[RBW] Re: Paul Touring vs. Neo-retro question
Scott, I've used the Neo-Retro as a front brake for about ten years and have always had great luck with it. It looks great and, at the time, I was under the impression that the Neo-Retro was the more powerful brake—than the Touring Canti, that is. Paul's web page for the Neo-Retro used to warn that it's a powerful enough brake that one should make sure the frame could take the braking force, and maybe use the Touring Canti instead if one wasn't sure. I can no longer find that warning on the website. In any case, the Neo-Retro is powerful enough for me and relatively easy to adjust, and it's my first choice for a rim brake. (For some reason, likely user error/dimwittedness, I've never had luck with linear-pull brakes, but then I've never tried the Motolite.) I chose the Touring Canti for the rear to maximize heel and pannier clearance. The combination works well for me, even with a full touring load going downhill. -- Bob On Friday, January 20, 2023 at 4:12:41 PM UTC-7 greenteadrinkers wrote: > If you had to choose between the Paul Touring Canti or the Neo-Retro for a > front brake, which would you pick and why? > > Curious about how much functional difference exists between the 2 models. > > Thanks, > Scott > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/55f46a5d-670d-41ef-9d3f-99c0a9efe4d2n%40googlegroups.com.
[RBW] Re: Paul Touring vs. Neo-retro question
Bob, My understanding is that this is one of the cases where the physics of brake design and how they interact with the setup as related to yoke angle in this case, creates confusion because it is not just the brake design that has to be considered, but also the yoke angle's part in overall mechanical advantage. Each brake type allows for very different yoke angles and that is why overall a touring brake has the capability to be setup with more power, if done correctly and with that purpose in mind. I think this article is a good one on the topic as it is actually on canti geometry: https://www.velonews.com/gear/technical-faq-with-lennard-zinn-a-detailed-look-at-brake-shudder/ And here is the associated Sheldon page: https://www.sheldonbrown.com/cantilever-geometry.html On Saturday, January 21, 2023 at 10:38:13 AM UTC-6 rcook...@gmail.com wrote: > Scott, > > I've used the Neo-Retro as a front brake for about ten years and have > always had great luck with it. It looks great and, at the time, I was under > the impression that the Neo-Retro was the more powerful brake—than the > Touring Canti, that is. Paul's web page for the Neo-Retro used to warn that > it's a powerful enough brake that one should make sure the frame could take > the braking force, and maybe use the Touring Canti instead if one wasn't > sure. I can no longer find that warning on the website. In any case, the > Neo-Retro is powerful enough for me and relatively easy to adjust, and it's > my first choice for a rim brake. (For some reason, likely user > error/dimwittedness, I've never had luck with linear-pull brakes, but then > I've never tried the Motolite.) > > I chose the Touring Canti for the rear to maximize heel and pannier > clearance. The combination works well for me, even with a full touring load > going downhill. > > -- > Bob > > > On Friday, January 20, 2023 at 4:12:41 PM UTC-7 greenteadrinkers wrote: > >> If you had to choose between the Paul Touring Canti or the Neo-Retro for >> a front brake, which would you pick and why? >> >> Curious about how much functional difference exists between the 2 models. >> >> Thanks, >> Scott >> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/69e3c749-cf03-461e-8c23-2ee1da1e24b7n%40googlegroups.com.
