Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
On Thu, 2009-05-28 at 22:53 -0700, Joe Sloan wrote: > Steve wrote: > > Personally, I would not have a M$ box for anything other than charity. > > That is to allow those nice far eastern people access to my resources to > > send UCE. > > Mind you, most of them buckle under the load > > > > I'm with you there... > > > Because DNS requires an MX entry for a mail server and a A record for > > the web server. Don't shoot the messenger - I'm not responsible for > > DNS ! These will often be pointing to the same host but be externally > > seen as different entities. An example would be CNAMES. A machine can > > have an unlimited number of CNAME aliases in DNS, but a separate CNAME > > record must be in the database for each alias. > > > > True, but they could technically all be the same name - let's say you > have one box and it's mydomain.com. Your dns records might look like this: > > IN A 1.2.3.4 > IN NS mydomain.com. > IN MX 10 mydomain.com > > You might also want to add: > > IN CNAME www.mydomain.com mydomain.com > > But nobody says you absolutely must have smtp.mydomain.com or > mail.mydomain.com or ns.mydomain.com or pop3.mydomain.com > > Joe I agree. But you would still need to list an MX record if you were expecting mail traffic and probably a CNAME for the www to the A record. It would not be 'not normal' for these to resolve to the same host. There is nothing wrong with doing so if it fits your needs. There may be arguments as to scaling and redundancy, but that is a different arena. To be called a 'big mouth' for pointing it out - or even a 'hobbyist' amuses me when you consider that Postfix is a Open Source and written by Hobbyists. I appreciate it's the guys baby - but to descend to abuse is really unnecessary. > > > >
Re: [ot / EOT] Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
On Thu, 2009-05-28 at 23:55 -0500, /dev/rob0 wrote: > On Thu May 28 2009 23:21:06 Steve wrote: > > way of the 1980's 'is the law' that leads to entirely useless, rude > > and incorrect answers. > > Replied offlist. I think this thread should stop here. Thank you. And another 'anal' response it was too calling me a 'hobbyist'. Basically told to 'agree with the guy who runs this list and project or else'. Thanks but no Hey dude - the world is flat. Black is white, and Postfix is perfect (It's everybody else who is at fault)> Will that do for you Rob.. ? If you have something to say, share it ON list so people can get a handle on who they are dealing with and how they interact with people.
[ot / EOT] Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
On Thu May 28 2009 23:21:06 Steve wrote: > way of the 1980's 'is the law' that leads to entirely useless, rude > and incorrect answers. Replied offlist. I think this thread should stop here. Thank you. -- Offlist mail to this address is discarded unless "/dev/rob0" or "not-spam" is in Subject: header
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
On Thu, 2009-05-28 at 15:20 -0400, Scott Lewis wrote: > On May 28, 2009, at 2:59 PM, Steve wrote: > > > Perhaps you can do the same to support your 1980's view of systems > > administration? You need to get some help with that temper of yours. > > It's the handrail of the crippled mind. > > I lurk more than post here mostly as a facet of being in awe of the > amount of knowledge already present, but can't resist. I currently > manage a cluster of anti-spam gateways (on-site and off-site), an > Exchange server, an Exchange front end server, a disaster recovery > Exchange instance (serves our internal employees), a Zimbra cluster as > well as an off-site Zimbra standby server (server our franchise > employees), two mailing list servers to ensure that if either of two > of my departments that send regular emails do something stupid, only > they get blocked while I sort it out with the RBLs, a cluster of mail > archiving servers, three Postfix servers that serve as internal > gateways routing mail to my various other servers since our Barracuda > spam appliances can't function as true gateways, and probably another > server I can't even recall right now. > > Sorry - should I have that all on one box? I don't think that would be the best plan in your circumstance. However, anyone who uses Barracuda Appliances will be aware of the fact they offer a cheap (and nasty) load balancer - which you can (and people do) deploy in High Availability mode. Behind this you can pile real servers, all offering different services. For example, you could put 10 Barracuda 'Spam & Virus Firewalls' behind them on port 25. You could also put half a dozen webservers there too. The point being that to the outside world they will all resolve to one IP - that of the load balancer. So mail.example.com, www.example.com (and probably ftp.example.com) appear as hosts pointing to the exact same place. As for the Barracuda's not acting as true mail gateways, they are not meant to. They are