Go to Church or Go to Jail

[Douglas Laycock]

The Times has picked up the story. Third parties trying to generate standing by 
filing a disciplinary complaint against the judge.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/22/us/oklahoma-judges-sentencing-of-youth-to-church-stirs-criticism.html?ref=us

Douglas Laycock
Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law
University of Virginia Law School
580 Massie Road
Charlottesville, VA  22903
 434-243-8546
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Re: Go to church or go to jail

[Paul Finkelman]

I wonder if he can change churches, or attend a Mosque, Synagogue, or some 
other non-Christian house of worship?  And what happens if he does not like 
welding school?
 

Paul Finkelman
President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law
Albany Law School
80 New Scotland Avenue
Albany, NY  12208


518-445-3386 (p)
518-445-3363 (f)


paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu


www.paulfinkelman.com



 From: Arthur Spitzer 
To: Law & Religion issues for Law Academics  
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: Go to church or go to jail
 

"Donn Baker, the attorney for Alred, said, 'My client goes to church every 
Sunday. That isn’t going to be a problem for him.'”

I suppose sentencing a person who likes broccoli to eat broccoli falls under 
the heading of harmless error.  But if he decides to stop going to church at 
some point in the next ten years and they try to revoke him for that violation, 
I hope he calls the ACLU.

Art Spitzer



On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Douglas Laycock  wrote:

http://www.jdjournal.com/2012/11/19/teen-convicted-of-manslaughter-sentenced-to-probation-and-church/
> 
>Unconstitutional, but the only person with standing to complain isn’t 
>complaining. And it may be that few defendants offered this deal would 
>complain. Refusing, getting sent to prison, and attacking your sentence on the 
>grounds of how it was arrived it, would be a costly and risky way to litigate.
> 
>Douglas Laycock
>Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law
>University of Virginia Law School
>580 Massie Road
>Charlottesville, VA  22903
> 434-243-8546
> 
>___
>To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu
>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see 
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>
>Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. 
> Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people 
>can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward 
>the messages to others.
>

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Re: Go to church or go to jail

[Arthur Spitzer]

"Donn Baker, the attorney for Alred, said, 'My client goes to church every
Sunday. That isn’t going to be a problem for him.'”

I suppose sentencing a person who likes broccoli to eat broccoli falls
under the heading of harmless error.  But if he decides to stop going to
church at some point in the next ten years and they try to revoke him for
that violation, I hope he calls the ACLU.

Art Spitzer


On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 3:16 PM, Douglas Laycock wrote:

>
> http://www.jdjournal.com/2012/11/19/teen-convicted-of-manslaughter-sentenced-to-probation-and-church/
> 
>
> ** **
>
> Unconstitutional, but the only person with standing to complain isn’t
> complaining. And it may be that few defendants offered this deal would
> complain. Refusing, getting sent to prison, and attacking your sentence on
> the grounds of how it was arrived it, would be a costly and risky way to
> litigate.
>
> ** **
>
> Douglas Laycock
>
> Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law
>
> University of Virginia Law School
>
> 580 Massie Road
>
> Charlottesville, VA  22903
>
>  434-243-8546
>
> ** **
>
> ___
> To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see
> http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw
>
> Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as
> private.  Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are
> posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or
> wrongly) forward the messages to others.
>
___
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Go to church or go to jail

[Douglas Laycock]

http://www.jdjournal.com/2012/11/19/teen-convicted-of-manslaughter-sentenced
-to-probation-and-church/

 

Unconstitutional, but the only person with standing to complain isn't
complaining. And it may be that few defendants offered this deal would
complain. Refusing, getting sent to prison, and attacking your sentence on
the grounds of how it was arrived it, would be a costly and risky way to
litigate.

 

Douglas Laycock

Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law

University of Virginia Law School

580 Massie Road

Charlottesville, VA  22903

 434-243-8546

 

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RE: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[b...@jmcenter.org]

Paul,
 
How is the enlistment option any different than the AA or church option as an
alternative to jail time? All three have a strong element of coercion and,
consequently, none of three options is truly voluntary.
 
