Re: [Python-Dev] 3.2.0
On Wed, 16 Feb 2011 10:52:16 -0800 Brett Cannon wrote: > On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 09:34, Terry Reedy wrote: > > I would like the next release called 3.2.0 rather than just 3.2. > > > > 'x.y' is known to be ambiguous and confusing. > > > > In most actual usages, I believe, it refers to the latest x.y.z release. On > > the site, the 'x.y' docs are almost always the latest version of the docs > > (actually x.y.z+additional fixes). In discussions on python-list, for > > instance, advice to use 'x.y' means to download and use the latest x.y.z > > release, not the initial x.y(.0) release. Similarly on the tracker, 'what > > happens with x.y' means the same. > > > > So the alternate use of 'x.y' to mean x.y(.0) is both confusing and > > correctable, at least for the future. > > With all of the writing I have been doing recently, I agree that > disambiguating 3.2.0 from 3.2 is a good thing. Agreed. Although better to defer it to 3.3.0 at this point. Regards Antoine. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 3.2.0
On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 12:20, Antoine Pitrou wrote: > Agreed. Although better to defer it to 3.3.0 at this point. +1.0.0 for that. Yes, it's confusing, but it's going to be even more confusing if it's called 3.2 sometimes and 3.2.0 sometimes. -- Lennart Regebro: http://regebro.wordpress.com/ Python 3 Porting: http://python3porting.com/ +33 661 58 14 64 ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 3.2.0
On 2/17/2011 1:36 AM, Senthil Kumaran wrote: On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 1:34 AM, Terry Reedy wrote: 'x.y' is known to be ambiguous and confusing. Not really. Actually, to me, the confusion is slightly worse, and the reason to change slightly stronger, than I initially explained. Python x.y is a version of the *language*. CPython x.y.z is an occasional marked release of an *implementation*. For instance, Python 3.2 is a version of the language and stdlib. It has been pretty well defined since new features were prohibited. The 3.2 docs are the specification of Python 3.2 (with a few CPython-specific notes). The 3.2 docs will be continuously upgraded as deficiencies are noted and fixed. As I understand it, all patches are expected to leave the docs in an improved and buildable state, so that updates can be built and uploaded to the site frequently (daily?). CPython 3.2.0 will be the first 'production' release of the CPython implementation of Python 3.2. It will be one in a series of approximation of an ideal bug-free 'CPython 3.2'. Some have already been released, more will come. Like the docs, the concrete CPython 3.2 codebase will also be continuously upgraded. For various reasons, it will probably not always be buildable on all platforms and not always be production ready. For practical reasons, marked releases will be spaced some months apart. So, for me, Python 3.2 is a now theoritically fixed version of the language. The Python 3.2 docs document that version, but will be upgraded as mistaked, ambiguities, and omissions are found. The CPython 3.2 codebase is an evolving approximation of an ideal bug-free CPython 3.2 (that will never be reached). And CPython 3.2.0 is an early snapshot release of that evolving codebase. -- Terry Jan Reedy ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 3.2.0
On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 3:19 AM, Terry Reedy wrote: > Actually, to me, the confusion is slightly worse, and the reason to change > slightly stronger, than I initially explained. Python x.y is a version of > the *language*. CPython x.y.z is an occasional marked release of an > *implementation*. > > For instance, Python 3.2 is a version of the language and stdlib. It has > been pretty well defined since new features were prohibited. > > The 3.2 docs are the specification of Python 3.2 (with a few > CPython-specific notes). The 3.2 docs will be continuously upgraded as > deficiencies are noted and fixed. As I understand it, all patches are > expected to leave the docs in an improved and buildable state, so that > updates can be built and uploaded to the site frequently (daily?). > > CPython 3.2.0 will be the first 'production' release of the CPython > implementation of Python 3.2. It will be one in a series of approximation of > an ideal bug-free 'CPython 3.2'. Some have already been released, more will > come. Like the docs, the concrete CPython 3.2 codebase will also be > continuously upgraded. For various reasons, it will probably not always be > buildable on all platforms and not always be production ready. For practical > reasons, marked releases will be spaced some months apart. > > So, for me, Python 3.2 is a now theoritically fixed version of the language. > The Python 3.2 docs document that version, but will be upgraded as mistaked, > ambiguities, and omissions are found. The CPython 3.2 codebase is an > evolving approximation of an ideal bug-free CPython 3.2 (that will never be > reached). And CPython 3.2.0 is an early snapshot release of that evolving > codebase. I actually agree with this viewpoint, and think it would definitely be a good way to go for 3.3.0. For the 3.2 series, I think living with the ambiguity for another 6 months or so (however long it is until 3.2.1 is released) is the better choice. There are enough parts of the release process that involve the version number that we *really* shouldn't be messing with it during the RC phase. Cheers, Nick. -- Nick Coghlan | ncogh...@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 3.2.0
