Re: [sage-devel] Re: Cannot build sage 10.4.beta6 [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0]

[Edgar Costa]

I could, but I know I will be messing up with my system flint installation
in the future, and I would like to do that and keep sage happy.

Cheers,
Edgar

On Wed, May 22, 2024 at 10:58 AM Dima Pasechnik  wrote:

> On Wed, May 22, 2024 at 4:48 AM Edgar Costa 
> wrote:
> >
> > I ended up only needing the first combined with `--with-system-flint=no`
>
> can you skip `--with-system-flint=no` with your latest Homebrew's flint
> 3.1.3 ?
>
> >
> > On Tuesday, May 21, 2024 at 9:53:07 AM UTC-4 Kwankyu Lee wrote:
> >>
> >> You need
> >>
> >> https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/38025
> >>
> >> and possibly also
> >>
> >> https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/38021
> >>
> >> On Tuesday, May 21, 2024 at 9:44:30 PM UTC+9 Edgar Costa wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hello,
> >>>
> >>> Does someone has insights how t fix this?
> >>> I already told ./configure --with-system-givaro=no and removed my
> installed givaro via homebrew.
> >>>
> >>> You can find the logs here:
> https://gist.github.com/edgarcosta/32a8dd533cf88b937fa54194da7efe8d
> >>> But the main issue is here:
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   "Givaro::Integer::operator-(long
> long) const", referenced from:
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double
> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic
> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double
> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic
> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double
> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic void> >(Givaro::Modular const&) in ffpack_inst.o
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double
> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic
> >(Givaro::Modular const&) in ffpack_inst.o
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]
>  "Givaro::Integer::operator>>(int) const", referenced from:
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double
> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic
> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double
> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic
> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
> >>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install] ld: symbol(s) not found for
> architecture x86_64
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Thank you,
> >>> Edgar
> >>>
> >>>
> > --
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>

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[sage-devel] Re: Cannot build sage 10.4.beta6 [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0]

[Edgar Costa]

I ended up only needing the first combined with `--with-system-flint=no`

On Tuesday, May 21, 2024 at 9:53:07 AM UTC-4 Kwankyu Lee wrote:

> You need
>
> https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/38025
>
> and possibly also
>
> https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/38021
>
> On Tuesday, May 21, 2024 at 9:44:30 PM UTC+9 Edgar Costa wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Does someone has insights how t fix this?
>> I already told ./configure --with-system-givaro=no and removed my 
>> installed givaro via homebrew.
>>
>> You can find the logs here: 
>> https://gist.github.com/edgarcosta/32a8dd533cf88b937fa54194da7efe8d
>> But the main issue is here:
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   "Givaro::Integer::operator-(long 
>> long) const", referenced from:
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
>> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
>> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
>> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic> void> >(Givaro::Modular const&) in ffpack_inst.o
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
>> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>> >(Givaro::Modular const&) in ffpack_inst.o
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   "Givaro::Integer::operator>>(int) 
>> const", referenced from:
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
>> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
>> FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>> >(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
>> [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install] ld: symbol(s) not found for 
>> architecture x86_64
>>
>>
>> Thank you,
>> Edgar
>>
>>
>>

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[sage-devel] Cannot build sage 10.4.beta6 [fflas_ffpack-2.5.0]

[Edgar Costa]

Hello,

Does someone has insights how t fix this?
I already told ./configure --with-system-givaro=no and removed my installed 
givaro via homebrew.

You can find the logs here: 
https://gist.github.com/edgarcosta/32a8dd533cf88b937fa54194da7efe8d
But the main issue is here:
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   "Givaro::Integer::operator-(long 
long) const", referenced from:
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic >(Givaro::Modular const&) in ffpack_inst.o
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>(Givaro::Modular const&) in ffpack_inst.o
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   "Givaro::Integer::operator>>(int) 
const", referenced from:
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install]   double 
FFLAS::Protected::computeFactorClassic 
>(Givaro::ModularBalanced const&) in ffpack_inst.o
[fflas_ffpack-2.5.0] [spkg-install] ld: symbol(s) not found for 
architecture x86_64


Thank you,
Edgar


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Re: [sage-devel] pari-jupyter 1.4.3 release candidate

[Edgar Costa]

Bill Allombert has been working on a kernel via xeus:
https://pari.math.u-bordeaux.fr/git/xeus-gp.git/
Which addresses many of the issues with the current one.
While we for its first stable release, I recommend mine:
https://github.com/edgarcosta/gp_kernel/
where I have addressed many of the issues, by going through the route that
every cell is a temporary file, which is loaded in gp.


