Re: Free ipa on sl7.3

[David Sommerseth]

On 27/06/17 12:47, Niels Walet wrote:
> I seem to have some serious issues with ipa on sl 7.3; on installing on
> a client, the install works through fine until it bombs on the following
> issue:
> 

Re: tip: Secondary Selection clipboard

[Ken Teh]

Time to hang it up?

I use the clipboard all the time especially when I'm coding. Multiple terminals 
each running a copy of vim.


I notice that many young programmers also use terminals and vim (or neovim) on 
Macs. At least on videos of programming topics I'm interested in.  Do they not 
use the clipboard?


On a more philosophical note:  I recall reading the X11 was all about capability 
and not policy.  People who design software nowadays seem to be all about policy 
and not capability. This is how you should do things.  F**k you if you don't get 
it.


Very un-unix if you ask me.  The one feature I love about unix is the countless 
permutations one can use its command line utilities to solve problems. Feeds the 
creative side of me, methinks.  That's why I never got much into GUIs.


Oh well, the future belongs to the young. Maybe it is time to hang it up.



On 06/27/2017 08:05 AM, Tom H wrote:

On Tue, Jun 27, 2017 at 8:19 AM, Andrew C Aitchison
 wrote:

On Tue, 27 Jun 2017, Tom H wrote:

On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 4:38 PM, ToddAndMargo 
wrote:


I have been using UNIX and Linux for over 25 years and did not
realize X11 has four clipboards. I recently discovered the Secondary
Selection keyboard.

It really saves a bunch of time when I am programming as I don't
lose my cursor's hot spot.

Here is a great 8 minute video demonstrating all four clipboards. It
is must learn for anyone using Linux.

http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/Secondary-Selection.mp4

To support this clipboard, your program has to use the GTK Toolkit.


Thanks. I didn't know about this secondary clipboard. I've just tried
it on my laptop running Ubuntu 17.10 but it didn't work. I suspect
that it's been deep-sixed in Gnome Shell and Unity.


I was interested in the secondary clipboard too, and looked at
http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/secondary-selection.html which makes
clear that this is not a standard gtk feature; there are experimental
modified gtk3 libraries which support secondary selection (no source
yet).

gtk3 means it doesn't run on SL6, so I haven't been able to explore further.


The author of "Secondary-Selection.mp4" asked about it on the gtk
development list

https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-devel-list/2016-August/msg00036.html

and the answer was

https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-devel-list/2016-August/msg00037.html

Part of the response:

We still (optionally) support the PRIMARY selection on the X11 backend,
and some compatibility layer for it on Wayland, but we have no plans on
adding support for the SECONDARY selection, as it's both barely
specified and, like the PRIMARY, highly confusing for anybody who is not
well-versed in 20+ years of use of textual interfaces on the X Windows
System. Personally, I would have jettisoned the PRIMARY selection a long
time ago as well, but apparently a very vocal minority is still holding
tight to that particular Easter egg. Adding support for the even more
esoteric SECONDARY selection on the X11 backend when we're trying to
move the Linux world towards the more modern and less legacy-ridden
Wayland display system would be problematic to say the least, and an ill
fit for the majority of graphical user experiences in use these days.

unsubscribe

[William Babbitt]

> Begin forwarded message:
> 
> From: Lars Behrens 
> Subject: Re: tip: Secondary Selection clipboard
> Date: June 27, 2017 at 9:15:55 AM EDT
> To: 
> 
> Am 27.06.2017 um 15:05 schrieb Tom H:
> 
>> We still (optionally) support the PRIMARY selection on the X11 backend,
>> and some compatibility layer for it on Wayland, but we have no plans on
>> adding support for the SECONDARY selection, as it's both barely
>> specified and, like the PRIMARY, highly confusing for anybody who is not
>> well-versed in 20+ years of use of textual interfaces on the X Windows
>> System. Personally, I would have jettisoned the PRIMARY selection a long
>> time ago as well, but apparently a very vocal minority is still holding
>> tight to that particular Easter egg. Adding support for the even more
>> esoteric SECONDARY selection on the X11 backend when we're trying to
>> move the Linux world towards the more modern and less legacy-ridden
>> Wayland display system would be problematic to say the least, and an ill
>> fit for the majority of graphical user experiences in use these days.
> 
> 
> Boy. I really dislike his arrogant sound. Already stumbled over
> something similar on the net, obviously written by that same guy.
> 
> Primary selection for me is a major feature in GUI *and* shell.
> 
> Cheerz,
> Lars
> 
> 

