Re: [RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[S]

As is my habit, I overstated my case. What I said is technically true, 
because of physics, but I can believe the real world effect might be 
negligible. 

In the back of my mind was the side discussion on here or iBob about the 
supposed deadness of the Surly Cross Check frame. Some forum members -- me 
included -- insisted the frame was a dog, no question, while others 
disagreed. As it turned out, those in the former camp had the 56 and those 
in the latter camp larger sizes. The theory was floated that maybe the 
frame "opens up," that is, flexes more, in a good way, in the larger sizes 
-- and with generally heavier riders -- and that accounted for the 
difference. To me, this seems plausible. And if it's plausible that a frame 
could improve in this way, then it also seems plausible that, conversely, 
some frames could open up *too much* and become too flexy, in larger sizes, 
thus necessitating some modification to maintain the same relative 
stiffness as in the smaller sizes. 

Also in the back of my mind was the experience of my larger cycling friends 
who seem to break more frames than I ever have. But then, that's anecdotal. 

I don't know if Grant ran any numbers or did any testing before deciding to 
add the second tube to some bikes. Could just be for looks, or could be a 
belt and suspenders kind of thing. Or a mix. But I wouldn't say it's 
totally off base from an engineering point of view. 

Anyway, you've ridden more 60 (and maybe 60 plus?) size frames than I have, 
and if you say you don't feel a difference, then I can't argue. 

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 8:27:15 PM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> Not true at all, unless -- perhaps -- you are well over 200 lb and carry 
> heavy loads. I owned and rode a 60 c-c frame extensively -- my best level 
> top tube size is 60 c-c -- and there was no more flex notiher 6- X 56 
> c-cceable than with an 18" mountain bike frame. And this frame was made 
> from standard gauge, and not OS, tubes.
>
> I currently have another 60 X 56 c-c frame being refurbished; this is also 
> standard gauge, and it is *very* light: 5.9 lb for frame + fork + steel 
> Campy headset; I *do not* expect to need a second top tube. I'm 175.
>
> And my best load carrier of all time, that happily and securely carried 
> 40+ in back (on an 11 oz rack!) was made from standard gauge, lightweight 
> 531 and was noticeably lighter than my 2003, 58 c-c Riv frame that weighed 
> 7 lb for frame + fork and Ultegra headset. This frame was a 58 c-c, IIRC.
>
> For anyone under say 250 lb who does not carry camping loads, a second top 
> tube is ornamental, not structural. Amen.
>
> Back when I lived in India and Pakistan and Kenya, you'd often see heavy 
> duty models of the stereotypical rod brake roadster wtih a second top tube 
> (and with heavy aftermarket fork braces), but these were bikes cheaply made 
> from cheap, weak tubing that carried 100 lb loads of firewood or 200 lb 
> loads of charcoal in gunny sacks, or a family of 4; even so, most Indian 
> and Pakistani made r b roadsters have single top tubes.
>
> Upshot: they look cool, but their benefit is purely aesthetic.
>
> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 8:19 PM S  wrote:
>
>> Yes, the extra tube strengthens the frame. Otherwise you would be left 
>> with a wobblier triangle and have to use thicker tubes and there goes at 
>> least some of your weight savings. I think it's a good solution and looks 
>> cool, so a double win. 
>>
>> On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 11:42:08 AM UTC-7 Jason Fuller wrote:
>>
>>> I can imagine it's useful once you get into the 60cm range, since the 
>>> average rider weight is going up while the structural triangulation of the 
>>> frame is going down.  But I can't deny that I love the totally unnecessary 
>>> extra tube on the Hunq so who am I to judge. 
>>>
>>> The "unnecessary tube" I want, and would put on a Riv custom if I ever 
>>> got one, would be the lift handle from the Rosco's. I keep hoping for it on 
>>> new models. 
>>>
>>> On Monday, 3 August 2020 at 09:00:02 UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>>
 I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve 
 no real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where 
 I don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on 
 those 
 Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, 
 I 
 think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not 
 the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.

 In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the 
 same time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:

 https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/

 Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he 
 had an Atlantis.

 -- 

 ---
 Patrick Moore
 Alburque

[RBW] Re: The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[christian poppell]

Hey Bird,

I'm glad you took the plunge and got the Quickbeam back on the road. 
Something that gives so much joy deserves to be repaired and brought back 
to life. Plus, its not like you could go out and pick another up! The paint 
work on yours looks stunning! 

