Re: [RE-wrenches] solar roof lift experience?

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi All,

After many years of installing on steep roofs  (most New England 
roofs are 10/12 or 12/12 pitch) with various approaches including 
harnesses, pulleys, lifts, Lulls, staging, etc.,  we finally realized 
that it is so much easier on residential installs to just erect 
scaffolding for all our jobs.


By installing regular construction scaffolding on the South Side we 
accomplish many things:


1)  With rails it meets Osha fall protection requirements
2)  We attach a rope and pulley to the scaffolding to lift modules. 
Super easy and safe.
3)  Our electrician and construction supervisor love it for going up 
and doing final connections, check polarity etc.
4)  Even with the extra 2.5 hour set up and another 2.5 hour 
breakdown time and the $200/month rental we figure we save alot of 
money on each job.  It makes everything on the roof go much smoother 
- it prevents roof crew burnout and it's much safer.   You can do 
rail assembly and other pre-roof assembly on the scaffolding.  Tool 
boxes are brought up for the duration of the job and you save a lot 
of up and down trips.   If you set it up close enough - anything 
dropped lands on the scaffolding. etc. etc. All around it works very 
nicely.


For larger commercial jobs or flat roofs - there's nothing like a 
LULL.  We rent them for around $1200 for 2-3 days.


Hope that helps!

Best,

Jeff C.







Check out: http://www.tranzsporter.com/lh400.html

I've used one of these for about two years now - I think it cost about
$1,400 for the electric motor version 28' tall, 200 lb. capacity. Once
you've done it a few times it takes about 15 minutes to assemble on site.

Kirk Herander
Vermont Solar Engineering
802.863.1202
NABCEP(tm) Certified Solar Installer
NYSERDA-eligible Installer
VT Solar Incentive Program Partner
-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Geoff
Greenfield
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 4:07 PM
To: 'RE Marketing for home scale RE industry'; 'RE-wrenches'
Subject: [RE-wrenches] solar roof lift experience?

Hey gang-  anyone have any success (or horror) stories with regard to
panel lifting equipment?  I have considered a home-brew cart on a ladder,
looked at some products made for comp shingles, and saw some
fancy-schmancy European stuff at the shows.  Just today I was hit with a
marketing email from this company:

Check us out at:   BoeckerUSA.com

Anyone been down this road?

For a brighter energy future,

Geoff Greenfield
President

Third Sun Solar & Wind Power Ltd.
340 West State street, Unit 25
Athens, Ohio 45701
(740) 597-3111   fax: (740)597-1548
www.third-sun.com

Clean Energy - Expertly Installed

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Senior Design Engineer
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http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

Voice: 413-259-3776
Fax: 413-825-0703
65 Schoolhouse Rd
Amherst, MA 01002
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Re: [RE-wrenches] 30 kW Inverters

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi Peter,

I don't have history with the PV Powered's but 
they have a 30 KW I've heard good things about.


A couple of Solectria 15 KWs would make a nice 
balance between "single inverter" and redundancy 
and ease of install.


2 or 3 Fronius IGPlus 12 KWs would also be a good 
solution.  Power One (Aurora) also has a 12.5 KW 
with multiple channel inputs and other nice 
features.  Wall mount advantage here too.


And if wall mount is important you don't need the 
Tower - just mount 4 or 5 Sunny Boy 7KWs above a 
gutter.


Lot's of ways to do it.

Hope that helps!

Best,

Jeff C.





We haven't designed/installed a 30 kW-dc class 
system for some time now (last time we used a 
Xantrex PV 30) and are currently investigating 
what is available in terms of single inverters 
with 240V 3Ph output. Our customer has enough 
roof space to for 58 kWp of modules, but we have 
to split the AC output into two separate 
services. So the first thing I've noticed is 
that there are not many inverters in the 30 kW 
range: Satcon PowerGate 30, Xantrex GT30 and by 
comparison a Sunny Tower with 6ea 6 kW SB 
inverters.


We will be feeding 240 3P so the GT30 and ST will need transformers.

So, I'm inclined to look more carefully into the PowerGate 30, first.

I am looking for some feedback from folks who 
have recently installed 30 kW inverters. If this 
is contained in an archived thread, please 
direct me appropriately.


- Peter

Peter T. Parrish, Ph.D., President
California Solar Engineering, Inc.
820 Cynthia Ave., Los Angeles, CA 90065
CA Lic. 854779, NABCEP Cert. 031806-26
peter.parr...@calsolareng.com
Ph 323-258-8883, Mobile 323-839-6108, Fax 
323-258-8885   



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~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

Voice: 413-259-3776
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Efficiency Curves of Fronius Inverters?

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Thanks Mark!

