[RBW] Re: It’s all about the power: Handlebar height/body position

[Jay in Tel Aviv]

Watching this video cut 5 minutes off of my commute home Thursday :)

On Thursday, February 15, 2018 at 4:11:55 PM UTC+2, Max S wrote:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THzi7sKr8Rc 
>
> On Monday, February 12, 2018 at 12:04:50 PM UTC-5, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>> Jan’s exploration of cycling myth #5, higher handlebars are more 
>> comfortable, sure matches my experience single speeding (free or fixed), 
>> where changing positions relates to only one thing because there is only 
>> one gear: power output. On steep climbs, I tuck until I stand. Otherwise, 
>> upright is fine.
>>
>> https://janheine.wordpress.com/2018/02/12/myth-5-an-upright-position-is-more-comfortable/
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>> www.CredoFamily.org
>> www.MindYourHeadCoop.org
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: RIvendell Bleriot 55cm

[Lum Gim Fong]

I bought a 53 after selling my 55!


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[RBW] Re: WTB single silver shifter (or dia-compe ENE)

[Belopsky]

"bump" I think I'm looking..otherwise I'll go Sora dt..

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[RBW] FS: Frank Jones Senor parts a.k.a. "you choose my adventure"

[Bill Lindsay]

Brakes sold. Dura ace NIB 7710 track hub still available. 

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[RBW] Re: FS: RIvendell Bleriot 55cm

[Ian A]

Joe - you can redeem yourself and buy another one.

IanA

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[RBW] Re: FS: RIvendell Bleriot 55cm

[Joe Bernard]

I had a 55 once. I sold it cuz I'm an idiot. 

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[RBW] Re: I'm the best at bad photos - Frank Jones Jr

[Belopsky]

;)

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 8:39:59 PM UTC-5, Dave Small wrote:
>
> Frank has a son?

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[RBW] Re: FS: RIvendell Bleriot 55cm

[Lum Gim Fong]

I had a 55 once. They have a pump peg

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[RBW] Re: I'm the best at bad photos - Frank Jones Jr

[Dave Small]

Frank has a son?

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John W]

Thank you everyone for your very patient advice. I've concluded that a 
current 55 or even better, a 56 with the 57.5 TT, is the way to go for me. 
Basically, what Riv recommends!

John

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[RBW] Re: last chance for 53cm Frank Jones

[Belopsky]

Go fish

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 3:36:38 PM UTC-5, Lum Gim Fong wrote:
>
> Not me
>
> I need 42mm tires with fenders and 54.5 longest tt tops.
>

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[RBW] Re: I have some ibex socks if anyone is interested.

[Stephen W.]

I'm interested. Sending private email/message.

Stephen 

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[RBW] Re: FS: RIvendell Bleriot 55cm

[John Hawrylak]

no pictures!!

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ


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Re: [RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John Woo]

All very excellent points, Jeremy. Thanks. 


> On Feb 16, 2018, at 11:09 AM, Jeremy Till  wrote:
> 
> I'd say go with the 55.  For a number of reasons: 
> 
> -Rivendell knows the fit of their bikes pretty well, and they generally err 
> on the side of larger frame sizes, so if they're telling you to go for a 
> smaller frame, chances are that's probably going to be big enough for you. 
> -You are going for a drop bar setup with the bars just below the saddle, 
> which again, puts you on in the camp of running relatively low bars in 
> Rivendell terms.  In my mind, this is another point in favor of going for a 
> smaller frame.  I think there's a real chance you wouldn't be able to get the 
> bars low enough on the larger frame.  
> -Numerous folks on here have reported sizing up on the Sam but later coming 
> to the conclusion that it is too big for them.  
> 
> When you say, "I know I could ride a 58cm," what leads you to that 
> conclusion?  Have you test ridden a 58cm Sam?  Or is it from riding other 
> 58cm road bikes?  You mention riding a 56cm Surly later in the post.  
> Remember that the up-sloping top tube on the Sam makes it fit larger than its 
> measured seat tube size, so a 55cm Sam probably would fit the same as a 58 or 
> 59cm Surly or other road bike with a level top tube, just with more exposed 
> seatpost.  
> 
> Even after you take this into account, there are other more subtle features 
> of a Rivendell that increase bar height: all of their upper head tube lugs 
> feature a headtube extension above the top tube, and they tend to leave their 
> forks a little on the long side, so the top nut of the headset is pretty 
> high.  So there's a lot of extra bar height built into that 55cm Sam already 
> over your 56 Surly.
> 
>> On Thursday, February 15, 2018 at 11:38:19 PM UTC-8, John W wrote:
>> Hello folks,
>> 
>> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes.
>> 
>> I'm 6' tall with an 85PBH (say, 86.25 PBH with shoes.) Saddle height ~75cm, 
>> a Brooks B17 which runs about 6cm tall.
>> 
>> Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I could ride a 58. I'll ride on 
>> pavement and trails. Less so, gnarly track. And I'll set up drop bars about 
>> 1cm lower than my saddle. 
>> 
>> My concerns are:
>> 
>> — will I have enough exposed stem above the headset and cable hanger in 
>> front?
>> — will the bike handle oddly with just ~2cm of exposed stem?
>> — am I setting myself up for the inability to use taller upright bars in the 
>> future?
>> 
>> I cribbed this photo from a fellow with a shorter saddle height than me:
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37347002@N05/4354827488/in/pool-hillborne/
>> 
>> The 55 is the safe bet, while the 58 looks doable. 
>> 
>> I'm cautious of getting a bike that's too small for me. Generally speaking, 
>> I'm a 56cm on Surly road frames and I don't feel stretched out on them.
>> 
>> What say you? 55 or 58?
>> 
>> Separately, looking at the geo charts on Riv's site, the Stack and Reach 
>> measurements on the Sam Hillbornes look off to me, but perhaps I'm not 
>> correctly parsing the effect of the 71.5 STA.
>> 
>> Apologies for the naval gazing email. Any input would be appreciated.
>> 
>> John in NYC
> 
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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Austin]

