[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Pablo Galindo Salgado]

Pablo Galindo Salgado  added the comment:


New changeset cdfbe581bae1b33d4eb135597cd27b0f3782e97e by Pablo Galindo (Miss 
Islington (bot)) in branch '3.10':
bpo-38623: Add note about site module (site-packages) (GH-16974) (GH-28536)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/cdfbe581bae1b33d4eb135597cd27b0f3782e97e


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Łukasz Langa]

Łukasz Langa  added the comment:


New changeset d672dd34f0bc3addeaf1789d4183e3a37ab110d5 by Miss Islington (bot) 
in branch '3.9':
bpo-38623: Add note about site module (site-packages) (GH-16974) (GH-28537)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/d672dd34f0bc3addeaf1789d4183e3a37ab110d5


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Łukasz Langa]

Łukasz Langa  added the comment:

Thanks, Peter! ✨ 🍰 ✨

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resolution:  -> fixed
stage: patch review -> resolved
status: open -> closed
versions: +Python 3.10, Python 3.11 -Python 3.7, Python 3.8

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Łukasz Langa]

Łukasz Langa  added the comment:


New changeset 87f97fe5e6434da51246d70af9e2cd7d63c29fba by Miss Islington (bot) 
in branch '3.10':
bpo-38623: Add note about site module (site-packages) (GH-16974) (GH-28536)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/87f97fe5e6434da51246d70af9e2cd7d63c29fba


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[miss-islington]

Change by miss-islington :


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Łukasz Langa]

Łukasz Langa  added the comment:


New changeset 55b45bf707c6c8084db259fe2f8aa08e84ea0d99 by Peter Bittner in 
branch 'main':
bpo-38623: Add note about site module (site-packages) (GH-16974)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/55b45bf707c6c8084db259fe2f8aa08e84ea0d99


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[miss-islington]

Change by miss-islington :


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Brett Cannon]

Brett Cannon  added the comment:

I think "Python learners deserve to know about "site-packages" and (optionally) 
"dist-packages" " is a bit strong of a statement. I don't think the tutorial 
covers how to install third-party package which is what goes into 
site-packages, so I don't know what benefit they will garner from having that 
covered in the tutorial to teach the basics of Python. In an intermediate 
tutorial I can totally understand the explanation along with using e.g. pip, 
but for a tutorial like this I still think it's unnecessary.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Inada Naoki]

Inada Naoki  added the comment:

> The tutorial currently mentions its special role only briefly [7], saying:
>
>> * The installation-dependent default.
>
> We should explain that part. I'll give it a shot replacing my earlier 
> proposal.

I don't think so.  At there, the tutorial doesn't explain about even standard 
library.  We shouldn't explain about it there.

It should be explained much later in the tutorial, or document other than the 
tutorial.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Peter Bittner]

Peter Bittner  added the comment:

Python learners deserve to know about "site-packages" and (optionally) 
"dist-packages". This is a "random note", it's an explanation that is missing 
in the tutorial.

- Site-packages "is the target directory of manually built Python packages", 
does someone explain.[4]

- It is the "expected convention for locally installed packages", explains Greg 
Ward in "Installing Python Modules".[5]

- Their location is only a subset of `sys.path`, as visible from the Python 
code in the `site` module.[6]

The tutorial currently mentions its special role only briefly [7], saying:

> * The installation-dependent default.

We should explain that part. I'll give it a shot replacing my earlier proposal.


[4] 
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/31384639/what-is-pythons-site-packages-directory
[5] https://docs.python.org/3.8/install/#modifying-python-s-search-path
[6] https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/master/Lib/site.py#L319-L344
[7] 
https://docs.python.org/3.8/tutorial/modules.html?highlight=installation-dependent%20default#the-module-search-path

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Inada Naoki]

Inada Naoki  added the comment:

It is tempting that putting some paragraphs to the tutorial when you think 
"this should be documented!" but there is no good place in the library 
reference.

HOWTOs is the document for advanced topics.  But it doesn't cover wide area 
yet.  There is no topic about module search path or site-packages.

Since the tutorial covers a wide area, including module, it is very tempting to 
add many random notes about module.

But please remember that the primary reader is people new to Python.  (I 
learned Python 2.4 by the tutorial!)

