[scots-l] Great posts..

[Toby Rider]

Thanks for all the good posts lately. I am certainly enjoying them.

Toby Rider
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[scots-l] Tow

[Janice Hopper]

At 12:36 PM 6/24/01 -0700, you wrote:
> > Would anyone be able to tell me what the title "Weary Pund o' Tow"
> > means?  Its the title of a slow air from Gow's 3rd Repository.
>
>Tow is wool in its unspun state.  A pound of it represents one hell of
>a lot of work ahead in spinning it.

Correction:  Tow is made up of the short fibers of flax.  To process flax, 
you take the retted stems of the plant and run them through hackles 
(essentially sharp tined combs.)  This process splits the fibers of the 
stem of the flax plant, and combs out any short bits.  The short bits are 
the tow.  The long-combed out bits frequently look very much like long 
blonde hair (hence "flaxen haired") and the short bits like short blonde 
hair (tow-headed boys.)

Spinning a pound of tow would be a lot of work!

Janice in GA
Spinster
who once did a spinning demo for 1st graders and entertained them by 
draping a long strick of flax over her short brown hair to became an 
instant blonde  :-)


Nil significat
nisi oscillat.

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Re: [scots-l] Tin Whistle Bands

[Stuart Eydmann]

Manuel asked:
 

Hello there, I'm doing from time to time some 
research on pennywhistle history, and I came once to one reference to a Tin 
Whistle Band in Glasgow, in the book "Voices from the War" Grace 
Kennedy says: “(...)But I remember the 
Boilermakers’ Tin Whistle Band going round Govan during the 
boilermakers’ lock-out or strike in 
1910.”
(Voices from War, p. 
40)
 
Does anyone knows any more about these bands, 
history, characteristics, etc?
___
 
 
Unfortunately, I can't find the reference in 
my archives yet but I have notes from elsewhere which record that bands were 
formed using tin whistles where more expensive fifes or flutes could not be 
afforded with a view to upgrading later. Several of the trade unions and similar 
organisations in Central Scotland had flute bands which accompanied marches, 
demonstrations and gala day parades. I'll keep looking for the 
reference.
 
In Glasgow in 1891 Nickle (sic) penny 
whistles ranged in price from 2s 3d for a G to 4s 6d for a Bb. Brass models were 
1s - 2s 3d. No doubt cheaper versions (including home made) were 
available.
 
A 3 piece Bb band flute was 3s 6d with one 
key, 12s with 4 keys and 16s with 6 keys and a tuning slide. F flutes were 20s 
with 6 keys and slide or 4s 6d with just one key. Second quality flutes were 
from 2s 6d.
 
The histories of the penny whistle and flute 
bands in Scotland have still to be written. I'd be very interested in any 
further refrences to Scotland.
 
Stuart 
Eydmann 

Re: [scots-l] Mrs. Somebody's Favourite

[Stuart Eydmann]

Nigel asked of me:

 ..."Bellany's Brush" was written for the painter in the hope that he
would give a priceless canvas in return...


Which I don't suppose panned out. He did, however, provide several
paintings for your (i.e. The Whistlebinkies) album covers; what was the
arrangement? Did he get a fee? A free LP?


Derek suggested:

1 LP if he delivered, and threatened with 2 LPs if he didn't stump up.
_

Well,

To set the record straight in the interest of the history of Scottish
painting Bellany did paint one canvas for a fee in 1979 for the album
Whistlebinkies 2. It's a big one too and after the artwork for the album was
set up it was offered for sale. I was just a new member at the time and did
not play on the album which was released in 1980 and felt I had little claim
on it. It was going for a ridiculously low sum but I was just about to be
married and could not get my hands on the required amount. Before I could
pursue the matter it was snapped up by a Glasgow journalist who was a fan of
the group. He was really chuffed with his bargain buy that he had us all
round for drinks to celebrate! I regert not having been to see my bank
manager more quickly to this day.

