Re: Hourly Network Checks Revisited...

[Nicholas Froome]

Irena said:


>Here's a little background on how the Retrospect client deals with network
>connectivity, so we can better understands why this is happening and how it
>might be addressed.
>
>The Retrospect client does in fact initiate a check of the network once an
>hour. It sends a request to Open Transport; if this is configured to use a
>dial-up connection, a dial-up will be initiated at that time. As mentioned,
>OT doesn't communicate the protocol to the client.

This should only be problematic with clients set to use PPP in the Open Transport 
Control Panel.

However, if the clients are set to use Ethernet and the LAN has a Routed 
dial-on-demand Internet connection, what happens when the clients initiate a network 
check? If the packet is destined for the LAN the Router would not initiate a call - 
but is that the case?


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Re: Hourly Network Checks Revisited...

[Irena Solomon]

Hello all,

Here's a little background on how the Retrospect client deals with network
connectivity, so we can better understands why this is happening and how it
might be addressed.

The Retrospect client does in fact initiate a check of the network once an
hour. It sends a request to Open Transport; if this is configured to use a
dial-up connection, a dial-up will be initiated at that time. As mentioned,
OT doesn't communicate the protocol to the client.

I've logged the suggestion for a checkbox on the client that forgoes network
checks if a connection isn't already established, and perhaps this can be
added in a future client software release. In the meantime, a few
suggestions:

1. Go to the Remote Access Control Panel -> Options -> Protocol -> PPP and
ensure that "Connect automatically when launching TCP/IP applications" is
unchecked.

2. The Location Manager script can be used to disable/enable the Retrospect
Client when Location Manager changes the TCP/IP settings to Ethernet. As
mentioned, this does require a reboot so the the Retrospect Client can
unload itself from the system.

Regards,

Irena Solomon
Technical Support Specialist
Dantz Development Corporation
925.253.3050
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


> From: Dean Brissinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Reply-To: "retro-talk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2000 09:53:48 -0600
> To: "retro-talk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Hourly Network Checks Revisited...
> 
> At 10:12 PM +1100 09/25/00, John F. Lambert wrote:
> 
>>> Ken Gillett wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> But I still maintain that NO software should cause unrequested
>>>> dialups, I'm sorry if you don't agree. I don't accept that it is
>>>> beyond the realms of possibility to only perform such checks if it
>>>> doesn't cause a dialup.
>>> 
>>> Peter S., the IPNR author, gets this type of bashing on his list all the
>>> time. His answer, and I assume it's true, is that a program can't tell
>>> if it's on a dial up connection. The OT code hides this from you. This
>>> causes a lot of support headaches for him as many of the problems are in
>>> the dialing, and he has no control over when and how that's happening.
>> 
>> Dantz needs the same check box on it's client software
> 
> I'm under the impression that the client software does not
> attempt to communicate with the network unless polled by the server.
> All connections are initiated with a broadcast from a Retrospect
> Backup Server (or script).
> 
> I have 2 G3 notebooks.  Both have Retrospect installed and
> have identical OSs (9.0.4).  One of them has this problem while the
> other does not.  The problem appeared when the laptop's user took it
> to a foreign network and they changed something in the configuration.
> I've been attempting to locate what changed.  I suspect the laptop is
> attempting to use NTP from the date and time control panel (however,
> this does not cause the dial-up effect on dial-up only machines).
> 
> I have noticed that the date and time CP on a dial-up only
> computer will attempt to connect to an NTP server the very moment you
> dial.  If the connection fails (poor line quality or busy signals...)
> the system reports a time-server error.  I suspect that while on a
> network and using the Location Manager to switch from Network to
> Dial-Up (without rebooting) the date and time control panel continues
> to check the time server.  I haven't verified this behavior, it's
> just suspicious.  I recall this being talked about on this thread
> earlier, but never read about any resolution.
> 
> 
> -- 
> . . . . . . . . ooo . . . . ooo . . . . . . . . .
> .   .
> .Dean Brissinger - Systems Administrator.
> .   Direct: 303-583-0278   Main: 303-444-0094   .
> .   Fax: 303-444-0470  http://www.vexcel.com/   .
> .   .
> . . . . . . . oOOo . . A . . oOOo . . . . . . . .
> 0 0
> '
> 
> 
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> For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.



