[recoznet2] Fw: [atsic] Media Release: Aboriginal Arts and Crafts Centres - their story told in new report
- Liam ___ . In The Spirit Of Crazy Horse http://itsoch.hypermart.net KOLA Action Group http://kola-hq.hypermart.net Journey of Healing http://www.journeyofhealing.com .___ -Original Message- From: Webcentral <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:59 AM Subject: [atsic] Media Release: Aboriginal Arts and Crafts Centres - their story told in new report >Aboriginal Arts and Crafts Centres - their story told in new report > >An important new report about to be released on Aboriginal community arts >centres, The Arts and Crafts Centre Story , was pre-viewed in Cairns today. > >The Arts and Crafts Centre Story is a series of four research reports which >surveys and documents best practice in 39 Aboriginal Arts and Crafts >centres operating in remote area Australia. > >Delegates at the National Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Visual Arts >Conference being held this week in Cairns were given a preview of the first >volume of the report, by Andrea Nungarrayi Martin, executive member of >Desart, the Central Australian organisation which began the project in 1996. > >Welcoming the report which is about to be released, ATSIC Commissioner Ian >Delaney said The Arts and Craft Centre Story is a vital document which >will boost the operations and ultimately the success of indigenous >community art and crafts centres across the country. > >"It assesses how centres are currently run, identifies best practices as >well as problems that need addressing, and will develop indicators to assess >centre's performance. > >"Arts and crafts remain critically important "centres" of economic and >cultural life for many thousands of indigenous people and communities. >Particularly in remote areas but also in urban and regional centres too. > >"Anything that helps make our arts and craft centres strong and successful >also helps make our artists, our communities and our cultures strong." > >Commissioner Delaney said the ACCS report is an important new guide and >planning resource for not only arts and crafts centres but also for policy >setting and funding bodies. > >Over four volumes, the report gathers together for the first time basic >information and profiles of Aboriginal Arts and Crafts centres, their role >in communities and their relationships with both commercial and government >sectors of the Aboriginal Arts industry. > >The ACCS project was designed and managed by Desart with the majority of >funding provided by ATSIC, with supplementary funding provided by the >Australia Council and the Northern Territory Department of Arts and Museums. > >Desart Inc is the association of 26 Aboriginal community art centres in >Central Australia, and represents more than 3000 artists from the NT, SA and >WA. > >Media Contact: ATSIC Commissioner Ian Delaney Mobile: 0419 418 336 >Further Information: Gaylene Whenmouth, ATSIC Cairns, 07 4042 8295 > >Craig Sproule >A/g Administration Manager >Office of Public Affairs - ATSIC >Ph: 02 6121 4952 >Fax: 02 6282 2854 >E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
[recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
"There go my people, I am their leader - I must follow." -- Mahatma Gandhi THE AGE Reflections on a referendum ROB SITCH Friday 5 November 1999 IT'S CLEAR from the opinion polls that Australia is overwhelmingly republican. It's not surprising then that attention has turned to the model. The rise in the number of undecided voters is even less surprising. People understand the difference between appointed positions and elected ones. You appoint high court judges, you elect presidents. We keep hearing that symbols are important. "Hear, hear," say the people, so the day the symbol of president was chosen it should have come with the democracy it implies. It didn't. Right sentiment, wrong symbol. The public have been repeatedly told that we need someone to represent us to ourselves. People don't want to be represented by someone they didn't choose. The third umpire represents nothing except the rules. Appointing auditors, ombudsmen and judges has never been a problem. An appointed president sounds like an oxymoron. The position of governor-general is at its best when it reflects the impartiality of the Constitution. The more the new role was talked up, the more say the people demanded. Some aspects that came out of the Constitutional Convention have made the past two years like the screech before a car crash. The public consultation process is so lame, unenforceable and shallow that it's an insult. The SOCOG board consults people, too. The prime minister can basically control the make-up of the committee and then still ignore its findings. How much faith would you have in the jury system if members were appointed by the judge in the hope they come to the only conclusion he will accept. It was probably sincerely conceived, but honestly...! The notion of a minimalist model is appealing, but unfortunately it's not the huge positive we always hoped it would be. The governor-general's role was conceived in 1901 and then fashioned by 100 years of democracy and gradual demotion. Validating everything that was written 100 years ago can hardly reflect this. Sir William Deane's name and manner have been frequently conscripted. The oscillation between using the regal "Sir William Deane" and the chummy "Bill Deane" is interesting, if not manipulative. I would like to give a slightly different spin on him. William Deane has been at his best when he has reflected human values, not Australian ones. His Australianness is rightly confined to his constitutional duties, not giving fluffy polemics on what it means to be "one of us". The advertising campaigns seem to have suffered from too much money and too little they could safely say. Both camps started with advertisements that seemed to be for Qantas and ended the campaign back at the usual level. If the politicians' republic is as scary as the no camp says, then the