Bob Ritter
Founder & President 
Jefferson Madison Center for Religious Liberty
Falls Church, VA 



On September 26, 2011 at 9:38 PM "Finkelman, Paul
"  wrote:

> the enlistment deal is different; and lots people took it including a friend
> of mine who had killed some people in the DWI and was offered jail or the
> marines; he took the marines and after Nam went to law school and became a
> prosecutor.
>
>
> *
> Paul Finkelman, Ph.D.
> President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law
> Albany Law School
> 80 New Scotland Avenue
> Albany, NY 12208
>
> 518-445-3386 (p)
> 518-445-3363 (f)
>
> paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu
> www.paulfinkelman.com
> *
> 
> From: conlawprof-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [conlawprof-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] on
> behalf of Robert Sheridan [r...@robertsheridan.com]
> Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 6:40 PM
> To: Douglas Laycock
> Cc: Law & Religion issues for Law Academics; conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
> Subject: Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?
>
> Being forced to pray to someone or something one doesn't believe in seems
> cruel and unusual punishment in violation of Amend-8, quite apart from what it
> does to Amend-1.
>
> As a (former) young prosecutor who observed a judge offer a defendant the
> choice of either jail or enlisting in the military, during Vietnam, I recall
> that no one went along with the WWII-era judge's proposed deal.  I believe
> that this condition, too, has failed to pass constitutional muster, but you're
> on your own for a citation.
>
> On the other hand, at a much later date, I was happy to help clean up the
> record of a convicted person who wanted to enlist shortly after 9-11.
>
> rs
>
> I'd thought this list had gone to bed, as tho' there wuz nothing left to
> wrangle over...
>
>
> On Sep 26, 2011, at 3:06 PM, Douglas Laycock wrote:
>
> > Much milder versions of this, such as go to jail or go to AA, have been
> > litigated and held unconstitutional. This plan will have a short life.
> >
> > On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 17:37:51 -0400
> > James Edward Maule  wrote:
> >> That's what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be
> >> useful to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say
> >> nothing of the expected discussion).
> >>
> >> http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2
> >>
> >> Headline and first paragraph:
> >>
> >> Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving
> >> time<http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/>
> >>
> >> If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might
> >> just have the chance to pray it all away.
> >> Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our
> >> Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found
> >> guilty of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying
> >> a fine or attending church each Sunday for a year.
> >>
> >>
> >> James Edward Maule
> >> Professor of Law
> >> Villanova University School of Law
> >> ma...@law.villanova.edu
> >> http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Douglas Laycock
> > Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law
> > University of Virginia Law School
> > 580 Massie Road
> > Charlottesville, VA  22903
> >     434-243-8546
> > ___
> > To post, send message to conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
> > To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see
> > http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/conlawprof
> >
> > Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as
> > private.  Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are
> > posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or
> > wrongly) forward the messages to others.
> >
>
> ___
> To post, send message to conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see
> http://l

RE: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Joel Sogol]

It’s only funny if you live somewhere else.  It’s real around here.  I am very 
familiar with the AA cases, which are also regularly ignored here.  

 

We have a Judge who has the ten Commandments sewn onto all his judicial robes.  
And that is just the start.  When I was involved in the first Roy Moore 
litigation, no one thought suing him would make him Chief Justice of the 
Alabama Supreme Court, but it did.  Some judges are just waiting for the same 
opportunity.

 

Joel L. Sogol

Attorney at Law

811 21st Avenue

Tuscaloosa, Alabama  35401

ph (205) 345-0966

fx  (205) 345-0971

jlsa...@wwisp.com

 

Ben Franklin observed that truth wins a fair fight -- which is why we have 
evidence rules in U.S. courts.

 

From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu 
[mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of hamilto...@aol.com
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 5:58 PM
To: religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu; conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
Subject: Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

 

First, this is hilarious.  Second, it reminds me of my cousin, who is a 
principal at a public high school in Kentucky.  When we were visiting several 
years ago, he left dinner early to draft the school prayer to be read over the 
PA for the next day.  When I joked that that might be a problem for the Supreme 
Court, he just smiled.  I would imagine that would be the response from the 
Alabama lawmakers on this issue.  

 


Marci A. Hamilton
Paul R. Verkuil Chair in Public Law
Benjamin N. Cardozo School of Law
Yeshiva University
55 Fifth Avenue
New York, NY 10003
215-353-8984 

 

In a message dated 9/26/2011 5:41:16 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 
ma...@law.villanova.edu writes:

That’s what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be useful 
to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say nothing of 
the expected discussion).

