[Python-Dev] mail.python.org disruption
[ Mailed to python-dev and python-list, as that should cover most of the users ;P ]There was a slight disruption on mail.python.org this morning. For about three and a half hours, it was rejecting most of its mail with the message: Client host [] blocked using singlehop.dsbl.org; Your mail has been rejected because the server you are sending to is misconfigured.The error means mail.python.org was using singlehop.dsbl.org as a DNSBL list, but that list doesn't exist, so it rejects all mail. Someone (not me :) added that blacklist at 08:15 local time (07:15 GMT) and I fixed it at 11:46 (10:46 GMT). Blame lingering PyCon-jetlag for me not catching it earlier, sorry. About 7759 mails were bounced, although a decent portion of them will have been actual spam (of which python.org gets massive amounts.) If you sent legitimate mail in that period, and got a bounce back with a message like the one above, it's safe to re-send it now.Sorry for the inconvenience. -- Thomas Wouters [EMAIL PROTECTED]Hi! I'm a .signature virus! copy me into your .signature file to help me spread! ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] mail.python.org disruption
Thomas Wouters wrote: [ Mailed to python-dev and python-list, as that should cover most of the users ;P ] There was a slight disruption on mail.python.org this morning. For about three and a half hours, it was rejecting most of its mail with the message: Client host [] blocked using singlehop.dsbl.org; Your mail has been rejected because the server you are sending to is misconfigured. The error means mail.python.org was using singlehop.dsbl.org as a DNSBL list, but that list doesn't exist, so it rejects all mail. Someone (not me :) added that blacklist at 08:15 local time (07:15 GMT) and I fixed it at 11:46 (10:46 GMT). Blame lingering PyCon-jetlag for me not catching it earlier, sorry. About 7759 mails were bounced, although a decent portion of them will have been actual spam (of which python.org gets massive amounts.) If you sent legitimate mail in that period, and got a bounce back with a message like the one above, it's safe to re-send it now. Sorry for the inconvenience. Has this also to do with that http://svn.python.org/ doesn't work? ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] mail.python.org disruption
On 3/8/06, Thomas Heller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thomas Wouters wrote: There was a slight disruption on mail.python.org this morning. Has this also to do with that http://svn.python.org/ doesn't work?No, it doesn't, although my fixing that (almost) is what made me notice mail.python.org wasn't working right. svn.python.org should be working fine for SVN checkouts and the like, it's just viewcvs that isn't working yet. I'll look at it.-- Thomas Wouters [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi! I'm a .signature virus! copy me into your .signature file to help me spread! ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] mail.python.org disruption
On 3/8/06, Thomas Wouters [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: svn.python.org should be working fine for SVN checkouts and the like, it's just viewcvs that isn't working yet. I'll look at it.Actually, it all seems to work fine now. Let me know of any specific problems if you see any :) -- Thomas Wouters [EMAIL PROTECTED]Hi! I'm a .signature virus! copy me into your .signature file to help me spread! ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] quit() on the prompt
Oleg Broytmann wrote: On Wed, Mar 08, 2006 at 12:37:47AM +0100, Thomas Wouters wrote: Raising SystemExit(quit() called) has an additional benefit (although the wording could use some work): raise SystemExit(quit() called) quit() called (At least, I consider that a benefit :-) It has a bad side-effect of returning an error code to the calling shell: $ python echo Ok || echo Error\! Python 2.4.2 (#1, Oct 3 2005, 20:57:52) [GCC 3.3.5 (Debian 1:3.3.5-13)] on linux2 Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. raise SystemExit(quit() called) quit() called Error! (At least, I consider that a bad side-effect.) I should imagine the use cases for running an interactive Python shell as a part of a script are fairly few and far between, though. regards Steve -- Steve Holden +44 150 684 7255 +1 800 494 3119 Holden Web LLC/Ltd www.holdenweb.com Love me, love my blog holdenweb.blogspot.com ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] quit() on the prompt
On Wed, Mar 08, 2006 at 12:39:51PM +, Steve Holden wrote: Oleg Broytmann wrote: raise SystemExit(quit() called) quit() called Error! I should imagine the use cases for running an interactive Python shell as a part of a script are fairly few and far between, though. IDEs. Edit a code in an editor, run python -i script.py, investigate the environment, return to the editor, get error message. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] __exit__ API?