On Thu, Mar 21, 2024 at 4:29 AM Matthias Koeppe 
wrote:

> - https://pypi.org/project/pari-jupyter/1.4.3rc1/
> - I've added simple CODE_OF_CONDUCT and CONTRIBUTING files that just point
> to the main sagemath repository
> - using WIP sage-project-cookiecutter to simplify maintenance
> https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/37541
>
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: VOTE: disputed PRs

[Edgar Costa]

+1

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Re: [sage-devel] VOTE: Use "CI Fix" label for merging into continuous integration runs

[Edgar Costa]

+1

On Mon, Mar 4, 2024, 10:49 Giacomo Pope  wrote:

> +1
>
> On Monday, March 4, 2024 at 1:57:48 PM UTC Dima Pasechnik wrote:
>
>> +1
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 8:43 AM David Roe  wrote:
>>
>>> The following proposal has been made several times the last few weeks:
>>> in PR #37428 , in this
>>> thread  and then
>>> in this thread .
>>> It is orthogonal to the ongoing vote in this thread
>>> .  With no
>>> further discussion, I'm calling a vote.
>>>
>>> *Background*
>>>
>>> Starting in Sage 10.2, PRs with the Blocker label have been merged into
>>> all other PRs before running CI; see the changelog
>>> 
>>> and this post
>>> 
>>> for more details.  This has led to disagreements about whether this label
>>> should be applied.
>>>
>>> *Proposal*
>>> We use "CI Fix" rather than Blocker to determine whether an open PR
>>> should be merged before running CI.  Blocker will retain its previous
>>> meaning of a PR that should be merged before the next release is finished.
>>> The process below describes how to resolve disagreements about whether the
>>> "CI Fix" label should be applied.
>>> a. Only PRs with positive review should be marked with the "CI Fix"
>>> label.  This should be done if both author and reviewer agree that it is
>>> appropriate, and a rationale should be given in a comment on the ticket.
>>> b. If a PR becomes disputed (as described in this proposal
>>> ), the "CI Fix"
>>> status can be voted on separately upon request; otherwise it should be
>>> applied if and only if positive review is applied.
>>>
>>> Voting will be open until Wednesday, March 13.
>>> David
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>> --
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Disputed Pull Requests / Role Sage-Abuse and the Code of Conduct

[Edgar Costa]

>
> I suspect it's due to the latter used to Sage the distro as a "missing
> macOS
> package manager".
> So they are happy adding more and more spkgs to Sage.
> And Linux users rightly see adding to Sage spkgs, which
> package software available on their systems in a regular way,
> as a bloat, which moreover needs constant attention -
> while sagelib suffers.
>

macOS has several unofficial package managers.
In particular, homebrew makes it very easy for anyone to add a formula,
which is very similar to the way that spkg works.

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Re: [sage-devel] how to enter a bug in the future for sagemath in github with no github account?

[Edgar Costa]

Dear Nasser,

Please be constructive and transparent.

It is already the norm that when people report bugs to sage-devel, when
appropriate, a relevant GitHub issue is created.


