[RBW] Re: Sam Hillborn

[Evan E.]

Carla:  About five years ago I bought a brand-new 56 Sam in 700c. Loved it: 
comfortable, stable, versatile, fun. I only sold it because I discovered 
that I much prefer my bikes pre-scratched and at least 20 years old. But 
that was just my particular illness. The Sam was (is) still a terrific 
bike. Oh, and for all of its good manners and confidence-inspiring 
stability, it still moved me down the road just as quickly as my Miyata 
road bike ever did. Hey, it's a Rivendell!

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[RBW] Re: cool new geometry section on rivbike.com

[Sky Coulter]

Man, 

I'd so like those numbers myself. I think I'll end up calling to find them 
out before pulling the trigger on a frameset, but it'd be great to have 
them in the geometry grid itself.

Sky in new west

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 10:07:02 PM UTC-8, Stuart Lovinggood wrote:
>
> A little bummed the standover heights for Joe aren't listed, if only for 
> the reason that I've tried two of those and would like to know how their 
> calculations match to my fit. 

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Re: [RBW] iBert with drops - workable?

[Nhat Vu]

I've tried drops with an iBert, but the fit was too tight under the bars as
you've mentioned. My little guy outgrew the space between the bars and leg
support very quickly and complained about it hurting him when he gets on
and off the seat. I also found the setup was uncomfortable for me too, as
the seat+kid positioning prevented me from easily reaching the
hoods/brakes. I mostly used the flat sections behind the hoods and near the
stem, but not a very safe way to ride unless you have some interrupter
levers or similar.

I ended up switching to a Yepp mini, which completely alleviated the tight
fit under the bars for my son's legs and slightly improved the reach issue
for me. BTW, the Yepp mini is very similar to this seat seen here on a bike
with drops: https://www.instagram.com/p/BBOPXbLtWAc/. My wife's bike has
upright bars and is way more suitable for this type of setup, so I'd
recommend upright bars instead.

Nhat
Menlo Park, CA

On Mar 9, 2017 1:18 PM, "Sky Coulter"  wrote:

> I put an ibert on my clementine with bosco bullmoose bars. Works ok, but i
> had to cut part of the seat away to accomodate the bullmoose section.  Our
> little girl River is still too inclined to lay back to try to make eye
> contact w me for us to go for many bike rides just yet (i worry about
> hitting a bump when she's looking back and hurting her neck).
>
> I briefly tried setting it up w drops, but thought it would be a lot safer
> w upright bars. I'd recommend going w a non bullmoose version of swept back
> bars to get the seat far forward.
>
> Sky in new west
>
> On Mar 9, 2017, at 12:55 PM, Jim Bronson  wrote:
>
> I mounted it up on my Road Standard/Custom with 46cm Noodles, seems pretty
> tight under the horizontal part of the bar.  Should I switch one of my
> Rivendells to upright bars to run this?  I have some upright bars in my
> parts bin, I think some Moustaches and maybe Albatross(?) not exactly
> sure.  It just seems like an upright bar would work better when I eyeball
> it.
>
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[RBW] Re: Sam Frame on Ebay (need advice)

[Antone Könst]

Dissuaded, thanks folks!  Now that Riv. is doing financing via PayPal 
thinking it might be time. 

Along the same lines as my initial post, there is a potentially shady but 
VERY well priced Cheviot on the NY craigslist (55cm, grey, new) 
https://newyork.craigslist.org/que/bik/6023730572.html for 18something. 
 Heads up. 

And, now completely off track, 

Can you be too heavy for a Cheviot? I'm about 220, was thinking a Sam might 
be stiffer than a 60 Chev. but the Chev is more appealing...thoughts?


On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 11:37:52 AM UTC-5, Antone Könst wrote:
>
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rivendell-Bicycle-Works-2011-Sam-Hillborne-60cm-Frameset-Green-Brakes-Seatpost-/252749473859
>
> This has been up for a long time now - seems expensive considering 6 years 
> 12,000 miles and headset/bb not installed, lots of chips...am I wrong to 
> not pull the trigger? (looking for 58 Sam used) 
> Also it's 60cm, is that just an old size? Assuming it's 60 relative to the 
> current 58 and 62 (as in, between the two), and not a different sizing 
> approach from 2011. 
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[Zach Roeder]

My Nitto 34F has carried more than 50lbs on occasion with no noticable flex. 
I'm not saying that you should exceed the max weight rating, but I think it is 
conservative.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[Timothy Orr]

Yeah, I guess I'll have to do that if j tour. Sometimes I really load the bike 
with stuff around town and I have a bike seat for my son on the back, so I'm 
just looking for an easy solution. 

Thanks!

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[RBW] cool new geometry section on rivbike.com

[Stuart Lovinggood]

A little bummed the standover heights for Joe aren't listed, if only for the 
reason that I've tried two of those and would like to know how their 
calculations match to my fit. 

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Re: [RBW] Sam Hillborn

[James Warren]

I have a double digit bike stable, and it might be the most often ridden in 
that stable.
And that includes the Hunqapillar, on which I travel city to city.


Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 8, 2017, at 4:18 PM, Carla Waugh  wrote:
> 
> Hello Sam owners I'm thinking about purchasing a Sam for retirement partly 
> price mostly because it's a Rivendell and lugged. I have one other bike it's 
> a custom 650B and I know the Sam is a 700c. Ideas? Thoughts? Thanks
> 
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Re: [RBW] Sam Hillborn

[James Warren]

It's a bike that I think about riding when I'm not riding it.


Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 8, 2017, at 4:18 PM, Carla Waugh  wrote:
> 
> Hello Sam owners I'm thinking about purchasing a Sam for retirement partly 
> price mostly because it's a Rivendell and lugged. I have one other bike it's 
> a custom 650B and I know the Sam is a 700c. Ideas? Thoughts? Thanks
> 
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[RBW] Re: Sam Hillborn

['Beaverton Bob' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Hi Carla, 

SHORT VERSION:  Get one, you will love it.  

LONG VERSION:  I also have a Sam Hillborne, 55cm size, 700c wheels.  Just 
bought it in 2016 from Rivelo here in Portland.  I got one of the Complete 
Drop-Bar bikes.  If it matters, they are now $100 less than when I bought 
mine, and I thought the original price was a good deal!  

I am a long-time roadie, and used to do triathlons semi-competitively.  I 
still have an older Cannondale, 54cm, essentially a typical race-oriented 
road bike.  I was looking for a do-it-all bike, one to basically ride and 
keep for life.  I wanted one to commute, ride a century on, and go on 
gravel or occasional singletrack.  Before I decided on the Sam, I 
considered other options.  I looked at titanium bikes, then seriously at a 
carbon(!) framed gravel bike with disc brakes.  However, I was always 
intrigued by Rivendells (since 2008 or so), and knew I had to at least try 
one.  Finally, I test-rode a Sam Hillborne.  It was a revelation.  The 
Hillborne I tried had Albatross bars, but it felt fun - like bike riding as 
a kid!  

I first wanted an A Homer Hilsen, but the more all-around nature of the 
Hillborne won me over.  The price was more affordable as well.  I went with 
the Complete Drop-Bar bike.  It had what I thought were pretty wide 
handlebars, 46cm bars for the 55cm frame size.  In comparison, my Cannonade 
has 40cm bars, and I thought those fit me well.  I got used to the wider 
bars quickly.  I also got Grip King pedals, my first platform pedals since 
childhood.  They were also a pleasant surprise.  I now recommend platform 
pedals to all my cycling friends.  No more looking for shoes, just hop on 
the bike and ride in whatever shoes you are wearing.

At this time, all my rides have been less than 1.5 hours.  I have the bike 
set-up in pretty much typical Rivendell fashion.  I have fenders, a stand, 
a rear rack, bell, lights, etc.  I really only feel the extra weight when 
riding uphill.  The bike feels very stable, and a lot of fun to ride.  In 
comparison to my "road" bike, I particularly like the wider tires and the 
full fenders.  I still have mixed thoughts on the non-indexed bar-end 
shifters (I am so used to brifters and indexed downtube shifters), but I 
really like the triple crank.  

I am thinking of trying out a mustache handlebar next and looking forward 
to some gravel or off-road riding this Spring.  FWIW, I have not ridden my 
Cannonade since getting my Sam.  I still intend to keep both bikes, and I 
am currently building up a vintage steel (lugged) rigid 26" MTB.

As long as you know what the Sam Hillborne is, and isn't, I really think 
you will enjoy it.  Whatever Rivendell you decide to get, you will find 
yourself riding more than ever.  I am certainly glad I got mine.  Hope that 
helps.

Ride Safely,
Beaverton Bob

On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 4:18:50 PM UTC-8, Carla Waugh wrote:
>
> Hello Sam owners I'm thinking about purchasing a Sam for retirement partly 
> price mostly because it's a Rivendell and lugged. I have one other bike 
> it's a custom 650B and I know the Sam is a 700c. Ideas? Thoughts? Thanks

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[RBW] Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[John Stowe]

"Our" Costco in Arlington, VA is about as well situated as one can hope for, 
with bike lanes all the way there and proximity to a major trail. There's a 
bike rack near the entrance, though it seems to be used mainly by employees. 
I've convinced the staff to let me wheel the bike through the store a couple of 
times when my son was sleeping in his seat.

We signed up primarily for diapers and baby formula, and in the diaper days I 
would often stop on my way home and load up my Pass & Stow porteur rack, with 
other small items in my rear pannier or even piled up in front: 

https://flic.kr/p/igxQLd

I don't buy 40 lb. bags of mulch or dog food, though. For that I would want a 
longtail or box bike (bakfiets).

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Re: [RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Christopher Murray]

If I were in that situation I'd buy a trailer designed for kids. You can find 
cheap ones for sale used. It is easy to put a bunch of large reflectors on it. 
It's sealed from the weather. It is easy to detach/attach. Drivers seem to be 
super cautious when they see one (no one wants to run over a bunch of little 
kids). IF someone were to hit you from behind they'd hit the trailer first-- 
hopefully increasing your chances of escaping unscathed. They can also hold a 
ton of weight and are very stable. 

