[RE-wrenches] Sunny Island Autotransformer

[Tom DeBates]

SMA has told me that they have or will have by June a "Smart transformer" for 
Sunny Island with efficiency of 98%. I do not see any info for it on the SMA 
site, so you may want to contact SMA/ Sunny Island tech support
good luck,
tom

Tom DeBates

Habi-Tek

524 Summit St.

Geneva,IL. 60134

630-262-8193

fax 630-262-1343___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PV harvest in grid-tied systems

[Chris Mason]

William,
I must confess to being totally confused by your post.

I am currently at my office writing to you using electricity from our
off-grid solar system. We only have the solar power, no grid power.

We get exactly as much power as I predicted we would, in fact a little
more. But, there is an intrinsic issue with off-grid systems that many
people miss. Unless you have a use for the power, it won't be "harvested".
If you allow the inverter to charge the batteries from the grid, there will
be nowhere for the PV power to go.

To give you an example, our warehouse and office has 2,580 watts of PV on a
60 amp charge controller and a 3.5KW outback inverter, with 250Ah of VRLA
batteries (4 x 12V).

Each day, I read the amount of power the charge controller makes. It
averages about 12KWh, depending on how much we used that day and the state
of the batteries at the beginning of the day. We have found that the loads
did not adequately exploit the power product capabilities of the system, so
we moved our freezer from the house to the warehouse to use up some more
power.

As we are in the Caribbean, the insolation levels are pretty continuous, so
it does make calculations easier.


Chris



On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 1:50 AM, William Miller wrote:

> Friends:
>
> There has been recent discussion on this forum about PV production in
> grid-tied with battery systems.  I have been faced with this same problem
> in a 3 XW system installed in 2009.
>
> The customer's power bill never went down.  PV harvest was abysmal.  The
> system would create great short circuit current but would not harvest into
> the batteries.
>
> It is starting to appear the XW firmware was at fault.  The inverters
> would charge the batteries too high so the charge controllers would back
> off.  Upgraded firmware seems to be helping, but the data set is still
> limited.
>
> Remember this:  just because a PV system can produce does not mean it
> will.  The charge controller knows only one thing:  battery voltage.  If it
> is high, production is curtailed.
>
> Off-grid production will also be reduced is consumption is curtailed.
>
> Charge controllers that can be set for grid-tied applications help, but
> only if the inverter(s) do not keep the battery voltage too high.
>
> William Miller
>
>
> Miller Solar
> Voice :805-438-5600
> email: will...@millersolar.com
> http://millersolar.com
> License No. C-10-773985
>
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-- 
Chris Mason
President, Comet Systems Ltd
mas...@cometsystems.co
www.cometsystems.co
Cell: 264.235.5670
Int: +1305.767.2094
Skype: netconcepts
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PV harvest in grid-tied systems

[William Miller]

Chris:

I would willingly clarify but I am confused about what you are confused 
about.  I think we are saying the same thing about off-grid systems:  If 
you don't consume power, battery voltage stays high and charge controllers 
reduce energy harvest.


William Miller



At 06:57 AM 4/16/2012, you wrote:

William,
I must confess to being totally confused by your post.

I am currently at my office writing to you using electricity from our 
off-grid solar system. We only have the solar power, no grid power.


We get exactly as much power as I predicted we would, in fact a little 
more. But, there is an intrinsic issue with off-grid systems that many 
people miss. Unless you have a use for the power, it won't be "harvested". 
If you allow the inverter to charge the batteries from the grid, there 
will be nowhere for the PV power to go.


To give you an example, our warehouse and office has 2,580 watts of PV on 
a 60 amp charge controller and a 3.5KW outback inverter, with 250Ah of 
VRLA batteries (4 x 12V).


Each day, I read the amount of power the charge controller makes. It 
averages about 12KWh, depending on how much we used that day and the state 
of the batteries at the beginning of the day. We have found that the loads 
did not adequately exploit the power product capabilities of the system, 
so we moved our freezer from the house to the warehouse to use up some 
more power.


As we are in the Caribbean, the insolation levels are pretty continuous, 
so it does make calculations easier.



