[issue35897] Support list as argument to .startswith()

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

> For subtle reasons, that would make us worse off.  Tuple of constants get 
> precomputed but lists of constants have to be rebuilt.

So if a list is 20 times slower than a tuple, I can still do billions of 
computations in a second on a Raspberry Pi, so does it matter?

Being able to pass a list into .startswith() makes it more user-friendly and 
makes Python be more productive for the developer.

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[issue46027] email.utils.parsedate_to_datetime() handling of -0000 offset

[Fred Drake]

New submission from Fred Drake :

A local time offset of '-' is not handled the same way as an offset of 
'+', but I'd expect it would be:

>>> import email.utils
>>> 
>>> email.utils.parsedate_to_datetime('9 Dec 2021 08:52:04 -')
datetime.datetime(2021, 12, 9, 8, 52, 4)
>>> email.utils.parsedate_to_datetime('9 Dec 2021 08:52:04 +')
datetime.datetime(2021, 12, 9, 8, 52, 4, tzinfo=datetime.timezone.utc)

I observe the same behavior on Python 3.9.9 and 3.10.1.

--
components: email
messages: 408149
nosy: barry, fdrake, r.david.murray
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: email.utils.parsedate_to_datetime() handling of - offset
type: behavior
versions: Python 3.10, Python 3.9

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[issue45625] Add support for top-level await

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

Yeah, those other languages such as C# and JavaScript and others make async 
much more easier, approachable, reduces boilerplate code and lowers the bar for 
entry!

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[issue45625] Add support for top-level await

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

I don't care what async framework is used, nor do I care if its a x86 or ARM, 
or if its Windows or Linux.

I don't want to have to setup an async runner because it is boilerplate code, 
and it brings concern into my application which is outside of the domain of my 
application.

In JavaScript, I can just call await fetch() or any other asynchronous function 
without having to pick and configure a async runtime.

On .NET it is also very easy, just await a function at the top-level without 
declare any runtime either. 
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/csharp/whats-new/tutorials/top-level-statements

Python is suppose to be a high-level language. Programmers should focus on 
their domain, not underlying things such as which runtime to use, which garbage 
collector to use, etc.

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[issue45625] Add support for top-level await

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

$ python3 --async myscript.py
unknown option --async

Also I cannot go around telling other people how to run my script. My script 
must be able to run properly without any special setup.

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[issue45625] Add support for top-level await

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

I think it would fit with the design and commmunity of Python. I think people 
who use Python don't care about what async runtime it is, or how to configure 
it or set it up, they just want to call async functions.

This is 2021, we live in a async-first world. I think users expect to be able 
to do async with minimal friction.

Other languages like C# lets you do it easy, by changing:
static void Main() {}
to:
static async Task Main() {}

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[issue45625] Add support for top-level await

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

No, I was not aware of that.

After I started Python by running "python3 -m asyncio" then it behaved as I 
expected it should behave by default.

But this seems to work only in the REPL. I would like to write Python scripts 
stored in files where I can easily await at the top level as in the example in 
my first post.

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[issue45625] Add support for top-level await

[Fred]

New submission from Fred :

I want top-level await without any boilerplate code or setup.
Just write a "await" statement on line 1 without any indention.

#!/usr/bin/env python3
import asyncio
await asyncio.sleep(1)


I don't want to have to call asyncio.run(main()), and I don't  want to have to 
put the await inside an async function.

--
components: Interpreter Core
messages: 405088
nosy: Fred
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: Add support for top-level await
type: enhancement
versions: Python 3.11

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[issue40990] Make http.server support SSL

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

How is this going? Any progress?

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[issue40990] Make http.server support SSL

[Fred]

Fred  added the comment:

It could look for a existing certificate in a well-known location, and could 
fallback to an self-signed certificate that could be shipped with Python.

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[issue44169] Add HTTPS support to http.server

[Fred]

New submission from Fred :

The http.server module only supports HTTP.
https://docs.python.org/3/library/http.server.html

I propose that it should also support HTTPS.

This would allow it to serve files that depend on features that are restricted 
to secure contexts.
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Security/Secure_Contexts/features_restricted_to_secure_contexts

--
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priority: normal
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status: open
title: Add HTTPS support to http.server
type: enhancement
versions: Python 3.9

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Geodetic Development Kit

[Fred Killet]

Dear software developers,

here I post a hint for people who develop programs with geodetic functionality 
like coordinate transformations, datum shifts or distance calculations. For 
this you can easily include ready for use geodetic functions from my Geodetic 
Development Kit GeoDLL. The Dynamic Link Library can be used with almost all 
modern programming languages like C, C++, C#, Basic, Delphi, Pascal, Java, 
Fortran, xSharp, MS-Office and so on. Examples and interfaces are available for 
many programming languages.

