Re: CSfloaters, chunkies and sparklies
Trem incorporates it in his pro unit. I think the Wishgranted 777 uses it instead of stirring and some people don't care for the results much. The CS Pro calls it Pulse Phasic and doesn't use stirring or current control..PPM by timer which doesn't work and they know it. [ without buffering the water with baking soda which DOES make light sensitve silver carbonate despite what is claimed] Ole Bob used to make and sell a home gen that did that years ago, but no longer indulges in the process. I've played with it and actually have the circuit artwork done in surface mount technology. I'm undecided if it's worth it for the home user. Things are complicated enough already and the result isn't substantially better than straight DC. The thing is, frequency at a given voltage is critical to getting a consistant ion to particle ratio and PPM calibration for automatic operation depends on ionic conductivity...a relationship that's already tenuous enough. [But a thousand times better than using timers alone] If frequency is too fast and voltage too low, ions just zap right back onto the electrode. [You can use a higher frequency at higher voltages and you get into the HVAC realms in thousands of volts] Trem says he's using 75 volts in his pro machine. The replying post is correct. So far as I've found, no DC chips will handle more than 36 volts. There are ways around that no doubt and Trems Pro unit costs around $500..probably for good reasons that make small home units economically unfeasable. [Where is the SG8?] Going slower results in periodic puffs of particles coming off both electrodes and nice clean electrodes but lots of crud in the water. [that dissipates and/or settles] Going slower still makes for both electrodes turning black. 45 to 60 second cycles seem to do the best at a 28 volt starting point. The velocity of the ions leaving the electrodes, hence the field size and density that develops around the electrodes depends on voltage and current control constantly changes those voltages. There's another complication. Since the particle to ion ratio is controlled by the size and density of a field developing around the electrodes and stirring disrupts that field Varying stir rates changes everything. Change the batch size and stir rates change. Though all batches turned out nice, some exceptionally nice and none went yellow I found it very difficult to make one batch resemble the next. Since particle to ion ratios were obviously varying with any change anywhere, I have no way of knowing with ANY degree of certainty what PPM the result is at any given conductivity. Toss the meter right out the windowforget it. One batch that pleases me to the extreme meters at 14.5 uS but the TE is almost like skim milk. It could be 50 PPM. [30?, 100?..no clue]..and have yet to make another like it. IMO, the process shows promise but could require an instruction manual as thick as a book to get reasonably repeatable results. I suppose a set batch size and set stir rate and no way to vary the process would help consistancy...but that limits versatility. I dunno..still pondering if it's worth the complications when straight current controlled DC with stirring does very nicely and the only real advantage to LVDC polarity swapping is cleaner electrodes. That is, it's a fun Gee Whiz toy for me, but can picky Mr and Ms Average handle it? Then too, using surface mount tech requires robot assembly. The parts are too small to handle and there are a LOT more of them involved. That means a substantial investment in short run production that I cannot do myself without tweezers and a jewlers loup...or...mega quantities. To make it worth while 'production wise' and keep the generator price down under $200, I'd be stocked up with PC boards for the next ten years and eating beans for a while. [I already live on the DIY cheap] Staying with through hole technology means that signature package compactness goes out the window. I have a few ideas on that score. maybe maybe Ode At 10:27 PM 10/18/2004 -0500, you wrote: Evening Ode, Swapping the polarity of the electrodes just blows all that stuff into the water...no big deal, but looks sorta ugly ... for a while. I have been following all this with interest not sure whether I am being educated or confused. If the polarity swapping was of great value, it could be automated by circuit design, could it not? The interval of the reversing could even be variable. Seems some experimenting soul would have done it already. Wayne --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.778 / Virus Database: 525 - Release Date: 10/15/2004 -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive:
CSfloaters, chunkies and sparklies
If you make the CS very strong without cleaning the electrodes, more hydrogen bubbles form, more silver makes it to those hydrogen bubbles, gain an electron and turn into particles getting trapped in their surface tension whie making them conductive as they get close enough to touch each other so more hydrogen bubbles will form on 'those' hydrogen bubbles to trap more silver. [grey fuzzies] When you remove the silver coated bubble formation from the water the bubbles tend to pop, transfer their surface tension load to the surface tension of the water and you get floaters. If the bubble formation gets thick enough it may detach portions of itself from the electrode but have enough bouyancy due to the hydrogen to float to the top and pop some of the bubbles...transferring part of the silver load to the surface of the water and some to other bubbles..which get heavy enough to sink. Some of these chunkies go up, some down and some up, then down and some just float around. [A sparklie is a small chunkie.] The hydrogen in the silver coated bubbles that reach the bottom eventually dissolves into the water and release a white 'cloud' that dissipates into the water identical to an ion cloud [It's really a particle cloudyou can't see ions at all] Eventually, floaters sparklies and chunkies just go away on their own and increase the TE of the water. Sometimes a little bit of white dust will be left stuck to the bottom as well. [silver hydroxide?] Floaters are only a few microns thick but have some weight which creates a depression in the surface tension of the water. They consist of silver particles held together by gravity like marbles in a bowl and 'look' a whole LOT worse than they are. It amounts to very little actual silver. Dragging a piece of paper towel across the surface of the water attaches those particles to the towel almost invisibly. ..or, just stir them in. Swapping the polarity of the electrodes just blows all that stuff into the water...no big deal, but looks sorta ugly ... for a while. I find the best way to deal with floaters, sparklies and chunkies is to just let the CS sit still for a while and decant. Ode At 10:07 PM 10/17/2004 -0500, you wrote: Re: CSIs it really this quiet? GARNET * From: Garnet wrote: * Date: Sun, 17 Oct 2004 09:29:15 I make 10 ppm CS but you can use what ever concentration CS you have on hand. It would make it more effective presumable to use a higher concentration CS but I get floaters when I go higher. I have not tried running the CS twice to see if I can get it higher because 10 ppm seems to be effective. What is this about floaters and high concentration CS? Why would this be? Dan -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSfloaters, chunkies and sparklies
Evening Ode, Swapping the polarity of the electrodes just blows all that stuff into the water...no big deal, but looks sorta ugly ... for a while. I have been following all this with interest not sure whether I am being educated or confused. If the polarity swapping was of great value, it could be automated by circuit design, could it not? The interval of the reversing could even be variable. Seems some experimenting soul would have done it already. Wayne --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.778 / Virus Database: 525 - Release Date: 10/15/2004
Re: CSfloaters, chunkies and sparklies
My generator switches polarity every 55 seconds electronicly and doesn't use stirring. I get 22 ppm of clear CS. I decant by the use of a sun tea jar with a spiggot on the side. You just set it and forget it. No filtering or wipeing the electrodes. Dave Wayne Fugitt wrote: Evening Ode, Swapping the polarity of the electrodes just blows all that stuff into the water...no big deal, but looks sorta ugly ... for a while. I have been following all this with interest not sure whether I am being educated or confused. If the polarity swapping was of great value, it could be automated by circuit design, could it not? The interval of the reversing could even be variable. Seems some experimenting soul would have done it already. Wayne --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.778 / Virus Database: 525 - Release Date: 10/15/2004 -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