Chris



On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 1:50 AM, William Miller 
<will...@millersolar.com> wrote:

Friends:

There has been recent discussion on this forum about PV production in 
grid-tied with battery systems.  I have been faced with this same problem 
in a 3 XW system installed in 2009.


The customer's power bill never went down.  PV harvest was abysmal.  The 
system would create great short circuit current but would not harvest into 
the batteries.


It is starting to appear the XW firmware was at fault.  The inverters 
would charge the batteries too high so the charge controllers would back 
off.  Upgraded firmware seems to be helping, but the data set is still limited.


Remember this:  just because a PV system can produce does not mean it 
will.  The charge controller knows only one thing:  battery voltage.  If 
it is high, production is curtailed.


Off-grid production will also be reduced is consumption is curtailed.

Charge controllers that can be set for grid-tied applications help, but 
only if the inverter(s) do not keep the battery voltage too high.


William Miller
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Re: [RE-wrenches] real world example - fuel saving with battery bank

[Lee Bristol]

Ron,

There is a simulation program called HOMER from NREL which is perfect for
sizing off-grid solar PV battery systems and for calculating the savings by
utilizing a small diesel generator.  It will optimize the usage of the
generator to minimize life cycle costs.  You will need to know the load
pattern on a 24 hour per day basis and can specify different patterns for
weekdays and weekends.  I have used HOMER for school PV battery systems in
Haiti.

Contact me off-list if you have any questions.

Lee

On Sat, Apr 14, 2012 at 2:39 PM, Ron Young wrote:

> Thanks for the offer Chris & Dan, I'll contact you off list when I have
> more info. By load profile or pattern I assume you & Maverick are simply
> referring to the hourly energy use on a 24 hour basis - or weekly basis? I
> know that there is no one at the sites that can provide that but maybe I'll
> send them something like a TED or an Elite meter and get them to clip it on
> to their genset output for a week then record the data and send it back.
>
> Ron
>
> On 2012-04-14, at 5:49 AM, Chris Mason wrote:
>
> Ron,
> If you send me the load profile, insolation (or location), fuel price,
> generator and PV equipment specifications, I will send you back an analysis
> of the design options which will show the savings very clearly. It will
> also tell you the duty cycle for the generator and the levelized cost of
> energy for each scenario. This should help you to identify the right
> combination of equipment and help close the deal.
>
> On Sat, Apr 14, 2012 at 12:17 AM, Ron Young wrote:
>
>> Hi Wrenches,
>> I'm putting together a proposal for a national company that has a few
>> remote installations. They are looking for options for saving generator
>> run-time using an inverter-charger/battery combo with the existing gensets.
>> Does anyone have any real world examples of realized fuel savings in this
>> type of scenario? They run generators 24/7 and a lot of the dusk to dawn
>> energy requirement is well below the daytime needs. Appreciate any ideas or
>> examples.
>>
>> Ron Young
>> ___
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>
>
> --
> Chris Mason
> President, Comet Systems Ltd
> mas...@cometsystems.co
> www.cometsystems.co
> Cell: 264.235.5670
> Int: +1305.767.2094
> Skype: netconcepts
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-- 
Lee Bristol
NABCEP Certified Solar Designer/Installer

Co-Founder & Commercial Channel Manager
Standard Solar, Inc.
1355 Piccard Drive, #300
Rockville, MD 20850
(301) 944-5105
(240) 479-1510 (c)
www.standardsolar.com
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Sunny Island Autotransformer

[Brian Teitelbaum]

I have pdf copies of the spec sheet and the installation manual for the new SMA 
Smartformer. Anyone interested can contact me off list, and I'll send you a 
copy.

Brian Teitelbaum
AEE Solar
bteitelb...@aeesolar.com

From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Tom DeBates
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 6:48 AM
To: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Sunny Island Autotransformer

SMA has told me that they have or will have by June a "Smart transformer" for 
Sunny Island with efficiency of 98%. I do not see any info for it on the SMA 
site, so you may want to contact SMA/ Sunny Island tech support
good luck,
tom

Tom DeBates
Habi-Tek
524 Summit St.
Geneva,IL. 60134
630-262-8193
fax 630-262-1343


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Re: [RE-wrenches] broken glass

[maver...@mavericksolar.com]

I agree.