I've wondered this about my Sam too. I'm a hair under 6'3", 93cm PBH, 82cm 
seat height on a 62cm frame with a 90mm stem. I've always felt the bike is 
a little big and wondered if a 60 would be better. Of course they don't 
make 60's any more. Maybe I need to find someone with a 60cm frame that is 
on the small side and make a swap



On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 10:29:34 AM UTC-5, Dave Small wrote:
>
> Hi John,
>
> My experience may help you decide, but to cut to the chase:  I'd recommend 
> not going outside Riv's PBH recommendations, and in fact I don't want to go 
> even to the edge of their recommended range.  
>
> In 2012 I bought a green 60cm first-run Sam.  I worked with a dealer in 
> Ohio and test-rode a 56cm and a 60cm.  I could have bought either one, but 
> at the time I was new to Riv and went with the larger size in part to test 
> their opinion that "most people buy too small" and their advice that, when 
> in doubt, go bigger.  I'm 6' 2" with a PBH of 88 cm, which was within the 
> recommended range of the 56cm *and* the 60cm frame sizes, but was at the 
> top of the former and the bottom of the latter.  
>
> I could never love that Sam.  It was okay, but always felt a little too 
> big, even after riding it enough that I'd have acclimated if the issue was 
> just that it wasn't what I was used to.  I questioned whether it was the 
> size, the specific model, or (gads!) a fallacy of the whole Riv philosophy, 
> since all were new to me at the time.  I *wanted* to love it, and I 
> *tried*---I really did!---but I just never felt it the way I wanted to or 
> expected to.  
>
> Then, a couple of years ago I bought a used 58cm Homer Hilsen in large 
> part to give Riv another chance because what they espouse still resonated 
> with me, and I suspected that the size was the problem, not the model or 
> the company's design philosophy.  I loved the Hilsen immediately, and after 
> my first ride told my wife that if I were forced to reduce to N=1, that the 
> Hilsen was a strong candidate to be that one.  
>
> With that renewed confidence in Riv, a couple of years ago I bought a 58cm 
> Sam when they became available with a single top tube in that size, and 
> loved it immediately.  The differences in "feel" between that and the 60cm 
> Sam were subtle but real, and took me over the hump from "okay" to "love." 
>  Last fall I bought a 58cm canti-Sam during their presale and will transfer 
> everything from the 60cm first-run Sam (which had cantis) to the new one 
> and then sell the green 60cm frame.  
>
> Based on my experience with Sams, I want to be solidly in the middle of 
> Riv's PBH range-recommendation.  Not at the edge, and certainly not outside 
> it.  I was at the bottom of the range for the 60cm Sam, while you're 2 cm 
> below the bottom edge of the range.  You say you're concerned about getting 
> a bike that's too small for you, but you should also be concerned about 
> getting a bike that's too big for you; neither one will fit well.  
>
> My last comment:  You say "Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I 
> could ride a 58" and that the 58 "looks doable," but that's the kind of 
> language I'd expect if someone were giving you a 58cm Sam free of charge 
> and you were wondering if it would work at all.  You have a choice, so why 
> not go for the optimal size?  I can ride my 60cm Sam, and it's quite 
> "doable," but it's not optimal and I want optimal if I can get it.  
>
> Dave 
>
>

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[RBW] Free for postage: probably broken S3X hub, 120 (I think), red barrel, 32 spokes

[Patrick Moore]

I was told by the distributor that a bike shop can get the innards for
$100. I *think* something in the innards is broken, because even with
careful shifter adjustment the thing skips under heavy load in 2nd and 1st.
And I *think* it is 120; at any rate, it is *not* 130, and I was told they
made it only in the 120 and 130 OL dimensions. It fit nicely into a 126 mm
OL frame, though.

It might be missing shifter and other shifting bits, and the nuts and
washers may be aftermarket.

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: NITTO Pearl stems (new-ish)

[Patrick Moore]

I'm in the market for a 8 cm Pearl, if it is the earlier, shinier (ie,
shinier than the current Tech Deluxe) model. What size is your 26.0? How
much?

On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 1:56 PM, Lum Gim Fong  wrote:

> 25.4 is sold
>
>
> 26.0 srill available
>
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[RBW] Re: FS: RIvendell Bleriot 55cm

[Joel Stern]

Well priced, I got $1800 for the new one I had all built up. That one was 
ridden maybe 3 times, I still have my first Bleriot.  Good luck

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 2:41:49 AM UTC-5, moshmosh wrote:
>
> For sale: Rivendell Bleriot 55cm. Frame has some paint chips, but no dings 
> or dents. Saddle height is 71cm in the pictures. Frame has fender and rack 
> mounts. Fork blades have rear facing eyelets. Brakes have been installed 
> with Sheldon Nuts for easy fender installation.
>
> Wheels and tires have less than 50 mi. Wheels were built by Larry at 
> Perfect Wheels in Seattle. Hubs are NOS XT (32 hole), rims are Velocity 
> Synergy. Fresh cables, housing, and bar tape. Ready to ride. 
>
> Asking $1350.00/shipped ($1250.00 w/out Brooks Saddle)
>
> Build info:
> Shimano Ultegra NOS headset
> Nitto Noodle handlebar 44cm
> Nitto Technomic stem 90mm
> Nitto seat post (S83)
> Shimano brake levers
> Rivendell Silver caliper brakes
> Rivendell Silver bar end shifters
> Shimano 8 speed cassette (11-34)
> Sugino XD triple crank (170mm, 46-36,24)
> Shimano XT rear der
> Campy triple front der
> Wheels: NOS XT hubs, Velocity Synergy 650B rims
> Soma Xpress 650B tires, 38 (Pasela tread)
> Brooks B17 Special
>

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[RBW] I have some ibex socks if anyone is interested.

[Joel Stern]

Hello all,

As you know ibex is not more (for now).

