subject:"\[RBW\] Re\: The Stem Chronicles\: Will this get me injured\?"

I’m really looking forward to hearing how it turns out for you! We’ll make sure 
to put our heads together on this thread when we’ve both got our new stems. And 
like I said earlier, you can get yours from Rivendell if you like!

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 23, 2020, at 5:45 PM, aeroperf  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> And thank you for this thread.  My Homer's stem looked exactly like Leah's 
> photo, and I just ordered the longer one from Soma.
> The 51 frame is too small and I may yet get a different one, but at least now 
> I'll be able to ride without destroying the steerer tube.
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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread aeroperf


And thank you for this thread.  My Homer's stem looked exactly like Leah's 
photo, and I just ordered the longer one from Soma.
The 51 frame is too small and I may yet get a different one, but at least 
now I'll be able to ride without destroying the steerer tube.

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

I think you should get the tall stem that SOMA was offering. Ok I know you've 
already decided this, but I wanted to give my advice, too! 🙃

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread masmojo

Maybe you could just get your Clementine repainted!?

Might be cheaper/easier!

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

You may well be right, Mas. 

I called Rivendell and I asked about the Nitto 280 mm quill. They had never 
heard of it so I sent them Soma’s link. Riv’s newsletter today told of a hefty 
bill they have coming so I asked if Rivendell could get this stem and take my 
order, and does it even help. They can! It does! 

So, I guess I’m going to spring for this ridiculously expensive stem and see if 
I can finally put #stemsonclems to rest.

It isn’t like my fit is so off on this bike - it’s just that every single time 
I ride it I think, I wish I could sit back a little. If these bars were just a 
bit higher I’d have no tension in my arms. I can get them there if I ignore the 
perils of the Max Height Line, but you all have scared me out of doing THAT. 
It’s close - it really is, and maybe I’m poised to make my situation worse in 
this pursuit of perfection. 

I know that perfect is the sworn enemy of good. Or however that saying goes - 
you know what I mean.

I guess we’ll see. Thanks for all the help!
Leah

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 23, 2020, at 4:00 PM, masmojo  wrote:
> 
> Leah, I think you are more or less at the limit; could you get the bars 
> higher or closer? Yeah, but reasonably how much difference would it make & at 
> what cost.
> 
> Honestly, I think you'll get a more effective upper body workout with the 
> bars lower and pushing & pulling the bars towards and away from you with your 
> body more or less over the bars. 
> 
> Did that make sense?
> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread masmojo

Leah, I think you are more or less at the limit; could you get the bars higher 
or closer? Yeah, but reasonably how much difference would it make & at what 
cost.

Honestly, I think you'll get a more effective upper body workout with the bars 
lower and pushing & pulling the bars towards and away from you with your body 
more or less over the bars. 

Did that make sense?

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread tc

Keep in mind that swapping out your current 5cm stem for an Analog 
"Tanglefoort w(Right)" 0cm stem I mentioned above gets the bars 2" closer 
to you.  So, you might not need your bar any higher at that point.  The 
w(Right) stem has a 225mm shaft height, so, though I'm not sure of its max 
height line (you should ask them how high it can safely go), you could 
hopefully get them up at least as high as your current stem.  I don't think 
there's another option for you stem-wise...I mean, 0mm is pretty much the 
shortest :)

Now, handlebar-wise, you DO have more options to get your grip higher than 
even a Bosco.  Search for "Cruiser" handlebars.  Nitto, Wald, Trek/Electra, 
Sunlite, and other companies make a wide variety of "sit up and beg" bars.

Tom

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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread David B

Using this stem comparison tool: http://yojimg.net/bike/web_tools/stem.php
The Dirt Drop would be 25mm taller than the Tallux at maximum heights, 
however it'd have ~15mm reach than the Tallux when raised to the 
appropriate position.


On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 3:30:40 PM UTC-6, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> The 8cm DirtDrop has 186mm rise above the Max Height line. I don't believe 
> this will give her any more height than her Tallux. 

