Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build

[Bob K.]

J Imler,

What trailer is that!? Looks great!

Bob

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[RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Belopsky]

Will be paying some attention, but all depends..Riv frames aren't exactly 
cheap, and if it is a TIG'd Taiwanese frame I'd be looking at a Gunnar 
instead

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[RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Belopsky]

If it's a road bike at Clem price point, I may be interested.

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 8:47:51 AM UTC-4, Belopsky wrote:
>
> Will be paying some attention, but all depends..Riv frames aren't exactly 
> cheap, and if it is a TIG'd Taiwanese frame I'd be looking at a Gunnar 
> instead
>

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[RBW] Saddle setback, frame angles, riding position, riding style (was: Can we talk about Riv bike sizing again?)

[Patrick Moore]

Starting a new thread about a topic that has interested me for a long time,
with a question: do slack angles and therefore (all else equal) saddles
well back of bb, work better with upright positions? Or perhaps, an upright
position works best with a rearward saddle and thus slack angles?

I recall dithering about a nice Dave Moulton, at a very good price, because
of the 74* st angle, and being told that a racing position on a racing bike
means being forward over the crank assembly/bb shell. This was confirmed by
several experienced ex racers. I finally passed.

The classic bolt upright ride seems to be the Raleigh DL-1, perhaps Dutch
city bikes (but I've no experience with them). Such slack angles, high bb
shell, and ends of grips practically bumping your knees. I've ridden many
such bikes and I've watched others ride them, and I know for a fact that
they very strongly discourage an energetic riding style -- if you try to
ride hard, you always (and I see others always) reposition the body to
negate the design -- lean forward, grab bar next to stem, sit on nose of
saddle).

And then there's the gearing: stock on the DL-1 was 46/18 or 72 gi, iirc.
Even if 44/18, that's still 68". Even 68" on a very tall, 50 lb bike is
damned high.

So the design must have been built with a (1) relaxed or energy conserving
and (2) ponderous or high torque/low rpm

It's hard to understand why the DL-1 remained in production for so long; I
don't think that this extended product life can't be explained solely on
failing-socialist Indian and Chinese economic practices, or pure inertia.

So something about this sort of riding position must work, and therefore
one presumes that Raleigh had worked out the riding style, and then the
position, and then the angles and lengths that were most efficient with
this position.

Translate this into the upright Rivendells. These have low bbs, so that's
different; they also come with low gearing -- I get the impression that
these favor spinning, and not mashing?

And the Rivs have startlingly long tts -- to countereffect the rearward
sweep of the bar and the slacker heads? So, this would mean a more
aggressive riding position, and therefore more spirited riding style, than
what the DL-1 was designed for.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:19 PM, Eric Karnes  wrote:

> My guess that this is mostly a commentary on the use of fairly steep seat
> tube angles (73–75 degrees) on many road/sport/touring bikes from (very
> roughly) the 80s to present. This can make it very hard for some people to
> get a proper weight distribution without slamming the seat back, using an
> ultra-setback seatpost, or a combination of both. I had a mid-eighties Trek
> sport touring bike like this. I loved the way the frame rode, but the 73.5
> degree sta made it impossible for me to get comfortable.
>
> [...]
>
>
> On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 2:27:41 PM UTC-4, Belopsky wrote:
>>
>> [...]
>> As a follow-up, I saw somewhere Grant writing that people like to slam
>> the seats ALL the way back - is this due to the upright bars / higher than
>> seat bars / upright posture on a bike?
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: Fall Liquidation (Nitto, Fairweather, Shimano, Sugino, Simworks, Rivendell, etc)

[Irving]

Updated list with remaining items, and price drops on some of the rest:

$50 - 46cm Nitto Noodle  Heat 
Treated 26.0 Handlebars (Silver) , 
Used, heat treated for all you ruff ryders 
 out there

$20 - 40cm  
Nitto 
B115 25.4 Handlebars (Silver) 
, Used, 
classic drop bars in a narrow width, not NJS unfortunately 
 
$250 - 170mm Sugino OX601D 44/30t with MB-608II Bottom Bracket Cups (Silver) 
, New in bag, seriously rad 
sub-compact cranks for the low Q-factor nerd in your life 


$100 - Shimano 105 5700 10 Speed Shifters 

 (Silver) 
,
 
Used, way cooler than those "90's era Dura Ace Shifter" 


$10 - 70mm, 26.0, +/-7° Degrees, Dimension Threadless Stem (Silver) 
,
 
New In Box

$5 - 60mm 25.4, +/-35° Degrees, Dimension Threadless Stem (Silver) 


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[RBW] Re: Saddle setback, frame angles, riding position, riding style (was: Can we talk about Riv bike sizing again?)

[Belopsky]

This all seems to make sense to me, but I will wait on others to chime in - 
I still have questions about seat position and stem lengths - Is there any 
reason to ride the biggest you can, if you're *not* touring - if I want a 
'go fast' Rivendell, do I size down rather than up?

Comparing my San Marcos to my Hillborne, the former looks rather small, or 
the latter looks rather big, but they are also set up differently - doing 
some measurements however seems like I can ride the Hillborne with drops, 
with a shorter stem and be fine, albeit probably not as fast as my Macho 
King

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:37:29 AM UTC-4, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Starting a new thread about a topic that has interested me for a long 
> time, with a question: do slack angles and therefore (all else equal) 
> saddles well back of bb, work better with upright positions? Or perhaps, an 
> upright position works best with a rearward saddle and thus slack angles?
>
> I recall dithering about a nice Dave Moulton, at a very good price, 
> because of the 74* st angle, and being told that a racing position on a 
> racing bike means being forward over the crank assembly/bb shell. This was 
> confirmed by several experienced ex racers. I finally passed.
>
> The classic bolt upright ride seems to be the Raleigh DL-1, perhaps Dutch 
> city bikes (but I've no experience with them). Such slack angles, high bb 
> shell, and ends of grips practically bumping your knees. I've ridden many 
> such bikes and I've watched others ride them, and I know for a fact that 
> they very strongly discourage an energetic riding style -- if you try to 
> ride hard, you always (and I see others always) reposition the body to 
> negate the design -- lean forward, grab bar next to stem, sit on nose of 
> saddle).
>
> And then there's the gearing: stock on the DL-1 was 46/18 or 72 gi, iirc. 
> Even if 44/18, that's still 68". Even 68" on a very tall, 50 lb bike is 
> damned high.
>
> So the design must have been built with a (1) relaxed or energy conserving 
> and (2) ponderous or high torque/low rpm
>
> It's hard to understand why the DL-1 remained in production for so long; I 
> don't think that this extended product life can't be explained solely on 
> failing-socialist Indian and Chinese economic practices, or pure inertia.
>
> So something about this sort of riding position must work, and therefore 
> one presumes that Raleigh had worked out the riding style, and then the 
> position, and then the angles and lengths that were most efficient with 
> this position.
>
> Translate this into the upright Rivendells. These have low bbs, so that's 
> different; they also come with low gearing -- I get the impression that 
> these favor spinning, and not mashing?
>
> And the Rivs have startlingly long tts -- to countereffect the rearward 
> sweep of the bar and the slacker heads? So, this would mean a more 
> aggressive riding position, and therefore more spirited riding style, than 
> what the DL-1 was designed for.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:19 PM, Eric Karnes  > wrote:
>
>> My guess that this is mostly a commentary on the use of fairly steep seat 
>> tube angles (73–75 degrees) on many road/sport/touring bikes from (very 
>> roughly) the 80s to present. This can make it very hard for some people to 
>> get a proper weight distribution without slamming the seat back, using an 
>> ultra-setback seatpost, or a combination of both. I had a mid-eighties Trek 
>> sport touring bike like this. I loved the way the frame rode, but the 73.5 
>> degree sta made it impossible for me to get comfortable.
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 2:27:41 PM UTC-4, Belopsky wrote:
>>>
>>> [...]
>>> As a follow-up, I saw somewhere Grant writing that people like to slam 
>>> the seats ALL the way back - is this due to the upright bars / higher than 
>>> seat bars / upright posture on a bike?
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: SUPERNOVA DYNO LIGHTS

[Kellie]

There are adapters to set up the lights in different ways. Supernova 
provides a handlebar mount and brake mount for the headlight and there's 
the Gino mount by Paul for a taillight. I'm looking at trying to do 
this (of course NOT with disc brakes)




On Sunday, October 9, 2016 at 3:06:40 PM UTC-7, Ginz wrote:
>
> I like everything about mine except there is no fender mounted taillight 
> available.
>
> That means you must use a rack mount or seatpost mount.  
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Saddle setback, frame angles, riding position, riding style (was: Can we talk about Riv bike sizing again?)

[Eric Karnes]

Very good question. I have a similar understanding of geometry as I have of 
macroeconomics. Which is to say, none. So I'll leave the theorizing to 
others.

But I will say (as a few others have opined in other conversations) that I 
have never been able to get older racing bikes to work well with upright 
bars. On my mid-eighties Trek for example (73.5 sta and 73 hta), I always 
felt like all of my weight was resting on my hands. This occurred even with 
different bars (albatross, jitensha, vo porteur), different stem lengths 
(everything from 8mm to 12mm), and different bar heights (below, even with, 
and above the saddle). It turned out the most expensive 200 dollar 
Craigslist bike I've ever come across.

My SimpleOne on the other hand (72 and 72 if I remember correctly), works 
beautifully with upright bars. Right now it's sporting VO Porteurs even 
with the saddle height, so it's not like I even have to be bolt upright to 
be comfortable. It took a little bit of noodling to get it dialed in, but 
honestly not a whole lot. I'm even thinking of getting a Hilsen with the 
same tt length and trying out some drop bars (which have always intimidated 
my long-legged, short-torsoed self).