Best,
Edgar


On Mon, Dec 11, 2023 at 4:47 PM 'Nasser M. Abbasi' via sage-devel <
sage-devel@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> " You can use a terminal program called pass
> (pass otp, to be precise), or you can get a special USB stick (yubico).
> You'll need to authorise your browser once, and typically as long as you
> don't log out/reboot, you remain authorised."
>
> Thanks, but this is way too complicated for me. I do not want to deal with
> any of this.
>
> I can only handle login using account+password. If I have to do more to
> login to a web site, I am not going to bother and not interested.
>
> If sagemath can setup either usenet group (can
> https://groups.google.com/g/sage-support  be used for this?) or
> email address to send bug reports, that will be much better and much
> easier for many people I am sure.
>
> Thanks
> --Nasser
>
>
> On Monday, December 11, 2023 at 3:39:04 PM UTC-6 Dima Pasechnik wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Dear Nasser,
>>
>> On 11 December 2023 21:18:18 GMT, "'Nasser M. Abbasi' via sage-devel" <
>> sage-...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >I got email today that my github account will be terminated if I do not
>> do
>> >that 2FA (two factor authentication) each time to login.
>> >
>> >I am not interested in 2FA, I do not know how to use smart phones and do
>> >not want text messages and emails and copying code and so on each time
>> to
>> >login.
>>
>> You don't need a smartphone for 2FA.
>> You can use a terminal program called pass
>> (pass otp, to be precise), or you can get a special USB stick (yubico).
>> You'll need to authorise your browser once, and typically as long as you
>> don't log out/reboot, you remain authorised.
>>
>> Please let me know if you need more instructions on how to set it up and
>> use pass (iirc, I posted hete on this some time ago).
>>
>> We can perhaps put something on the wiki in that regard.
>>
>> Yes, we can look for ways around it, such as a special mailing list - but
>> we'd rather buy you a Yubico key for 2FA.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Dima
>>
>> > I hate smart phones and can't even do texting and do not to deal
>> >with all this complexity just to login. I think account+password is
>> enough.
>> >
>> >The email from Github says will take effect by 1/25/2023. So my current
>> >github account which I now use to report sagemath bugs when I do CAS
>> >integration tests will not work after that if I do not do 2FA I assume:
>> >
>> >"After this date, your access to GitHub.com will be limited until you
>> >enroll in 2FA"
>> >
>> >My question is: since sagemath has now moved to github, are there other
>> >ways to still be able to report such problems to sagemath if found
>> without
>> >having an account at github?
>> >
>> >I have no need for github myself, I only made my account to be able to
>> >report bugs that I find. Is there a sagemath email to send bug reports
>> to
>> >for example and then someone else can enter these into github?
>> >
>> >Thank you
>> >--Nasser
>> >
>>
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>

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Re: [sage-devel] Cython errors when building p_group_cohomology

[Edgar Costa]

Marc, you should try something like this:
https://github.com/edgarcosta/pyfib/commit/f30cd702f5b8610a284b1b1f425ef22b2a2a11fa

On Wed, Nov 15, 2023 at 6:49 PM Marc Culler  wrote:

> I am not able to build the optional package p_group_cohomology in 10.2.rc2
> due to cython errors.
>
> The first error looks like:
>
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]   Error compiling Cython file:
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]   ---
> -
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]   ...
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]   from sage.structure.element cimport Element
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]   from .map cimport Map
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]   ^
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]   ---
> -
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]
> [p_group_cohomology-3.3.3.p1]
> /XXX/local/var/lib/sage/venv-python3.11.1/lib/python3.11/site-packages/sage/categories/morphism.pxd:2:0:
> 'sage/categories/map.pxd' not found
>
> In fact, the file map.pxd does exist in the same directory as
> morphism.pxd, which is the file containing the failing cimport line.  But
> the missing path reported by cython is not an absolute path:
> sage/categories/map.pxd.  I don't know to which base directory that
> relative path is meant to be applied, but evidently it is wrong.
>
> I will attach the log file.
>
> - Marc
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: External cython cimports fail in Sage 10.2.beta8

[Edgar Costa]

In case someone else stumbles on this, this was my fix
<https://github.com/edgarcosta/pyfib/commit/f30cd702f5b8610a284b1b1f425ef22b2a2a11fa>
:

from Cython.Build import cythonize as cython_cythonize

try:
from sage.misc.package_dir import cython_namespace_package_support
def cythonize(*args, **kwargs):
with cython_namespace_package_support():
return cython_cythonize(*args, **kwargs)
except ImportError:
cythonize = cython_cythonize

On Sun, Oct 29, 2023 at 8:08 PM Matthias Koeppe 
wrote:

> You'll need sage.misc.package_dir.cython_namespace_package_support
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, October 29, 2023 at 5:00:08 PM UTC-7 Edgar Costa wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Cythonizing a package, via setuptools, that uses a `from sage.foo cimport
>> bar` seems to no longer work with Sage 10.2.beta8
>>
>> Here is a minimal example:
>> sage -pip install git+https://github.com/edgarcosta/pyfib.git@main
>>
>> here is the error log:
>> https://gist.github.com/edgarcosta/a0a189839c9053c30a33f60435431957
>>
>> Note, that one can also try to install the package without the `from
>> sage.rings.integer cimport Integer`, via
>> sage -pip install git+https://github.com/edgarcosta/pyfib.git@nosage
>> and then everything works as expected.
>>
>> I believe this has something to do with  PEP-420 and the recent upgrade
>> to Cython3.0
>>
>> https://cython.readthedocs.io/en/latest/src/userguide/migrating_to_cy30.html#namespace-packages
>>
>> Furthermore, by looking at commits like this one
>>
>> https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/36110/commits/cb78fd95b03678f821bc575c683feb74f860105c
>> it gives me the idea that there is something to do with relative imports,
>> but I am not sure.
>>
>> Any insight would be appreciated, as all my Cython pip installable
>> packages fail exactly the same way.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Edgar
>>
>> --
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[sage-devel] External cython cimports fail in Sage 10.2.beta8