Nice source I wasn't aware of!

jc



Jeff,

Here is what they submitted to the California Energy Commision:

<http://www.gosolarcalifornia.ca.gov/equipment/inverter_tests/summaries/Fronius%20IG%204000.pdf>http://www.gosolarcalifornia.ca.gov/equipment/inverter_tests/summaries/Fronius%20IG%204000.pdf


Mark Frye
Berkeley Solar Electric Systems
303 Redbud Way
Nevada City,  CA 95959
(530) 401-8024
<http://www.berkeleysolar.com/>www.berkeleysolar.com 




From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Jeff 
Clearwater, Village Power Design

Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 3:35 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Efficiency Curves of Fronius Inverters?

Hey Folks,

Anyone have or know where I can get my hands on the efficiency vs. 
wattage curve for the Fronius IG series (the old series - not the 
Plus).


I have a 4000 in stock and wondering if I can apply it to a friend's 
2660 watt system without losing much to efficiency at low power 
levels.


Best,

Jeff



There are numerous options here:  most ground mount manu's offer 
ballasted systems, I would look to them 1st. Other systems I've 
seen or used - 1) Pour a continuous surface "footer" that is large 
enough in size to provide the proper ballast for the uplift in your 
area, pour one along the S. edge/legs and another along the 
back/north legs. 2) Tie all legs together via a horiz. rail at 
least 6' wide and embed this in a rock filled gabion, again of the 
required weight. 3) Limestone is easy to drill, useing a hammer 
drill and extension bit drill 11/16" - 3/4" holes at least 18" into 
the stone at an angle, vary all angles as viewed in plan as they 
relate to the N/S line of the array (not as they relate to level), 
to mitgate pull-out from them all being in a line. i.e. - 1st leg 
hole is 90 degrees to the N/S line, 2nd leg is 180 from this, 3rd 
is 45 and so on, in other words if looking in plan and you could 
see all holes they would radiate around the "face of a clock" with 
each leg hole on a different "hour". Finally, epoxy in 5/8" all 
thread, you can pre-bend the end to come out of the hole verticle 
or use a swivel connector from Uni-strut, B-line or equal.


All of these suggestions should be run by a Structural Engineer 
before embarking, thus the 1st choice of working with a manu.





Good luck!

-jeff o

From the Solar, Wind and Hydro powered office of Jeff 
Oldham/Regenerative SOLutions





<http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2132/fc/BLSrjnsHGiu92lJJqoMGi0uE8kGS8cyBf0zjvb0ir0FblIZfJXPnNi0BtXC/>Protect 
your home before it is too late. Click here for homeowner insurance 
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~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

Voice: 413-259-3776
Fax: 413-825-0703
65 Schoolhouse Rd
Amherst, MA 01002
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~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

Voice: 413-259-3776
Fax: 413-825-0703
65 Schoolhouse Rd
Amherst, MA 01002
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[RE-wrenches] Efficiency Curves of Fronius Inverters?

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hey Folks,

Anyone have or know where I can get my hands on the efficiency vs. 
wattage curve for the Fronius IG series (the old series - not the 
Plus).


I have a 4000 in stock and wondering if I can apply it to a friend's 
2660 watt system without losing much to efficiency at low power 
levels.


Best,

Jeff



There are numerous options here:  most ground mount manu's offer 
ballasted systems, I would look to them 1st. Other systems I've seen 
or used - 1) Pour a continuous surface "footer" that is large enough 
in size to provide the proper ballast for the uplift in your area, 
pour one along the S. edge/legs and another along the back/north 
legs. 2) Tie all legs together via a horiz. rail at least 6' wide 
and embed this in a rock filled gabion, again of the required 
weight. 3) Limestone is easy to drill, useing a hammer drill and 
extension bit drill 11/16" - 3/4" holes at least 18" into the stone 
at an angle, vary all angles as viewed in plan as they relate to the 
N/S line of the array (not as they relate to level), to mitgate 
pull-out from them all being in a line. i.e. - 1st leg hole is 90 
degrees to the N/S line, 2nd leg is 180 from this, 3rd is 45 and so 
on, in other words if looking in plan and you could see all holes 
they would radiate around the "face of a clock" with each leg hole 
on a different "hour". Finally, epoxy in 5/8" all thread, you can 
pre-bend the end to come out of the hole verticle or use a swivel 
connector from Uni-strut, B-line or equal.


All of these suggestions should be run by a Structural Engineer 
before embarking, thus the 1st choice of working with a manu.




Good luck!

-jeff o

From the Solar, Wind and Hydro powered office of Jeff 
Oldham/Regenerative SOLutions





Protect 
your home before it is too late. Click here for homeowner insurance 
information.


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--
~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

Voice: 413-259-3776
Fax: 413-825-0703
65 Schoolhouse Rd
Amherst, MA 01002
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Re: [RE-wrenches] A Wrench's computer

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi All,

I've been into Macs since '84 - we have 6 in the office - my 17" 
MacBook Pro is the second brain to my business.


Ease of use - rock solid OS - rock solid hardware -  elegant 
interface - VMWare Fusion makes it both a Mac and fast full fledged 
PC - best of both worlds.  .mac can provide some great syncing 
features for a multiple person small office - we use ichat for 3 and 
4 way video conferences which Skype can't do.


