Re: Pythons Ladders
On Feb 27, 10:18 pm, Jeff Schwab [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Benoit wrote: I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). Get a better teacher, if you can. Please do me a personal favor: Personal favor? Seriously, do you have stock in a C++ support company or something? There's no need to take stuff like this personally. Don't hold the crappy course against C++. C++ has so much badness to hold against it, there's no need to throw a crappy course on top of it. Carl Banks -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
On Feb 28, 9:10 pm, Jeff Schwab [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Benoit wrote: Forgive my language concerning C++ as its turned the thread into something I did not intend. I merely wished to point out that Python was easier for me to learn than C++. To Schwab, its likely that Mark Lutz is simply a better instructor than my professor. Sorry for hijacking your thread! In addition to Python Challenge, check out Code Golf: http://codegolf.com/ It's eye-opening to see how concise the solutions can be. You should also give Project Euler a shot: http://projecteuler.net/index.php?section=problems Just keep in mind two points. One, your solutions should work with under one minute of execution time, even in Python. Secondly, the main benefit of the site is attempting some of the simpler problems and then diving head-first into the forums to see other peoples' solutions to the same problem. I guarantee you'll find some unique Python techniques from these forums that should open new avenues of learning wrt Python for you. Nothing enterprise level...but definitely interesting. Be warned that some of the harder problems require undergraduate-level math. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
On Feb 28, 1:10 am, Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, 27 Feb 2008 19:18:27 -0800, Jeff Schwab wrote: Benoit wrote: I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). Get a better teacher, if you can. Please do me a personal favor: Don't hold the crappy course against C++. For the record, you should never have to manage dynamically allocated arrays manually, nor store pointers to them. Try the std::vector template, and post in comp.lang.c++ if have any trouble. Hey a flame bait. I'll bite. This a bit of an overreaction unless you know what the course was about. If the goal is to learn about the computer and that basically everything is a number in the end, then C is a good choice. More portable than assembler but nearly as close to the metal. To the OP: If you try C++, don't hold that crappy language against C#, D, or Java. ;-) Ciao, Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch Welcome! This is the self-proclaimed 'impossible and useless' guy. Since you're in to TMLs, try escaping a text file with a small subset of characters, so that it's readable with a browser. Say by replacing all the ampersands with amp;, the line breaks with p, and maybe even a 'list' with lis. (That went easy, moderate, hard.) Then, for impossible, do it without (I repeat, WITHOUT) reading the whole file into memory, say only 32 characters at a time. Sadly, even at teenages, specializations you make affect your specializations later. There's no best specialization priority, and $$ $ned if I'm picking yours. Mine gets me here; that's all I can know. Electives or bust! Anyway, Marc is right. Python teaches you a lot about programming, but C teaches you a lot about computers. More generally, you can write in one line in one language what takes hundreds in another, but in one line in that one what's impossible in the first. It's -your- - day-; allegretto: meter's running. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch wrote: On Wed, 27 Feb 2008 19:18:27 -0800, Jeff Schwab wrote: Benoit wrote: I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). Get a better teacher, if you can. Please do me a personal favor: Don't hold the crappy course against C++. For the record, you should never have to manage dynamically allocated arrays manually, nor store pointers to them. Try the std::vector template, and post in comp.lang.c++ if have any trouble. Hey a flame bait. I'll bite. This a bit of an overreaction unless you know what the course was about. If the goal is to learn about the computer and that basically everything is a number in the end, then C is a good choice. More portable than assembler but nearly as close to the metal. To the OP: If you try C++, don't hold that crappy language against C#, D, or Java. ;-) He was talking about C++, not C. Jeff has quite a good point; teaching C++ as C is not terribly useful. -- Erik Max Francis [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alcyone.com/max/ San Jose, CA, USA 37 18 N 121 57 W AIM, Y!M erikmaxfrancis Wyrd has swept all my kin / all the brave chiefs away! / Now I must follow them! -- Beowulf -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