It is wide but it is also bright and large. I'm much less afraid of getting hit 
by someone who sees me than someone who doesn't.

I have a decent one you can have for free if you want to pick it up in North 
Dakota! 

Cheers!
Chris

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[RBW] Small Appaloosas going away

[dougP]

>From today's Blug:

"...we have six 46cm Appaloosa frames left, and 6 complete bikes, and we’re 
not doing them anymore because people don’t buy small bikes, and we can’t 
afford to make groovy bikes that don’t sell. The other sizes, no problem.)"

If you or anyone you know is seriously thinking about a 46 cm Appaloosa, 
get 'em while you can.  The 47 cm Atlantis has disappeared.  They're right; 
small bikes are a tough sell.  But if that's the size you need, nothing 
else works.  This is too bad but I can understand the business decision.  

dougP

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Re: [RBW] Re: Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[drew]

That's interesting. I can't quite envision that tweak, but I'd like to see it. 

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[RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[Joe Bernard]

I know, Keith, I was just rolling with it. Right into a phone pole!

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[RBW] HiRiser?

['Eamon Nordquist' via RBW Owners Bunch]

I've thought about it for getting both a little more height and extension for 
my old mtb, but realized I would have to find a way to deal with a brake hanger 
(it's drilled into the stock stem). The fork doesn't have enough threads to fit 
one into the headset. Otherwise it would be perfect for me.

Eamon

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[RBW] HiRiser?

[iamkeith]

I got one.  Planned to install it on a 90s norba mtb with a short/low head 
tube.  Fyi, its a nice stem, butit didn't quite work.  Or it worked, but was 
funny looking on that bike is more accurate. The quill is really long, so a lot 
stuck out, even inserted as far as possible.   I think it will work better on 
something with a longer steerer, so Im going to put it on my daughter's xo-1, 
to get the bars up while still not looking like an afterthought.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[Patrick Moore]

You can always carry the weight on the back!

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 5:40 PM, Timothy Orr 
wrote:

>
>
> I figure I can try limiting the weight I carry on the rack to try to avoid
> the issue, but I'd hate to need to replace the fork.
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[iamkeith]

I meant that as a joke.  I was in santa monica in '74, doing similar things, 
and realize there were no helmets.  If we got hurt, we were taken to the doctor 
riding in the back of a wood-paneled station wagon, with no seat belts.

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[RBW] Re: Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[Timothy Orr]

Thanks, Reed and Drew! 

I was curious why the Nitto 34F rack was only rated to 35lbs. It seems like 
it could handle much more than that. The Surly 2.0 rack is rate to 70lbs 
(!), which seems like wa more than I'd ever carry. 

The person I'm getting the bike from, Kurt who is a member of the list, 
said he had to replace a Hunq fork because of the issue. I guess the weight 
tweaked the fork blades a bit. He said, "Having all of the stress that 
would normally flex the fork blades evenly concentrated into the one point 
right above where the rack mounts caused the fork tweak right there." It 
also sounds like Riv staff provided some of this context, but I hadn't ever 
heard anything on the issue.  

I figure I can try limiting the weight I carry on the rack to try to avoid 
the issue, but I'd hate to need to replace the fork. 



On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 10:46:22 AM UTC-8, drew wrote:
>
> I have the nitto big front rack with a medium wald on my hunq. i've used 
> panniers on it quite a bit and never had a problem. i do try to even out 
> the load from side to side and front to back of the bike. i also only keep 
> the stuff i need to get to easily in the basket. i suppose it keeps the 
> fork stiffer. i dont know what kind of damage it could cause other than 
> damaging an eyelet or something like that. 
>

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Re: [RBW] iBert with drops - workable?

[Leif Eckstrom]

+1, drops might work, but an albatross with positive rise will give more 
clearance for kid's knees and shoes. Important when kid grows. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Patrick Moore]

Now that's cute! I'd buy one, though I don't know if there is any
particular merit for this role in the small wheels. I think I'd find it
rather long to wheel through the aisles, though I happily do that with my
own regular length bikes.

Austin: Gotcha. My west-most-side Costco has a cemented in "undulating Us"
rack down the wall from the exit, which is never used by anyone that I've
seen except, once or twice, by myself. So lockup is no problem.

It's just getting through the car-afflicted bottlenecks and dealing with
the car choked bottlenecks. At my age and speed, I think I'd want power
assist to speed me through those areas, involving hills, on any bike big
enough to carry a Costco-sized load.

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 3:14 PM, Joe Bunik  wrote:

> maybe they'd let you wheel something like this through the aisles:
> http://www.dinosaursandrobots.com/2009/08/david-mahans-
> ingenuous-grocery-getter.html
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Patrick Moore]

A thought as an aside: a 44 X 12 (99 gi with 27" wheel) is smack in the
middle of a 50 X 13 and a 50 X 14; and at the other end, a 24 X 32 (20 gi)
is just 10% lower than a 30 X 36 (22 gi).

I got compact, indeed sub compact, gearing with a 52/38 using a cassette
with a 16 t Miche outer cog. IOW, there are ways to accommodate high tabs.

Quoth Steve P:


> Going from the now omnipresent 35/50 to 39/53 is within the capabilities
> of the common hanger tab you find on many (most?) carbon road bikes these
> days.  The problem is going smaller than 50.  There may well be some, my
> experience with modern carbon road bikes is very limited, but the ones I've
> looked at have not.
>
>
Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
**
**
*The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

*Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
world revolves.) *Carthusian motto

*It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart

*Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle

*Le sacre est la projection du Centre celeste dans la peripherie cosmique,
ou du "Moteur immobile" dans le flux des choses. *F Schuon, *Le Sens du
Sacre, *Etudes Traditionnelles, 1r q 1979

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[Eric Karnes]

Haha. That response made me chuckle out loud (I refuse to use 'lol').

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Re: [RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Austin ^]

Nothing too crafty, the racks in question are basically a few of these - 
http://www.parkitbikeracks.com/br-04-traditional-galvanized-bike-racks - 
chained together right outside the exit portal. If there are only one or 
two other bikes I can park parallel to the rack, taking up a large amount 
of the intended capacity. If there are a few other folks using the racks 
I've had to park my bike on top of the rack (awkward) with the trailer sort 
of where the designer originally intended bikes to go. It's really more of 
a solution for costco employees who ride to work than taking a bike on a 
costco run. It's a notable contrast to the staple racks that are making up 
the current bike corral designs. 

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 11:54:18 AM UTC-8, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Austin: thanks. And yes, parking might be a problem. Can you describe your 
> "creativity"?
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Joe Bunik]

maybe they'd let you wheel something like this through the aisles:
http://www.dinosaursandrobots.com/2009/08/david-mahans-ingenuous-grocery-getter.html

On 3/9/17, Patrick Moore  wrote:
> Austin: thanks. And yes, parking might be a problem. Can you describe your
> "creativity"?
>
> On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 11:22 AM, Austin ^ 
> wrote:
>
>> On the infrequent occasions I need to do a costco run I bring a flatbed
>> trailer, haulin colin trailer pulled by my hillborne. I have one big tub
>> with a lid that takes up ~75% of the deck for "smaller" items and leave
>> bulky things like tp out in the open. I keep a variety of straps and
>> bungees in the tub for whatever configurations are needed. It easily
>> handles loads of around 150 lbs but is rated for much higher, and while
>> my
>> local costco isn't freeway adjacent there is a bit of traffic riding and
>> hills are unavoidable. I can load the trailer with way more stuff than I
>> would normally get with racks/bags/basket and the low center of gravity
>> makes the weight surprisingly not as difficult as expected. Two
>> taillights
>> and a big hi vis triangle in back make the otherwise large red trailer
>> more
>> conspicuous. The only thing like a problem I encounter are the racks at
>> the
>> store - While covered, they're not what I would think of as racks that
>> would accommodate a bike anyone would actually take to shop at costco,
>> requiring some creativity in parking.
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
> Other professional writing services.
> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
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> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
> **
> **
> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
> circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>
> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
> world revolves.) *Carthusian motto
>
> *It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart
>
> *Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle
>
> *Le sacre est la projection du Centre celeste dans la peripherie cosmique,
> ou du "Moteur immobile" dans le flux des choses. *F Schuon, *Le Sens du
> Sacre, *Etudes Traditionnelles, 1r q 1979
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[Steve Palincsar]

On 03/09/2017 04:22 PM, Joe Bernard wrote:

I think I'm right, unless you want to take a humorous comment and turn it into 
an actual statistical analysis of how many people in Long Beach had ever seen a 
bicycle helmet in 1974. For the purposes of my story centered on kids on 
Sting-Rays in the early '70s, the comment stands.



I'm very aware of this issue because in 1974 I was the workshops chair 
for the Great Eastern Rally, held in Poughkeepsie NY at Marist College.  
One of my workshops featured a demonstration of the then brand new MSR 
bicycle helmet.  The highlight of the presentation was when the 
presenter put on the helmet, took an Indian Club and whacked himself 
over the head with it and asked the audience if anyone would care to try 
that themselves with a leather hairnet.



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[RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Ben Van Dyke]

I've owned a Big Dummy for a number of years and it works exceedingly well 
for these types of trips. Can fit four large grocery bags in the back no 
problem, I do this almost every week. On occasion, I've found myself 
carrying five cases of beer, a Weber grill and cooler, a live adult human, 
a complete bicycle and other assorted heavy loads. I don't have a front 
rack on it either, you could increase the capacity substantially with a big 
touring or porteur rack.

I find the bike handles fine with a big load, although the steering can get 
a little squirrelly (a front load might help here). Overall its an 
incredibly fun and useful bike, I even enjoy riding it unloaded and find 
kind of a perverse joy in seeing how much junk I can carry with it. 