I think I mentioned it on the other thread but my QB also has a few gaps 
along the shorelines. The gaps that I can see are just the ones visible 
through the paint. Its possible there are more but the paint is not very 
thick to begin with. If I ever get around to making a few mods and 
repainting, I'll surly be adding filler in those joints. I am curious as 
well, what joints were left open? 

To new life!
Christian
Berkeley, CA

On Sunday, August 2, 2020 at 2:28:44 PM UTC-7, Birdman wrote:
>
> Hey bunch,
>
> I discovered a cracked bottom bracket shell on my beloved 66cm Quickbeam 
> back in April, as chronicled in this thread 
> . 
> After a lot of back and forth, I decided to get it repaired and repainted, 
> as it is, after all, my all time favorite bicycle. I got a replacement 
> shell and decals from Riv HQ. Dave Levy at Ti Cycles here in Portland did 
> an amazing job on the repair, and then the folks at Black Magic Paint, a 
> local painter that came highly recommended by Will, nailed the wet paint. 
>
> I went with the painter's stock British racing green as a nod to Tolkein, 
> the Ents, and the fact that the Quickbeam has always reminded me of an old 
> British path racer. Besides, I've always liked BRG on its own merit.
>
> Here she is:
>
> [image: IMG_1550.jpeg]
>
> [image: IMG_1548.jpeg]
>
>
> [image: IMG_1551.jpeg]
>
>
> [image: IMG_1552.jpeg]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Path Less Pedaled will review a Riv!

[Joe Bernard]

Should be interesting. Even if he says "supple" 17 times OMG I hate that term. 

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Re: [RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

['Eric Norris' via RBW Owners Bunch]

I recall someone with an early green Quickbeam had a failure where the seat 
tube enters the bottom bracket shell. Looked like it had rusted from the inside?

Fingers crossed, no problems with my first-gen QB, which has been everywhere 
and is still going strong.

--Eric Norris
campyonly...@me.com
Insta: @CampyOnlyGuy
YouTube: YouTube.com/CampyOnlyGuy 

> On Aug 3, 2020, at 8:01 PM, Birdman  wrote:
> 
> There are stories, but it’s hard to know. Single speed frames have to contend 
> with a lot of forces, especially around the bottom bracket, and I would 
> imagine that larger riders on the larger frames could exasperate the 
> situation. On the other hand, my frame did have some manufacturing flaws...
> 
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[RBW] Path Less Pedaled will review a Riv!

[J Imler]

I’m looking forward to this also. I read about it first in a Riv email...a Sam 
Hillborne review I believe.

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[RBW] Re: FS: Sackville HappiSack grid gray, Nitto Big Rack black

[Joe Bernard]

Bag is sold, somebody buy this rack! 

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[RBW] Path Less Pedaled will review a Riv!

[Brett Callahan]

I don't know what the reader/viewer overlap between the Riv list and the Path 
Less Pedaled list is like, outside of Michael Mann and myself, but damn am I 
excited by this!

https://www.instagram.com/p/CDccdhYHoFU/?igshid=phskilu88qw3
(Link is to their Instagram, I'm mobile right know so you may have to copy and 
paste, apologies) 

Anyone know what model this is? 

For those unfamiliar, Russ and his partner at Path Less Pedaled do a lot of 
great bike reviews, videos and interviews with Industry folk "on the supple 
side" of cycling, i.e.; they're into non race oriented stuff.  Worth your time, 
I think.  

Cheers, 

Brett in PDX

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[RBW] FS- 700×40 schwalbe spike tires

[Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY]

That's kaivierstra AT gmail doT com

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[RBW] FS- 700×40 schwalbe spike tires

[Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY]

Just in time for winter! Schwalbe Marathon Winters!!
https://photos.app.goo.gl/YjoyayXWpEQTZZdHA
I would've used these more but the bike that they fit so nicely on passed away, 
and as much as I'm hoping to have my own ZOMBEAM soon enough, not soon enough 
to keep these around (plus I've got some Ice Spiker Pros with a bike to fit 
them, so yeah, the big spikers rule in the icey worst of it). Missing a few 
rusty carbide teeth, but still quite studly with loads of tread and a powerful 
wire bead. I Hope someone in the NYC vacinity wants them for $30 for the pair, 
so locals please. I'll drop them by... 

Thanks
-Kai

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Re: [RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[Patrick Moore]

My biplane crown (new Chauncey) is racier than your biplane crown, and I'll
bet the bike faster than your Della Santa -- it has an *alloy shell QR* SA
hub. (This bike as fenders, racks f and r, lighting, but no double tt.)