GeoDLL is a professional Geodetic Development Kit or Geodetic Function Library 
for worldwide 2D and 3D coordinate transformations and datum shifts with 
highest accuracy. Also: Helmert and Molodensky parameters, NTv2, HARN, INSPIRE, 
EPSG, elevation model (DEM), distance and time zone calculation, meridian 
convergence and much more. GeoDLL is available as 32bit and 64bit DLL and as C 
/ C++ source code. 

The DLL is very fast, secure and compact thanks to the consistent development 
in C / C++ with Microsoft Visual Studio. The geodetic functions are available 
in 32bit and 64bit architecture. All functions are prepared for multithreading 
and server operating.

You find a free downloadable test version on 
https://www.killetsoft.de/p_gdla_e.htm
Notes about the NTv2 support can be found here: 
https://www.killetsoft.de/t_ntv2_e.htm
Report on the quality of the coordinate transformations: 
https://www.killetsoft.de/t_1705_e.htm 

Best regards and stay healthy!
Fred

Email: https://www.killetsoft.de/email.htm?lan=e=News

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[issue43620] os.path.join does not use os.sep as documentation claims

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

PR applied and backported; closing this.

Thanks, Jared!

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[issue43620] os.path.join does not use os.sep as documentation claims

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:


New changeset 455583b54aaec9a4266ff37dd438cbbd8ec6068a by Miss Islington (bot) 
in branch '3.8':
bpo-43620: Remove reference to os.sep from os.path.join() doc (GH-25025, 
GH-5030)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/455583b54aaec9a4266ff37dd438cbbd8ec6068a


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[issue43620] os.path.join does not use os.sep as documentation claims

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:


New changeset f311290f091957653bba5ebfda28ad981bb78363 by Miss Islington (bot) 
in branch '3.9':
bpo-43620: Remove reference to os.sep from os.path.join() doc (GH-25025) 
(#25027)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/f311290f091957653bba5ebfda28ad981bb78363


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[issue43620] os.path.join does not use os.sep as documentation claims

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:


New changeset 21a2cabb3795f5170c746ab8f29e9d25c7442550 by Jared Sutton in 
branch 'master':
bpo-43620: Remove reference to os.sep from os.path.join() doc (#25025)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/21a2cabb3795f5170c746ab8f29e9d25c7442550


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[issue43620] os.path.join does not use os.sep as documentation claims

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Just reviewed the documentation for both os.sep and os.path.join().

The os.sep docs do not suggest it can be set, and the reference in the 
os.path.join() description is silent regarding that, so can be read as Jared 
did.  I don't recall this coming up before, but... there's a lot I don't 
remember at this point.  --sigh--

Removing the reference to os.sep from the os.path.join() description would not 
be confusing, IMO.  Clearly, the ambiguity can bite.

I'd be open to a patch to remove the reference to os.sep from the 
os.path.join() docs.  Reopening, but removing 3.6 and 3.7 since they're in 
security-fix-only mode.

--
keywords: +easy
resolution: not a bug -> 
stage: resolved -> needs patch
status: closed -> open
versions:  -Python 3.6, Python 3.7

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[issue43620] os.path.join does not use os.sep as documentation claims

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Perhaps Jared was expecting that modifying os.sep would affect the functions in 
os.path?

os.sep was never intended to be updated.

Using the specific *path modules to work with "foreign" paths has long been 
advocated as the way to do this.  It isn't a work-around.

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[issue43353] Document that logging.getLevelName() can return a numeric value.

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:


New changeset 9bdb5802361016704fb3434369741cc6c5e08f02 by Mariusz Felisiak in 
branch '3.8':
bpo-43353: Document that logging.getLevelName() accepts string representation 
of logging level. (GH-24693) (#24825)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/9bdb5802361016704fb3434369741cc6c5e08f02


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[issue43353] Document that logging.getLevelName() can return a numeric value.

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Mariusz: Good point.  IMO, an insane API behavior, but a legacy we must live 
with.

No further objections from me.

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[issue43353] Document that logging.getLevelName() can return a numeric value.

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Just noticed this fly by in the stream of emails... sorry for not commenting 
earlier.

The patch seems to describe "Level #" as "numeric", which I would not be 
inclined to do.  It includes the numeric value since there's no available name 
for it, but as a value, it's still textual.

I'm referring specifically to the change here:
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/bbba28212ce0f58096a4043f32442c6e727b74fc#diff-1bf0ad6d121df3948853dafdd8e5406709fe0c3911b30e3cf2def41717455c98R121

Otherwise, I do believe this should be back-ported.