 

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2

 

Headline and first paragraph:

 

Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time 
<http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/>
 

 

If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might just 
have the chance to pray it all away.

Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found guilty 
of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a fine or 
attending church each Sunday for a year.

 

 

James Edward Maule

Professor of Law

Villanova University School of Law

ma...@law.villanova.edu

http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule

 

 

=

___
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RE: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Finkelman, Paul]

the enlistment deal is different; and lots people took it including a friend of 
mine who had killed some people in the DWI and was offered jail or the marines; 
he took the marines and after Nam went to law school and became a prosecutor.


*
Paul Finkelman, Ph.D.
President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law
Albany Law School
80 New Scotland Avenue
Albany, NY 12208

518-445-3386 (p)
518-445-3363 (f)

paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu
www.paulfinkelman.com
*

From: conlawprof-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [conlawprof-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] on 
behalf of Robert Sheridan [r...@robertsheridan.com]
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 6:40 PM
To: Douglas Laycock
Cc: Law & Religion issues for Law Academics; conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
Subject: Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

Being forced to pray to someone or something one doesn't believe in seems cruel 
and unusual punishment in violation of Amend-8, quite apart from what it does 
to Amend-1.

As a (former) young prosecutor who observed a judge offer a defendant the 
choice of either jail or enlisting in the military, during Vietnam, I recall 
that no one went along with the WWII-era judge's proposed deal.  I believe that 
this condition, too, has failed to pass constitutional muster, but you're on 
your own for a citation.

On the other hand, at a much later date, I was happy to help clean up the 
record of a convicted person who wanted to enlist shortly after 9-11.

rs

I'd thought this list had gone to bed, as tho' there wuz nothing left to 
wrangle over...


On Sep 26, 2011, at 3:06 PM, Douglas Laycock wrote:

> Much milder versions of this, such as go to jail or go to AA, have been 
> litigated and held unconstitutional. This plan will have a short life.
>
> On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 17:37:51 -0400
> James Edward Maule  wrote:
>> That's what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be 
>> useful to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say 
>> nothing of the expected discussion).
>>
>> http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2
>>
>> Headline and first paragraph:
>>
>> Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving 
>> time<http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/>
>>
>> If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might 
>> just have the chance to pray it all away.
>> Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
>> Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found 
>> guilty of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying 
>> a fine or attending church each Sunday for a year.
>>
>>
>> James Edward Maule
>> Professor of Law
>> Villanova University School of Law
>> ma...@law.villanova.edu
>> http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule
>>
>>
>
> Douglas Laycock
> Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law
> University of Virginia Law School
> 580 Massie Road
> Charlottesville, VA  22903
> 434-243-8546
> ___
> To post, send message to conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see 
> http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/conlawprof
>
> Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as 
> private.  Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; 
> people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) 
> forward the messages to others.
>

___
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Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Hamilton02]

First, this is hilarious.  Second, it reminds me of my cousin, who is  a 
principal at a public high school in Kentucky.  When we were visiting  several 
years ago, he left dinner early to draft the school prayer to be  read over 
the PA for the next day.  When I joked that that might be a  problem for 
the Supreme Court, he just smiled.  I would imagine  that would be the 
response from the Alabama lawmakers on this issue.  
 

Marci A.  Hamilton
Paul R. Verkuil Chair in Public Law
Benjamin N. Cardozo School of  Law
Yeshiva University
55 Fifth Avenue
New York, NY  10003
215-353-8984  

 
In a message dated 9/26/2011 5:41:16 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
ma...@law.villanova.edu writes:

 
That’s  what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be 
useful to  subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say 
nothing of the  expected discussion). 
_http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-opti
ons-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2_ 
(http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2)
  
Headline  and first paragraph: 
_Jesus  or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving  time_ 
(http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serv
ing-time/)  
If  you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might 
just  have the chance to pray it all away. 
Starting  this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
Community),  local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found 
guilty of  misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a 
fine or  attending church each Sunday for a year. 
James  Edward Maule 
Professor  of Law 
Villanova  University School of Law 
ma...@law.villanova.edu 
http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule 

=

___
To  post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu
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Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Marc Stern]

Sixty five years ago, the Virginia Supreme Court threw out a juvenile sentence 
of this type. One can only wonder why this prosecutor and judge can't see what 
was long ago obvious.
Marc

From: Steve Sanders [mailto:steve...@umich.edu]
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 09:05 PM
To: 'Law & Religion issues for Law Academics' ; 
conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu 
Subject: RE: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

I suspect the response from the Alabama legislators would actually be more 
truculent!


