

On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 3:19 PM, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:

>  why do you think it is they gave Napolitano her new job?
>
> On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 12:16 PM, James
> Finstrom wrote:
> > It seems the security holes in the border were not from bad policy.
> > This whole time they were running windows... Redmond says we should
> > see patches shortly...
> >
> > On 7/30/09, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:
> >>   Thanks Keith.  I am standing right behind you.
> >>
> >>   -jmz
> >>
> >> On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 11:08 AM, keith smith
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Interesting.  What is on topic?  Seems most everything is off topic
> these
> >>> days.
> >>>
> >>> I received a ticket the other day for running a red light. 213 dollars
> and
> >>> 1/2 a day in class and I am on my way.  No lenience for me. Seems I
> broke
> >>> the law.  I understand the system.
> >>>
> >>> If someone jumps our border fence and enters the USA illegally that is
> an
> >>> illegal act.  Plain and simple.
> >>>
> >>> What do you think would happen if I jumped the fence and traveled South
> >>> into Mexico.  I suspect I might be beaten and jailed.
> >>>
> >>> We are a sovereign nation.  I grew up on the border and saw the effects
> of
> >>> the illegal population during my time as a police officer.
> >>>
> >>> The main stream media does not tell you the whole truth, nor does
> Obama.
> >>>
> >>> If this problem persists it will cost us all a lot of money.
> >>>
> >>> These are not our people (illegal aliens).  They need to be returned to
> >>> their country. If they do not like what is going on in Mexico then they
> >>> need to make some changes just as some of us are trying to return our
> >>> country to it's rightful place as a constitutional country that is
> free.
> >>>
> >>> Very few people understand the sacrifices of our founding fathers.
>  They
> >>> gave their all so we could be free.  Today many people through out the
> US
> >>> are fighting for our freedom.  So how can I respect someone that comes
> to
> >>> my country to be a parasite? They need to return to their own country
> and
> >>> build an economy, not leach of of ours.
> >>>
> >>> Because I hold the law to be supreme I am called a racist. Call me what
> >>> you may.  At the end of the day I am just an American who believes in
> our
> >>> find country based on the rule of law and who is willing to stand up
> for
> >>> freedom.
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>> Keith Smith
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --- On Thu, 7/30/09, Craig White  wrote:
> >>>
>  From: Craig White 
>  Subject: Re: Re: guess what
>  To: "Main PLUG discussion list" <
> plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
>  Date: Thursday, July 30, 2009, 6:27 AM
>  On Wed, 2009-07-29 at 22:33 -0700,
>  Lyle Tuttle wrote:
>  > Perhaps you are looking at the wrong source.we now
>  have a $3
>  > Billion deficit.check out these numbers in bold
>  blue.
>  
>  every state has a major deficit as they clearly were
>  unprepared for such
>  a drastic change in the economy.
> 
>  I find it offensive in every way that first JMZ linked the
>  racist
>  article and now you found it worthy to paste. The article
>  is not a news
>  story but rather an opinion piece and not really suitable
>  for this list.
> 
>  That anyone should scapegoat any group of people (not once
>  but many
>  times) for causing this economic downturn is stupid. This
>  is a bitter,
>  hate filled person and his comments have no place on this
>  list.
> 
>  Craig
> 
> 
>  --
>  This message has been scanned for viruses and
>  dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
>  believed to be clean.
> 
>  ---
>  PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>  To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
>  settings:
>  http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> 
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>>
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > James Finstrom
> > Rhino Equipment Corp.
> > http://rhinoequipment.com ~ http://postug.com
> > Phone: 1-877-RHINO-T1 ~ FAX: +1 (480) 961-1826
> > Twitter: http://twitter.com/rhinoequipment
> > IP: gu...@asterisk.rhinoequipment.com
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - 

Re: ****Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

BURN!

