[Repeater-Builder] OT Power Factor

[Thomas Oliver]

Question for any electrical engineers out there.

Are the meters on the side of buildings metering real power or apparent power?

Is power factor correction worth doing if the power company is not dinging the 
customer for low power factor?

This article 
http://powerelectronics.com/power_management/motor_power_management/705PET23.pdf
  talks about residential power factor correction and my conclusion (from this 
article) is the savings would never be recouped. 

Second conclusion is the only benefit with correction is the wires between the 
source and load don't heat up as much. What about the wires in the motor or 
transformer? do they also heat less? I would think so.

Third conclusion is by correcting power factor you are helping the utility 
company more than yourself because these phase differences "standing waves" 
exist all the way back to the power generation source therefore the utility 
lines have more loss due to their greater length than the customers building 
wiring has.

The reason I am researching this is a customer of mine has roughly 50 hp of 
total motors in his shop and wanted to know if he could save 30% on his 
electric bill like some salesman of power factor correction black boxes told 
him he could.

I realize I am going to have to look at his energy bill to see if there is a 
charge for low power factor and maybe call the utility company to see if he 
will get a lower rate if he adds PFC devices


tom



(\__/) ... 
(='.'=) 
(")_(")

Pagers in 2009 - why? (was: [Repeater-Builder] A desense issue)

[Jacob Suter]

Seriously...

What is today's market for pagers?  I can't imagine there's any real reason
for them to continue to exist.  If the FCC can force you to quit using your
perfectly good 25 khz rig, force the multi-billion-dollar-a-year OTA TV
industry onto HD, or the zillion other examples of the FCC's absolute power,
why hasn't someone asked the FCC why the paging industry is continuing to
camp on a pile of spectrum with insane EIRPs that regularly cause co-site
and near-site crosstalk problems.

Playing with my rather deaf scanner, in a rather low-population area, I hear
almost no pager traffic - enough that it could easily all be placed onto a
single channel or thrown onto a cellular network.  Unluckily, there is just
enough traffic on practically everywhere from 145 to 960 mhz that it causes
problems on any high mounted site.

Come on, who's for a "Paging Sunset"?

JS

-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jed Barton
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 4:26 PM
To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] A desense issue

Hey guys,

Alright, perhaps some of you have some ideas, cause this one has driven a
bunch of us absolutely crazy.
At one of my repeater sights, I have a 220 repeater, a 440, and a 900.
Also, there is a paging transmitter about 3 feet away from all of this.
Here's the issue.  The paging transmitter is desensing both the 440 and the
900.  The 440 repeater is a kenwood tkr850, and the 900 is an msf5000.
I'm running a set of 4 cavity wacom cans on UHF, same for 900.
The paging transmitter is transmitting on 152.6. 
We've watched it, and there is no doubt that the paging transmitter is the
problem.
The transmitter is a Glen Air.
We can shoot a weak signal in to the UHF repeateror the 900 with the service
monitor.  That weak signal will get very strong as soon as the paging
transmitter unkeys.
We even went to the extreme of getting a filter from par electronics to
knotch out the 152.6, but na, didn't work.
As if this isn't bad enough, the antennas for the 900 and the 440 are only
about 25 feet apart horizontally, it's as far apart as they can go.
Any thoughts guys, anyone ever run in to this situation?

Thanks,
Jed







Yahoo! Groups Links

[Repeater-Builder] W4ZT Tony King SK

[Bruce Bagwell]

>From Bruce in Texas, KE5TPN
Never knew this person  but 73 and 88 to all who were close to him.
NEVER DISRESCECT THE SILENT KEY!

RPI my friend, RPI.  May the "Skip" be with you always!

Bruce Bagwell in Texas
KE5TPN




Tony passed away this afternoon at 2:40 after a long battle with cancer.
He will be missed by me and all the other friends he made over the 
years. 

John, KC4YI

Re: [Repeater-Builder] A desense issue

[Nate Duehr]

The 4 can Wacom's can't do anything about out-of-band signals.  You  
might experiment with a nice high-Q filter on your receive side...  
but...