Eric



On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:37:29 AM UTC-4, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Starting a new thread about a topic that has interested me for a long 
> time, with a question: do slack angles and therefore (all else equal) 
> saddles well back of bb, work better with upright positions? Or perhaps, an 
> upright position works best with a rearward saddle and thus slack angles?
>
> I recall dithering about a nice Dave Moulton, at a very good price, 
> because of the 74* st angle, and being told that a racing position on a 
> racing bike means being forward over the crank assembly/bb shell. This was 
> confirmed by several experienced ex racers. I finally passed.
>
> The classic bolt upright ride seems to be the Raleigh DL-1, perhaps Dutch 
> city bikes (but I've no experience with them). Such slack angles, high bb 
> shell, and ends of grips practically bumping your knees. I've ridden many 
> such bikes and I've watched others ride them, and I know for a fact that 
> they very strongly discourage an energetic riding style -- if you try to 
> ride hard, you always (and I see others always) reposition the body to 
> negate the design -- lean forward, grab bar next to stem, sit on nose of 
> saddle).
>
> And then there's the gearing: stock on the DL-1 was 46/18 or 72 gi, iirc. 
> Even if 44/18, that's still 68". Even 68" on a very tall, 50 lb bike is 
> damned high.
>
> So the design must have been built with a (1) relaxed or energy conserving 
> and (2) ponderous or high torque/low rpm
>
> It's hard to understand why the DL-1 remained in production for so long; I 
> don't think that this extended product life can't be explained solely on 
> failing-socialist Indian and Chinese economic practices, or pure inertia.
>
> So something about this sort of riding position must work, and therefore 
> one presumes that Raleigh had worked out the riding style, and then the 
> position, and then the angles and lengths that were most efficient with 
> this position.
>
> Translate this into the upright Rivendells. These have low bbs, so that's 
> different; they also come with low gearing -- I get the impression that 
> these favor spinning, and not mashing?
>
> And the Rivs have startlingly long tts -- to countereffect the rearward 
> sweep of the bar and the slacker heads? So, this would mean a more 
> aggressive riding position, and therefore more spirited riding style, than 
> what the DL-1 was designed for.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:19 PM, Eric Karnes  > wrote:
>
>> My guess that this is mostly a commentary on the use of fairly steep seat 
>> tube angles (73–75 degrees) on many road/sport/touring bikes from (very 
>> roughly) the 80s to present. This can make it very hard for some people to 
>> get a proper weight distribution without slamming the seat back, using an 
>> ultra-setback seatpost, or a combination of both. I had a mid-eighties Trek 
>> sport touring bike like this. I loved the way the frame rode, but the 73.5 
>> degree sta made it impossible for me to get comfortable.
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 2:27:41 PM UTC-4, Belopsky wrote:
>>>
>>> [...]
>>> As a follow-up, I saw somewhere Grant writing that people like to slam 
>>> the seats ALL the way back - is this due to the upright bars / higher than 
>>> seat bars / upright posture on a bike?
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: RBW listers in eastern Kansas

[Chad]

Saw a nice orange Roadeo and nice Atlantis at the Velo+ shop yesterday. I was 
shocked to see not one, but two Rivs belonging to different people in town! 
There is now 3 there with my Hillborne:-) I think the Roadeo was your's, Tim.  

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[RBW] Stolen: My daughters 650b Sequoia

[Mark R.]

I hope this is ok here, I know some listers are in the San Diego area, 
wanted to put some more eyes out on the street.












Got a text from my kid, her bike was stolen.  She is pretty upset, not so 
much because it was her bike, but that I built it for her.  She did love to 
ride the wheels off it: she used it daily to commute, shop, fun rides.

It was stolen in North Park, San Diego.

Details:  47 cm, powdercoated black, 650 b conversion, Mavic front hub, 
Shimano 600 rear, Weinman ZAC rims, front laced radially.  Gripshifts to 
Shimano derailers, xt front, Deore rear, ultegra headset, Nitto bars, SR 
Stem.   Nifty Swifties, new, Dia compe Centerpul brakes.

Maybe it will show up on CL, or at the swap meet in a few weeks.  Let me 
know if you see it.

Thanks

Mark "heavy heart for my daughter" Rosenberg
SDCA

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[RBW] End of fall s24o - impressed by durability of Compass tires...

[Mark Reimer]

I went on a long s24o this weekend - 108km (about 67 miles) on varying 
surfaces. 

The route started with a 'Voyageur Start'. This excellent term was new to 
me. Supposedly the old fur trading voyageurs would paddle out of town for 
only a few miles before stopping for the first night, with the idea that if 
they had forgotten anything critical, they were still able to turn back and 
retrieve forgotten supplies. I can understand the reasoning when you're 
paddling half way across a country. 

So, we rolled out of Elma, Manitoba at 2pm and stopped 10km later in 
Whitemouth for some burgers, soup, pumpkin pie and beers. I have to say I'm 
a fan of this voyageur start business..

We hit about 15km of farm roads, which were a mix of gravel roads, mud 
roads, and double track. I was riding Compass Barlow Pass Extra-Lite 38s on 
my Atlantis. We connected to a rolling highway that snakes through the 
Canadian Shield, making for a camp spot at Meditation Lake. Can you think 
of a better-named destination? 

I had planned the route to include two special off-road diversions. The 
first was a snowmobile track that ended at an old prison site. The second 
is part of the trans-canada trail, which is mostly crushed stone, exposed 
granite and a touch of grassy single track here and there. Being October, 
all these sections would be done in complete darkness as a result of our 
long, leisurely lunch.

The temperature dropped to about freezing and we kept warm by maintaining a 
respectable pace. It has rained for nearly the entire week prior, so full 
fenders were a must. I was very happy with how the Barlow Pass tires rolled 
over the varied surfaces and had no flats despite the sharp rocky trails, 
exposed granite, and rough roads. 

We had all of Meditation Lake to ourselves, save the occasional chorus of 
coyotes and owls in the night. A few beers, some pad thai and a bonfire 
later and we were passed out. 

We woke up to the sound of shotguns, which was surprising to say the least. 
 I guess with camping season officially closed, hunting is allowed near the 
camp spot. We passed 6 hunters on our 5km ride back to the highway. The 
ride back was pretty much the same, including a second voyageur start for 
our second breakfast of the day. A stiff headwind reduced our pace to 
between 9-15km/h for the final 50km. It was a grind, but still having fun. 


In the end, we covered 210km, saw several bald eagles, had a fox run along 
with us for about 30 seconds, were treated to a clear night with bright 
stars, and sent autumn on its way properly. The next s24o is my annual 
November Winter Welcomer, which is on the first weekend of November, and 
marks the beginning of the snowy, sub-freezing camping season :) 

Hope you all had a great weekend.



















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[RBW] Re: Saddle setback, frame angles, riding position, riding style (was: Can we talk about Riv bike sizing again?)

[Bill Lindsay]

Patrick Moore asked two questions.  Others were implied but I think these 
were the three he sincerely meant to ask:

1.  do slack angles and therefore (all else equal) saddles well back of bb, 
work better with upright positions?

In my humble opinion, no.  I use the full length mirror to illustrate. 
 Stand in front of the full length mirror, sideways.  Bolt upright your 
head is stacked over your shoulders, down through your spine and hips down 
to your feet.  Keep your spine straight and bend forward.  As you bend 
forward reach your relaxed arms towards imaginary handlebars.  As you reach 
for various different handlebar positions, and different spine and arm 
positions, look at what your hips are doing.  The further down you reach 
and the further away you reach, the further back your hips need to go. 
 Slack angles allow you to get your hips back more easily.  An upright 
position doesn't need to have your hips get so far back.  

2.  Or perhaps, an upright position works best with a rearward saddle and 
thus slack angles?

In my opinion, this is incorrect.  Its the opposite.  You don't need to 
slam your saddle back on an upright.  You need to get your hips back with a 
sporting riding position.  The case for a steep STA is for an aero riding 
position with aero bars where you rest substantial weight on your forearms. 
  

P.S.  Grant wrote two things about saddle slamming.   First, he noticed 
that everybody slams their Brooks saddles all the way back, because Brooks 
saddles have very short rails.  Rivendell pretty much single handedly kept 
Brooks afloat for a while before Brooks became hipster-tweed-cool.  Grant 
wanted to offer frames that did not require 100% of people to slam their 
Brooks saddles all the way back and handwring that they couldn't go 
farther.  Second, Grant thinks a long setback seatpost and a slammed all 
the way back saddle just doesn't look good.  On all my Rivendells, the 
saddle is very near the middle of the rails, with normal setback posts, and 
I think that's a nice look.  That's why Rivendells' "long" top tubes are 
not actually all that long, because you are running your saddle farther 
forward.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA


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[RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Grant @ Rivendell]

The Rodin theme was too obvious to adopt, but it was always in the 
background. It'll likely be a frame only, but we're thinking about whole 
bike, and that's not ruled out. Maybe some of each. It may follow CLEM and 
have a seat lug. Sam is already a good road bike, but the clearances big 
you to fill them up with a huge "road?" tire, and Rodini won't allow that. 
Up to 35mm, probably.
Our bike certainly are not inexpensive, but they cannot possibly be any 
less expensive without do-featuring/de-cooling them or replacing the staff 
with wealthy philanthropists or unemployables! 
I think Will and Roman picked the colors. Same sizes as Sam.

On Friday, October 7, 2016 at 12:02:36 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> His first name is Leo.  He apparently has paws.  Your Roadini that you buy 
> next summer may have a fake panel.  So far, nothing not to like
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>

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[RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Belopsky]

Same as in, 51,55,58,62? Will be interesting to see this - I imagine we're 
months out from more info

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:51:42 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell 
wrote:
>
> The Rodin theme was too obvious to adopt, but it was always in the 
> background. It'll likely be a frame only, but we're thinking about whole 
> bike, and that's not ruled out. Maybe some of each. It may follow CLEM and 
> have a seat lug. Sam is already a good road bike, but the clearances big 
> you to fill them up with a huge "road?" tire, and Rodini won't allow that. 
> Up to 35mm, probably.
> Our bike certainly are not inexpensive, but they cannot possibly be any 
> less expensive without do-featuring/de-cooling them or replacing the staff 
> with wealthy philanthropists or unemployables! 
> I think Will and Roman picked the colors. Same sizes as Sam.
>
> On Friday, October 7, 2016 at 12:02:36 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> His first name is Leo.  He apparently has paws.  Your Roadini that you 
>> buy next summer may have a fake panel.  So far, nothing not to like
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: End of fall s24o - impressed by durability of Compass tires...