push will start soon against a politicians' parliament! On the other hand, Bob Hawke doesn't seem to understand the longevity of the Windsors if he thinks this could be a vote for King CharlesIII. Most politicians have been railing against a model whereby the people elect the head of state, at the same time espousing a model whereby they elect the head of state. What was the problem with elected presidents again? The nation is told that this position will be above politics, on the same day that it is revealed Peter Costello and John Howard have done a deal on the republic-vote aftermath. One politician said there won't be another vote for 30 years. Is there a prize for hyperbole? When has any politician dropped an issue that has 80per cent popular support? There are many problems with direct-election models, but the democratic maturity of Australians is not one of them. How could so many smart people centre on the one assertion that is unbelievably offensive to the very people they're trying to enlist? Apparently Australians are so shallow, fatuous and unthinking that they would elect an entirely inappropriate person if given the power. The insult was compounded by the assertion that the "right" sort of people would never lower themselves to a vote by the very people they expect to lead. Whichever way the vote goes, there will be some positives. We've had a referendum for a start. More please! I've also learnt what a plebiscite is. We've had another demonstration of the gulf between elite and popular views. This is something Robert Manne has touched on a number of times on this page. People want to be represented more than they want to be led, and informed more than they want to be told. One recent article was so pompously paternalistic it made me laugh out loud. This fellow thought that regional embarrassment was the nation's cruellest fate. Maybe in your circles, pal! "How will we be seen?" he cried. Well, let's think about that. We'll probably be seen as a democracy thoughtfully going through the process of peaceful self-determinati
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
Interesting that Rob Sitch quotes Ghandi in the article below, India being one of the countries that appoints rather than directly elects its Presidents. Tim === >"There go my people, I am their leader - I must follow." -- Mahatma >Gandhi > >THE AGE >Reflections on a referendum > ROB SITCH > Friday 5 November 1999 > --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
It wasn't Rob Sitch but me;-) Trudy tdunlop wrote: > Interesting that Rob Sitch quotes Ghandi in the article below, India being > one of the countries that appoints rather than directly elects its > Presidents. > > Tim > === > >"There go my people, I am their leader - I must follow." -- Mahatma > >Gandhi > > > >THE AGE > >Reflections on a referendum > > ROB SITCH > > Friday 5 November 1999 > > > > --- > RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at >http://www.mail-archive.com/ > To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body > of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce > This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission >from the > copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under >the "fair > use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further >without > permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." > > RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
Sorry, Trudy - just presumed because it was with the article. BTW Any chance of a last-minute conversion? Only one more sleep to go! Tim >It wasn't Rob Sitch but me;-) > >Trudy > >tdunlop wrote: > >> Interesting that Rob Sitch quotes Ghandi in the article below, India being >> one of the countries that appoints rather than directly elects its >> Presidents. >> >> Tim >> === >> >"There go my people, I am their leader - I must follow." -- Mahatma >> >Gandhi >> > >> >THE AGE >> >Reflections on a referendum >> > ROB SITCH >> > Friday 5 November 1999 >> > >> >> --- >> RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ >> To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body >> of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here >> mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce >> This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the >> copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair >> use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without >> permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." >> >> RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ > >--- >RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ >To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body >of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce >This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the >copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair >use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without >permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." > >RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
No, I'm afraid not. Did you happen to see Lateline either last night or today? It was a very good discussion and brought up many points as to why even though 91% (in the latest poll) expressed a wish for a republic, this model isn't likely to make it tomorrow. The Gandhi quote was not about a republic but about leadership... Trudy tdunlop wrote: > Sorry, Trudy - just presumed because it was with the article. > > BTW Any chance of a last-minute conversion? Only one more sleep to go! > > Tim > > > >It wasn't Rob Sitch but me;-) > > > >Trudy > > > >tdunlop wrote: > > > >> Interesting that Rob Sitch quotes Ghandi in the article below, India > being > >> one of the countries that appoints rather than directly elects its > >> Presidents. > >> > >> Tim > >> === > >> >"There go my people, I am their leader - I must follow." -- Mahatma > >> >Gandhi > >> > > >> >THE AGE > >> >Reflections on a referendum > >> > ROB SITCH > >> > Friday 5 November 1999 > >> > > >> > >> --- > >> RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived > at http://www.mail-archive.com/ > >> To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in > the body > >> of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here > >> mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce > >> This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without > permission from the > >> copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and > research under the "fair > >> use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be > distributed further without > >> permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." > >> > >> RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ > > > >--- > >RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at > http://www.mail-archive.com/ > >To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the > body > >of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here > >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce > >This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without > permission from the > >copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and > research under the "fair > >use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed > further without > >permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." > > > >RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ > > --- > RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at >http://www.mail-archive.com/ > To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body > of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce > This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission >from the > copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under >the "fair > use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further >without > permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." > > RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
>No, I'm afraid not. Ah, well. I guess we can have all the arguments again at the next referendum - if I'm not too arthritic to type by then ;-) > >Did you happen to see Lateline either last night or today? It was a very good discussion and brought up many >points as to why even though 91% (in the latest poll) expressed a wish for a republic, this model isn't >likely to make it tomorrow. Yes I did see it. I'm afraid I find Leonie Kramer unbearable and thought most of what she said was self-serving garbage. Still, that's just me being unfair probably. I take your wider point, though. It seems it will go down, though I haven't given up hope entirely. Maybe enough of all those republicans out there will find it just too hard to vote for the Queen once they're in the booth? We'll see I guess Tim >The Gandhi quote was not about a republic but about leadership... > >Trudy > >tdunlop wrote: > >> Sorry, Trudy - just presumed because it was with the article. >> >> BTW Any chance of a last-minute conversion? Only one more sleep to go! >> >> Tim >> >> >> >It wasn't Rob Sitch but me;-) >> > >> >Trudy >> > >> >tdunlop wrote: >> > >> >> Interesting that Rob Sitch quotes Ghandi in the article below, India >> being >> >> one of the countries that appoints rather than directly elects its >> >> Presidents. >> >> >> >> Tim >> >> === >> >> >"There go my people, I am their leader - I must follow." -- Mahatma >> >> >Gandhi >> >> > >> >> >THE AGE >> >> >Reflections on a referendum >> >> > ROB SITCH >> >> > Friday 5 November 1999 >> >> > >> >> >> >> --- >> >> RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived >> at http://www.mail-archive.com/ >> >> To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in >> the body >> >> of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here >> >> mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce >> >> This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without >> permission from the >> >> copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and >> research under the "fair >> >> use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be >> distributed further without >> >> permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." >> >> >> >> RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ >> > >> >--- >> >RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at >> http://www.mail-archive.com/ >> >To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the >> body >> >of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here >> >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce >> >This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without >> permission from the >> >copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and >> research under the "fair >> >use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed >> further without >> >permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." >> > >> >RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ >> >> --- >> RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ >> To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body >> of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here >> mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce >> This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the >> copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair >> use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without >> permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." >> >> RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ > >--- >RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ >To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body >of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce >This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the >copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair >use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without >permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." > >RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To u
[recoznet2] Fw: [atsic] Media Release: Seize the Time - says respected Aboriginal Rights activist Terry O'Shane