Benoit wrote: Give me something to do! Help to improve one of the experimental writers for docutils. IIRC, the ODT writer does not yet support figures and tables. http://www.rexx.com/~dkuhlman/odtwriter.html The rst2wordml writer appears to be getting its features in place, but when I last used it, some tinkering was required. You could work on adding features. http://docutils.sourceforge.net/sandbox/rst2wordml/readme.html If you get good enough a docutils, provide an option to have the number for the note be superscripted, like the note reference can be. fwiw, Alan Isaac -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch wrote: On Wed, 27 Feb 2008 19:18:27 -0800, Jeff Schwab wrote: Benoit wrote: I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). Get a better teacher, if you can. Please do me a personal favor: Don't hold the crappy course against C++. For the record, you should never have to manage dynamically allocated arrays manually, nor store pointers to them. Try the std::vector template, and post in comp.lang.c++ if have any trouble. Hey a flame bait. I'll bite. Excuse me? Somebody posts about an introductory course on C++ covering dynamic arrays using pointers and literally says kill me now, and I'm the flamer for asking him not to hold the language responsible for the bad course? This a bit of an overreaction unless you know what the course was about. It's supposed to be about C++, according to the OP. If the goal is to learn about the computer and that basically everything is a number in the end, then C is a good choice. More portable than assembler but nearly as close to the metal. And a better choice than C++ would be. To the OP: If you try C++, don't hold that crappy language against C#, D, or Java. ;-) What's the relevance of C#, D, or Java to the OP's post? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
On Feb 28, 12:34 pm, Jeff Schwab [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch wrote:
Hey a flame bait. I'll bite.
[ redirected to OP ]
OP.flamebait= 1.0.
bait.bite()
Traceback (most recent call last):
File stdin, line 1, in module
AttributeError: 'FlameBait' object has no attribute 'bite'
Excuse me? Somebody posts about an introductory course on C++ covering
dynamic arrays using pointers and literally says kill me now, and
I'm the flamer for asking him not to hold the language responsible for
the bad course?
This a bit of an overreaction unless you
know what the course was about.
It's supposed to be about C++, according to the OP.
If the goal is to learn about the
computer and that basically everything is a number in the end, then C is a
good choice. More portable than assembler but nearly as close to the
metal.
And a better choice than C++ would be.
To the OP: If you try C++, don't hold that crappy language against C#, D,
or Java. ;-)
What's the relevance of C#, D, or Java to the OP's post?
public static void synchronized flamewar() {}
virtual void flamewar() {}
def flamewar(): pass
[ castironpi has changed the newsgroup to comp.lang.flamewar ]
Programming is very hard. And on that note!
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
Forgive my language concerning C++ as its turned the thread into something I did not intend. I merely wished to point out that Python was easier for me to learn than C++. To Schwab, its likely that Mark Lutz is simply a better instructor than my professor. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 10:34:45 -0800, Jeff Schwab wrote: Hey a flame bait. I'll bite. Excuse me? Somebody posts about an introductory course on C++ covering dynamic arrays using pointers and literally says kill me now, and I'm the flamer for asking him not to hold the language responsible for the bad course? This a bit of an overreaction unless you know what the course was about. It's supposed to be about C++, according to the OP. Yeah, sorry I've read C. Actually it's about a language called C ++ according to the OP. To the OP: If you try C++, don't hold that crappy language against C#, D, or Java. ;-) What's the relevance of C#, D, or Java to the OP's post? The same as C++ to the OP's post if he would have talked about C. :-) Ciao, Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
On 28 Feb, 21:08, Benoit [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Forgive my language concerning C++ as its turned the thread into something I did not intend. I merely wished to point out that Python was easier for me to learn than C++. To Schwab, its likely that Mark Lutz is simply a better instructor than my professor. I think the remark about C++ just hit a nerve with certain people, and then you're likely to get all sorts of low quality remarks from perpetual bystanders. Returning to your original enquiry, however... Perhaps you would benefit from looking at this page: http://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide/Programmers If you feel that you need more practical experience, the following page has some suggestions, although it's rather focused on people mucking in and fixing things around Python rather than pure recreation: http://wiki.python.org/moin/CodingProjectIdeas And the volunteers page is possibly a bit formal for someone just wanting to improve their skills: http://wiki.python.org/moin/VolunteerOpportunities Paul P.S. There's another remark that could be made about the project ideas page, editing practices, and an insufficiently publicised mailing list, but I'll leave that for another time. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch wrote: On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 10:34:45 -0800, Jeff Schwab wrote: Hey a flame bait. I'll bite. Excuse me? Somebody posts about an introductory course on C++ covering dynamic arrays using pointers and literally says kill me now, and I'm the flamer for asking him not to hold the language responsible for the bad course? This a bit of an overreaction unless you know what the course was about. It's supposed to be about C++, according to the OP. Yeah, sorry I've read C. Actually it's about a language called C ++ according to the OP. No problem! True that! To the OP: If you try C++, don't hold that crappy language against C#, D, or Java. ;-) What's the relevance of C#, D, or Java to the OP's post? The same as C++ to the OP's post if he would have talked about C. :-) Whew, everybody lives. :) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