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 9:34 PM Mike Godwin  wrote:

> No but it does have a chrome-plated contrasting paint-filled twin-plate
> fork crown. Does that almost count?
>
> Mike SLO CA
>
> On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 8:29:05 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> I'll bet it doesn't have a second top tube.
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 9:27 PM Mike Godwin  wrote:
>>
>>> My Della Santa is outfitted with drop out eyelets and threaded chainstay
>>> and brakebridge brazeons for fenders, and it is a racey bike.
>>>
>>> Mike SLO CA
>>>
>>> On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 9:00:02 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:

 I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve
 no real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where
 I don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those
 Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I
 think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not
 the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.

 In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the
 same time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:

 https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/

 Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he
 had an Atlantis.

 --

 ---
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

 --
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>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> ---
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
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> .
>


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---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[Mike Godwin]

No but it does have a chrome-plated contrasting paint-filled twin-plate 
fork crown. Does that almost count?

Mike SLO CA

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 8:29:05 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> I'll bet it doesn't have a second top tube.
>
> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 9:27 PM Mike Godwin  > wrote:
>
>> My Della Santa is outfitted with drop out eyelets and threaded chainstay 
>> and brakebridge brazeons for fenders, and it is a racey bike.
>>
>> Mike SLO CA
>>
>> On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 9:00:02 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>>
>>> I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve 
>>> no real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where 
>>> I don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those 
>>> Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I 
>>> think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not 
>>> the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.
>>>
>>> In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the same 
>>> time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:
>>>
>>> https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/
>>>
>>> Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he 
>>> had an Atlantis.
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Patrick Moore
>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>>
>>> -- 
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>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[Patrick Moore]

I'll bet it doesn't have a second top tube.

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 9:27 PM Mike Godwin  wrote:

> My Della Santa is outfitted with drop out eyelets and threaded chainstay
> and brakebridge brazeons for fenders, and it is a racey bike.
>
> Mike SLO CA
>
> On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 9:00:02 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve
>> no real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where
>> I don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those
>> Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I
>> think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not
>> the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.
>>
>> In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the same
>> time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:
>>
>> https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/
>>
>> Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he had
>> an Atlantis.
>>
>> --
>>
>> ---
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>> --
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> 
> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[Patrick Moore]

Not true at all, unless -- perhaps -- you are well over 200 lb and carry
heavy loads. I owned and rode a 60 c-c frame extensively -- my best level
top tube size is 60 c-c -- and there was no more flex notiher 6- X 56
c-cceable than with an 18" mountain bike frame. And this frame was made
from standard gauge, and not OS, tubes.

I currently have another 60 X 56 c-c frame being refurbished; this is also
standard gauge, and it is *very* light: 5.9 lb for frame + fork + steel
Campy headset; I *do not* expect to need a second top tube. I'm 175.

And my best load carrier of all time, that happily and securely carried 40+
in back (on an 11 oz rack!) was made from standard gauge, lightweight 531
and was noticeably lighter than my 2003, 58 c-c Riv frame that weighed 7 lb
for frame + fork and Ultegra headset. This frame was a 58 c-c, IIRC.

For anyone under say 250 lb who does not carry camping loads, a second top
tube is ornamental, not structural. Amen.

Back when I lived in India and Pakistan and Kenya, you'd often see heavy
duty models of the stereotypical rod brake roadster wtih a second top tube
(and with heavy aftermarket fork braces), but these were bikes cheaply made
from cheap, weak tubing that carried 100 lb loads of firewood or 200 lb
loads of charcoal in gunny sacks, or a family of 4; even so, most Indian
and Pakistani made r b roadsters have single top tubes.

Upshot: they look cool, but their benefit is purely aesthetic.

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 8:19 PM S  wrote:

> Yes, the extra tube strengthens the frame. Otherwise you would be left
> with a wobblier triangle and have to use thicker tubes and there goes at
> least some of your weight savings. I think it's a good solution and looks
> cool, so a double win.
>
> On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 11:42:08 AM UTC-7 Jason Fuller wrote:
>
>> I can imagine it's useful once you get into the 60cm range, since the
>> average rider weight is going up while the structural triangulation of the
>> frame is going down.  But I can't deny that I love the totally unnecessary
>> extra tube on the Hunq so who am I to judge.
>>
>> The "unnecessary tube" I want, and would put on a Riv custom if I ever
>> got one, would be the lift handle from the Rosco's. I keep hoping for it on
>> new models.
>>
>> On Monday, 3 August 2020 at 09:00:02 UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>>> I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve
>>> no real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where
>>> I don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those
>>> Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I
>>> think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not
>>> the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.
>>>
>>> In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the same
>>> time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:
>>>
>>> https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/
>>>
>>> Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he
>>> had an Atlantis.
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Patrick Moore
>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>>
>>> --
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> 
> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[Mike Godwin]

My Della Santa is outfitted with drop out eyelets and threaded chainstay 
and brakebridge brazeons for fenders, and it is a racey bike.