I have a bunch of socks, 8 pair in all. 6 have been worn lightly, 1 is a 
low, also worn lightly, one is new.

If anyone has interest let me know. 

Thanks

Joel Stern

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[RBW] Re: FS: NITTO Pearl stems (new-ish)

[Lum Gim Fong]

25.4 is sold


26.0 srill available

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[RBW] Re: WTB/WTT for: Nitto Mini Front Rack

[Justin Schoop]

Correct

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[RBW] Re: WTB/WTT for: Nitto Mini Front Rack

[Philip Williamson]

You want the Nitto Campee 32F, that mounts with p-clamps or fork brazeons, 
correct? 


 

Philip
Santa Rosa, CA 

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 9:01:07 AM UTC-8, Justin Schoop wrote:
>
> Title says it all. 

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[RBW] Re: last chance for 53cm Frank Jones

[Lum Gim Fong]

Not me

I need 42mm tires with fenders and 54.5 longest tt tops.

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[adam leibow]

Hey John,


I just bought a 58cm SH and I am 5'-9" with 87.5 PBH. I have very long legs 
for my height, so I figured I could fit the bigger size and I was right. 
The TT is proportionally long but it feels good with 7cm stem and 46cm 
noodles. I would forsure go 58 if it were me. Depends how low/high you want 
the bars. I like bars & saddle to be about even, and this does the trick. 

On Thursday, February 15, 2018 at 11:38:19 PM UTC-8, John W wrote:
>
> Hello folks,
>
> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes.
>
> I'm 6' tall with an 85PBH (say, 86.25 PBH with shoes.) Saddle height 
> ~75cm, a Brooks B17 which runs about 6cm tall.
>
> Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I could ride a 58. I'll ride on 
> pavement and trails. Less so, gnarly track. And I'll set up drop bars about 
> 1cm lower than my saddle. 
>
> My concerns are:
>
> — will I have enough exposed stem above the headset and cable hanger in 
> front?
> — will the bike handle oddly with just ~2cm of exposed stem?
> — am I setting myself up for the inability to use taller upright bars in 
> the future?
>
> I cribbed this photo from a fellow with a shorter saddle height than me:
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37347002@N05/4354827488/in/pool-hillborne/
>
> The 55 is the safe bet, while the 58 looks doable. 
>
> I'm cautious of getting a bike that's too small for me. Generally 
> speaking, I'm a 56cm on Surly road frames and I don't feel stretched out on 
> them.
>
> What say you? 55 or 58?
>
> Separately, looking at the geo charts on Riv's site, the Stack and Reach 
> measurements on the Sam Hillbornes look off to me, but perhaps I'm not 
> correctly parsing the effect of the 71.5 STA.
>
> Apologies for the naval gazing email. Any input would be appreciated.
>
> John in NYC
>

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Surlyprof]

https://www.flickr.com/photos/129545862@N03/19238298132/in/dateposted-public/

Here's a photo of my 56 with Smart Sams.  Those are the biggest tires I can 
get on there.  Saddle height is 75.

John

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 8:32:21 AM UTC-8, Surlyprof wrote:
>
> I am 5’11” with an 85 pbh and ride a 56.  I use an albastache bar with an 
> 8cm stem or an albatross bar with an 11.  Mine is the year they shortened 
> the top tube from 59 (green, first run) to 57.5 if I remember correctly and 
> it fits great.  I was initially concerned about the standover height 
> because it got very close when using 45 Smart Sam tires.  For that reason 
> I’d be concerned about the 58.  On the chance that you might want to max 
> out you tire size, the higher standover might be a problem.  Given your 
> proportions, you may have to go to a longer stem but that would depend 
> partially on your arm length, too. 
>
> Good luck.  Sam’s a great bike. 
>
> John

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Re: [RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[tc]

Link to my google photos album. Both mine and wife’s Sams are in there. 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/9kfJxuf3sXyDyBoA3

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[RBW] Re: Off topic kinda...

[sameness]

Ahhh, yes. Sorry for the misinformation. I use the Proraso shaving soap 
(not cream) myself.

Jeff Hagedorn
Los Angeles, CA USA

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 11:14:07 AM UTC-8, Jay Lonner wrote:
>
> Musgo Real, made in Portugal. Tried it, liked it OK, still prefer Proraso 
> shaving soap (not cream).
>
> Jay Lonner
> Bellingham, WA
>

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[RBW] Re: Off topic kinda...

[sameness]

Ahhh, yes. Sorry for the misdirection. I use the Proraso having soap (not 
cream) myself.

Jeff Hagedorn
Los Angeles, CA USA

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 11:14:07 AM UTC-8, Jay Lonner wrote:
>
> Musgo Real, made in Portugal. Tried it, liked it OK, still prefer Proraso 
> shaving soap (not cream).
>
> Jay Lonner
> Bellingham, WA
>

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[RBW] Re: Off topic kinda...

[Jay Lonner]

Musgo Real, made in Portugal. Tried it, liked it OK, still prefer Proraso 
shaving soap (not cream).

Jay Lonner
Bellingham, WA

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 10:20:19 AM UTC-8, Diego J. Garza wrote:
>
> Does anyone remember the shaving cream that was sold by Riv? I was looking 
> to buy some but can no longer find it on their site? I believe it had a 
> Spanish royal name or something... anyone recall?
>
> Diego "Beardsly" Garza
> Los Angeles, California
>

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Re: [RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John Woo]

I have indeed search around for a 56 Sam with the shorter top tube. (I had a 
WTB post a little while back.) But I’m not really counting on one showing up, 
hence my decision point between the 55 and 58 sizes. 

John 



> On Feb 16, 2018, at 11:46 AM, Surlyprof  wrote:
> 
> Have you tried seeking out a first run 56 with the longer top tube?  Would 
> probably fit you perfectly.  BTW... I forgot to mention that I also set my 
> saddle height at 75.
> 
> John
> 
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[RBW] Re: Off topic kinda...