Always been the way to go in my book.

Best,

Jeff C.
Village Power Design

Mac for certain - 25 years of owning a Mac and over 10 with a PC at 
work. You'll likely want a vpc program and a wireless keyboard and 
two button mouse for desk work. Don't buy the bottom of the line nor 
the top- you will like I think.


Ezra Auerbach



On 10-Apr-09, at 10:56 AM, Keith Cronin 
<electrich...@yahoo.com> wrote:


I also segued to a mac last fall and installed VMWare to bridge the 
PC experience. Overall, I would recommend the transition.
There is also incentive, if you live in a metro area- to get 
training at the Apple store- it is $100 for the year and if you can 
carve out time, you can take 1 lesson a week on a host of topics to 
get up to speed rather quickly.


I believe in the next 5 years, we will be agnostic on platforms, 
and we will be primarily web based, as we want everything on the 
go. It (wireless) will be inexpensive and ubiquitous in larger 
populaces and my vision for larger mesh networks will cover all of 
us to connect more readily. It is amazing, Get Smart's shoe phone 
to where we are today is extraordinary and the innovation will only 
accelerate..


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cL9Wu2kWwSY

Back to the mac- very robust machine architecture and relatively 
simple to use and setup anything from wireless networking to 
installing a printer. Their time machine feature also deserves 
mentioning- it does incremental backups- meaning, it will take, 
like a video of your activities and save the activities as they 
occur. So, if you are working on a proposal, and doing alot of 
revisions, it will archive them on a time line. If you ever wonder 
what you where working on, lets say Monday, you can go back in 
time, and find it. Very slick, as PC's, I believe, don't have this 
functionality to date.


Lastly, on the backup and if you still have a PC- I would highly 
suggest subscribing to <>www.mozy.com for your laptop and office 
server. Same theorem as above- incremental backups, when you are 
not working on your machine- to the web. I did this a few months 
ago- have almost 100GB of data archived there. Did take alot of 
time (weeks) to upload, but it is all there, in a directory to grab 
anything when I need it. Lets face it, when we do backups, like at 
the office, we take either some DVD's or a hard drive, back and 
forth every week. This eliminates this completely. Also, I found a 
coupon code for their service- type in the word NEXT into the box 
before you subscribe and it is $46 a year to back up everything for 
one machine. The office/server flavored subscription is alot more, 
but this also frees up your time to focus on your business.


Another great wrench tool list addition!



From: Kurt Albershardt <i...@es-ee.com>
To: RE-wrenches 
<re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>

Sent: Friday, April 10, 2009 7:19:16 AM
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] A Wrench's computer

As yet another long-time PC veteran (after IBM SNA and PDP-11s) 
with way too much Windows internals experience, I also just 
purchased my first Mac.  Installed Parallels to support Quickbooks 
(still no integrated payroll on their Mac version.)


I have a maxed-out MacBook Pro as a desktop replacement but I will 
say that the integrated graphics (9400M) is quite adequate even for 
large SketchUp models - so the plain MacBook looks like a heckuva 
deal given its monoblock case design and low price.  The MagSafe 
power connector is pure genius.


If you click on the new trackpads with two fingers, you get the 
right-click context menu all us Windows power users miss.  The 
other shortcut it took me awhile to find was  + <~> which 
is equivalent to  +  in Windows (move to next window in a 
multiple document interface.)






On 4/10/09 9:56 AM, Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar wrote:

 Joel,
 After 28 years of business computing dating from my George Morrow 
CPM machine, I purchased my first Mac, a MackBook Pro, 2.4GHz. 
After 6 months, I have very mixed feelings about it. I love the 
battery life and simplicity of features and included programs. 
Although I am still in a steep learning curve, there are many 
things that frustrate me daily. NO right click button means you 
need to plug in a mouse so you can use the many options accessible 
by a right click. I have my old Sharp laptop PC on the other desk 
and find that I often scoot my roll

Re: [RE-wrenches] Trace SW Stacking Cable?

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi William and All,

Thanks to all for the offers and clarifications.  I may have located 
a cable locally and if not will probably make one up per William's 
and Phil's instructions.


And as William and others have said  - do not use anything as an SWI 
cable unless you know it's an original SWI cable or have made up the 
cable yourself according to the original SW pin out diagrams.


Thanks again for all the support.

Best,

Jeff




Carl:

I have checked with Xantrex.  I would not make a declaration on the 
Wrenches forum to my esteemed colleagues unless I was quite certain. 
Find the "SWI Stacking Cable wiring diagram" on our web site at: 
http://millersolar.com/resources/resources.html under 
"Manufacturer's data".  This diagram came directly from a Xantrex 
engineer.  I have no reason to doubt it's authenticity. This is not 
the pin out for a "standard" DB25 cable.  Not also the link just 
below it for "Not an SWI cable"  This is your "standard" cable.  I 
fished this out of my attic this evening and scanned it still in the 
package.  Note it is listed as a "straight through" cable.  This 
means pin 1 connects to pin 1, pin 2 to pin 2, etc.  This is not the 
same wiring as depicted in the SWI stacking cable diagram.