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[issue41111] [C API] Convert a few stdlib extensions to the limited C API (PEP 384)

[Fred Drake]

Change by Fred Drake :


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[issue39994] pprint handling of dict subclasses that override __repr__

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

And that is why the original code was checking not only for the type, but the 
actual __repr__ method itself.

I think the current behavior is broken.

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[issue39994] Redundant code in pprint module.

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Ah, good find!  It's been so long since the first version of that code, but the 
implementation was surprisingly nuanced.

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[issue39994] Redundant code in pprint module.

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Adding serhiy.storchaka to nosy list since it looks like he introduced the 
isinstance check on purpose (see bpo-23741).

Though bpo-23741 asserts that no behavior was changed with the patch applied 
then, reading through the change leads me to think this did change for cases 
like the MyDict example from iritkatriel.

The intent of the original code was that MyDict.__repr__ would be used; only 
the small handful of "known" reprs would be handled specially.

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[issue36207] robotsparser deny all with some rules

[Fred AYERS]

Fred AYERS  added the comment:

I tried this one http://gtxgamer.fr/robots.txt/;>http://gtxgamer.fr/robots.txt and it 
seems to work.

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[issue40065] py39: remove deprecation note for xml.etree.cElementTree

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

The Python 2.7 documentation was not clear that xml.etree.cElementTree was 
optional, so users who didn't dive into the implementation or build process 
could easily not have known unless someone with a more limited installation 
used their code.

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[issue40065] py39: remove deprecation note for xml.etree.cElementTree

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Same core problem (module removed with insufficient document update), but a 
different action is needed for 3.8 and 3.9.

When I started testing an application with 3.9 and found one of the 
dependencies broken because it was relying directly on xml.etree.cElementTree, 
I had to dig into the history to determine that it was removed intentionally.  
Updated documentation would have helped.

I did file an issue on the dependency as well:
https://github.com/boto/botocore/issues/2002

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[issue40065] py39: remove deprecation note for xml.etree.cElementTree

[Fred Drake]

New submission from Fred Drake :

Since xml.etree.cElementTree does not exist in Python 3.9, the statement that 
it's deprecated should be removed from the documentation.

--
assignee: docs@python
components: Documentation
keywords: easy
messages: 365016
nosy: docs@python, fdrake
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: py39: remove deprecation note for xml.etree.cElementTree
versions: Python 3.9

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[issue40064] py38: document xml.etree.cElementTree will be removed in 3.9

[Fred Drake]

Change by Fred Drake :


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[issue40064] py38: document xml.etree.cElementTree will be removed in 3.9

[Fred Drake]

Change by Fred Drake :


--
assignee: docs@python
components: Documentation
nosy: docs@python, fdrake
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: py38: document xml.etree.cElementTree will be removed in 3.9
versions: Python 3.8

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[issue39480] referendum reference is needlessly annoying

[Fred Drake]

Change by Fred Drake :


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[issue38351] Modernize email example from %-formatting to f-string

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

Thanks, Julien!

Sounds good to me; no reason for a PR addressing this specific issue to be held 
up once one becomes available.

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[issue38621] Bad decoding of encoded-words in unstructured email headers

[Fred Drake]

Change by Fred Drake :


--
resolution: fixed -> rejected
stage: resolved -> 

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[issue38621] Bad decoding of encoded-words in unstructured email headers

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

It turns out this was a problem in 3.7.4; Python 3.7.5 seems to have fixed this.

Sorry for the noise.

Guess it's time to update my application to use 3.7.5!

--
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stage:  -> resolved
status: open -> closed

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[issue38621] Bad decoding of encoded-words in unstructured email headers

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

This problem does not exist in Python 3.6 or Python 3.8; it appears to only 
exist in Python 3.7.

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[issue38619] [Doc] UUID.hex is lowercase

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

While I don't know Felipe's use case, I would expect the documentation to be 
clear that the representation won't change in the future so users will know 
that this can be relied on to generate keys into some other persistent 
structure.

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[issue38621] Bad decoding of encoded-words in unstructured email headers

[Fred Drake]

Fred Drake  added the comment:

It's worth noting that dealing with this header eventually causes the header 
parser to enter an infinite loop.

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[issue38621] Bad decoding of encoded-words in unstructured email headers

[Fred Drake]

New submission from Fred Drake :

I've encountered a problem parsing an email with this Subject: header:

Subject: Be sure to redeem your =?utf-8?Q?$?=201.71 credit card reward
 certificate by the end of the year

email._header_value_parser.get_unstructured defers to get_encoded_word, passing 
the argument

  '=?utf-8?Q?$?=201.71 credit card reward certificate by the end of the year'

get_encoded_word eventually calls email._encoded_words.decode with the argument

  '=?utf-8?Q?$?=201.71 credit card reward certificate by the end of the year?='

This doesn't seem right, but I'm unsure of the syntactic priority of =XX and ?= 
in this case.