an filter. People dream up other uses for them, but they are just a simple relay filter. Postfix, Clam, Spamassassin, Amavis. It's all Open Source, it's all free - but that's another subject. > > Look, some of the replies here may be terse... but most of the help > comes from a fairly modern base of expertise. The guy is often rude and his responses of the 'grunt' variety. On top of that he tends to become abusive when wrong. This cannot go unchallenged. I would guess (and that is all it is) that there are millions to billions of small businesses out there, with a single static IP presented to the outside world. That IP will resolve to their mail and web server via there gateway and that will probably be just one machine. Here is one example; http://www.microsoft.com/smallbusiness/products/server/default.aspx#Evaluate Wonder how many copies of that they have sold? In fact, with virtualisation taking off the way it has, it is now more than possible that a single machine is hosting many virtual machines which in turn can be hosting many services on a virtual IP. It's the failure to spot and adapt to trends like this because the way of the 1980's 'is the law' that leads to entirely useless, rude and incorrect answers.
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
Tim Legg a écrit : > According to 'postconf -d', myhostname is set to genex.localdomain where > genex is an arbitrary name I chose for a hostname when I installed Debian > Lenny. > > When I look in /etc/postfix/main.cf, > myhostname = genex.example1.com > > Is this a normal discrepancy? use 'postconf -n' instead of '-d'. > > Is it even neccessary to have a hostname at all since the days of having > seperate machines for seperate daemons are behind us for most websites? > After all, mail.example1.com, www.example1.com, pop3.example1.com,... are all > the same machine these days. > - an MTA needs a name to use as a HELO/EHLO argument. - an MTA needs a name to show in the smtp banner. - an MTA needs a name to put in Received header. myhostname provides a handy default for these, because most people are happy with a single name.
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
On May 28, 2009, at 2:59 PM, Steve wrote: Perhaps you can do the same to support your 1980's view of systems administration? You need to get some help with that temper of yours. It's the handrail of the crippled mind. I lurk more than post here mostly as a facet of being in awe of the amount of knowledge already present, but can't resist. I currently manage a cluster of anti-spam gateways (on-site and off-site), an Exchange server, an Exchange front end server, a disaster recovery Exchange instance (serves our internal employees), a Zimbra cluster as well as an off-site Zimbra standby server (server our franchise employees), two mailing list servers to ensure that if either of two of my departments that send regular emails do something stupid, only they get blocked while I sort it out with the RBLs, a cluster of mail archiving servers, three Postfix servers that serve as internal gateways routing mail to my various other servers since our Barracuda spam appliances can't function as true gateways, and probably another server I can't even recall right now. Sorry - should I have that all on one box? Look, some of the replies here may be terse... but most of the help comes from a fairly modern base of expertise. If your organization is absurdly smaller than mine, perhaps one box works well for you. I certainly run multiple server services on one machine in my house, but then that serves two adults and an infant who likes to watch ripped Disney DVDs plus a small personal web site and some file sharing.
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
On Thu, 2009-05-28 at 11:42 -0400, Wietse Venema wrote: > Steve: > > On Wed, 2009-05-27 at 19:20 -0400, Wietse Venema wrote: > > > > > A machine name is required for several email-related Internet standards. > > No problem with this; > > > Besides, having all DNS names resolve to the same box is not normal usage. > > > > > This is nothing more than an opinion as far as I can tell. It may have > > once had some foundation but it's fair to say that it is perfectly > > reasonable with current hardware to have a machine that acts as a web > > server, ftp server, and mail server. Naturally there will be some > > duplicate in DNS resolution to resolve these. In fact, if you start load > > balancing real servers and services with dedicated load balancers > > capable of multiple services, you'll find most of the DNS entries will > > point to the same IP. Perhaps this makes people like me 'not normal' > > then. Thanks :-) > > Perhaps you can show some actual numbers from a representative > survey that supports your big mouth claims. > > Wietse Perhaps you can do the same to support your 1980's view of systems administration? You need to get some help with that temper of yours. It's the handrail of the crippled mind.