I believe you have suggested twice that solar installers grab the 
nearest "standard" DB25 cable and give it a try.  I feel compelled 
to correct the record publicly.  These are not the same cables and 
unspecified damage could occur.  I know I once shorted out a sync 
cable for Heart Interface inverters and blew two of them up 
catastrophically two days before Christmas.  It was a very 
unpleasant surprise for the client (who had guests coming) and for 
my self.  These cables are a direct link to the FET control circuits 
and need to be treated with the utmost caution.


I don't know what would happen to two SW inverters if connected with 
your straight through cable, but I recommend strongly against trying 
it.  Please do not recommend practices unless you are quite certain 
they will cause no harm.



Respectfully,

William Miller

PS:  Printer cables were never DB25-DB25.  They were DB25 to Centronics.

Wm





At 10:01 AM 3/31/2009, you wrote:


William,

  I used an off the shelf cable to use with the SW and PS remote, 
it was a double male ended  25 pin cable. They were formally used 
as printer/computer cables. I believe the stacking cable is the 
same style. You could check with Xantrex.


  Carl Hansen



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--
~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

Voice: 413-259-3750
Fax: 413-825-0703
65 Schoolhouse Rd
Amherst, MA 01002
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[RE-wrenches] Trace SW Stacking Cable?

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi All,

I need to track down a '98 vintage Trace SW stacking cable.  Anyone 
have or know where I might find one?


Thanks,

Jeff C.
--
~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

Voice: 413-259-3750
Fax: 413-825-0703
65 Schoolhouse Rd
Amherst, MA 01002
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Re: [RE-wrenches] NABCEP

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi Folks,

Please note that Michael asked us to give our vote offlist to him 
directly.  I will vote there.


Thanks!

Jeff C.



Thanks Michael for bringing this up.

I vote YES. Allow the ED of NABCEP being allowed on the list, until and
unless NABCEP gets a dedicated Wrench-head employee that can speak to the
sort of issues we come up with here. No holds barred. Same basic rules as
Manus. No marketing, no bashing others, stick to your corner, protect
yourself at all times, only one rep on the list. Michael is the referee and
you must obey his commands at all times.

The learning will go both ways. I see it as "tech support" and "field
feedback" for our industry credential. This differs GREATLY from allowing a
building inspector or fire fighter or other government dude. I think we all
want that credential to mean something, have value, and continue to improve.
As NABCEP grows, more and more credentials are being added. What used to be
the original "PV Practitioner" is now "PV Installer". There are "new"
credentials now and coming up... Entry Level PV, Thermal, Wind... Pretty
much covers what RE-Wrenches is about.

In a perfect world, I'm in favor of questions or concerns about NABCEP being
sent directly to NABCEP and having them post the questions & answers on an
FAQ or info page. That's not gonna happen and most everybody wouldn't read
them all anyway. This effectively means that there is a failure to share the
information with 265 (or so) other Wrenches who just happen to have a stake
in it, too. Whether or not they are "certified".

How many questions have been sent directly to NABCEP by Wrenches that are
identical to the one somebody already asked? Or how many aren't asked that
should be? Will asking and responding onlist prevent duplication and
minimize needless concerns? I believe so. Will valid concerns be voiced and
responded too for the benefit of all? I expect they will be. Should we be
sending questions about "price" on the list? No. NABCEP needs to maintain
clarity and deal with that internally.

I sincerely doubt that Rebecca or any future ED of NABCEP will spend a lot
of time monitoring the list and responding to stuff that doesn't apply
directly to NABCEP as an organization. Here, I'll prove it: Hey, Rebecca.
What do you think about 2008 NEC Article 230 and how it applies to PV
interconnections? (If she answers that one, I want to change my vote to NO)

We all know there have been many NABCEP conversations on this list over the
years. These have ranged from speculation to attaboys and complaints to
defense of the organization. In the past, some of the NABCEPers have been so
good as to forward Wrench conversations to the ED and have been allowed to
post the response. I believe that the responses have been helpful and
appropriate every time that I remember. Why should the 3rd party have to do
this? Why can't it be straight to the horse and straight back from the
horse's mouth?

Frankly, I don't believe that Ezra or the other board members should be
expected or required to answer on behalf of the organization or to forward a
conversation and wait for a reply. I sit on a tech committee with a couple
other Wrenches, and I ain't about to speak on behalf of the organization.

NABCEP is of, to, by, and for Wrenches. Always has been. Let's keep it that
way.

$0.020001,

Matt Lafferty
gilliga...@gmail.com

-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Michael
Welch
Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 10:16 AM
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] NABCEP

Hello Wrenches. As always, please contact me off list about this subject if
you would like to weigh in.