There is one Group X panel. The 72 cell mono. 24v nominal, 62.2" x 31.8" with 
varying frame thickness. I use them for all grid interactive and off grid 
systems. They are more ergonomic and higher voltage helps as well.

Conergy, Mage, suntech, astroenrgy, sharp, and many other make or made this 
panel.



Thank you,

Maverick


Maverick Brown
BSEET, NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer ®
President & CEO
Maverick Solar Enterprises, Inc.
Office: 512-919-4493
Cell:512-460-9825

Sent from my HondaJet!

On Apr 16, 2012, at 12:58 AM, William Miller  wrote:

> Friends:
> 
> New Business Plan:  PV recycle yard.  Stock used PV modules of all makes and 
> models.  Get on the "hot-line" and provide used product for warranty repairs.
> 
> Rant on:  I have always advocated that the industry be required by federal 
> mandate to build modules in some basic standardized sizes -- like batteries.  
> Then, if your "Group X" sized module is broken, you have a fair chance of 
> finding another Group X sized module with similar electrical characteristics 
> to replace it.  Probably never gonna happen, but it should.  Rant off.
> 
> William
> 
> 
> 
> At 03:10 PM 4/15/2012, you wrote:
>> Dear Broken Glass Guys,
>>  
>> While I admire your bravery, I don't see how you could fix that panel and 
>> put any kind of a warranty on it.  I have replaced about 6 pieces of glass 
>> on thermal panels and even that is such a pain in the butt I now recommend 
>> panel switchouts.  And thermal panels do not require nearly the functional 
>> perfection PVs do.  That said, this brings up a great point that PV 
>> manufactures and perhaps the industry needs to address.  Though not a 
>> commonality, PV panel breakage is inevitable.  I think the question best be 
>> turned over to the manufactures.  I can't see the answer coming from 
>> anywhere else.
>>  
>> Tip of the Hat,
>>  
>> Andrew Koyaanisqatsi
>> President
>> Solar Energy Solutions, Inc.
>> Since 1987,
>> Moving Portland and Beyond 
>> to an Environmentally Sustainable Future.
>> 503-238-4502
>> www.solarenergyoregon.com 
>>  
>> "Better one's House too little one day
>> than too big all the Year after."
>>   
>> 
>> From: Phil Theis 
>> To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org 
>> Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 12:07 PM
>> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] broken glass
>> 
>> Clear krylon. Lets see what the esteemed group comes up with.
>> 
>> 
>> From my Android phone on T-Mobile. The first nationwide 4G network.
>> 
>> 
>>  Original message 
>> Subject: [RE-wrenches] broken glass 
>> From: Michael Gullo  
>> To: RE-wrenches  
>> CC: 
>> 
>> 
>> Esteemed group:
>>  
>> I have a customer who called this week stating that their son hit a golf 
>> ball in the backyard up on the roof and shattered one of the solar modules. 
>> The system was installed in 2005 and the module is a Sanyo HIP-190BA19. I 
>> have not been able to find a replacement as most sites list the module as 
>> discontinued. The module is still functioning and I was wondering if anyone 
>> has taken a module to a glazier for a glass replacement? Any other solutions 
>> are welcome. Thanks.
>>  
>> Mike
>> Michael Gullo
>> Solar Solutions LLC
>> Marlton, NJ
>> NJ Electrical Lic #16758
>> NABCEP Certified Installer
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[RE-wrenches] Trace Change out

[frenergy]

Wrenches,

I had not thought of using AC1 for the gennyI had some thinking in 
the back of my mind that AC1 had to meet tighter input requirements to be 
practical for a generator and was thus delegated to grid use, which is not used 
here.. I'll keep that one in my toolbox.  Customer manually starts the 
generator so AC1 is an option.

Yes, it is a deep well (250') and the pump is manually turned on to 
occasionally fill a 2500 Gallon tank for gravity feed.  This the only time the 
autoformer is in the picture.

Part of the reason I was considering the Magnum was for the 240/120 
feature, though this particular install has some equipment space requirements 
that could make it a major job to install Magnum's vertical footprint vs. that 
of the SW.  