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Re: Hourly Network Checks Revisited...

[Jim Cowing]

One thing to look at:

In the TCP/IP Control panel, set to advanced mode (via the edit menu):

Click the options button and make sure that "load only when needed" is
unchecked for machines that you don't want to initiate network activity when
unnecessary. However, if a machine is on a network, I strongly suggest to
keep the option checked.

I would be curios to know if this setting is different on your two
powerbooks.

Jim Cowing
Systems Engineer
Target Corporation

> From: Dean Brissinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> I'm under the impression that the client software does not
> attempt to communicate with the network unless polled by the server.
> All connections are initiated with a broadcast from a Retrospect
> Backup Server (or script).
> 
> I have 2 G3 notebooks.  Both have Retrospect installed and
> have identical OSs (9.0.4).  One of them has this problem while the
> other does not.  The problem appeared when the laptop's user took it
> to a foreign network and they changed something in the configuration.
> I've been attempting to locate what changed.  I suspect the laptop is
> attempting to use NTP from the date and time control panel (however,
> this does not cause the dial-up effect on dial-up only machines).
> 
> I have noticed that the date and time CP on a dial-up only
> computer will attempt to connect to an NTP server the very moment you
> dial.  If the connection fails (poor line quality or busy signals...)
> the system reports a time-server error.  I suspect that while on a
> network and using the Location Manager to switch from Network to
> Dial-Up (without rebooting) the date and time control panel continues
> to check the time server.  I haven't verified this behavior, it's
> just suspicious.  I recall this being talked about on this thread
> earlier, but never read about any resolution.
> 
> 
> -- 
> . . . . . . . . ooo . . . . ooo . . . . . . . . .
> .   .
> .Dean Brissinger - Systems Administrator.
> .   Direct: 303-583-0278   Main: 303-444-0094   .
> .   Fax: 303-444-0470  http://www.vexcel.com/   .
> .   .
> . . . . . . . oOOo . . A . . oOOo . . . . . . . .




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Re: Hourly Network Checks Revisited...

[Matt Barkdull]

>The problem appeared when the laptop's user took it to a foreign 
>network and they changed something in the configuration. I've been 
>attempting to locate what changed.  I suspect the laptop is 
>attempting to use NTP from the date and time control panel (however, 
>this does not cause the dial-up effect on dial-up only machines).


I'd check the TCP/IP control panel, Set user mode to advance, and 
then click on OPTIONs and make sure the "Load Only When Needed" 
button is unchecked.

Matt



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Re: Hourly Network Checks Revisited...

[Dean Brissinger]

At 10:12 PM +1100 09/25/00, John F. Lambert wrote:

>>Ken Gillett wrote:
>>>
>>>  But I still maintain that NO software should cause unrequested
>>>  dialups, I'm sorry if you don't agree. I don't accept that it is
>>>  beyond the realms of possibility to only perform such checks if it
>>>  doesn't cause a dialup.
>>
>>Peter S., the IPNR author, gets this type of bashing on his list all the
>>time. His answer, and I assume it's true, is that a program can't tell
>>if it's on a dial up connection. The OT code hides this from you. This
>>causes a lot of support headaches for him as many of the problems are in
>>the dialing, and he has no control over when and how that's happening.
>
>Dantz needs the same check box on it's client software

I'm under the impression that the client software does not 
attempt to communicate with the network unless polled by the server. 
All connections are initiated with a broadcast from a Retrospect 
Backup Server (or script).

I have 2 G3 notebooks.  Both have Retrospect installed and 
have identical OSs (9.0.4).  One of them has this problem while the 
other does not.  The problem appeared when the laptop's user took it 
to a foreign network and they changed something in the configuration. 
I've been attempting to locate what changed.  I suspect the laptop is 
attempting to use NTP from the date and time control panel (however, 
this does not cause the dial-up effect on dial-up only machines).