On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 3:16 PM, James Finstrom <
jfinst...@rhinoequipment.com> wrote:

> It seems the security holes in the border were not from bad policy.
> This whole time they were running windows... Redmond says we should
> see patches shortly...
>
> On 7/30/09, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:
> >   Thanks Keith.  I am standing right behind you.
> >
> >   -jmz
> >
> > On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 11:08 AM, keith smith
> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> Interesting.  What is on topic?  Seems most everything is off topic
> these
> >> days.
> >>
> >> I received a ticket the other day for running a red light. 213 dollars
> and
> >> 1/2 a day in class and I am on my way.  No lenience for me. Seems I
> broke
> >> the law.  I understand the system.
> >>
> >> If someone jumps our border fence and enters the USA illegally that is
> an
> >> illegal act.  Plain and simple.
> >>
> >> What do you think would happen if I jumped the fence and traveled South
> >> into Mexico.  I suspect I might be beaten and jailed.
> >>
> >> We are a sovereign nation.  I grew up on the border and saw the effects
> of
> >> the illegal population during my time as a police officer.
> >>
> >> The main stream media does not tell you the whole truth, nor does Obama.
> >>
> >> If this problem persists it will cost us all a lot of money.
> >>
> >> These are not our people (illegal aliens).  They need to be returned to
> >> their country. If they do not like what is going on in Mexico then they
> >> need to make some changes just as some of us are trying to return our
> >> country to it's rightful place as a constitutional country that is free.
> >>
> >> Very few people understand the sacrifices of our founding fathers.  They
> >> gave their all so we could be free.  Today many people through out the
> US
> >> are fighting for our freedom.  So how can I respect someone that comes
> to
> >> my country to be a parasite? They need to return to their own country
> and
> >> build an economy, not leach of of ours.
> >>
> >> Because I hold the law to be supreme I am called a racist. Call me what
> >> you may.  At the end of the day I am just an American who believes in
> our
> >> find country based on the rule of law and who is willing to stand up for
> >> freedom.
> >>
> >> 
> >> Keith Smith
> >>
> >>
> >> --- On Thu, 7/30/09, Craig White  wrote:
> >>
> >>> From: Craig White 
> >>> Subject: Re: Re: guess what
> >>> To: "Main PLUG discussion list"  >
> >>> Date: Thursday, July 30, 2009, 6:27 AM
> >>> On Wed, 2009-07-29 at 22:33 -0700,
> >>> Lyle Tuttle wrote:
> >>> > Perhaps you are looking at the wrong source.we now
> >>> have a $3
> >>> > Billion deficit.check out these numbers in bold
> >>> blue.
> >>> 
> >>> every state has a major deficit as they clearly were
> >>> unprepared for such
> >>> a drastic change in the economy.
> >>>
> >>> I find it offensive in every way that first JMZ linked the
> >>> racist
> >>> article and now you found it worthy to paste. The article
> >>> is not a news
> >>> story but rather an opinion piece and not really suitable
> >>> for this list.
> >>>
> >>> That anyone should scapegoat any group of people (not once
> >>> but many
> >>> times) for causing this economic downturn is stupid. This
> >>> is a bitter,
> >>> hate filled person and his comments have no place on this
> >>> list.
> >>>
> >>> Craig
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> This message has been scanned for viruses and
> >>> dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
> >>> believed to be clean.
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail
> >>> settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
>
>
> --
> James Finstrom
> Rhino Equipment Corp.
> http://rhinoequipment.com ~ http://postug.com
> Phone: 1-877-RHINO-T1 ~ FAX: +1 (480) 961-1826
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/rhinoequipment
> IP: gu...@asterisk.rhinoequipment.com
> ---
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Re: ****Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

I didn't start this one!

On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Ryan Rix  wrote:

> Eric Cope wrote:
> > This is the first time I agree with Craig (for the most part).
> > Perhaps if immigration weren't illegal...
> >
>
> Immigration is legal. As long as you do it through the normal means and
> don't steal a real American's identity to do it.
> Illegal immigration is just that, illegal.
>
> Ryan
>
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Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

I think we were all agreeing I was just commenting to the fact that the
illegal alien problem is not as front-n-center as it is in AZ. Sorry for any
confusion.