[Bill Lindsay]

I love the blues that your skies display.  Thanks Mark.

Caption for Photo #2:

"You think my Atlantis is a tank?!  That's not a tank.  THIS is a tank!"

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA




>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Ryan Ray]

Road 700x44 would be reeeaaay nice :)

- Ryan


On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 9:54 AM Belopsky  wrote:

Same as in, 51,55,58,62? Will be interesting to see this - I imagine we're
months out from more info


On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:51:42 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell
wrote:

The Rodin theme was too obvious to adopt, but it was always in the
background. It'll likely be a frame only, but we're thinking about whole
bike, and that's not ruled out. Maybe some of each. It may follow CLEM and
have a seat lug. Sam is already a good road bike, but the clearances big
you to fill them up with a huge "road?" tire, and Rodini won't allow that.
Up to 35mm, probably.
Our bike certainly are not inexpensive, but they cannot possibly be any
less expensive without do-featuring/de-cooling them or replacing the staff
with wealthy philanthropists or unemployables!
I think Will and Roman picked the colors. Same sizes as Sam.

On Friday, October 7, 2016 at 12:02:36 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:

His first name is Leo.  He apparently has paws.  Your Roadini that you buy
next summer may have a fake panel.  So far, nothing not to like

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

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Re: [RBW] End of fall s24o - impressed by durability of Compass tires...

[René Sterental]

Love the report. How do you carry all the S24O camping equipment in those
two bags alone? Can you describe what you carry and how you pack it?

Great photos! Love your spirit!

René

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016, Bill Lindsay  wrote:

> I love the blues that your skies display.  Thanks Mark.
>
> Caption for Photo #2:
>
> "You think my Atlantis is a tank?!  That's not a tank.  THIS is a tank!"
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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Re: [RBW] End of fall s24o - impressed by durability of Compass tires...

[Mark Reimer]

Absolutely!

So the bags are both Carradice Camper Longflaps. On the rear I have my 
sleeping bag stashed inside a waterproof compression bag made by Outdoor 
Research. I was carrying a bulky digital SLR camera in my front bag. If I 
wasn't carrying that, I could have fit all my gear inside these bags. 

Rear bag keeps my 'home' and kitchen:
- Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2 Platinum tent. This is a small 2-person tent. 
It's an amazing 1 person tent. My wife and I often use it together on 
backpacking trips, which makes it pretty "cozy" inside. I removed the poles 
from the tent bag and used the Carradice flap to hold them in place as 
they're just a hair too long to fit inside the bag.
- Thermarest Neoair matress
- Mountain Equipment Co-op blow-up camping pillow
- GSI Dualist pot, with fuel cannister, bowl and coffee beans stuffed inside
- Porlex coffee grinder
- Mini pump
- Aeropress stuffed into the right side pocket, with coffee cup clipped to 
the outside
- Left side pocket had my tools, spare tube/parts and Brooks rain cover


Front bag holds my clothes and most food:
- Rain pants and jacket
- Down jacket
- Two apples and a banana
- Bag of granola and dried fruit for breakfast
- Pad Thai ingredients - I modified this excellent recipe, it's my go-to 
now: http://www.bikepacking.com/plan/bikepacking-recipe-pad-thai/
- Nikon Df in a zip-lock bag, wrapped up with the down jacket for padding 
while riding
- An assortment of chocolate and snacks for riding
- Toilet paper and a bit of newspaper for starting a fire
- Pocket knife
- Dry pair of socks
- Toque for sleeping at night
- I left the side pockets pretty much empty as my bars are too narrow to 
fit the bag with stuffed pockets. If I have dirt drops or albatross bars 
on, it's no problem at all. 

The rear bag was pretty full, but I didn't open up the 'long flap', so 
there is room for quite a bit more. The front wasn't full, definitely could 
have taken more stuff there. 


I've also got a RandiJo bartender bag, which I keep my phone and wallet in, 
as well as a few snacks. I'm running a SONdelux hub with a Sine Wave USB 
charger, keeping my iPhone and Garmin fully charged. At night, I disconnect 
the Sine Wave and use all available power for the eDeluxe light.

I'm carrying two regular sized Klean Kanteen bottles and one over-sized one 
under the downtube. It was enough water for drinking all day and cooking 
dinner/breakfast. 

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:14:19 PM UTC-5, René wrote:
>
> Love the report. How do you carry all the S24O camping equipment in those 
> two bags alone? Can you describe what you carry and how you pack it?
>
> Great photos! Love your spirit!
>
> René 
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016, Bill Lindsay  > wrote:
>
>> I love the blues that your skies display.  Thanks Mark.
>>
>> Caption for Photo #2:
>>
>> "You think my Atlantis is a tank?!  That's not a tank.  THIS is a tank!"
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
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>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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[RBW] Tech question.

[Hugh Smitham]

I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index 
positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone know 
whether the internals are repairable? 

~Hugh

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[RBW] Re: Tech question.

[Bill Lindsay]

The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable.  

1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
2.  exactly which index positions are missed?

The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often people 
rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the shifter has 
been on and off its based several times in its life and people just lose 
track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift pod. 
 The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular keyway. 
 The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base must be 
oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway pointing DOWN 
towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of the bicycle.  

If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end or the 
other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter is just 
shot.  

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index 
> positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone know 
> whether the internals are repairable? 
>
> ~Hugh
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[Hugh Smitham]

Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because
the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its life and
people just lose track.

I tried that Bill.

Sounds like the shifter is shot.

~Hugh

“Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
moving.” ― Albert Einstein

http://velocipeedemusings.com/



On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:

> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable.
>
> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>
> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often people
> rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the shifter has
> been on and off its based several times in its life and people just lose
> track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift pod.
> The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular keyway.
> The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base must be
> oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway pointing DOWN
> towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of the bicycle.
>
> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end or
> the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter is
> just shot.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>
>> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index
>> positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone know
>> whether the internals are repairable?
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Belopsky]

Grant just said ~35mm

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 1:13:27 PM UTC-4, Ryan Ray wrote:
>
> Road 700x44 would be reeeaaay nice :)
>
> - Ryan
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 9:54 AM Belopsky  > wrote:
>
>> Same as in, 51,55,58,62? Will be interesting to see this - I imagine 
>> we're months out from more info
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:51:42 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> The Rodin theme was too obvious to adopt, but it was always in the 
>>> background. It'll likely be a frame only, but we're thinking about whole 
>>> bike, and that's not ruled out. Maybe some of each. It may follow CLEM and 
>>> have a seat lug. Sam is already a good road bike, but the clearances big 
>>> you to fill them up with a huge "road?" tire, and Rodini won't allow that. 
>>> Up to 35mm, probably.
>>> Our bike certainly are not inexpensive, but they cannot possibly be any 
>>> less expensive without do-featuring/de-cooling them or replacing the staff 
>>> with wealthy philanthropists or unemployables! 
>>> I think Will and Roman picked the colors. Same sizes as Sam.
>>>
>>> On Friday, October 7, 2016 at 12:02:36 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:

 His first name is Leo.  He apparently has paws.  Your Roadini that you 
 buy next summer may have a fake panel.  So far, nothing not to like

 Bill Lindsay
 El Cerrito, CA

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Re: [RBW] FS: Schmidt, Carradice, Tubus, Grand Bois, Nitto, XC-Pro Crank, Brooks B15 & C13, Ice Cream!

[Patrick Shea]

I'll take the DA barends.

Cheers,
Patrick

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016, Jack K  wrote:

> Hi Riv-folk,
>
>
> As part of my continuing efforts to turn excess bike bits into rent ...  Lots
> of premo stuff here for your consideration!
>
>
> All prices are "+ shipping", where shipping will be a best guess rounded
> to $5. Figure $10 for saddles, $15 for panniers and $30 for wheels within
> the ConUS. Some things shown in photos, some found after photos taken.
> Happy to supply images on request!
>
>
> *Bags and racks:*
>
>- *NEW Carradice Super-C Saddlepack**:*
>Mounts to saddle rails, not the transverse style of Carradice bag.
>Black waterproof cotton duck, lotsa reflective material, 8 liter capacity,
>This guy: http://tinyurl.com/gwy4mny   *$65*
>- *NEW MUSA Madden Buzzard Rear Panniers:*
>High quality bags sewn in Boulder, CO, I believe the last generation
>of Madden pannier. Purchased from Adventure Cycling website ($200 in 2006),
>but never used. High visibility gold/black color combo. Uses a locking
>attachment system that wraps completely around the rack rail, similar to
>Ortlieb, but you engage the lock with the flip of a finger. Lots of
>standard and mesh pockets for organizing & drying damp gear, reflective
>strips for visibility. A great bit of rugged American made kit! This guy
>here: http://www.suburbancyclist.com/madden.html*$165*
>- *NEW Tubus Cosmo Stainless Rear Rack** (with low rider mounts):*
>Installed, then removed without ever having a pannier mounted on it.
>Original version of the Cosmo, so looks like this:
>http://www.therandonneeshop.com/medi...ubus_Cosmo.jpg
>
> 
>Included is the $13 Tubus "Lower Rack Mounting Kit", which can be used to
>position the rack slightly further back to increase clearance for heels or
>disc brakes, or help on bikes with shortish chainstays. Paid $210+$13=$223
>at TheTouringStore.Com; say *$160* for everything.
>
> *Wheels and Tires:*
>
>
>- *Schmidt SON28 Dyno-hub Tandem Wheelset (10/9/8/7 Spd Shimano):*
> All silver, 700c, 36 spoke Schmidt classic front hub, 40 spoke DT/Hugi
>tandem rear hub (threaded on left for drag brake), Velocity Dyad rims,
>spaced 145 mm OLD (modern non-Santana tandem standard). Bought on list
>or eBay (can’t remember) a few years ago to build my ultimate BOB-ish
>tandem, then never used. Original owner stated they were built by Peter
>White and had less than 1000 miles. I can’t confirm that, but build and
>condition seem consistent. Look good to me, but assume they’ll need a
>touch-up truing (my assumption with any used wheels). No skewers. Cost
>considerably more than $800 to build,   *$525.*
>- *NEW 26” (559) XT M760 / Mavic 717 Wheelset (V-Brake, 10/9/8/7 Spd
>Shimano):*
> All silver. Purchased from one of the big online retailers (Colorado
>Cyclist most likely) back in the 9 speed era when XT M760 was current, but
>never used. When received I did mount a cassette and two different tires to
>test the fit of the tires in my touring frame, then hung in my garage for a
>decade. Silver XT M760 hubs, 32 stainless butted spokes front and rear,
>light/expensive Mavic XC717 rims, original silver XT skewers, tags still
>attached.   *$275*
>-
> *Grand Bois Cypres Tires (a pair of 700c x 32): *Purchased from a fellow
>iBOB, but never used. Tread shows no visible wear, but sidewalls dirty, so
>I assume they've been ridden a bit. These guys:
>http://tinyurl.com/gw9ptln   *$65*
>- *NEW Hutchinson TopSlick Tires (a pair of 26" x 1.2" or 559 x 31mm):*
> New, still in packaging. One tire was test mounted, but never ridden. High
>thread count (127 tpi) tires with flexible sidewalls. 340 grams / tire,
>including the packaging.  *$35*
>
> *Components:*
>
>- *NEW-In-Box Dura-Ace 9 Speed Bar-End Shifters:*
> Bought for (yet another) project that didn’t happen. This is the full kit,
>with shifters, pods, cables, pre-cut cable housing, BB guide and down-tube
>cable stops. Everything that’s metal is beautifully polished alloy. These
>ones here: http://www.rivbike.com/product-p/sh2-9.htm   *$85*
>- *NEW-In-Box Schmidt SONdelux:*
> 32 hole, polished, rim brake model, 100mm width, includes bolt-on skewer –
>everything exactly as it comes from Schmidt. Purchsed from Boulder Bicycles
>where it had been built into a wheel, then immediately unbuilt again when
>customer changed his/her mind. Zero use on this, but very slight marks on
>flanges from spokes. A really beautiful bit of kit! This is it:
>https://www.compasscycle.com/shop/components/hubs/sondelux-
>generator-hub/
>
>*$225*
>- *NOS SunTou

Re: [RBW] End of fall s24o - impressed by durability of Compass tires...

[Jon Dukeman,central Colorado]

Mark,
Thanks for sharing your story and photos of your adventure.
Sounds like you had a great time. Thanks for sharing your list of equipment 
and tire review.
Jon

>









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[RBW] Stolen: My daughters 650b Sequoia

[masmojo]

I ride 650b, but I am guessing most crooks have no idea what it is. I would 
alert shops in the area, because if the crook gets a flat there's probably not 
too many places there that will have the poper sized tires or tubes. It could 
be their undoing!

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Re: [RBW] Stolen: My daughters 650b Sequoia

[Steve Palincsar]

If they have their wits about them they'll discover that every bike shop 
will have a tube that will fit.  Not news here, but MTB 26" [i.e., 559] 
x either 1.5-1.75 or 1.25-1.5 depending on the brand, fit just fine.



On 10/12/2016 03:14 PM, masmojo wrote:

I ride 650b, but I am guessing most crooks have no idea what it is. I would 
alert shops in the area, because if the crook gets a flat there's probably not 
too many places there that will have the poper sized tires or tubes. It could 
be their undoing!



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Re: [RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Grant Petersen]

Road 700x44 is Sam.
Roadini is a cheap Rodeo, for the most part. It'll fit med-reach (around
54-55mm) brakes.
(I use "cheap" in a celebratory, not degrading way!)

Sidepulls (or Paul bolt-on)

B/O for Mark's Rack, but single rear eyelet below, so as not to encourage
the fashionable monster front loads.

Big picture addition is: Let's say you've got your everyday
commuter-trail-tourish bike with fenders, racks, kickstand, basket, voodoo
dolls and stuffed animals, and you love the bike, and you end up doing this
to all of your bikes (this is autobiographical, but it works that way for a
lot of people here, and probably out there, too). Well, at some point, the
bike should force you to rein it all in---not as much as a track bike or a
Cervelo-type bike, but a little, and the Roadini will. Two eyelets in the
rear, one in front, midfork, mid seat stay.

Completes will be doubles, and we're hoping they'll all be cheap enough to
allow people who even KIND of want one to get one.





On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:13 AM, Ryan Ray  wrote:

> Road 700x44 would be reeeaaay nice :)
>
> - Ryan
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 9:54 AM Belopsky 
> wrote:
>
> Same as in, 51,55,58,62? Will be interesting to see this - I imagine we're
> months out from more info
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:51:42 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell
> wrote:
>
> The Rodin theme was too obvious to adopt, but it was always in the
> background. It'll likely be a frame only, but we're thinking about whole
> bike, and that's not ruled out. Maybe some of each. It may follow CLEM and
> have a seat lug. Sam is already a good road bike, but the clearances big
> you to fill them up with a huge "road?" tire, and Rodini won't allow that.
> Up to 35mm, probably.
> Our bike certainly are not inexpensive, but they cannot possibly be any
> less expensive without do-featuring/de-cooling them or replacing the staff
> with wealthy philanthropists or unemployables!
> I think Will and Roman picked the colors. Same sizes as Sam.
>
> On Friday, October 7, 2016 at 12:02:36 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> His first name is Leo.  He apparently has paws.  Your Roadini that you buy
> next summer may have a fake panel.  So far, nothing not to like
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: SUPERNOVA DYNO LIGHTS

[Jeremy Till]

Here's a neat mod of a Honjo fender to accept the Supernova rack mount 
light, by Steve Rex: 

https://flic.kr/p/aLoBf6

On Sunday, October 9, 2016 at 3:06:40 PM UTC-7, Ginz wrote:
>
> I like everything about mine except there is no fender mounted taillight 
> available.
>
> That means you must use a rack mount or seatpost mount.  
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Belopsky]

This is exciting, Grant. I imagine we'll get more info about it in the next 
couple of months, with pre-orders later in the winter/early spring for a 
delivery in June or so? THAT would be lovely for those of us in the colder 
parts of the country

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 3:54:41 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell wrote:
>
> Road 700x44 is Sam. 
> Roadini is a cheap Rodeo, for the most part. It'll fit med-reach (around 
> 54-55mm) brakes.
> (I use "cheap" in a celebratory, not degrading way!)
>
> Sidepulls (or Paul bolt-on) 
>
> B/O for Mark's Rack, but single rear eyelet below, so as not to encourage 
> the fashionable monster front loads. 
>
> Big picture addition is: Let's say you've got your everyday 
> commuter-trail-tourish bike with fenders, racks, kickstand, basket, voodoo 
> dolls and stuffed animals, and you love the bike, and you end up doing this 
> to all of your bikes (this is autobiographical, but it works that way for a 
> lot of people here, and probably out there, too). Well, at some point, the 
> bike should force you to rein it all in---not as much as a track bike or a 
> Cervelo-type bike, but a little, and the Roadini will. Two eyelets in the 
> rear, one in front, midfork, mid seat stay.  
>
> Completes will be doubles, and we're hoping they'll all be cheap enough to 
> allow people who even KIND of want one to get one.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:13 AM, Ryan Ray  > wrote:
>
>> Road 700x44 would be reeeaaay nice :)
>>
>> - Ryan
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 9:54 AM Belopsky > > wrote:
>>
>>> Same as in, 51,55,58,62? Will be interesting to see this - I imagine 
>>> we're months out from more info
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:51:42 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell 
>>> wrote:

 The Rodin theme was too obvious to adopt, but it was always in the 
 background. It'll likely be a frame only, but we're thinking about whole 
 bike, and that's not ruled out. Maybe some of each. It may follow CLEM and 
 have a seat lug. Sam is already a good road bike, but the clearances big 
 you to fill them up with a huge "road?" tire, and Rodini won't allow that. 
 Up to 35mm, probably.
 Our bike certainly are not inexpensive, but they cannot possibly be any 
 less expensive without do-featuring/de-cooling them or replacing the staff 
 with wealthy philanthropists or unemployables! 
 I think Will and Roman picked the colors. Same sizes as Sam.

 On Friday, October 7, 2016 at 12:02:36 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> His first name is Leo.  He apparently has paws.  Your Roadini that you 
> buy next summer may have a fake panel.  So far, nothing not to like
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
 -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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Re: [RBW] Re: SUPERNOVA DYNO LIGHTS

[Patrick Moore]

That's a wonderfull rear rack.

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 2:03 PM, Jeremy Till  wrote:

> Here's a neat mod of a Honjo fender to accept the Supernova rack mount
> light, by Steve Rex:
>
> https://flic.kr/p/aLoBf6
>
> On Sunday, October 9, 2016 at 3:06:40 PM UTC-7, Ginz wrote:
>>
>> I like everything about mine except there is no fender mounted taillight
>> available.
>>
>> That means you must use a rack mount or seatpost mount.
>>
>> --
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Re: [RBW] End of fall s24o - impressed by durability of Compass tires...

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks for the report and photos.