I just called DPW (Alan's suggestion) and they are in fact still 
repairing SW's.  Raymond there says turnaround is usually 1-2 days...he also 
said AC1 for the gen would be an option, though be sure to never use the "sell" 
mode.  I found Tekris through a search, but did not contact them.  It's good to 
see there are also other options to repair these inverters (thanks Mac).

Phil, I'm also thinking it may be that extra "kick" of something like 
the conventional frig (with the other loads running, batts charging, pump 
running) in the house that produces the out-of-spec condition, bumping the 
inverter out of the picture.  It's wait and see right now with my new batt 
charge and AC2
 amps settings and how they affect the SW staying online.  So far so good.  
I'll have to look into the picoscope.

Thanks again to all for so much help. This list rocks.

Bill
Feather River Solar Electric
4291 Nelson St.
Taylorsville, CA  95983
530-284-7849/6544 fax
solar powered since 1982
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[RE-wrenches] Transformerless inverter reliability

[Joel Davidson]

Wrenches,
Los Angeles Department of Water & Power (LADWP), the largest and most 
influential municipal utility in the US is finally going to allow 
transformerless inverters for residential PV systems. Are there any design, 
installation or reliability issues to consider with the SMA and other 
high-frequency transformerless inverters. Can they be mounted on a hot south 
or west wall or do the have to be kept cool in the shade?

Joel Davidson

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Trace Change out

[Dana]

Ditto Excellent service from One stop.

 

Thanks

Dana Orzel -  Great Solar Works, Inc -  E - d...@solarwork.com -  V
970.626.5253

F - 970.626.4140 C - 970.209.4076 web - www.solarwork.com  

"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"

P Please consider the environment before printing this email

 

From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of mac Lewis
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 7:08 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Trace Change out

 

Hi Allan,

 

I have used the One Stop Cop Shop in Colorado Springs for repairs on an SW
recently, with success.  They can be contacted at  (719) 495-2740.  I have
found it has been best for customers to deal directly with them, because
repairs can vary widely in price, based on what has failed.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

 

On Sun, Apr 15, 2012 at 6:32 AM,  wrote:

As I recall, AC IN2 sets the Gen input limit, any load beyond that the
inverter lights up and makes up the difference. Batt charge amps AC sets the
charge rate (up to the AC IN set point). SWs have been the industry war
horse for years. And for lots of folks, are still the cat's pajamas
(especially if they're set up so the defaults work out), but I've been
replacing gobs of them (Especially Grid Tied). I like Outback only only
because I'm more familiar with them (and I'm in love with Katy), but Magnum
seems to have more bells and whistles. I'll need to be heading that way PDQ.
(Just to tune in).

 

I think Tekris Power out of NJ still repairs SWs (But not SW Plus?). 

 

Good luck.

 

db

 


Dan Brown
Foxfire Energy Corp.
Renewable Energy Systems
(802)-483-2564  
www.Foxfire-Energy.com
NABCEP #092907-44

 

 Original Message 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Trace Change out

From: "frenergy" 
Date: Sat, April 14, 2012 9:21 pm
To: 

Wrenches,

 

I have a customer that may be having some issues with the
reliability of his 11 year old Trace4024.  If my current fix doesn't solve
the problem, I have suggested having the unit fixed, which I think still
happens on these puppies. I have also suggested replacing it with either an
Outback 3524 or a Magnum MS 4024.  He is now running a 1 HP Submersible pump
ala autoformer along with the usual array of  house loads.

 

The issue is the inverter accepting and then rejecting the generator
power, which I have been watching recent comments here regarding this issue.
I have not thoroughly checked out pump wiring (was apparently already done
by the well/pump guy, whom is reputable), but have checked the output of the
Kohler 8.5 genny and Hz and voltage appear stable with and without load.  So
far I've gone the route of programming in a few less amps on the "battery
charging" and "AC2 IN" functions.   The inverter seems to be happy with new
settings, this new programming was just done a few hours ago.

 

So this may be a more generic question for those with more
experience than I: Are both the OB and Magnum inverters considered equally
capable of replacing the Trace? I guess I'm thinking mainly of that pump,
but are there other considerations?

