Re: How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures?
Dear Shay, 1. If you trying to identify phases PDF is most comprehensive database for this and COD (and others) could be used to expand the search in case of negative results with PDF. 2) You are missing data that are not in COD and PDF. For example CSD data are no longer included in PDF + any published data not included in any database. Peter Y. Zavalij Director - X-ray Crystallographic Center University of Maryland, College Park, M aryland On Tue, Jan 10, 2017 at 10:12 AM, Shay Tirosh wrote: > Dear retrievers > > I wander the followings: > 1. How much COD and PDF overlaps? > 2. What I am missing if I only search in COD and PDF? > > Are there any reviews addressing those questions ? > > Thank you from advance > > Shay > > > > > -- > _ > > Dr. Shay Tirosh > Institute for Nanotechnology & Advanced Materials > Bar Ilan University > Ramat Gan, 52900 > Israel > Phone: +972-(0)30-531-7320 > Mobile: +972-(0)54-8834533 <+972%2054-883-4533> > Email: stiro...@gmail.com > _ > > ++ > Please do NOT attach files to the whole list > > Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body > text > The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/ > rietveld_l@ill.fr/ > ++ > > > ++ Please do NOT attach files to the whole list Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body text The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/rietveld_l@ill.fr/ ++
RE: How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures?
I agree with Alan, and may add that searching for isomorphous structures can help and happens very often. Complex anions may replace single atom anions etc. For the inorganic world I strongly recommend the Pearson Crystal Data which allows for nice combined search using for example atomic coordination. Radovan Radovan Cerny Laboratoire de Cristallographie, DQMP Université de Genève 24, quai Ernest-Ansermet CH-1211 Geneva 4, Switzerland Phone : [+[41] 22] 37 964 50, FAX : [+[41] 22] 37 961 08 mailto : radovan.ce...@unige.ch<mailto:radovan.ce...@unige.ch> URL: http://www.unige.ch/sciences/crystal/cerny/rcerny.htm De : rietveld_l-requ...@ill.fr [mailto:rietveld_l-requ...@ill.fr] De la part de Alan Hewat Envoyé : mardi 10 janvier 2017 16:54 À : Shay Tirosh Cc : rietveld_l@ill.fr Objet : Re: How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures? It depends on what you want. If you want to identify a powder pattern you probably want to use the PDF, which may also help with the structure. If you want to find a particular structure, you can try COD. If you are planning a structure determination and want to be sure that it hasn't already been done, you should use ICSD (inorganic) or CCSD (organic) if the material contains carbon because those databases are exhaustive. If possible use all available databases, since it is expensive to do an experiment before doing a thorough literature search. Don't forget Google Scholar. Don't rely on databases; use them to find the original papers - then read them, don't just add them to your reference list. You should also consider how the database is searched. A simple search on the supposed formula may miss the structure described with a slightly different formula, or may miss isomorphous structures that may be almost as useful as the structure you require. Alan. On 10 January 2017 at 16:12, Shay Tirosh mailto:stiro...@gmail.com>> wrote: Dear retrievers I wander the followings: 1. How much COD and PDF overlaps? 2. What I am missing if I only search in COD and PDF? Are there any reviews addressing those questions ? Thank you from advance Shay -- _ Dr. Shay Tirosh Institute for Nanotechnology & Advanced Materials Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, 52900 Israel Phone: +972-(0)30-531-7320 Mobile: +972-(0)54-8834533 Email: stiro...@gmail.com<mailto:stiro...@gmail.com> _ ++ Please do NOT attach files to the whole list mailto:alan.he...@neutronoptics.com>> Send commands to mailto:lists...@ill.fr>> eg: HELP as the subject with no body text The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/rietveld_l@ill.fr/ ++ -- __ Dr Alan Hewat, NeutronOptics, Grenoble, FRANCE mailto:alan.he...@neutronoptics.com>> +33.476.98.41.68 http://www.NeutronOptics.com/hewat __ ++ Please do NOT attach files to the whole list Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body text The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/rietveld_l@ill.fr/ ++
Re: How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures?