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:21 AM, Mark Reimer  wrote:

> I went on a long s24o this weekend - 108km (about 67 miles) on varying
> surfaces.
>
> The route started with a 'Voyageur Start'. This excellent term was new to
> me. Supposedly the old fur trading voyageurs would paddle out of town for
> only a few miles before stopping for the first night, with the idea that if
> they had forgotten anything critical, they were still able to turn back and
> retrieve forgotten supplies. I can understand the reasoning when you're
> paddling half way across a country.
>
> So, we rolled out of Elma, Manitoba at 2pm and stopped 10km later in
> Whitemouth for some burgers, soup, pumpkin pie and beers. I have to say I'm
> a fan of this voyageur start business..
>
> We hit about 15km of farm roads, which were a mix of gravel roads, mud
> roads, and double track. I was riding Compass Barlow Pass Extra-Lite 38s on
> my Atlantis. We connected to a rolling highway that snakes through the
> Canadian Shield, making for a camp spot at Meditation Lake. Can you think
> of a better-named destination?
>
> I had planned the route to include two special off-road diversions. The
> first was a snowmobile track that ended at an old prison site. The second
> is part of the trans-canada trail, which is mostly crushed stone, exposed
> granite and a touch of grassy single track here and there. Being October,
> all these sections would be done in complete darkness as a result of our
> long, leisurely lunch.
>
> The temperature dropped to about freezing and we kept warm by maintaining
> a respectable pace. It has rained for nearly the entire week prior, so full
> fenders were a must. I was very happy with how the Barlow Pass tires rolled
> over the varied surfaces and had no flats despite the sharp rocky trails,
> exposed granite, and rough roads.
>
> We had all of Meditation Lake to ourselves, save the occasional chorus of
> coyotes and owls in the night. A few beers, some pad thai and a bonfire
> later and we were passed out.
>
> We woke up to the sound of shotguns, which was surprising to say the
> least.  I guess with camping season officially closed, hunting is allowed
> near the camp spot. We passed 6 hunters on our 5km ride back to the
> highway. The ride back was pretty much the same, including a second
> voyageur start for our second breakfast of the day. A stiff headwind
> reduced our pace to between 9-15km/h for the final 50km. It was a grind,
> but still having fun.
>
>
> In the end, we covered 210km, saw several bald eagles, had a fox run along
> with us for about 30 seconds, were treated to a clear night with bright
> stars, and sent autumn on its way properly. The next s24o is my annual
> November Winter Welcomer, which is on the first weekend of November, and
> marks the beginning of the snowy, sub-freezing camping season :)
>
> Hope you all had a great weekend.
>
>
> 
>
>
> 
>
>
> 
>
>
> 
>
>
> 
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
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**
**
*The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

*Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
world revolves.) *Carthusian motto

*It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart

*Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the be

[RBW] Re: Autumn Gravel Ramble in Michigan

[Wayne Naha]

How did your ride go?  Inquiring minds want to know!

On Friday, August 12, 2016 at 3:38:48 PM UTC-4, Marc Irwin wrote:
>
>  On October 8th, The Barry Roubaix will be holding the Fall Fondo. 
>   It is not a race but a casual charity 
> ride over the same course used for the spring competition.  Last year a 
> few of us got together on another weekend 
>  
> and had a great time on the roads.  As charity rides go, it's pretty 
> inexpensive and I thought I would invite a few Riv riders to join.  I will 
> probably get a campsite in Yankee Springs for the weekend and will be glad 
> to share if some are coming from out of town.  The ride starts in downtown 
> Hastings and there's a good chance to see some spectacular foliage in the 
> forests on the rides.
>
> Marc
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: SUPERNOVA DYNO LIGHTS

[Kellie]

Very nice!

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 1:03:33 PM UTC-7, Jeremy Till wrote:
>
> Here's a neat mod of a Honjo fender to accept the Supernova rack mount 
> light, by Steve Rex: 
>
> https://flic.kr/p/aLoBf6
>
> On Sunday, October 9, 2016 at 3:06:40 PM UTC-7, Ginz wrote:
>>
>> I like everything about mine except there is no fender mounted taillight 
>> available.
>>
>> That means you must use a rack mount or seatpost mount.  
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Ryan Ray]

I always forget Sams go up to 44... Hmm...

- Ryan

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 1:39 PM Belopsky  wrote:

> This is exciting, Grant. I imagine we'll get more info about it in the
> next couple of months, with pre-orders later in the winter/early spring for
> a delivery in June or so? THAT would be lovely for those of us in the
> colder parts of the country
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 3:54:41 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell
> wrote:
>
> Road 700x44 is Sam.
> Roadini is a cheap Rodeo, for the most part. It'll fit med-reach (around
> 54-55mm) brakes.
> (I use "cheap" in a celebratory, not degrading way!)
>
> Sidepulls (or Paul bolt-on)
>
> B/O for Mark's Rack, but single rear eyelet below, so as not to encourage
> the fashionable monster front loads.
>
> Big picture addition is: Let's say you've got your everyday
> commuter-trail-tourish bike with fenders, racks, kickstand, basket, voodoo
> dolls and stuffed animals, and you love the bike, and you end up doing this
> to all of your bikes (this is autobiographical, but it works that way for a
> lot of people here, and probably out there, too). Well, at some point, the
> bike should force you to rein it all in---not as much as a track bike or a
> Cervelo-type bike, but a little, and the Roadini will. Two eyelets in the
> rear, one in front, midfork, mid seat stay.
>
> Completes will be doubles, and we're hoping they'll all be cheap enough to
> allow people who even KIND of want one to get one.
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:13 AM, Ryan Ray  wrote:
>
> Road 700x44 would be reeeaaay nice :)
>
> - Ryan
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 9:54 AM Belopsky  wrote:
>
> Same as in, 51,55,58,62? Will be interesting to see this - I imagine we're
> months out from more info
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:51:42 PM UTC-4, Grant @ Rivendell
> wrote:
>
> The Rodin theme was too obvious to adopt, but it was always in the
> background. It'll likely be a frame only, but we're thinking about whole
> bike, and that's not ruled out. Maybe some of each. It may follow CLEM and
> have a seat lug. Sam is already a good road bike, but the clearances big
> you to fill them up with a huge "road?" tire, and Rodini won't allow that.
> Up to 35mm, probably.
> Our bike certainly are not inexpensive, but they cannot possibly be any
> less expensive without do-featuring/de-cooling them or replacing the staff
> with wealthy philanthropists or unemployables!
> I think Will and Roman picked the colors. Same sizes as Sam.
>
> On Friday, October 7, 2016 at 12:02:36 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> His first name is Leo.  He apparently has paws.  Your Roadini that you buy
> next summer may have a fake panel.  So far, nothing not to like
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> --
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Re: [RBW] Stolen: My daughters 650b Sequoia

[Mark R.]

Good points about checking with bike shops, I just put new Nifty Swifties on it 
with fresh tubes, may be a long time before the their gets a flat 0:(

Mark 
SDCA

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[RBW] Credit where it's due (tires)

[Paul G]

Global Cycling Network is a British racing-oriented YouTube channel. Much 
of their advice has been typical of most sources cycling information that 
has a racer sort of bias and is not of much interest to this group.

They did a video on wide tires and gave credit to Bicycling Quarterly and, 
by extension, Jan Heine, as their source for all the benefits of fatter 
tires. I don't think they missed a single one of those benefits that BQ has 
given either.

It's not a perfect video. For instance, they claim a racing bike would need 
disc brakes in order to use wider (32mm) tires when we know that racing 
bikes are simply not optimally designed for wider tire clearances in the 
first place. But I've never seen a racer-type media source give such clear 
reasons to use wider-than-25mm tires.

I know I'm preaching to the choir, but it's still cool that BQ's research 
continues to get more into the mainstream. Let us also not forget that it 
was Grant Petersen himself that originally got Jan interested in wider 
tires.

Here's the YouTube video .

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[dougP]

Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?

dougP

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
> Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because 
> the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its life and 
> people just lose track.
>
> I tried that Bill.
>
> Sounds like the shifter is shot.
>
> ~Hugh
>
> “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep 
> moving.” ― Albert Einstein
>
> http://velocipeedemusings.com/
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay  > wrote:
>
>> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable.  
>>
>> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
>> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>>
>> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often people 
>> rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the shifter has 
>> been on and off its based several times in its life and people just lose 
>> track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift pod.  
>> The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular keyway.  
>> The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base must be 
>> oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway pointing DOWN 
>> towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of the bicycle.  
>>
>> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end or 
>> the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter is 
>> just shot.  
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>>
>>> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index 
>>> positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone know 
>>> whether the internals are repairable? 
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[Hugh Smitham]

I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that is. I
think the issue is the small internal ratchets.

On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP"  wrote:

> Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?
>
> dougP
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>
>> Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake
>> because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its life
>> and people just lose track.
>>
>> I tried that Bill.
>>
>> Sounds like the shifter is shot.
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>> “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
>> moving.” ― Albert Einstein
>>
>> http://velocipeedemusings.com/
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:
>>
>>> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable.
>>>
>>> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
>>> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>>>
>>> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often people
>>> rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the shifter has
>>> been on and off its based several times in its life and people just lose
>>> track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift pod.
>>> The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular keyway.
>>> The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base must be
>>> oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway pointing DOWN
>>> towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of the bicycle.
>>>
>>> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end or
>>> the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter is
>>> just shot.
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:

 I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index
 positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone know
 whether the internals are repairable?

 ~Hugh

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[Hugh Smitham]

And to my understanding not replaceable.

On Oct 12, 2016 5:27 PM, "Hugh Smitham"  wrote:

> I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that is. I
> think the issue is the small internal ratchets.
>
> On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>
>> Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?
>>
>> dougP
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>>
>>> Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake
>>> because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its life
>>> and people just lose track.
>>>
>>> I tried that Bill.
>>>
>>> Sounds like the shifter is shot.
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
>>> “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
>>> moving.” ― Albert Einstein
>>>
>>> http://velocipeedemusings.com/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable.

 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?