[Edgar Costa]

Hello,

Cythonizing a package, via setuptools, that uses a `from sage.foo cimport
bar` seems to no longer work with Sage 10.2.beta8

Here is a minimal example:
sage -pip install git+https://github.com/edgarcosta/pyfib.git@main

here is the error log:
https://gist.github.com/edgarcosta/a0a189839c9053c30a33f60435431957

Note, that one can also try to install the package without the `from
sage.rings.integer cimport Integer`, via
sage -pip install git+https://github.com/edgarcosta/pyfib.git@nosage
and then everything works as expected.

I believe this has something to do with  PEP-420 and the recent upgrade to
Cython3.0
https://cython.readthedocs.io/en/latest/src/userguide/migrating_to_cy30.html#namespace-packages

Furthermore, by looking at commits like this one
https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/36110/commits/cb78fd95b03678f821bc575c683feb74f860105c
it gives me the idea that there is something to do with relative imports,
but I am not sure.

Any insight would be appreciated, as all my Cython pip installable packages
fail exactly the same way.

Cheers,
Edgar

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: opinions requested on x + y behaviour for polynomials

[Edgar Costa]

Frederic,

Magma is quite pedantic and doesn't let you do that.
> R := PolynomialRing(Integers(),2);
> S := PolynomialRing(Integers(),2);
> x1 + y1;

>> x1 + y1;
  ^
Runtime error in '+': Arguments are not compatible
Argument types given: RngMPolElt, RngMPolElt

However, I should also point out that Magma has some global rings, e.g.,
ZZ, QQ, ZZ[x], QQ[x], and thus, one might be misled into thinking that they
constructed two different rings:
> R := PolynomialRing(Integers());
> S := PolynomialRing(Integers());
> x eq y;
true
> x + y;
2*y

Cheers,
Edgar

On Sat, Aug 26, 2023 at 11:51 AM John H Palmieri 
wrote:

> In principle it seems okay, but to be honest, I don't think I understand
> Sage's polynomial rings. It seems like anything goes:
>
> sage: R. = GF(2)[]
> sage: S. = R[]
> sage: S
> sage: R.0 + S.0
> x + x
>
> Why am I allowed to construct S?
>
> With your proposed changes, what happens in the following situation:
>
> sage: T. = QQ[]
> sage: U. = QQ[]
> sage: t1, t2 = T.gens()
> sage: u1, u2 = U.gens()
>
> Can I now add t1, t2, u1, u2 by automatically creating QQ[x,y,z]?
>
> Do we merge, and therefore identify, QQ[x,y] with QQ[y,x]?
>
>
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 12:22:39 AM UTC-7 Frédéric Chapoton wrote:
>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> currently, if x and y are in two different polynomial rings, one cannot
>> add them.
>>
>> I propose in https://github.com/sagemath/sage/pull/36138 a sketch of
>> changes that would build a common polynomial ring by taking the union of
>> variables. This does not break too many things. Instead many doctests
>> checking for coercion failure now report coercion success. There are still
>> a few problematic things to solve, in particular about infinite polynomials
>> rings.
>>
>> Please express your opinion about that change of behaviour.
>>
>> Frederic
>>
>> Question: what does magma do ?
>>
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Re: [sage-devel] Memory leak (quite bad)

[Edgar Costa]

Two users try to use 51% of the memory simultaneously.