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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch

Alternatively, lower your saddle to raise your bars. You may well be 
surprised. My experience is this:

When doing full squats, the most powerful, sustainable push is mid-squat. 
Very few people have their saddle height set so their pedal stroke matches 
the middle third of a squat, yet this is the most efficient and powerful 
way to position the saddle: so the down stroke begins at a 1/3rd squat and 
the bottom of the stroke is at a 2/3rds squat.

With abandon,
Patrick  

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

Soma evidently has the 280 length, 50 extension, 25.4 diameter in stock - 
over 2 extra inches of height! I vote go for that. 

Laing

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 4:33:39 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Maybe I’m being unreasonable. If they don’t really make stems this high 
> and we know my bike already has a high head tube, maybe it’s not you it’s 
> me, you know? 
>
> Sent from my iPhone 
>
> > On Jan 23, 2020, at 1:30 PM, Joe Bernard  > wrote: 
> > 
> > The 8cm DirtDrop has 186mm rise above the Max Height line. I don't 
> believe this will give her any more height than her Tallux. 
> > 
> > -- 
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>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

Maybe I’m being unreasonable. If they don’t really make stems this high and we 
know my bike already has a high head tube, maybe it’s not you it’s me, you know?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 23, 2020, at 1:30 PM, Joe Bernard  wrote:
> 
> The 8cm DirtDrop has 186mm rise above the Max Height line. I don't believe 
> this will give her any more height than her Tallux. 
> 
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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

The 8cm DirtDrop has 186mm rise above the Max Height line. I don't believe this 
will give her any more height than her Tallux. 

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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread Benz, Sunnyvale, CA

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 10:21:11 AM UTC-8, lconley wrote:
>
> The fork steerer tube is weakest at the threads, When you go above the 
> minimum insertion line of the stem, you run the risk of the expander at the 
> bottom of the stem putting pressure on the weaker threaded part of the stem 
> instead of the stronger smooth part of the stem. The steerer tube could 
> then break at the threaded section and the handlebars and stem would no 
> longer be able to steer the bike. Also, if you the lifted the bike, the 
> fork might drop out of the frame. Never seen it happen, but those are the 
> dangers.
>

I just want to add that since there's a small stack of spacers between the 
two threaded pieces, there's a higher chance the expander will be on the 
threads. Nevertheless, I'm not a big proponent of going nuts on that 
expander bolt, simply because it only needs to be tight enough to not slip. 
Furthermore, in a crash, I'll want the stem to slip anyway.

Leah, since you're already using a tall stem with a 50mm extension, perhaps 
you should consider a dirt drop stem. These tend to have a long quill, and 
have taller effective height with shorter effective reach through that 
up-jutting design.

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread Dorothy C

How about a dirt drop? You would need the 25.4 clamp version for mountain bike 
style bars. 
https://www.rivbike.com/collections/stems/products/nitto-dirt-drop-26-0-8cm-or-10cm?variant=17940575027311

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread Mark Roland

https://www.modernbike.com/nitto-mt-10-long-quill-stem-25.4-35d-x-80-silver

this should be able to go higher than your current stem, since the extension 
itself also rises. The effective reach will probably be around the 50mm point 
of your current stem. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

I am in agreement. You guys have all said the same thing which is “DON’T DO 
THAT!” 

Knowing the risk, I’ll gladly buy the new taller stem.. if it exists!  I don’t 
want to be injured (again). It turns out I’m not good at that. 🤷‍♀️ 

Where do you find one? My cursory searches yielded nothing.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 23, 2020, at 11:18 AM, Christopher Murray  
> wrote:
> 
> It might be fine but it might not. Is it worth the risk? Stem failures can 
> be dangerous depending on the how and when of it. I'd buy the longer stem and 
> do it right to eliminate the risk and so it would be done right. Your 
> beautiful bike deserves it! 
> 
> Chris 
> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch

Leah: "So with all the standing I do (because I (erroneously?) believe it
gives me an upper body workout as I pull on the bars up giant hills, this
is a risky thing, huh?"