Mike SLO CA

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 9:00:02 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve no 
> real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where I 
> don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those 
> Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I 
> think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not 
> the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.
>
> In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the same 
> time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:
>
> https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/
>
> Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he had 
> an Atlantis.
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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Re: [RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[Birdman]

There are stories, but it’s hard to know. On the one hand, single speed frames 
have to contend with a lot of forces, especially around the bottom bracket, and 
I would imagine that larger riders on the larger frames could exacerbate the 
situation. On the other hand, my frame did have some manufacturing flaws, 
though it could have been the exception. Hard to say.

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Re: [RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[Birdman]

There are stories, but it’s hard to know. Single speed frames have to contend 
with a lot of forces, especially around the bottom bracket, and I would imagine 
that larger riders on the larger frames could exasperate the situation. On the 
other hand, my frame did have some manufacturing flaws...

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[RBW] Re: FS: Sackville HappiSack grid gray, Nitto Big Rack black

[Joe Bernard]

Andrew, I have one offer ahead of you for both but he hasn't gotten back to me 
to confirm yet. In the meantime I need a way to contact you privately, your 
email address do didn't come through intact. You can reach me at:
joeremi62 gmail com

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[RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[S]

Yes, the extra tube strengthens the frame. Otherwise you would be left with 
a wobblier triangle and have to use thicker tubes and there goes at least 
some of your weight savings. I think it's a good solution and looks cool, 
so a double win. 

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 11:42:08 AM UTC-7 Jason Fuller wrote:

> I can imagine it's useful once you get into the 60cm range, since the 
> average rider weight is going up while the structural triangulation of the 
> frame is going down.  But I can't deny that I love the totally unnecessary 
> extra tube on the Hunq so who am I to judge. 
>
> The "unnecessary tube" I want, and would put on a Riv custom if I ever got 
> one, would be the lift handle from the Rosco's. I keep hoping for it on new 
> models. 
>
> On Monday, 3 August 2020 at 09:00:02 UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve 
>> no real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where 
>> I don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those 
>> Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I 
>> think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not 
>> the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.
>>
>> In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the same 
>> time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:
>>
>> https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/
>>
>> Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he had 
>> an Atlantis.
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> ---
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone had experience with the Grand Cru 110 Fluted Triple Crankset

[Joel Stern]

John, I ordered that and the Sugino.  The Sugino is MIJ, the Velo is MIT.
The Velo triple feels hollow, I am waiting for the Sugino to come to do a
side by side.  I am leaning heavily to the Sugino as I have had good luck
with them in the past.

Thanks for your thought, hope all is well.

Joel

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 9:23 PM 'John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Joel
>
> I looked at the VO website.  The triple seems to use a tripleralizer
> design for the inner ring.  You need a special middle ring having the
> extension and holes for the inner ring, sinc ethe crank has no casting for
> the inner ring nuts.  Something to consider.
>
> John Hawrylak
> Woodstown NJ.
>
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[RBW] Re: FS: Sackville HappiSack grid gray, Nitto Big Rack black

[Andrew Turner]

I'll buy the bag! my email is andyreedtur...@gmail.com

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 2:57:20 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Let's try $190 for the bag, $150 rack. Shipped CONUS. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone had experience with the Grand Cru 110 Fluted Triple Crankset

['John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Joel

I looked at the VO website.  The triple seems to use a tripleralizer design 
for the inner ring.  You need a special middle ring having the extension 
and holes for the inner ring, sinc ethe crank has no casting for the inner 
ring nuts.  Something to consider.

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ.

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Re: [RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[Michael Baquerizo]

Reading about the construction flaws on this bike reminds me of a story / 
gripe grant posted about in a reader around the time the QB was released. 
someone made a stink about flaws in the bikes welding and grant told her it 
was nothing to worry about. 

it seems like he was wrong, there are a few stories about qb's failing at 
lug points, no?