Eric's right.  To really figure it out you need:

1. To look at what's going on on a spectrum analyzer.
2. To move away from their antenna, vertically.

Paging is all about raw transmitter power, and they COULD be within  
spec and still clobber your input with broadband noise... as someone  
else pointed out, if you have a contact at the paging company who's  
got a clue, they might help with filtering (if you can professionally  
prove the problem is their transmitter, but keep in mind, they  
probably pay a lot more than you do at a commercial site -- and if the  
site owners get a call from them saying you're being a pain... guess  
who's going to lose?  Be diplomatic!!)...

Nate

On Feb 8, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Jed Barton wrote:

> Hey guys,
>
> Alright, perhaps some of you have some ideas, cause this one has  
> driven a
> bunch of us absolutely crazy.
> At one of my repeater sights, I have a 220 repeater, a 440, and a 900.
> Also, there is a paging transmitter about 3 feet away from all of  
> this.
> Here's the issue.  The paging transmitter is desensing both the 440  
> and the
> 900.  The 440 repeater is a kenwood tkr850, and the 900 is an msf5000.
> I'm running a set of 4 cavity wacom cans on UHF, same for 900.
> The paging transmitter is transmitting on 152.6.
> We've watched it, and there is no doubt that the paging transmitter  
> is the
> problem.
> The transmitter is a Glen Air.
> We can shoot a weak signal in to the UHF repeateror the 900 with the  
> service
> monitor.  That weak signal will get very strong as soon as the paging
> transmitter unkeys.
> We even went to the extreme of getting a filter from par electronics  
> to
> knotch out the 152.6, but na, didn't work.
> As if this isn't bad enough, the antennas for the 900 and the 440  
> are only
> about 25 feet apart horizontally, it's as far apart as they can go.
> Any thoughts guys, anyone ever run in to this situation?
>
> Thanks,
> Jed
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

RE: [Repeater-Builder] Transistor needed

[Eric Lemmon]

I looked at the parts list for the UHS preamplifier in LBI-4561C, and saw:
"Q2301 N-channel FET, similar to 3N187".  You can buy this very common
transistor from Mouser or Digi-Key.

You can also purchase the exact GE part 19A116818P1 from New London
Technology, for $2 each.


73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY

-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of WA Brown
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 7:53 PM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Transistor needed

I have a ULS preamp that has a bad transistor. The bad transistor on the UHS
preamp board is a GE Mobile Part Number 19A116818P1 device (marked 6818P1).
Would anyone have one that we could get?
 
 
WA Brown

Re: [Repeater-Builder] W4ZT Tony King SK

[Mike Reed]

Wow...another good one...I liked his antenna design...
73
 Mike - N7ZEF

- Original Message - 
From: "John Crockett KC4YI" 
To: 
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 7:55 PM
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] W4ZT Tony King SK


Tony passed away this afternoon at 2:40 after a long battle with cancer.
He will be missed by me and all the other friends he made over the 
years. 

John, KC4YI







Yahoo! Groups Links

[Repeater-Builder] Transistor needed

[WA Brown]

I have a ULS preamp that has a bad transistor. The bad transistor on the UHS 
preamp board is a GE Mobile Part Number 19A116818P1 device (marked 6818P1).  
Would anyone have one that we could get?


WA Brown

RE: [Repeater-Builder] W4ZT Tony King SK

[Peter Dakota Summerhawk]

My thoughts a prayers go out to the King family as well as Tony. May he
still reach the heavens above to be with God.

Peter Summerhawk-N0WRE

 

-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Crockett KC4YI
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 7:56 PM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] W4ZT Tony King SK

 

Tony passed away this afternoon at 2:40 after a long battle with cancer.
He will be missed by me and all the other friends he made over the 
years. 