From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu 
[mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of hamilto...@aol.com
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 3:58 PM
To: religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu; conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
Subject: Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

First, this is hilarious.  Second, it reminds me of my cousin, who is a 
principal at a public high school in Kentucky.  When we were visiting several 
years ago, he left dinner early to draft the school prayer to be read over the 
PA for the next day.  When I joked that that might be a problem for the Supreme 
Court, he just smiled.  I would imagine that would be the response from the 
Alabama lawmakers on this issue.

[cid:887100401@27092011-0C7E]
Marci A. Hamilton
Paul R. Verkuil Chair in Public Law
Benjamin N. Cardozo School of Law
Yeshiva University
55 Fifth Avenue
New York, NY 10003
215-353-8984

In a message dated 9/26/2011 5:41:16 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 
ma...@law.villanova.edu writes:
That’s what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be useful 
to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say nothing of 
the expected discussion).

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2

Headline and first paragraph:

Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving 
time<http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/>

If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might just 
have the chance to pray it all away.
Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found guilty 
of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a fine or 
attending church each Sunday for a year.


James Edward Maule
Professor of Law
Villanova University School of Law
ma...@law.villanova.edu
http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule


=

___
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RE: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Steve Sanders]

I suspect the response from the Alabama legislators would actually be more
truculent!


  _  

From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu
[mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of hamilto...@aol.com
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 3:58 PM
To: religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu; conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
Subject: Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?



First, this is hilarious.  Second, it reminds me of my cousin, who is a
principal at a public high school in Kentucky.  When we were visiting
several years ago, he left dinner early to draft the school prayer to be
read over the PA for the next day.  When I joked that that might be a
problem for the Supreme Court, he just smiled.  I would imagine that would
be the response from the Alabama lawmakers on this issue.  
 

Marci A. Hamilton
Paul R. Verkuil Chair in Public Law
Benjamin N. Cardozo School of Law
Yeshiva University
55 Fifth Avenue
New York, NY 10003
215-353-8984 
 
In a message dated 9/26/2011 5:41:16 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
ma...@law.villanova.edu writes:



That's what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be
useful to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say
nothing of the expected discussion).

 

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-optio
ns-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2

 

Headline and first paragraph:

 

Jesus
<http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-opti
ons-for-serving-time/> or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time

 

If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might
just have the chance to pray it all away.

Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our
Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found
guilty of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying
a fine or attending church each Sunday for a year.

 

 

James Edward Maule

Professor of Law

Villanova University School of Law

ma...@law.villanova.edu

http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule

 

 

=

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<>___
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RE: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Finkelman, Paul]

Oh, I just remembered. When I was the main expert in the Ten Commandments 
monument case in Alabama (Glassroth v. Moore), Chief Justice Roy Moore said 
that the Ten Commandments monument could not offend any religion because all 
religions believe in the Ten Commandments.  When asked about Hindus or 
Buddhists he said "they are not real religions so they are not protected by the 
First Amendment."  I had forgotten about that!  I guess that answer part of my 
question, although not for Jews or 7th Day Adventists.





*
Paul Finkelman, Ph.D.
President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law
Albany Law School
80 New Scotland Avenue
Albany, NY 12208

518-445-3386 (p)
518-445-3363 (f)

paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu<mailto:paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu>
www.paulfinkelman.com<http://www.paulfinkelman.com>
*


From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] 
on behalf of James Edward Maule [ma...@law.villanova.edu]
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 5:37 PM
To: Law & Religion issues for Law Academics; conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
Subject: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

That’s what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be useful 
to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say nothing of 
the expected discussion).

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2

Headline and first paragraph:

Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving 
time<http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/>

If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might just 
have the chance to pray it all away.
Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found guilty 
of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a fine or 
attending church each Sunday for a year.