 The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often people
 rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the shifter has
 been on and off its based several times in its life and people just lose
 track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift pod.
 The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular keyway.
 The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base must be
 oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway pointing DOWN
 towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of the bicycle.

 If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end or
 the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter is
 just shot.

 Bill Lindsay
 El Cerrito, CA


 On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index
> positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone know
> whether the internals are repairable?
>
> ~Hugh
>
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[RBW] Re: Saddle setback, frame angles, riding position, riding style (was: Can we talk about Riv bike sizing again?)

[GAJett]

For various reasons my main bikes, over 40 years, have always had the 
saddle slammed FORWARD.  On my AHH with a Nitto seatpost, the Brooks Pro is 
as far forward as possible.  My old Raleigh Competition came with a 
straight seatpost and separate saddle clamp.  In this case I was most 
comfortable with the saddle clamp FORWARD of the seatpost, instead of being 
behind.  This may have been the result of a too large frame and stem, but I 
find I like to be forward over the bottom bracket allowing me to spin more 
easily.  Further back I find I'm more of a stomper, which I've never 
liked.  I bike fitter would probably have a field day with my position (if 
not running away crying!).

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 7:37:29 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Starting a new thread about a topic that has interested me for a long 
> time, with a question: do slack angles and therefore (all else equal) 
> saddles well back of bb, work better with upright positions? Or perhaps, an 
> upright position works best with a rearward saddle and thus slack angles?
>
> I recall dithering about a nice Dave Moulton, at a very good price, 
> because of the 74* st angle, and being told that a racing position on a 
> racing bike means being forward over the crank assembly/bb shell. This was 
> confirmed by several experienced ex racers. I finally passed.
>
> The classic bolt upright ride seems to be the Raleigh DL-1, perhaps Dutch 
> city bikes (but I've no experience with them). Such slack angles, high bb 
> shell, and ends of grips practically bumping your knees. I've ridden many 
> such bikes and I've watched others ride them, and I know for a fact that 
> they very strongly discourage an energetic riding style -- if you try to 
> ride hard, you always (and I see others always) reposition the body to 
> negate the design -- lean forward, grab bar next to stem, sit on nose of 
> saddle).
>
> And then there's the gearing: stock on the DL-1 was 46/18 or 72 gi, iirc. 
> Even if 44/18, that's still 68". Even 68" on a very tall, 50 lb bike is 
> damned high.
>
> So the design must have been built with a (1) relaxed or energy conserving 
> and (2) ponderous or high torque/low rpm
>
> It's hard to understand why the DL-1 remained in production for so long; I 
> don't think that this extended product life can't be explained solely on 
> failing-socialist Indian and Chinese economic practices, or pure inertia.
>
> So something about this sort of riding position must work, and therefore 
> one presumes that Raleigh had worked out the riding style, and then the 
> position, and then the angles and lengths that were most efficient with 
> this position.
>
> Translate this into the upright Rivendells. These have low bbs, so that's 
> different; they also come with low gearing -- I get the impression that 
> these favor spinning, and not mashing?
>
> And the Rivs have startlingly long tts -- to countereffect the rearward 
> sweep of the bar and the slacker heads? So, this would mean a more 
> aggressive riding position, and therefore more spirited riding style, than 
> what the DL-1 was designed for.
>
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2016 at 2:19 PM, Eric Karnes  > wrote:
>
>> My guess that this is mostly a commentary on the use of fairly steep seat 
>> tube angles (73–75 degrees) on many road/sport/touring bikes from (very 
>> roughly) the 80s to present. This can make it very hard for some people to 
>> get a proper weight distribution without slamming the seat back, using an 
>> ultra-setback seatpost, or a combination of both. I had a mid-eighties Trek 
>> sport touring bike like this. I loved the way the frame rode, but the 73.5 
>> degree sta made it impossible for me to get comfortable.
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 2:27:41 PM UTC-4, Belopsky wrote:
>>>
>>> [...]
>>> As a follow-up, I saw somewhere Grant writing that people like to slam 
>>> the seats ALL the way back - is this due to the upright bars / higher than 
>>> seat bars / upright posture on a bike?
>>>
>>
On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 7:37:29 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Starting a new thread about a topic that has interested me for a long 
> time, with a question: do slack angles and therefore (all else equal) 
> saddles well back of bb, work better with upright positions? Or perhaps, an 
> upright position works best with a rearward saddle and thus slack angles?
>
> I recall dithering about a nice Dave Moulton, at a very good price, 
> because of the 74* st angle, and being told that a racing position on a 
> racing bike means being forward over the crank assembly/bb shell. This was 
> confirmed by several experienced ex racers. I finally passed.
>
> The classic bolt upright ride seems to be the Raleigh DL-1, perhaps Dutch 
> city bikes (but I've no experience with them). Such slack angles, high bb 
> shell, and ends of grips practically bumping your knees. I've ridden many 
> such bikes and I've watched others ride them, and I know for a fact that 

[RBW] WTB: 650b front wheel and MAP + Ahearne Bars

[Leif Eckstrom]

Hello,

I need a front wheel for a 650b conversion for a rim-braked commuter. I've 
got a Velocity dyad for the rear in silver, so a 32h or 36h dyad or a23 
silver front wheel would be ideal. 
I'd also be interested in a pacenti rimmed front wheel in 32 or 36h, or 
possibly a wheelset if the rear is 120, 126, or 130 and the price is right. 
Please let me know what you've got.

I've seen the ZAC19 wheelset that's super cheap on eBay through the uglyrhm 
seller, but hoping someone here has something that they're not using. If 
not, uglyrhm is my fall back plan.

I'd also like to try the wider 61.5 cm Ahearne + Map bars. Off-list 
messages welcomed. 

Thank you!
Leif
Chicago

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[dougP]

Now you've got my curiousity.  I'm thinking the wear part is the silver 
plastic goodie that Bill mentions having to be in correct alignment.  It's 
a loose part so it is replaceable.  Whether they're readily available is 
another question.  On my 8 speed, I just switched to friction a couple of 
years ago but admit having index would be nice.  

dougP

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 5:27:48 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
> And to my understanding not replaceable. 
>
> On Oct 12, 2016 5:27 PM, "Hugh Smitham" > 
> wrote:
>
>> I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that is. I 
>> think the issue is the small internal ratchets. 
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP" > wrote:
>>
>>> Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?
>>>
>>> dougP
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:

 Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake 
 because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its 
 life 
 and people just lose track.

 I tried that Bill.

 Sounds like the shifter is shot.

 ~Hugh

 “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep 
 moving.” ― Albert Einstein

 http://velocipeedemusings.com/



 On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay  
 wrote:

> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable.  
>
> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>
> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often people 
> rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the shifter has 
> been on and off its based several times in its life and people just lose 
> track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift pod.  
> The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular keyway.  
> The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base must be 
> oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway pointing DOWN 
> towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of the bicycle.  
>
> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end 
> or the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter 
> is 
> just shot.  
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham 
> wrote:
>>
>> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index 
>> positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone 
>> know 
>> whether the internals are repairable? 
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Saddle setback, frame angles, riding position, riding style (was: Can we talk about Riv bike sizing again?)

[Patrick Moore]

That actually seems to fit with the bikes and the setups discussed. No one
in the world is going to spin a 72" gear, let alone a 96" gear (Sturmey
Archer 3d, 133% of direct) on a DL-1; and the DL-1 has the saddle wy
back.

And this also fits with what I've heard from racers: when you want to
generate power -- ie, when you are spinning all out -- you are "on the
rivet" -- ie, sitting on the nose of the saddle, where, back when racers
rode Brooks Pros or Swallows, there was a rivet attaching the leather to
the front of the saddle frame. And see the TT and pro road race bikes in
the post immediately prioer to this one.

I recall setting up what would have been a very nice 1989 Falcon, toute
531C with cool '80s painted Sante group. This was a bike with long stays
and very short front/center (hard to fit a thumb between 20" tire and down
tube).

I was chasing KOPS (knee over pedal spindle) with short femurs (my mother
was Filipino) and a liking for full leg extension on the downstroke. I had
to buy a mtb seatpost to get the saddle high enough, and I had the Turbo or
Flite so far forward that it would tilt under my weight; I had to use blue
Loctite on the cradle to hold it level. Of course, this also meant a 140 mm
stem (6" below saddle).

 I was sure fast spinning on the level -- these were the days when I could
maintain 20-21 in a 42/17 with a 20 mm tire -- but downhills were scary,
especially with gusty winds. And, standing on climbs, I'd skip the rear
wheel when I torqued down. (Grant later advised me to get bar up and back,
and saddle back and down; and I've been happy ever since.) Now the lowest I
go on our local 5 mile Tramway climb is 60", and usually 66" -- and I've
done it in a 76" gear.

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 7:44 PM, GAJett  wrote:

> For various reasons my main bikes, over 40 years, have always had the
> saddle slammed FORWARD.  On my AHH with a Nitto seatpost, the Brooks Pro is
> as far forward as possible.  My old Raleigh Competition came with a
> straight seatpost and separate saddle clamp.  In this case I was most
> comfortable with the saddle clamp FORWARD of the seatpost, instead of being
> behind.  This may have been the result of a too large frame and stem, but I
> find I like to be forward over the bottom bracket allowing me to spin more
> easily.  Further back I find I'm more of a stomper, which I've never
> liked.  I bike fitter would probably have a field day with my position (if
> not running away crying!).
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[Hugh Smitham]

Doug,

I think that part rotates 90 degrees and changes the pull ratio.  The part
I think that's broken is the plastic ratcheted pieces. When I get home I'll
pull it apart and investigate.

On Oct 12, 2016 7:56 PM, "dougP"  wrote:

Now you've got my curiousity.  I'm thinking the wear part is the silver
plastic goodie that Bill mentions having to be in correct alignment.  It's
a loose part so it is replaceable.  Whether they're readily available is
another question.  On my 8 speed, I just switched to friction a couple of
years ago but admit having index would be nice.

dougP


On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 5:27:48 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:

> And to my understanding not replaceable.
>
> On Oct 12, 2016 5:27 PM, "Hugh Smitham"  wrote:
>
>> I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that is. I
>> think the issue is the small internal ratchets.
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>>
>>> Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?
>>>
>>> dougP
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:

 Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake
 because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its life
 and people just lose track.