On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 7:56 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote: > For the 3.2 series, I think living with the ambiguity for another 6 > months or so (however long it is until 3.2.1 is released) is the > better choice. There are enough parts of the release process that > involve the version number that we *really* shouldn't be messing with > it during the RC phase. And the number 1 reason I consider messing with the numbering to be a bad idea: >>> "3.2" >= "3.2.0" False >>> (3, 2) >= (3, 2, 0) False If we miss anything, it could easily lead to errors like the two above. I'll grant that it *shouldn't* be any different to what happens when the release version gets bumped to 3.2.1 in the first maintenance release, but I really don't trust "should" all that much in a release management context :) Cheers, Nick. -- Nick Coghlan | ncogh...@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] svn outage on Friday
Speaking of, what is the current status and timeline on the move to Mercurial? ~/santa On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 1:25 AM, Victor Stinner < victor.stin...@haypocalc.com> wrote: > Le mardi 15 février 2011 à 09:30 +0100, "Martin v. Löwis" a écrit : > > I'm going to perform a Debian upgrade of svn.python.org on Friday, > > between 9:00 UTC and 11:00 UTC. I'll be disabling write access during > > that time. The outage shouldn't be longer than an hour. > > It's time to move to Mercurial! :-) > > Victor > > ___ > Python-Dev mailing list > Python-Dev@python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev > Unsubscribe: > http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/santoso.wijaya%40gmail.com > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 3.2.0
On 17/02/2011 22:01, Nick Coghlan wrote: On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 7:56 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote: For the 3.2 series, I think living with the ambiguity for another 6 months or so (however long it is until 3.2.1 is released) is the better choice. There are enough parts of the release process that involve the version number that we *really* shouldn't be messing with it during the RC phase. And the number 1 reason I consider messing with the numbering to be a bad idea: "3.2">= "3.2.0" False (3, 2)>= (3, 2, 0) False If we miss anything, it could easily lead to errors like the two above. How are those errors? Surely what matters is that the following *is* True: >>> (3, 2, 0) >= (3, 2) True >>> "3.2.0" >= "3.2" True I'm +1 for the change, but happy for it to happen for 3.3.0 given how close we are to 3.2 release. Michael Foord I'll grant that it *shouldn't* be any different to what happens when the release version gets bumped to 3.2.1 in the first maintenance release, but I really don't trust "should" all that much in a release management context :) Cheers, Nick. -- http://www.voidspace.org.uk/ May you do good and not evil May you find forgiveness for yourself and forgive others May you share freely, never taking more than you give. -- the sqlite blessing http://www.sqlite.org/different.html ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] svn outage on Friday
Am 17.02.2011 23:19, schrieb Santoso Wijaya: > Speaking of, what is the current status and timeline on the move to > Mercurial? I think it's fair to say that the project currently rests, lacking a project lead. The most recent timeline is that conversion should be completed by PyCon, and, failing that, should start at PyCon. Regards, Martin ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] svn outage on Friday
On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 00:17, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote: > I think it's fair to say that the project currently rests, lacking > a project lead. The most recent timeline is that conversion should > be completed by PyCon, and, failing that, should start at PyCon. It's not exactly resting; I've been pushing around the cvs2svn-converted tags to get them to behave sensibly, and I've been having good discussions with Antoine and Georg about several things we need to hash out in IRC. Sorry I haven't been doing more progress reports here. But yes, it would be nice if we could actually switch by PyCon, but at the very least there should be a fresh test repo and consensus on most of the workflow issues by PyCon (for those interested who live in Europe, I'm going to be at a hg sprint in Karlsruhe during the PyCon weekend). Cheers, Dirkjan ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