I have a patch for this now -- python.org/sf/1445739. Please review. --Guido On 3/3/06, Guido van Rossum [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A few days ago there were rumbling noises that requiring __exit__ to re-raise the exception (as I amended PEP 343 at the time) could lead to easily-missed bugs in __exit__ handlers. After thinking it over I think I agree and I think I'd like to change the API so that the exception is only ignored if __exit__ returns a true value. The easiest implementation is probably to just let the WITH_CLEANUP opcode do everything. This becomes a rather heavy opcode then but the alternative is to generate very hairy code (like the original patch did, full of ROT 4 choruses). Any objections? I probably won't get to this until Monday. -- --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) -- --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] 2.5 release schedule?
Have we reached final agreement on the 2.5 release schedule? The last message was on Feb 15, which said: alpha 1: May 6, 2006 [planned] alpha 2: June 3, 2006 [planned] alpha 3: July 1, 2006 [planned] beta 1: July 29, 2006 [planned] beta 2: August 26, 2006 [planned] rc 1:September 16, 2006 [planned] final: September 30, 2006 [planned] but http://www.python.org/doc/peps/pep-0356/ still has alpha 1: April 1, 2006 [planned] alpha 2: April 29, 2006 [planned] alpha 3: May 27, 2006 [planned] beta 1: June 24, 2006 [planned] beta 2: July 15, 2006 [planned] rc 1:August 5, 2006 [planned] final: August 19, 2006 [planned] Can we complete this? (Or does the actual PEP have the correct schedule and the web site re-org didn't get the published version updated?) -- Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) * http://www.pythoncraft.com/ 19. A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing. --Alan Perlis ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 2.5 release schedule?
If anything, we're probably going to do it earlier even. All schedules are tentative, BTW; the PSF is not responsible for losses due to schedule changes. :-) --Guido On 3/8/06, Aahz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have we reached final agreement on the 2.5 release schedule? The last message was on Feb 15, which said: alpha 1: May 6, 2006 [planned] alpha 2: June 3, 2006 [planned] alpha 3: July 1, 2006 [planned] beta 1: July 29, 2006 [planned] beta 2: August 26, 2006 [planned] rc 1:September 16, 2006 [planned] final: September 30, 2006 [planned] but http://www.python.org/doc/peps/pep-0356/ still has alpha 1: April 1, 2006 [planned] alpha 2: April 29, 2006 [planned] alpha 3: May 27, 2006 [planned] beta 1: June 24, 2006 [planned] beta 2: July 15, 2006 [planned] rc 1:August 5, 2006 [planned] final: August 19, 2006 [planned] Can we complete this? (Or does the actual PEP have the correct schedule and the web site re-org didn't get the published version updated?) -- Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) * http://www.pythoncraft.com/ 19. A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing. --Alan Perlis ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/guido%40python.org -- --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] quit() on the prompt
Guido van Rossum [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bad idea, as several pointed out -- quit() should return a 0 exit to the shell. I like the idea of making quit callable. One small concern I have is that people will use it in scripts to exit (rather than one of the other existing ways to exit). OTOH, maybe that's a feature. Neil ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] quit() on the prompt
Neil Schemenauer wrote: Bad idea, as several pointed out -- quit() should return a 0 exit to the shell. I like the idea of making quit callable. One small concern I have is that people will use it in scripts to exit (rather than one of the other existing ways to exit). OTOH, maybe that's a feature. I actually thought it was only defined for interactive sessions, but a brief test shows I was wrong. It doesn't bother me, but it does make me think that exit(1) should exit with a code of one. -- Ian Bicking / [EMAIL PROTECTED] / http://blog.ianbicking.org ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Long-time shy failure in test_socket_ssl