Re: tip: Secondary Selection clipboard

[Tom H]

On Tue, Jun 27, 2017 at 8:19 AM, Andrew C Aitchison
 wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Jun 2017, Tom H wrote:
>> On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 4:38 PM, ToddAndMargo 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have been using UNIX and Linux for over 25 years and did not
>>> realize X11 has four clipboards. I recently discovered the Secondary
>>> Selection keyboard.
>>>
>>> It really saves a bunch of time when I am programming as I don't
>>> lose my cursor's hot spot.
>>>
>>> Here is a great 8 minute video demonstrating all four clipboards. It
>>> is must learn for anyone using Linux.
>>>
>>> http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/Secondary-Selection.mp4
>>>
>>> To support this clipboard, your program has to use the GTK Toolkit.
>>
>> Thanks. I didn't know about this secondary clipboard. I've just tried
>> it on my laptop running Ubuntu 17.10 but it didn't work. I suspect
>> that it's been deep-sixed in Gnome Shell and Unity.
>
> I was interested in the secondary clipboard too, and looked at
> http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/secondary-selection.html which makes
> clear that this is not a standard gtk feature; there are experimental
> modified gtk3 libraries which support secondary selection (no source
> yet).
>
> gtk3 means it doesn't run on SL6, so I haven't been able to explore further.

The author of "Secondary-Selection.mp4" asked about it on the gtk
development list

https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-devel-list/2016-August/msg00036.html

and the answer was

https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-devel-list/2016-August/msg00037.html

Part of the response:

We still (optionally) support the PRIMARY selection on the X11 backend,
and some compatibility layer for it on Wayland, but we have no plans on
adding support for the SECONDARY selection, as it's both barely
specified and, like the PRIMARY, highly confusing for anybody who is not
well-versed in 20+ years of use of textual interfaces on the X Windows
System. Personally, I would have jettisoned the PRIMARY selection a long
time ago as well, but apparently a very vocal minority is still holding
tight to that particular Easter egg. Adding support for the even more
esoteric SECONDARY selection on the X11 backend when we're trying to
move the Linux world towards the more modern and less legacy-ridden
Wayland display system would be problematic to say the least, and an ill
fit for the majority of graphical user experiences in use these days.

Re: tip: Secondary Selection clipboard

[Tom H]

On Tue, Jun 27, 2017 at 8:13 AM, Ken Teh  wrote:
> On 06/27/2017 06:23 AM, Tom H wrote:
>> On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 4:38 PM, ToddAndMargo 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have been using UNIX and Linux for over 25 years and did not
>>> realize X11 has four clipboards. I recently discovered the Secondary
>>> Selection keyboard.
>>>
>>> It really saves a bunch of time when I am programming as I don't
>>> lose my cursor's hot spot.
>>>
>>> Here is a great 8 minute video demonstrating all four clipboards. It
>>> is must learn for anyone using Linux.
>>>
>>> http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/Secondary-Selection.mp4
>>>
>>> To support this clipboard, your program has to use the GTK Toolkit.
>>
>> Thanks. I didn't know about this secondary clipboard. I've just tried
>> it on my laptop running Ubuntu 17.10 but it didn't work. I suspect
>> that it's been deep-sixed in Gnome Shell and Unity.
>
> Haha. I've been on fedora for almost a year and learning to unlearn
> everything I've learnt about Unix and X11 over 25 years.