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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Brewster Fong]

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 12:59:50 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> On 03/09/2017 03:32 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:
>
>
>
> On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 11:16:59 AM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote: 
>>
>>
>>
>> On 03/09/2017 01:05 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 9:29:31 PM UTC-8, Bill M. wrote: 
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 2:14:48 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote: 
>>>
>>> On 03/08/2017 04:21 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:

 For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with mid-cage 
 RD. I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a sub-compact double like a 46x30 
 or 46x28.  Since I don't "tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should 
 be 
 more than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV!  
 Good 
 Luck!

 You can help that luck by making sure your frame has a round seat tube 
 and uses a clamp on front derailleur.  Which pretty much means a titanium 
 frame.

>>>
>>> Or a Calfee.  Which, come to think of it, Brewster already owns.
>>>
>>
>> Haha, my secret is out!  Actually, I'm thinking of getting one of these 
>> really lightweight carbon bikes to see what all the fuss is about. I see my 
>> buddies with these 14-15lb bikes with e-shifting and they're loving it!  I 
>> mean, take a look at the latest Trek Emonda. With not really stupid light 
>> parts, you can get a 10.25lb bike that supposedly has a weight limit of 
>> 275lb?!  Yow!  I doubt there are many here who are that heavy, but if so, 
>> there it is! 
>>
>>
>> The Calfee may have a round seat tube, but I'm pretty sure none of the 
>> Trek "Anagram" bikes do.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I do agree that a round seat tube with a clamp on FD is ideal. However, 
>> my 90-ish Litespeed Classic ti bike has a braze-on FD hanger tab and I have 
>> my FD mounted at the lowest point for my 48/34 crankset.  
>>
>>
>> And some braze on mounting tabs have their slots configured to allow 
>> smaller than 50T big rings.  Many these days do not.  It is a limiting 
>> factor you need to be aware of.
>>
>
> Agree. At last year's NAHBS, I got into it with Mark DiNucci, one of 
> the premier builders at the show!  When I heard he was showing, I really 
> wanted to check out his frames. He didn't disappoint as he had 2 or 3 of 
> the cleanest bikes/frames on display:
>
>
> 
>
> 
>
> 
>
> Beautiful work especially the long thin lugs that just flow into the 
> frame. Gorgeous! But one question I had for him was whether I could get a 
> frameset without the FD hanger tab. He blew up! He asked why? I told him I 
> wanted to be able to adjust the FD to work with whatever crank I got. He 
> then went on about how they design the frame with the crank in mind and how 
> the hanger tab would be properly place!  Since he got animated, I let it 
> go. But later thought, I should have asked what happens if someone decides 
> to change their crank?  Let's say you are young "racer" type and want to 
> use a crank with 53/39 chainrings. Later, you get older and slower and want 
> more gearing so you go to 50/34 or 48/34.  Will that new crank if the FD 
> hanger tab? Let's say it does. Then a few years later, you want to go even 
> smaller like a 44/30 or 44/28?!  Will that tab still allow the FD to work 
> with this new smaller gearing?!  
>
> I guess if I ever get the money for a DiNucci, that is one of the 
> questions I'll be asking! Good Luck!
>
>  

>
> Going from the now omnipresent 35/50 to 39/53 is within the capabilities 
> of the common hanger tab you find on many (most?) carbon road bikes these 
> days.  The problem is going smaller than 50.  There may well be some, my 
> experience with modern carbon road bikes is very limited, but the ones I've 
> looked at have not.
>

 I bet most FD hanger tabs will allow a crank to go from 53/39 to something 
with a 48/34 or maybe and this is a stretch 46/34 combo. 

>
> As for future compatibility with other cranks and chain ring combinations, 
> I'm guessing that's not an important consideration for bike designers these 
> days.  Getting older & slower?  You'll probably 

Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[sameness]

Dude, c'mon. Not here, not anywhere.

Jeff Hagedorn
Los Angeles, CA USA

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 1:12:30 PM UTC-8, Skenry wrote:
>
> Too bad this didn't come up on yesterday's women's day.   Maybe her 
> husband can show her how her bike works.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[Joe Bernard]

I think I'm right, unless you want to take a humorous comment and turn it into 
an actual statistical analysis of how many people in Long Beach had ever seen a 
bicycle helmet in 1974. For the purposes of my story centered on kids on 
Sting-Rays in the early '70s, the comment stands.  

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Re: [RBW] iBert with drops - workable?

[Sky Coulter]

I put an ibert on my clementine with bosco bullmoose bars. Works ok, but i had 
to cut part of the seat away to accomodate the bullmoose section.  Our little 
girl River is still too inclined to lay back to try to make eye contact w me 
for us to go for many bike rides just yet (i worry about hitting a bump when 
she's looking back and hurting her neck).

I briefly tried setting it up w drops, but thought it would be a lot safer w 
upright bars. I'd recommend going w a non bullmoose version of swept back bars 
to get the seat far forward.

Sky in new west

> On Mar 9, 2017, at 12:55 PM, Jim Bronson  wrote:
> 
> I mounted it up on my Road Standard/Custom with 46cm Noodles, seems pretty 
> tight under the horizontal part of the bar.  Should I switch one of my 
> Rivendells to upright bars to run this?  I have some upright bars in my parts 
> bin, I think some Moustaches and maybe Albatross(?) not exactly sure.  It 
> just seems like an upright bar would work better when I eyeball it.
> 
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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Scott Henry]

And the lady who didn't charge her battery probably wouldn't charge her
lights, or lube her cables or replace her chain or...

Too bad this didn't come up on yesterday's women's day.   Maybe her husband
can show her how her bike works.


On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 4:04 PM, Steve Palincsar  wrote:

>
>
> On 03/09/2017 03:55 PM, Scott Henry wrote:
>
> Not sure on why you would need a tablet.   Do you take extra cables and
> spokes on your rides too?
>
> For the most part, electric shifting is pretty rock steady.   Being with a
> shop that sells them, I've had one DI2 come back.   One.   I stopped trying
> to see how long the battery lasts, It just keeps going and going.
>
>
> If you mean how long a *charge* lasts, I had a woman on a ride I led last
> month whose DI2 unit went into the first warning mode of low charge,
> shifting to the small chain ring and refusing to budge from it.  This
> happened something like 15 miles into the ride, and she spent the rest of
> the ride rationing shifts hoping to finish the ride before the unit quit
> working entirely.  It had been "a very long time," she said, since she'd
> even checked the state of charge, never mind charged the system, and had no
> clue how many miles she'd gone.   It may be rare, and it may take a long
> time to get to that state, but it definitely does happen.
>
>
> I've stopped counting defective cable actuated parts.   No need to count
> really, we have an open RA number for Sram.Best warranty  program in
> the business.  Though  if they didn't build crap they wouldn't need it.
>
> Some people can break anything.   They shouldn't have nice things.
>
>
> Moreish on the topic.   Clamp on front derailleurs are the way to go.
> My 46x28 likes them.
>
>
> Yes, they're great - but they do require a round seat tube and OMG how
> boring is that, right?
>
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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Steve Palincsar]

On 03/09/2017 03:55 PM, Scott Henry wrote:
Not sure on why you would need a tablet.   Do you take extra cables 
and spokes on your rides too?


For the most part, electric shifting is pretty rock steady.   Being 
with a shop that sells them, I've had one DI2 come back.   One.   I 
stopped trying to see how long the battery lasts, It just keeps going 
and going.


If you mean how long a /charge/ lasts, I had a woman on a ride I led 
last month whose DI2 unit went into the first warning mode of low 
charge, shifting to the small chain ring and refusing to budge from it.  
This happened something like 15 miles into the ride, and she spent the 
rest of the ride rationing shifts hoping to finish the ride before the 
unit quit working entirely.  It had been "a very long time," she said, 
since she'd even checked the state of charge, never mind charged the 
system, and had no clue how many miles she'd gone.   It may be rare, and 
it may take a long time to get to that state, but it definitely does happen.



I've stopped counting defective cable actuated parts.   No need to 
count really, we have an open RA number for Sram.Best warranty 
program in the business.  Though  if they didn't build crap they 
wouldn't need it.


Some people can break anything.   They shouldn't have nice things.


Moreish on the topic.   Clamp on front derailleurs are the way to go. 
My 46x28 likes them.


Yes, they're great - but they do require a round seat tube and OMG how 
boring is that, right?


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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Jim Bronson]

Yes, I carry spare cables at all times, and on really long brevets (more
than 600K) I carry an extra bar end shifter too!  And a spare tire too for
that matter, at all times.

I run high spoke counts so I don't have to carry spare spokes - never had a
spoke fail on a wheel with 36 or more spokes that was built by a competent
wheel builder.  If I ran wheels with lower spoke counts I would carry a
fiber fix spoke.  (have some 32H Pacenti SL23s hanging in my garage I am
considering having built up...)

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 2:55 PM, Scott Henry  wrote:

> Not sure on why you would need a tablet.   Do you take extra cables and
> spokes on your rides too?
>
> For the most part, electric shifting is pretty rock steady.   Being with a
> shop that sells them, I've had one DI2 come back.   One.   I stopped trying
> to see how long the battery lasts, It just keeps going and going.
> I've stopped counting defective cable actuated parts.   No need to count
> really, we have an open RA number for Sram.Best warranty  program in
> the business.  Though  if they didn't build crap they wouldn't need it.
>
> Some people can break anything.   They shouldn't have nice things.
>
>
> Moreish on the topic.   Clamp on front derailleurs are the way to go.
> My 46x28 likes them.
> Scott
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 3:33 PM, Jim Bronson  wrote:
>
>> The one Randonneur that I know who has electronic shifting, it has failed
>> him twice on long brevets.  He says hooking it up to his laptop and
>> resetting the whole system fixes it.  He's an extremely strong rider
>> despite being in his mid-60s and he can deal with having front shifting
>> only.
>>
>> Last time this topic came up I researched some Windows 10 tablets on
>> Amazon and there were some that weighed less than a pound that cost around
>> $100.  That would be the price for me to get electronic shifting, I would
>> have to have something with me on the bike that could run Shimano's
>> software for troubleshooting..  I would need to have the tools to service
>> it in the field.  I am not strong enough to just jam it up steep hills with
>> whatever gearing that I had available with the rear derailer fixed in place.
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 3:21 PM, Brewster Fong  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 12:41:59 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:





 With Shimano road 11 they've taken road cassettes to 32T, but for many
 with the usual (and often not replaceable with any better gearing) 34/50
 that's not a low enough low gear.  It was much simpler in 10 speed days:
 replace cassette and rear derailleur as noted above and you're good up to
 36T in back.  That won't work with 11, and it's necessary to enter the
 world of altering cable pull.