[Shoji Takahashi]

Musgo!

shoji
arlington ma

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 1:20:19 PM UTC-5, Diego J. Garza wrote:
>
> Does anyone remember the shaving cream that was sold by Riv? I was looking 
> to buy some but can no longer find it on their site? I believe it had a 
> Spanish royal name or something... anyone recall?
>
> Diego "Beardsly" Garza
> Los Angeles, California
>

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[RBW] Re: Off topic kinda...

[sameness]

Pretty sure it was Proraso ?

Jeff Hagedorn
Los Angeles, CA USA

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 10:20:19 AM UTC-8, Diego J. Garza wrote:
>
> Does anyone remember the shaving cream that was sold by Riv? I was looking 
> to buy some but can no longer find it on their site? I believe it had a 
> Spanish royal name or something... anyone recall?
>
> Diego "Beardsly" Garza
> Los Angeles, California
>

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[RBW] Re: FS Wool & Winter-weather Gear for the Big N' Tall- Patagonia, Pendleton, Chrome, Carhartt, etc

[ant ritchey]

Several items have sold.

Here's what remains, regardless of black or grey fonts:

>
> Pics via Google Drive 
> 
>  Never 
> tried this method of sharing pics with the bunches before so lemme know if 
> it's not working properly, please!
>
> *Patagonia base layers *
> -Full side zip pants
> Men's large. Not the quilted Nano puff-style but again Primaloft. Great 
> for sleeping in cold temps or winter touring/camping. Slightly too big for 
> me; had they been mediums I'd be keeping these (I love Primaloft!). Good 
> condition. No pics of these yet. $50
>
> *Wool button ups*
> -Sears vintage Wool-blend button up. Double-breast pocket. Maybe the best 
> looking of the bunch, but it needs some work. Lining is torn where stitched 
> into the fabric & the stitching around the button holes has started to come 
> undone over the years. Otherwise it's the handsomest of the bunch and a 
> solid heavy-duty-ish outer layer. $30 as-is
>
> *Jerseys*
> Pearl Izumi Select. Men's small. Just a little too tight. Zip up. Usual 
> three pockets in back. Some bike grease on one cuff, tiny mystery splotch 
> on the back, as pictured. $15
> Serac large. A baby-blue vintage beauty. Zippered neck, side & back 
> pockets. Lined/padded collar. Grommet vent holes in the pits. Minor issues 
> with stitching on the chest. $25  
>
>
> *Riv railroad rip-off seersucker*
> A Nordstrom Classic, apparently, 100% combed cotton seersucker. 15 1/2-36 
> says the tag. I bought this in response & resemblance to RBW's railroad 
> shirt, although it's undeniably more boat than train. Great summer riding 
> sun shirt, very good condition. $15
>
> *Carhartt Jacket*
> Heavy duty canvas zip up with hood in the seldom-seen Carhartt color of 
> blue!. Size "Large Tall" for the longer trunk-ed body. In great shape with 
> a few minor issues- some small snags on the inside of each sleeve from 
> carrying firewood & small conveniently-also-blue splotching on front right 
> pocket from a dubiously cheap pen. $40 
>
>
> *Chrome merino hoodie*
> *This one 
> 
>  *100% 
> Merino. Size small. A really well-made garment that I wish I'd have bought 
> in large. Worn only a few times, very good condition. $50
>
> Prices are net to me after shipping/fees. Open to offers if you want a 
> bunch of stuff. Last year when I posted winter clothing FS the first chap 
> bought the lot and got what I'd say was a smokin' deal...so lemme know if 
> you're that way inclined. Cross-posted to RBWOG & iBOB. PM or text for more 
> images, questions, etc.
>
> Ant Ritchey / Portland Oregon / 724 757 9358
>

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John W]

My PBH is 85. 

The geo chart can be found here:
https://www.rivbike.com/pages/geometry

The reach seems significantly shorter and the stack significantly higher than 
I’d expect, even having ridden similar compact frames like the Vaya and Awol. 

I’m not saying the number are wrong, but head scratching to someone like me who 
has never ridden a Riv “expanded” geo frame. Hence my poll. 

A picture is worth a thousand words. Anyone have a photo of their 56cm Sam 
(59cm TT) with a saddle height in my neighborhood?

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John W]

To clarify, I don’t mean to say that the stack is wrong, just a bit higher than 
I’d expect, even with an upslope. This is going on past experience with compact 
frames, and having ridden others’ off the peg frames like the Awol and Vaya. 

https://www.rivbike.com/pages/geometry

The stack (vertical height from center of bottom bracket to top 
tube/headtubeintersection) is 64.5cm on a size 58 frame. 

My PBH is 85. With shoes on I can comfortably ride my 56cm Disc Trucker, which 
has an 85cm standover with 50mm Marathons. 

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Re: [RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John Woo]

Truer words were never spoken. 

Separate thought: I think someone could make a fortune selling or renting a fit 
cycle that could actually be ridden, at least around the block a few times. 


> On Feb 16, 2018, at 9:17 AM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:
> 
> I’d say 55, but I’d also say: make a decision, enjoy yourself, and if you 
> change your mind down the road, do something else. 
> 
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito Ca

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[RBW] Off topic kinda...

[Diego J. Garza]

Does anyone remember the shaving cream that was sold by Riv? I was looking 
to buy some but can no longer find it on their site? I believe it had a 
Spanish royal name or something... anyone recall?

Diego "Beardsly" Garza
Los Angeles, California

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Re: [RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John Woo]

Thanks Tom. Good data points. 

Could you perhaps snap a photo of your wife’s bike? I’m curious about the stem 
height and length, although I’d be running drop bars. 