Everything changes all the time... The wayland developers had intended
to drop the primary selection but they've had to reverse course:

https://wiki.gnome.org/Initiatives/Wayland/PrimarySelection

UNSUBSCRIBE

[Vasili Semenov]

Dear SL User Group,

I am sorry for the disturbance.
Please unsubscribe me from SL Users group.

Vasili

Re: tip: Secondary Selection clipboard

[Andrew C Aitchison]

On Tue, 27 Jun 2017, Tom H wrote:


On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 4:38 PM, ToddAndMargo  wrote:


I have been using UNIX and Linux for over 25 years and did not realize
X11 has four clipboards. I recently discovered the Secondary Selection
keyboard.

It really saves a bunch of time when I am programming as I don't lose
my cursor's hot spot.

Here is a great 8 minute video demonstrating all four clipboards. It
is must learn for anyone using Linux.

http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/Secondary-Selection.mp4

To support this clipboard, your program has to use the GTK Toolkit.


Thanks. I didn't know about this secondary clipboard. I've just tried
it on my laptop running Ubuntu 17.10 but it didn't work. I suspect
that it's been deep-sixed in Gnome Shell and Unity.


I was interested in the secondary clipboard too, and looked at
  http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/secondary-selection.html
which makes clear that this is not a standard gtk feature;
there are experimental modified gtk3 libraries which support
secondary selection (no source yet).

gtk3 means it doesn't run on SL6, so I haven't been able to explore 
further.


--
Andrew C Aitchison  Cambridge, UK

Re: tip: Secondary Selection clipboard

[Ken Teh]

Haha.  I've been on fedora for almost a year and learning to unlearn everything 
I've learnt about Unix and X11 over 25 years.




On 06/27/2017 06:23 AM, Tom H wrote:

On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 4:38 PM, ToddAndMargo  wrote:


I have been using UNIX and Linux for over 25 years and did not realize
X11 has four clipboards. I recently discovered the Secondary Selection
keyboard.

It really saves a bunch of time when I am programming as I don't lose
my cursor's hot spot.

Here is a great 8 minute video demonstrating all four clipboards. It
is must learn for anyone using Linux.

http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/Secondary-Selection.mp4

To support this clipboard, your program has to use the GTK Toolkit.


Thanks. I didn't know about this secondary clipboard. I've just tried
it on my laptop running Ubuntu 17.10 but it didn't work. I suspect
that it's been deep-sixed in Gnome Shell and Unity.

Re: tip: Secondary Selection clipboard

[Tom H]

On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 4:38 PM, ToddAndMargo  wrote:
>
> I have been using UNIX and Linux for over 25 years and did not realize
> X11 has four clipboards. I recently discovered the Secondary Selection
> keyboard.
>
> It really saves a bunch of time when I am programming as I don't lose
> my cursor's hot spot.
>
> Here is a great 8 minute video demonstrating all four clipboards. It
> is must learn for anyone using Linux.
>
> http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl/Secondary-Selection.mp4
>
> To support this clipboard, your program has to use the GTK Toolkit.

Thanks. I didn't know about this secondary clipboard. I've just tried
it on my laptop running Ubuntu 17.10 but it didn't work. I suspect
that it's been deep-sixed in Gnome Shell and Unity.

Re: Proper forum suggestion?

[Maarten]

X2go is also an option: http://wiki.x2go.org/doku.php. You connect via 
the ssh port.



On 2017-06-27 12:17, Nico Kadel-Garcia wrote:

On Mon, Jun 26, 2017 at 2:00 PM, Stan Orlov  wrote:

Greetings,

We've just installed Scientific Linux with the hope to migrate some of 
our solutions from Windows to Linux. I ran into a problem with VNC and 
posted to this list, but nobody replied to it.  I am stuck and really 
hope to find guidance online. Can anyone suggest a list/forum that 
would be better suited for such questions?


Please include a fresh copy of the question, or a pointer to the
original note on the archives. I *wrote* the first published port of
VNC to SunOS way back when, which was a pain in the keister due to X11
version incompatibilities. It's gotten much, much easier to use since
then.