On Fri, Jul 7, 2023 at 11:01 AM Nils Bruin  wrote:

> On Friday, 7 July 2023 at 07:53:22 UTC-7 Edgar Costa wrote:
>
> I'm okay with a user using 90% of the ram, if that becomes an issue, I can
> always email them or kill their process, but more often than not, until I
> started to use earlyoom is that the memory usage slowly creeps to 100% and
> the culprit process only gets killed by oom or a power cycle.
>
>
> In that case, would you get the desired result by setting the relevant
> ulimit to 90% ? I'm trying to understand what earlyoom offers over the
> quota system that posix offers out of the box.
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Memory leak (quite bad)

[Edgar Costa]

Nils,

This is my recommendation to avoid my worst-case scenario, where someone
must go to some far away basement and power cycle the server manually after
waiting a couple of days for OOM kicking in.
I'm okay with a user using 90% of the ram, if that becomes an issue, I can
always email them or kill their process, but more often than not, until I
started to use earlyoom is that the memory usage slowly creeps to 100% and
the culprit process only gets killed by oom or a power cycle.

Cheers,
Edgar

On Thu, Jul 6, 2023 at 8:56 PM Michael Orlitzky 
wrote:

> On 2023-07-06 09:16:46, Nils Bruin wrote:
> > > On Wednesday, 5 July 2023 at 08:29:44 UTC-7 Edgar Costa wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Gonzalo,
> > >
> > > I highly recommend using https://github.com/rfjakob/earlyoom instead
> of
> > > waiting for OOM to kick in.
> >
> > Wouldn't setting ulimit with -m (memory) or -v (virtual memory) for the
> > process that is liable to exceed its memory quota be a more sensible
> thing?
>
> If you don't need a portable solution, then on linux, cgroups are the
> most flexible way to leave yourself juuust enough RAM to be able to
> move your mouse over the X.
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Memory leak (quite bad)

[Edgar Costa]

Hi Gonzalo,

I highly recommend using https://github.com/rfjakob/earlyoom instead of
waiting for OOM to kick in.

Cheers,
Edgar

On Wed, Jul 5, 2023 at 11:24 AM Gonzalo Tornaria  wrote:

> This slowly and inexorably goes on. Computing `sqrt(T2)` leaks 32 bytes
> each and every time (asymptotically).
>
> Found by a student who, through no fault of himself, brought down our
> server (unable to ssh in until the OOM triggered -- but since the leak is
> slow it takes a while to trash 16G of swap).
>
> ===
> $ cat memleak.py
> from sage.all import sqrt
> T2 = sqrt(2)
> import psutil
> ps = psutil.Process()
> base = ps.memory_info().rss
> for a in range(1, 10):
> for b in range(num := 100_000):
> C = sqrt(T2)
> mem = ps.memory_info().rss - base
> print(f"{mem/1e6 :.2f} MB ({mem/a/num :.2f} bytes/iter)")
> $ sage memleak.py
> 2.70 MB (27.03 bytes/iter)
> 5.95 MB (29.74 bytes/iter)
> 9.19 MB (30.64 bytes/iter)
> 12.44 MB (31.09 bytes/iter)
> 15.41 MB (30.82 bytes/iter)
> 18.65 MB (31.09 bytes/iter)
> 21.90 MB (31.28 bytes/iter)
> 25.14 MB (31.43 bytes/iter)
> 28.39 MB (31.54 bytes/iter)
> ===
>
> Replace the 10 in the outer loop by something larger at your own peril
> (each outer iteration will take 3.2M so 10_000 should kill a laptop in an
> hour or two).
>
> This is with system sagemath 10.0 but it also happens with 9.6, 9.7, 9.8
> and 10.0 in cocalc.com.
>
> Best,
> Gonzalo
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Voting: Block-scoped optional tag and the keyword

[Edgar Costa]

I vote for (A)

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 6:27 PM Marc Culler  wrote:

> I vote for (C).
>
> On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 9:40:07 PM UTC-5 Kwankyu Lee wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> We spent six days for the preliminary discussion in the sage-devel thread
>>
>> https://groups.google.com/g/sage-devel/c/OUnoroIf0qc
>>
>> about choosing the keyword triggering block-scoped optional tag needed in
>>
>> https://github.com/sagemath/sage/issues/35750
>>
>> We now start the voting with the four candidates (A), (B), (C), (D). The
>> voting will end 7th July 23:59 KST (Korea Standard Time). During the
>> voting, discussions can continue in the linked places but please only your
>> vote (and, if you will, short comment) to this thread.
>>
>> (A) "needs"
>>
>> sage: # needs sage.rings.number_field
>> sage: QQbar(I)^2
>> -1
>> sage: QQbar(I)^10 # long time
>> 1
>>
>> sage: # needs sage.rings.finite_rings
>> sage: F = GF(7)
>> sage: F(1) + QQbar(1)  # needs sage.rings.number_field
>> ...
>>
>> (B) "requires"
>>
>> sage: # requires sage.rings.number_field
>> sage: QQbar(I)^2
>> -1
>> sage: QQbar(I)^10  # long time
>> 1
>>
>> sage: # requires sage.rings.finite_rings
>> sage: F = GF(7)
>> sage: F(1) + QQbar(1)  # requires sage.rings.number_field
>> ...
>>
>> (C) "uses"
>>
>> sage: # uses sage.rings.number_field
>> sage: QQbar(I)^2
>> -1
>> sage: QQbar(I)^10  # long time
>> 1
>>
>> sage: # uses sage.rings.finite_rings
>> sage: F = GF(7)
>> sage: F(1) + QQbar(1)  # uses sage.rings.number_field
>> ...
>>
>> (D) "standard"
>>
>> sage: # use standard feature - sage.rings.number_field
>> sage: QQbar(I)^2
>> -1
>> sage: QQbar(I)^10  # long time
>> 1
>>
>> sage: # use standard feature - sage.rings.finite_rings
>> sage: F = GF(7)
>> sage: F(1) + QQbar(1)  # standard - sage.rings.number_field
>> ...
>>
>> Please just focus on the keyword. Don't worry about minor details or
>> punctuations: the keyword would be recognized, the rest would be ignored
>> noise, in the implementation.
>>
>> Thanks for your attention. Happy voting :-)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Why matrix powers are slower over Integers(p) than in ZZ?

[Edgar Costa]

Indeed, that is what we should use for single-word modulus.
I think David and I wrote a wrapper at some point, but then we did not use
it?

On Thu, Jun 15, 2023 at 8:26 AM Dima Pasechnik  wrote:

> Flint has matrices mod n, see  https://flintlib.org/doc/nmod_mat.html
> I guess they should be fast - but they need Sage interface to be provided.
>
> On Thu, Jun 15, 2023 at 1:01 PM Georgi Guninski 
> wrote:
> >
> > On Wed, Jun 14, 2023 at 8:15 PM David Roe  wrote:
> > >
> > >  Another possibility would be to change the __pow__ method for integer
> matrices to not ignore the modulus argument.  As a workaround you can
> either use pari (as you discovered), or use an integer matrix and
> occasionally reduce the coefficients.
> >
> > I implemented something very close to efficiently reduction modulo
> integers
> > when working over ZZ and probably it can implemented in __pow__().
> >
> > check the attached file.
> >
> > sage: time M1f=matpowermodp(M,n,p)
> > CPU times: user 528 ms, sys: 2.98 ms, total: 531 ms
> > Wall time: 362 ms
> > sage: time M1s=M1p**n
> > CPU times: user 21.3 s, sys: 4.01 ms, total: 21.3 s
> > Wall time: 21.4 s
> > sage: M1s==M1f
> > True
> >
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: images lacking on docker hub

[Edgar Costa]

I realized that one of my messages never got to the mailing list.

If we agree that we would like to keep having this, then we should move the
> old gitlab workflow to GitHub.
> I have minimal experience building dockers, but these are quite convenient
> when you suddenly break your sage due to some external library upgrade or
> when you are trying to use a code that was written for a version of the
> past.
>

I am happy to help with maintaining the docker images.
But maybe first I should try to build them myself :)

On Thu, May 11, 2023 at 9:29 AM julian...@fsfe.org 
wrote:

> Sorry, I didn't see this thread.
>
> I do have the credentials for docker hub. I am happy to share them with
> anybody who wants to help with maintaining the docker images. (I don't use
> the docker images anymore myself so I do not really maintain them anymore.
> Also, the automatic infrastructure that we used to update them broke years
> ago which makes the process quite a bit of work. With each release of
> SageMath, something in the build process breaks typically. We could migrate
> this to GitHub workflows but it's also a fair amount of work and, again
> since I am not using the images, I don't feel very motivated to champion
> that process.)
>
> julian
>
> On Thursday, May 11, 2023 at 3:27:20 PM UTC+3 Frédéric Chapoton wrote:
>
>> asking again : who has the rights for the docker user *sagemathadmins* ?
>>
>> Frédéric
>>
>> Le dimanche 23 avril 2023 à 10:33:42 UTC+2, Frédéric Chapoton a écrit :
>>
>>> There are some instructions for that at the top of our
>>> docker/Dockerfile. But I guess there is also a matter of rights, no ? Who
>>> is allowed to do that ? Maybe Julian ?
>>>
>>> Le mercredi 5 avril 2023 à 10:18:27 UTC+2, Frédéric Chapoton a écrit :
>>>
 Hello,