The policy for this is email.policy.SMTP + email.policy.strict (not sure if 
that's ideal; I'm retrieving messages from mbox files and over IMAP).

--
assignee: r.david.murray
messages: 355564
nosy: barry, fdrake, r.david.murray
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: Bad decoding of encoded-words in unstructured email headers

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[issue38351] Modernize email example from %-formatting to f-string

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

I'd like to see consistent usage by default, with specific examples using the 
older forms as appropriate.  The use cases Raymond identified are worth 
discussing (and the tutorial may be a good place for this), and well as 
mentioned in the reference docs for the '%s' % x and ''.format() operations 
(and string.Template(), of course).

I would not like to see different syntaxes randomly applied to different 
examples that happen to involve formatting, but where that's not the emphasis.

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[issue38351] Modernize email example from %-formatting to f-string

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Definitely agree with Eric on this; code modernization is definitely on the 
risky side, so judicious updates are important. (Of course, not updating is 
also a risk, eventually. But not much of one in this case.)

This issue is really about whether the docs should be updated to use the newer 
syntax. In general, I think we should update the docs, and we've delayed long 
enough for the general application of f-strings.

There will be cases to be wary of, certainly. I'm thinking especially of calls 
to the logging methods, or anywhere else doing delayed formatting. (Not that I 
can think of others off the top of my head.)

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[issue38351] Modernize email example from %-formatting to f-string

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

I agree that it's less invasive and easier to review.

My question (and it's just that) is whether we've made a decision to prefer one 
formatting syntax over others (outside of examples discussing the formatting 
approaches themselves).

If a decision is made to prefer one over others, it's worth making that 
decision separately, and then using separate PRs to deal with updates to 
different parts of the docs.

Added Julien Palard to the issue; I'd value input on this.

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[issue38351] Modernize email example from %-formatting to f-string

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Does it make sense to change just one example?

I'm not sure what the long-term stance is on whether %-formatting should be 
replaced at this point, but shouldn't this be a matter of which string 
formatting approach we want overall, rather than adjusting only specific 
examples?

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[issue38255] Replace "method" with "attribute" in the description of super()

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue38255] Replace "method" with "attribute" in the description of super()

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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Won't Uninstall

[Fred Vincent]

Python 3.7.4 won’t uninstall, I have tried doing what I can such as going to 
the control panel and uninstalling the program there, but that did not work. 
Since I am unable to delete it I am unable to download a different version of 
python. How do I fix this and fully uninstall python?

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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[issue37741] importlib.metadata docs not showing up in the module index

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Provisional status should not cause a module or other API element to be omitted 
from the indexes.  So long as it's marked provisional where it's described, it 
should be locatable.

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[issue34226] cgi.parse_multipart() requires undocumented CONTENT-LENGTH in Python 3.7

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue14149] argparse: Document how to use argument names that are not Python identifiers

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


--
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[issue36705] Unexpected Behaviour of pprint.pprint

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Eric nailed it; pprint was not designed as a replacement for print, and was 
never intended to serve that purpose.

Rejecting as out of scope.

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[issue36532] Example of logging.formatter with new str.format style

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Good catch, Vinay!  Thanks.

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[issue36532] Example of logging.formatter with new str.format style

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue9883] minidom: AttributeError: DocumentFragment instance has no attribute 'writexml'

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Updated target to Python 3.8, since this has aged a bit.

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[issue36418] urllib.parse.*Result: support _replace for additional computed addresses

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue31822] Document that urllib.parse.{Defrag, Split, Parse}Result are namedtuples

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

To clarify: I'm not suggesting that an API expansion should be considered as 
part of this issue.

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[issue31822] Document that urllib.parse.{Defrag, Split, Parse}Result are namedtuples

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Unfortunately, when the implementation was migrated to use 
collections.namedtuple (a benefit), the _replace method wasn't extended to 
support the additional computed addresses for these types.

That would really be useful.

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[issue36138] Improve documentation about converting datetime.timedelta to scalars

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue35897] Support list as argument to .startswith()

[Fred .Flintstone]

Fred .Flintstone  added the comment:

A programmer want to instruct the computer to do something, without having to 
care about how it works.

Maybe the library could in the background convert the list to a tuple.

Like:
"foo".startswith(tuple(["food", "for", "fast"]))

But the programmer shouldn't have to worry about this. I have a list, I want to 
use the list. I shouldn't have to care about interpreter internals that have 
nothing to do with the intent of my code.