We played at most of Bellany's big exhibition openings in Scotland during
the 80s and 90s. The other painting by him which were used on covers were
from existing stock in private or public collections. Copies of these albums
are still available. I keep meaning to hand a full set into the Scottish
Gallery of Modern Art for their collection.

I note that a number of book publishers have used Ballany's for their book
covers of late and that this has attracted a lot of attention - as always
Scottish traditional music was leading the other arts!

I never did get my canvas in return for the tune but I know that my
manuscript hangs framed on Bellany's wall.

Stuart

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[scots-l] Now J F Dickie

[Stuart Eydmann]

In my opinion the fiddle in Scotland has seen little in the way of personal
expression within the tradition and Dickie's highly personal arhythmic
interpretations with their extreme shortening and lenghtening of notes and
dramatic pauses are both welcome and curious. 20 years ago I had no time for
the JF Dickie recordings but now see him as an important landmark in the
otherwise gently varied landscape of the scottish fiddle. In some ways they
make me think of the recordings of Tommie Potts in relation to the fiddle
tradition in Ireland.

As to whether I'd like to play like him or think others should emulate his
style, well that's another thing altogether.

What gives me most concern is that these recordings are not easily available
for others to judge.

What do others think?

Stuart Eydmann

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Re: [scots-l] Mrs. Somebody's Favourite

[Stuart Eydmann]

Nigel wrote:

You weren't the first, either. William Marshall (1748-1833) was also on
that game, writing "Mr Hoy, Gordon Castle" in a vain attempt to extract
some tin from Derek's pocket. I expect he got the same response as you,
Stuart.


Well Nigel I'm just back from visiting Mr Hoy, Terraced House, where I had a
fine feed of the finest home made fish stew washed down with an excellent
New Zealand white - funny things people will give you to stop you writing
more rubbish tunes about them.

Stuart

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Re: [scots-l] Music related to Scotland Winning the World Cup in the 80's

[Stuart Eydmann]

Francis wrote:

I am trying to locate information a music which may
have been written and recorded on the occasion of
Scotland Winning the World Cup in Football (Soccer) in
the early 80's. 
__

I presume you refer to the Fantasy World Cup.

Yours in hope,

Stuart Eydmann

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Re: [scots-l] Tenor Banjo Players in Edinburgh?

[Stuart Eydmann]

Concerning tenor banjoists in Edinburgh - what about Jock Broon? 

Stuart

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[scots-l] Tenor Banjo Players in Edinburgh?

[Nigel Gatherer]

I have been contacted by a sixth year pupil who wants to do tenor banjo
as his second instrument for Higher Music (his first being euphonium!).
I told him that my adult mandolin class would not satisfy him (many of
the participants are picking up an instrument for the first time,
without any grounding in music).

It would be good if I could direct him to a tenor banjo player who
might give him some lessons, but I don't know any. There's a very good
Irish player in Edinburgh, Aiden Someone - anyone know? Or do you
perhaps know any other players who might give the lad some pointers?

-- 
Nigel Gatherer, Crieff, Scotland
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/gatherer/

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Re: [scots-l] Mrs. Somebody's Favourite

[Nigel Gatherer]

Stuart Eydmann wrote:

> ...I've tried to carry the tradition on: "The Old Man Hoy" was
> composed for Derek Hoy to avoid having to buy him a proper 40th
> birthday present...

You weren't the first, either. William Marshall (1748-1833) was also on
that game, writing "Mr Hoy, Gordon Castle" in a vain attempt to extract
some tin from Derek's pocket. I expect he got the same response as you,
Stuart.

