Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250
I agree that the FW250 has a few shortcomings however it does work out quite well on the AC side. My own system has a FW500 DC and a FW250 on the AC side outputting to the existing service panel. It is a bit crowded in the FW250 especially with the FW-SP-250 (surge protector) however I can honestly say with the pre-made jumpers Outback supplies there were no bloody knuckles involved. Also, as far as I know Outback is now shipping built up FW250 power panels and I believe they've addressed the shunt and negative bus issues. I certainly like the E-Panel but the FW250 does have it's place on certain systems and should remain as a viable option in a designer's bag o' tricks. Nick A Lucchese On Aug 26, 2009, at 6:48 PM, Bruce Geddes wrote: Hello Wrenches, There is a potential customer that purchased some equipment, including a FW250 box, that goes on the end of the VFX inverter. http://www.outbackpower.com/pdf/manuals/900-0060-1_REV_A.pdf I've not installed one of these yet. Looking at the manual, it looks extremely tight, especially on the DC side. Has anyone had experience with these? Is there sufficient wire bending space? Thanks, Drake Chamberlin Athens Electric OH License 44810 CO License 3773 NABCEP TM Certified PV Installer Office - 740-448-7328 Mobile - 740-856-9648___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250
Hi Drake, I did one of these when they first appeared in the spring of 2007, and swore them off. There is inadequate circuit breaker space on the AC DC side especially when you are integrating a GFP, requiring breakers be installed on both sides of the unit, back to back, which really eats into your working room! The lack of positive and negative DC busses and AC in or AC out busses left me using multi hole Polaris Insultaps or tying onto the top of the inverter's DC posts as recommended by OB tech support.. There were other issues too as you mention wire bending space. Go with the MidNite Solar E panel and you'll be fine. Sincerely, Chris Worcester Solar Wind Works NABCEP Certified PV Installer Phone: 530-582-4503 Fax: 530-582-4603 www.solarwindworks.com http://www.solarwindworks.com/ ch...@solarwindworks.com Proven Energy Solutions From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake Chamberlin Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 5:42 AM To: RE-wrenches Subject: [RE-wrenches] FW250 Hello Wrenches, There is a potential customer that purchased some equipment, including a FW250 box, that goes on the end of the VFX inverter. http://www.outbackpower.com/pdf/manuals/900-0060-1_REV_A.pdf I've not installed one of these yet. Looking at the manual, it looks extremely tight, especially on the DC side. Has anyone had experience with these? Is there sufficient wire bending space? Thanks, Drake Chamberlin Athens Electric OH License 44810 CO License 3773 NABCEP TM Certified PV Installer Office - 740-448-7328 Mobile - 740-856-9648 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250
I did one this spring, i do not remember a particular problem, i m going to that site this weekend i will take a look and see if I remember anything. daryl --- On Wed, 8/26/09, Chris Worcester ch...@solarwindworks.com wrote: From: Chris Worcester ch...@solarwindworks.com Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250 To: 'RE-wrenches' re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Date: Wednesday, August 26, 2009, 10:20 AM Hi Drake, I did one of these when they first appeared in the spring of 2007, and swore them off. There is inadequate circuit breaker space on the AC DC side especially when you are integrating a GFP, requiring breakers be installed on both sides of the unit, back to back, which really eats into your working room! The lack of positive and negative DC busses and AC in or AC out busses left me using multi hole Polaris Insultaps or tying onto the top of the inverter’s DC posts as recommended by OB tech support.. There were other issues too as you mention wire bending space. Go with the MidNite Solar E panel and you’ll be fine. Sincerely, Chris Worcester Solar Wind Works NABCEP Certified PV Installer Phone: 530-582-4503 Fax: 530-582-4603 www.solarwindworks.com ch...@solarwindworks.com Proven Energy Solutions From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake Chamberlin Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 5:42 AM To: RE-wrenches Subject: [RE-wrenches] FW250 Hello Wrenches, There is a potential customer that purchased some equipment, including a FW250 box, that goes on the end of the VFX inverter. http://www.outbackpower.com/pdf/manuals/900-0060-1_REV_A.pdf I've not installed one of these yet. Looking at the manual, it looks extremely tight, especially on the DC side. Has anyone had experience with these? Is there sufficient wire bending space? Thanks, Drake Chamberlin Athens Electric OH License 44810 CO License 3773 NABCEP TM Certified PV Installer Office - 740-448-7328 Mobile - 740-856-9648 -Inline Attachment Follows- ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250
