Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Long Believed Myths about Gas Mileage Debunked
I lived in Chi-town for a year, after graduating from college. Lord did I learn about cold-weather survival! You're right: there's no way to warm up a standard car sufficiently in the drive in that kind of weather. As an aside, how come none of those damn songs that sing about "winter wonderlands" talk about what happens *after* those beautiful snowfalls. When I moved there from Fort Worth, i was ecstatic to see snow falling on halloween day! A white Thanksgiving? The first white Christmas I'd seen in over a decade? Awesome! That is, until the temps rise just a bit, and those feet of snow turn to semi-solid mush...until the mushy snow is piled up in man-high piles along every roadway and street, like piles of dirty brown laundry...until you spend days trudging dirty brown mush into the car on your shoes, into your home, into every coffee house and bookstore that people frequent. In my home city, even big snows are typically completely melted within days: the snow and ice damn near sublimates. But in those colder climes, it lingers around like rotting food or something. Yuck - Original Message - From: "Tracy Curtis" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, May 29, 2010 10:23:04 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Long Believed Myths about Gas Mileage Debunked Rave, I've had to tell people about the Wisconsin mornings when the steering wheel is too cold to touch. A lot flat out disbelieved me. And my family still tries to tell me to warm up the car even though most mechanics now go so far as to say that idling is bad for the car. And on one of those Wisconsin winter days, when I spent nearly an hour trying to de-ice the outside of the car enough to drive it and left it on to help, the temperature gage never moved beyond that absolute cold place until I drove it. This same now 16-year-old car seemed to increase its mileage each time I thought seriously about getting rid of it. I think it hears me talking about it. The premium fuel thing is interesting. I can't see myself buying a car that requires or even recommends it. My understanding is that if it's required, using something else worsens the exhaust and the performance. But a regular car can't take advantage of the high octane and thus gets no benefit. On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Kelwyn < ravena...@yahoo.com > wrote: I live in Wisconsin and I learned the "no need to warm up car" dictum from Click and Clack the Car Talk guys. Once it starts, the car will warm up the same whether it is sitting still or moving. Of course, a warm vs. a cold car makes a BIG difference to the driver! ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > I must admit, several of these were myths I still believed, especially the > whole concept of warming up the car on a cold morning. > > > > ** > > http://green.yahoo.com/blog/daily_green_driving/62/six-gas-mileage-myths.html > > > > Six gas mileage myths > > > > Do Americans care about fuel economy as oil spills into the Gulf of Mexico > and gasoline hovers around $3 a gallon? You bet they do, though they also > have a fair number of misconceptions about how to squeeze a few more miles > out of every drop. > > The Consumer Federation of America's (CFA) most recent survey says that if we > had a 50-mile-per-gallon car fleet today, we'd save more oil than the entire > proven reserves in the entire Gulf of Mexico. And people care about that. > > According to Jack Gillis, author of The Car Book and a CFA spokesman, 87 > percent of respondents said it is "important that the country reduce its > consumption of oil," and 54 percent said it is "very important." > > An amazing 65 percent of Americans surveyed support a mandated transition to > a 50-mpg fuel economy standard by 2025. That's a tough standard, some 15 mpg > better than the ambitious goal set by the Obama Administration (35 mpg by > 2016). > > "The expectations of American consumers are reasonable and achievable," > Gillis said in a conference call." CFA says that Asian carmakers, compared to > the U.S. competition, are offering twice as many vehicles with 30 mpg or > better. "It's shocking that so few of today's cars get more than 30 mpg ," > he said. > > Mark Cooper, CFA's research director, noted that in five years of the group's > polling, the public's views have stayed remarkably consistent: Americans want > less dependence on Middle Eastern oil and higher fuel-economy standards. > > People care about fuel economy, but they're misinformed about how
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Long Believed Myths about Gas Mileage Debunked