-- 
Nigel Gatherer, Crieff, Scotland
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/gatherer/

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Re: [scots-l] Mystery Title

[W. B. OLSON]

Jack Campin wrote:
> 
> > Would anyone be able to tell me what the title "Weary Pund o' Tow"
> > means?  Its the title of a slow air from Gow's 3rd Repository.
> 
> Tow is wool in its unspun state.  A pound of it represents one hell of
> a lot of work ahead in spinning it.
> 
> ===  ===
> 
> Posted to Scots-L - The Traditional Scottish Music & Culture List - To 
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"Tarry woo' is ill to spin" is another Scots song popular with women
demonstraitors of carding, combing, spinning, and weaving.

Bruce Olson

-- 
Old British Isles popular and folk songs, tunes, broadside
ballads at my no-spam website - www.erols.com/olsonw or
just http://www.erols.com/olsonw";> Click 

Motto: Keep it up; muddling through always works.
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[scots-l] Re: scots-l-digest V1 #420

[Fidhle1]

After reading what others posted, I guess I should say more about myself and 
my interest in Scottish music.  I have been playing violin since back in the 
dark ages (my childhood), but was raised with a broad interest in all kinds 
of music.  I got into Scottish Country dancing in Belgium in 1962, during a 
year there, but never got a chance to really learn until I arrived in 
Alexandria, VA and joined a class in 1983.  I became interested in the music 
and thought it would be nice to play at a ceilidh during a ball--but the tune 
I had learned was played as a duet by the performers before me, much better 
than I (sigh), so I hastily picked another tune and read it over the shoulder 
of my accompanist, Liz Donaldson.  I didn't play very well. but my next 
effort was competing, with Alasdair Fraser judging--he was very tactful in 
suggesting I not try transposing Flowers of Edinburgh to fit it to my other 
tunes.  At TAC school I ventured to play at the ceilidh at which Ian Powry 
and Stan Hamilton were performing--thank goodness they were out of the room 
when I played--I later heard Ian play my favorite tune of the time, as it 
should be played, and it was then I got serious about learning how to play!  
I still compete, and play for SCD when invited; our local fiddle club, which 
I launched and which has been propelled forward most successfully by Elke 
Baker, now hosts dances at which members play.  Love the music--a far cry  
from the Dvorak piano quartette our quartette has been learning with me on 
viola.  Cheers, Anne

Re: [scots-l] Mystery Title

[David Kilpatrick]

"W. B. OLSON" wrote:
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > Would anyone be able to tell me what the title "Weary Pund o' Tow" means?
> > Its the title of a slow air from Gow's 3rd Repository. 
(snip)

> There's another song that's related to "Weary Pund o' Tow". It's called
> "Wary Bachelors" in Jean Thomas's, 'Devil's Ditties', 1931.
> 
> The 3rd and 4th verses closely parallel verses in "Weary Pund" (SMM
> #350). 3rd and 4th verses:
> 
> I bought my wife ten pound of flax
> As good as ever growed
> And out of that she hackled me
> One single pound of tow.
> 
> Beware of a pound of tow
> Before it is begun
> I am afraid my wife will end her life
> Before the tow is spun.
> 

A double meaning: literally, to get a small quantity of linen from a
large amount of flax steams by beating them and shredding them
(hackling) which is particularly back-breaking manual labour. The men
used to have the job of cutting the flax or hemp, and soaking the stems
or fermenting them in piles; the women got the job of breaking up the
rotted stems to extract the fibres, which would then be spun. The method
was to thrash bunches of the stalks against stones, until devices were
invented to speed this up, including kinds of water and wind mills.
Apparently it's one of those jobs which leaves you either with no skin
on your hands - combination of highly abrasive, cutting fibres with water.

So: to get a very small quantity of reward from a large amount of effort.

Above: to devote your life to a marriage which produces little reward in
return. This might be taken to metaphorically today, as we expect
relationships to be judged on their emotional value. When the phrase was
coined, the meaning was probably more literal; the wife was expected to
be an economic partner and to manage the prosperity of the household, so
the writer is probably really complaining about a marriage where
material wealth is wasted. However the words above have a 'feel' of
being about the emotional side as well, something which begins to appear
in the 18th century.