This is your list, and I run it by a consensus of your wishes. If any
changes are to be made, I have tried to at least come close to a consensus
among the Wrenches (not manufacturer reps) on the list. We now have a
proposed change in policy before us.

I am being placed under pressure by Ezra Auerbach to add an otherwise
nonqualified NABCEP staff person, Rebecca Eaton, to the Wrench list so she
may respond on behalf of NABCEP if Wrenches are discussing anything to do
with the org.

First, I often receive membership requests from nonqualified individuals.
Unless they are technically proficient, they are respectfully turned down,
and have included (among others): the general public, casual installers,
academics, trade organization staff, union staff, and now NABCEP staff. I
think you have clearly and appropriately drawn the line that we want pros on
this list in order to keep the discussion quality high.

Second, the only exceptions to this have been "technically proficient"
representatives of the companies that manufacture the equipment that you
Wrenches install -- and some time ago, we reached consensus to allow any
fully NABCEP-certified individual, working pro or not. Ezra believes that
the manufacturers' privilege should be extended

Re: [RE-wrenches] Favorite Flat Roof Mounting System?

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi All,

We use ProSolar and UniRac but like the ProSolar better for most 
residential installs.  Clips are much easier to install and more 
secure.  Less Aluminum and hence much cheaper and easier to handle. 
Disadvantage with ProSolar is you have to drill holes for mounting 
bolts but then again that allows you to choose side or bottom 
mounting.  And they are not much for engineering documentation.


AEE's new rail system has many of the advantages of both - I haven't 
priced it yet though.


Still waiting for a racking company to include a wire race or built 
in bundling!


Jeff Clearwater
Village Power Design




Unirac uses T bolts and is easily assembled.

Jason Lombard
CSBA
Open Hand Solar
505 795 8646


On Jan 21, 2009, at 7:14 PM, Carl Adams 
<<mailto:swingjun...@gmail.com>swingjun...@gmail.com> wrote:



Jason,

I agree the DP&W racking is very sturdy.  My wish list for the CRS 
system is for some T-bolts for the slots rather than sliding in 
bolts from the end of the track.


The Schuco Roof mount is nicely engineered.  The rear stanchions 
are a bit time consuming to assemble but very versatile.Integrated 
roof pads would be nice, and specs for the ballast rails.


My wish list in general is for some good online calculators which 
allow you to select the module, tilt angle, and let you specify the 
array size (kw) or geometry ( L x W) and then provide you a layout 
drawing, and BOM.


Any other comments from the wrenches out there?  I know you guys 
have covered acres of flat rooftop with PV at this point.


Thanks
Carl

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 8:30 PM, Ohs <<>openhandso...@gmail.com> wrote:

I second the DPW tilt rack. Versatile an I felt like it was sturdy.

Jason Lombard
CSBA
Open Hand Solar
505 795 8646



On Jan 19, 2009, at 4:57 PM, "Carl Adams" <<>swingjun...@gmail.com> wrote:

I have some experience with DP&W and UniRac Flat Roof mounting 
systems.  I'd be interested to here what your most and least 
favorite systems are and why.


Thanks
Carl

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Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
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goso...@villagepower.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Feedback on Sunny Web Box and Sunny Portal

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi John,

We've installed several systems with the Webbox as the primary DAS. 
Works like a charm - customer's like them cause they can program 
their own website pages.  We like them cause they send us an email 
each night on system performance and monthly summaries (or whatever 
else you program).  You can make the pages public or private.


Go to http://www.sunnyportal.com

and click on "Publically available plants"

you can see ongoing data from a 30.2 KW system we did at the Food 
Bank of Western MA (zip 01038).  There's 512 US plants available and 
thousands worldwide.


Easy to install - just need a card - make up a cable  and plug into 
an ethernet line or dedicated modem.


Hope that helps - hope you are staying warm up there!

Best,

Jeff Clearwater
Village Power Design





Wrenches,
   I am looking into using the Sunny Web Box and Sunny Portal on 
some new installations and possibly adding to some older ones.  What 
experiences have you had with this system?  We are being asked by a 
large potential customer for our experience with the data system we 
are quoting.  One of my employees has taken an SMA Course and has 
some hands on with the system but we would like some field input. We 
will have students and other folks watching as we hook this up at 
one of our sites.




John Blittersdorf

Central Vermont Solar & Wind, LLC
104 River Street
Rutland, VT

802-770-8625

30 years living off-grid



Which stars will make the biggest headlines in 2009? 
<http://toolbar.aol.com/popeater/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown0025>Get 
Hollywood predictions, celebrity holiday photos and more with the 
PopEater Toolbar.


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Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
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Re: [RE-wrenches] fire safety vs. fire hysteria?

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Nicely done Bill and Matt P !

Hopefully that'll set a good precedent for future discussions and 
guidelines on this!


