[RE-wrenches] Defective modules

2013-06-01 Thread Marco Mangelsdorf 
What we know for sure: cSi mods have stood up through the test of time since
Bell Labs cranked out the first modern-day cells in 1954. Over ½ century
worth of data and real-world experience with the technology.

 

What we don’t know for sure: how long cadmium telluride and other non-cSi
will hold up over time.  It’s a huge experiment that’s playing out before
our eyes now and in the years to come for the thin films.

 

marco

 

From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Carl Emerson
Sent: Saturday, June 01, 2013 3:21 PM
To: 'RE-wrenches'
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Defective modules

 

Hi there,

 

Thin film is still getting bad press after early production suffered
degradation issues way back in the 90’s.

 

There is plenty of evidence that thin film produces at least 10% more energy
because it performs better at temperature and responds better to global
irradiance.

 

Some brands may be problematic today but this is equally true of crystalline
modules.

 

Sure the efficiency is down and more area is needed for the same rated power
but some brands are delivering 20% more energy in some climates.

 

As for degradation, I have seen crystalline BP’s with every panel turning
brown and clapping out after just 12 years in the pacific Islands.

 

So let’s be Brand specific and not lump all thin film together and tar it
with the same brush, based on early failures 30 years ago. 

 

Current issues backed up with hard data would be very useful…

 

Regards
Carl Emerson

 

 

First Solar's thin film is definitely part of the industry's early onset
under performance problem.
With monocrystalline under $1/watt, I just don't understand why big projects
are still going forward with thin film.  
I would only use thin film for partial shading, or curved, odd shaped
surfaces.  (RV roofs, not MW plants)
The bean counters are putting too much faith in warranties and spread
sheets, instead of looking at real life long term performance history.  PV's
been around now for several decades; there's just no excuse to keep
repeating the same mistakes over again.



R.Ray Walters

On 5/31/2013 1:02 AM, Brian Teitelbaum wrote:

I don’t know for sure, but the S. California installation in the article is
likely a large Unisolar installation down there.

 

However, since the article talks about Chinese modules, which are mostly
crystalline, I don’t think thin film is the major problem, if there really
is one.

 

Not mentioned in the article is the possibility for micro-fracturing of the
cells being a major problem, especially since they are sliced so thin these
days, and generally shipped lying flat, which must cause a lot of flexing
during transport.

 

Brian Teitelbaum

AEE Solar

 

From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Carl Emerson
Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2013 2:50 PM
To: 'RE-wrenches'
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Defective modules

 

Hi there,

 

Hilton’s third question is important.

 

Are we seeing a rise in thin film failure or is this only mono and poly?

 

Regards
Carl Emerson

 


  _  


From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Hilton Dier
III
Sent: 30 May 2013 1:09 a.m.
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Defective modules

 

Greetings wrenches,

I'm sure many of you have seen this article in the New York Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/29/business/energy-environment/solar-powers-d
ark-side.html?hp
 &_r=1&

I have already gotten an email from a panicked client asking about canceling
his project.

First question: Has anybody dealt with defective modules lately, and if so,
what brands?
Second question: How much does this affect first-tier manufacturers (Trina,
Suntech, Yingli...) and how much of this is "no-name" brands?
Third question: Is this restricted to a particular technology such as thin
film?

And the big question: How do we deal with this? I can imagine the fossil
fuel and nuclear industries promoting this story with enthusiasm.

Thanks,

Hilton

-- 
Hilton Dier III
Renewable Energy Design
Partner, Solar Gain LLC
453 East Hill Rd.
Middlesex, VT 05602







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Defective modules

2013-06-01 Thread Carl Emerson 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Defective modules

2013-06-01 Thread Carl Emerson 
Hi there,

 

Thin film is still getting bad press after early production suffered
degradation issues way back in the 90's.

 

There is plenty of evidence that thin film produces at least 10% more energy
because it performs better at temperature and responds better to global
irradiance.

 

Some brands may be problematic today but this is equally true of crystalline
modules.

 

Sure the efficiency is down and more area is needed for the same rated power
but some brands are delivering 20% more energy in some climates.

 

As for degradation, I have seen crystalline BP's with every panel turning
brown and clapping out after just 12 years in the pacific Islands.

 

So let's be Brand specific and not lump all thin film together and tar it
with the same brush, based on early failures 30 years ago. 

 

There are plenty of thin film Megawatt installations in Europe.

 

Current issues backed up with hard data would be very useful.