At 17:12 10/01/2017 +0200, Shay Tirosh wrote: Dear retrievers I wander the followings: 1. How much COD and PDF overlaps? Indeed the answer is funny. It depends on you. How much of your own data have you sent to COD ? If zero, then there is no overlap at all, your own data will be only in PDF (unless you published in journals allowing the COD to grab for data, but they are very few). 2. What I am missing if I only search in COD and PDF? Same funny answer, given that the number of crystallographers sending their own data to the COD is itself absolutely funny. Best, Armel Le Bail ++ Please do NOT attach files to the whole list Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body text The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/rietveld_l@ill.fr/ ++
Re: How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures?
It depends on what you want. If you want to identify a powder pattern you probably want to use the PDF, which may also help with the structure. If you want to find a particular structure, you can try COD. If you are planning a structure determination and want to be sure that it hasn't already been done, you should use ICSD (inorganic) or CCSD (organic) if the material contains carbon because those databases are exhaustive. If possible use all available databases, since it is expensive to do an experiment before doing a thorough literature search. Don't forget Google Scholar. Don't rely on databases; use them to find the original papers - then read them, don't just add them to your reference list. You should also consider how the database is searched. A simple search on the supposed formula may miss the structure described with a slightly different formula, or may miss isomorphous structures that may be almost as useful as the structure you require. Alan. On 10 January 2017 at 16:12, Shay Tirosh wrote: > Dear retrievers > > I wander the followings: > 1. How much COD and PDF overlaps? > 2. What I am missing if I only search in COD and PDF? > > Are there any reviews addressing those questions ? > > Thank you from advance > > Shay > > > > > -- > _ > > Dr. Shay Tirosh > Institute for Nanotechnology & Advanced Materials > Bar Ilan University > Ramat Gan, 52900 > Israel > Phone: +972-(0)30-531-7320 > Mobile: +972-(0)54-8834533 <+972%2054-883-4533> > Email: stiro...@gmail.com > _ > > ++ > Please do NOT attach files to the whole list > > Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body > text > The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/ > rietveld_l@ill.fr/ > ++ > > > -- __ * Dr Alan Hewat, NeutronOptics, Grenoble, FRANCE * +33.476.98.41.68 http://www.NeutronOptics.com/hewat __ ++ Please do NOT attach files to the whole list Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body text The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/rietveld_l@ill.fr/ ++
RE: How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures?
This should be fun to watch… James P. Cline Materials Measurement Science Division National Institute of Standards and Technology 100 Bureau Dr. stop 8520 [ B113 / Bldg 217 ] Gaithersburg, MD 20899-8523USA jcl...@nist.gov<mailto:jcl...@nist.gov> (301) 975 5793 FAX (301) 975 5334 From: rietveld_l-requ...@ill.fr [mailto:rietveld_l-requ...@ill.fr] On Behalf Of Shay Tirosh Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 10:13 AM To: rietveld_l@ill.fr Subject: How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures? Dear retrievers I wander the followings: 1. How much COD and PDF overlaps? 2. What I am missing if I only search in COD and PDF? Are there any reviews addressing those questions ? Thank you from advance Shay -- _ Dr. Shay Tirosh Institute for Nanotechnology & Advanced Materials Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, 52900 Israel Phone: +972-(0)30-531-7320 Mobile: +972-(0)54-8834533 Email: stiro...@gmail.com<mailto:stiro...@gmail.com> _ ++ Please do NOT attach files to the whole list Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body text The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/rietveld_l@ill.fr/ ++
How much COD and PDF database gives the complete known structures?
Dear retrievers I wander the followings: 1. How much COD and PDF overlaps? 2. What I am missing if I only search in COD and PDF? Are there any reviews addressing those questions ? Thank you from advance Shay -- _ Dr. Shay Tirosh Institute for Nanotechnology & Advanced Materials Bar Ilan University Ramat Gan, 52900 Israel Phone: +972-(0)30-531-7320 Mobile: +972-(0)54-8834533 Email: stiro...@gmail.com _ ++ Please do NOT attach files to the whole list Send commands to eg: HELP as the subject with no body text The Rietveld_L list archive is on http://www.mail-archive.com/rietveld_l@ill.fr/ ++
