on 4/6/10 10:36 PM, Dave Craig at dcr...@prescott.edu wrote:
Moderator Jim: The RBW forum is the only internet forum I care to
participate in. I appreciate the quality of thought and the civil
discourse I find here. If you believe that my offer isn't an
appropriate use of this forum, let me know and I'll retract my offer
without a fuss.
Well, since this bit was directed at me, I guess I need to dust off my
epaulettes and respond... ;^)
In the strictest sense, this has a high possibility of being outside the
realm of this group. To put it plainly, a touring topic stream not related
to Rivendell products isn't within the confines of the definition.
Dedicated to the discussion of Rivendell Bicycles and products, you don't
need to own one - just an interest in RBW designs is enough to join in. Ride
reports encouraged, as is a respectful, supportive and polite tone in all
posts.
That being said, I do realize that (a) Riv sells bike camping products, (b)
many people's enthusiasm for certain Riv models is specifically for the
touring capabilities, camping and S24O adaptability, and (c) there are
active touring folks on this list.
I have to rely upon you and the others who contribute positively in this
forum to be mindful of balancing those two thoughts.
If we're discussing Touring in the Capital T sense, I'd suggest having
the conversation over at the Touring group on phred.org (graciously hosted
by alex who also hosts/moderates the iBob list).
http://www.phred.org/mailman/listinfo/touring
One of the things I feel very strongly about, and have mentioned in the
various State of the List reports, is that the strength and quality of
this group discussion has a lot to do with the narrowness and specificity of
the topic.
http://cyclofiend.com/rbw/sotlr
This list began as a subset of the iBob list (again, initially hosted on the
phred.org servers) specifically because people wanted to talk about
Rivendell designs and products without dealing with the waves of sniping
comments by naysayers who didn't necessarily care about RBW products.
The gen1 RBW list grew, became a bit fractured, then began to implode
because it was becoming a mini-iBob list - replicating the conversations
on the iBob list, but idoing so in a smaller venue where folks knew one
another. The problem was that the tone was nicer, and the quality of
response was generally reasoned, so people felt more comfortable asking
questions of the RBW group.
When some fairly caustic exchanges took place, Rivendell and alex decided to
pull the plug. Generally, the discussion topics weren't Rivendell related
and the tone had taken a decided turn for the worst.
At that point, a number of us felt that the initial idea was a valid one.
After emailing both alex and RBW to make sure it was ok, I fired up this
group, which is where we are now.
In one sense, we're a bit victimized by the quality of discussion on this
list. I've been involved with online groups and lists and such for a while,
and it is a rare thing when positive discussions can be maintained with a
high signal to noise ratio.
We're doing that here. A number of members have recognized that as well,
which they've been kind enough to share with me privately.
A great number of people on this list have a lot of knowledge in many areas
of bicycling - frame design, history, technique, etc. When they respond to
questions or share experience within the framework of this group, everyone
benefits. That's how this list has grown to its current size and retained
its direct and positive feel.
To continue that growth, to retain the positive and focused nature of this
list, I think it's important to maintain the Rivendell component of this
discussion as topic number one. Rivendell: Touring is probably the way I'd
see it working.
To the extent that it becomes a discussion of Touring in general, non-RBW
products and tips and trends in the general universe of Bicycle Touring, it
strikes me as off-topic by definition, and therefore best discussed
elsewhere - tour...@phred.org, a new google group, blog or a combination of
those things.
If you decide to follow it up that way - i.e. starting a blog or new group -
email me directly. I'd be glad to help you think about how to structure
that, and I think it could be an asset to many.
I'm sorry to hear about your situation with your parent, and you have my
thoughts and best wishes in dealing with that.
- Jim / List Admin
--
Jim Edgar
cyclofi...@earthlink.net
Whatever you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do
it.
Mahatma Gandhi
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