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 5:51:51 PM UTC-4 J L wrote:

> This looks sweet! I’m glad everything worked out with the repairs. That BB 
> removal trick sounds very clever. 
>
> Jason

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[RBW] Re: Brake levers for setting up Canti front and V for rear wheel

[Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, CA]

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 1:33:19 PM UTC-7, Garth wrote:
>
>
> Yep, Tektro's 354AG and MT2.1 are for both linear and canti, they adjust 
> inside the lever body. They are also often rebranded, like mine are Forte 
> brand but they are Tektro made. 
>

If you're going high-zoot, Paul levers come in both flavors of cable pull 
(Canti and Love), but are visually similar.

I'm not sure I agree with Will on this canti front/V-brake rear setup 
though. I would have recommended the other way around because:

   1. I like having a stronger brake up front. Yes, cantilevers can be 
   adjusted to have high braking power, but it's a compromise with tire 
   clearance, and it's convenient to have the front brake default to high 
   power.
   2. You can eliminate the cable hanger required for use with a cantilever 
   brake. It makes for a cleaner look, and…
   3. If you suffer from front brake judder, not having a long run of brake 
   cable between the hanger and the cantilever straddle cable may solve that.


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Re: [RBW] Atlantis on Tahoe singletrack

[Clark Fitzgerald]

Here's the route with the nasty motorcycle trails taken out:
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/33562901 I did it as an out and back from
Strawberry, easily accessible from highway 50. Once you get up near
treeline there's more legal singletrack if you want to make it longer, but
no bikes allowed on the PCT. The Tahoe Rim Trail is also excellent.

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 2:05 PM Jeff B  wrote:

> That looks like an excellent ride! At least on a bike like the Atlantis
> you are able to enjoy the scenery as well instead of it flying by.
>
> I'm wanting to do the same on my Atlantis or vintage stumpjumer. Is it
> possible to get more detailed information of your route or point in a good
> direction of where to look for routes?
>
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>

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Re: [RBW] Brake levers for setting up Canti front and V for rear wheel

[Joe Bernard]

I'm with Patrick on this, if you're going to use a canti front then I don't see 
how a v rear helps anything. 

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Re: [RBW] Brake levers for setting up Canti front and V for rear wheel

[Brewster Fong]

Agree. I had the cheapest mini-v brakes up front (Tektro 926al) and a 
Suntour XC Pro canti brake in the rear and worked well. The problem I had 
with canti up front was it would squeal, shudder and had almost no stopping 
power. I changed pads to Kool stop salmon and that helped, but the problems 
persisted. I was consistently adjusting the front canti and it would work 
for like 5 minutes or maybe one ride. In the end, my LBS suggested giving 
the cheap v-brake a shot and WOW, all of a sudden I had stopping power 
without any shuddering or squealing!  

Of course, I later learned that one option that might have helped would be 
to use a fork cable hanger as it might have stopped the squealing and 
shuddering, maybe...it looks like this:

[image: Tektro Front Cable Hangar with Adjusting Barrel 1-1/8]

Of course, YMMV! 

Good Luck!

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 1:34:12 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Since V brakes are often (not always!) more powerful (meaning, here, brake 
> harder for given hand pressure) than cantilevers, I'd say that you are 
> wasting your time thinking of a V for the rear. I can see a V for the 
> front, leaving aside modulation, if you want a higher stopping 
> power-to-hand pressure, but in the rear, anything works, IME -- even the 
> most horribly ineffective brakes I've used in front worked fine in the rear.
>
> On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 2:16 PM Ash > wrote:
>
>> Generally I have no problems with v-brakes.  I like them.  When I used 
>> them on my last 2 Riv builds, I felt like they can a bit too abrupt for 
>> front wheels at times.  A modulator solved that problem.  Since I do not go 
>> on mountain biking or on technical trails, a little mushiness the modulator 
>> introduces is not an issue.
>>
>> However, I like experimenting.  Will at Riv had once mentioned in passing 
>> that Canti for front ant v for back would be ideal.  That idea stuck with 
>> me.  My new Susie is going to be built that way.  Ideally I would like the 
>> brake levers on left and right to have the same feel.  Is there a v-brake 
>> lever that has a similarly shaped canti counterpart?  Or are there levers 
>> that support both modes? 
>>
>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] FS Sackville Trunksack Small - Olive

[Huston]

For sale is a used small Sackville Trunksack.  A few signs of use but no 
issues to mention.  Olive color.  I purchased this from a fellow RBW 
member; however, I have a really small front rack, and the attachment 
points on this bag didn't work for my setup.  Should work well with 
standard front racks from Nitto, VO, etc.  Measurements per Riv: 8" long, 
4.25" wide, 5.5" tall.  $80 (shipping included) via Paypal Friends and 
Family.  

Photos are available here: 
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1--eTxcO9AW4u4K6TuSrp-9ZK-v1safyJ?usp=sharing.
  
