Re: [sage-devel] Re: Do we really need Element, RingElement, AdditiveGroupElement, ...?

[Jonas Jermann]

Hi

In one case I was forced to use CommutativeAlgebraElement because I
needed it's operations (e.g. __mul__) even though the category/class
from the parent (module) doesn't support it:

It sometimes makes sense to view (homogeneous) elements of a graded
ring as module elements (because operations might be specific to that 
module and not to the whole ring).


On the other hand we still want to be able to multiply those *module* 
elements of possibly different homogeneous parts.


So if we inherit from CommutativeAlgebraElement we get the __mul__
operation but we can still treat elements as module elements...

Or what is the "modern" approach/solution for this?
I found my own way of working with graded rings in sage but I also
noticed that the framework doesn't solve all problems and tricks
have to be used...


Best
Jonas

On 27.11.2015 13:59, Simon King wrote:

Hi Jeroen,

On 2015-11-26, Jeroen Demeyer  wrote:

On 2015-11-23, Travis Scrimshaw  wrote:

However, I'm +1 for flatting things down to Element as it would probably
solve #15160  and #15947
.


See #18756 or #18758. I think these would solve it eventually.


I don't really see how those tickets are related to getting rid of
classes like RingElement.


Perhaps I recall wrongly what I did in these tickets. Anyway, what I
recall is this:
- Implement the generic coercion framework in Element rather than in
   RingElement.
- Make it possible to implement an action via parent methods of a
   category.
- Preserve RingElement and friends for backwards compatibility and for
   applications for which few nanoseconds slowdown in multiplication
   matter.

Best regards,
Simon



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[sage-devel] Re: Have not got my trac account

[Ninad Bhat]

Thank you very much Nathann,
  Would me my pleasure help with the workload after I get used to trac.

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[sage-devel] Re: Have not got my trac account

[Nathann Cohen]

Hello,

   I had emailed my details to sage-trac-account @googlegroups.com on 
> Sunday, Nov 22.But, I still haven't got a trac account.Does it usually take 
> this much time?
>

It is done manually by some of us. Sometimes, everybody expects the others 
to do it, and the accounts are not created. Wouldn't hurt if there were 
more of us doing the job.

You account has been created, and you should have received your password a 
minute ago.

Welcome here,

Nathann 

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[sage-devel] Re: Mathematics without apologies - Portrait of a Problematical Vocation

[Henri Girard]

They aren't the only ones to get paid for doing pleasure !
Politicians are...and well paied...
I had to wait for retirement for doing my pleasure :)


Le mercredi 25 novembre 2015 19:18:51 UTC+1, rjf a écrit :
>
> This is a new book by Michael Harris.
>
> I have not read it, but there is an extensive review in the NY Review of 
> Books. (Dec 3, 2015)
>
> Apparently Harris *rejects* the argument that justifies pure mathematics
>  because of its beauty or truth (or its utility).  He says it is motivated 
> by pleasure.
>
> Why should society pay for a small group of people to exercise
> their creative powers on something they enjoy?
>
> "If a government minister asked me that question"  says Harris,
>
> "I could claim that mathematicians, like other academics, are needed in
> the universities to teach a specific population of students the skills
> needed for the development of a technological society and to keep
> a somewhat broader population of students occupied with courses
> that serve to crush the dreams of superfluous applicants to 
> particularly desirable professions (as freshman calculus used to be a
> formal requirement to enter medical school in the United States)"
>
> Maybe he knows someone at the NSF. :)
>
> Best wishes to all for a Happy Thanksgiving  (USA holiday this week).
>
> RJF
>

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[sage-devel] Re: Do we really need Element, RingElement, AdditiveGroupElement, ...?

[Simon King]

Hi Jeroen,

On 2015-11-26, Jeroen Demeyer  wrote:
>> On 2015-11-23, Travis Scrimshaw  wrote:
>>> However, I'm +1 for flatting things down to Element as it would probably
>>> solve #15160  and #15947
>>> .
>>
>> See #18756 or #18758. I think these would solve it eventually.
>
> I don't really see how those tickets are related to getting rid of 
> classes like RingElement.

Perhaps I recall wrongly what I did in these tickets. Anyway, what I
recall is this:
- Implement the generic coercion framework in Element rather than in
  RingElement.
- Make it possible to implement an action via parent methods of a
  category.
- Preserve RingElement and friends for backwards compatibility and for
  applications for which few nanoseconds slowdown in multiplication
  matter.

Best regards,
Simon

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: install_package('whatever')

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2015-11-27 09:06, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:

And server_pool makes it impossible to have %cython cells.


By the way, this is https://github.com/sagemath/sagenb/issues/260

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: install_package('whatever')

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2015-11-27 11:16, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:


And server_pool makes it impossible to have %cython cells.


As a workaround, doing

cython("""
# Cython code here
""")

does work.


Great!

Somebody please document this.


Or somebody fix %cython (one can wonder why %cython isn't just calling 
cython()).


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Re: [sage-devel] Re: install_package('whatever')

[Jori Mäntysalo]

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:


And server_pool makes it impossible to have %cython cells.


As a workaround, doing

cython("""
# Cython code here
""")

does work.


Great!

Somebody please document this. That could be part of "Sagemath perfomance 
tips" with Nathann Cohen's suggestions of installing packages like bliss.


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Re: [sage-devel] Re: install_package('whatever')

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2015-11-27 09:06, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:

And server_pool makes it impossible to have %cython cells.


As a workaround, doing

cython("""
# Cython code here
""")

does work.

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: install_package('whatever')

[Jori Mäntysalo]

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015, Volker Braun wrote:


The question was about the default notebook; We aren't going to remove
SageNB any time soon but for most users its not a good match. Also, jupyter
also has multiuser stuff (though not packaged in Sage), and a better
implementation thereof thats not totally oblivious to security.


AFAIK the only way to have secure SageNB is to use server_pool and 
different account for computing. Otherwise one can use system() to change 
files that take care of login.


And server_pool makes it impossible to have %cython cells. Is this going 
to change with jupyter?


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