John, KC4YI

[Repeater-Builder] FS: Arcom RC-210 w/ rack encousure & autopatch

[Don E. Wisdom]

Hi,
I have a RC-210 for sale that is in the Arcom rack enclosure with the
autopatch (AP1) module.  It was built by me & was in full operating
condition when I was doing burn-in on my repeater that I have scrapped.  I
would like to get $400 OBO for it.  Please email me off list if you are
interested.
Thanks
--Don

[Repeater-Builder] W4ZT Tony King SK

[John Crockett KC4YI]

Tony passed away this afternoon at 2:40 after a long battle with cancer.
He will be missed by me and all the other friends he made over the 
years. 

John, KC4YI

RE: [Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...

[Ken Arck]

At 05:55 PM 2/8/2009, Richard wrote:

>and the liberals are going to reward them with hundreds of 
>millions of dollars instead. In other words, your typical democratic 
>congress at work.
>
>
<---One correction.  4.2 BILLION, not hundreds of millions.

But I suspect this isn't the place to go into a whole lot of detail. 
There are much better venues for doing so..

Ken 

RE: [Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...

[Richard]

Acorn was in the news late last year for voter fraud, mostly for
fraudulent voter registrations. I didn't follow it too closely because
it pissed me off so much. They were being investigated but, now that
obama is in office, that appears to have been stopped, and the
liberals are going to reward them with hundreds of millions of dollars
instead. In other words, your typical democratic congress at work. 
 
 
Richard
  www.n7tgb.net
 

  _  

From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wd8chl
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 5:35 PM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...



Ken Arck wrote:
> At 08:36 AM 2/8/2009, Lee Pennington wrote:
> 
>> One Acorn Too Many and other amatuer related videos!
> 
> <---Man... I thought this was about voter fraud!
> 
> Ken
> --

h...don't get the reference

Re: [Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...

[wd8chl]

Ken Arck wrote:
> At 08:36 AM 2/8/2009, Lee Pennington wrote:
> 
>> One Acorn Too Many and other amatuer related videos!
> 
> <---Man... I thought this was about voter fraud!
> 
> Ken
> --

h...don't get the reference

Re: [Repeater-Builder] A desense issue

[Henry Wingate]

We had the exact same problem with a Glenayre  on that same frequency at 
our 2 meter site a number of years ago. It turned out that the problem
was wide band noise from the Glenayre. We had Wacom (shows how long ago 
it was) make us a cavity with a peak at 152.6 and a notch at our receive
frequency of 146.16. Fortunately the engineer for the paging company was 
a ham and he installed the cavity in the Glenayre transmitter. It was 
like magic,
we suddenly had our repeater back. This was the proof they needed to 
make a number of upgrades to the transmitter which eliminated the noise and
it was able to operate without the cavity. The paging industry meltdown 
finally took care of the problem and the transmitter is no longer there.

We have retuned the cavity and are presently using it on our APRS digi 
at the site.


Jed Barton wrote:
> Hey guys,
>
> Alright, perhaps some of you have some ideas, cause this one has driven a
> bunch of us absolutely crazy.
> At one of my repeater sights, I have a 220 repeater, a 440, and a 900.
> Also, there is a paging transmitter about 3 feet away from all of this.
> Here's the issue.  The paging transmitter is desensing both the 440 and the
> 900.  The 440 repeater is a kenwood tkr850, and the 900 is an msf5000.
> I'm running a set of 4 cavity wacom cans on UHF, same for 900.
> The paging transmitter is transmitting on 152.6. 
> We've watched it, and there is no doubt that the paging transmitter is the
> problem.
> The transmitter is a Glen Air.
> We can shoot a weak signal in to the UHF repeateror the 900 with the service
> monitor.  That weak signal will get very strong as soon as the paging
> transmitter unkeys.
> We even went to the extreme of getting a filter from par electronics to
> knotch out the 152.6, but na, didn't work.
> As if this isn't bad enough, the antennas for the 900 and the 440 are only
> about 25 feet apart horizontally, it's as far apart as they can go.
> Any thoughts guys, anyone ever run in to this situation?
>
> Thanks,
> Jed
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
> 
>
>
> Internal Virus Database is out of date.
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
> Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1928 - Release Date: 1/31/2009 
> 8:03 PM
>
>   

Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: GE MVP output power level

[wd8chl]

n...@no6b.com wrote:

> The UHF PAs aren't quite as 
> efficient; for those I still use 110 VAC fans that spin 24/7, or in one 
> case where the site manager didn't allow that,

Huh-wow. I guess they don't have too many commercial tenants then, huh?
I know that no paging company could have that restiction!