 Agree.  With 11 speed, all of the different platforms work with each
>>> other. So you can mix Campy, Shimano and Sram wheels and cassettes.  With
>>> my friends, several have gone to bigger gearing like 11-32 or 11-36 and one
>>> friend just picked up an 11-40 or 12-40, so don't know if that will work. I
>>> know there's also 12-42 and I think either an 11-50 or 12-50 11 speed
>>> cassette!  The key is you need to have a "mid-cage" RD.  All of these big
>>> gear cassette is being driven by the latest "1 by" movement. But that
>>> doesn't stop you found adapting to a bike with a double or even a triple
>>> crank!  Of course, you may need a "mid-cage" RD and the wolf tooth thing.
>>>
>>> For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with mid-cage
>>> RD. I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a sub-compact double like a 46x30
>>> or 46x28.  Since I don't "tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be
>>> more than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV!  Good
>>> Luck!
>>>
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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Steve Palincsar]

On 03/09/2017 03:32 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:



On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 11:16:59 AM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:



On 03/09/2017 01:05 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:



On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 9:29:31 PM UTC-8, Bill M. wrote:

On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 2:14:48 PM UTC-8, Steve
Palincsar wrote:

On 03/08/2017 04:21 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:


For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless"
with mid-cage RD. I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a
sub-compact double like a 46x30 or 46x28.  Since I don't
"tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be more
than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of
course, YMMV!  Good Luck!

You can help that luck by making sure your frame has a
round seat tube and uses a clamp on front derailleur. 
Which pretty much means a titanium frame.



Or a Calfee.  Which, come to think of it, Brewster already owns.


Haha, my secret is out!  Actually, I'm thinking of getting one of
these really lightweight carbon bikes to see what all the fuss is
about. I see my buddies with these 14-15lb bikes with e-shifting
and they're loving it!  I mean, take a look at the latest Trek
Emonda. With not really stupid light parts, you can get a 10.25lb
bike that supposedly has a weight limit of 275lb?!  Yow!  I doubt
there are many here who are that heavy, but if so, there it is!


The Calfee may have a round seat tube, but I'm pretty sure none of
the Trek "Anagram" bikes do.





I do agree that a round seat tube with a clamp on FD is ideal.
However, my 90-ish Litespeed Classic ti bike has a braze-on FD
hanger tab and I have my FD mounted at the lowest point for my
48/34 crankset.


And some braze on mounting tabs have their slots configured to
allow smaller than 50T big rings.  Many these days do not.  It is
a limiting factor you need to be aware of.


Agree. At last year's NAHBS, I got into it with Mark DiNucci, one of 
the premier builders at the show!  When I heard he was showing, I 
really wanted to check out his frames. He didn't disappoint as he had 
2 or 3 of the cleanest bikes/frames on display:










Beautiful work especially the long thin lugs that just flow into the 
frame. Gorgeous! But one question I had for him was whether I could 
get a frameset without the FD hanger tab. He blew up! He asked why? I 
told him I wanted to be able to adjust the FD to work with whatever 
crank I got. He then went on about how they design the frame with the 
crank in mind and how the hanger tab would be properly place!  Since 
he got animated, I let it go. But later thought, I should have asked 
what happens if someone decides to change their crank?  Let's say you 
are young "racer" type and want to use a crank with 53/39 chainrings. 
Later, you get older and slower and want more gearing so you go to 
50/34 or 48/34.  Will that new crank if the FD hanger tab? Let's say 
it does. Then a few years later, you want to go even smaller like a 
44/30 or 44/28?! Will that tab still allow the FD to work with this 
new smaller gearing?!


I guess if I ever get the money for a DiNucci, that is one of the 
questions I'll be asking! Good Luck!




Going from the now omnipresent 35/50 to 39/53 is within the capabilities 
of the common hanger tab you find on many (most?) carbon road bikes 
these days.  The problem is going smaller than 50.  There may well be 
some, my experience with modern carbon road bikes is very limited, but 
the ones I've looked at have not.


As for future compatibility with other cranks and chain ring 
combinations, I'm guessing that's not an important consideration for 
bike designers these days.  Getting older & slower?  You'll probably 
need to raise your bars a bit too, and good luck with that if they cut 
your steerer so as to not leave any extra for future needs.   You need 
those changes?  Get a new bike.


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[RBW] iBert with drops - workable?

[Jim Bronson]

I mounted it up on my Road Standard/Custom with 46cm Noodles, seems pretty
tight under the horizontal part of the bar.  Should I switch one of my
Rivendells to upright bars to run this?  I have some upright bars in my
parts bin, I think some Moustaches and maybe Albatross(?) not exactly
sure.  It just seems like an upright bar would work better when I eyeball
it.

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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Scott Henry]

Not sure on why you would need a tablet.   Do you take extra cables and
spokes on your rides too?

For the most part, electric shifting is pretty rock steady.   Being with a
shop that sells them, I've had one DI2 come back.   One.   I stopped trying
to see how long the battery lasts, It just keeps going and going.
I've stopped counting defective cable actuated parts.   No need to count
really, we have an open RA number for Sram.Best warranty  program in
the business.  Though  if they didn't build crap they wouldn't need it.

Some people can break anything.   They shouldn't have nice things.


Moreish on the topic.   Clamp on front derailleurs are the way to go.My
46x28 likes them.
Scott



On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 3:33 PM, Jim Bronson  wrote:

> The one Randonneur that I know who has electronic shifting, it has failed
> him twice on long brevets.  He says hooking it up to his laptop and
> resetting the whole system fixes it.  He's an extremely strong rider
> despite being in his mid-60s and he can deal with having front shifting
> only.
>
> Last time this topic came up I researched some Windows 10 tablets on
> Amazon and there were some that weighed less than a pound that cost around
> $100.  That would be the price for me to get electronic shifting, I would
> have to have something with me on the bike that could run Shimano's
> software for troubleshooting..  I would need to have the tools to service
> it in the field.  I am not strong enough to just jam it up steep hills with
> whatever gearing that I had available with the rear derailer fixed in place.
>
> On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 3:21 PM, Brewster Fong  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 12:41:59 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> With Shimano road 11 they've taken road cassettes to 32T, but for many
>>> with the usual (and often not replaceable with any better gearing) 34/50
>>> that's not a low enough low gear.  It was much simpler in 10 speed days:
>>> replace cassette and rear derailleur as noted above and you're good up to
>>> 36T in back.  That won't work with 11, and it's necessary to enter the
>>> world of altering cable pull.
>>>
>>>
>>> Agree.  With 11 speed, all of the different platforms work with each
>> other. So you can mix Campy, Shimano and Sram wheels and cassettes.  With
>> my friends, several have gone to bigger gearing like 11-32 or 11-36 and one
>> friend just picked up an 11-40 or 12-40, so don't know if that will work. I
>> know there's also 12-42 and I think either an 11-50 or 12-50 11 speed
>> cassette!  The key is you need to have a "mid-cage" RD.  All of these big
>> gear cassette is being driven by the latest "1 by" movement. But that
>> doesn't stop you found adapting to a bike with a double or even a triple
>> crank!  Of course, you may need a "mid-cage" RD and the wolf tooth thing.
>>
>> For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with mid-cage RD.
>> I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a sub-compact double like a 46x30 or
>> 46x28.  Since I don't "tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be
>> more than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV!  Good
>> Luck!
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[Steve Palincsar]

I think you're wrong: the MSR and the Bell Biker came out in 1974.


On 03/09/2017 03:39 PM, Joe Bernard wrote:

Ha! I don't think anyone in Long Beach, CA. in the early '70s had ever even 
SEEN a bicycle helmet!



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Re: [RBW] Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Jim Bronson]

The Costco in SW Austin has a freeway in the front of it, but on the
backside there is green space and gravel walking paths that are smooth
enough for riding.  Additionally, the roads that abut to the backside of
the store and green space are bicycle friendly.

That being said I've never tried to make a bike run, but would be
interested in doing so now that I read that other people have taken bike
runs to Costco.