Arm and core work happens to varying degrees with every pedal stroke. The
more you pull up on the bars in opposition to you pedal stroke down, the
greater the arm work out. Ideally, all motion (legs and arms) initiates in
your core (because of modern chairs et al, core muscles tend to be fairly
weak), the idea being that big work should be done with big muscles, then
attenuated through small muscles (hips, legs, feet) in finer gratiation of
application and finesse. Your core can't push the pedals, that's what feet
are fore, but it can initiate the engery push through the hips, to the
legs, to the feet, each of which refines and applies that power along the
way until it goes into a pedal traveling in a circle.

None of this is dependent on standing, though applying power through a
high, parallel handlebar, such as Bosco, is made far easier standing than
sitting (as opposed to a more perpendicular bar, such as bullmoose, that
make sitting power strokes very easy.

All of which is to say you may want to play (within the limits of your
current stem) some more before trying for a taller stem. Enjoy!

With abandon,
Patrick

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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?



https://www.somafabshop.com/shop/product/nitto-stem-technomic-quill-280mm-xl-25-4mm-4096?category=817

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-NITTO-Nitto-MTC-04-x-225mm-SILVER-o28-6-22-2/173450990973?hash=item28627c157d:g:de0AAOSwdqJbZfOy

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread Christopher Murray

It might be fine but it might not. Is it worth the risk? Stem failures can be 
dangerous depending on the how and when of it. I'd buy the longer stem and do 
it right to eliminate the risk and so it would be done right. Your beautiful 
bike deserves it! 

Chris 

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

Bike Touring News has a 90 extension with 26.0 bars.

Alex's Cycle in Japan says 50 extension with 25.4 bars.$59 plus shipping

Rivendell can probably order one.

Laing

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 2:04:32 PM UTC-5, Joe Bernard wrote:

> Laing, can you find a link for that?

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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?



FWIW, the Nitto NTC 280 also comes in a 50mm version. 

http://nitto-tokyo.sakura.ne.jp/stem-E.html

https://alexscycle.com/products/nitto-technomic-ntc-280-stem-1

There's also using the Nitto MTC-04-225 , sometimes called the MTC-04 long, 
with a threadless stem that has positive rise, rather than extra long 
quills and a negative rise stem . 

At least with an open face stem you never ever have to remove everything 
from your bars to change a stem. 



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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?


I'll put it this way, E calls you on the phone and says :  "I'm going to 
alter your sourdough recipe, just a smidge , and it will still taste even 
better, trust me".  

You say ...  ? 

 



On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:11:39 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:
>
> It’s the stem chronicles, with Leah Peterson. Are you sick of it? I’m sick 
> of it. 
>
> There is nothing wrong with my new Clem L.; it’s turning out to be a real 
> joy that has made me very happy.  I’ve settled in on it, save for one small 
> thing. I want the bars just a hair higher and closer. I had them at max 
> height, and today I upped them a bit more. See photo. The stem is a Nitto 
> 50 mm and 225 high. I have Bosco bars. 
>
> What I want to know is, what horrors might befall me for disobeying the 
> max height line? 
>
> If I don’t have to swap out the stem that would be awesome. I’m tired of 
> that game, and if you would just tell me everything will be fine with my 
> current adjustment that would be fantastic. This is what I’m hoping for, 
> folks, but give it to me straight. And can I raise it a smidge more? 😬 
>
> I like ‘em close and I like ‘em high, 
> Leah

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?




Okay smartypants  ahahahahahahha  !!! 

..what do you suppose the "min. insertion" line is there for in the 
first place ? 


On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:37:52 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> I say...
>
> “You better share your recipe. You owe me, kid.”
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>

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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread Drw

Also, and im only saying this because i recently had to encounter a 
handlebar raising issue that previously had been of no concern,  that max 
height line should be at or below the top of the headtube of the bike. 