James Edward Maule
Professor of Law
Villanova University School of Law
ma...@law.villanova.edu
http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule


___
To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu
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RE: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Eric Rassbach]

If the preaching is particularly bad, they might also have an Eighth Amendment 
claim.


From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] 
On Behalf Of Douglas Laycock [dlayc...@virginia.edu]
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 6:06 PM
To: Law & Religion issues for Law Academics; James Edward Maule; 
conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu
Subject: Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

Much milder versions of this, such as go to jail or go to AA, have been 
litigated and held unconstitutional. This plan will have a short life.

On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 17:37:51 -0400
 James Edward Maule  wrote:
>That's what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be 
>useful to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say 
>nothing of the expected discussion).
>
>http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2
>
>Headline and first paragraph:
>
>Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving 
>time<http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/>
>
>If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might just 
>have the chance to pray it all away.
>Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
>Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found guilty 
>of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a fine or 
>attending church each Sunday for a year.
>
>
>James Edward Maule
>Professor of Law
>Villanova University School of Law
>ma...@law.villanova.edu
>http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule
>
>

Douglas Laycock
Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law
University of Virginia Law School
580 Massie Road
Charlottesville, VA  22903
 434-243-8546
___
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___
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Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Paul Finkelman]

I wonder what happens if a Jew, a Moslem, or a Seventh Day Adventist gets 
arrested.  Not to mention a  Hindu, Buddhist, or another other follower of a 
non-western faith. 

 

Paul Finkelman
President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law
Albany Law School
80 New Scotland Avenue
Albany, NY  12208


518-445-3386 (p)
518-445-3363 (f)


paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu


www.paulfinkelman.com



From: James Edward Maule 
To: Law & Religion issues for Law Academics ; 
"conlawp...@lists.ucla.edu" 
Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 5:37 PM
Subject: Go to Church or Go to Jail?


That’s what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be useful 
to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say nothing of 
the expected discussion).
 
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2
 
Headline and first paragraph:
 
Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
 
If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might just 
have the chance to pray it all away.
Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found guilty 
of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a fine or 
attending church each Sunday for a year.
 
 
James Edward Maule
Professor of Law
Villanova University School of Law
ma...@law.villanova.edu
http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule
 
 
___
To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see 
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Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private.  
Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can 
read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the 
messages to others.___
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To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see 
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Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private.  
Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can 
read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the 
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Re: Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[Douglas Laycock]

Much milder versions of this, such as go to jail or go to AA, have been 
litigated and held unconstitutional. This plan will have a short life.

On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 17:37:51 -0400
 James Edward Maule  wrote:
>That's what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be 
>useful to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say 
>nothing of the expected discussion).
>
>http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2
>
>Headline and first paragraph:
>
>Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving 
>time
>
>If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might just 
>have the chance to pray it all away.
>Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
>Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found guilty 
>of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a fine or 
>attending church each Sunday for a year.
>
>
>James Edward Maule
>Professor of Law
>Villanova University School of Law
>ma...@law.villanova.edu
>http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule
>
>

Douglas Laycock
Robert E. Scott Distinguished Professor of Law
University of Virginia Law School
580 Massie Road
Charlottesville, VA  22903
 434-243-8546
___
To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu
To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see 
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Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private.  
Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can 
read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the 
messages to others.

Go to Church or Go to Jail?

[James Edward Maule]

That's what it appears to be (sorry for cross-posting but this should be useful 
to subscribers on both lists looking for an exam question, to say nothing of 
the expected discussion).

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/26/jesus-or-jail-alabama-town-offers-options-for-serving-time/?hpt=hp_t2

Headline and first paragraph:

Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving 
time

If you're charged with a nonviolent crime in one Alabama town, you might just 
have the chance to pray it all away.
Starting this week, under a new program called Operation ROC (Restore Our 
Community), local judges in Bay Minette, Alabama, will give those found guilty 
of misdemeanors the choice of serving out their time in jail, paying a fine or 
attending church each Sunday for a year.


James Edward Maule
Professor of Law
Villanova University School of Law
ma...@law.villanova.edu
http://vls.law.villanova.edu/prof/maule


___
To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu
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Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private.  
Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can 
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