I hear the brothers say that just a few weeks ago on their NPR show, and was surprised to know that. For decades, people always equated warming up a car with warming out the human body: the same way you have to warm up the body in the morning before going for a run, you supposedly needed to do the same for a car. - Original Message - From: "Kelwyn" To: scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, May 29, 2010 8:54:46 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [scifinoir2] Re: Long Believed Myths about Gas Mileage Debunked I live in Wisconsin and I learned the "no need to warm up car" dictum from Click and Clack the Car Talk guys. Once it starts, the car will warm up the same whether it is sitting still or moving. Of course, a warm vs. a cold car makes a BIG difference to the driver! ~rave! --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith Johnson wrote: > > > > I must admit, several of these were myths I still believed, especially the > whole concept of warming up the car on a cold morning. > > > > ** > > http://green.yahoo.com/blog/daily_green_driving/62/six-gas-mileage-myths.html > > > > Six gas mileage myths > > > > Do Americans care about fuel economy as oil spills into the Gulf of Mexico > and gasoline hovers around $3 a gallon? You bet they do, though they also > have a fair number of misconceptions about how to squeeze a few more miles > out of every drop. > > The Consumer Federation of America's (CFA) most recent survey says that if we > had a 50-mile-per-gallon car fleet today, we'd save more oil than the entire > proven reserves in the entire Gulf of Mexico. And people care about that. > > According to Jack Gillis, author of The Car Book and a CFA spokesman, 87 > percent of respondents said it is "important that the country reduce its > consumption of oil," and 54 percent said it is "very important." > > An amazing 65 percent of Americans surveyed support a mandated transition to > a 50-mpg fuel economy standard by 2025. That's a tough standard, some 15 mpg > better than the ambitious goal set by the Obama Administration (35 mpg by > 2016). > > "The expectations of American consumers are reasonable and achievable," > Gillis said in a conference call." CFA says that Asian carmakers, compared to > the U.S. competition, are offering twice as many vehicles with 30 mpg or > better. "It's shocking that so few of today's cars get more than 30 mpg ," > he said. > > Mark Cooper, CFA's research director, noted that in five years of the group's > polling, the public's views have stayed remarkably consistent: Americans want > less dependence on Middle Eastern oil and higher fuel-economy standards. > > People care about fuel economy, but they're misinformed about how to actually > achieve it. The federal government's fueleconomy.gov site (very useful to > check cars' mpg) just published the "Top 10 Misconceptions About Fuel > Economy." > > Here are a few big myths: > > • > > It takes more fuel to start a vehicle than it does to let it idle. People are > really confused about this one and will leave a car idling for half an hour > rather than turn it off and restart. Some kids I know started an anti-idling > campaign in the suburbs and are shaming parents into shutting down their > cars. Idling uses a quarter- to a half-gallon of fuel in an hour (costing you > one to two cents a minute). Unless you're stalled in traffic, turn off the > car when stopped for more a few minutes. > • > > Vehicles need to be warmed up before they're driven. Pshaw. That is a > long-outdated notion. Today's cars are fine being driven off seconds after > they're started . > • > > As a vehicle ages, its fuel economy decreases significantly. Not true. As > long as it's maintained, a 10- or 15-year-old car should have like-new > mileage. The key thing is maintenance -- an out-of-tune car will definitely > start to decline mileage-wise. > • > > Replacing your air filter helps your car run efficiently. Another outdated > claim, going back to the pre-1976 carburetor days. Modern fuel-injection > engines don't get economy benefits from a clean air filter. > • > > After-market additives and devices can dramatically improve your fuel > economy. As readers of my story on The Blade recall, there's not much > evidence that these "miracle products" do much more than drain your wallet. > Both the Federal Trade Commission and Consumer Reports have weighed in on > this. There are no top-secret 100-mpg add-ons out there. > • > > Using premium fuel improves fuel economy. You might as well write a check to > BP if you believe this. Only use premium if your car specifies it. >
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Long Believed Myths about Gas Mileage Debunked