Thanks for looking.

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Re: [RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[J L]

This looks sweet! I’m glad everything worked out with the repairs. That BB 
removal trick sounds very clever. 

Jason

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Re: [RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[Eric Daume]

Interesting to hear about the shoddy brazing of the original QB. Better
than new now!

Eric

On Sunday, August 2, 2020, Birdman  wrote:

> Sure, I can snap BB photo. The only surprise is that once the paint was
> stripped, the frame builder found several gaps in various lugs where the
> bronze had not properly penetrated when it was originally built, he got all
> of those fixed up. His approach to the BB shell was to saw the old shell
> into four separate pieces and then remove each piece from the corresponding
> tube. This allowed him to remove the old shell without overheating any of
> the tubes. He said it was less of a pain than he had expected, because with
> the poor welds, the BB shell pieces came off pretty easily.
>
> On Sunday, August 2, 2020 at 2:46:16 PM UTC-7 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY
> wrote:
>
>> Dreamy...
>> I've got a couple jealous 68's that are glad to be a few steps back from
>> the scrap yard. Can we get a close-up of the new bottom bracket? Any
>> surprises? Was it easier/harder than the builder expected? Thanks for doing
>> this
>> -Kai
>
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> .
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[RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[RichS]

What a stunning Quickbeam. Thumbs up on the BRG paint. Glad you were able to 
get the distinctive QB down tube decal! The finishing touch.

Best,
Rich in ATL

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[RBW] Atlantis on Tahoe singletrack

[Jeff B]

That looks like an excellent ride! At least on a bike like the Atlantis you are 
able to enjoy the scenery as well instead of it flying by.

I'm wanting to do the same on my Atlantis or vintage stumpjumer. Is it possible 
to get more detailed information of your route or point in a good direction of 
where to look for routes?

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Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis on Tahoe singletrack

['Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Ha! For that level of technical climbing, I use LCG. Lowest common gear. 
The gear every bike comes with. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Monday, August 3, 2020 at 1:19:02 PM UTC-6, Clark Fitzgerald wrote:
>
> Patrick, I believe you're right, it's a matter of experience. For the 
> first few rides descending fast, rough dirt roads it felt strange and 
> unfamiliar to have the rear end moving around so far behind me. It felt 
> like it was jumping around. Now I don't even notice that, but I do notice 
> the smoothness and tracking from the long wheelbase.
>
> It's the technical climbing that gets me- where you have to trackstand, 
> bounce sideways, thread the needle through some rocks, hop up ledges, and 
> so on. I can't ride that terrain well on any bike, so the wheelbase 
> probably isn't at fault. 😉
>
> On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 1:03 PM 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com > wrote:
>
>> "Except for the shorter wheelbase, the Gus/Susie is the bike you 
>> describe."
>>
>> And a brilliant ride. My experience with Gus is the long wheelbase is 
>> rarely to never a detriment, and always an asset. Smooth, better climbing, 
>> better flow. Experience teaches the taking of slightly different curves in 
>> the technical areas, but generally speaking point the front one where you 
>> want to go and the rear follows smoothly, even if it goes over a bit more. 
>> Need proof? Search YouTube for "downhill tandem MTB" and realize: oh. None 
>> issue. Grin.
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>> On Sunday, August 2, 2020 at 1:44:58 PM UTC-6, S wrote:
>>>
>>> On Saturday, August 1, 2020 at 9:16:43 PM UTC-7 Clark Fitzgerald wrote:
>>>
 If I could ride here regularly I'd prefer a rigid mountain bike. In 
 particular, I'd like a bike with wider, knobby tires, much lower standover 
 for when I have to hop off, a higher bottom bracket for less pedal strike, 
 higher handlebars for descending, and a tighter wheelbase to thread 
 through 
 the granite boulders. 

>>>
>>> Thanks for sharing the photos.
>>>
>>> Except for the shorter wheelbase, the Gus/Susie is the bike you 
>>> describe. 
>>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Brake levers for setting up Canti front and V for rear wheel

[Patrick Moore]

Since V brakes are often (not always!) more powerful (meaning, here, brake
harder for given hand pressure) than cantilevers, I'd say that you are
wasting your time thinking of a V for the rear. I can see a V for the
front, leaving aside modulation, if you want a higher stopping
power-to-hand pressure, but in the rear, anything works, IME -- even the
most horribly ineffective brakes I've used in front worked fine in the rear.