[Tim] Neal plugged another hole later, but-- alas --I have seen the same shy failure since then on WinXP. One of the most recent buildbot test runs saw it too, on a non-Windows box: http://www.python.org/dev/buildbot/trunk/g5%20osx.3%20trunk/builds/204/step-test/0 test_socket_ssl test test_socket_ssl crashed -- exceptions.TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not callable in the second test run there. [Neal] For closure, I believe this problem was addressed by revs 42842 and 42844 to Lib/test/test_importhooks.py. I agree the mystery-change there made the problem go away (yay!), but would prefer to reserve addressed for some notion of understood. Who understands test_importhooks? Without Neal's change to delete urllib from sys.modules there, and when running tests in a specific order, test_socket_ssl dies because the module-global `urlparse` magically becomes None on line 147 of urlparse.py's urljoin() function. What sins does test_importhooks commit to provoke this? What else does running test_importhooks distort? That is, what else should test_importhooks be doing to clean up after itself that it's not currently doing (in the absence of understanding the original problem, there's no apparent answer)? If anyone sees spurious failures with the buildbot (one time failures, crashes, etc), please report the problems to python-dev. It would be great to see if you can reproduce the results with the same tests that failed. We need to determine if it is architecture specific, test-order related, or something else. Yes, it's loads of fun :-) ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] quit() on the prompt
Ian Bicking [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Neil Schemenauer wrote: Bad idea, as several pointed out -- quit() should return a 0 exit to the shell. I like the idea of making quit callable. One small concern I have is that people will use it in scripts to exit (rather than one of the other existing ways to exit). OTOH, maybe that's a feature. I actually thought it was only defined for interactive sessions, but a brief test shows I was wrong. It doesn't bother me, but it does make me think that exit(1) should exit with a code of one. Sounds like the quit/exit bits are becoming aliases for sys.exit with special docstrings. That would be fine with me. - Josiah ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] Bug Day?
Hi, I know, PyCon's just been, but not many bugs were closed and there really ought to be some issues resolved before 2.4.3 happens. The number of open bugs is again crawling to 900. I myself are looking at many bugs and patches over time, but with most of them I can't decide alone what to do. Writing here every time doesn't seem like the most sensible thing too. So, is there interest? Can I do anything to make it easier? Cheers, Georg ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Bug Day?
On 3/8/06, Georg Brandl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I know, PyCon's just been, but not many bugs were closed and there really ought to be some issues resolved before 2.4.3 happens. The number of open bugs is again crawling to 900. I myself are looking at many bugs and patches over time, but with most of them I can't decide alone what to do. Writing here every time doesn't seem like the most sensible thing too. So, is there interest? Pending time, I would be interested, especially to see if we can at least narrow down the persistent reference leaks. Can I do anything to make it easier? Do my homework and TA work for me to an acceptable level of quality. =) Other than that, just holding at a time that works for me (they tend to fall in the morning for PSF on the weekend which means I am still asleep, although I am working on actually getting up at reasonable hours these days. =) -Brett ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Bug Day?
On 3/8/06, Georg Brandl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know, PyCon's just been, but not many bugs were closed and there really ought to be some issues resolved before 2.4.3 happens. The number of open bugs is again crawling to 900. I myself are looking at many bugs and patches over time, but with most of them I can't decide alone what to do. Writing here every time doesn't seem like the most sensible thing too. So, is there interest? Can I do anything to make it easier? Would anyone be interested in a bug day on a weekday? I don't have time on weekends, but could probably find some time on a Wed or Fri for bug fixing. I'll probably do it regardless, but I'd have more fun if a few others were online. Jeremy ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Bug Day?
