Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
rantingrick rantingr...@gmail.com wrote: Actually i see you point but there is a good reason behind me bringing this up here. I want to bring to the attention of everyone how little interest there is for Tkinter. Right. You have no interest in resolving this issue and instead want to use it as more ammunition in your ongoing crusade. You even have the gall to act _offended_ at Giampaolo's suggestion that you log the bug, dumping your usual bullshit and vitriol on someone WHO HAS ACTUALLY DONE THE SORT OF WORK YOU CONSTANTLY CLAIM YOU'RE GOING TO, even though your every intention was to parade this issue around as if it somehow validates your personal blend of crazy. You're a class act, that's for sure. Agreed. However i would rather just write a patch, send it to some email and be done. Or just commit the changes myself. This bug tracker is just bureaucracy at it's worst. You are making this process too hard and people are not going to get involved when they have to jump through 20 hoops just to patch three lines of freaking code! Because complex distributed coding projects should be treated like Wikipedia? It must suck being such a genius and yet be unable to grapple with a simple bug tracker... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 12:34 AM, rantingrick rantingr...@gmail.com wrote: Well i tried searching for Tkinter issues on the tracker and just got annoyed quickly and left. It seems far to complicated to do searches with this software. You should apply some of the persistence that you show on the mailing list to the problem! Go to http://bugs.python.org On the left hand side, there's a link to the search page (listed just below Issues). Click that. Find the list box labeled Components and select Tkinter from the drop down. Click Search. Bob's your uncle! -- Jerry -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
2011/1/26 rantingrick rantingr...@gmail.com: I just installed Python 3,0 on my machine. I cannot use 3.0 exclusively yet however i was interested in just poking around and acquiring a taste if you will. I was happy to find that the new Tkinter module names now follow convention and are placed correctly... example: tkinter.simpledialog However some things never change it seems and some improvements are actually a step backwards. The same problems with the unit test in 2.x got ported to 3.x. And the new SimpleDialog is just more lackluster code like we've seen before. I was hoping to be amazed, i am disappointed and disgusted. It is obvious that whoever is writing/ maintaining the tkinter code base does NOT understand tkinter completely and this is blinding apparent by reading the source code! --- Issues --- First lets start with the problems that migrated from 2.x... (tkinter.simpledialog) #-- ISSUE 1 --# In the test() function we still have code that uses the quit method instead of destroy. Calling the quit method only tells Tkinter to stop processing events, IT DOES NOT DESTROY THE WIDGET!! And on windows the the root will then become unresponsive -- you cannot close the window, you cannot do anything. I have said time and time again. DO NOT USE THE QUIT METHOD UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT THE HECK YOU ARE DOING! So the code needs to be this... OLD: q = Button(root, text='Quit', command=t.quit) NEW: q = Button(root, text='Quit', command=root.destroy) #-- ISSUE 2: --# The author used a very strange method by which to denote the default button in the SimpleDialog class. He choose to set the relief to RIDGE and the border 8. This not only looks horrible (and exposes the authors ignorance of tkinter) but a much more elegant solution is provided by the TclTk folks. All buttons have a default option that will display the button with a nice border so the user can visually see which button is active. So the code should be this OLD: if num == default: b.config(relief=RIDGE, borderwidth=8) NEW: if num == default: b.config(default=ACTIVE) Last but not least i am puzzled as to why we choose the method name go over show. for showing the dialog. SimpleDialog uses no inheritance so name clashes are mum. Why would anyone choose go over show for a modal dialog? I would really like an explanation for this. Other minor issues exists. I may describe them later. At this time we need to fix these grave abominations first. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list Why don't you file a ticket on the bug tracker instead of wasting yours and other people's time here by making appear another rant against Tkinter as a bug report? It's been 3 days in a row you've been doing this. Aren't you tired? Seriously! This has come to not even being a rant anymore. It's just nonsense. --- Giampaolo http://code.google.com/p/pyftpdlib/ http://code.google.com/p/psutil/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Jan 28, 8:52 am, Giampaolo Rodolà g.rod...