The higher octane prevents knocking in the engine. I think that it is really only for boutique cars like an older Jag or Ferrari and Maserati. On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 7:23 AM, Tracy Curtis wrote: > > > Rave, I've had to tell people about the Wisconsin mornings when the > steering wheel is too cold to touch. A lot flat out disbelieved me. And my > family still tries to tell me to warm up the car even though most mechanics > now go so far as to say that idling is bad for the car. And on one of those > Wisconsin winter days, when I spent nearly an hour trying to de-ice the > outside of the car enough to drive it and left it on to help, the > temperature gage never moved beyond that absolute cold place until I drove > it. > This same now 16-year-old car seemed to increase its mileage each time I > thought seriously about getting rid of it. I think it hears me talking > about it. > > The premium fuel thing is interesting. I can't see myself buying a car > that requires or even recommends it. My understanding is that if it's > required, using something else worsens the exhaust and the performance. But > a regular car can't take advantage of the high octane and thus gets no > benefit. > > > On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Kelwyn wrote: > >> >> >> I live in Wisconsin and I learned the "no need to warm up car" dictum from >> Click and Clack the Car Talk guys. Once it starts, the car will warm up the >> same whether it is sitting still or moving. Of course, a warm vs. a cold car >> makes a BIG difference to the driver! >> >> ~rave! >> >> >> --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith >> Johnson wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> > I must admit, several of these were myths I still believed, especially >> the whole concept of warming up the car on a cold morning. >> > >> > >> > >> > ** >> > >> > >> http://green.yahoo.com/blog/daily_green_driving/62/six-gas-mileage-myths.html >> > >> > >> > >> > Six gas mileage myths >> > >> > >> > >> > Do Americans care about fuel economy as oil spills into the Gulf of >> Mexico and gasoline hovers around $3 a gallon? You bet they do, though they >> also have a fair number of misconceptions about how to squeeze a few more >> miles out of every drop. >> > >> > The Consumer Federation of America's (CFA) most recent survey says that >> if we had a 50-mile-per-gallon car fleet today, we'd save more oil than the >> entire proven reserves in the entire Gulf of Mexico. And people care about >> that. >> > >> > According to Jack Gillis, author of The Car Book and a CFA spokesman, 87 >> percent of respondents said it is "important that the country reduce its >> consumption of oil," and 54 percent said it is "very important." >> > >> > An amazing 65 percent of Americans surveyed support a mandated >> transition to a 50-mpg fuel economy standard by 2025. That's a tough >> standard, some 15 mpg better than the ambitious goal set by the Obama >> Administration (35 mpg by 2016). >> > >> > "The expectations of American consumers are reasonable and achievable," >> Gillis said in a conference call." CFA says that Asian carmakers, compared >> to the U.S. competition, are offering twice as many vehicles with 30 mpg or >> better. "It's shocking that so few of today's cars get more than 30 mpg ," >> he said. >> > >> > Mark Cooper, CFA's research director, noted that in five years of the >> group's polling, the public's views have stayed remarkably consistent: >> Americans want less dependence on Middle Eastern oil and higher fuel-economy >> standards. >> > >> > People care about fuel economy, but they're misinformed about how to >> actually achieve it. The federal government's fueleconomy.gov site (very >> useful to check cars' mpg) just published the "Top 10 Misconceptions About >> Fuel Economy." >> > >> > Here are a few big myths: >> > >> > • >> > >> > It takes more fuel to start a vehicle than it does to let it idle. >> People are really confused about this one and will leave a car idling for >> half an hour rather than turn it off and restart. Some kids I know started >> an anti-idling campaign in the suburbs and are shaming parents into shutting >> down their cars. Idling uses a quarter- to a half-gallon of fuel in an hour >> (costing you one to two cents a minute). Unless you're stalled in traffic, >> turn off the car when stopped for more a few minutes. >> > • >> > >> > Vehicles need to be warmed up before they're driven. Pshaw. That is a >> long-outdated notion. Today's cars are fine being driven off seconds after >> they're started . >> > • >> > >> > As a vehicle ages, its fuel economy decreases significantly. Not true. >> As long as it's maintained, a 10- or 15-year-old car should have like-new >> mileage. The key thing is maintenance -- an out-of-tune car will definitely >> start to decline mileage-wise. >> > • >> > >> > Replacing your air filter helps your car run efficiently. Another >> outdated claim, going back to the pre-1976 carburet
Re: [scifinoir2] Re: Long Believed Myths about Gas Mileage Debunked