Jeff





William and all,

I notified a friend of mine in the fire service about this, and he has
followed up with the website to have the article removed. Here is the thread
with me and the website:


Note to me:

This article is exactly the same as one I received from a young firefighter
from Orange County, CA a few months ago.  I made numerous comments on it,
and sent him our video.  Curiously, I just emailed him yesterday inquiring
as to the status of his interest in publishing an 
article, and heard back that he had not taken any action on it.   It 
appears the original "Author" got this posted.  I will attempt to have this

article removed from this site, for correction.

FE Matthew Paiss, T13B
San Jose Fire Department
San Jose, CA


Note from Matt to website administrator:

Billy,

By way of introduction, my name is Matt Paiss.  I am a Fire Engineer for the
San Jose Fire Department.  Additionally, I am a subject matter expert in the
area of Solar Photovoltaic (PV) Firefighter Safety, have a degree in Solar
Technology, and  am a member of the State Fire Marshals Office PV Task Force
which is tasked with creating guidelines for the safe installation of said
systems.  I also teach classes on PV Safety for Firefighters.

I was sent this article (below) to review a few months ago.
http://firefighterclosecalls.com/fullstory.php?77468

It is riddled with incorrect statements and does a disservice to the fire
service in the fact that it presents us as ignorant to the science and
realities of Solar Photovoltaic systems.  I sent the "Author" a redlined
commentary and suggested that he take some time to gather factual background
info prior to attempting to publish.

My request is that you remove it, and refer the author to me to help correct
his info.  I believe that there is information that FF's need to know about
these systems, but this is NOT it.  Let's get it right.

Best Regards,

FE Matthew Paiss, T13B
San Jose Fire Department
San Jose, CA



Note from administrator to Matt:

Thanks Matt! Please send me what should be posted and we will not only
remove it-but will also send it out on The Secret List with your name and
any other affiliate org that can substantiate the facts. A simple (FF
readable-you know what I mean) document would be great.
Thanks!
Billy


Final message from Matt to administrator:

Will do Chief!
As the info is incorrect in so many areas, would you please consider
removing it now?  It does reflect poorly on both firefighterclosecalls.com
AND the fire service in general.  I was actually sent the link by a friend
who works for the DOE, and asked if I could help.  I will get you a more
accurate article within a week, if you could grant me that time.  I promise
it will be FF-friendly!!  I am preparing for 3 classes and am a bit swamped.

FE Matthew Paiss, T13B
San Jose Fire Department
San Jose, CA



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http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Solyndra solar panels

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi All,

Their website video and literature claims they don't need any 
tie-downs or ballast.  That I'd like to believe!  Hard to imagine 
that'll fly. (or more like I can imagine them flying off the roof!)


Jeff



They are new and cylindrical.

Bill.

-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Bob Clark
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 6:31 AM
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Solyndra solar panels

WRENCHES:

Does anyone know anything about Solyndra solar panels
(http://www.solyndra.com/Products/More-Electricity)?

Bob Clark

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http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design/NorthEast Solar Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
goso...@villagepower.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] SS zip ties

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi Bill and all,

I've been searching for an alternative to plastic wire ties for some 
time as I'm not sure they are going to hold up over the system life 
of 20-30+ years and it'll be an ugly site to have all those wires 
drop onto the roof.


But for a flush rooftop array, an assumption to replace broken ones 
with an O&M plan as Bill suggests is prohibitive unless you want to 
pull modules and rewire all over again.  Way too much labor.


At first I was glad to see the SS ties too - but they just don't work 
that well and I too worry about the sharp edges with all the 
contraction and expansion that goes on in an aluminum based racking 
system.


On many commercial jobs we've used our own home made wire loom by 
splitting liquidtight non-metallic on a table saw.  We then use a 
self tapper and washer to screw through the back of the inside of the 
split LT to the array frame and then use one-hole straps to hold the 
wire from coming out of the slot where we want to.  I shared this 
method way back on this list and at 
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~clrwater  It's code since it's outdoor 
rated wire anyway.


I sometimes even run the LT home to a LT fitting after stopping the 
split (after providing a drain loop/low spot).  Not exactly covered 
by the code but I see no inherent violation.


I'm glad to see UniRac coming out with a zip bundle that slides into 
their rail slot  but that does only some of the job as there are many 
places we need to attach that are not directly along their rails.


I've told the folks at UniRac, DP&W, ProSolar, AEE etc. that the 
first racking company that comes out with an integrated loom or wire 
handling system will rule.  That was 2 years ago.


Still waiting!

Thanks,

Jeff Clearwater
NorthEast Solar/Village Power Design





Folks,

I'm a bit sour on SS ties. These are easy to overtighten and have caused
numerous ground faults in the field. My recommendation is to use
UV-resistant black wire ties and install 2-3 times as many as necessary.
Sure some will fail over time, but we are much less likely to have ground
faults, and proper O&M says that we maintain the wire supports over time and
replace broken ties as need. Proper tension is a must and people have to be
shown how to do it properly and checked up on in the field to make sure they
are not getting them too tight.

Bill.