@gmail.com wrote: Why don't you file a ticket on the bug tracker instead of wasting yours and other people's time here by making appear another rant against Tkinter as a bug report? Why don't you instead thank me for helping out instead of jumping to irate conclusions? It would *seem* that if YOU cared about the future of Python you would be more *accepting* of my help. [...snip: shameless plugs...] Oh, i see why you dropped by; First to score some points on my behalf and then to plug your own software. Interesting. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 3:24 PM, rantingrick rantingr...@gmail.com wrote: On Jan 28, 8:52 am, Giampaolo Rodolà g.rod...@gmail.com wrote: Why don't you file a ticket on the bug tracker instead of wasting yours and other people's time here by making appear another rant against Tkinter as a bug report? Why don't you instead thank me for helping out instead of jumping to irate conclusions? It would *seem* that if YOU cared about the future of Python you would be more *accepting* of my help. It's not that people don't appreciate your help. It's that the mailing list is not the appropriate place for this type of discussion. Once it's been verified as a bug, you should create a ticket on the bug tracker, come back here and post a link, and then move the discussion over to the tracker. Even if you intend to fix it yourself, you should create a ticket and then attach the patch to the ticket when you fix it. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 3:24 PM, rantingrick rantingr...@gmail.com wrote: Why don't you instead thank me for helping out instead of jumping to irate conclusions? It would *seem* that if YOU cared about the future of Python you would be more *accepting* of my help. But you have not, in fact, helped out. You've complained to a mailing list of python users that you've found some bugs. If you want to help out, you need to file issues on the bug tracker for bugs that you've found. If you want to be extra helpful, you'll also attach patches to those bug reports. It really isn't difficult, but you don't seem to be willing to do it. Until you do, all you're doing is ranting, not helping. -- Jerry -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Jan 28, 2:34 pm, Benjamin Kaplan benjamin.kap...@case.edu wrote: It's not that people don't appreciate your help. First: Thanks for the reasonable response. It's that the mailing list is not the appropriate place for this type of discussion. Actually i see you point but there is a good reason behind me bringing this up here. I want to bring to the attention of everyone how little interest there is for Tkinter. Not many folks are using Tkinter, most hate Tkinter, and not many (if any) are capable of patching the Tkinter source code. It has been mentioned in this thread that the last person to do any real work on Tkinter is someone from two years ago. This is insanity! You know why i think nobody cares.. * Too much trouble to get patches submitted. * Nobody really cares at py-dev so the patches never get resolved. * There is resistance in the community to outsiders. This mentality is setting us up for a bad bad future. Why are people so pedantic and emotional. Python does not belong to me, or you, or anybody. This is a team effort. And whist we need people doing work we also need to listen to the community. I have had nothing but an uphill battle dealing with a few elites on this list. Anybody can see that i am serious about helping out. Heck, i want Tkinter to be removed from the stdlib but yet i still offer help to noobies and still report bugs. Once it's been verified as a bug, you should create a ticket on the bug tracker, come back here and post a link, and then move the discussion over to the tracker. Agreed. However i would rather just write a patch, send it to some email and be done. Or just commit the changes myself. This bug tracker is just bureaucracy at it's worst. You are making this process too hard and people are not going to get involved when they have to jump through 20 hoops just to patch three lines of freaking code! There is too much red tape here. I COULD HAVE PATCHED HUNDREDS OF LINE OF CODE IN THE TIME I HAVE WASTED WITH THE BUG TRACKER PROCESS ALONE! I understand we need checks and balances but at some point the very safety net we rely on becomes a noose around our neck! Something needs to be done! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Jan 26, 3:57 pm, Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote: On 1/26/2011 11:53 AM, rantingrick wrote: To answer your other post, one of the main people to touch tkinter in the last 3 years was Guilherme Polo, who worked on it during and after a Google Summer of Code project. He does not seen to be active currently. There are currently 63 open issues on the tracker listing tkinter as a component. There are probably a few that could be closed. When I have learned more, I should be able to review any patched sitting around. Well i tried searching for Tkinter issues on the tracker and just got annoyed quickly and left. It seems far to complicated to do searches with this software. Anyhoo, i did find the most current version of tksimpledialog.py and sure enough all the issues i have documented have been ported into this new version. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