 

Thanks Folks

 

Bill

Feather River Solar Electric
4291 Nelson St.
Taylorsville, CA  95983
530-284-7849/6544 fax

solar powered since 1982


  _  


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-- 

 

 

 

Mac Lewis

"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates

 

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Array spacing for optimum performance

[William Miller]

Carl:

The "sweet spot" is something you have to figure out for yourself.  You 
need to balance job-specific values against one another.  Consider factors 
such as:  how much you pay for power, how valuable morning and afternoon 
production is, the cost of additional PV, the balance between lower tilt 
angle production versus more PV that could fit and what weather patterns 
are that influence the value of insolation at a given hour or season.


Maybe you can minimize tilt angle and purchase more PV...  Or you can 
purchase more land and install more PV...  Or build a bigger structure to 
add more PV...  Consider the price of conservation against the price of 
more PV...


Build some spreadsheets to explore these trade-offs.  I can' do this for you.

Good luck...

William Miller


At 04:44 PM 4/15/2012, you wrote:
Carl is having sending issues, so I am posting this on his behalf. He will 
be able to receive your responses on the list, though.


From: Carl Emerson 
Sent: 15 April 2012 10:16 p.m.
Subject: Array Spacing for optimum performance.

 Hi there,

Can I raise a design issue with large grid-tied arrays.

Using William’s spreadsheet for array spacing leaves me with several 
questions unanswered.


Assuming the array is inclined for max year round performance, one could 
then space the array for no shading for a certain sun Elevation and Azimuth.


The question I have is what is the sweet spot when compromising shading 
for array spacing in large arrays.


Narrower spacing means more panels in the array and better output in summer.

Wider spacing means better winter performance with less panels and less 
annual power production.


Is there a guideline available to optimise these factors…

Thanks for your help.

Carl Emerson
Freepower Co.
Auckland N.Z.
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Array spacing for optimum performance

[mac Lewis]

Carl,

I have explored this a bit and William is right.  It's complicated!  I have
used the System advisor model (SAM) to do a cost benefit on this.  SAM is a
free power system modeling program from NREL that is very extensive and
complicated.  Here is the download link.

https://sam.nrel.gov/content/downloads

There a couple of tutorials to help you get started.

Good luck!

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 1:32 PM, William Miller wrote:

>  Carl:
>
> The "sweet spot" is something you have to figure out for yourself.  You
> need to balance job-specific values against one another.  Consider factors
> such as:  how much you pay for power, how valuable morning and afternoon
> production is, the cost of additional PV, the balance between lower tilt
> angle production versus more PV that could fit and what weather patterns
> are that influence the value of insolation at a given hour or season.
>
> Maybe you can minimize tilt angle and purchase more PV...  Or you can
> purchase more land and install more PV...  Or build a bigger structure to
> add more PV...  Consider the price of conservation against the price of
> more PV...
>
> Build some spreadsheets to explore these trade-offs.  I can' do this for
> you.
>
> Good luck...
>
> William Miller
>
>
>
> At 04:44 PM 4/15/2012, you wrote:
>
> Carl is having sending issues, so I am posting this on his behalf. He will
> be able to receive your responses on the list, though.
>
> *From:* Carl Emerson 
> *Sent:* 15 April 2012 10:16 p.m.
> *Subject:* Array Spacing for optimum performance.
>
>  Hi there,
>
> Can I raise a design issue with large grid-tied arrays.
>
> Using William’s spreadsheet for array spacing leaves me with several
> questions unanswered.
>
> Assuming the array is inclined for max year round performance, one could
> then space the array for no shading for a certain sun Elevation and Azimuth.
>
> The question I have is what is the sweet spot when compromising shading
> for array spacing in large arrays.
>
> Narrower spacing means more panels in the array and better output in
> summer.
>
> Wider spacing means better winter performance with less panels and less
> annual power production.
>
> Is there a guideline available to optimise these factors…
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> Carl Emerson
> Freepower Co.
> Auckland N.Z.
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> 18:34:00
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> **
>
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> Voice :805-438-5600
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> http://millersolar.com
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-- 



Mac Lewis

*

"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates
*
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PV harvest in grid-tied systems

[Chris Mason]

So if I understand you, your problem is that you have a grid tied battery
backed system XW based system that ought to be exporting power. I have
installed the same system near my office. You are finding that the
customer's electricity cost has not decreased as expected.
I know that when I stand in front of the utilities mechanical meter at
noon, especially when the owners are not in residence, the meter spins
backwards at a rapid pace.