-Jim

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 11:05 AM, Patrick Moore  wrote:

> Reed: please post a photo of one of those 50 lb loads when you get a
> chance.
>
> Question about Costco runs on a bike. I've used my bike (not a Rivendell,
> old Motobecane racing bike with panniers good for 40 lb) for one or two
> Costco trips, but approach to both Costcos on the Westside of ABQ, where I
> live, is by 4 or 6 lane, 50 mph arteries, and involve at least half a mile
> and, in the case of the easternmost one, a couple of miles, of very busy
> multi-lane boulevards with high side traffic: not something I care to do
> with a heavily loaded bike. All Costcos I've seen are similarly situated.
> How do you who bike-shop at Costco handle this?
>
> And what sort of bike and rack system do you (= all y'all) use? My
> purchases, put off as long as I can because I hate shopping at big box
> stores, usually include cases of beer, 50 lb bags of dog food, 60-count
> flats of eggs, and so forth.
>
> My next door neighbor would probably sell his Extracycle setup cheap; that
> with a hub motor would be a nice carrier if I in fact give my car to my
> daughter in the fall. Just thinking out loud ...
>
> On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 9:52 AM, Reed Kennedy  wrote:
>
>> I run a Nitto Campee front rack with removable low-rider pannier mount on
>> my Hunq, with a Wald basket up top. It all works great.
>>
>> Some folks (BQ, for instance) worry about stiffening a fork by attaching
>> a rack at the top and bottom, reenforcing it. I try to avoid it on my
>> lighter-tubed BQ-style bikes. But the Hunq uses fairy thick, heavy, rigid
>> tubes of its fork. There isn't much flex to lose, so I don't worry about it
>> on Riv-style bikes.
>>
>> As for damaging the fork? Unless you do something you obviously
>> shouldn't, I can't imagine how you'd damage it. I do 50lb Costco runs with
>> my front basket and pannier setup (the Nitto is rated for 35lbs) and while
>> it isn't fun, nothing seems anywhere near breaking.
>>
>>
>> Reed
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 8:31 AM Timothy Orr 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey! I'm about to acquire my first Riv. I was planning to run the
>>> Surly front rack 2.0 with a Wald 139 and front panniers, but I've heard
>>> that running a basket with panniers on the same rack will really stiffen
>>> the front fork and could potentially cause some damage to the fork. I've
>>> seen lots of folks who run a separate rack for the basket and use lowriders
>>> for front panniers, so I'm wondering if there something I'm missing. The
>>> Surly rack, like the Nitto 34f, mounts to the dropouts and the mid-blade
>>> braze-ons. I'd consider carrying some weight in the rear, but that's where
>>> I put the seat for my son to ride along around town. Any feedback or
>>> personal experiences?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
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[RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[Joe Bernard]

Ha! I don't think anyone in Long Beach, CA. in the early '70s had ever even 
SEEN a bicycle helmet!

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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Jim Bronson]

The one Randonneur that I know who has electronic shifting, it has failed
him twice on long brevets.  He says hooking it up to his laptop and
resetting the whole system fixes it.  He's an extremely strong rider
despite being in his mid-60s and he can deal with having front shifting
only.

Last time this topic came up I researched some Windows 10 tablets on Amazon
and there were some that weighed less than a pound that cost around $100.
That would be the price for me to get electronic shifting, I would have to
have something with me on the bike that could run Shimano's software for
troubleshooting..  I would need to have the tools to service it in the
field.  I am not strong enough to just jam it up steep hills with whatever
gearing that I had available with the rear derailer fixed in place.

On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 3:21 PM, Brewster Fong  wrote:

>
>
> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 12:41:59 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> With Shimano road 11 they've taken road cassettes to 32T, but for many
>> with the usual (and often not replaceable with any better gearing) 34/50
>> that's not a low enough low gear.  It was much simpler in 10 speed days:
>> replace cassette and rear derailleur as noted above and you're good up to
>> 36T in back.  That won't work with 11, and it's necessary to enter the
>> world of altering cable pull.
>>
>>
>> Agree.  With 11 speed, all of the different platforms work with each
> other. So you can mix Campy, Shimano and Sram wheels and cassettes.  With
> my friends, several have gone to bigger gearing like 11-32 or 11-36 and one
> friend just picked up an 11-40 or 12-40, so don't know if that will work. I
> know there's also 12-42 and I think either an 11-50 or 12-50 11 speed
> cassette!  The key is you need to have a "mid-cage" RD.  All of these big
> gear cassette is being driven by the latest "1 by" movement. But that
> doesn't stop you found adapting to a bike with a double or even a triple
> crank!  Of course, you may need a "mid-cage" RD and the wolf tooth thing.
>
> For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with mid-cage RD.
> I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a sub-compact double like a 46x30 or
> 46x28.  Since I don't "tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be
> more than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV!  Good
> Luck!
>
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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Brewster Fong]

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 11:16:59 AM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
>
>
> On 03/09/2017 01:05 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 9:29:31 PM UTC-8, Bill M. wrote: 
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 2:14:48 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote: 
>>
>> On 03/08/2017 04:21 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:
>>>
>>> For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with mid-cage 
>>> RD. I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a sub-compact double like a 46x30 
>>> or 46x28.  Since I don't "tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be 
>>> more than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV!  Good 
>>> Luck!
>>>
>>> You can help that luck by making sure your frame has a round seat tube 
>>> and uses a clamp on front derailleur.  Which pretty much means a titanium 
>>> frame.
>>>
>>
>> Or a Calfee.  Which, come to think of it, Brewster already owns.
>>
>
> Haha, my secret is out!  Actually, I'm thinking of getting one of these 
> really lightweight carbon bikes to see what all the fuss is about. I see my 
> buddies with these 14-15lb bikes with e-shifting and they're loving it!  I 
> mean, take a look at the latest Trek Emonda. With not really stupid light 
> parts, you can get a 10.25lb bike that supposedly has a weight limit of 
> 275lb?!  Yow!  I doubt there are many here who are that heavy, but if so, 
> there it is! 
>
>
> The Calfee may have a round seat tube, but I'm pretty sure none of the 
> Trek "Anagram" bikes do.
>
>
>
>
> I do agree that a round seat tube with a clamp on FD is ideal. However, my 
> 90-ish Litespeed Classic ti bike has a braze-on FD hanger tab and I have my 
> FD mounted at the lowest point for my 48/34 crankset.  
>
>
> And some braze on mounting tabs have their slots configured to allow 
> smaller than 50T big rings.  Many these days do not.  It is a limiting 
> factor you need to be aware of.
>

Agree. At last year's NAHBS, I got into it with Mark DiNucci, one of 
the premier builders at the show!  When I heard he was showing, I really 
wanted to check out his frames. He didn't disappoint as he had 2 or 3 of 
the cleanest bikes/frames on display:







Beautiful work especially the long thin lugs that just flow into the frame. 
Gorgeous! But one question I had for him was whether I could get a frameset 
without the FD hanger tab. He blew up! He asked why? I told him I wanted to 
be able to adjust the FD to work with whatever crank I got. He then went on 
about how they design the frame with the crank in mind and how the hanger 
tab would be properly place!  Since he got animated, I let it go. But later 
thought, I should have asked what happens if someone decides to change 
their crank?  Let's say you are young "racer" type and want to use a crank 
with 53/39 chainrings. Later, you get older and slower and want more 
gearing so you go to 50/34 or 48/34.  Will that new crank if the FD hanger 
tab? Let's say it does. Then a few years later, you want to go even smaller 
like a 44/30 or 44/28?!  Will that tab still allow the FD to work with this 
new smaller gearing?!  

I guess if I ever get the money for a DiNucci, that is one of the questions 
I'll be asking! Good Luck!

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[RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[franklyn]

Though I have a Costco card, I don't shop there regularly, if at all. But 
it just so happens that the Costco nearest to me is in Richmond, CA and is 
just off the Bay Trail and adjacent to a very popular public dog park. Tons 
of bike/pedestrian traffic goes by Costco all the time.

Every 2-3 months I will purchase a 20-lb bag of California-grown brown rice 
from the local farmers' market, along with whatever grocery haul I have at 
the time. My Kogswell with a porteur rack and bag handles this 3--40lbs 
load 
splendidly.
 
This picture 

 
shows the P/R with Swift Industries Polaris porteur bag. Currently I am 
using a slightly smaller and more compressible ILE Porteur bag that works 
really well. 

What my setup is not great for is bulky odd-shaped stuff. In that instance, 
I tend to take off the porteur bag and use just the bare rack and bungee 
chords.

Franklyn

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 10:22:33 AM UTC-8, Austin ^ wrote:
>
> On the infrequent occasions I need to do a costco run I bring a flatbed 
> trailer, haulin colin trailer pulled by my hillborne. I have one big tub 
> with a lid that takes up ~75% of the deck for "smaller" items and leave 
> bulky things like tp out in the open. I keep a variety of straps and 
> bungees in the tub for whatever configurations are needed. It easily 
> handles loads of around 150 lbs but is rated for much higher, and while my 
> local costco isn't freeway adjacent there is a bit of traffic riding and 
> hills are unavoidable. I can load the trailer with way more stuff than I 
> would normally get with racks/bags/basket and the low center of gravity 
> makes the weight surprisingly not as difficult as expected. Two taillights 
> and a big hi vis triangle in back make the otherwise large red trailer more 
> conspicuous. The only thing like a problem I encounter are the racks at the 
> store - While covered, they're not what I would think of as racks that 
> would accommodate a bike anyone would actually take to shop at costco, 
> requiring some creativity in parking. 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Patrick Moore]

Austin: thanks. And yes, parking might be a problem. Can you describe your
"creativity"?

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 11:22 AM, Austin ^  wrote:

> On the infrequent occasions I need to do a costco run I bring a flatbed
> trailer, haulin colin trailer pulled by my hillborne. I have one big tub
> with a lid that takes up ~75% of the deck for "smaller" items and leave
> bulky things like tp out in the open. I keep a variety of straps and
> bungees in the tub for whatever configurations are needed. It easily
> handles loads of around 150 lbs but is rated for much higher, and while my
> local costco isn't freeway adjacent there is a bit of traffic riding and
> hills are unavoidable. I can load the trailer with way more stuff than I
> would normally get with racks/bags/basket and the low center of gravity
> makes the weight surprisingly not as difficult as expected. Two taillights
> and a big hi vis triangle in back make the otherwise large red trailer more
> conspicuous. The only thing like a problem I encounter are the racks at the
> store - While covered, they're not what I would think of as racks that
> would accommodate a bike anyone would actually take to shop at costco,
> requiring some creativity in parking.
>
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*Le sacre est la projection du Centre celeste dans la peripherie cosmique,
ou du "Moteur immobile" dans le flux des choses. *F Schuon, *Le Sens du
Sacre, *Etudes Traditionnelles, 1r q 1979

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[RBW] Re: Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Jon BALER]

for the friction shifters, a couple of alternate ideas:

My Fargo has 10 speed mountain dynasys rear der and cassette, but uses a 9 
speed friction shifter.   I took a dremel to the shifter to get more travel 
out of it.