My code should clearly represent intent, not have boilerplate code or 
constructs to workaround interpreter internals.

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[issue35897] Support list as argument to .startswith()

[Fred .Flintstone]

New submission from Fred .Flintstone :

The "".startswith() method accepts a string or a tuple as a parameter.

Consider adding support for list as parameter.

Example:
"foo".startswith(["food", "for", "fast"])

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priority: normal
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status: open
title: Support list as argument to .startswith()
type: enhancement
versions: Python 3.6

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[issue35831] Format Spec example says limited to 3.1+ but works in 2.7

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

The 3.X docs generally don't refer to the 2.X series.

What that comment is pointing out is that leaving the field identifier out (the 
number inside the {...} placeholder syntax) was not in the 3.0, but added in 
3.1.

Unfortunately, I don't have a 3.0 interpreter available to show the exception 
that's raised.

No change is required.

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[issue33381] Incorrect documentation for strftime()/strptime() format code %f

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue11233] clarifying Availability: Unix

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

A PR for this would be good, and would certainly accelerate getting this 
accomplished.  Thanks, Cheryl!

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[issue34789] doc xml.sax.make_parser expects a list not just any sequence

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

The existing PR can be re-targeted to merge to a maintenance branch (I'd be 
inclined to merge manually, myself, but will have to check the current devguide 
to make sure that's still allowed).

A new PR can be made for the non-documentation fix for master.

My thought is that a PR is more about the patch than about the workflow; a 
different patch can be handled in a separate PR, and review & discussion are 
used to determine which PR should be applied where.

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[issue34789] doc xml.sax.make_parser expects a list not just any sequence

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

It probably makes more sense to keep that PR for the maintenance branches, and 
create a new branch / PR to land on master.

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[issue34789] doc xml.sax.make_parser expects a list not just any sequence

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

I'm just going to presume this issue has been around a long time, but I think 
that's a pretty safe presumption.

Accepting a general sequence instead of only a list would reasonable, and I'd 
support a fix that caused the code to accept a general sequence (or any 
iterable) by calling list() on the passed-in value, starting with 3.8.

The patch provided looks good for versions in maintenance.  (It would also be 
fine for 3.8 if there's no interest in generalizing the code to accept 
arbitrary iterables).

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[issue15474] Differentiate decorator and decorator factory in docs

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

I like Éric's terminology; giving a concrete name to the concept makes it a lot 
easier to grasp, and this doesn't require inventing any new component terms.

Andrés, if you'd like to tackle this, that's great!  I'd be happy to for you to 
bounce drafts through me if you like.

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[issue33869] doc Add set, frozen set, and tuple entries to Glossary

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue33832] Make "magic methods" a little more discoverable in the docs

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. :


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[issue33832] Make "magic methods" a little more discoverable in the docs

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Indeed, I did not.  Fixed now.  I hope.

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[issue33832] Make "magic methods" a little more discoverable in the docs

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

A quick grep on the 3.7 branch indicates that the standard documentation 
includes each of the terms "magic method" and "special method" about the same 
number of times.  (I didn't check for instances that wrapped lines.)

Perhaps we should decide on just one of these terms and fix references that use 
the other.  I agree this can be a source of confusion, but having two terms for 
the same concept is a bug.

I don't think we need to change references to "the __something__ method", 
because those are specific.  We only need to decide on and consistently use the 
categorical term for these methods when referring to the entire category.

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[issue33274] minidom removeAttributeNode returns None

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

> I saw what looked to me like a bug that's been in the code for 18 years,
> and I saw that it was a simple fix.

And you're right:  It is a bug, the fix is simple, and the risk is low.

Ten years ago, I'd have probably just landed the fix on all applicable branches 
and moved on.  But the longer something stays the same (like you said, for 18 
years now), the more surprising a fix can be when something (however foolishly 
and unlikely it seems) relied on the old, broken behavior falls apart because 
of the change.

Please don't think we don't appreciate your contribution; we do.  I hope you'll 
continue to be observant and catch bugs (even little ones!), and provide fixes.

Feel free to reach out if you'd like to discuss this further.

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[issue33274] minidom removeAttributeNode returns None

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:


New changeset 5bfa058e65897567889354d7eb34af2b93a20f18 by Fred Drake 
(arikrupnik) in branch 'master':
bpo-33274: Compliance with DOM L1: return removed attribute (#7465)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/5bfa058e65897567889354d7eb34af2b93a20f18


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[issue33274] minidom removeAttributeNode returns None

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

I should stop relying on wetware memory; it's not working out.  Sorry for the 
mis-information.