 

Regards
Carl Emerson

 

 

First Solar's thin film is definitely part of the industry's early onset
under performance problem.
With monocrystalline under $1/watt, I just don't understand why big projects
are still going forward with thin film.  
I would only use thin film for partial shading, or curved, odd shaped
surfaces.  (RV roofs, not MW plants)
The bean counters are putting too much faith in warranties and spread
sheets, instead of looking at real life long term performance history.  PV's
been around now for several decades; there's just no excuse to keep
repeating the same mistakes over again.



R.Ray Walters

On 5/31/2013 1:02 AM, Brian Teitelbaum wrote:

I don't know for sure, but the S. California installation in the article is
likely a large Unisolar installation down there.

 

However, since the article talks about Chinese modules, which are mostly
crystalline, I don't think thin film is the major problem, if there really
is one.

 

Not mentioned in the article is the possibility for micro-fracturing of the
cells being a major problem, especially since they are sliced so thin these
days, and generally shipped lying flat, which must cause a lot of flexing
during transport.

 

Brian Teitelbaum

AEE Solar

 

From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Carl Emerson
Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2013 2:50 PM
To: 'RE-wrenches'
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Defective modules

 

Hi there,

 

Hilton's third question is important.

 

Are we seeing a rise in thin film failure or is this only mono and poly?

 

Regards
Carl Emerson

 


  _  


From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Hilton Dier
III
Sent: 30 May 2013 1:09 a.m.
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Defective modules

 

Greetings wrenches,

I'm sure many of you have seen this article in the New York Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/29/business/energy-environment/solar-powers-d
ark-side.html?hp
 &_r=1&

I have already gotten an email from a panicked client asking about canceling
his project.

First question: Has anybody dealt with defective modules lately, and if so,
what brands?
Second question: How much does this affect first-tier manufacturers (Trina,
Suntech, Yingli...) and how much of this is "no-name" brands?
Third question: Is this restricted to a particular technology such as thin
film?

And the big question: How do we deal with this? I can imagine the fossil
fuel and nuclear industries promoting this story with enthusiasm.

Thanks,

Hilton

-- 
Hilton Dier III
Renewable Energy Design
Partner, Solar Gain LLC
453 East Hill Rd.
Middlesex, VT 05602








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[RE-wrenches] Monitoring - The Dilemma

2013-06-01 Thread August Goers 
Hi Wrenches,

As we're building up a larger and larger grid tied PV installation
portfolio we're also building up hundreds of monitoring systems. We have
monitoring systems from SunPower, SMA, Enphase, Power-one, Locus Energy,
SunRun, and several others. We also have monitored SHW systems.

I'm finding that except for the occasional inverter failure, our systems
are running well but we have frequent monitoring issues. Most often the
monitoring system has become disconnected from the internet for some
reason. Other times the monitoring system has lost signal strength which
is common with Enphase (it may have been weak to begin with). Other times
the monitoring systems have failed. And occasionally there is actually a
production problem which really needs to be addressed.

I'm a firm believer that monitoring empowers our clients and us to better
understand how their systems are operating. However, the burden of keeping
all these systems running is starting to have a significant cost on our
business. It is easiest to solve problems when we have a motivated client
who can help troubleshoot remotely on the phone. But other clients really
just don't seem to care. For example, I spent a couple hours a while back
troubleshooting a system and it turned out that our client's grandson had
disconnected the data logger to plug in his X Box. Many people are totally
clueless about internet issues. Internet service providers and routers are
also likely to change throughout the years causing even more connection
issues.

SunRun's system is good because it uses cell technology to completely
bypass the client's internet system. However, these don't always run
smoothly either and cell reception can be a problem.

How are other Wrenches dealing with ongoing customer service and
expectations for their monitoring systems? Any ideas out there on how to
put more responsibility on the client while still keeping them happy?

Thanks in advance,

August


August Goers
Luminalt Energy Corporation
o: 415.641.4000
m: 415.559.1525
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Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack

2013-06-01 Thread Max Balchowsky 
Have installed last three systems (35Kw)with snap n rack.
love it
 
Max Balchowsky
Design Engineer
SEE Systems
1048 Irvine Ave Suite 217
Newport Beach, Ca. 92660
760-403-6810
"Building a Better Future For The Next Generation"




 From: Solarguy 
To: 'RE-wrenches'  
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 10:11 PM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
 


The only complaint with the Snapnrack rails is the thin wall can easily be 
distorted. This will allow the nut to drop out of its groove. Love the 
universal end clamps but have learned to assemble every one to check for proper 
fit before getting on the roof.
Jim Duncan
-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 7:32 PM
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] SnapNrack
 
Hello Wrenches,
 
How would you rate the SnapNrack mounting systems against Unirac and other 
mounting systems?
 
Thanks,
 
Drake
 
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