Re: The Importance of Terminology's Quality

2008-05-31 Thread Peter Duniho

On Sat, 31 May 2008 23:27:35 -0700, szr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


[...]

But the subthread Lew commente don was about Perl and Unix. That is
clearly off topic.


I agree with and understand what you are saying in general, but still,
isn't it possible that were are people in the java group (and others)
who might of been following the thread, only to discover (probably not
right away) that someone decided to remove the group they were reading
the thread from? I know I would not like that, even if it wasn't on
topic at the branch.


All due respect, I don't really care if those people find the thread  
gone.  And no one should.


Each individual person has a wide variety of interests.  A thread that is  
off-topic in a newsgroup may in fact be concerning a topic of interest for  
someone who just happened to be reading that newsgroup.  The fact that  
that person might have been interested in it isn't justification for  
continuing the thread in that newsgroup.  The most important question  
isn't who might have been reading the thread, but rather whether the  
thread is on-topic.


What if someone cross-posted a thread about motorcycle racing in the Perl  
newsgroup as well as an actual motorcycle racing newsgroup?  No doubt, at  
least some people reading the Perl newsgroup have an interest in  
motorcycle racing.  They may in fact be racers themselves.  Those people  
may have found the thread about motorcycle racing interesting.


Does that justify the thread continuing to be cross-posted to the Perl  
newsgroup?  No, of course not.


So please.  Quit trying to justify a thread being cross-posted to a  
newsgroup that you aren't even reading just on the sole basis of the  
remote possibility that someone in that newsgroup was interested in the  
thread.  It's not a legitimate justification, and even if it were, there's  
been sufficient opportunity for someone here in the Java newsgroup to  
speak up and say "hey, wait!  I was reading that!"


But no one's said anything of the sort.  Those people who don't exist have  
no need for you to provide an irrelevant defense for them.



Personally, I find it very annoying to have to switch news groups in
order to resume a thread and weed my way down the thread to where it
left off before it was cut off from the previous group.


If people use the newsgroups responsibly, that never happens.

A thread should never be cut-off midstream like that unless it was  
inappropriately cross-posted in the first place, and if the thread was  
inappropriately cross-posted in the first place, no one has any business  
expecting to be able to continue reading it in any newsgroup where it's  
off-topic.


If you're interested in discussions on Perl and Unix, go read a newsgroup  
about Perl and/or Unix.  Don't look for those discussions in the Java  
newsgroup, and don't get comfy reading the thread in the Java newsgroup  
should you happen across it.  They don't belong, and they should be  
terminated within the Java newsgroup ASAP.  Go follow the thread where  
it's on-topic.


Pete
--
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Re: The Importance of Terminology's Quality

2008-05-31 Thread Peter Duniho

On Fri, 30 May 2008 22:40:03 -0700, szr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


Arne Vajhøj wrote:

Stephan Bour wrote:

Lew wrote:
} John Thingstad wrote:
} > Perl is solidly based in the UNIX world on awk, sed, bash and C.
} > I don't like the style, but many do.
}
} Please exclude the Java newsgroups from this discussion.

Did it ever occur to you that you don't speak for entire news groups?


Did it occur to you that there are nothing about Java in the above ?


Looking at the original post, it doesn't appear to be about any specific
language.


Indeed.  That suggests it's probably off-topic in most, if not all, of the  
newsgroups to which it was posted, inasmuch as they exist for topics  
specific to a given programming language.


Regardless, unless you are actually reading this thread from the c.l.j.p  
newsgroup, I'm not sure I see the point in questioning someone who _is_  
about whether the thread belongs there or not.  Someone who is actually  
following the thread from c.l.j.p can speak up if they feel that Lew is  
overstepping his bounds.  Anyone else has even less justification for  
"speaking for the entire newsgroup" than Lew does, and yet that's what  
you're doing when you question his request.


And if it's a vote you want, mark me down as the third person reading  
c.l.j.p that doesn't feel this thread belongs.  I don't know whether Lew  
speaks for the entire newsgroup, but based on comments so far, it's pretty  
clear that there unanimous agreement among those who have expressed an  
opinion.


If you all in the other newsgroups are happy having the thread there,  
that's great.  Please feel free to continue with your discussion.  But  
please, drop comp.lang.java.programmer from the cross-posting.


Pete
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