My rosco build uses 10 speed mountain/dynasys in the rear, and 10 speed 
road in the front.  50/34 cranks with 11:34 cassette gives a good range for 
commuting and all around road riding.  Shifting is handled by IRD power 
ratchet shifters, which have enough travel for dynaysis.


On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 2:52:49 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> 1. Road 10 speed derailleurs 
>  and shifters are 
> completely incompatible with mountain (dyna sys) 10 speed derailleurs and 
> shifters. The cable pull by the shifters is different for both front and 
> rear. 
>
> 2. Nine speed rear derailleurs will not work with 10 speed mountain 
> 
>  rear 
> shifters. They will however work with road “flat bar” 10 speed rear 
> shifters. Dyna speed shifters pull twice as much cable per shift as 9 speed 
> shifters, so if you use a 9 speed derailleur 
>  it shifts two gears 
> for every one push.
>
> 3. Dyna sys 10 speed rear derailleurs 
>  cannot be used with 9 
> speed shifters. Road 10 speed derailleurs can be used with 9 speed shifters.
>
> 4. Nine speed front derailleurs can be used with 10 speed front shifters 
> ,
>  
> but do not work optimally if used with a 10 speed crankset 
> . Nine speed 
> front derailleurs  and 
> cranksets  can be used 
> with 10 speed chains 
> 
>  and front shifters 
> .
>  
> A nine speed shifter can be used to shift a 10 speed dyna sys front 
> derailleur 
> 
> .
>
> 5. 10 speed road chains are different from 10 speed mountain 
> 
>  (dyna 
> sys) chains. The dyna sys chain is a directional chain that is made to 
> shift better with 10 speed mountain 
> 
>  drivetrains .
>
> 6. 10 speed road cassettes and 10 speed mountain cassette use the same 
> sprocket spacing.
>
> [...]
>
> The days of bike riders shopping for new cranks or cassettes or shifters 
> is mostly gone. Or at least, it's not like it used to be, by a mile. Bike 
> shops are so desperate (for the most part) that they want their suppliers 
> to drive customers to their stores with new exciting things every year.
>
> I was not aware, taking just Shimano, of the variety and complexity and 
> incompatibility of the various indexing systems. Man, it all looks like a 
> hassle I am very, very happy to avoid. 
>
> And the first sentence of the next paragraph seems very strange to me; 
> nothing is more natural than shopping for new cranks and cassettes and 
> shifters, in my world. I guess I live in an alternate universe, but one I 
> like much better. I've just replaced crankset and cassettes and shifters on 
> the Matthews.
>
> Going from 9 

[RBW] Handmade Bicycle Basket

[Ray Varella]

Email rayvarella007 at gmail dot com for inquiries and more pictures. 
Thank you. 

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[RBW] HiRiser?

[ant ritchey]

Anyone tried/trying this stem?

THIS ONE 


I think it might be just right for one of several of my TSFM 
(too-small-for-me) mtb projects.

I've found some older Ritchey 1" quills in the used bins around town. They 
look similar but obviously much less quill.

If anyone has a HiRiser or something similar lying around drop me a PM. 
(I've got a box of Technomics so not really interested in those, thanks.)

rain rain rain,
ant ritchey / portland oregon

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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Steve Palincsar]

On 03/09/2017 01:05 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:



On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 9:29:31 PM UTC-8, Bill M. wrote:

On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 2:14:48 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar
wrote:

On 03/08/2017 04:21 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:


For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with
mid-cage RD. I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a
sub-compact double like a 46x30 or 46x28.  Since I don't
"tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be more than
enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV! 
Good Luck!

You can help that luck by making sure your frame has a round
seat tube and uses a clamp on front derailleur. Which pretty
much means a titanium frame.


Or a Calfee.  Which, come to think of it, Brewster already owns.


Haha, my secret is out!  Actually, I'm thinking of getting one of 
these really lightweight carbon bikes to see what all the fuss is 
about. I see my buddies with these 14-15lb bikes with e-shifting and 
they're loving it!  I mean, take a look at the latest Trek Emonda. 
With not really stupid light parts, you can get a 10.25lb bike that 
supposedly has a weight limit of 275lb?!  Yow!  I doubt there are many 
here who are that heavy, but if so, there it is!


The Calfee may have a round seat tube, but I'm pretty sure none of the 
Trek "Anagram" bikes do.






I do agree that a round seat tube with a clamp on FD is ideal. 
However, my 90-ish Litespeed Classic ti bike has a braze-on FD hanger 
tab and I have my FD mounted at the lowest point for my 48/34 crankset.


And some braze on mounting tabs have their slots configured to allow 
smaller than 50T big rings.  Many these days do not.  It is a limiting 
factor you need to be aware of.



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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[stevef]

Which cranks and rings were those, Bill--I'd like to set up my all road 
bike with a 44t big/28-32t small crankset and 10 speed shimano road mechs, 
but I'm having trouble finding a crank that'll work. 

Steve

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 12:29:31 AM UTC-5, Bill M. wrote:
>
> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 2:14:48 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> On 03/08/2017 04:21 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:
>>
>> For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with mid-cage RD. 
>> I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a sub-compact double like a 46x30 or 
>> 46x28.  Since I don't "tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be 
>> more than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV!  Good 
>> Luck!
>>
>> You can help that luck by making sure your frame has a round seat tube 
>> and uses a clamp on front derailleur.  Which pretty much means a titanium 
>> frame.
>>
>
> Or a Calfee.  Which, come to think of it, Brewster already owns.
>
> I have had no problems mixing SRAM road and mountain 10 speed derailleurs 
> and shifters with 44/28 and 42/26 cranks and 11/32 or 12/28 cassettes. 
>  Even on my Calfee, now sadly sold.
>
> Bill 
> Stockton, CA
>

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[RBW] Re: Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[drew]

I have the nitto big front rack with a medium wald on my hunq. i've used 
panniers on it quite a bit and never had a problem. i do try to even out 
the load from side to side and front to back of the bike. i also only keep 
the stuff i need to get to easily in the basket. i suppose it keeps the 
fork stiffer. i dont know what kind of damage it could cause other than 
damaging an eyelet or something like that. 

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[RBW] FS: 650b rim brake wheelset / SON28, White Ind, Velocity / $700

[Patch T]

Hi Bunch,

I recently had the folks at Golden Saddle in LA build me a wheelset that I 
won't be using after all. I have only used them on a few test rides, 
totalling no more than 200 miles. They're still in amazing condition. I 
think this is a good deal. Tell me if you think otherwise.

both: Velocity Cliffhangers 650b black 36h
rear: White Industries T11 silver 135
front: SON28 front silver
DT Swiss comp silver spokes

$700


Love,
Patch
LACA




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[RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Austin ^]

On the infrequent occasions I need to do a costco run I bring a flatbed 
trailer, haulin colin trailer pulled by my hillborne. I have one big tub 
with a lid that takes up ~75% of the deck for "smaller" items and leave 
bulky things like tp out in the open. I keep a variety of straps and 
bungees in the tub for whatever configurations are needed. It easily 
handles loads of around 150 lbs but is rated for much higher, and while my 
local costco isn't freeway adjacent there is a bit of traffic riding and 
hills are unavoidable. I can load the trailer with way more stuff than I 
would normally get with racks/bags/basket and the low center of gravity 
makes the weight surprisingly not as difficult as expected. Two taillights 
and a big hi vis triangle in back make the otherwise large red trailer more 
conspicuous. The only thing like a problem I encounter are the racks at the 
store - While covered, they're not what I would think of as racks that 
would accommodate a bike anyone would actually take to shop at costco, 
requiring some creativity in parking. 

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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[Brewster Fong]

On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 9:29:31 PM UTC-8, Bill M. wrote:
>
> On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 2:14:48 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> On 03/08/2017 04:21 PM, Brewster Fong wrote:
>>
>> For my next bike, I'm planning on going etap "wireless" with mid-cage RD. 
>> I want to run 11-32 in the rear with a sub-compact double like a 46x30 or 
>> 46x28.  Since I don't "tour" or carry a load, a 30x32 or 28x32 should be 
>> more than enough to get me up the hills around here! Of course, YMMV!  Good 
>> Luck!
>>
>> You can help that luck by making sure your frame has a round seat tube 
>> and uses a clamp on front derailleur.  Which pretty much means a titanium 
>> frame.
>>
>
> Or a Calfee.  Which, come to think of it, Brewster already owns.
>

Haha, my secret is out!  Actually, I'm thinking of getting one of these 
really lightweight carbon bikes to see what all the fuss is about. I see my 
buddies with these 14-15lb bikes with e-shifting and they're loving it!  I 
mean, take a look at the latest Trek Emonda. With not really stupid light 
parts, you can get a 10.25lb bike that supposedly has a weight limit of 
275lb?!  Yow!  I doubt there are many here who are that heavy, but if so, 
there it is! 

I do agree that a round seat tube with a clamp on FD is ideal. However, my 
90-ish Litespeed Classic ti bike has a braze-on FD hanger tab and I have my 
FD mounted at the lowest point for my 48/34 crankset.  

Alternatively, if I don't go crazy and get that fancy carbon bike, I'm 
still thinking about a custom steel. If so, it will definitely use a 
clamp-on FD adapter. Or, if I must put on a FD hanger tab, it is going to 
be either one really long hanger or mounted very low so I have the option 
of running anything from 53/39 to 46/28 or smallerGood Luck!



> I have had no problems mixing SRAM road and mountain 10 speed derailleurs 
> and shifters with 44/28 and 42/26 cranks and 11/32 or 12/28 cassettes. 
>  Even on my Calfee, now sadly sold.
>
> Bill 
> Stockton, CA
>

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[RBW] Re: Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Brian Campbell]

I use a 2006 Honda Accord for Costco. If your personal safety is in 
question, might be best to use the correct tool for the job.