I'll also point out that VNC used to have some significant security
issues with keeping passwords in clear text in $HOME/.vnc/, which I
think has been much reduced.

If you decide that the X server built into your VNC client isn't good
enough, you can also consider the personal or even professional
versions of NX, which is available from https://www.nomachine.com/.
The big advantages are that it's a better user interface, better local
X server on your clients, and provides *much* better handling of
multiple users on your Linux server. It does not replace Remote
Desktop, which is the preferred and more stable way to log into a
Windows box remotely.

Frankly, there are a number of scammers out there who will talk you
into running VNC or tools like it on your Windows box, and then
monitor you rWindows use remotely. And VNC doesn't have a good concept
of "only use one copy". People tend to run numberous VNC servers
because they've simply lost track, and those are chewing up time and
leaving open security vulnerabilities if mishandled.

Free ipa on sl7.3

[Niels Walet]

I seem to have some serious issues with ipa on sl 7.3; on installing on a 
client, the install works through fine until it bombs on the following issue:
https://theoipa.ph.man.ac.uk/ipa/json
Created connection context.rpcclient_47349328
Forwarding 'schema' to json server 'https://ipa./ipa/json'
Destroyed connection context.rpcclient_47349328
Traceback (most recent call last):


---
Prof. Niels R. Walet Phone:  +44(0)1613063693
School of Physics and Astronomy Mobile: +44(0)7516622121
The University of ManchesterRoom 7.7, Schuster Building
Manchester, M13 9PL,  UK
email: niels.wa...@manchester.ac.uk   twitter: @nwalet

Re: Proper forum suggestion?

[Nico Kadel-Garcia]

On Mon, Jun 26, 2017 at 2:00 PM, Stan Orlov  wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> We've just installed Scientific Linux with the hope to migrate some of our 
> solutions from Windows to Linux. I ran into a problem with VNC and posted to 
> this list, but nobody replied to it.  I am stuck and really hope to find 
> guidance online. Can anyone suggest a list/forum that would be better suited 
> for such questions?

Please include a fresh copy of the question, or a pointer to the
original note on the archives. I *wrote* the first published port of
VNC to SunOS way back when, which was a pain in the keister due to X11
version incompatibilities. It's gotten much, much easier to use since
then.

I'll also point out that VNC used to have some significant security
issues with keeping passwords in clear text in $HOME/.vnc/, which I
think has been much reduced.

If you decide that the X server built into your VNC client isn't good
enough, you can also consider the personal or even professional
versions of NX, which is available from https://www.nomachine.com/.
The big advantages are that it's a better user interface, better local
X server on your clients, and provides *much* better handling of
multiple users on your Linux server. It does not replace Remote
Desktop, which is the preferred and more stable way to log into a
Windows box remotely.

Frankly, there are a number of scammers out there who will talk you
into running VNC or tools like it on your Windows box, and then
monitor you rWindows use remotely. And VNC doesn't have a good concept
of "only use one copy". People tend to run numberous VNC servers
because they've simply lost track, and those are chewing up time and
leaving open security vulnerabilities if mishandled.

Re: 7.4

[Tom H]

On Mon, Jun 19, 2017 at 6:18 PM, ToddAndMargo  wrote:
> On 06/19/2017 05:12 AM, Tom H wrote:
>> On Mon, Jun 19, 2017 at 12:16 AM, ToddAndMargo 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Any rumors on when 7.4 will hit SL?
>>
>> Why are you always so keen about dot-releases?
>
> Because when Red Hat fixed my bug reports, they always fix
> it in the next release. They don't care about the one I
> am using. It is appreciated that they fix them, although
> somewhat frustrations that I have to wait forever to see them.

Yes, non-critical bug fixes are published at dot-release time :(

You can enable the "fastbugs" repo to try to get them earlier; but
only closer to release time. RHEL 7.3 was released in Nov and SL 7.3
was released in Jan so it's going to take a few months.