I just installed Python 3,0 on my machine. I cannot use 3.0 exclusively yet however i was interested in just poking around and acquiring a taste if you will. I was happy to find that the new Tkinter module names now follow convention and are placed correctly... example: tkinter.simpledialog However some things never change it seems and some improvements are actually a step backwards. The same problems with the unit test in 2.x got ported to 3.x. And the new SimpleDialog is just more lackluster code like we've seen before. I was hoping to be amazed, i am disappointed and disgusted. It is obvious that whoever is writing/ maintaining the tkinter code base does NOT understand tkinter completely and this is blinding apparent by reading the source code! --- Issues --- First lets start with the problems that migrated from 2.x... (tkinter.simpledialog) #-- ISSUE 1 --# In the test() function we still have code that uses the quit method instead of destroy. Calling the quit method only tells Tkinter to stop processing events, IT DOES NOT DESTROY THE WIDGET!! And on windows the the root will then become unresponsive -- you cannot close the window, you cannot do anything. I have said time and time again. DO NOT USE THE QUIT METHOD UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT THE HECK YOU ARE DOING! So the code needs to be this... OLD: q = Button(root, text='Quit', command=t.quit) NEW: q = Button(root, text='Quit', command=root.destroy) #-- ISSUE 2: --# The author used a very strange method by which to denote the default button in the SimpleDialog class. He choose to set the relief to RIDGE and the border 8. This not only looks horrible (and exposes the authors ignorance of tkinter) but a much more elegant solution is provided by the TclTk folks. All buttons have a default option that will display the button with a nice border so the user can visually see which button is active. So the code should be this OLD: if num == default: b.config(relief=RIDGE, borderwidth=8) NEW: if num == default: b.config(default=ACTIVE) Last but not least i am puzzled as to why we choose the method name go over show. for showing the dialog. SimpleDialog uses no inheritance so name clashes are mum. Why would anyone choose go over show for a modal dialog? I would really like an explanation for this. Other minor issues exists. I may describe them later. At this time we need to fix these grave abominations first. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On 1/26/2011 8:00 AM rantingrick said... I just installed Python 3,0 on my machine. Try it again on the current release candidate -- http://www.python.org/download/releases/3.2/ -- testing old first release code and reporting on its problems won't get any traction. Verify the problem continues to exist in the current maintained version and then ask. If you get confirmation that the behavior is likely a bug, file a bug report so those who can and do can do (or at least consider). See http://docs.python.org/bugs.html http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0003/ Emile -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Jan 26, 10:43 am, Emile van Sebille em...@fenx.com wrote: On 1/26/2011 8:00 AM rantingrick said... I just installed Python 3,0 on my machine. Try it again on the current release candidate --http://www.python.org/download/releases/3.2/-- testing old first Seehttp://docs.python.org/bugs.htmlhttp://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0003/ Why would i want to waste bandwidth downloading an RC? Can i not just browse the source online? I only need to check one module. Where is the source available for viewing simpledialog online? Thanks PS: The version i have now is 3.1.1 (but i would like to see the newest version available, just not download it!) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:53 AM, rantingrick rantingr...@gmail.com wrote: On Jan 26, 10:43 am, Emile van Sebille em...@fenx.com wrote: On 1/26/2011 8:00 AM rantingrick said... I just installed Python 3,0 on my machine. Try it again on the current release candidate --http://www.python.org/download/releases/3.2/-- testing old first Seehttp://docs.python.org/bugs.htmlhttp://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0003/ Why would i want to waste bandwidth downloading an RC? Can i not just browse the source online? I only need to check one module. Where is the source available for viewing simpledialog online? Thanks PS: The version i have now is 3.1.1 (but i would like to see the newest version available, just not download it!) The code is hosted on http://svn.python.org If you just one that one file, it's at http://svn.python.org/view/python/trunk/Lib/lib-tk/tkSimpleDialog.py?view=markup -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 11:53 AM, rantingrick rantingr...@gmail.com wrote: Why would i want to waste bandwidth downloading an RC? Can i not just browse the source online? If I understand what you're asking for, the answer is http://svn.python.org/view . If you're specifically looking for 3.2rc1, then I believe you could look at http://svn.python.org/view/python/tags/r32rc1/ I only need to check one module. Where is the source available for viewing simpledialog online? Again, assuming you're looking for the 3.2rc1 code in particular: http://svn.python.org/view/python/tags/r32rc1/Lib/tkinter/simpledialog.py?view=markup -- Jerry -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