 I tried that Bill.

 Sounds like the shifter is shot.

 ~Hugh

 “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
 moving.” ― Albert Einstein

 http://velocipeedemusings.com/



 On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay 
 wrote:

> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable.
>
> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>
> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often people
> rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the shifter has
> been on and off its based several times in its life and people just lose
> track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift pod.
> The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular keyway.
> The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base must be
> oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway pointing DOWN
> towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of the bicycle.
>
> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end
> or the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter 
> is
> just shot.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham
> wrote:
>>
>> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the index
>> positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does anyone 
>> know
>> whether the internals are repairable?
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[dougP]

This may be it:

https://www.modernbike.com/shimano-sl-bs78-rear-shift-lever-boss-cover

But this doesn't say how many speeds.  It does say what levers it fits.  
When Shimano first brought out SIS, those little tabs inside these washers 
used to break off.  Bike shops had bags of them & just handed out 
replacements.  I haven't taken mine apart to see what's failed.  It could 
be some of the tabs are worn to the point of not accurately indexing.  Now 
I've got a project for tomorrow.  

dougP

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 8:03:10 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
> Doug, 
>
> I think that part rotates 90 degrees and changes the pull ratio.  The part 
> I think that's broken is the plastic ratcheted pieces. When I get home I'll 
> pull it apart and investigate. 
>
> On Oct 12, 2016 7:56 PM, "dougP" > wrote:
>
> Now you've got my curiousity.  I'm thinking the wear part is the silver 
> plastic goodie that Bill mentions having to be in correct alignment.  It's 
> a loose part so it is replaceable.  Whether they're readily available is 
> another question.  On my 8 speed, I just switched to friction a couple of 
> years ago but admit having index would be nice.  
>
> dougP
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 5:27:48 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
>> And to my understanding not replaceable. 
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016 5:27 PM, "Hugh Smitham"  wrote:
>>
>>> I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that is. 
>>> I think the issue is the small internal ratchets. 
>>>
>>> On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>>>
 Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?

 dougP

 On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
> Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake 
> because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its 
> life 
> and people just lose track.
>
> I tried that Bill.
>
> Sounds like the shifter is shot.
>
> ~Hugh
>
> “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep 
> moving.” ― Albert Einstein
>
> http://velocipeedemusings.com/
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay  
> wrote:
>
>> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not repairable. 
>>  
>>
>> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
>> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>>
>> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often 
>> people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the 
>> shifter 
>> has been on and off its based several times in its life and people just 
>> lose track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift 
>> pod.  The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular 
>> keyway.  The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base 
>> must be oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway 
>> pointing DOWN towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of 
>> the 
>> bicycle.  
>>
>> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end 
>> or the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your shifter 
>> is 
>> just shot.  
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the 
>>> index positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does 
>>> anyone 
>>> know whether the internals are repairable? 
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
>> -- 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[Hugh Smitham]

So yours is broken too?

On Oct 12, 2016 8:09 PM, "dougP"  wrote:

> This may be it:
>
> https://www.modernbike.com/shimano-sl-bs78-rear-shift-lever-boss-cover
>
> But this doesn't say how many speeds.  It does say what levers it fits.
> When Shimano first brought out SIS, those little tabs inside these washers
> used to break off.  Bike shops had bags of them & just handed out
> replacements.  I haven't taken mine apart to see what's failed.  It could
> be some of the tabs are worn to the point of not accurately indexing.  Now
> I've got a project for tomorrow.
>
> dougP
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 8:03:10 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>
>> Doug,
>>
>> I think that part rotates 90 degrees and changes the pull ratio.  The
>> part I think that's broken is the plastic ratcheted pieces. When I get home
>> I'll pull it apart and investigate.
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016 7:56 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>>
>> Now you've got my curiousity.  I'm thinking the wear part is the silver
>> plastic goodie that Bill mentions having to be in correct alignment.  It's
>> a loose part so it is replaceable.  Whether they're readily available is
>> another question.  On my 8 speed, I just switched to friction a couple of
>> years ago but admit having index would be nice.
>>
>> dougP
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 5:27:48 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>
>>> And to my understanding not replaceable.
>>>
>>> On Oct 12, 2016 5:27 PM, "Hugh Smitham"  wrote:
>>>
 I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that is.
 I think the issue is the small internal ratchets.

 On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP"  wrote:

> Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?
>
> dougP
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham
> wrote:
>>
>> Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake
>> because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its 
>> life
>> and people just lose track.
>>
>> I tried that Bill.
>>
>> Sounds like the shifter is shot.
>>
>> ~Hugh
>>
>> “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
>> moving.” ― Albert Einstein
>>
>> http://velocipeedemusings.com/
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not
>>> repairable.
>>>
>>> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
>>> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>>>
>>> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often
>>> people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the 
>>> shifter
>>> has been on and off its based several times in its life and people just
>>> lose track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the shift
>>> pod.  The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular
>>> keyway.  The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter base
>>> must be oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway
>>> pointing DOWN towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of 
>>> the
>>> bicycle.
>>>
>>> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one end
>>> or the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your 
>>> shifter is
>>> just shot.
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham
>>> wrote:

 I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the
 index positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does 
 anyone
 know whether the internals are repairable?

 ~Hugh

>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in
>>> the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>> pic/rbw-owners-bunch/Wz8uc5aFq0s/unsubscribe.
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>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: ROADINI tease on the BLUG

[Surlyprof]

And even 45 Smart Sams if you wanna get dirty.

John

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Re: [RBW] Re: Saddle setback, frame angles, riding position, riding style (was: Can we talk about Riv bike sizing again?)

[René Sterental]

I studied macroeconomics with Eric, and then we both did graduate studies
on bike geometry.

I can't say that you are all right or wrong, but I can say that on all my
Rivendell bikes and also on my custom, which has a slacker head tube, the
only position I'm comfortable in is with the extended set back Nitto lugged
seat post and the Brooks leather saddles, B17 or B67 pushed fully back.
Only then, do I feel my weight is not all resting on my hands. If I could,
I might still push them further back a bit. With the C17 on my Atlantis,
since the rails are longer, I didn't need to push it all the way to the
end. Without the extended set back on the lugged post, which was the main
reason for me to go from the 58 Betty to the 60 Cheviot, I cannot get as
far back as I need to.

Is that because I'm still quite overweight? Maybe. My weight loss which has
slipped back noticeably this year, allowed me to lean forward more and get
overall more comfortable. I still need that saddle set back quite a bit.
Maybe I'm just weird.

When I figure the root causes and theories behind it all, I'll make a
significant impact on the macroeconomics theory as well. Don't wait
standing up for me to figure it out... :-)

René

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 8:02 PM, Patrick Moore  wrote:

> That actually seems to fit with the bikes and the setups discussed. No one
> in the world is going to spin a 72" gear, let alone a 96" gear (Sturmey
> Archer 3d, 133% of direct) on a DL-1; and the DL-1 has the saddle wy
> back.
>
> And this also fits with what I've heard from racers: when you want to
> generate power -- ie, when you are spinning all out -- you are "on the
> rivet" -- ie, sitting on the nose of the saddle, where, back when racers
> rode Brooks Pros or Swallows, there was a rivet attaching the leather to
> the front of the saddle frame. And see the TT and pro road race bikes in
> the post immediately prioer to this one.
>
> I recall setting up what would have been a very nice 1989 Falcon, toute
> 531C with cool '80s painted Sante group. This was a bike with long stays
> and very short front/center (hard to fit a thumb between 20" tire and down
> tube).
>
> I was chasing KOPS (knee over pedal spindle) with short femurs (my mother
> was Filipino) and a liking for full leg extension on the downstroke. I had
> to buy a mtb seatpost to get the saddle high enough, and I had the Turbo or
> Flite so far forward that it would tilt under my weight; I had to use blue
> Loctite on the cradle to hold it level. Of course, this also meant a 140 mm
> stem (6" below saddle).
>
>  I was sure fast spinning on the level -- these were the days when I could
> maintain 20-21 in a 42/17 with a 20 mm tire -- but downhills were scary,
> especially with gusty winds. And, standing on climbs, I'd skip the rear
> wheel when I torqued down. (Grant later advised me to get bar up and back,
> and saddle back and down; and I've been happy ever since.) Now the lowest I
> go on our local 5 mile Tramway climb is 60", and usually 66" -- and I've
> done it in a 76" gear.
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 7:44 PM, GAJett  wrote:
>
>> For various reasons my main bikes, over 40 years, have always had the
>> saddle slammed FORWARD.  On my AHH with a Nitto seatpost, the Brooks Pro is
>> as far forward as possible.  My old Raleigh Competition came with a
>> straight seatpost and separate saddle clamp.  In this case I was most
>> comfortable with the saddle clamp FORWARD of the seatpost, instead of being
>> behind.  This may have been the result of a too large frame and stem, but I
>> find I like to be forward over the bottom bracket allowing me to spin more
>> easily.  Further back I find I'm more of a stomper, which I've never
>> liked.  I bike fitter would probably have a field day with my position (if
>> not running away crying!).
>>
>> --
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Re: [RBW] End of fall s24o - impressed by durability of Compass tires...

[René Sterental]

Wow. I'm going to have to try to see if I can fit the same things the way
you do... Last time I tried, several years ago, it seems to me my stuff
took up a lot more space. And no large DSLR...

BTW, what lens(es) do you bring along?