For related song expressing attitudes towards women/marriage see 'The
Wife Wrap'd in the Wether's Skin' (etc) which definitely comes from
before this 'watershed' and happily describes how an unsatisfactory wife
(again, mainly in economic and functional terms) can be cured by
beating! (But does acknowledge that a man should not really beat his
wife - hence the sheep's skin to wrap her in, as he can legitimately
beat his sheep).

David
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[scots-l] Re: scots-l-digest V1 #420

[Fidhle1]

Thanks for the invitation to this "lurker".  I'm President of the U.S. 
Scottish Fiddling Revival. Ltd., and we are hosting the National Scottish 
Fiddling Competition this year on July 14 in Mt. Vernon, Washington, USA at 
the Skagit Valley Highland Games.  Three of our prominent fiddler members are 
judging; Mr. Calum McKinnon of Seattle, Washington. Ms. Jan Tappan of Los 
Angeles, and Mr. Iain Fraser of Glasgow, Scotland.  You can read all about it 
on the games' web page, www.celticarts.org.  I don't suppose we will see many 
of you there from Scotland, but we have some contributors and past judges who 
are on the list serve.  I don't have any humorous bits to contribute, but I 
can list one of my favorite Scottish fiddle composers:  John Marshall.  We'd 
love to hear from some of you Scots--something we can publish in our 
newsletter (!)  Anne Leslie  ([EMAIL PROTECTED])

[scots-l] Holm Band jig and Lake on the Mountain abcs

[Ian King]

I've managed to find my abc software, so here are the tunes in that
format.

Ian

Lake on the Mountain

X: 1
T: 
M: 4/4
L: 1/8
Q:1/4=79
K:C 
V:1
|G/2F/2E/2C/2C/2A,/2C/2C/2
G,/2C/2E/2G/2E/2C/2G,/2B,/2|D/2F/2E/2F/2A/2G/2^F/2
G>=FE/2C/2C/2A,/2C/2|C/2G,/2C/2E/2G/2E/2C/2F/2
d/2c/2B/2A/2B/2c2|c/2A/2G/2E/2C/2C/2A,/2C/2 C/2G,/2C/2E/2G/2E/2C/2G,/2|
B,/2D/2F/2E/2F/2A/2G/2 ^Fag/2e/2c/2G/2c/2|e/2g/2f/2e/2.f3/2a/2
f/2d/2B/2G/2B/2d/2f/2e/2|
f/2 g>ag/2e/2c/2 G/2c/2e/2g/2f/2e/2f/2d/2|B/2G/2A/2B/2c2
c/2e/2f/2.g3/2a/2g/2|e/2c/2G/2c/2e/2g/2f/2e/2
.f3/2a/2f/2d/2B/2G/2|B/2d/2f/2e/2f/2 g>ag/2e/2c/2G/2c/2e/2g/2|
f/2e/2f/2d/2B/2G/2A/2B/2 c5/2|


Holm Band Jig

X: 1
T: 
M: 4/4
L: 1/8
Q:1/4=110
K:A 
V:1
|EA3/2A/2A c3/2B/2AF3/2|F/2Fd3/2 z/2 fe3/2c/2A|G3/2A/2Bc3/2A/2cB3/2 z/2
|EA3/2A/2A c3/2B/2AF3/2|
F/2Fd3/2 z/2 fe3/2c/2A|G3/2A/2Bc3/2A/2A|A3/2 z5
E|A3/2A/2Ac3/2B/2AF3/2F/2|
Fd3/2 z/2 f e3/2c/2AG3/2|A/2Bc3/2A/2cB3/2 z/2
E|A3/2A/2Ac3/2B/2AF3/2F/2|Fd3/2 z/2 f e3/2c/2AG3/2|
A/2Bc3/2A/2AA3/2 z/2 E|A3/2c/2ea3/2g/2ae3/2c/2|Ad3/2 z/2 f
e3/2c/2AG3/2|A/2Bc3/2A/2cB3/2 z/2 E|
A3/2c/2ea3/2g/2ae3/2c/2|Ad3/2 z/2 f e3/2c/2AG3/2|A/2Bc3/2A/2AA3/2 z/2
E|A3/2c/2ea3/2g/2ae3/2c/2|
Ad3/2 z/2 f e3/2c/2AG3/2|A/2Bc3/2A/2cB3/2 z/2
E|A3/2A/2Ac3/2B/2AF3/2F/2|Fd3/2 z/2 f e3/2c/2AG3/2|
A/2Bc3/2A/2AA3/2|