However some things never change it seems and some improvements are actually a step backwards. The same problems with the unit test in 2.x got ported to 3.x. And the new SimpleDialog is just more lackluster code like we've seen before. I was hoping to be amazed, i am disappointed and disgusted. It is obvious that whoever is writing/ maintaining the tkinter code base does NOT understand tkinter completely and this is blinding apparent by reading the source code! --- Issues --- First lets start with the problems that migrated from 2.x... (tkinter.simpledialog) #-- ISSUE 1 --# In the test() function we still have code that uses the quit method instead of destroy. Calling the quit method only tells Tkinter to stop processing events, IT DOES NOT DESTROY THE WIDGET!! And on windows the the root will then become unresponsive -- you cannot close the window, you cannot do anything. I have said time and time again. DO NOT USE THE QUIT METHOD UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT THE HECK YOU ARE DOING! So the code needs to be this... OLD: q = Button(root, text='Quit', command=t.quit) NEW: q = Button(root, text='Quit', command=root.destroy) #-- ISSUE 2: --# The author used a very strange method by which to denote the default button in the SimpleDialog class. He choose to set the relief to RIDGE and the border 8. This not only looks horrible (and exposes the authors ignorance of tkinter) but a much more elegant solution is provided by the TclTk folks. All buttons have a default option that will display the button with a nice border so the user can visually see which button is active. So the code should be this OLD: if num == default: b.config(relief=RIDGE, borderwidth=8) NEW: if num == default: b.config(default=ACTIVE) Last but not least i am puzzled as to why we choose the method name go over show. for showing the dialog. SimpleDialog uses no inheritance so name clashes are mum. Why would anyone choose go over show for a modal dialog? I would really like an explanation for this. Sounds like you need to help by: Creating a bug report Attaching a patch Thanks for the help, Rick. Nick -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Jan 26, 11:55 am, Benjamin Kaplan benjamin.kap...@case.edu wrote: The code is hosted onhttp://svn.python.org Thanks! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On Jan 26, 11:55 am, Benjamin Kaplan benjamin.kap...@case.edu wrote: [...snip...] Well i should have looked before i leaped :) This looks like an old 2.x version. I am looking for the newest version with is renamed to simpledialog and contains a new class called SimpleDialog. Do you know were i can view this module? Thanks again. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Bugs/issues in tkinter.simpledialog!!
On 1/26/2011 11:53 AM, rantingrick wrote: To answer your other post, one of the main people to touch tkinter in the last 3 years was Guilherme Polo, who worked on it during and after a Google Summer of Code project. He does not seen to be active currently. There are currently 63 open issues on the tracker listing tkinter as a component. There are probably a few that could be closed. When I have learned more, I should be able to review any patched sitting around. On Jan 26, 10:43 am, Emile van Sebilleem...@fenx.com wrote: On 1/26/2011 8:00 AM rantingrick said... I just installed Python 3,0 on my machine. Try it again on the current release candidate --http://www.python.org/download/releases/3.2/-- testing old first Seehttp://docs.python.org/bugs.htmlhttp://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0003/ Why would i want to waste bandwidth downloading an RC? Can i not just browse the source online? I only need to check one module. Where is the source available for viewing simpledialog online? Thanks PS: The version i have now is 3.1.1 (but i would like to see the newest version available, just not download it!) I was hoping you meant 3.1.something, not 3.0. Latest is 3.1.3. 3.2c2 will be out very soon, and 3.2 2 weeks after if no problems arise. As far as the doc and stdlib go, 3.2 is probably one of the most improved releases ever, as they got almost all the attention with no syntax changes allowed. When it is out, I will strongly recommend upgrading, absent a really good reason not to. (but i would like to see the newest version available, just not download it!) http://svn.python.org/view/python/branches/py3k/Lib/tkinter/simpledialog.py?revision=81010view=markup go back up a step and you can look at the log of changes. For current python 3 in general: http://svn.python.org/view/python/branches/py3k/ If you install TortoiseSVN, it is trivial to download the whole source tree. I believe you could also just download a subtree, like the tkinter and/or idlelib subtrees. Sometime after 3.2 is out, we will move from svn to hg and above will change. -- Terry Jan Reedy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