Rave, I've had to tell people about the Wisconsin mornings when the steering wheel is too cold to touch. A lot flat out disbelieved me. And my family still tries to tell me to warm up the car even though most mechanics now go so far as to say that idling is bad for the car. And on one of those Wisconsin winter days, when I spent nearly an hour trying to de-ice the outside of the car enough to drive it and left it on to help, the temperature gage never moved beyond that absolute cold place until I drove it. This same now 16-year-old car seemed to increase its mileage each time I thought seriously about getting rid of it. I think it hears me talking about it. The premium fuel thing is interesting. I can't see myself buying a car that requires or even recommends it. My understanding is that if it's required, using something else worsens the exhaust and the performance. But a regular car can't take advantage of the high octane and thus gets no benefit. On Sat, May 29, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Kelwyn wrote: > > > I live in Wisconsin and I learned the "no need to warm up car" dictum from > Click and Clack the Car Talk guys. Once it starts, the car will warm up the > same whether it is sitting still or moving. Of course, a warm vs. a cold car > makes a BIG difference to the driver! > > ~rave! > > > --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com , Keith > Johnson wrote: > > > > > > > > I must admit, several of these were myths I still believed, especially > the whole concept of warming up the car on a cold morning. > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > http://green.yahoo.com/blog/daily_green_driving/62/six-gas-mileage-myths.html > > > > > > > > Six gas mileage myths > > > > > > > > Do Americans care about fuel economy as oil spills into the Gulf of > Mexico and gasoline hovers around $3 a gallon? You bet they do, though they > also have a fair number of misconceptions about how to squeeze a few more > miles out of every drop. > > > > The Consumer Federation of America's (CFA) most recent survey says that > if we had a 50-mile-per-gallon car fleet today, we'd save more oil than the > entire proven reserves in the entire Gulf of Mexico. And people care about > that. > > > > According to Jack Gillis, author of The Car Book and a CFA spokesman, 87 > percent of respondents said it is "important that the country reduce its > consumption of oil," and 54 percent said it is "very important." > > > > An amazing 65 percent of Americans surveyed support a mandated transition > to a 50-mpg fuel economy standard by 2025. That's a tough standard, some 15 > mpg better than the ambitious goal set by the Obama Administration (35 mpg > by 2016). > > > > "The expectations of American consumers are reasonable and achievable," > Gillis said in a conference call." CFA says that Asian carmakers, compared > to the U.S. competition, are offering twice as many vehicles with 30 mpg or > better. "It's shocking that so few of today's cars get more than 30 mpg ," > he said. > > > > Mark Cooper, CFA's research director, noted that in five years of the > group's polling, the public's views have stayed remarkably consistent: > Americans want less dependence on Middle Eastern oil and higher fuel-economy > standards. > > > > People care about fuel economy, but they're misinformed about how to > actually achieve it. The federal government's fueleconomy.gov site (very > useful to check cars' mpg) just published the "Top 10 Misconceptions About > Fuel Economy." > > > > Here are a few big myths: > > > > • > > > > It takes more fuel to start a vehicle than it does to let it idle. People > are really confused about this one and will leave a car idling for half an > hour rather than turn it off and restart. Some kids I know started an > anti-idling campaign in the suburbs and are shaming parents into shutting > down their cars. Idling uses a quarter- to a half-gallon of fuel in an hour > (costing you one to two cents a minute). Unless you're stalled in traffic, > turn off the car when stopped for more a few minutes. > > • > > > > Vehicles need to be warmed up before they're driven. Pshaw. That is a > long-outdated notion. Today's cars are fine being driven off seconds after > they're started . > > • > > > > As a vehicle ages, its fuel economy decreases significantly. Not true. As > long as it's maintained, a 10- or 15-year-old car should have like-new > mileage. The key thing is maintenance -- an out-of-tune car will definitely > start to decline mileage-wise. > > • > > > > Replacing your air filter helps your car run efficiently. Another > outdated claim, going back to the pre-1976 carburetor days. Modern > fuel-injection engines don't get economy benefits from a clean air filter. > > • > > > > After-market additives and devices can dramatically improve your fuel > economy. As readers of my story on The Blade recall, there's not much > evidence that these "miracle products" do much more than drain your wallet. > Both t