 it seems that no recent image is available on docker hub:

 https://hub.docker.com/search?q=sagemath%2Fsage

 In particular, 9.8 is not there.
 Is there a way to manually update that, if there is no automatic
 mechanism to do the job ?

 Frédéric

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: images lacking on docker hub

[Edgar Costa]

Either Julian Ruth or whoever set up https://gitlab.com/sagemath/sage

I have also asked on Zulip
https://sagemath.zulipchat.com/#narrow/stream/271070-help---build/topic/Docker/near/357583892

Best,
Edgar

On Thu, May 11, 2023 at 8:27 AM Frédéric Chapoton 
wrote:

> asking again : who has the rights for the docker user *sagemathadmins* ?
>
> Frédéric
>
> Le dimanche 23 avril 2023 à 10:33:42 UTC+2, Frédéric Chapoton a écrit :
>
>> There are some instructions for that at the top of our docker/Dockerfile.
>> But I guess there is also a matter of rights, no ? Who is allowed to do
>> that ? Maybe Julian ?
>>
>> Le mercredi 5 avril 2023 à 10:18:27 UTC+2, Frédéric Chapoton a écrit :
>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> it seems that no recent image is available on docker hub:
>>>
>>> https://hub.docker.com/search?q=sagemath%2Fsage
>>>
>>> In particular, 9.8 is not there.
>>> Is there a way to manually update that, if there is no automatic
>>> mechanism to do the job ?
>>>
>>> Frédéric
>>>
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Re: [sage-devel] RealField isn't doing it right

[Edgar Costa]

You keep saying
> Any normal mathematician who writes "e^1.1" intends that to mean
"e^(11/10)".

To be honest, I don't think that is the case, if a paper presented to you
some constant gamma = 1.1, you would not assume that gamma is 11/10, but
instead that an approximation to 2 decimal digits for gamma is "1.1".
That is the meaning of finite decimal expansion!

A valid complaint could perhaps be, why are you casting gamma to 53 bits
when I didn't give you that many, I think you know the answer to that
question.

On Tue, Apr 18, 2023 at 8:18 PM David Roe  wrote:

>
>
> On Tue, Apr 18, 2023 at 8:15 PM aw  wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday, April 18, 2023 at 4:19:45 PM UTC-6 Nils Bruin wrote:
>>
>>
>> It may not be the default, but you can still have it! As referenced
>> before, just execute upon startup:
>>
>> old_RealNumber=RealNumber
>> def RealNumber(*args, **kwargs):
>> return QQ(old_RealNumber(*args, **kwargs))
>>
>> You can place it in a startup file so that it is in force for all your
>> subsequent sessions. See:
>> https://doc.sagemath.org/html/en/reference/repl/startup.html
>>
>>
>> Thanks for this, but that would be a global substitution, right?
>>
>> I'm arguing just for a local substitution, in the high-precision
>> environments only.
>>
>
> It's not possible in Python to interpret 1.1 as 11/10 in a high-precision
> environment and as a normal float otherwise, unless you do something that
> "takes a lot of work," which you claimed you weren't trying to suggest.
> David
>
>
>>
>> -aw
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [sage-devel] RealField isn't doing it right

[Edgar Costa]

>
> It's reasonable to expect that multiplying by one won't cause a viable
> alternative to Mathematica et al. to go bonkers. I haven't declared a
> float variable, and I haven't type-cast anything to float. The
> expression "0.5" is, a priori, quite equal to 1/2. Mathematica knows
> it
>

I believe you misunderstand Mathematica semantics.

Mathematica 12.0.0 Kernel for Mac OS X x86 (64-bit)
Copyright 1988-2019 Wolfram Research, Inc.