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 2:16 PM Ash  wrote:

> Generally I have no problems with v-brakes.  I like them.  When I used
> them on my last 2 Riv builds, I felt like they can a bit too abrupt for
> front wheels at times.  A modulator solved that problem.  Since I do not go
> on mountain biking or on technical trails, a little mushiness the modulator
> introduces is not an issue.
>
> However, I like experimenting.  Will at Riv had once mentioned in passing
> that Canti for front ant v for back would be ideal.  That idea stuck with
> me.  My new Susie is going to be built that way.  Ideally I would like the
> brake levers on left and right to have the same feel.  Is there a v-brake
> lever that has a similarly shaped canti counterpart?  Or are there levers
> that support both modes?
>
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> 
> .
>


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---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: Brake levers for setting up Canti front and V for rear wheel

[Garth]

Yep, Tektro's 354AG and MT2.1 are for both linear and canti, they adjust 
inside the lever body. They are also often rebranded, like mine are Forte 
brand but they are Tektro made. 

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[RBW] Brake levers for setting up Canti front and V for rear wheel

[Ash]

Generally I have no problems with v-brakes.  I like them.  When I used them 
on my last 2 Riv builds, I felt like they can a bit too abrupt for front 
wheels at times.  A modulator solved that problem.  Since I do not go on 
mountain biking or on technical trails, a little mushiness the modulator 
introduces is not an issue.

However, I like experimenting.  Will at Riv had once mentioned in passing 
that Canti for front ant v for back would be ideal.  That idea stuck with 
me.  My new Susie is going to be built that way.  Ideally I would like the 
brake levers on left and right to have the same feel.  Is there a v-brake 
lever that has a similarly shaped canti counterpart?  Or are there levers 
that support both modes? 

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[RBW] Re: FS: Sackville HappiSack grid gray, Nitto Big Rack black

[Joe Bernard]

Let's try $190 for the bag, $150 rack. Shipped CONUS. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis on Tahoe singletrack

[Clark Fitzgerald]

Patrick, I believe you're right, it's a matter of experience. For the first
few rides descending fast, rough dirt roads it felt strange and unfamiliar
to have the rear end moving around so far behind me. It felt like it was
jumping around. Now I don't even notice that, but I do notice the
smoothness and tracking from the long wheelbase.

It's the technical climbing that gets me- where you have to trackstand,
bounce sideways, thread the needle through some rocks, hop up ledges, and
so on. I can't ride that terrain well on any bike, so the wheelbase
probably isn't at fault. 😉

On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 1:03 PM 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> "Except for the shorter wheelbase, the Gus/Susie is the bike you describe."
>
> And a brilliant ride. My experience with Gus is the long wheelbase is
> rarely to never a detriment, and always an asset. Smooth, better climbing,
> better flow. Experience teaches the taking of slightly different curves in
> the technical areas, but generally speaking point the front one where you
> want to go and the rear follows smoothly, even if it goes over a bit more.
> Need proof? Search YouTube for "downhill tandem MTB" and realize: oh. None
> issue. Grin.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
> On Sunday, August 2, 2020 at 1:44:58 PM UTC-6, S wrote:
>>
>> On Saturday, August 1, 2020 at 9:16:43 PM UTC-7 Clark Fitzgerald wrote:
>>
>>> If I could ride here regularly I'd prefer a rigid mountain bike. In
>>> particular, I'd like a bike with wider, knobby tires, much lower standover
>>> for when I have to hop off, a higher bottom bracket for less pedal strike,
>>> higher handlebars for descending, and a tighter wheelbase to thread through
>>> the granite boulders.
>>>
>>
>> Thanks for sharing the photos.
>>
>> Except for the shorter wheelbase, the Gus/Susie is the bike you describe.
>>
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[RBW] Re: Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[Jason Fuller]

I can imagine it's useful once you get into the 60cm range, since the 
average rider weight is going up while the structural triangulation of the 
frame is going down.  But I can't deny that I love the totally unnecessary 
extra tube on the Hunq so who am I to judge. 

The "unnecessary tube" I want, and would put on a Riv custom if I ever got 
one, would be the lift handle from the Rosco's. I keep hoping for it on new 
models. 

On Monday, 3 August 2020 at 09:00:02 UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve no 
> real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where I 
> don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those 
> Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I 
> think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not 
> the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.
>
> In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the same 
> time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:
>
> https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/
>
> Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he had 
> an Atlantis.
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] Re: daily post ur riv

[Bones]

P.S. Y’all are going to have to stand on your heads, Google is not cooperating.
Regards,
Bones

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[RBW] Re: FS: Paul Love Levers

[Tim Bantham]

Love levers are sold. 