2009/7/30 Ryan Rix 

> On Wed 29 July 2009 10:33:29 pm Lyle Tuttle wrote:
> > At 08:00 PM 7/29/2009, you wrote:
> > >I moved here and the illegal alien problem doesn't seem to be a
> > >problem. I had forgotten about it! Almost everyone here is an alien
> > >of some sort (legal or not).
> >
> > Perhaps you are looking at the wrong source.we now have a $3
> > Billion deficit.check out these numbers in bold blue.
>
> 
> And here we have it, the rare but savage introduction to a PLUG-discuss
> political maelstrom. Look at the size of its horns, oh what a beauty.
>
> The male begins with its mating call, usually in the form of an on topic,
> but
> political, reply to a message on the mailing list. The message would be one
> that half of the pack's males would agree on and half would disagree on.
> Naturally the dominant males in the group will take to bellowing and
> fighting
> until the maelstrom finally subsides.
>
> These events are rare occurences in such a group, but a splendid site to
> see
> when they do occur. Oh, crikey, here it comes! We best make way back to the
> lorry and find another less rambuctious group of listers.
> 
>
> ;D Ryan
> (ps, my .sig fortune is really good today)
>
> ---
> Ryan Rix
> (623)-826-0051
>
> vi is [[13~^[[15~^[[15~^[[19~^[[18~^ a
> muk[^[[29~^[[34~^[[26~^[[32~^ch better editor than this emacs. I know
> I^[[14~'ll get flamed for this but the truth has to be
> said. ^[[D^[[D^[[D^[[D ^[[D^[^[[D^[[D^[[B^
> exit ^X^C quit :x :wq dang it :w:w:w :x ^C^C^Z^D
>-- Jesper Lauridsen  from alt.religion.emacs
>
> http://hackersramblings.wordpress.com | http://twitter.com/phrkonaleash
> XMPP: phrkonale...@gmail.com  | MSN: phrkonale...@yahoo.com
> AIM:  phrkonaleash| Yahoo: phrkonaleash
> IRC:  phrkon...@irc.freenode.net/#srcedit,#teensonlinux,#plugaz and
>  countless other FOSS channels.
>
> ---
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Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

I moved here and the illegal alien problem doesn't seem to be a problem. I
had forgotten about it! Almost everyone here is an alien of some sort (legal
or not).

On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 9:05 PM, Joshua Zeidner  wrote:

>
>
> http://www.examiner.com/x-16231-Maricopa-County-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m7d28-AZ-Gov-resumes-budget-talks-illegal-immigration-avoided<http://www.examiner.com/x-16231-Maricopa-County-Conservative-Examiner%7Ey2009m7d28-AZ-Gov-resumes-budget-talks-illegal-immigration-avoided>
>
>  -jmz
>
> >
> > How far south deep into the er...
> > Peninsula!
> > were you?
> > ET
> >
> > PS: I WANT A SR-22 TOO!!!
> > http://cirrusaircraft.com/sr22/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > mike havens writes:
> >
> >> I got married and moved to Florida for the next adventure of my life.
> What a
> >> mistake! I got what the state requires you to have in insurance, got
> into an
> >> accident, and now have an SR-22 because I didn't have what the state
> >> requires. I talked to an insurance agent and found out that if you buy
> >> online (like I did) you don't find out about the non-required, required
> >> insurance. This state sucks. It rains too much here. This state sucks.
> And I
> >> have met many dishonest people here. This state sucks!
> >>
> >> On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Joe  wrote:
> >>
> >>> Out of curiosity, where is "here"? I want to know if I should agree
> with
> >>> that part of not. Most likely, if "here" was not Arizona, I will ;)
> >>>
> >>> Sorry to hear about the marriage though...
> >>>
> >>> -Joe
> >>>
> >>> mike havens wrote:
> >>> > my marriage is a disaster living here sucks. most of the
> people
> >>> seem
> >>> > to be dishonest... so I'm moving back to AZ. (sorry to disappoint you
> >>> all. I
> >>> > am so grateful my parents are willing to helping me. I'll be living
> with
> >>> > them for a little in Cornville on Rolling Stone Lane. Isn't that a
> cool
> >>> > street's name? Very Flint Stone-esqe.
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> 
> >>> >
> >>> > ---
> >>> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>> ---
> >>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> :-)~MIKE~(-:
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
> ---
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Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

Wrong kind of sr-22 buddy.

Where I am? I am between Fort Lauderdale and Miami in a city called
Hollywood.