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[issue33274] minidom removeAttributeNode returns None

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr.  added the comment:

Python 2.7 is in security-fix-only mode, and this doesn't fit that.  While I 
wouldn't object to a note in the documentation, see my comments in my patch 
review (there's just no place for it to go).

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[issue33274] minidom removeAttributeNode returns None

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com> added the comment:

While I've no strong objection to updating to follow the specification, I also 
don't see any real value here.  The current minidom implementation has been 
considered sufficient for many years now (if you consider the DOM desirable at 
all), so the lack of conformance with the W3C spec doesn't seem significant in 
practice.

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[issue1644818] Allow built-in packages and submodules as well as top-level modules

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com>:


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[issue32706] test_check_hostname() of test_ftplib started to fail randomly

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com>:


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[issue32143] os.statvfs lacks f_fsid

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com> added the comment:

This has landed on master and will be part of Python 3.7.

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[issue32143] os.statvfs lacks f_fsid

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com> added the comment:


New changeset 96a5e50a5de3683b2afd6d680c7ecc4b525986f6 by Fred Drake (Giuseppe 
Scrivano) in branch 'master':
bpo-32143: add f_fsid to os.statvfs() (#4571)
https://github.com/python/cpython/commit/96a5e50a5de3683b2afd6d680c7ecc4b525986f6


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[issue32143] os.statvfs lacks f_fsid

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com> added the comment:

I think Giuseppe's patch is good, but there's a Windows failure on AppVeyor, so 
I'm a little wary. It doesn't look related, but I haven't looked at Python on 
Windows since... 2001, maybe?

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[issue32143] os.statvfs lacks f_fsid

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com>:


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[issue31803] Remove not portable time.clock(), replaced by time.perf_counter() and time.process_time()

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com>:


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[issue31766] Python 3.5 missing from documentation

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com> added the comment:

The 3.5 docs should really remain in the main docs UI via the pulldown as long 
as it's so widely used.  The fact that it won't be changing much just means it 
can be served efficiently.

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[issue29400] Add instruction level tracing via sys.settrace

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Change by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com>:


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Re: A question on modification of a list via a function invocation

[Fred Stluka]

Here is my attempt to clarify the situation with some ascii graphics.
(Well, not ascii, but utf-8 box-drawing characters — I hope they come 
through ok.

And, of curse, it won't display properly with a proportional font.)

Here's a VERY useful tool for understanding/explaining/drawing
such code snippets:
- http://pythontutor.com

At the "Edit code" link, you can type/paste your own Python
statements and have the tool single-step though them.  At each
step, it draws the data structures with values, links to other data
structures, etc.  A great Python visualization tool!

Enjoy!
--Fred
----
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Bristle Software, Inc -- http://bristle.com -- Glad to be of service!
Open Source: Without walls and fences, we need no Windows or Gates.


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[issue31055] All Sphinx generated pages could have a new "Edit This Page" link adjacent to the existing "Show Source"

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. added the comment:

On Thu, Jul 27, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Fred L. Drake, Jr.
<rep...@bugs.python.org> wrote:
> If the link went to an edit form with the version of the content the
> user was reading,
> and includes an explanation of the multiple-versions issue, it might
> prove reasonable

Egads, look at that formatting!

Somedays I miss my VT-100 terminals and sane line handling.

  -Fred

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[issue31055] All Sphinx generated pages could have a new "Edit This Page" link adjacent to the existing "Show Source"

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. added the comment:

On Thu, Jul 27, 2017 at 1:03 PM, Mariatta Wijaya <rep...@bugs.python.org> wrote:
> I don't think we should add this link.
>
> When we make edits to the docs, even simple typo fixes, it should first be 
> done
> in the master branch, instead of the maintenance branches (e.g. 2.7, 3.5 or 
> 3.6).
>
> If "Edit This Page" link takes you to edit the documentation in branches other
> than "master", that's not desirable workflow.
>
> If "Edit This Page" link takes you to edit the master branch, it can be 
> confusing
> to the contributor since the content on "master" might be different.

I wonder if a better solution lies somewhere between the original
suggestion and just
not including such a link.

If the link went to an edit form with the version of the content the
user was reading,
and includes an explanation of the multiple-versions issue, it might
prove reasonable
to try applying the diff between the modified and original text to the
HEADs of each
maintenance branch.  If the diff doesn't apply, the (possibly new)
contributor can be
offered a chance to deal with edits to each version (which might be a bit much).

At any rate, the diff could be used to construct a temporary branch,
b.p.o issue, and
PR. This would allow us to provide the contributor with a way to see
that their suggested
changes are being considered, and we're less likely to lose them in a
wall of email.

There'd be a bit of work to make all this play out, though.