My dad had his set like right below the top nut and thought it was ok 
because the line wasn't visible. sorta makes sense, but i asked LBS and its 
gotta go lower. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

Laing, can you find a link for that?

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

Yes it will get you injured. Which you already did this week so no more 
injuries for you! 

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

2020-01-23 Thread Joe Bunik

The problem is with the location where the expander-bolt now falls
within the steerer -- IF it's in the threaded section, its force is
creating a stress riser which gets amplified every time you hit bump.

One of the Bruce Gordon frames I salvaged had this fate befall it,
clearly a too-high stem had tore through the steerer. Somebody
probably regretted that immediately!

=- Joe Bunik
Walnut Creek, CA

On 1/23/20, Leah Peterson  wrote:
> So with all the standing I do (because I (erroneously?) believe it gives me
> an upper body workout as I pull on the bars up giant hills, this is a risky
> thing, huh?
>
> What does a person do if she wants higher bars? Or should I just try to
> adapt to what I have?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jan 23, 2020, at 10:21 AM, lconley  wrote:
>>
>> 
>> The fork steerer tube is weakest at the threads, When you go above the
>> minimum insertion line of the stem, you run the risk of the expander at
>> the bottom of the stem putting pressure on the weaker threaded part of the
>> stem instead of the stronger smooth part of the stem. The steerer tube
>> could then break at the threaded section and the handlebars and stem would
>> no longer be able to steer the bike. Also, if you the lifted the bike, the
>> fork might drop out of the frame. Never seen it happen, but those are the
>> dangers.
>>
>> Laing
>> Delray Beach, FL
>>
>>
>>> On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:11:39 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding
>>> Ding! wrote:
>>> It’s the stem chronicles, with Leah Peterson. Are you sick of it? I’m
>>> sick of it.
>>>
>>> There is nothing wrong with my new Clem L.; it’s turning out to be a real
>>> joy that has made me very happy.  I’ve settled in on it, save for one
>>> small thing. I want the bars just a hair higher and closer. I had them at
>>> max height, and today I upped them a bit more. See photo. The stem is a
>>> Nitto 50 mm and 225 high. I have Bosco bars.
>>>
>>> What I want to know is, what horrors might befall me for disobeying the
>>> max height line?
>>>
>>> If I don’t have to swap out the stem that would be awesome. I’m tired of
>>> that game, and if you would just tell me everything will be fine with my
>>> current adjustment that would be fantastic. This is what I’m hoping for,
>>> folks, but give it to me straight. And can I raise it a smidge more? 😬
>>>
>>> I like ‘em close and I like ‘em high,
>>> Leah
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

Nitto makes a 280 extra tall Technomic, supposedly available as short as 70 
extension. 

Laing

On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:33:40 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> So with all the standing I do (because I (erroneously?) believe it gives 
> me an upper body workout as I pull on the bars up giant hills, this is a 
> risky thing, huh? 
>
> What does a person do if she wants higher bars? Or should I just try to 
> adapt to what I have? 
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 23, 2020, at 10:21 AM, lconley > 
> wrote:
>
> 
> The fork steerer tube is weakest at the threads, When you go above the 
> minimum insertion line of the stem, you run the risk of the expander at the 
> bottom of the stem putting pressure on the weaker threaded part of the stem 
> instead of the stronger smooth part of the stem. The steerer tube could 
> then break at the threaded section and the handlebars and stem would no 
> longer be able to steer the bike. Also, if you the lifted the bike, the 
> fork might drop out of the frame. Never seen it happen, but those are the 
> dangers.
>
> Laing
> Delray Beach, FL
>
>
> On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:11:39 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding 
> Ding! wrote:
>
>> It’s the stem chronicles, with Leah Peterson. Are you sick of it? I’m 
>> sick of it. 
>>
>> There is nothing wrong with my new Clem L.; it’s turning out to be a real 
>> joy that has made me very happy.  I’ve settled in on it, save for one small 
>> thing. I want the bars just a hair higher and closer. I had them at max 
>> height, and today I upped them a bit more. See photo. The stem is a Nitto 
>> 50 mm and 225 high. I have Bosco bars. 
>>
>> What I want to know is, what horrors might befall me for disobeying the 
>> max height line? 
>>
>> If I don’t have to swap out the stem that would be awesome. I’m tired of 
>> that game, and if you would just tell me everything will be fine with my 
>> current adjustment that would be fantastic. This is what I’m hoping for, 
>> folks, but give it to me straight. And can I raise it a smidge more? 😬 
>>
>> I like ‘em close and I like ‘em high, 
>> Leah
>
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