-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of William
Miller
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 9:52 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SS zip ties

Kent:

To tighten:  1. Pull tie snug by hand.  2. Cut tail about 20 mm from
clasp.  3. Roll tail with needle-nose pliers, like a sardine can lid.  This
tightens tie and hides sharp end.

See
http://mpandc.com/practices/Technical_Procedures/PV_wiring/PV_wiring.html
for photos.

Do not over-tighten to avoid wire damage.

William


At 09:25 PM 12/10/2008, you wrote:

Fastenal has stainless ties is various lengths

http://www.fastenal.com/web/products/detail.ex?sku=0710242

For those that haven't used these before, beware that it is difficult to
tighten them.

Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar



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Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
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Re: [RE-wrenches] grid-tie inverters & generators

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi Folks,

We burnt up a gen set's voltage regulator on an off-grid system sunny 
island/sunny boy system when we took the sunny island's off-line but 
didn't shut off the sunny boy.  So the SB backfed the genny and fried 
the very expensive voltage regulator on a 30 KW system.  SMA had us 
install a relay to tell the SB to shut down as soon as the AC 
reference from the SI was gone.  Same situation as grid-tie really in 
terms of your question.


Jeff




Hi Kelly

It is an interesting issue and was just dicussing this the other day.

I think what happens if the inverter backfeeds the genny, the 
generator voltage will go up, if it goes up enough, it will go 
outside the window of the inverter and the inverter will drop out, 
voltage will them return to normal, inverter will reconnect and 
repeat.


But I sure wouldn't want to fix the generator.  A relay powered from 
the grid will take care of the problem.


jay

peltz power
On Nov 19, 2008, at 5:24 PM, Kelly Keilwitz, Whidbey Sun & Wind wrote:


Wrenches,
I'm dredging up this subject again (previous postings 6/08) with a 
simple question that doesn't seem to have been answered:


Is there any issue connecting a batteryless grid-tie PV system to 
the load side of a panel that is backed-up by a generator on an 
automatic transfer switch, when the grid is down and the generator 
running?


In this case the PV is 5.7kW, the inverter an SMA 6000, the 
generator unknown size/type, but propane, automatic start, and 
backing up the entire main panel.


SMA tech support first said it's OK, then that the generator will 
blow up. I can imagine, if the inverter tries to sync with the 
inverter, that the voltage could rise, causing the inverter to 
disconnect, wait 5 minutes, repeat. Is there anything nasty that 
could happen?


Thanks,
-Kelly


Kelly Keilwitz, P.E.
Whidbey Sun & Wind, LLC
Renewable Energy Systems
NABCEP Certified PV Installer
987 Wanamaker Rd,
Coupeville, WA 98239
PH & FAX 360-678-7131
<>[EMAIL PROTECTED]





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Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Need help to get power torque wrench

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hey Darryl,

I agree with Jason.  We've done some commercial S5 systems and we 
pre-tighten with a cordless driver and then two guys follow with a 
couple of manual torque wrenches  - it takes but a few seconds to 
turn the final 1/2 turn to the right torque - felt and confirmed by 
human feel and eyes.  We used digital beeping torque wrenches for a 
while but they would eventually fail.  Our tool of choice now is a 
1/4" drive hand held good - ole "click" type torque wrench.  Worth 
the very little bit of extra time in my book to know it's done right.


Jeff Clearwater
NorthEast Solar/Village Power Design







Hello Darryl,
I am a big fan of manually tightening all bolts and panel clips on 
any array. I have done this on a MW tracker and racking systems on 
schools, which were checked by a special inspector who required them 
to be hand torqued and yes it's a lot, but in many peoples minds 
hand tightened is worth it. I do know folks who use a cordless drill 
and turn the setting down so as not to strip bolts and then go 
through and torque by hand.


Mostly this is a personnel opinion on the process and wanted to 
relay my experiences.



On Tue, Nov 11, 2008 at 6:04 PM, Darryl Thayer 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


Hi all, I need advice
I am soon starting a 1000 module system, uning top down mounts, What 
power tools will tighten to torque specification?  I will want to 
tighten each SS 1/4" nut on bolt to proper specs.  This is about 
2000 bolts, so i want a power tool, either air or battery electric, 
or electric that will tighten to specification.


Thanks Darryl



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Jason Lombard
Open Hand Solar LLC.
HC74 Box13
Pecos, NM. 87552
505 795 8646

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Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
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Village Power Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Pt valves as overheat control

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hey Folks,

When I installed SS heat exchangers in wood stoves a while back, I 
always made sure to have 2 PT valves in the system for redundancy in 
case one stuck or underperformed.  Steam explosions are simply no fun.


We'd locate one right on the woodstove outlet and another at the 
first bend of that same output.  Sometimes there would even be a 
third one on the tank as well.


Jeff C.


Sure, but the discussion was about preventing hot water storage 
tanks from exploding. Putting BTUs into a tank, whether that  be 
from a wood stove loop or 5 kW electric heating element is not the 
issue. Relying on a P/T valve to regulate overheating is of course 
not a good idea, but it will prevent the tank from exploding.