  -Fred

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Re: Access flles on a Android device from Windows PC (Posting On Python-List Prohibited)

[Fred Fishbin]

Lawrence_D?Oliveiro <lawrenced...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Thursday, June 8, 2017 at 3:41:35 PM UTC+12, Fred Fishbin wrote:
>> Yup, that seems to be the deal, and there doesn't seem tpo be a really 
>>simple 
>> way to deal with this.
>
>The preferred way to do file transfers to/from Android devices over USB seems 
>to be via MTP nowadays <https://github.com/ldo/mtpy>.

Excellent!  Exactly what I was looking for!

thank you, Freddie
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Re: Access flles on a Android device from Windows PC (Posting On Python-List Prohibited)

[Fred Fishbin]

Lawrence_D?Oliveiro <lawrenced...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Thursday, June 8, 2017 at 3:41:35 PM UTC+12, Fred Fishbin wrote:
>> Yup, that seems to be the deal, and there doesn't seem tpo be a really 
>>simple 
>> way to deal with this.
>
>The preferred way to do file transfers to/from Android devices over USB seems 
>to be via MTP nowadays <https://github.com/ldo/mtpy>.

Excellent!  Exactly what I was looking for!

thank you, Freddie
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Re: Access flles on a Android device from Windows PC

[Fred Fishbin]

Um, no.  I *now* understand that USB Mass drive is no longer supported, but it 
was a legit question.

I'd still love if someone could post a code sample, or point me in the 
direction to a code snippet that would show me how to access the phone.  I know 
it can be done, its just not simple anymore.

Freddie

wxjmfa...@gmail.com wrote:
Le mardi 6 juin 2017 21:37:24 UTC+2, Fred Fishbin a écrit :
>> Hi
>> 
>> I want to write little program that my friend can run - he'll plug a USB 
>>drive 
>> into his Windows 7 PC, plug his phone in a USB port on same PC, then run my 
>> program and it'll xfer some audiobook files over for him.
>> 
>> I plugged the USB drive in and it became "G:\", but the phone plugged in and 
>> became just "SAMSUNG-SM-G930V", no drive designation, just a Portable Media 
>> Device.  Windows Explore can go there so the files are accessible, the phone 
>> isn't looking him out, but what do I use for a path?  I tried several 
>>different 
>> listdir()'s nothing worked.
>> 
>> Thoughts?
>> 
>> thanks, Freddie
>
>I hope your mounted external device is full of file names
>with plenty of Emojis...
>It will be very funny.

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Re: New to Python - Career question

[Fred Stluka]

   On 6/6/17 5:39 PM, [1]pta...@gmail.com wrote:

 New to Python and have been at it for about a month now. I'm doing well and 
like it very much. Considering a career change down the road and have been 
wondering... What are the job prospects for a middle age entry level 
programmer. Just trying to get a better understanding where I stand career 
wise.  Appreciate all feed back. Thanks!

   Are you asking about job prospects based on experience with Python
   vs other languages?

   If so, here's a site that shows the relative demand for various
   programming languages over time.  Based on its huge database of
   job listings.  Also shows the relative supply of programmers in
   various languages over time.  You can specify which languages
   or other marketable skills to show in the graph:
   -
   
[2]https://www.indeed.com/jobtrends/q-python-q-ruby-q-php-q-javascript-q-java-q-perl.html

   Hope this helps,
   --Fred

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References

   Visible links
   1. mailto:pta...@gmail.com
   2. 
https://www.indeed.com/jobtrends/q-python-q-ruby-q-php-q-javascript-q-java-q-perl.html
   3. mailto:f...@bristle.com
   4. http://bristle.com/~fred/
   5. http://bristle.com/
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Re: Access flles on a Android device from Windows PC << YES! Thanks

[Fred Fishbin]

Yup, that seems to be the deal, and there doesn't seem tpo be a really simple 
way to deal with this.  ...but at least I know what I need to look for.

thanks!  Freddie

eryk sun <eryk...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Tue, Jun 6, 2017 at 7:36 PM, Fred Fishbin <fredfish...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I want to write little program that my friend can run - he'll plug a USB 
>>drive
>> into his Windows 7 PC, plug his phone in a USB port on same PC, then run my
>> program and it'll xfer some audiobook files over for him.
>>
>> I plugged the USB drive in and it became "G:\", but the phone plugged in and
>> became just "SAMSUNG-SM-G930V", no drive designation, just a Portable Media
>> Device.  Windows Explore can go there so the files are accessible, the phone
>> isn't looking him out, but what do I use for a path?  I tried several 
>>different
>> listdir()'s nothing worked.
>
>The shell is probably mounting the device via the Windows Portable
>Devices (WPD) API. It isn't mounted as a USB disk with a file system,
>so it won't be assigned a drive letter that you can simply use via
>file-system APIs such as open (CreateFile), listdir (FindFirstFile),
>etc. You can look into using WPD Automation via win32com [1]. I
>haven't used WPD, so I can't offer specific help.
>
>https://msdn.microsoft.com/library/dd389295

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Access flles on a Android device from Windows PC

[Fred Fishbin]

Hi

I want to write little program that my friend can run - he'll plug a USB drive 
into his Windows 7 PC, plug his phone in a USB port on same PC, then run my 
program and it'll xfer some audiobook files over for him.