Drake, I completely agree with Chris here. The Midnight Solar E-Panels are far superior, in my opinion, to the OutBack FW-250 boxes, and by the time that you add up all of the needed parts to make the FW-250 boxes work (cables, wire, breakers, shunt, etc.), they are about the same cost. The E-Panels are much easier to install and service. They also come with a shunt, whereas with the FW-250 boxes, if you need a shunt, you have to mount it on the inverter, below the top cover. This only works with the vented inverters, as the turbo cover on the sealed units don't have the clearance. On top of that, the shunt ends up only about 2-3 from the negative battery post, and is a hell of a hassle to connect with 2/0 or 4/0 cable. Brian Teitelbaum AEE Solar From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Chris Worcester Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:21 AM To: 'RE-wrenches' Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250 Hi Drake, I did one of these when they first appeared in the spring of 2007, and swore them off. There is inadequate circuit breaker space on the AC DC side especially when you are integrating a GFP, requiring breakers be installed on both sides of the unit, back to back, which really eats into your working room! The lack of positive and negative DC busses and AC in or AC out busses left me using multi hole Polaris Insultaps or tying onto the top of the inverter's DC posts as recommended by OB tech support.. There were other issues too as you mention wire bending space. Go with the MidNite Solar E panel and you'll be fine. Sincerely, Chris Worcester Solar Wind Works NABCEP Certified PV Installer Phone: 530-582-4503 Fax: 530-582-4603 www.solarwindworks.comhttp://www.solarwindworks.com/ ch...@solarwindworks.commailto:ch...@solarwindworks.com Proven Energy Solutions From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake Chamberlin Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 5:42 AM To: RE-wrenches Subject: [RE-wrenches] FW250 Hello Wrenches, There is a potential customer that purchased some equipment, including a FW250 box, that goes on the end of the VFX inverter. http://www.outbackpower.com/pdf/manuals/900-0060-1_REV_A.pdf I've not installed one of these yet. Looking at the manual, it looks extremely tight, especially on the DC side. Has anyone had experience with these? Is there sufficient wire bending space? Thanks, Drake Chamberlin Athens Electric OH License 44810 CO License 3773 NABCEP TM Certified PV Installer Office - 740-448-7328 Mobile - 740-856-9648 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250
We've looked at both, and the E-panel wins every time for single inverter installs where space and cost are issues. (Midnite includes cables, and breakers, and lots of extra goodies, while Outback keeps leaving more things out) We do use the larger Outback stuff, when we are using multiple inverters, or doing a more complex off grid system (DC loads, wind, etc). Midnite's E-panel and battery box make for a very clean Grid tie w/ battery backup system. We just couldn't fit systems in such small spaces before. R. Walters Solarray.com NABCEP # 04170442 On Aug 26, 2009, at 9:20 AM, Chris Worcester wrote: Hi Drake, I did one of these when they first appeared in the spring of 2007, and swore them off. There is inadequate circuit breaker space on the AC DC side especially when you are integrating a GFP, requiring breakers be installed on both sides of the unit, back to back, which really eats into your working room! The lack of positive and negative DC busses and AC in or AC out busses left me using multi hole Polaris Insultaps or tying onto the top of the inverter’s DC posts as recommended by OB tech support.. There were other issues too as you mention wire bending space. Go with the MidNite Solar E panel and you’ll be fine. Sincerely, Chris Worcester Solar Wind Works NABCEP Certified PV Installer Phone: 530-582-4503 Fax: 530-582-4603 www.solarwindworks.com ch...@solarwindworks.com Proven Energy Solutions From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches- boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Drake Chamberlin Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 5:42 AM To: RE-wrenches Subject: [RE-wrenches] FW250 Hello Wrenches, There is a potential customer that purchased some equipment, including a FW250 box, that goes on the end of the VFX inverter. http://www.outbackpower.com/pdf/manuals/900-0060-1_REV_A.pdf I've not installed one of these yet. Looking at the manual, it looks extremely tight, especially on the DC side. Has anyone had experience with these? Is there sufficient wire bending space? Thanks, Drake Chamberlin Athens Electric OH License 44810 CO License 3773 NABCEP TM Certified PV Installer Office - 740-448-7328 Mobile - 740-856-9648 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re- wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250
Thanks for the replies. I am also happy with the Midnight E-Panel, and am strongly urging the customer to get one, having forwarded your posts. The AC/DC 250 looks like it should come with a box or two of bandages. Drake Chamberlin Athens Electric OH License 44810 CO License 3773 NABCEP TM Certified PV Installer Office - 740-448-7328 Mobile - 740-856-9648 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] FW250
Do your self a huge favor and use the Midnite solar Epanel. one thing is for sure you wont install 2 FW250's ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
[RE-wrenches] FW250
Did one FW250 and that was it. No space for bus bars and it can be an issue remebering each bit you need to order for a job. Also, the breakers are not supposed to be mounted facing up or down in order to work properly so that means the install has to run vertically up the wall or be on a shelf where the inverter led indicators are not visible. E panel wins hands down even outside the USA! Bruce Geddes PowerOn___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