In order to make that work, I programmed the inverter to a "Charge Off"
setting. I let the batteries charge by solar only.

The XW is a pig to setup , I used the outback GFX seriesafter that
installation.

The biggest issue is the hybrid setups like this have poor reporting so it
is hard to know what is going on without moving in. In your case, I would
put one of my eGuage metering units on the utility feeder and look at the
export and import in real time. I would also put CTs on the inverter feed
to measure the production and consumption. Let me know if you need help
with that, I resell these devices.


On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 10:56 AM, William Miller wrote:

>  Chris:
>
> I would willingly clarify but I am confused about what you are confused
> about.  I think we are saying the same thing about off-grid systems:  If
> you don't consume power, battery voltage stays high and charge controllers
> reduce energy harvest.
>
> William Miller
>
>
>
>
> At 06:57 AM 4/16/2012, you wrote:
>
> William,
> I must confess to being totally confused by your post.
>
> I am currently at my office writing to you using electricity from our
> off-grid solar system. We only have the solar power, no grid power.
>
> We get exactly as much power as I predicted we would, in fact a little
> more. But, there is an intrinsic issue with off-grid systems that many
> people miss. Unless you have a use for the power, it won't be "harvested".
> If you allow the inverter to charge the batteries from the grid, there will
> be nowhere for the PV power to go.
>
> To give you an example, our warehouse and office has 2,580 watts of PV on
> a 60 amp charge controller and a 3.5KW outback inverter, with 250Ah of VRLA
> batteries (4 x 12V).
>
> Each day, I read the amount of power the charge controller makes. It
> averages about 12KWh, depending on how much we used that day and the state
> of the batteries at the beginning of the day. We have found that the loads
> did not adequately exploit the power product capabilities of the system, so
> we moved our freezer from the house to the warehouse to use up some more
> power.
>
> As we are in the Caribbean, the insolation levels are pretty continuous,
> so it does make calculations easier.
>
>
> Chris
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 1:50 AM, William Miller 
> wrote:
>  Friends:
>
> There has been recent discussion on this forum about PV production in
> grid-tied with battery systems.  I have been faced with this same problem
> in a 3 XW system installed in 2009.
>
> The customer's power bill never went down.  PV harvest was abysmal.  The
> system would create great short circuit current but would not harvest into
> the batteries.
>
> It is starting to appear the XW firmware was at fault.  The inverters
> would charge the batteries too high so the charge controllers would back
> off.  Upgraded firmware seems to be helping, but the data set is still
> limited.
>
> Remember this:  just because a PV system can produce does not mean it
> will.  The charge controller knows only one thing:  battery voltage.  If it
> is high, production is curtailed.
>
> Off-grid production will also be reduced is consumption is curtailed.
>
> Charge controllers that can be set for grid-tied applications help, but
> only if the inverter(s) do not keep the battery voltage too high.
>
> William Miller
>
>
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-- 
Chris Mason
President, Comet Systems Ltd
mas...@cometsystems.co
www.cometsystems.co
Cell: 264.235.5670
Int: +1305.767.2094
Skype: netconcepts
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Array spacing for optimum performance

[Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar Power Systems]

Carl, 

This answer does not address a shading issue but may be pertinent to your 
question. 

Due to the higher cost of electricity in Yuma, AZ in the summer, I installed an 
18kW PV array with the elevation optimized for summer production. The utility 
company recently reported that the system is performing at 15% better than 
comparable sized systems. It may have to due with choice of components (very 
low temperature coefficient for power) but also due to the energy cost that is 
offset in the summer. So, even though the all year performance is compromised, 
it is still saving my customer more money annually.

Something to consider.

Larry Crutcher
Starlight Solar Power Systems
(928) 342-9103






On Apr 15, 2012, at 4:44 PM, Michael Welch wrote:

Carl is having sending issues, so I am posting this on his behalf. He will be 
able to receive your responses on the list, though.