;c}

Re: [Repeater-Builder] New Equipment - never installed

[wd8chl]

skipp025 wrote:
> Happens all the time... 
> 
> In the last month or two I was made aware of a large warehouse 
> size amount of new in box Motorola Spectra, Midland Base-Tech 
> and even a fairly large number original Midland Syntech radios 
> that will probably never see action until sold off to the 
> surplus market. 
> 
> Lots of tax dollar sin out there ... and no, there's no way 
> (yet) to access/purchase the mentioned above NOS radios. 
> 
> cheers, 
> s. 
> 

Tell them to sell them to you from scrap value-because after 2012, they 
won't be of any value to anyone outside of the ham world!
Well, GMRS to some degree...

RE: [Repeater-Builder] A desense issue

[Eric Lemmon]

Jed,

You might use a spectrum analyzer first, to look at the paging system's
signal- it could be spurring.  Note that harmonics of the 152.6 MHz carrier
will appear close to your repeater inputs, so you might try some bandpass
cavities on their inputs.  Some VHF paging transmitters have more than a
kilowatt of ERP, so you may be fighting an uphill battle.  Finally, look to
vertical separation of the antennas; horizontal separation does relatively
little unless it is hundreds of feet.

73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY
 

-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jed Barton
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 2:26 PM
To: repeater-builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] A desense issue

Hey guys,

Alright, perhaps some of you have some ideas, cause this one has driven a
bunch of us absolutely crazy.
At one of my repeater sites, I have a 220 repeater, a 440, and a 900.
Also, there is a paging transmitter about 3 feet away from all of this.
Here's the issue. The paging transmitter is desensing both the 440 and the
900. The 440 repeater is a kenwood tkr850, and the 900 is an msf5000.
I'm running a set of 4 cavity wacom cans on UHF, same for 900.
The paging transmitter is transmitting on 152.6. 
We've watched it, and there is no doubt that the paging transmitter is the
problem.
The transmitter is a Glen Air.
We can shoot a weak signal in to the UHF repeater or the 900 with the
service
monitor. That weak signal will get very strong as soon as the paging
transmitter unkeys.
We even went to the extreme of getting a filter from par electronics to
knotch out the 152.6, but na, didn't work.
As if this isn't bad enough, the antennas for the 900 and the 440 are only
about 25 feet apart horizontally, it's as far apart as they can go.
Any thoughts guys, anyone ever run in to this situation?

Thanks,
Jed

Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Anyone Modified a Zetron 48B?

[wd8chl]

wb0vhb wrote:
> I'm not sure why you think "tone panels" are not a good fit for a ham
> repeater?
> 
> The Zetron Model 48B I'm using has CWID that can be adjusted in
> increments of one minute intervals.
> 
> I haven't seen very many commercial tone panels that didn't have
> built-in CWID.
> 
> Most do have remote programming over the air with DTMF commands.  My
> 48B will allow me to disable the repeater, change the frequency of the
> courtesy beep, control relay outputs, enable/disable PL and DPL
> tones/codes and many other functions.
> 

I already stated my reasons for my statement. And I stand by them.
Go back and read it again.

[Repeater-Builder] A desense issue

[Jed Barton]

Hey guys,

Alright, perhaps some of you have some ideas, cause this one has driven a
bunch of us absolutely crazy.
At one of my repeater sights, I have a 220 repeater, a 440, and a 900.
Also, there is a paging transmitter about 3 feet away from all of this.
Here's the issue.  The paging transmitter is desensing both the 440 and the
900.  The 440 repeater is a kenwood tkr850, and the 900 is an msf5000.
I'm running a set of 4 cavity wacom cans on UHF, same for 900.
The paging transmitter is transmitting on 152.6. 
We've watched it, and there is no doubt that the paging transmitter is the
problem.
The transmitter is a Glen Air.
We can shoot a weak signal in to the UHF repeateror the 900 with the service
monitor.  That weak signal will get very strong as soon as the paging
transmitter unkeys.
We even went to the extreme of getting a filter from par electronics to
knotch out the 152.6, but na, didn't work.
As if this isn't bad enough, the antennas for the 900 and the 440 are only
about 25 feet apart horizontally, it's as far apart as they can go.
Any thoughts guys, anyone ever run in to this situation?