In[1]:= 2*0.5 === 1
Out[1]= False
In[2]:= 2*1/2 === 1
Out[2]= True
In[3]:= 2*0.5 == 1
Out[3]= True
In[4]:= 3004166023946433/10^15 == E^1.1
Out[4]= True

Wolfram Alpha also has beginners and students as a big chunk of its user
> base, and they get the default semantics exactly right.
>

Do they?
https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=100+digits+of+e%5E1.1
https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=100+digits+of+e%5E%2811%2F10%29

On Sun, Apr 16, 2023 at 6:45 PM Nils Bruin  wrote:

> On Sunday, 16 April 2023 at 14:31:43 UTC-7 aw wrote:
>
> Awesome, let's talk about floating point semantics. [...]
> We zero-pad the 1.1 to whatever length is needed to match the other number.
> Because we see 1.1 as a shorthand for 1.1  (infinitely
> many zeros)
>
>
> That's the ordinary-person semantics of the string "1.1".
>
>
> That's not floating-point semantics. That's just a funny way of writing
> 11/10. Those are also not the semantics that scientific calculators use (or
> excel for that matter), so I suspect that "ordinary persons" are already
> quite used to 1.1 not meaning an exact  rational number but a possible
> approximation to something quite close to 11/10. In fact, I've seen people
> use this as an argument why standard units are more precise than metric:
> one would talk about 5/16 in, but that is only approximately 0.79375 cm
> (I'm not saying I'm convinced by the argument, but it is a good
> illustration that ordinary people are quite aware of rounding errors in
> decimal fraction notation)
>
> The fact that computers often don't use base-10 floating point but base-2
> floating point is a more subtle trap, but once you're realizing that doing
> floating point arithmetic quickly leads to not all your digits being
> accurate, those difference tend to only be in digits that you shouldn't be
> trusting anyway.
>
> Perhaps you're interested in exploring RealLazyField. It actually attempts
> to provide a framework to compute with (some) real numbers exactly. I don't
> think it's ready to be the default just yet, if ever.
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Procedure to be a member of sage github organization

[Edgar Costa]

Most likely not the status quo at the moment, but if a PR is not ready to
be reviewed should be marked as a draft, which the author can do without
any special permissions.
Otherwise, I would assume the PR is ready to be reviewed.

On Fri, Feb 24, 2023 at 9:43 PM Trevor Karn  wrote:

> How do new developers tag their PR as "needs review" without having triage
> access?
>
> On Thursday, February 23, 2023 at 1:37:07 AM UTC-6 David Roe wrote:
>
>> As a first proposal: once you have a PR accepted then you're added to the
>> sagemath organization.  I'm not sure exactly what the cutoff should be for
>> being added to triage (which gives the capability of changing labels,
>> closing and assigning issues and PRs, requesting PR reviews, applying
>> milestones and marking as duplicate.  I'm fine with giving these
>> permissions to people after their first PR is merged, but some might argue
>> for more of a history with contributors.
>>
>> Julian and I had talked about writing a bot to handle these permissions,
>> but haven't gotten around to it yet.
>> David
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2023 at 5:33 AM Kwankyu Lee  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> We are getting PRs from non-member contributors.
>>>
>>> What is the procedure or the condition to be invited for membership?
>>>
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[sage-devel] Re: VOTE: move Sage development to Github

[Edgar Costa]

+1 for Github

On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 1:23:36 PM UTC-4 David Roe wrote:

> Dear Sage developers,
> Following extensive discussion, both recently 
>  
> (prompted 
> by issues upgrading the trac server) and over 
>  the 
>  last 
>  
> decade 
> , we 
> are calling a vote on switching Sage development from Trac 
>  to Github .  We've 
> created a summary of the pros and cons of each system 
> , a 
> description 
> of the development model to be used on github 
> , 
> and a trac ticket  for 
> coordinating work on the transition.  More work will need to be done to 
> carry out the actual transition once voting is complete.
>
> The voting will last until noon Eastern time (16:00 UTC) on Wednesday, 
> October 5.  Please use this thread only for sending votes, to make it 
> easier to count them afterward; there is a parallel thread where you can 
> make arguments in favor of either system.
>
> Finally, I will close with a plea to be involved in this vote and 
> discussion even if you are not a core Sage developer.  By definition, core 
> Sage developers have become comfortable with trac, and I think that one of 
> the major arguments in favor of github is that it will help bring in new 
> contributors who are not familiar with Sage's development workfow 
> .  Anyone who has 
> ever contributed to the Sage code base or who maintains a Sage user package 
> is welcome to vote.
> David
>

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