On Sunday, August 2, 2020 at 8:00:23 PM UTC-4 Tim Bantham wrote:

> Up for sale is a pair of polished Paul Love Levers. These are *short pull* 
> for 
> Center Pull, Side Pull and Canti brakes. 
>
> $150 Shipped to the lower 48. 
>
> Link to photos:
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/wVbceKxcZyWzEkGo6
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: daily post ur riv

[lambbo]

Patrick, I have my Roadini set up with 35s...I think 38 would squeeze in but 
this feels cushy considering the road-like frame and generous flex of the fork, 
even on woodsy trails.  Ive run jack browns, and 28s with fenders, but with 35s 
its in the sweet spot of being truly all road. 

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[RBW] Earl Craig's Atlantis on the Blug

[Patrick Moore]

I don't want a second top tube on any bike I own because it would serve no
real purpose and add needless weight (and also, perhaps, rigidity where I
don't want it), but I do have to say that the curved second tube on those
Atlantises looks wonderful *as sculpture.* In fact, merely aesthetically, I
think that edition of the Atlantis is one of the prettiest bikes, if not
the prettiest bike that Rivendell has made.

In other, and very unrelated news -- but I opened the window at the same
time as I opened the Blug window -- fenders are going road-mainstream:

https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bikes-with-fender-mounts/

Patrick Moore, who would indeed install fenders on his Atlantis if he had
an Atlantis.

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: Bikes on eBay, CraigsLIst, and Other Sites

[Kyle Altshuler]

Very intrigued - I think I sent the poster an email, will see if it went
through and I am in Manhattan so no shipping

On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 11:19 AM Justin Kennedy (Brooklyn, NY) <
thesixtht...@gmail.com> wrote:

> 57cm Romulus on NYC Craigslist:
>
>
> https://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/bik/d/brooklyn-rivendell-romulus-57cm/7170433976.html
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, July 8, 2020 at 7:11:41 PM UTC-4, Matthew Williams wrote:
>>
>> This thread is for Rivendells you've found on eBay, CraigsList, and sites
>> beyond: bikes in which you think someone here might be interested. This
>> thread isn't for posting ads to your own ad, it's just so people who are
>> searching or interested have a place to look, like, "Hey, check this out!"
>> Here are a few, from today's searches:
>>
>> 61cm Roadini
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/283940882590
>>
>> 58cm Quickbeam
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/pinole-rivendell-quickbeam-58/7154380920.html
>>
>> 52cm Clementine
>>
>> https://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/bik/d/richardson-rivendell-clementine/7130894748.html
>>
>> 65cm Redwood
>>
>> https://bellingham.craigslist.org/bik/d/bellingham-rivendell-redwood/7153843392.html
>>
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> .
>

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[RBW] Re: New Homer Sizing & Standover

[☆ Paul ☆]

🙏 Roberta. I'll definitely do that when I can make it down there!!!

On Sunday, August 2, 2020 at 9:08:38 PM UTC-4 Roberta wrote:

> If you ever change your mind, I’m in N. NJ every month, off I-287.

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[RBW] Re: FS: Bikes on eBay, CraigsLIst, and Other Sites

[Justin Kennedy (Brooklyn, NY)]

57cm Romulus on NYC Craigslist:

https://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/bik/d/brooklyn-rivendell-romulus-57cm/7170433976.html



On Wednesday, July 8, 2020 at 7:11:41 PM UTC-4, Matthew Williams wrote:
>
> This thread is for Rivendells you've found on eBay, CraigsList, and sites 
> beyond: bikes in which you think someone here might be interested. This 
> thread isn't for posting ads to your own ad, it's just so people who are 
> searching or interested have a place to look, like, "Hey, check this out!" 
> Here are a few, from today's searches:
>
> 61cm Roadini
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/283940882590
>
> 58cm Quickbeam
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/pinole-rivendell-quickbeam-58/7154380920.html
>
> 52cm Clementine
>
> https://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/bik/d/richardson-rivendell-clementine/7130894748.html
>
> 65cm Redwood
>
> https://bellingham.craigslist.org/bik/d/bellingham-rivendell-redwood/7153843392.html
>

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[RBW] The Quickbeam Rides Again!

[Rob Kristoff]

Looks wonderful. As someone else said, better than new!

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[RBW] Re: WTB/ISO Nitto 26.8 300mm S83, possibly S65

[Garth]

   I'm still looking for the Nitto S83 for sure, either 250 or 300mm is 
fine.  Even a 250mm, W44 SP72. Nay to the S65, 

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