The reader has learned Python syntax and basic types in chapters 1~5 and now 
learning how to split a Python program into multiple files.

So please don't try to answer the question in Stackoverflow in the tutorial, 
unless it is worth enough for the reader.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[miss-islington]

miss-islington  added the comment:


New changeset a6b37589a05c63abec122d3a00785641a3bcd85a by Miss Islington (bot) 
in branch '3.8':
bpo-38623: Doc: Add section for site module CLI. (GH-17858)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/a6b37589a05c63abec122d3a00785641a3bcd85a


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[miss-islington]

miss-islington  added the comment:


New changeset 72995c5cdd7ad4af6252bbe129e8fc63f5006130 by Miss Islington (bot) 
in branch '3.7':
bpo-38623: Doc: Add section for site module CLI. (GH-17858)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/72995c5cdd7ad4af6252bbe129e8fc63f5006130


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[miss-islington]

Change by miss-islington :


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Inada Naoki]

Inada Naoki  added the comment:


New changeset ca94677a6216e2d41b04574986ce49d31a0b329c by Inada Naoki in branch 
'master':
bpo-38623: Doc: Add section for site module CLI. (GH-17858)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/ca94677a6216e2d41b04574986ce49d31a0b329c


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[miss-islington]

Change by miss-islington :


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Brett Cannon]

Brett Cannon  added the comment:

I agree with Inada-san that pointing out how to get the file path on a module 
is a better solution then explaining directory layouts which are borderline 
implementation details.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Inada Naoki]

Inada Naoki  added the comment:

> There is a specific question this change attempts to answer: "Where is the 
> module I imported located in the file system?"

So `print(the_module.__file__)` is better answer.  (or `pip list -v` if the 
module is third party package installed via pip).

`python -m site` doesn't tell you where the imported module came from.



> [3] https://docs.python.org/3/library/site.html#site.getusersitepackages

After merging PR 17858, you can use :ref:`site-commandline` for cross reference.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Peter Bittner]

Peter Bittner  added the comment:

There is a specific question this change attempts to answer: "Where is the 
module I imported located in the file system?"

I suspect this comes up a lot because developers want to inspect or mess with 
installed modules, add debug output and the like, to understand some of their 
development issues better.

The site module documentation explains the details.[3] The paragraph the change 
adds links to that documentation. That should be sufficient (for a tutorial); 
other technical details probably fit well in the document being linked to.

[3] https://docs.python.org/3/library/site.html#site.getusersitepackages

I tried to keep it concise, adding value with a quick glance over the `site` 
module features that relate to the module paths topic.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Inada Naoki]

Change by Inada Naoki :


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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Inada Naoki]

Inada Naoki  added the comment:

There is a document about it in Doc/library/site.rst already.

I'm not sure this should be documented in the tutorial.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Vinay Keerthi]

Vinay Keerthi  added the comment:

Just chiming in my opinion, the site-packages directory is also dependent on 
venv, correct? So would explaining where it is at a global install level be 
much use? Or do you mean explaining where site-packages is even for a venv?


I could take this up, if some agrees that jr needs doing.

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Cheryl Sabella]

Change by Cheryl Sabella :


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versions:  -Python 2.7, Python 3.5, Python 3.6

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Peter Bittner]

Change by Peter Bittner :


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pull_request: https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/16974

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[issue38623] Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages

[Peter Bittner]

New submission from Peter Bittner :

A popular question on StackOverflow is, "How do I find the location of my 
Python site-packages directory?" [1]

While this may hint at a deeper problem that needs to be solved, a user 
suggested [2] the accepted answer to be added to Python's official 
documentation.

The most appropriate place I could find to add related information is 
``Doc/tutorial/modules.rst``.

[1] 
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/122327/how-do-i-find-the-location-of-my-python-site-packages-directory/46071447
[2] 
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/122327/how-do-i-find-the-location-of-my-python-site-packages-directory/46071447#comment103247041_46071447

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assignee: docs@python
components: Documentation
messages: 355599
nosy: bittner, docs@python
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: Python documentation should mention how to find site-packages
type: enhancement
versions: Python 2.7, Python 3.5, Python 3.6, Python 3.7, Python 3.8, Python 3.9

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