> On Feb 16, 2018, at 9:34 AM, tc  wrote:
> 
> I'd say 58, esp. if you're gonna mostly ride pavement or packed trails.
> 
> My wife rides her 58 Sam with a 74.9 saddle height which exposes about 4" of 
> seatpost.  She's 5'-9.5" and is mostly legs, with a PBH of 87.5, so her reach 
> isn't as long as yours (...and her actual saddle height is lower than PBH - 
> 11).  Her albatross bars are up high and she loves it.  It's a road/paved 
> greenway bike for her; she has an Anthem for offroading.
> 
> I'm 6' - 0.5" tall with a PBH of 90.5.  Actual saddle height is 78.7 (...also 
> less than PBH - 11).  I have a Noodle-equipped 58 Sam and love it.  I have a 
> a hair less than 5" of seatpost showing and about 4" of stem showing, but the 
> bars are a tad higher than the saddle because of the great geo of the Sam.
> 
> I know it's frustrating when you think you're in between sizes!
> 
> Tom
> 

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Re: [RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[John Woo]

Marc, what’s the TT of your 56 Sam, since there were geo changes through the 
years? (Would you have a photo?)


> On Feb 16, 2018, at 9:54 AM, Marc Irwin  wrote:
> 
> I'm 5'11"and and have an 84 PBH.  I ride 56 Hillborne and 54 Hunqapillar.  
> They are both incredibly comfortable. 
> 
> Marc
> 
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[RBW] Re: Old Synergys

[Jay in Tel Aviv]

Following with interest. 
I have a set of older Synergy - XT wheels too.
Traded the (135mm) rear for an ENO and the front for a dynamo.
I keep them for spares and for lack of anything else to do with them. 
They are in fine shape, but I doubt anyone would buy them for enough over 
the cost of shipping to be worthwhile.

Jay


On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 6:58:00 PM UTC+2, Kieran J wrote:

> Synergys are not tubeless-compatible. I wouldn't try it :-)
>
> KJ
>
>
> On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 6:45:18 AM UTC-8, jandrews_nyc wrote:
>>
>> I have an old wheelset from Riv that I purchased when I got my S.H. in 
>> '09.  Synergy rims, Deore Hubs, 32h.
>> They don't get any use.
>> I'm thinking of making them a cheap tubeless off-road set and have no 
>> experience with this.
>> I think I remember reading years ago that they were not good candidates 
>> for this sort of thing, but like I said, they haven't been used in years.
>> Any reason why I should avoid this?  And, any suggestions on doing this 
>> without too much expense?
>>
>> *Note-they , nor any other wheelset using Synergy rims, ever gave me 
>> any trouble , no cracking or rim wear or unmounted tires, etc.
>>
>> Thank you
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[tc]

I should mention that my wife's 58 Sam with albatross bars has a 120mm 
Tallux stem.  My 58 Sam with Noodle bar has a 70mm Tallux stem.

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 9:34:22 AM UTC-5, tc wrote:
>
> I'd say 58, esp. if you're gonna mostly ride pavement or packed trails.
>
> My wife rides her 58 Sam with a 74.9 saddle height which exposes about 4" 
> of seatpost.  She's 5'-9.5" and is mostly legs, with a PBH of 87.5, so her 
> reach isn't as long as yours (...and her actual saddle height is lower than 
> PBH - 11).  Her albatross bars are up high and she loves it.  It's a 
> road/paved greenway bike for her; she has an Anthem for offroading.
>
> I'm 6' - 0.5" tall with a PBH of 90.5.  Actual saddle height is 78.7 
> (...also less than PBH - 11).  I have a Noodle-equipped 58 Sam and love 
> it.  I have a a hair less than 5" of seatpost showing and about 4" of stem 
> showing, but the bars are a tad higher than the saddle because of the great 
> geo of the Sam.
>
> I know it's frustrating when you think you're in between sizes!
>
> Tom
>
> On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 2:38:19 AM UTC-5, John W wrote:
>>
>> Hello folks,
>>
>> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes
>>
>

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[RBW] WTB/WTT for: Nitto Mini Front Rack

[Justin Schoop]

Title says it all. 

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[RBW] Re: Old Synergys

[Kieran J]

Synergys are not tubeless-compatible. I wouldn't try it :-)

KJ


On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 6:45:18 AM UTC-8, jandrews_nyc wrote:
>
> I have an old wheelset from Riv that I purchased when I got my S.H. in 
> '09.  Synergy rims, Deore Hubs, 32h.
> They don't get any use.
> I'm thinking of making them a cheap tubeless off-road set and have no 
> experience with this.
> I think I remember reading years ago that they were not good candidates 
> for this sort of thing, but like I said, they haven't been used in years.
> Any reason why I should avoid this?  And, any suggestions on doing this 
> without too much expense?
>
> *Note-they , nor any other wheelset using Synergy rims, ever gave me 
> any trouble , no cracking or rim wear or unmounted tires, etc.
>
> Thank you
>
>

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Surlyprof]

Have you tried seeking out a first run 56 with the longer top tube?  Would 
probably fit you perfectly.  BTW... I forgot to mention that I also set my 
saddle height at 75.

John

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Surlyprof]

I am 5’11” with an 85 pbh and ride a 56.  I use an albastache bar with an 8cm 
stem or an albatross bar with an 11.  Mine is the year they shortened the top 
tube from 59 (green, first run) to 57.5 if I remember correctly and it fits 
great.  I was initially concerned about the standover height because it got 
very close when using 45 Smart Sam tires.  For that reason I’d be concerned 
about the 58.  On the chance that you might want to max out you tire size, the 
higher standover might be a problem.  Given your proportions, you may have to 
go to a longer stem but that would depend partially on your arm length, too.

Good luck.  Sam’s a great bike.

John

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Jeremy Till]

I'd say go with the 55.  For a number of reasons: 

-Rivendell knows the fit of their bikes pretty well, and they generally err 
on the side of larger frame sizes, so if they're telling you to go for a 
smaller frame, chances are that's probably going to be big enough for you. 
-You are going for a drop bar setup with the bars just below the saddle, 
which again, puts you on in the camp of running relatively low bars in 
Rivendell terms.  In my mind, this is another point in favor of going for a 
smaller frame.  I think there's a real chance you wouldn't be able to get 
the bars low enough on the larger frame.  
-Numerous folks on here have reported sizing up on the Sam but later coming 
to the conclusion that it is too big for them.  