So with all the standing I do (because I (erroneously?) believe it gives me an 
upper body workout as I pull on the bars up giant hills, this is a risky thing, 
huh? 

What does a person do if she wants higher bars? Or should I just try to adapt 
to what I have? 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 23, 2020, at 10:21 AM, lconley  wrote:
> 
> 
> The fork steerer tube is weakest at the threads, When you go above the 
> minimum insertion line of the stem, you run the risk of the expander at the 
> bottom of the stem putting pressure on the weaker threaded part of the stem 
> instead of the stronger smooth part of the stem. The steerer tube could then 
> break at the threaded section and the handlebars and stem would no longer be 
> able to steer the bike. Also, if you the lifted the bike, the fork might drop 
> out of the frame. Never seen it happen, but those are the dangers.
> 
> Laing
> Delray Beach, FL
> 
> 
>> On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:11:39 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>> It’s the stem chronicles, with Leah Peterson. Are you sick of it? I’m sick 
>> of it. 
>> 
>> There is nothing wrong with my new Clem L.; it’s turning out to be a real 
>> joy that has made me very happy.  I’ve settled in on it, save for one small 
>> thing. I want the bars just a hair higher and closer. I had them at max 
>> height, and today I upped them a bit more. See photo. The stem is a Nitto 50 
>> mm and 225 high. I have Bosco bars. 
>> 
>> What I want to know is, what horrors might befall me for disobeying the max 
>> height line? 
>> 
>> If I don’t have to swap out the stem that would be awesome. I’m tired of 
>> that game, and if you would just tell me everything will be fine with my 
>> current adjustment that would be fantastic. This is what I’m hoping for, 
>> folks, but give it to me straight. And can I raise it a smidge more? 😬 
>> 
>> I like ‘em close and I like ‘em high, 
>> Leah
> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?

I say...

“You better share your recipe. You owe me, kid.”

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 23, 2020, at 10:36 AM, Garth  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll put it this way, E calls you on the phone and says :  "I'm going to 
> alter your sourdough recipe, just a smidge , and it will still taste even 
> better, trust me".  
> 
> You say ...  ? 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
>> On Thursday, January 23, 2020 at 1:11:39 PM UTC-5, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>> It’s the stem chronicles, with Leah Peterson. Are you sick of it? I’m sick 
>> of it. 
>> 
>> There is nothing wrong with my new Clem L.; it’s turning out to be a real 
>> joy that has made me very happy.  I’ve settled in on it, save for one small 
>> thing. I want the bars just a hair higher and closer. I had them at max 
>> height, and today I upped them a bit more. See photo. The stem is a Nitto 50 
>> mm and 225 high. I have Bosco bars. 
>> 
>> What I want to know is, what horrors might befall me for disobeying the max 
>> height line? 
>> 
>> If I don’t have to swap out the stem that would be awesome. I’m tired of 
>> that game, and if you would just tell me everything will be fine with my 
>> current adjustment that would be fantastic. This is what I’m hoping for, 
>> folks, but give it to me straight. And can I raise it a smidge more? 😬 
>> 
>> I like ‘em close and I like ‘em high, 
>> Leah
> 
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[RBW] Re: The Stem Chronicles: Will this get me injured?