Todd



Conrad Geyser wrote:


Todd Cory

Todd,



I'm afraid that any PT valves that I've ever known have continued 
to weep indefinitely after one or two overheat triggers. 


I would not recommend relying on them for heat control devices.



Conrad

Cotuit Solar

NABCEP thermal cert.




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~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
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http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Micro Hydro MPPT

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi Carl,

Depends on what kind of microhydro output you are talking.

We have installed two systems now with a HiPower 3-phase inductive 
Alt output voltage clamped and rectified straight into a SMA standard 
SunnyBoy (with blessings from SMA).  As long as you don't go over 600 
VDC the warranty applies and the MPPT locks in nicely.


I don't have experience with going direct DC like from a PM motor 
though - probably would work but maybe others have some experience 
with this?


Best,

Jeff






Hullo again,

Can someone comment on the use of SMA Windyboy with microhydro.

I understand that the Windyboy MPPT table is specific to a Wind Turbine.

Does this matter? Is the MPPT table critical in the case of a hydro 
with little variation of output ??


Thanks for your help.

Carl Emerson
Free Power
Auckland NZ

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~
Jeff Clearwater
Senior Design Engineer
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer
http://www.nabcep.org/
Village Power Design
Turnkey Solar Design & Installation for the Commercial Sector
http://www.villagepower.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Imbalanced Legs in 3-Phase systems

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi Bill and all,

Thanks for the great input.  That was my sense but it's nice to get 
confirmation!


I imagine that determining imbalanced phases is more a matter of 
analyzing what loads are on what phases over time with a a peak 
current (or low voltage) recorder -  rather than one spot measurement.


Best,

Jeff





Jeff and Ryan,

The 6kVA value comes from the California Rule 21 that I worked on. It only
applies to split-phase 240V systems (6kVA on 120V). There is no specific
limit for imbalance on a 3-phase service.

A basic rule for single phase generation on a 3=phase service is to rotate
among the phases in a balanced manner. This means the largest imbalance
possible right now is 7kVA because of the SMA SB7000US. There is a
single-phase SatCon that is 30kVA, but it would be silly to buy a
single-phase Satcon when the major on 3-phase units.

The best way to place the imbalanced single-phase generators on the service
is to test the current on all three phases and put the inverter(s) on the
most heavily loaded phase(s). This reduces the site imbalance by reducing
the imbalance on the serving transformer (lowering current on the most
heavily loaded phases). It is common for 3-phase services to have imbalances
of 10 kVA or more, so single-phase inverters can reduce the problem rather
than make it worse.

Make any sense?

Bill.



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ryan
Mayfield
Sent: Friday, August 08, 2008 3:40 PM
To: 'RE-wrenches'
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Imbalanced Legs in 3-Phase systems

Jeff,

My memory also recalls something about a 6kW value.

I've talked to one of our local utilities about this as well and they base
the accepted imbalance by the size of the transformer serving the building.
I have never read their white paper on the subject though. When I described
a similar situation for an install we were working on, the engineer
acknowledged that he would not have any concern with such an arrangement.
You may approach your utility and see if they have a standard protocol you
could follow for your system.

Ryan



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff
Clearwater, Village Power Design
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 10:14 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Imbalanced Legs in 3-Phase systems

Hi Wrenches,

How does one determine how much imbalance can be tolerated on a 3 phase
system?

I'd like to feed 2 SMA SB5000s at 277 VAC into a 480 VAC panel
instead of 1 13 KW Solectria at 480VAC as the PV system is only 9500
Watts STC.  The main on the backfed service panel is 600 A.  But I'm
not that sure of the loads as it's new construction and hasn't been
characterized.

What are the appropriate calcs to do here?

Thanks!

Jeff C.
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~~~~~~~~~
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Village Power Design
Sustainable Energy & Water Solutions for Home & Village
http://www.villagepower.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Voice: 413-259-3776
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Jeff Clearwater
Village Power Design
Sustainable Energy & Water Solutions for Home & Village
http://www.villagepower.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer

Voice: 413-259-3776
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[RE-wrenches] Imbalanced Legs in 3-Phase systems

[Jeff Clearwater, Village Power Design]

Hi Wrenches,

How does one determine how much imbalance can be tolerated on a 3 phase system?

I'd like to feed 2 SMA SB5000s at 277 VAC into a 480 VAC panel 
instead of 1 13 KW Solectria at 480VAC as the PV system is only 9500 
Watts STC.  The main on the backfed service panel is 600 A.  But I'm 
not that sure of the loads as it's new construction and hasn't been 
characterized.


What are the appropriate calcs to do here?

Thanks!

Jeff C.
--
~~~~~
Jeff Clearwater
Village Power Design
Sustainable Energy & Water Solutions for Home & Village
http://www.villagepower.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
NABCEP (tm) Certified Solar PV Installer

Voice: 413-259-3776
Fax: 413-825-0703
65 Schoolhouse Rd
Amherst, MA 01002
~`~
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