Thought this might be of interest to people. >Seize the Time - says respected Aboriginal Rights activist Terry O'Shane > >On the eve of the referendum, Terry O'Shane, one of the most senior and >respected activists for Aboriginal and human rights for more than 30 years, >has issued a passionate and very personal plea to indigenous people to >vote "yes" for a republic. > >In doing so, he has taken issue with other prominent indigenous leaders >who earlier this week issued an open letter to the public and media, urging >indigenous people to vote down the republic question. > >If we as Aboriginal people oppose racism in all its forms, institutional and >direct, then we must raise our voices in unison and vote "YES" for the >Republic and "NO" for the preamble. > >I fear the continuation of the Monarchy, and all the problems that have >arisen from the use of the "Crown. " And I'm concerned we may see it's >continuation because some of my people are supporting the "NO" vote. > >In the list of those people who support a "NO" vote are a lot of my personal >friends - people that I have enormous respect for and some whom I consider >as my closest friends. > >On this issue I'm afraid we'll need to agree to disagree. > >It defies understanding that indigenous people may well help maintain a >British Monarch as Head of State for "our country ", simply because >neither party spoke to us about the Republic or the inclusion of our rights >in any new Constitution. > >This is precisely what their advocacy for a "No" vote this Saturday >means. > >If that is the outcome, they are aiding and abetting the perpetuation of >the great racism we have been made to live under. > >This country was claimed under the doctrine of "Terra Nullius" on behalf of >the British Crown. > >1992 saw that evil lie exposed in the High Court's decision on "Mabo". Since >then, against all opposition, we have been making incremental progress, >slowly but surely. > >The latest step forward was the decision by the UN 's CERD committee, >criticising the suspension of the Racial Discrimination Act by the Howard >Government, when it enacted its 10 point plan. > >We need to get rid of the Monarchy and with it the legal fiction of Crown >Land. > >So I am asking all Aboriginal People to vote "YES" for a Republic and "NO" >for the preamble on Saturday. > >My position is that I will follow the direction that many good people have >set for us and continue to set. > >My life has been dedicated to the elimination of all forms of racism. > >If I remain silent now I would be complicit in the perpetuation of those >things that I have opposed all my life. > >We will, by increments, develop better quality of life for future >generations of Indigenous people, if we attack the evils of racism when the >opportunity is with us. > >This is one of those times. >Sieze the Time. > >Terry O'Shane: Tel 0417 764 992 >5 November 1999 > >Craig Sproule >A/g Administration Manager >Office of Public Affairs - ATSIC >Ph: 02 6121 4952 >Fax: 02 6282 2854 >E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
tdunlop wrote: > >No, I'm afraid not. > > Ah, well. I guess we can have all the arguments again at the next > referendum - if I'm not too arthritic to type by then ;-) Well, it's not stopping me, so you have nothing to worry about. ;-) > >Did you happen to see Lateline either last night or today? It was a very > good discussion and brought up many > >points as to why even though 91% (in the latest poll) expressed a wish for > a republic, this model isn't > >likely to make it tomorrow. > > Yes I did see it. I'm afraid I find Leonie Kramer unbearable and thought > most of what she said was self-serving garbage. Well, we agree on that at least...;-) I was impressed with David Mallouf's contributions. > Still, that's just me being > unfair probably. I take your wider point, though. It seems it will go > down, though I haven't given up hope entirely. Maybe enough of all those > republicans out there will find it just too hard to vote for the Queen once > they're in the booth? We'll see I guess If that was the problem then the result would be different. Most are not voting 'for' the Queen but against the model... Trudy --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
Hi Trudy Doesn't all this remind you of a magicians sleight of hand. The name of the game appears to be misdirection. I am wondering what we are going to find out about after all this furor is over. What did get pushed through parliament while we looked elsewhere? At 03:24 PM 11/5/99 +1100, you wrote: >No, I'm afraid not. > Peter (Possum)McGrath Phone: +61 07 3844 6887 Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Homepade:http://www.tals.qut.edu.au/staff/peter/index.htm "Never complain about stupidity it is natures way of keeping the gene pool clean" --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
Maybe enough of all those >> republicans out there will find it just too hard to vote for the Queen once >> they're in the booth? We'll see I guess > >If that was the problem then the result would be different. Most are not voting 'for' the Queen but against >the model... > >Trudy Ah, but the net effect is that the Queen (and Howard and her other supporters) win. Really can't see them letting go of their victory lightly (or quickly). (Sorry, couldn't help myself ;-)) Tim --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
tdunlop wrote: > Maybe enough of all those > >> republicans out there will find it just too hard to vote for the Queen > once > >> they're in the booth? We'll see I guess > > > >If that was the problem then the result would be different. Most are not > voting 'for' the Queen but against > >the model... > > > >Trudy > > Ah, but the net effect is that the Queen (and Howard and her other > supporters) win. Really can't see them letting go of their victory lightly > (or quickly). Wasn't it the 'yes' side who discounted 'in effect' when Howard used it? Can't have it both ways... > (Sorry, couldn't help myself ;-)) Neither could I... ;-) Trudy --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