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[scots-l] John Cuthbert, fiddler

[Nigel Gatherer]

Just missed the birthday of John Cuthbert, who lived just outside
Crieff (where I live these days). He was born 21st June 1778. After
hearing another local fiddler, Colin McAinsh, the young John became
determined to be a fiddler, but without money for an instrument, he
fashioned a fiddle out of a horse's skull and four strings. he managed
to play tunes on this, and having attracted the attention of those with
the ability to help, he studied with "Messrs Bowie" at Huntingtower.

There is a report of him playing at a hall in Crieff at which Niel Gow
also played; indeed he elicited high praise on that occasion, and Gow
often employed him whenever he returned to the Crieff area. Later he
also played with the younger Gows in Edinburgh.

Cuthbert seemed to have been employed regularly around the country at a
time when music and dancing was a huge craze. As it says in 'Crieff:
Its Traditions and Characters' (Edinburgh 1881):

  "The "sound of revelry by night" was the fashion, and births,
   birthdays, christenings, marriages, and visits were all
   celebrated by the necessary rounds of feasting and dancing. The
   lairds mingled with the tenantry, and did not disdain a hulichan
   with them..."

John Cuthbert came into contact with Sir William Murray of Ochtertyre
whose daughter, I believe - Miss Murray - was a fairly successful
composer of tunes, having has several published in the Gow collections.
Murray employed Cuthbert for as long as he could play, which turned out
to be a considerable length of time (he died in his late 70s).

-- 
Nigel Gatherer, Crieff, Scotland
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/gatherer/

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Re: [scots-l] Mrs. Somebody's Favourite

[Derek Hoy]

Stuart wrote:
> The practice of naming tunes after people to curry favour or say thanks for
> services rendered is a long an honourable tradition which includes the
> planxties and fancies of earlier periods. I saw a tv prog once about
> flamenco which talked about the tradition of 'homage' composing in that
> culture.
> 
> I've tried to carry the tradition on: "The Old Man Hoy" was composed for
> Derek Hoy to avoid having to buy him a proper 40th birthday present,
> "Bellany's Brush" was written for the painter in the hope that he would give
> a priceless canvas in return, "The Boston Cuffes" was for guitarist Tony and
> his family to pave the way for a free holiday in the States, the list
> goes on.

Stuart's attitude nicely sums up the grasping attitude of musicians in these 
parts.  I have tried it myself, but there is one fatal flaw in the Tune as 
unit of currency- it has least value when it's just written.

I tried to peddle a composition in the local butcher's last week, but he 
argued he had no idea of the potential value as it was unplayed.  A couple of 
sausages and a slice of black pudding was all he'd hand over.
Safeways definitely doesn't accept Tunes as payment, but I haven't tried Asda 
yet.

The real value of a tune is only realised when it has become played in and 
popular.  So the successful tunesmith should give a tune a catchy place-holder 
(A Man Getting Off a Bus, The Price of Mince, Warm For the Time of Year, ...), 
plug it like hell (mp3.com seems to be the new place :) then auction it off to 
the highest bidder.