Thanks,
Jed

[Repeater-Builder] UHF MSR2000 on e-Bay

[George Henry]

I have been forced to abandon my GMRS repeater project after failing to find 
a suitable site, so...

My MSR2000 is up on e-Bay, item number 160314584725, no cabinet or power 
supply, low reserve.  All the details are posted there, but feel free to ask 
any questions here.

Perhaps someone on the list could give it a good home?


George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413

Re: [Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...

[Ken Arck]

At 08:36 AM 2/8/2009, Lee Pennington wrote:

>One Acorn Too Many and other amatuer related videos!

<---Man... I thought this was about voter fraud!

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/
Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and
we offer complete repeater packages!
AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
http://www.irlp.net
"We don't just make 'em. We use 'em!"

Re: [Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...

[Paul Holm]

Thanks...this is the same video that was posted here a little over a week ago.


  - Original Message - 
  From: Lee Pennington 

  Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...





  One Acorn Too Many and other amatuer related videos!

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mdm12KONMBA

[Repeater-Builder] Check Your Traps...

[Lee Pennington]

One Acorn Too Many and other amatuer related videos!

*http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mdm12KONMBA*

__
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-- 
"Smart pills are placebos, you can't fix stupid."

[Repeater-Builder] IFR 500A Manual

[johnmichaelwelton]

Anyone know where I could pick up an IFR FM/AM 500A service monitor 
manual . . . just picked up one at a hamfest without the manual.

Tnx, John/N4SJW

Re: [Repeater-Builder] re: Decibel folded dipole

[Chuck Kelsey]

You lost me on that one.

Again, measure the element from tip to tip.

It will be 12-1/2" for 406-420 MHz
It will be 11-3/16" for 450-470 MHz

If your intent is for RX only, it won't make a lot of difference if it's out 
of band, but you will loose some gain.

Chuck
WB2EDV


- Original Message - 
From: "mike" 
To: 
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 7:15 AM
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] re: Decibel folded dipole


> Hi
> Thanks for the replies on this topic. I measured the dipole loop and
> came up with 13 1/2 inches. The measurement was taken from one side of
> the loop from the top of the loop to end just were just goes into the
> mounting backet. I need the lower half of UHF at 423mhz for receive
> only.
> Thanks
> Mike
>
>

Re: [Repeater-Builder] re: Decibel folded dipole

[Ralph Mowery]

--- On Sun, 2/8/09, mike  wrote:

> From: mike 
> Subject: [Repeater-Builder] re: Decibel folded dipole
> To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Sunday, February 8, 2009, 7:15 AM
> Hi 
>  Thanks for the replies on this topic. I measured the
> dipole loop and 
> came up with 13 1/2 inches. The measurement was taken from
> one side of 
> the loop from the top of the loop to end just were just
> goes into the 
> mounting backet. I need the lower half of UHF at 423mhz for
> receive 
> only.
> Thanks
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
I have seen two differant dipole arays that had a low swr out of the band but 
would not work very well.  I am not sure if the phasing is causing the signal 
to go way up in the air or just cancle out each other.  About like the time I 
used the wrong 1/4 wave multiplier to phase two beams.  Either antenna would 
work well by its self , but when hooked together I could not hardly get a 
signal out of my yard.



  

[Repeater-Builder] re: Decibel folded dipole

[mike]

Hi 
 Thanks for the replies on this topic. I measured the dipole loop and 
came up with 13 1/2 inches. The measurement was taken from one side of 
the loop from the top of the loop to end just were just goes into the 
mounting backet. I need the lower half of UHF at 423mhz for receive 
only.
Thanks
Mike