When you say, "I know I could ride a 58cm," what leads you to that 
conclusion?  Have you test ridden a 58cm Sam?  Or is it from riding other 
58cm road bikes?  You mention riding a 56cm Surly later in the post.  
Remember that the up-sloping top tube on the Sam makes it fit larger than 
its measured seat tube size, so a 55cm Sam probably would fit the same as a 
58 or 59cm Surly or other road bike with a level top tube, just with more 
exposed seatpost.  

Even after you take this into account, there are other more subtle features 
of a Rivendell that increase bar height: all of their upper head tube lugs 
feature a headtube extension above the top tube, and they tend to leave 
their forks a little on the long side, so the top nut of the headset is 
pretty high.  So there's a lot of extra bar height built into that 55cm Sam 
already over your 56 Surly.

On Thursday, February 15, 2018 at 11:38:19 PM UTC-8, John W wrote:
>
> Hello folks,
>
> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes.
>
> I'm 6' tall with an 85PBH (say, 86.25 PBH with shoes.) Saddle height 
> ~75cm, a Brooks B17 which runs about 6cm tall.
>
> Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I could ride a 58. I'll ride on 
> pavement and trails. Less so, gnarly track. And I'll set up drop bars about 
> 1cm lower than my saddle. 
>
> My concerns are:
>
> — will I have enough exposed stem above the headset and cable hanger in 
> front?
> — will the bike handle oddly with just ~2cm of exposed stem?
> — am I setting myself up for the inability to use taller upright bars in 
> the future?
>
> I cribbed this photo from a fellow with a shorter saddle height than me:
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37347002@N05/4354827488/in/pool-hillborne/
>
> The 55 is the safe bet, while the 58 looks doable. 
>
> I'm cautious of getting a bike that's too small for me. Generally 
> speaking, I'm a 56cm on Surly road frames and I don't feel stretched out on 
> them.
>
> What say you? 55 or 58?
>
> Separately, looking at the geo charts on Riv's site, the Stack and Reach 
> measurements on the Sam Hillbornes look off to me, but perhaps I'm not 
> correctly parsing the effect of the 71.5 STA.
>
> Apologies for the naval gazing email. Any input would be appreciated.
>
> John in NYC
>

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[RBW] Re: I'm the best at bad photos - Frank Jones Jr

[Davey Two Shoes]

I don't know that there is a bike I regret missing out on more than this 
one!

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Jonathan D.]

I am an 85pbh but six foot. I don’t have long legs. I stood over a 58 at Rivelo 
this weekend after talking with you. It could work but felt big and not much 
stand over room. I would think a 55 would be great with drops and if you can 
find a 56 if you run Albatross. I would go smaller. As Bill says buy one and 
enjoy and I am sure you can always sell and try a different size if that 
doesn’t work. 

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[lconley]

> I am 6' tall with a 83.5 PBH - short legs, lng torso. I ride a 56cm 
>> Sam (last generation - Double TT) it is too "big" for me according to Riv's 
>> sizing recommendations, But I need to put the seat back all the way on the 
>> post and use a 100 cm stem with drops. Because my body proportions are 
>> several standard deviations from the norm, I have almost always ridden a 
>> bike that is too "big" for me. Years ago when I bought a LeMond Buenos 
>> Aires, the shop measured my pubic bone height and tried to put me on a 54 
>> cm frame. It was comically undersized, even the salesman agreed. I ride 
>> what is comfortable to ride, not what I can comfortably straddle when I 
>> stop. 
>>
>
You are in a tough spot, I think the 55 would be ideal for me, but you are 
in between the two sizes. If you are going drops I would say 58, upright - 
55. 
 

>  
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> Cocoa, FL
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Dave Small]

Hi John,

My experience may help you decide, but to cut to the chase:  I'd recommend 
not going outside Riv's PBH recommendations, and in fact I don't want to go 
even to the edge of their recommended range.  

In 2012 I bought a green 60cm first-run Sam.  I worked with a dealer in 
Ohio and test-rode a 56cm and a 60cm.  I could have bought either one, but 
at the time I was new to Riv and went with the larger size in part to test 
their opinion that "most people buy too small" and their advice that, when 
in doubt, go bigger.  I'm 6' 2" with a PBH of 88 cm, which was within the 
recommended range of the 56cm *and* the 60cm frame sizes, but was at the 
top of the former and the bottom of the latter.  

I could never love that Sam.  It was okay, but always felt a little too 
big, even after riding it enough that I'd have acclimated if the issue was 
just that it wasn't what I was used to.  I questioned whether it was the 
size, the specific model, or (gads!) a fallacy of the whole Riv philosophy, 
since all were new to me at the time.  I *wanted* to love it, and I *tried*---I 
really did!---but I just never felt it the way I wanted to or expected to.  

Then, a couple of years ago I bought a used 58cm Homer Hilsen in large part 
to give Riv another chance because what they espouse still resonated with 
me, and I suspected that the size was the problem, not the model or the 
company's design philosophy.  I loved the Hilsen immediately, and after my 
first ride told my wife that if I were forced to reduce to N=1, that the 
Hilsen was a strong candidate to be that one.  

With that renewed confidence in Riv, a couple of years ago I bought a 58cm 
Sam when they became available with a single top tube in that size, and 
loved it immediately.  The differences in "feel" between that and the 60cm 
Sam were subtle but real, and took me over the hump from "okay" to "love." 
 Last fall I bought a 58cm canti-Sam during their presale and will transfer 
everything from the 60cm first-run Sam (which had cantis) to the new one 
and then sell the green 60cm frame.  

Based on my experience with Sams, I want to be solidly in the middle of 
Riv's PBH range-recommendation.  Not at the edge, and certainly not outside 
it.  I was at the bottom of the range for the 60cm Sam, while you're 2 cm 
below the bottom edge of the range.  You say you're concerned about getting 
a bike that's too small for you, but you should also be concerned about 
getting a bike that's too big for you; neither one will fit well.  