Derek
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[scots-l] Re: Holm band Jig

[Ian King]

Holm Band Jig is on a Wrigley Sisters CD I think - a friend of mine got
it from a workshop at the Borders Gaitherin. I'll try and turn it into
abc - I currently have it in Noteworthy Composer format - could be
turned into a midi easily enough.

Ian
> 
> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 13:58:17 +0100
> From: Nigel Gatherer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: [scots-l] Lurker - tunes of the moment
> 
> Ian King wrote:
> 
> > The holm band jig (orkney)
> 
> I recognise that name, but can't think from where. Where did you learn
> it, Ian?
> 
> - --
> Nigel Gatherer, Crieff, Scotland
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/gatherer/
> 
> Posted to Scots-L - The Traditional Scottish Music & Culture List - To 
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> 
> --


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   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [scots-l] Lurker - tunes of the moment

[Janice Lane]

>Nigel Gatherer wrote:
>> Ian King wrote:
> >
> > The holm band jig (orkney)
> >
> >I recognise that name, but can't think from where. Where did you learn
> >it, Ian?
>
The Holm Band Tune is in the last track of Jennifer & Hazel Wrigley's album
"Mither o' the Sea".
Jennifer said that she knew nothing about it except that the Holm Band
played it. Once, at a concert a man came up saying that he had belonged to
the Holm Band, but he, too, knew nothing about its origins. Does anyone?
The other piece on that track, "R. Aim's Compliments to J. Cragie" is also
very nice, but the simple four note accompaniment makes special.
Jan Lane


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[scots-l] Peeri Weeri

[Keith W Dunn]

Does anyone know the story behind this tune?  I've read that it's
either a Shetland or Orkney tune but what about the author?  Anddoes
anyone have a gif or jpg file of it that they could send to me off list? 
If so..send it to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

I've searched the net through Google and wasn't able to find much at all.
 I heard Alasdair Frasers version and liked it quiet a bit but as I said,
I haven't been able to find any information on it or a gif \ jpg file
anywhere.  I don't have an abc conversion program.

Also, I read that it was somehow associated to "Trowie" tunes.  So, there
must be more.  Does anyone have a list of "Trowie or Trow" tunes?

Keith Dunn


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[scots-l] Music related to Scotland Winning the World Cup in the 80's

[Elheran Francis]

Hello,
I am trying to locate information a music which may
have been written and recorded on the occasion of
Scotland Winning the World Cup in Football (Soccer) in
the early 80's. I believe one of the musicians
involved was Fiddler John Turner from the Boston area
of the US. There was a Scottish Highland Broadsword
Dance called the World Cup Reel which was
choreographed to go with the music. 



__
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[scots-l] Dickie

[Kate Dunlay or David Greenberg]

>a cassette re-release of JF Dickie called James F. Dickie
>Delights on Scottish Fiddle which, of course, contains his own playing of JF
>Dickie's Delight. What do others think about his playing?
>
>Stuart Eydmann (delighted)

I can't say I really enjoy it, but it's interesting.  I haven't listened
for a long time, but I think it was the timing which was not at all what I
am used to.

- Kate D.

--
Kate Dunlay & David Greenberg
Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
http://www.total.net/~dungreen


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Re: [scots-l] Mrs. Somebody's Favourite

[Derek Hoy]

Nigel asked:
> > ..."Bellany's Brush" was written for the painter in the hope that he
> > would give a priceless canvas in return...
> 
> Which I don't suppose panned out. He did, however, provide several
> paintings for your (i.e. The Whistlebinkies) album covers; what was the
> arrangement? Did he get a fee? A free LP? 

1 LP if he delivered, and threatened with 2 LPs if he didn't stump up.

Derek
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Re: [scots-l] Mystery Title

[Jack Campin]

> Would anyone be able to tell me what the title "Weary Pund o' Tow"
> means?  Its the title of a slow air from Gow's 3rd Repository.

Tow is wool in its unspun state.  A pound of it represents one hell of
a lot of work ahead in spinning it.


===  ===


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