I have noticed that the date and time CP on a dial-up only 
computer will attempt to connect to an NTP server the very moment you 
dial.  If the connection fails (poor line quality or busy signals...) 
the system reports a time-server error.  I suspect that while on a 
network and using the Location Manager to switch from Network to 
Dial-Up (without rebooting) the date and time control panel continues 
to check the time server.  I haven't verified this behavior, it's 
just suspicious.  I recall this being talked about on this thread 
earlier, but never read about any resolution.


-- 
. . . . . . . . ooo . . . . ooo . . . . . . . . .
.   .
.Dean Brissinger - Systems Administrator.
.   Direct: 303-583-0278   Main: 303-444-0094   .
.   Fax: 303-444-0470  http://www.vexcel.com/   .
.   .
. . . . . . . oOOo . . A . . oOOo . . . . . . . .
  0 0
 '


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Re: Hourly Network Checks Revisited...

[Matt Barkdull]

I'm a bit confused here. You mean to tell me that Retrospect _client_ 
will cause dialups?   Strange that I have not had that problem at all 
with either of the laptops that I've had, and I do have dial on 
demand checked on both.

Now, if the server looks for a machine, I can see that waking up the 
port and dialing.

Plus, instead of disabling the client all together, doesn't just 
disabling the client in the control panel work?

Matt

ps. I suppose I should go back and read the original discussion, but 
to put it simply, I'm too Lazy...errr, I mean busy...   :)



>This thread is a bit old, but...
>
>>Ken Gillett wrote:
>>>
>>>  But I still maintain that NO software should cause unrequested
>>>  dialups, I'm sorry if you don't agree. I don't accept that it is
>>>  beyond the realms of possibility to only perform such checks if it
>>>  doesn't cause a dialup.
>>
>>Peter S., the IPNR author, gets this type of bashing on his list all the
>>time. His answer, and I assume it's true, is that a program can't tell
>>if it's on a dial up connection. The OT code hides this from you. This
>>causes a lot of support headaches for him as many of the problems are in
>>the dialing, and he has no control over when and how that's happening.
>
>
>This has got to be rubbish - just go to Eudora's preferences under 
>"Internet Dial-up"!  There is a check box marked
>
>"Don't check mail automatically if my Internet Dial-up software 
>isn't already connected"
>
>Dantz needs the same check box on it's client software
>
>"Don't check the network connection if my Internet Dial-up software 
>isn't already connected"
>
>This would work beautifully!  I am heartily sick of the delays 
>caused by automated dial-ups every hour!
>
>
>I hear your comments Matthew Tevenan, but there is simply no good 
>reason why Retrospect couldn't behave in this manner!
>
>My problem with your location manager suggestion is that often I 
>want to use my machine "on the road", and use location manager to 
>switch locations WITHOUT rebooting to install/deinstall the 
>Retrospect Client!
>
>John



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Hourly Network Checks Revisited...

[John F. Lambert]

This thread is a bit old, but...

>Ken Gillett wrote:
>>
>>  But I still maintain that NO software should cause unrequested
>>  dialups, I'm sorry if you don't agree. I don't accept that it is
>>  beyond the realms of possibility to only perform such checks if it
>>  doesn't cause a dialup.
>
>Peter S., the IPNR author, gets this type of bashing on his list all the
>time. His answer, and I assume it's true, is that a program can't tell
>if it's on a dial up connection. The OT code hides this from you. This
>causes a lot of support headaches for him as many of the problems are in
>the dialing, and he has no control over when and how that's happening.


This has got to be rubbish - just go to Eudora's preferences under 
"Internet Dial-up"!  There is a check box marked

"Don't check mail automatically if my Internet Dial-up software isn't 
already connected"

Dantz needs the same check box on it's client software

"Don't check the network connection if my Internet Dial-up software 
isn't already connected"

This would work beautifully!  I am heartily sick of the delays caused 
by automated dial-ups every hour!


I hear your comments Matthew Tevenan, but there is simply no good 
reason why Retrospect couldn't behave in this manner!

My problem with your location manager suggestion is that often I want 
to use my machine "on the road", and use location manager to switch 
locations WITHOUT rebooting to install/deinstall the Retrospect 
Client!

John


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