My last comment:  You say "Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I 
could ride a 58" and that the 58 "looks doable," but that's the kind of 
language I'd expect if someone were giving you a 58cm Sam free of charge 
and you were wondering if it would work at all.  You have a choice, so why 
not go for the optimal size?  I can ride my 60cm Sam, and it's quite 
"doable," but it's not optimal and I want optimal if I can get it.  

Dave 

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[lconley]

I am 6' tall with a 53.5 PBH - short legs, lng torso. I ride a 56cm Sam 
(last generation - Double TT) it is too "big" for me according to Riv's 
sizing recommendations, But I need to put the seat back all the way on the 
post and use a 100 cm stem with drops. Because my body proportions are 
several standard deviations from the norm, I have almost always ridden a 
bike that is too "big" for me. Years ago when I bought a LeMond Buenos 
Aires, the shop measured my pubic bone height and tried to put me on a 54 
cm frame. It was comically undersized, even the salesman agreed. I ride 
what is comfortable to ride, not what I can comfortably straddle when I 
stop. 

Laing
Cocoa, FL


>

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Edwin W]

I am a hair over 6'0 with a PBH of 90cm and had a 60cm Sam that fit very 
well. I think if I were getting one now I would be battleing between 58 and 
62. My first instinct was to say "58," but the best bet is to talk it 
through with Riv. 

Now on a 58 Joe,

Edwin

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 1:38:19 AM UTC-6, John W wrote:
>
> Hello folks,
>
> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes.
>
> I'm 6' tall with an 85PBH (say, 86.25 PBH with shoes.) Saddle height 
> ~75cm, a Brooks B17 which runs about 6cm tall.
>
> Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I could ride a 58. I'll ride on 
> pavement and trails. Less so, gnarly track. And I'll set up drop bars about 
> 1cm lower than my saddle. 
>
> My concerns are:
>
> — will I have enough exposed stem above the headset and cable hanger in 
> front?
> — will the bike handle oddly with just ~2cm of exposed stem?
> — am I setting myself up for the inability to use taller upright bars in 
> the future?
>
> I cribbed this photo from a fellow with a shorter saddle height than me:
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37347002@N05/4354827488/in/pool-hillborne/
>
> The 55 is the safe bet, while the 58 looks doable. 
>
> I'm cautious of getting a bike that's too small for me. Generally 
> speaking, I'm a 56cm on Surly road frames and I don't feel stretched out on 
> them.
>
> What say you? 55 or 58?
>
> Separately, looking at the geo charts on Riv's site, the Stack and Reach 
> measurements on the Sam Hillbornes look off to me, but perhaps I'm not 
> correctly parsing the effect of the 71.5 STA.
>
> Apologies for the naval gazing email. Any input would be appreciated.
>
> John in NYC
>

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Belopsky]

I'm 5'7 and 83PBH and a 55/56 SH was too big for drops but fine w pullback 
bars or a short stem and drops but didnt like the sloping top tube look so 
sold

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 9:54:52 AM UTC-5, Marc Irwin wrote:
>
> I'm 5'11"and and have an 84 PBH.  I ride 56 Hillborne and 54 Hunqapillar. 
>  They are both incredibly comfortable. 
>
> Marc
>

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Marc Irwin]

 I'm 5'11"and and have an 84 PBH.  I ride 56 Hillborne and 54 Hunqapillar.  
They are both incredibly comfortable. 

Marc

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[RBW] Old Synergys

[jandrews_nyc]

I have an old wheelset from Riv that I purchased when I got my S.H. in '09. 
 Synergy rims, Deore Hubs, 32h.
They don't get any use.
I'm thinking of making them a cheap tubeless off-road set and have no 
experience with this.
I think I remember reading years ago that they were not good candidates for 
this sort of thing, but like I said, they haven't been used in years.
Any reason why I should avoid this?  And, any suggestions on doing this 
without too much expense?

*Note-they , nor any other wheelset using Synergy rims, ever gave me 
any trouble , no cracking or rim wear or unmounted tires, etc.

Thank you

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[tc]

I'd say 58, esp. if you're gonna mostly ride pavement or packed trails.

My wife rides her 58 Sam with a 74.9 saddle height which exposes about 4" 
of seatpost.  She's 5'-9.5" and is mostly legs, with a PBH of 87.5, so her 
reach isn't as long as yours (...and her actual saddle height is lower than 
PBH - 11).  Her albatross bars are up high and she loves it.  It's a 
road/paved greenway bike for her; she has an Anthem for offroading.

I'm 6' - 0.5" tall with a PBH of 90.5.  Actual saddle height is 78.7 
(...also less than PBH - 11).  I have a Noodle-equipped 58 Sam and love 
it.  I have a a hair less than 5" of seatpost showing and about 4" of stem 
showing, but the bars are a tad higher than the saddle because of the great 
geo of the Sam.

I know it's frustrating when you think you're in between sizes!

Tom

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 2:38:19 AM UTC-5, John W wrote:
>
> Hello folks,
>
> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes
>

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Max S]

Bill Lindsay wrote:  
“...make a decision, enjoy yourself, and if you change your mind down the road, 
do something else.” 

Words to live by! 

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Bill Lindsay]

I’d say 55, but I’d also say: make a decision, enjoy yourself, and if you 
change your mind down the road, do something else. 

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito Ca 

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Carla Waugh]

I ride a 55cm and I’m 5’9” and It’s fine.