[RBW] Re: Paul Touring vs. Neo-retro question
I was familiar with the Sheldon page, but not the Zinn piece. Nice to have an explanation for the old Neo-Retro warning. Thanks for the reference. -- Bob On Saturday, January 21, 2023 at 12:40:30 PM UTC-7 cjus...@gmail.com wrote: > Bob, > > My understanding is that this is one of the cases where the physics of > brake design and how they interact with the setup as related to yoke angle > in this case, creates confusion because it is not just the brake design > that has to be considered, but also the yoke angle's part in overall > mechanical advantage. Each brake type allows for very different yoke > angles and that is why overall a touring brake has the capability to be > setup with more power, if done correctly and with that purpose in mind. > > I think this article is a good one on the topic as it is actually on canti > geometry: > > > https://www.velonews.com/gear/technical-faq-with-lennard-zinn-a-detailed-look-at-brake-shudder/ > > And here is the associated Sheldon page: > > https://www.sheldonbrown.com/cantilever-geometry.html > > On Saturday, January 21, 2023 at 10:38:13 AM UTC-6 rcook...@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Scott, >> >> I've used the Neo-Retro as a front brake for about ten years and have >> always had great luck with it. It looks great and, at the time, I was under >> the impression that the Neo-Retro was the more powerful brake—than the >> Touring Canti, that is. Paul's web page for the Neo-Retro used to warn that >> it's a powerful enough brake that one should make sure the frame could take >> the braking force, and maybe use the Touring Canti instead if one wasn't >> sure. I can no longer find that warning on the website. In any case, the >> Neo-Retro is powerful enough for me and relatively easy to adjust, and it's >> my first choice for a rim brake. (For some reason, likely user >> error/dimwittedness, I've never had luck with linear-pull brakes, but then >> I've never tried the Motolite.) >> >> I chose the Touring Canti for the rear to maximize heel and pannier >> clearance. The combination works well for me, even with a full touring load >> going downhill. >> >> -- >> Bob >> >> >> On Friday, January 20, 2023 at 4:12:41 PM UTC-7 greenteadrinkers wrote: >> >>> If you had to choose between the Paul Touring Canti or the Neo-Retro for >>> a front brake, which would you pick and why? >>> >>> Curious about how much functional difference exists between the 2 models. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Scott >>> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/ad61e0e6-fedf-449f-8c93-44d03ad0e6d9n%40googlegroups.com.
[RBW] Re: Paul Touring vs. Neo-retro question
Thank you all for the feedback, very helpful! Scott On Saturday, January 21, 2023 at 3:09:50 PM UTC-5 rcook...@gmail.com wrote: > I was familiar with the Sheldon page, but not the Zinn piece. Nice to have > an explanation for the old Neo-Retro warning. Thanks for the reference. > > -- > Bob > > > On Saturday, January 21, 2023 at 12:40:30 PM UTC-7 cjus...@gmail.com > wrote: > >> Bob, >> >> My understanding is that this is one of the cases where the physics of >> brake design and how they interact with the setup as related to yoke angle >> in this case, creates confusion because it is not just the brake design >> that has to be considered, but also the yoke angle's part in overall >> mechanical advantage. Each brake type allows for very different yoke >> angles and that is why overall a touring brake has the capability to be >> setup with more power, if done correctly and with that purpose in mind. >> >> I think this article is a good one on the topic as it is actually on >> canti geometry: >> >> >> https://www.velonews.com/gear/technical-faq-with-lennard-zinn-a-detailed-look-at-brake-shudder/ >> >> And here is the associated Sheldon page: >> >> https://www.sheldonbrown.com/cantilever-geometry.html >> >> On Saturday, January 21, 2023 at 10:38:13 AM UTC-6 rcook...@gmail.com >> wrote: >> >>> Scott, >>> >>> I've used the Neo-Retro as a front brake for about ten years and have >>> always had great luck with it. It looks great and, at the time, I was under >>> the impression that the Neo-Retro was the more powerful brake—than the >>> Touring Canti, that is. Paul's web page for the Neo-Retro used to warn that >>> it's a powerful enough brake that one should make sure the frame could take >>> the braking force, and maybe use the Touring Canti instead if one wasn't >>> sure. I can no longer find that warning on the website. In any case, the >>> Neo-Retro is powerful enough for me and relatively easy to adjust, and it's >>> my first choice for a rim brake. (For some reason, likely user >>> error/dimwittedness, I've never had luck with linear-pull brakes, but then >>> I've never tried the Motolite.) >>> >>> I chose the Touring Canti for the rear to maximize heel and pannier >>> clearance. The combination works well for me, even with a full touring load >>> going downhill. >>> >>> -- >>> Bob >>> >>> >>> On Friday, January 20, 2023 at 4:12:41 PM UTC-7 greenteadrinkers wrote: >>> If you had to choose between the Paul Touring Canti or the Neo-Retro for a front brake, which would you pick and why? Curious about how much functional difference exists between the 2 models. Thanks, Scott >>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f6157c7c-bbdb-4074-bdd6-2f9f5c59e140n%40googlegroups.com.