From: Carl Emerson 
Sent: 15 April 2012 10:16 p.m.
Subject: Array Spacing for optimum performance.
 
 Hi there,
 
Can I raise a design issue with large grid-tied arrays.
 
Using William’s spreadsheet for array spacing leaves me with several questions 
unanswered.
 
Assuming the array is inclined for max year round performance, one could then 
space the array for no shading for a certain sun Elevation and Azimuth.
 
The question I have is what is the sweet spot when compromising shading for 
array spacing in large arrays.
 
Narrower spacing means more panels in the array and better output in summer.
 
Wider spacing means better winter performance with less panels and less annual 
power production.
 
Is there a guideline available to optimise these factors…
 
Thanks for your help.
 
Carl Emerson
Freepower Co.
Auckland N.Z.



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[RE-wrenches] Knowledgable person in or near Ketchikan, AK

[Chris Daum]

Hi Folks:
 
I have a fellow in need of system diagnostics near Ketchikan; he would be
happy to pay and fly someone in and out to his remote cabin (it appears he's
having battery issues).
 
Does anyone know of a person in the neighborhood who may be able to help
this guy?  Feel free to contact me off list.
 
THANKS.
Chris Daum
Oasis Montana Inc.
406-777-4309
406-777-0830 fax
www.oasismontana.com 

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[RE-wrenches] Solarex Diode Information

[Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar Power Systems]

Wrenches,

I'm looking for a diode for a Solarex MSX-Lite PV module. The original, 
according to the customer, was a SR2512. Can't find data for that part #. I 
know that they used the MR2510 button diodes in larger modules. Does anyone 
have any data or know if the MR2510 will work OK as a sub?

Off list email is la...@starlightsolar.com.

Larry Crutcher
Starlight Solar Power Systems
(928) 342-9103





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Re: [RE-wrenches] Array spacing for optimum performance

[Kent Osterberg]

Carl,

As you posed your question, with the array fixed at the angle optimized 
for annual energy production, you've forced a solution that cannot meet 
the goal of harvesting the maximum energy from the site.


To get the most energy from any site,  the array will be horizontal with 
no spacing between rows. The intuitive way to see this is to consider 
the question: how do you get every photon that hits the site to land on 
a PV module? Horizontal is not a very practical solution. To wash clean 
with rainfall, the modules need to have some slope; 10° to 15° is 
usually considered minimum. If someone is to clean the modules by hand, 
or inspect the modules, there must be access space between the rows.


Also, the horizontal solution isn't the most cost effective solution, 
except perhaps near the equator. To get the most energy per money unit 
(insert your choice: dollar, yen, ...), more information needs to be 
considered. If the value of the land or roof surface is ignored, the 
lowest cost per kWh will probably occur when the modules are spaced far 
enough apart that there is virtually never any shading from the rows in 
front and the optimum angle is a little less than the latitude. This 
solution produces much less energy the maximum possible. And, of course, 
ignoring the value of the land or roof space isn't practical either.


Ultimately, you have to look at what limits apply to the problem and 
work from there.


Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar, Inc.
www.bluemountainsolar.com


On 4/15/2012 4:44 PM, Michael Welch wrote:
Carl is having sending issues, so I am posting this on his behalf. He 
will be able to receive your responses on the list, though.


*From:* Carl Emerson 
*Sent:* 15 April 2012 10:16 p.m.
*Subject:* Array Spacing for optimum performance.

 Hi there,

Can I raise a design issue with large grid-tied arrays.

Using William's spreadsheet for array spacing leaves me with several 
questions unanswered.


Assuming the array is inclined for max year round performance, one 
could then space the array for no shading for a certain sun Elevation 
and Azimuth.


The question I have is what is the sweet spot when compromising 
shading for array spacing in large arrays.


Narrower spacing means more panels in the array and better output in 
summer.


Wider spacing means better winter performance with less panels and 
less annual power production.


Is there a guideline available to optimise these factors...

Thanks for your help.

Carl Emerson
Freepower Co.
Auckland N.Z.