Seriously impressed,

René

On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:30 AM, Mark Reimer  wrote:

> Absolutely!
>
> So the bags are both Carradice Camper Longflaps. On the rear I have my
> sleeping bag stashed inside a waterproof compression bag made by Outdoor
> Research. I was carrying a bulky digital SLR camera in my front bag. If I
> wasn't carrying that, I could have fit all my gear inside these bags.
>
> Rear bag keeps my 'home' and kitchen:
> - Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2 Platinum tent. This is a small 2-person tent.
> It's an amazing 1 person tent. My wife and I often use it together on
> backpacking trips, which makes it pretty "cozy" inside. I removed the poles
> from the tent bag and used the Carradice flap to hold them in place as
> they're just a hair too long to fit inside the bag.
> - Thermarest Neoair matress
> - Mountain Equipment Co-op blow-up camping pillow
> - GSI Dualist pot, with fuel cannister, bowl and coffee beans stuffed
> inside
> - Porlex coffee grinder
> - Mini pump
> - Aeropress stuffed into the right side pocket, with coffee cup clipped to
> the outside
> - Left side pocket had my tools, spare tube/parts and Brooks rain cover
>
>
> Front bag holds my clothes and most food:
> - Rain pants and jacket
> - Down jacket
> - Two apples and a banana
> - Bag of granola and dried fruit for breakfast
> - Pad Thai ingredients - I modified this excellent recipe, it's my go-to
> now: http://www.bikepacking.com/plan/bikepacking-recipe-pad-thai/
> - Nikon Df in a zip-lock bag, wrapped up with the down jacket for padding
> while riding
> - An assortment of chocolate and snacks for riding
> - Toilet paper and a bit of newspaper for starting a fire
> - Pocket knife
> - Dry pair of socks
> - Toque for sleeping at night
> - I left the side pockets pretty much empty as my bars are too narrow to
> fit the bag with stuffed pockets. If I have dirt drops or albatross bars
> on, it's no problem at all.
>
> The rear bag was pretty full, but I didn't open up the 'long flap', so
> there is room for quite a bit more. The front wasn't full, definitely could
> have taken more stuff there.
>
>
> I've also got a RandiJo bartender bag, which I keep my phone and wallet
> in, as well as a few snacks. I'm running a SONdelux hub with a Sine Wave
> USB charger, keeping my iPhone and Garmin fully charged. At night, I
> disconnect the Sine Wave and use all available power for the eDeluxe light.
>
> I'm carrying two regular sized Klean Kanteen bottles and one over-sized
> one under the downtube. It was enough water for drinking all day and
> cooking dinner/breakfast.
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 12:14:19 PM UTC-5, René wrote:
>>
>> Love the report. How do you carry all the S24O camping equipment in those
>> two bags alone? Can you describe what you carry and how you pack it?
>>
>> Great photos! Love your spirit!
>>
>> René
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016, Bill Lindsay  wrote:
>>
>>> I love the blues that your skies display.  Thanks Mark.
>>>
>>> Caption for Photo #2:
>>>
>>> "You think my Atlantis is a tank?!  That's not a tank.  THIS is a tank!"
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>


 










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Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[dougP]

A couple of years ago the indexing got imprecise on a couple of the most 
commonly used positions so I switched it to friction.  I'm guessing some of 
those little tabs are worn.  Used to be when you disassembled the old SIS 
shifters little bits of broken plastic would fall out.  I just never took 
my current ones apart to see what the problem was.  

dougP

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 8:12:49 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>
> So yours is broken too?
>
> On Oct 12, 2016 8:09 PM, "dougP" > wrote:
>
>> This may be it:
>>
>> https://www.modernbike.com/shimano-sl-bs78-rear-shift-lever-boss-cover
>>
>> But this doesn't say how many speeds.  It does say what levers it fits.  
>> When Shimano first brought out SIS, those little tabs inside these washers 
>> used to break off.  Bike shops had bags of them & just handed out 
>> replacements.  I haven't taken mine apart to see what's failed.  It could 
>> be some of the tabs are worn to the point of not accurately indexing.  Now 
>> I've got a project for tomorrow.  
>>
>> dougP
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 8:03:10 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>>
>>> Doug, 
>>>
>>> I think that part rotates 90 degrees and changes the pull ratio.  The 
>>> part I think that's broken is the plastic ratcheted pieces. When I get home 
>>> I'll pull it apart and investigate. 
>>>
>>> On Oct 12, 2016 7:56 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>>>
>>> Now you've got my curiousity.  I'm thinking the wear part is the silver 
>>> plastic goodie that Bill mentions having to be in correct alignment.  It's 
>>> a loose part so it is replaceable.  Whether they're readily available is 
>>> another question.  On my 8 speed, I just switched to friction a couple of 
>>> years ago but admit having index would be nice.  
>>>
>>> dougP
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 5:27:48 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>>
 And to my understanding not replaceable. 

 On Oct 12, 2016 5:27 PM, "Hugh Smitham"  wrote:

> I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that 
> is. I think the issue is the small internal ratchets. 
>
> On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>
>> Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?
>>
>> dougP
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake 
>>> because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its 
>>> life 
>>> and people just lose track.
>>>
>>> I tried that Bill.
>>>
>>> Sounds like the shifter is shot.
>>>
>>> ~Hugh
>>>
>>> “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep 
>>> moving.” ― Albert Einstein
>>>
>>> http://velocipeedemusings.com/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not 
 repairable.  

 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?

 The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often 
 people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the 
 shifter 
 has been on and off its based several times in its life and people 
 just 
 lose track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the 
 shift 
 pod.  The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular 
 keyway.  The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter 
 base 
 must be oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway 
 pointing DOWN towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of 
 the 
 bicycle.  

 If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one 
 end or the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your 
 shifter is just shot.  

 Bill Lindsay
 El Cerrito, CA


 On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:30:49 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham 
 wrote:
>
> I have a right dura ace bar con shifter that misses some of the 
> index positions. It works fine in friction but I like my index. Does 
> anyone 
> know whether the internals are repairable? 
>
> ~Hugh
>
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 Visit this gro

Re: [RBW] Re: Tech question.

[Hugh Smitham]

Well it sure would be nice if they were repairable.  Bill L. believes
they're done.

I know this much the washer you showed is on both sides. Meaning the left
shifter non indexing as well as the right rear deaurailler shifter. On the
left you can rotate it 90 degrees to change the pull ratio from a double to
a triple. I fiddled with that ring on the right and sure enough the shifter
had more range of motion. But when I counted the clicks (there should be 9)
the middle was smooth, no clicks, which led me to believe the finer more
intricate mechanism was stripped. So I decided to ask whether it was
repairable?

On the bright side, even when the indexed part fails like you did by just
switching to friction you can still get by. With my old MTB rapid fire
shifters when they went they went.

On Oct 12, 2016 9:37 PM, "dougP"  wrote:

> A couple of years ago the indexing got imprecise on a couple of the most
> commonly used positions so I switched it to friction.  I'm guessing some of
> those little tabs are worn.  Used to be when you disassembled the old SIS
> shifters little bits of broken plastic would fall out.  I just never took
> my current ones apart to see what the problem was.
>
> dougP
>
> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 8:12:49 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:
>>
>> So yours is broken too?
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016 8:09 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>>
>>> This may be it:
>>>
>>> https://www.modernbike.com/shimano-sl-bs78-rear-shift-lever-boss-cover
>>>
>>> But this doesn't say how many speeds.  It does say what levers it fits.
>>> When Shimano first brought out SIS, those little tabs inside these washers
>>> used to break off.  Bike shops had bags of them & just handed out
>>> replacements.  I haven't taken mine apart to see what's failed.  It could
>>> be some of the tabs are worn to the point of not accurately indexing.  Now
>>> I've got a project for tomorrow.
>>>
>>> dougP
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 8:03:10 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:

 Doug,

 I think that part rotates 90 degrees and changes the pull ratio.  The
 part I think that's broken is the plastic ratcheted pieces. When I get home
 I'll pull it apart and investigate.

 On Oct 12, 2016 7:56 PM, "dougP"  wrote:

 Now you've got my curiousity.  I'm thinking the wear part is the silver
 plastic goodie that Bill mentions having to be in correct alignment.  It's
 a loose part so it is replaceable.  Whether they're readily available is
 another question.  On my 8 speed, I just switched to friction a couple of
 years ago but admit having index would be nice.

 dougP


 On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 5:27:48 PM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham wrote:

> And to my understanding not replaceable.
>
> On Oct 12, 2016 5:27 PM, "Hugh Smitham"  wrote:
>
>> I wouldn't even know where to start looking for that? Nor what that
>> is. I think the issue is the small internal ratchets.
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016 5:17 PM, "dougP"  wrote:
>>
>>> Is it possible to buy just the indexing washer?
>>>
>>> dougP
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, October 12, 2016 at 10:43:05 AM UTC-7, Hugh Smitham
>>> wrote:

 Very often people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake
 because the shifter has been on and off its based several times in its 
 life
 and people just lose track.

 I tried that Bill.

 Sounds like the shifter is shot.

 ~Hugh

 “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep
 moving.” ― Albert Einstein

 http://velocipeedemusings.com/



 On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 10:40 AM, Bill Lindsay 
 wrote:

> The internals of a shimano indexed barcon shifter are not
> repairable.
>
> 1.  What model exactly is your shifter?
> 2.  exactly which index positions are missed?
>
> The answers to 1 and 2 might imply a setup mistake.  Very often
> people rotate the shifter base by 90 degrees by mistake because the 
> shifter
> has been on and off its based several times in its life and people 
> just
> lose track.  The base piece fits onto a square protuberance on the 
> shift
> pod.  The shifter itself has a round recess with a single rectangular
> keyway.  The corresponding round feature and keyway on the shifter 
> base
> must be oriented correctly.  The correct orientation has the keyway
> pointing DOWN towards the ground, tilted slightly towards the REAR of 
> the
> bicycle.
>
> If you are missing random middle shifts, and are not missing one
> end or the other, then this setup error is not your problem and your
> shifter is just shot.
>
> Bill Lindsay
>>>