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 12:05:37 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Reed: please post a photo of one of those 50 lb loads when you get a 
> chance.
>
> Question about Costco runs on a bike. I've used my bike (not a Rivendell, 
> old Motobecane racing bike with panniers good for 40 lb) for one or two 
> Costco trips, but approach to both Costcos on the Westside of ABQ, where I 
> live, is by 4 or 6 lane, 50 mph arteries, and involve at least half a mile 
> and, in the case of the easternmost one, a couple of miles, of very busy 
> multi-lane boulevards with high side traffic: not something I care to do 
> with a heavily loaded bike. All Costcos I've seen are similarly situated. 
> How do you who bike-shop at Costco handle this?
>
> And what sort of bike and rack system do you (= all y'all) use? My 
> purchases, put off as long as I can because I hate shopping at big box 
> stores, usually include cases of beer, 50 lb bags of dog food, 60-count 
> flats of eggs, and so forth.
>
> My next door neighbor would probably sell his Extracycle setup cheap; that 
> with a hub motor would be a nice carrier if I in fact give my car to my 
> daughter in the fall. Just thinking out loud ...
>
> On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 9:52 AM, Reed Kennedy  > wrote:
>
>> I run a Nitto Campee front rack with removable low-rider pannier mount on 
>> my Hunq, with a Wald basket up top. It all works great. 
>>
>> Some folks (BQ, for instance) worry about stiffening a fork by attaching 
>> a rack at the top and bottom, reenforcing it. I try to avoid it on my 
>> lighter-tubed BQ-style bikes. But the Hunq uses fairy thick, heavy, rigid 
>> tubes of its fork. There isn't much flex to lose, so I don't worry about it 
>> on Riv-style bikes. 
>>
>> As for damaging the fork? Unless you do something you obviously 
>> shouldn't, I can't imagine how you'd damage it. I do 50lb Costco runs with 
>> my front basket and pannier setup (the Nitto is rated for 35lbs) and while 
>> it isn't fun, nothing seems anywhere near breaking. 
>>
>>
>> Reed
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 8:31 AM Timothy Orr > > wrote:
>>
>>> Hey! I'm about to acquire my first Riv. I was planning to run the 
>>> Surly front rack 2.0 with a Wald 139 and front panniers, but I've heard 
>>> that running a basket with panniers on the same rack will really stiffen 
>>> the front fork and could potentially cause some damage to the fork. I've 
>>> seen lots of folks who run a separate rack for the basket and use lowriders 
>>> for front panniers, so I'm wondering if there something I'm missing. The 
>>> Surly rack, like the Nitto 34f, mounts to the dropouts and the mid-blade 
>>> braze-ons. I'd consider carrying some weight in the rear, but that's where 
>>> I put the seat for my son to ride along around town. Any feedback or 
>>> personal experiences?
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> --
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>
>
>
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> Other professional writing services.
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> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
> **
> **
> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
> circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>
> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the 
> world revolves.) *Carthusian motto
>
> *It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart
>
> *Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle
>
> *Le sacre est la projection du Centre celeste dans la peripherie cosmique, 
> ou du "Moteur immobile" dans le flux des choses. *F Schuon, *Le Sens du 
> Sacre, *Etudes Traditionnelles, 1r q 1979
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: Medium Saddlesack Olive Green - $150 shipped

[gordo]

Bump - $140 shipped for the medium saddlesack.

On Sunday, March 5, 2017 at 3:53:58 PM UTC-8, gordo wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>
> This bag just came through as part of a complete bike purchase.  I use a 
> small saddlesack daily and do not need the extra capacity.  Some 
> scuffing/discoloration on the bottom leather (see photos), but otherwise in 
> very good shape.
>
> $150 shipped within the U.S. (Paypal friends & family preferred) or $140 
> local pick up in San Francisco.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Eric
>

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Re: [RBW] ird power ratchet shifters keep loosening

[Patrick Moore]

The fixing bolts kept loosening on my Silver BES and on my old Campy Record
dt shifters. Blue Loctite keeps the bolt in place, but allows you to tweak
tension. In fact, I dumped the Silvers' D ring bolts -- no use if they stay
tight -- and used button head screws.

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 4:54 AM, Jon BALER  wrote:

> Anybody else have a problem with ird power ratchet shifters frequently
> loosening up?  My rear shifter needs to be tightened every about 1-2 times
> a week (my commute is ~100 miles/week).   It's easy enough to tighten while
> riding, but there should be a way to avoid this.   I'm talking about the
> shifting lever moving on its own, not the bar clamp.
>
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**
**
*The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

*Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
world revolves.) *Carthusian motto

*It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart

*Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle

*Le sacre est la projection du Centre celeste dans la peripherie cosmique,
ou du "Moteur immobile" dans le flux des choses. *F Schuon, *Le Sens du
Sacre, *Etudes Traditionnelles, 1r q 1979

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[RBW] Costco runs on bicycle (Was:Front rack w/ basket and panniers)

[Patrick Moore]

Reed: please post a photo of one of those 50 lb loads when you get a chance.

Question about Costco runs on a bike. I've used my bike (not a Rivendell,
old Motobecane racing bike with panniers good for 40 lb) for one or two
Costco trips, but approach to both Costcos on the Westside of ABQ, where I
live, is by 4 or 6 lane, 50 mph arteries, and involve at least half a mile
and, in the case of the easternmost one, a couple of miles, of very busy
multi-lane boulevards with high side traffic: not something I care to do
with a heavily loaded bike. All Costcos I've seen are similarly situated.
How do you who bike-shop at Costco handle this?

And what sort of bike and rack system do you (= all y'all) use? My
purchases, put off as long as I can because I hate shopping at big box
stores, usually include cases of beer, 50 lb bags of dog food, 60-count
flats of eggs, and so forth.

My next door neighbor would probably sell his Extracycle setup cheap; that
with a hub motor would be a nice carrier if I in fact give my car to my
daughter in the fall. Just thinking out loud ...

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 9:52 AM, Reed Kennedy  wrote:

> I run a Nitto Campee front rack with removable low-rider pannier mount on
> my Hunq, with a Wald basket up top. It all works great.
>
> Some folks (BQ, for instance) worry about stiffening a fork by attaching a
> rack at the top and bottom, reenforcing it. I try to avoid it on my
> lighter-tubed BQ-style bikes. But the Hunq uses fairy thick, heavy, rigid
> tubes of its fork. There isn't much flex to lose, so I don't worry about it
> on Riv-style bikes.
>
> As for damaging the fork? Unless you do something you obviously shouldn't,
> I can't imagine how you'd damage it. I do 50lb Costco runs with my front
> basket and pannier setup (the Nitto is rated for 35lbs) and while it isn't
> fun, nothing seems anywhere near breaking.
>
>
> Reed
>
> On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 8:31 AM Timothy Orr 
> wrote:
>
>> Hey! I'm about to acquire my first Riv. I was planning to run the Surly
>> front rack 2.0 with a Wald 139 and front panniers, but I've heard that
>> running a basket with panniers on the same rack will really stiffen the
>> front fork and could potentially cause some damage to the fork. I've seen
>> lots of folks who run a separate rack for the basket and use lowriders for
>> front panniers, so I'm wondering if there something I'm missing. The Surly
>> rack, like the Nitto 34f, mounts to the dropouts and the mid-blade
>> braze-ons. I'd consider carrying some weight in the rear, but that's where
>> I put the seat for my son to ride along around town. Any feedback or
>> personal experiences?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
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**
**
*The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a
circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and
individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

*Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the
world revolves.) *Carthusian motto

*It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart

*Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle

*Le sacre est la projection du Centre celeste dans la peripherie cosmique,
ou du "Moteur immobile" dans le flux des choses. *F Schuon, *Le Sens du
Sacre, *Etudes Traditionnelles, 1r q 1979

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Re: [RBW] Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[Reed Kennedy]

I run a Nitto Campee front rack with removable low-rider pannier mount on
my Hunq, with a Wald basket up top. It all works great.

Some folks (BQ, for instance) worry about stiffening a fork by attaching a
rack at the top and bottom, reenforcing it. I try to avoid it on my
lighter-tubed BQ-style bikes. But the Hunq uses fairy thick, heavy, rigid
tubes of its fork. There isn't much flex to lose, so I don't worry about it
on Riv-style bikes.

As for damaging the fork? Unless you do something you obviously shouldn't,
I can't imagine how you'd damage it. I do 50lb Costco runs with my front
basket and pannier setup (the Nitto is rated for 35lbs) and while it isn't
fun, nothing seems anywhere near breaking.


Reed
On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 8:31 AM Timothy Orr 
wrote:

> Hey! I'm about to acquire my first Riv. I was planning to run the Surly
> front rack 2.0 with a Wald 139 and front panniers, but I've heard that
> running a basket with panniers on the same rack will really stiffen the
> front fork and could potentially cause some damage to the fork. I've seen
> lots of folks who run a separate rack for the basket and use lowriders for
> front panniers, so I'm wondering if there something I'm missing. The Surly
> rack, like the Nitto 34f, mounts to the dropouts and the mid-blade
> braze-ons. I'd consider carrying some weight in the rear, but that's where
> I put the seat for my son to ride along around town. Any feedback or
> personal experiences?
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
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[RBW] Front rack w/ basket and panniers

[Timothy Orr]

Hey! I'm about to acquire my first Riv. I was planning to run the Surly front 
rack 2.0 with a Wald 139 and front panniers, but I've heard that running a 
basket with panniers on the same rack will really stiffen the front fork and 
could potentially cause some damage to the fork. I've seen lots of folks who 
run a separate rack for the basket and use lowriders for front panniers, so I'm 
wondering if there something I'm missing. The Surly rack, like the Nitto 34f, 
mounts to the dropouts and the mid-blade braze-ons. I'd consider carrying some 
weight in the rear, but that's where I put the seat for my son to ride along 
around town. Any feedback or personal experiences?

Thanks!