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Belopsky]

>From the sounds of this, you have shorter legs? What is your PBH

On Friday, February 16, 2018 at 7:18:55 AM UTC-5, eflayer wrote:
>
> I am 5'11 and I ride the biggest bikes of any one my height that I know. I 
> think my body proportions are not really abnormal in any way. I can ride a 
> 59 or 60 top tube and still have about an 110 mm stem. I have never ridden 
> anything with a 61 top tube as in a 60 Sam. I prefer as much headtube as I 
> can get to get the bars even or a bit higher than my saddle and to avoid 
> upjutting stems. At 6' you may have longer arms and more top tube may be 
> just right for you.
>
> On Thursday, February 15, 2018 at 11:38:19 PM UTC-8, John W wrote:
>>
>> Hello folks,
>>
>> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes.
>>
>> I'm 6' tall with an 85PBH (say, 86.25 PBH with shoes.) Saddle height 
>> ~75cm, a Brooks B17 which runs about 6cm tall.
>>
>> Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I could ride a 58. I'll ride 
>> on pavement and trails. Less so, gnarly track. And I'll set up drop bars 
>> about 1cm lower than my saddle. 
>>
>> My concerns are:
>>
>> — will I have enough exposed stem above the headset and cable hanger in 
>> front?
>> — will the bike handle oddly with just ~2cm of exposed stem?
>> — am I setting myself up for the inability to use taller upright bars in 
>> the future?
>>
>> I cribbed this photo from a fellow with a shorter saddle height than me:
>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37347002@N05/4354827488/in/pool-hillborne/
>>
>> The 55 is the safe bet, while the 58 looks doable. 
>>
>> I'm cautious of getting a bike that's too small for me. Generally 
>> speaking, I'm a 56cm on Surly road frames and I don't feel stretched out on 
>> them.
>>
>> What say you? 55 or 58?
>>
>> Separately, looking at the geo charts on Riv's site, the Stack and Reach 
>> measurements on the Sam Hillbornes look off to me, but perhaps I'm not 
>> correctly parsing the effect of the 71.5 STA.
>>
>> Apologies for the naval gazing email. Any input would be appreciated.
>>
>> John in NYC
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[eflayer]

I apologize if my posting was confusing. Not sure what the current Sam geo 
actually is since it is not easily found on the Riv website.

On Thursday, February 15, 2018 at 11:38:19 PM UTC-8, John W wrote:
>
> Hello folks,
>
> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes.
>
> I'm 6' tall with an 85PBH (say, 86.25 PBH with shoes.) Saddle height 
> ~75cm, a Brooks B17 which runs about 6cm tall.
>
> Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I could ride a 58. I'll ride on 
> pavement and trails. Less so, gnarly track. And I'll set up drop bars about 
> 1cm lower than my saddle. 
>
> My concerns are:
>
> — will I have enough exposed stem above the headset and cable hanger in 
> front?
> — will the bike handle oddly with just ~2cm of exposed stem?
> — am I setting myself up for the inability to use taller upright bars in 
> the future?
>
> I cribbed this photo from a fellow with a shorter saddle height than me:
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37347002@N05/4354827488/in/pool-hillborne/
>
> The 55 is the safe bet, while the 58 looks doable. 
>
> I'm cautious of getting a bike that's too small for me. Generally 
> speaking, I'm a 56cm on Surly road frames and I don't feel stretched out on 
> them.
>
> What say you? 55 or 58?
>
> Separately, looking at the geo charts on Riv's site, the Stack and Reach 
> measurements on the Sam Hillbornes look off to me, but perhaps I'm not 
> correctly parsing the effect of the 71.5 STA.
>
> Apologies for the naval gazing email. Any input would be appreciated.
>
> John in NYC
>

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Lum Gim Fong]

Riv will set up stem height and saddle on one of theirs to your measurements 
and send a pic to you so you can see what it looks like if you ask.

I had a 52 blue sam with 71 SH.
Lowest I coukd get bars was 1.3cm below saddle. So beware going too big.
Call riv and they will set it up and email you pics.

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[RBW] Re: Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[eflayer]

I am 5'11 and I ride the biggest bikes of any one my height that I know. I 
think my body proportions are not really abnormal in any way. I can ride a 
59 or 60 top tube and still have about an 110 mm stem. I have never ridden 
anything with a 61 top tube as in a 60 Sam. I prefer as much headtube as I 
can get to get the bars even or a bit higher than my saddle and to avoid 
upjutting stems. At 6' you may have longer arms and more top tube may be 
just right for you.

On Thursday, February 15, 2018 at 11:38:19 PM UTC-8, John W wrote:
>
> Hello folks,
>
> I'm reaching out for some input regarding current Sam Hillbornes.
>
> I'm 6' tall with an 85PBH (say, 86.25 PBH with shoes.) Saddle height 
> ~75cm, a Brooks B17 which runs about 6cm tall.
>
> Riv recommends a size 55 frame, but I know I could ride a 58. I'll ride on 
> pavement and trails. Less so, gnarly track. And I'll set up drop bars about 
> 1cm lower than my saddle. 
>
> My concerns are:
>
> — will I have enough exposed stem above the headset and cable hanger in 
> front?
> — will the bike handle oddly with just ~2cm of exposed stem?
> — am I setting myself up for the inability to use taller upright bars in 
> the future?
>
> I cribbed this photo from a fellow with a shorter saddle height than me:
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37347002@N05/4354827488/in/pool-hillborne/
>
> The 55 is the safe bet, while the 58 looks doable. 
>
> I'm cautious of getting a bike that's too small for me. Generally 
> speaking, I'm a 56cm on Surly road frames and I don't feel stretched out on 
> them.
>
> What say you? 55 or 58?
>
> Separately, looking at the geo charts on Riv's site, the Stack and Reach 
> measurements on the Sam Hillbornes look off to me, but perhaps I'm not 
> correctly parsing the effect of the 71.5 STA.
>
> Apologies for the naval gazing email. Any input would be appreciated.
>
> John in NYC
>

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Belopsky]

Also, since you're in NYC, call up 718cyclery and see if they have any in stock 
to try out

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[RBW] Informal poll: Sam Hillborne sizing, 6' tall about an 85PBH?

[Belopsky]

What looks off to you about the stack and reach? The Sam Hillborne has a long 
reach. Look at it compared to the other bikes in the range.

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