stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-12 Thread Mark Lawrence 

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/python

"Python has two major versions (2 and 3) in use which have significant 
differences."


I believe that this is incorrect.  The warts have been removed, but 
significant differences, not in my book.  If there is agreement about 
there not being significant differences, should stackoverflow be asked 
to change their wording?


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Cheers.

Mark Lawrence.

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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-12 Thread Rodrick Brown 
I believe this statement is correct given key differences do exist in
underlying implementations even though such differences may be highly
transparent to end users (developers).


On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 10:08 PM, Mark Lawrence wrote:

> http://stackoverflow.com/**questions/tagged/python
>
> "Python has two major versions (2 and 3) in use which have significant
> differences."
>
> I believe that this is incorrect.  The warts have been removed, but
> significant differences, not in my book.  If there is agreement about there
> not being significant differences, should stackoverflow be asked to change
> their wording?
>
> --
> Cheers.
>
> Mark Lawrence.
>
> --
> http://mail.python.org/**mailman/listinfo/python-list
>
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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-12 Thread Ian Kelly 
On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 8:08 PM, Mark Lawrence  wrote:
> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/python
>
> "Python has two major versions (2 and 3) in use which have significant
> differences."
>
> I believe that this is incorrect.  The warts have been removed, but
> significant differences, not in my book.  If there is agreement about there
> not being significant differences, should stackoverflow be asked to change
> their wording?

They have differences, and those differences are significant in that
they must often be taken into account when asking or answering
questions about Python on stackoverflow.
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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-12 Thread Steven D'Aprano 
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 03:08:54 +, Mark Lawrence wrote:

> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/python
> 
> "Python has two major versions (2 and 3) in use which have significant
> differences."
> 
> I believe that this is incorrect.  The warts have been removed, but
> significant differences, not in my book.  If there is agreement about
> there not being significant differences, should stackoverflow be asked
> to change their wording?

Define "significant".

If StackOverflow mean "significant like the differences between Lisp and 
Cobol", then they are clearly wrong.

On the other hand, if you are suggesting that nothing short of the 
differences between Lisp and Cobol count as significant, then I think you 
too are wrong.

There are clear differences between the two versions, and the much-talked-
about "print is now a function" is the least among them:

* major reorganisation of parts of the standard library, with many
  libraries being removed, renamed, reorganised, or added;

* file objects are completely re-implemented;

* strings are now proper text strings (Unicode), not byte strings;

* nonlocal;

* keyword-only parameters for functions;

* cannot use grouped parameters in functions, e.g. def spam(a, (b,c), d)
  no longer is allowed;

* cannot use "import *" inside a function;

* dict methods keys(), values(), items() are iterators;

* so are map, reduce, zip;

* builtins like reduce, reload have been moved to modules;

* some itertools functions are now builtins;

* sorted and list.sort no longer support comparison functions;

* comparisons between different types may raise TypeError;

* extended iterable unpacking;

* function annotations;

* dict comprehensions and set literals;

* new metaclass syntax;

* classic classes are gone;

* automatic delegation doesn't work for __dunder__ methods;

* backticks `x` gone;


among others. Are these "significant" differences? Well, maybe.



-- 
Steven
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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-13 Thread Alister 
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 03:08:54 +, Mark Lawrence wrote:

> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/python
> 
> "Python has two major versions (2 and 3) in use which have significant
> differences."
> 
> I believe that this is incorrect.  The warts have been removed, but
> significant differences, not in my book.  If there is agreement about
> there not being significant differences, should stackoverflow be asked
> to change their wording?
I think you are confusing significant with fundamental

they are significant differences because failing to take them into 
account may cause incorrect operation.
they are not fundamental differences because someone familiar with on 
version should have minimal difficulty in understanding the other.




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Mother said there would be days like this,
but she never said that there'd be so many!
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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-13 Thread wxjmfauth 
Le mardi 13 novembre 2012 06:42:19 UTC+1, Steven D'Aprano a écrit :
> On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 03:08:54 +, Mark Lawrence wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * strings are now proper text strings (Unicode), not byte strings;
> 
 


Let me laugh.

jmf
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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-13 Thread Mark Lawrence 

On 13/11/2012 13:21, wxjmfa...@gmail.com wrote:

Le mardi 13 novembre 2012 06:42:19 UTC+1, Steven D'Aprano a écrit :

On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 03:08:54 +, Mark Lawrence wrote:

* strings are now proper text strings (Unicode), not byte strings;





Let me laugh.

jmf



Presumably because you're looking at yourself in a mirror, and have 
finally realised that you've completely misunderstood the work done with 
unicode in Python 3, specifically Python 3.3?


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Mark Lawrence.

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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-13 Thread Ethan Furman 

wxjmfa...@gmail.com wrote:

Le mardi 13 novembre 2012 06:42:19 UTC+1, Steven D'Aprano a écrit :

On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 03:08:54 +, Mark Lawrence wrote:

* strings are now proper text strings (Unicode), not byte strings;

Let me laugh.


*plonk*
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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-13 Thread Thomas Rachel 

Am 13.11.2012 14:21 schrieb wxjmfa...@gmail.com:


* strings are now proper text strings (Unicode), not byte strings;


Let me laugh.


Do so.


Thomas
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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-14 Thread wxjmfauth 
Le mardi 13 novembre 2012 16:53:30 UTC+1, Mark Lawrence a écrit :
> On 13/11/2012 13:21, wxjmfa...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> > Le mardi 13 novembre 2012 06:42:19 UTC+1, Steven D'Aprano a écrit :
> 
> >> On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 03:08:54 +, Mark Lawrence wrote:
> 
> >>
> 
> >> * strings are now proper text strings (Unicode), not byte strings;
> 
> >>
> 
> >
> 
> > 
> 
> >
> 
> > Let me laugh.
> 
> >
> 
> > jmf
> 
> >
> 
> 
> 
> Presumably because you're looking at yourself in a mirror, and have 
> 
> finally realised that you've completely misunderstood the work done with 
> 
> unicode in Python 3, specifically Python 3.3?
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Cheers.
> 
> 
> 
> Mark Lawrence.



I'am still fascinated by the mathematically absurd "negative
logic" used in and by the flexible string representation
(algorithm).

jmf



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Re: stackoverflow quote on Python

2012-11-14 Thread Chris Angelico 
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 7:56 PM,   wrote:
> I'am still fascinated by the mathematically absurd "negative
> logic" used in and by the flexible string representation
> (algorithm).

I am still fascinated that you persist in comparing a buggy old Python
against a bug-free new Python and haven't noticed the difference.

ChrisA
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