Re: [PyQt] Inter-office distribution/installation of packages/modules
That's indeed an interesting approach. We only update a single egg (that egg than contains our app and the libraries that change most often). The application is thus able to update itself and restart itself with some kind of bootstrapper. The egg itself is in the User Data folder, so that any user is able to update its app. Don't you have issues with permissions and virus scanners and such when updating DLL's and things in C:\Program Files\... ? On Sat, 2011-07-02 at 18:43 +, Demetrius Cassidy wrote: Basically the updater is a separate python program, built using twisted. It is self contained, and can update any file on our project. The client queries the server for the client version, and if it's out of date, it launchers the patcher and quits. It's not part of py2exe itself, though it's packaged into a self contained exe with py2exe, just like our program. For our client, many dlls are updated on a regular basis for bug fixes. But you can update python code, since it's just stored in a .zip file (just have the updater dl the updated zip file and copy it over). On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 6:41 PM, Erik Janssens erik.janss...@conceptive.be wrote: that's interesting, how do you handle the auto update with py2exe ? which part of the app gets updated ? On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Demetrius Cassidy dcassid...@gmail.com wrote: We have an app which must be redistributed to multiple groups, with 40+ users and py2exe is the reason we are able to do this. Gui2exe makes the building simpler. If you need to debug, you won't be running the bundled app, so I don't see why you would need to so much other than making sure it runs when bundled. If your packages are making assumptions on how your enviroment is set up, IMO I think that is wrong and will only lead to problems down the road. And the last thing, is that we have an auto updater, so new releases only require a rebuild and push to the sever. On Jun 16, 2011 2:58 PM, Erik Janssens erik.janss...@conceptive.be wrote: Hi, I would not agree with using Py2exe, while the idea is nice, we have had many issues with it, basically for 2 reasons : - it's dependency analysis, in combination with automatic updates : if your update uses a part of a package that was not used in the original package, you need to redeploy everything, instead of just the part of your app that you update - it changes the 'environment' your app runs in (eg sys.path), while it is possible to work around it in your app, you need to make sure that none of the packages you use make certain assumption on the environment This combination means that in order to properly test your application, you need to continuously rebuild your app with py2exe, and run it. notice some error, fix it, rebuild, etc. This takes far too much time. So what we did was : - build a custom python distro with all 'binary' packages included we need that does not depend on registry settings and does not conflict with potentially other pythons installed on the machine, so we can develop, test and deploy in exactly the same environment http://www.python-camelot.com/cpd.html - build an auto-update monitoring service around it that was integrated with setuptools and buildbot http://www.conceptive.be/downloads/camelot/doc/sphinx/build/advanced/deployment.html we serve more than 100 sites with this combination. updating the app is just pressing the buildbot button which will run unittests, build a package and push it to the end users. Regards, Erik On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 7:13 PM, James Polk jpolk5...@yahoo.com wrote: Apologies if this is too off-topic,but I'd like to propose a discussion of how-to's and where-fore's regarding distributing python modules to a user-base. Recently, I've been using Mark Hammond's excellent pywin32 packages, along with NumPy and PyOpenGL,etc. I have a user-base of
Re: [PyQt] Inter-office distribution/installation of packages/modules
that's interesting, how do you handle the auto update with py2exe ?
which part of the app gets updated ?
On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Demetrius Cassidy
dcassid...@gmail.com wrote:
We have an app which must be redistributed to multiple groups, with 40+
users and py2exe is the reason we are able to do this. Gui2exe makes the
building simpler.
If you need to debug, you won't be running the bundled app, so I don't see
why you would need to so much other than making sure it runs when bundled.
If your packages are making assumptions on how your enviroment is set up,
IMO I think that is wrong and will only lead to problems down the road.
And the last thing, is that we have an auto updater, so new releases only
require a rebuild and push to the sever.
On Jun 16, 2011 2:58 PM, Erik Janssens erik.janss...@conceptive.be
wrote:
Hi,
I would not agree with using Py2exe, while the idea is nice, we have had
many
issues with it, basically for 2 reasons :
- it's dependency analysis, in combination with automatic updates : if
your
update
uses a part of a package that was not used in the original package, you
need to
redeploy everything, instead of just the part of your app that you update
- it changes the 'environment' your app runs in (eg sys.path), while it is
possible
to work around it in your app, you need to make sure that none of the
packages
you use make certain assumption on the environment
This combination means that in order to properly test your application,
you
need
to continuously rebuild your app with py2exe, and run it. notice some
error,
fix it,
rebuild, etc. This takes far too much time.