Benoit wrote: Forgive my language concerning C++ as its turned the thread into something I did not intend. I merely wished to point out that Python was easier for me to learn than C++. To Schwab, its likely that Mark Lutz is simply a better instructor than my professor. Sorry for hijacking your thread! In addition to Python Challenge, check out Code Golf: http://codegolf.com/ It's eye-opening to see how concise the solutions can be. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Pythons Ladders
I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). My problem, however, is that I found myself lacking problems with which to create solutions and so practice what I've learned. I think I'm one of those people who really get into something when the instructions come from without. So I'd like to ask you resident python gurus to help me learn. Give me something to do! Specifically, I'd like to be given tasks that incrementally increase in difficulty, starting from simple file/text manipulation to those harder things like built-in function overloading (you know, where you can make the + operator do something different in relation to a given object). I hope my request doesn't come off as demanding, as perhaps we could archive these tasks for future pedagogy. If something like this already exists though, please point me in the right direction. Otherwise, thanks for any and all assistance. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
On Feb 27, 5:24 pm, Benoit [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). My problem, however, is that I found myself lacking problems with which to create solutions and so practice what I've learned. I think I'm one of those people who really get into something when the instructions come from without. So I'd like to ask you resident python gurus to help me learn. Give me something to do! Specifically, I'd like to be given tasks that incrementally increase in difficulty, starting from simple file/text manipulation to those harder things like built-in function overloading (you know, where you can make the + operator do something different in relation to a given object). I hope my request doesn't come off as demanding, as perhaps we could archive these tasks for future pedagogy. If something like this already exists though, please point me in the right direction. Otherwise, thanks for any and all assistance. Just some background: My main thing is XHTML/CSS, and we're on javascript in my Web Design course. I'm ultimately interested in dynamic website design. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
Benoit wrote: I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). Get a better teacher, if you can. Please do me a personal favor: Don't hold the crappy course against C++. For the record, you should never have to manage dynamically allocated arrays manually, nor store pointers to them. Try the std::vector template, and post in comp.lang.c++ if have any trouble. My problem, however, is that I found myself lacking problems with which to create solutions and so practice what I've learned. I think I'm one of those people who really get into something when the instructions come from without. So I'd like to ask you resident python gurus to help me learn. Give me something to do! Specifically, I'd like to be given tasks that incrementally increase in difficulty, starting from simple file/text manipulation to those harder things like built-in function overloading (you know, where you can make the + operator do something different in relation to a given object). I hope my request doesn't come off as demanding, as perhaps we could archive these tasks for future pedagogy. If something like this already exists though, please point me in the right direction. Otherwise, thanks for any and all assistance. Happy hacking! http://www.pythonchallenge.com/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pythons Ladders
On Wed, 27 Feb 2008 19:18:27 -0800, Jeff Schwab wrote: Benoit wrote: I've been teaching myself the python language over the past few months using Mark Lutz' Learning Python, 3ed. Python is also the first programming language I've ever taken up. I find the language easy to learn and rather productive in relation to the introductory course on C ++ I'd begun in January for fun @ school (we're practicing dynamic arrays using pointers... kill me now). Get a better teacher, if you can. Please do me a personal favor: Don't hold the crappy course against C++. For the record, you should never have to manage dynamically allocated arrays manually, nor store pointers to them. Try the std::vector template, and post in comp.lang.c++ if have any trouble. Hey a flame bait. I'll bite. This a bit of an overreaction unless you know what the course was about. If the goal is to learn about the computer and that basically everything is a number in the end, then C is a good choice. More portable than assembler but nearly as close to the metal. To the OP: If you try C++, don't hold that crappy language against C#, D, or Java. ;-) Ciao, Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