I plugged the USB drive in and it became "G:\", but the phone plugged in and 
became just "SAMSUNG-SM-G930V", no drive designation, just a Portable Media 
Device.  Windows Explore can go there so the files are accessible, the phone 
isn't looking him out, but what do I use for a path?  I tried several different 
listdir()'s nothing worked.

Thoughts?

thanks, Freddie
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Re: Emacs command to select only lines indented below a specified level

[Fred Stluka]

Ben,

Excellent answer!  Thanks!

--Fred

Fred Stluka -- mailto:f...@bristle.com -- http://bristle.com/~fred/
Bristle Software, Inc -- http://bristle.com -- Glad to be of service!
Open Source: Without walls and fences, we need no Windows or Gates.


On 5/23/17 6:46 PM, Ben Finney wrote:

Fred Stluka <f...@bristle.com> writes:


On 5/23/17 4:43 PM, Ben Finney wrote:


The ‘set-selective-display’ command […] is bound to ‘C-x $’ in
default Emacs.

How do I specify the number of columns when using "C-x $"?

You will remember, from doing the Emacs tutorial when you first learned
Emacs, that all commands have a “prefix argument” available
<URL:https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/PrefixArgument> that the command
can use to modify its behaviour.

So, use the prefix argument to specify the number of columns for
‘set-selective-display’.

E.g.:

 M-9 C-x $  # Indentation >= 9 disappears.
 C-u C-x $  # Indentation >= 4 disappears.
 C-u 1 3 C-x $  # Indentation >= 13 disappears.
 C-u C-u C-u $  # Indentation >= 64 disappears.
 C-x $  # All lines reappear.

etc.


Same for using the command at the M-x prompt. I type "M-x" and see the
M-x prompt, then then type "set-selective-display" using tab to
autocomplete it. But I can't then type a column number after a space
or in parens or anything. What am I missing?

Time to work through the Emacs tutorial again; ‘C-h t’ :-)



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Re: Scala considering significant indentation like Python

[Fred Stluka]

On 5/23/17 4:43 PM, Ben Finney wrote:


The ‘set-selective-display’ command will collapse the current buffer's
text to lines indented to the specified number of columns; the same
command with no argument will expand the buffer to normal again. The
command is bound to ‘C-x $’ in default Emacs.

Ben,

How do I specify the number of columns when using "C-x $"?  It
doesn't prompt, and doesn't seem to take the current column of
the cursor position into account.  Just echoes:
selective-display set to nil.

Same for using the command at the M-x prompt.  I type "M-x"
and see the M-x prompt, then then type "set-selective-display"
using tab to autocomplete it.  But I can't then type a column
number after a space or in parens or anything.  What am I missing?

Thanks,
--Fred
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Bristle Software, Inc -- http://bristle.com -- Glad to be of service!
Open Source: Without walls and fences, we need no Windows or Gates.



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[issue9883] minidom: AttributeError: DocumentFragment instance has no attribute 'writexml'

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. added the comment:

I agree that writexml should be available for document fragments.

I doubt the additional level of indentation should be added, as you've included 
in point 2.

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[issue29996] Use terminal width by default in pprint

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. added the comment:

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's never come up; it's something I've thought 
about a number of times, and I've waffled on it a few times.

It's not fundamentally unreasonable to want it to adapt to the current terminal 
window, though I think it would be in a minority among the Unix command line 
tools that I use.

Raymond's point about potentially confusing students is an important one, 
though.  If adaptive behavior is sufficiently desirable, the module should 
check the value of an environment variable, and default to the current 
behavior.  PYTHONADAPTIVEPPRINT ?

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[issue29996] Use terminal width by default in pprint

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Fred L. Drake, Jr. added the comment:

This is not a problem for doctests, since the output stream is not a terminal; 
the check for terminal-ness seems reasonable.  (Though I don't have any idea if 
it works on Windows, but it seems properly factored.)

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[issue29997] Suggested changes for https://docs.python.org/3.6/extending/extending.html

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Changes by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com>:


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[issue27879] add os.syncfs()

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Changes by Fred L. Drake, Jr. <fdr...@gmail.com>:


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