So what we did was :
- build a custom python distro with all 'binary' packages included we need
that
does not depend on registry settings and does not conflict with
potentially other
pythons installed on the machine, so we can develop, test and deploy in
exactly the same environment
http://www.python-camelot.com/cpd.html
- build an auto-update monitoring service around it that was integrated
with
setuptools and buildbot
http://www.conceptive.be/downloads/camelot/doc/sphinx/build/advanced/deployment.html
we serve more than 100 sites with this combination. updating the app is
just
pressing the buildbot button which will run unittests, build a package and
push
it to the end users.
Regards,
Erik
On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 7:13 PM, James Polk jpolk5...@yahoo.com wrote:
Apologies if this is too off-topic,but I'd like to propose a
discussion
of
how-to's and where-fore's regarding distributing python modules to a
user-base.
Recently, I've been using Mark Hammond's excellent pywin32 packages,
along with NumPy and PyOpenGL,etc. I have a user-base of approx 40 or so,
who will need these packages added to their base Python install.
Rather than visit 40 separate desktops, I used pip (pip freeze) to get
a
short list of packages outside the base install, and wrote an app that
each
user can run to find what's missing, and initiate the appropriate
install,etc.
Then I realized that pip itself was a 3rd party package!..DOh!
I can fall back and use help('modules') to generate a new list, but it
lists
*everything* in the install,...usable but not as succinct, for pywin32
for
example,
it lists about a dozen things with a form of win32 in them,...and
doesn't
appear
to return the real package name that is associated with the binary
installation file.
Surely these issues are fairly common phenomena in many workplaces,etc...
I'm wondering if anybody out there has any knowledge, tips, or
experiences
regarding this issue that they can share.
I've found moduleFinder, and various ideas about searching sys.path,
pkgutils, but nothing else that seems like a long term viable and/or
elegant solution.
Thoughts anyone?
Thanks,
-Jim
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Re: [PyQt] Inter-office distribution/installation of packages/modules
Have you tried using py2exe? We have an application written in python with
many dependencies, and without py2exe we would have to create an installer
to manually install python and all the dependencies...And we initially did
that, but that was far more problematic in the end than deploying an .exe
(problems with multiple python installations, upgrading packages, upgrading
Python!, etc.)
Use py2exe along with gui2exe (makes deploying much simpler). It's not
perfect, and the project seems to have stalled, but it works. There is also
PyInstaller, but I have never gotten it to work with twisted and distutils.
It would also balloon our app because it started including every system32
dll it could find that was used!
On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 1:13 PM, James Polk jpolk5...@yahoo.com wrote:
Apologies if this is too off-topic,but I'd like to propose a discussion
of
how-to's and where-fore's regarding distributing python modules to a
user-base.
Recently, I've been using Mark Hammond's excellent pywin32 packages,
along with NumPy and PyOpenGL,etc. I have a user-base of approx 40 or so,
who will need these packages added to their base Python install.
Rather than visit 40 separate desktops, I used pip (pip freeze) to get a
short list of packages outside the base install, and wrote an app that each
user can run to find what's missing, and initiate the appropriate
install,etc.
Then I realized that pip itself was a 3rd party package!..DOh!
I can fall back and use help('modules') to generate a new list, but it
lists
*everything* in the install,...usable but not as succinct, for pywin32 for
example,
it lists about a dozen things with a form of win32 in them,...and doesn't
appear
to return the real package name that is associated with the binary
installation file.
Surely these issues are fairly common phenomena in many workplaces,etc...
I'm wondering if anybody out there has any knowledge, tips, or experiences
regarding this issue that they can share.
I've found moduleFinder, and various ideas about searching sys.path,
pkgutils, but nothing else that seems like a long term viable and/or
elegant solution.
Thoughts anyone?
Thanks,
-Jim
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Re: [PyQt] Inter-office distribution/installation of packages/modules
On Thursday 16 June 2011 19:13:10 James Polk wrote:
Apologies if this is too off-topic,but I'd like to propose a discussion
of how-to's and where-fore's regarding distributing python modules to a
user-base.
Recently, I've been using Mark Hammond's excellent pywin32 packages,
along with NumPy and PyOpenGL,etc. I have a user-base of approx 40 or so,
who will need these packages added to their base Python install.
Rather than visit 40 separate desktops, I used pip (pip freeze) to get a
short list of packages outside the base install, and wrote an app that each
user can run to find what's missing, and initiate the appropriate
install,etc. Then I realized that pip itself was a 3rd party
package!..DOh!
I can fall back and use help('modules') to generate a new list, but it
lists *everything* in the install,...usable but not as succinct, for
pywin32 for example, it lists about a dozen things with a form of win32
in them,...and doesn't appear to return the real package name that is
associated with the binary installation file.
Surely these issues are fairly common phenomena in many workplaces,etc...
I'm wondering if anybody out there has any knowledge, tips, or experiences
regarding this issue that they can share.