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[RBW] Re: Sam Hillborn

[TampaTech]

I have a 55cm Sam on 700c wheels and drop bars.  I also have a carbon fiber 
bike that weighs half as much and a hard tail mountain bike with 2.25" 
tires.  I ride the Sam 95% of the time.  I bring the mountain bike if I am 
driving my truck to the trails and ride the race bike when I want to feel 
like I'm going really fast.  The Sam is typically 1-2 mph slower average 
speed than my go-fast bike.  On rougher roads the Sam has the advantage. 
 Hills certainly favor the lighter bike.  Despite the fact that the Sam is 
much more stable, I feel that it handles very well in corners and on 
trails.  If I had one bike it would be the Sam Hillborne.  I may replace my 
other two with Rivendell offerings someday but for now I ride what I've got.

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[RBW] WTB/WTT: black Brooks B68 or C19

[WETH]

Bump!
Saddle is going on a bike I am building up for my 14 year old son, so I'd 
rather not put a brand new Brooks on it.
Thanks.
Erl

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[RBW] Re: FS: Sackville TrunSack Small - Olive

[Jim S.]

Bump - $75. I think it's pretty close to new.

On Monday, March 6, 2017 at 9:06:46 AM UTC-6, Jim S. wrote:
>
> $95 shipped. Thank you for your consideration.
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Feb 24th Century Ride on the Sam Hillborne

[Daniel Betancourt]

>
> Thanks for all the responses. Les is right in that we flew out to Mardi 
> Gras the next morning and partied like rock stars. Great time for my first 
> trip out there.
>

My next adventure will be biking the  Florida Keys Overseas Heritage Trail 
next month. Les is supposed to come along and my wife will be coming along 
in the car. The game plan at this time is to bike from Key Largo to 
Marathon on day 1, and then from Marathon to Key West on Day 2. The rest of 
day 2, 3, & 4 will include partying it up in Key West. I can't wait for 
that trip!!

I hope we don't party as hard as this guy did in Key West!!  :b

http://wfla.com/2017/03/08/ufs-newly-elected-student-body-president-arrested-knocking-over-bikes-in-key-west/

Dan

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[RBW] Re: Feb 24th Century Ride on the Sam Hillborne

[Ryan Fleming]

I'm impressed. Good for you and good for the Sam!

On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 11:25:42 AM UTC-6, Daniel Betancourt wrote:
>
> I finished my first Century ride after around 2 months of preparation. I'm 
> including a few pics of the ride below. I took the day off of work as I 
> wanted to get the ride in before our trip to New Orleans the following day. 
>
> The weather was nice that morning as there was no rain, it wasn't cold, 
> and the winds laid down for the most part. I got out of the house just 
> before 6 am and decided to hit the bike trail outside of our neighborhood 
> that I've been preparing on. I'm fortunate that the trail goes 40 miles in 
> one direction, so I would finish 80% of the ride just by completing one 
> loop. The ride was uneventful until I got 70 miles in. I ended up with a 
> nasty upper leg cramp that forced me to take a break for about 30 minutes 
> and I had to stop periodically the last 30 miles which killed my expected 
> average speed. I'm not complaining as I was just happy to finish the ride 
> in one piece.  :)
>
> I did get a kick out of seeing the artwork on a section of the trail on 
> the back of a large section of fences facing the trail. There are some 
> talented people out there that put some serious time in. The last pic below 
> is a trail that leads to a stream under a bridge that I've seen kids 
> playing in the past. They have some rope tied to a tree where they swing 
> into the water, but as the water levels are low right now I can't imagine 
> it's getting much use.
>
> This is my longest ride and prior to purchasing this bike, my longest ride 
> was just over 60 miles. Overall I was happy with how the bike performed. 
> I'm still getting used to this leather seat and that along with the leg 
> cramp caused me the most discomfort at the later part of the ride, but to 
> be fair I remember feeling the same way on my 60-mile ride I took about 7 
> years ago on my road bike with a gel seat. One nice thing I lacked on this 
> ride was number wrists/hands. That has for the most part gone away and was 
> always an issue when riding my road bike.
>
> Dan
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Sam Hillborn

[Philip Kim]

Carla,I used to have a sam. Great just to ride around, but also useful for 
running errands etc. I had tektro 559s, and was not a fan. I later switched 
to Paul Racers which were much better. the sam does all things pretty well, 
but not excellent at one particular thing, which works for me. most of my 
miles comes from commuting, running errands, and doing moderate weekend 
rides. Nothing that requires lycra.

I've had noodles with a 8cm stem, and it was comfy. I had albatross bars, 
and like drew, I found them too cramped.

I regret selling it, but I'm excited to try the Appaloosa, which is a 
stretched out Sam, that is a bit beefier. Will be nice, since I plan to run 
upright bars.

I also ride a semi-custom 650b BDB Pelican (my gf's once I get my 650b 
norther cycles custom in shortly).

On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 7:18:50 PM UTC-5, Carla Waugh wrote:
>
> Hello Sam owners I'm thinking about purchasing a Sam for retirement partly 
> price mostly because it's a Rivendell and lugged. I have one other bike 
> it's a custom 650B and I know the Sam is a 700c. Ideas? Thoughts? Thanks

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[RBW] Re: Remember Good People, Steel is Real!

[iamkeith]

Did his helmet survive?  ;-)

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[RBW] Re: cool new geometry section on rivbike.com

[Dave Johnston]

I believe all the Waterford bikes are pretty much built to order and you 
can get different paint color for an upcharge. Since Riv and Waterford 
already have the designs and jigs for previous size models there is no 
reason for them not to keep offering them.

-Dave J


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[RBW] Re: ird power ratchet shifters keep loosening

[Garth]

You might try removing any grease on the d-ring bolt and melt some beeswax 
on it, if you have any that is.  Or, if you have some linseed oil try that, 
better than buying loctite. 

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 6:54:07 AM UTC-5, Jon BALER wrote:
>
> Anybody else have a problem with ird power ratchet shifters frequently 
> loosening up?  My rear shifter needs to be tightened every about 1-2 times 
> a week (my commute is ~100 miles/week).   It's easy enough to tighten while 
> riding, but there should be a way to avoid this.   I'm talking about the 
> shifting lever moving on its own, not the bar clamp.
>

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Re: [RBW] Current indexing systems and shifting in general, per the Knothole

[ascpgh]

I attached that video of Merckx to give image to Jan Heine's observation of 
the riding style necessitated by the CFRP frame he tested in the current BQ 
and how it differed from his regular bike(s) with frame flex, suppleness. 
He illustrated his point by describing how Merckx pedaled with his whole 
body, as you described, standing in the hooks without downshifting to 
torque through the obstacle.

Andy Cheatham
PIttsburgh

On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 4:36:57 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Segueing a lil' bit: there was another thread today on this list or 
> t'other, where someone attached old video of Eddy one one of the big rides. 
> Very interesting to see (I guess this was very early '70s) how pedaling had 
> changed from the days of Coppi and late Bartali. You watch even older video 
> of C and B on the flats, and they're spinning at very high cadences; Coppi 
> seemed to prefer the spin-coast, spin-coast, which I also favored 25 years 
> ago when I could maintain 20-23 in my favorite 64-65" gear. Then they hit 
> inclines, and they're grinding up in amazingly high gears at very low 
> cadences.
>
> But Eddy and companions are pushing bigger gears on the flats, and it is 
> very interesting to see how, at the slightest rise or, perhaps, a turn into 
> a wind, they get out of the saddle, without downshifting, and torque their 
> way through the "obstacle." And they stand while in the hooks! (And, btw, 
> Eddy was a "messy" pedaler; you can't say he had finesse -- all over the 
> bike!)
>
> I've not watched much Tour video since Big Mig, but I daresay that the 
> style now is fast spinning and maintaining cadence in all conditions and 
> terrains.
>
> On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 2:29 PM, Patrick Moore  > wrote:
>
>> I guess the gaps are getting so narrow that any difference between 
>> marques disappears. But that's a good thing.
>>
>> What about derailleurs? Are road and mountain bike derailleurs compatible 
>> with the opposite shifters? And what about shifter compatibility between 
>> the different marques?
>>
>> Frankly, if I were to use indexing, I'd at least seriously consider 
>> wireless electric (I'm tempted to be snide and say, "If you've abdicated 
>> shifting skill to indexing, you might as use electricity," but I won't). 
>> But my last bike with indexing was the Ram, when I had it set up with 7 
>> speed Dura Ace, and I didn't particularly like it. Friction for me. 
>>
>> Patrick "hell, fixed/single for me" Moore, who just had a nice 76" gear 
>> ride on the gofast in breezy but sunny and warm ABQ, NM.
>>
>> Seriously, if you don't shift so much, you have all the more attention to 
>> give to other aspects of cycling, like cadence strategy -- but don't mind 
>> me, I admit that it's *chacun/ne a son/sa gout/te.*
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Brewster Fong > > wrote:
>>
>>>
 Agree.  With 11 speed, all of the different platforms work with each 
>>> other. So you can mix Campy, Shimano and Sram wheels and cassettes.  
>>>
>>
>
>
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> **
> **
> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
> circumference on the contours of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>
> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* *(The cross stands motionless while the 
> world revolves.) *Carthusian motto
>
> *It is *we *who change; *He* remains the same.* Eckhart
>
> *Kinei hos eromenon.* (*It moves [all things] as the beloved.) *Aristotle
>
> *Le sacre est la projection du Centre celeste dans la peripherie cosmique, 
> ou du "Moteur immobile" dans le flux des choses. *F Schuon, *Le Sens du 
> Sacre, *Etudes Traditionnelles, 1r q 1979
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Sam Hillborn

[Belopsky]

Ive had two 700c Hillbornes. Very stable and comfortable riding if that's 
your thing. Both of mine were second/third owners and not set up well for 
me/too overbuilt for my weight = too boring for me.

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[RBW] ird power ratchet shifters keep loosening

[Jon BALER]

Anybody else have a problem with ird power ratchet shifters frequently 
loosening up?  My rear shifter needs to be tightened every about 1-2 times 
a week (my commute is ~100 miles/week).   It's easy enough to tighten while 
riding, but there should be a way to avoid this.   I'm talking about the 
shifting lever moving on its own, not the bar clamp.

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