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[RE-wrenches] Autotransformer caution

[Hilton Dier III]

In the last list someone mentioned putting the transformer behind the 
pressure switch for the well pump so it won't be sitting there idling 
24/7. It's a good idea, but watch out for the double surge. When the 
contacts close you'll get a surge load from the well pump trying to lift 
a column of pressurized water, but also a surge from the transformer as 
the coils energize. I have seen a few inverters have trouble handling 
that stacked surge. If the inverter is significantly oversized compared 
to the pump/transformer it will be ok. Otherwise you can get a time 
delay relay that waits a second (or so) after it gets actuator power 
before energizing. In that case you'd want to adjust the pressure switch 
to come on a few PSI higher than usual so the customer doesn't 
experience a momentary loss in pressure.


Best,

Hilton

--
Hilton Dier III
Renewable Energy Design
Partner, Solar Gain LLC
453 East Hill Rd.
Middlesex, VT 05602

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Transformerless inverter reliability

[Martin E. Herzfeld]

  
  
NEC 110.3(B) Installation and Use. "Listed or labeled equipment
shall be installed and used in accordance with any instructions
included in the listing or labeling." 

(1) "5.2 Selecting the mounting location" Page 19: "• Do not expose
the Sunny Boy to direct sunlight, in order to avoid power reduction
due to excessive heating."
http://files.sma.de/dl/10707/SB8-10TL-IUS103811.pdf

(2)  Others

.
.
.


On 4/16/2012 9:05 AM, Joel Davidson wrote:
Wrenches,
  
  Los Angeles Department of Water & Power (LADWP), the largest
  and most influential municipal utility in the US is finally going
  to allow transformerless inverters for residential PV systems. Are
  there any design, installation or reliability issues to consider
  with the SMA and other high-frequency transformerless inverters.
  Can they be mounted on a hot south or west wall or do the have to
  be kept cool in the shade?
  
  Joel Davidson
  
  
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-- 
  

  

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Trace Change out

[jay peltz]

the good old 4024 don't have any difference  in the acceptance window from AC-1 
or 2
Only issue is if you want genny support or AGS.

jay

peltz power
On Apr 16, 2012, at 7:54 AM, frenergy wrote:

> Wrenches,
>  
> I had not thought of using AC1 for the gennyI had some thinking 
> in the back of my mind that AC1 had to meet tighter input requirements to be 
> practical for a generator and was thus delegated to grid use, which is not 
> used here.. I'll keep that one in my toolbox.  Customer manually starts the 
> generator so AC1 is an option.
>  
> Yes, it is a deep well (250') and the pump is manually turned on to 
> occasionally fill a 2500 Gallon tank for gravity feed.  This the only time 
> the autoformer is in the picture.
>  
> Part of the reason I was considering the Magnum was for the 240/120 
> feature, though this particular install has some equipment space requirements 
> that could make it a major job to install Magnum's vertical footprint vs. 
> that of the SW. 
>  
> I just called DPW (Alan's suggestion) and they are in fact still 
> repairing SW's.  Raymond there says turnaround is usually 1-2 days...he also 
> said AC1 for the gen would be an option, though be sure to never use the 
> "sell" mode.  I found Tekris through a search, but did not contact them.  
> It's good to see there are also other options to repair these inverters 
> (thanks Mac).
>  
> Phil, I'm also thinking it may be that extra "kick" of something like 
> the conventional frig (with the other loads running, batts charging, pump 
> running) in the house that produces the out-of-spec condition, bumping the 
> inverter out of the picture.  It's wait and see right now with my new batt 
> charge and AC2
>  amps settings and how they affect the SW staying online.  So far so good.  
> I'll have to look into the picoscope.
>  
> Thanks again to all for so much help. This list rocks.
>  
> Bill
> Feather River Solar Electric
> 4291 Nelson St.
> Taylorsville, CA  95983
> 530-284-7849/6544 fax
> solar powered since 1982
>
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[RE-wrenches] Decentralized power

[Philip]

Just wanted to share with the list one of the better mainstream articles on RE 
that I've seen in a while. For me it really captures a new way of thinking 
about the true meaning of independence, autonomy, responsibility and community. 

http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/04/what-we-talk-about-when-we-talk-about-the-decentralization-of-energy/255873/

This is a great list,

Phil
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