Re: real country
"Real" country is probably a bit different for anyone here as well as those artists who say that they wish to get back to their roots and do some "real" country. I would imagine that defining "it" would take into account an individual's preferences, exposure to different musical styles while growing up and any/all labels as assigned by the newsmedia or music historians. However, the sense that I get from performers today is that "real" country music pretty much encompasses a timeframe from the fifties through the sixties with the likes of Hank Williams, Johnny Cash, Loretta Lynn, George Jones etc; ruled the charts. At times, I have inquired what elements of that music made it "real"? I've been told for the most part that the music was simplistic in its beauty, being that it was devoid of heavy-handed commercialism which includes "lush" instrumentation, pronounced drumming with a decided rural/folk-like appeal. By that definition, I suppose we could rule out many of our lauded country greats as being "real". I just think this term is a bit different for everyone but that it seems to be generationally defined. If a person grew up liking George Jones and believes that Jones epitomized country then that will be the standard by which he/she defines all other country music. Watson has been quoted as saying that Buck Owens and Merle Haggard were some of his major influences. I suppose we could conclude that for Watson, the aforementioned two are "real" country for him. However, for brevity sake, may I add that my Grandmother (who was a bluegrass fan) once told me years ago that Merle Haggard was just another rock-n-roll upstart. Perception is a mighty sword. Tera -Original Message- From: BARNARD [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: passenger side [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Saturday, January 30, 1999 10:41 AM Subject: "real" country One clarification to my post on this thread yesterday: That is, in response to Todd's question, "What are people trying to say *today* when they contrast HNC or ND to 'real' country?," I was only trying to get at that contemporary usage of "real" country. I was not trying to define country, period, in other words, but rather that ideal of "real" country, "stone"' country, "hard" country that is in the vocabulary these days, usually as the right-thinking alternative to various unsatisfactory mixtures of country with rock and pop, etc I was thinking of the last I saw Dale Watson, when, after a song, he looked around and said, "Now ain't that *real* country??" That's the sort of usage I was thinking of... and so forth g, --junior
Re: real country [was re: old 97s in Toronto]
Jon Weisberger wrote: let me commend to your attention the fine essay on "Country Music As Music" by Bill Evans, "So where is the 'country' in country music? To borrow a well-worn advertising phrase, it might be more a state of mind than any specific set of unique musical characteristics. Country musicians seem to share certain assumptions about melody, harmony, form, and performance technique that together help to shape ideas about the nature of the country sound, its boundaries and its possibilities." Interesting, but it how does one get to be called a country musician? And how does one differentiate between specific set of unique musical characteristics on one hand, and certain shared assumptions about melody, etc., on the other. Likewise the pairing of boundaries and possibilities is curious. It all seems sort of circular to me. One thing I like about that is that it nudges the reader in the direction of considering not only what those "certain assumptions" are, but how they're transmitted. And who is in authority to name what is and what is not country. But I don't quite understand this transmission thing. Especially in the age of mass media. Care to elucidate?
Re: real country
At 04:36 PM 1/29/1999 -0500, you wrote: At 12:25 PM 1/29/99 -0500, Todd wrote: I'd be interested to hear country defined in the positive -- that is by actually naming the musical elements that make something country rather than by saying what it's *not*. ... My guess is that for every supposed criterion there are too many examples of country songs that *don't* include it to get anything on the list. Here's the best explanation I've heard; Country is simply 'three chords and the truth'also the title of a GREAT book on the *real* Nashville of today. Chris Ignitors
Re: real country
I think a definition of country music--now as before--that doesn't resort to lists of what it's NOT is still relatively easy. We can then begin (did I say "begin"?) proposing who that's around fits the bill! Country music is a commercial extension of Anglo-Celt, Scots-/Irish folk music as it came to be expressed and played in the American South. The instruments and vocal styles have evolved from those available there, and the singing style from the speech patterns there. And if you're going to bother to call it country, it still oughta be like that somewhere!. That be twang. Both of the words at the end there (American...South) COUNT--so as a product of America, it's no purebred; it has inevitably gathered in and been impacted by a number of other popular commercial and folk American music types, especially Afro-American music forms from right next door or across the tracks, and Tin Pan Alley pop tunes,--plus musics of varied ethnic immigrants, (Mexican, German, French, Polish, even Hawaiian and a few Italian and Jewish guest songwriters... and a few Scots/Irish Canadians. ) . You don't have to be any of the above to play it or love it. Several Scandanavians have been known to have twangful feet and chops and apparently been misplaced, so you never know. There are certainly artists in so-called mainstream country as well as alt.country who's music can be described as above. Many of 'em are damn good. Many of 'em aren't. Whoops--just got negative. Positively country, Barry. Strange visitor from the North.
RE: real country [was re: old 97s in Toronto]
Boy, I'd sure like to take on this thread, and I hope to later on, but I am just getting my eyebrows over this backlog of work that's piled up... In the meantime, let me commend to your attention the fine essay on "Country Music As Music" by Bill Evans, the banjerpicking ethnomusicologist; it appears in that Country Music Hall Of Fame Encyclopedia Of Country Music that came out not too long ago. It's a good starting point for getting a handle on the stylistic contours of country music (note, please, that I say nothing about "real" g). Here's a taste: "So where is the 'country' in country music? To borrow a well-worn advertising phrase, it might be more a state of mind than any specific set of unique musical characteristics. Country musicians seem to share certain assumptions about melody, harmony, form, and performance technique that together help to shape ideas about the nature of the country sound, its boundaries and its possibilities." One thing I like about that is that it nudges the reader in the direction of considering not only what those "certain assumptions" are, but how they're transmitted. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: real country
Bob sez: Hey, Junior, I'm sure you too remember a time when any post that was *shorter* than what you sent out wasn't taken seriously... I sure do, s'matter of fact. Yessiree, even when I give David a hard time about strings and such, it doesn't elicit the historical-critical productions of yesteryear g. Now those *class* threads Dan was mentioning, perhaps those are the thing. As if Gram knew from a $1000 wedding, sheeit Waiting for Jon W. to define country, without the "realness" factor added, --junior