On 3/8/06, Jeremy Hylton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 3/8/06, Georg Brandl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know, PyCon's just been, but not many bugs were closed and there really ought to be some issues resolved before 2.4.3 happens. The number of open bugs is again crawling to 900. I myself are looking at many bugs and patches over time, but with most of them I can't decide alone what to do. Writing here every time doesn't seem like the most sensible thing too. So, is there interest? Can I do anything to make it easier? Would anyone be interested in a bug day on a weekday? I don't have time on weekends, but could probably find some time on a Wed or Fri for bug fixing. I'll probably do it regardless, but I'd have more fun if a few others were online. I could find time on Fridays. Wednesday as well, but not quite as much. -Brett ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] quit() on the prompt
Oleg Broytmann wrote: IDEs. Edit a code in an editor, run python -i script.py, investigate the environment, return to the editor, get error message. An IDE is likely to want to catch SystemExits in the debugged script and handle them specially anyway. -- Greg Ewing, Computer Science Dept, +--+ University of Canterbury, | Carpe post meridiam! | Christchurch, New Zealand | (I'm not a morning person.) | [EMAIL PROTECTED] +--+ ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] quit() on the prompt
We seem to have a consensus. Is anybody working on a patch yet? -- --Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/) ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] Generated code in test_ast.py
I’m finishing up a patch for bug 1441408. I had to change the asdl definitions which in turn caused a failure in test_ast.py. A comment in the file indicates that EVERYTHING BELOW IS GENERATED # and has a definition for Slice() that is no longer valid. Can anyone tell me how this is generated? Should it be automatically generated when I run asdl_c.py? I'm developing on Windows. I know in the past some of the autogenerated code from the ast-branch worked better via make. Would this have fixed itself on a linux box, or is this a manual process? -Grant P.S. Originally sent this on Monday, still waiting moderator approval. Thought I'd give gmane a try. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Bug Day?
[Georg Brandl] I know, PyCon's just been, but not many bugs were closed Ya, it was very much a development sprint this year -- new features. and there really ought to be some issues resolved before 2.4.3 happens. The number of open bugs is again crawling to 900. I myself are looking at many bugs and patches over time, but with most of them I can't decide alone what to do. Writing here every time doesn't seem like the most sensible thing too. So, is there interest? Can I do anything to make it easier? Some bug days would be an excellent idea. Given my current schedule, I'm afraid the only days I could make time are those whose names end with y ;-) ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Bug Day?
I think it would be a good idea to follow the Plone project and try to encourage new developers by offering assistance to get them up and running. AFAIK, we've done that for the other bug days but it might help to publish the fact that no prior Python development experience is necessary. Neil ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] Making builtins more efficient
I'm interested in how builtins could be more efficient. I've read over some of the PEPs having to do with making global variables more efficient (search for global): http://www.python.org/doc/essays/pepparade.html But I think the problem can be simplified by focusing strictly on builtins. One of my assumptions is that only a small fractions of modules override the default builtins with something like: import mybuiltins __builtins__ = mybuiltins As you probably know each access of a builtin requires two hash table lookups. First, the builtin is not found in the list of globals. It is then found in the list of builtins. Why not have a means of referencing the default builtins with some sort of index the way the LOAD_FAST op code currently works? In other words, by default each module gets the default set of builtins indexed (where the index indexes into an array) in a certain order. The version stored in the pyc file would be bumped each time the set of default builtins is changed. I don't have very strong feelings whether things like True = (1 == 1) would be a syntax error, but assigning to a builtin could just do the equivalent of STORE_FAST. I also don't have very strong feelings about whether the array of default builtins would be shared between modules. To simulate the current behavior where attempting to assign to builtin actually alters that module's global hashtable a separate array of builtins could be used for each module. As to assigning to __builtins__ (like I mentioned at the beginning of this post) perhaps it could assign to the builtin array for those items that have a name that matches a default builtin (such as True or len). Those items that don't match a default builtin would just create global variables. Perhaps what I'm suggesting isn't feasible for reasons that have already been discussed. But it seems like it should be possible to make while True as efficient as while 1. -- --- | Steven Elliott | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | --- ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] conditional expressions - add parens?
Steve Holden wrote: Contrast with the bleeding obvious: level = 0 if absolute_import in self.futures: level = -1 regards Steve The issue that spawned the necessity of a ternary operator in the first place was that this syntax is not usable at all in quite a few situations like, say, list comprehensions... ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] fixing log messages
talk about embarrassing spelling misteaks [Fredrik Lundh] (but alright, as long as you don't call me Fred...) [Steve Holden] Did I *ever* do that? That would have been an embarrassing slip ;-) I know I'm extremely late, but there should be a POTF (Pun Of The Fortnight) from now on. A member of the Mund-SIG ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