>> >> Ah, but the net effect is that the Queen (and Howard and her other >> supporters) win. Really can't see them letting go of their victory lightly >> (or quickly). > >Wasn't it the 'yes' side who discounted 'in effect' when Howard used it? Can't have it both ways... > >> (Sorry, couldn't help myself ;-)) > >Neither could I... ;-) > >Trudy But we can have it both ways, can't we? Isn't that the whole argument? We can vote No AND get a Republic? Tim > >--- >RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ >To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body >of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce >This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the >copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair >use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without >permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." > >RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/ --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
Peter McGrath wrote: > Hi Trudy > Doesn't all this remind you of a magicians sleight of hand. The name of the game >appears to be misdirection. I am wondering what we are going to find out about after >all this furor is over. I think we'll be in for a few surprises. I have visions of the ship of state springing many leaks... > What did get pushed through parliament while we looked elsewhere? Good question. If the papers hadn't been campaigning so hard they might have been able to tell us. ;-) Trudy > > > Peter (Possum)McGrath > Phone: +61 07 3844 6887 > Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Homepade:http://www.tals.qut.edu.au/staff/peter/index.htm > > "Never complain about stupidity it is > natures way of keeping the gene pool clean" --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
tdunlop wrote: > >> > >> Ah, but the net effect is that the Queen (and Howard and her other > >> supporters) win. Really can't see them letting go of their victory > lightly > >> (or quickly). > > > >Wasn't it the 'yes' side who discounted 'in effect' when Howard used it? > Can't have it both ways... > > > >> (Sorry, couldn't help myself ;-)) > > > >Neither could I... ;-) > > > >Trudy > > But we can have it both ways, can't we? Isn't that the whole argument? We > can vote No AND get a Republic? > > Tim Well, I guess we'll find out, won't we? ;-) --- RecOzNet2 has a page @ http://www.green.net.au/recoznet2 and is archived at http://www.mail-archive.com/ To unsubscribe from this list, mail [EMAIL PROTECTED], and in the body of the message, include the words:unsubscribe announce or click here mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=unsubscribe%20announce This posting is provided to the individual members of this group without permission from the copyright owner for purposes of criticism, comment, scholarship and research under the "fair use" provisions of the Federal copyright laws and it may not be distributed further without permission of the copyright owner, except for "fair use." RecOzNet2 is archived for members @ http://www.mail-archive.com/
Re: [recoznet2] The Age: Reflections on a referendum
At 04:31 PM 5/11/99, Peter McGrath wrote:
>Hi Trudy
>Doesn't all this remind you of a magicians sleight of hand. The
>name of the game appears to be misdirection. I am wondering what we are
>going to find out about after all this furor is over.
>
>What did get pushed through parliament while we looked elsewhere?
>
I've been reflecting a little about the referendum over the last couple of
days. One thing that strikes me is that the real problem is that , unlike
some of the republics of yore, the real issues in Australia are NOT related
to our system of government. Our oppressors are not the King , Queen or
the system of government, as they were when the French, Americans, Russians
or Kenyans became republics.
Rather , those calling the shots lie elsewhere. The media barons, the
multi-nationals, the financial institutions , the communication companies,
the mega pastoralists, the huge mining companies - these are the people
who make the decisions that really affect us. These are the contemporary
Kings, Queens, Earls and Barons. Governments perhaps help them to do their
job for them, but they are really merely pawns rather than the power. It
doesn't really make the slightest difference whether you have a directly
elected president, a parliamentarily approved president or a king or queen.
They all simply provide a "technical" solution to the idea of sovereignty
at a time when the "nation" is less relevant than ever before.
If "the people" are to really rule ("Res publica") then these are the
matters which must be dealt with. But no referendum, regardless of who
promulgates it, is really likely to address such matters.
If we were really to address the critical human issues of this hunk of land
between the Indian and Pacific Oceans we would be looking to limit the
manner in which the big players (today's equivalent of the aristocracy)
control our lives. Instead they seem to become ever more pervasive as the
debate about side issues flows on.
This perhaps explains the lack of passion about the current proposals in
the eyes of most people. The current storm in a tea cup is unlikely to have
any real impact on the real human problems of contemporary life, whoever we
are. We will not overthrow the shackles that constrain us by voting for any
of the alternatives currently offered.
Perhaps, if we become a "republic" then we will be more disposed to
consider such matters in greater depth. The longer we go on "fighting in
the Captain's tower" about the nonsense of monarchy, direct election or
parliamentary selection the less likely we are to move on to the real
issues. Perhaps not. But at least we will have got this ridiculous
diversion out of the way.
Cheers
Rod
Rod Hagen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hurstbridge, Victoria, Australia
WWWhttp://www.netspace.net.au/~rodhagen
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