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
Steve: > On Wed, 2009-05-27 at 19:20 -0400, Wietse Venema wrote: > > > A machine name is required for several email-related Internet standards. > No problem with this; > > Besides, having all DNS names resolve to the same box is not normal usage. > > > This is nothing more than an opinion as far as I can tell. It may have > once had some foundation but it's fair to say that it is perfectly > reasonable with current hardware to have a machine that acts as a web > server, ftp server, and mail server. Naturally there will be some > duplicate in DNS resolution to resolve these. In fact, if you start load > balancing real servers and services with dedicated load balancers > capable of multiple services, you'll find most of the DNS entries will > point to the same IP. Perhaps this makes people like me 'not normal' > then. Thanks :-) Perhaps you can show some actual numbers from a representative survey that supports your big mouth claims. Wietse
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
On Wed, 2009-05-27 at 19:20 -0400, Wietse Venema wrote: > A machine name is required for several email-related Internet standards. No problem with this; > Besides, having all DNS names resolve to the same box is not normal usage. > This is nothing more than an opinion as far as I can tell. It may have once had some foundation but it's fair to say that it is perfectly reasonable with current hardware to have a machine that acts as a web server, ftp server, and mail server. Naturally there will be some duplicate in DNS resolution to resolve these. In fact, if you start load balancing real servers and services with dedicated load balancers capable of multiple services, you'll find most of the DNS entries will point to the same IP. Perhaps this makes people like me 'not normal' then. Thanks :-)
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
Tim Legg: > > According to 'postconf -d', myhostname is set to genex.localdomain where g >-enex is an arbitrary name I chose for a hostname when I installed Debian Len >-ny. As documented, "postconf -d" does not show what is in main.cf. > When I look in /etc/postfix/main.cf, > myhostname = genex.example1.com > > Is this a normal discrepancy? There is no discrepancy. > Is it even neccessary to have a hostname at all since the days of having s >-eperate machines for seperate daemons are behind us for most websites? Afte >-r all, mail.example1.com, www.example1.com, pop3.example1.com,... are all th >-e same machine these days. A machine name is required for several email-related Internet standards. Besides, having all DNS names resolve to the same box is not normal usage. Wietse
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
Tim Legg wrote: According to 'postconf -d', myhostname is set to genex.localdomain where genex is an arbitrary name I chose for a hostname when I installed Debian Lenny. When I look in /etc/postfix/main.cf, myhostname = genex.example1.com postconf -d shows compiled-in defaults, not your settings. Use "postconf myhostname" to show the current setting as used by postfix. Is it even neccessary to have a hostname Yes. at all since the days of having seperate machines for seperate daemons are behind us for most websites? After all, mail.example1.com, www.example1.com, pop3.example1.com,... are all the same machine these days. Maybe in your shop... Postfix is used in a wide variety of environments, some of them have more than one computer. -- Noel Jones
Re: myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
* Tim Legg : > > According to 'postconf -d', Which displays the default, not what you set... -- Ralf Hildebrandt Postfix - Einrichtung, Betrieb und Wartung Tel. +49 (0)30-450 570-155 http://www.computerbeschimpfung.de Wenn etwas Abstoßendes modern wird, ist es sofort anziehend.
myhostname is different between postconf and main.cf
According to 'postconf -d', myhostname is set to genex.localdomain where genex is an arbitrary name I chose for a hostname when I installed Debian Lenny. When I look in /etc/postfix/main.cf, myhostname = genex.example1.com Is this a normal discrepancy? Is it even neccessary to have a hostname at all since the days of having seperate machines for seperate daemons are behind us for most websites? After all, mail.example1.com, www.example1.com, pop3.example1.com,... are all the same machine these days. Tim Legg