I've found moduleFinder, and various ideas about searching sys.path,
pkgutils, but nothing else that seems like a long term viable and/or
elegant solution.
I don't really get your question? Why are you so serious about third-party
applications/modules? Do you suspect licensing problems?
If that is the case: As long as the app/modules you develop stays within the
company that pays you generally, its not publishing the stuff. So when you
wrote that app during your day-job for your employer and want to distribute it
to all the other employers, neither are you affected by the licenses of the
third-party modules, nor do you have to use a certain license for your code.
Which actually belongs to your employer, thats why using it inside the firm is
no publication...
Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer.
Have fun,
Arnold
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Re: [PyQt] Inter-office distribution/installation of packages/modules
On Thursday 16 June 2011 10:13:10 James Polk wrote:
Apologies if this is too off-topic,but I'd like to propose a discussion
of how-to's and where-fore's regarding distributing python modules to a
user-base.
Recently, I've been using Mark Hammond's excellent pywin32 packages,
along with NumPy and PyOpenGL,etc. I have a user-base of approx 40 or so,
who will need these packages added to their base Python install.
Rather than visit 40 separate desktops, I used pip (pip freeze) to get a
short list of packages outside the base install, and wrote an app that each
user can run to find what's missing, and initiate the appropriate
install,etc. Then I realized that pip itself was a 3rd party
package!..DOh!
I can fall back and use help('modules') to generate a new list, but it
lists *everything* in the install,...usable but not as succinct, for
pywin32 for example, it lists about a dozen things with a form of win32
in them,...and doesn't appear to return the real package name that is
associated with the binary installation file.
Surely these issues are fairly common phenomena in many workplaces,etc...
I'm wondering if anybody out there has any knowledge, tips, or experiences
regarding this issue that they can share.
I've found moduleFinder, and various ideas about searching sys.path,
pkgutils, but nothing else that seems like a long term viable and/or elegant
solution.
Thoughts anyone?
Thanks,
-Jim
Have your tried easy_install ? similar to pip, but is part of the
setuputils/distribute packaging system. But I would second: use py2exe you
can bundle a copy of everything into a single bin for the users.
py2exe is a Python Distutils extension which converts Python scripts into
executable Windows programs, able to run without requiring a Python
installation. -- http://py2exe.org
Mike
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Re: [PyQt] Inter-office distribution/installation of packages/modules
Hi,
I would not agree with using Py2exe, while the idea is nice, we have had
many
issues with it, basically for 2 reasons :
- it's dependency analysis, in combination with automatic updates : if your
update
uses a part of a package that was not used in the original package, you
need to
redeploy everything, instead of just the part of your app that you update
- it changes the 'environment' your app runs in (eg sys.path), while it is
possible
to work around it in your app, you need to make sure that none of the
packages
you use make certain assumption on the environment
This combination means that in order to properly test your application, you
need
to continuously rebuild your app with py2exe, and run it. notice some error,
fix it,
rebuild, etc. This takes far too much time.
So what we did was :
- build a custom python distro with all 'binary' packages included we need
that
does not depend on registry settings and does not conflict with
potentially other
pythons installed on the machine, so we can develop, test and deploy in
exactly the same environment
http://www.python-camelot.com/cpd.html
- build an auto-update monitoring service around it that was integrated
with
setuptools and buildbot
http://www.conceptive.be/downloads/camelot/doc/sphinx/build/advanced/deployment.html
we serve more than 100 sites with this combination. updating the app is
just
pressing the buildbot button which will run unittests, build a package and
push
it to the end users.
Regards,
Erik
On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 7:13 PM, James Polk jpolk5...@yahoo.com wrote:
Apologies if this is too off-topic,but I'd like to propose a discussion
of
how-to's and where-fore's regarding distributing python modules to a
user-base.
Recently, I've been using Mark Hammond's excellent pywin32 packages,
along with NumPy and PyOpenGL,etc. I have a user-base of approx 40 or so,
who will need these packages added to their base Python install.
Rather than visit 40 separate desktops, I used pip (pip freeze) to get a
short list of packages outside the base install, and wrote an app that each
user can run to find what's missing, and initiate the appropriate
install,etc.
Then I realized that pip itself was a 3rd party package!..DOh!
I can fall back and use help('modules') to generate a new list, but it
lists
*everything* in the install,...usable but not as succinct, for pywin32 for
example,
it lists about a dozen things with a form of win32 in them,...and doesn't
appear
to return the real package name that is associated with the binary
installation file.
Surely these issues are fairly common phenomena in many workplaces,etc...
I'm wondering if anybody out there has any knowledge, tips, or experiences
regarding this issue that they can share.
I've found moduleFinder, and various ideas about searching sys.path,
pkgutils, but nothing else that seems like a long term viable and/or
elegant solution.
Thoughts anyone?
Thanks,
-Jim
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