On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 8:52 PM, kitepi...@kitepilot.com <
kitepi...@kitepilot.com> wrote:

> Dishonest people in Florida?
> Nawh!
> You gotta be kidding us...   ;-)
>
> How far south deep into the er...
> Peninsula!
> were you?
> ET
>
> PS: I WANT A SR-22 TOO!!!
> http://cirrusaircraft.com/sr22/
>
>
>
>
>
>
> mike havens writes:
>
> > I got married and moved to Florida for the next adventure of my life.
> What a
> > mistake! I got what the state requires you to have in insurance, got into
> an
> > accident, and now have an SR-22 because I didn't have what the state
> > requires. I talked to an insurance agent and found out that if you buy
> > online (like I did) you don't find out about the non-required, required
> > insurance. This state sucks. It rains too much here. This state sucks.
> And I
> > have met many dishonest people here. This state sucks!
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Joe  wrote:
> >
> >> Out of curiosity, where is "here"? I want to know if I should agree with
> >> that part of not. Most likely, if "here" was not Arizona, I will ;)
> >>
> >> Sorry to hear about the marriage though...
> >>
> >> -Joe
> >>
> >> mike havens wrote:
> >> > my marriage is a disaster living here sucks. most of the
> people
> >> seem
> >> > to be dishonest... so I'm moving back to AZ. (sorry to disappoint you
> >> all. I
> >> > am so grateful my parents are willing to helping me. I'll be living
> with
> >> > them for a little in Cornville on Rolling Stone Lane. Isn't that a
> cool
> >> > street's name? Very Flint Stone-esqe.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> 
> >> >
> >> > ---
> >> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> ---
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Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

I got married and moved to Florida for the next adventure of my life. What a
mistake! I got what the state requires you to have in insurance, got into an
accident, and now have an SR-22 because I didn't have what the state
requires. I talked to an insurance agent and found out that if you buy
online (like I did) you don't find out about the non-required, required
insurance. This state sucks. It rains too much here. This state sucks. And I
have met many dishonest people here. This state sucks!

On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Joe  wrote:

> Out of curiosity, where is "here"? I want to know if I should agree with
> that part of not. Most likely, if "here" was not Arizona, I will ;)
>
> Sorry to hear about the marriage though...
>
> -Joe
>
> mike havens wrote:
> > my marriage is a disaster living here sucks. most of the people
> seem
> > to be dishonest... so I'm moving back to AZ. (sorry to disappoint you
> all. I
> > am so grateful my parents are willing to helping me. I'll be living with
> > them for a little in Cornville on Rolling Stone Lane. Isn't that a cool
> > street's name? Very Flint Stone-esqe.
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> >
> > ---
> > PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> > http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
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Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

right on top of a gully. They just built a house.

On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 7:16 PM, Bob Elzer  wrote:

>  Sounds like they live at the bottom of a mountain. :-)
>
>
>  --
> *From:* plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:
> plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] *On Behalf Of *mike havens
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 29, 2009 4:07 PM
> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list
> *Subject:* guess what
>
> my marriage is a disaster living here sucks. most of the people
> seem to be dishonest... so I'm moving back to AZ. (sorry to disappoint you
> all. I am so grateful my parents are willing to helping me. I'll be living
> with them for a little in Cornville on Rolling Stone Lane. Isn't that a cool
> street's name? Very Flint Stone-esqe.
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
>
> ---
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Re: guess what....

[mike havens]

Not back yet should be back by the tenth.

On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 7:08 PM, Lisa Kachold wrote:

> I am sorry for your loss.
> I love the Saber tooth tiger!
> Welcome back to the land of the free!
>
> On 7/29/09, mike havens  wrote:
> > my marriage is a disaster living here sucks. most of the people
> seem
> > to be dishonest... so I'm moving back to AZ. (sorry to disappoint you
> all. I
> > am so grateful my parents are willing to helping me. I'll be living with
> > them for a little in Cornville on Rolling Stone Lane. Isn't that a cool
> > street's name? Very Flint Stone-esqe.
> >
> > --
> > :-)~MIKE~(-:
> >
>
>
> --
>
> (623)239-3392
> (503)754-4452 www.obnosis.com
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guess what....

[mike havens]

my marriage is a disaster living here sucks. most of the people seem
to be dishonest... so I'm moving back to AZ. (sorry to disappoint you all. I
am so grateful my parents are willing to helping me. I'll be living with
them for a little in Cornville on Rolling Stone Lane. Isn't that a cool
street's name? Very Flint Stone-esqe.

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