Re: [Simh] error

[Johnny Eriksson]

Johnny Billquist  wrote:

> I wonder what powering down would imply for simh? Just exiting simh, or 
> should it power down the host? :-)

Well, "shutdown -p now" on my laptop just brings down the hardware that
runs that instance of *BSD, not the whole building, so just exiting simh
seems like the reasonable thing to do. ;->

--Johnny
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Re: [Simh] Sounds

[J. David Bryan]

On Friday, February 12, 2016 at 18:09, Bob Supnik wrote:

> When Applied Data Research got its PDP-7 in 1966, there was a DECUS
> program to get it to play music by toggling the lower order 4 bits of
> the MQ (and the MQ lights) to generate square waves. If you wired that
> up to an audio player, you got electronic "music" of a blatting sort,
> in four part harmony. 

At the HP office in Rockville, MD in 1975, they had a small program that 
played music on an HP 2748 paper tape reader, which was a 500 cps optical 
unit that could stop and start on each byte.  It utilized a solenoid-
actuated brake that was driven by the control flip-flop on the interface 
card.  Set the control FF, and the brake would release for reading.  Clear 
the FF, and the brake would energize and pinch the tape to stop it.

So with the program loaded, you'd fold a foot-long piece of scrap tape in 
half and tuck it under the brake anvil to act as a sounding board.  When 
you ran the program, it'd play a short ditty by pulsing the brake at 
various frequencies.


> ...it sounded utterly bizarre, but... the computer was playing music! 

Quite so.  The HP SEs didn't like to show the program more than once per 
customer, as they said it put a month's worth of wear on the reader in 
thirty seconds.

  -- Dave

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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Bill Cunningham]

  - Original Message - 
  From: Johnny Billquist 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 4:42 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  On 2016-02-12 22:40, Bill Cunningham wrote:
  > Hum. I am running in console mode. Cut and paste from one terminal
  > window to another? I will have to load some things. That's ok, but I was
  > wondering if simh was able to do this.

  I was just giving a suggestion. :-)
  I'm not aware of any really simple way of transporting bytes across the 
  barrier. I can think of various more or less tricky ways, but no really 
  simple ones.

  Sure I understand. I had in mind simh could do this though. 

  Bill
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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Johnny Billquist]

On 2016-02-12 22:36, Bill Cunningham wrote:

 I thought there were directions for this but I can't find them now.
I have a file I wish to put into openvms. I am using the vax simulator.
It contains a bit of license information. Is there a way through simh
that this file can be passed into a loaded openvms image? Maybe I was
looking at an emulator other than vax.


Text? How about cut-and-paste?

Johnny

--
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  ||  on a psychedelic trip
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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Bill Deegan]

For the PAKs I just copy/pasted to get things going. That worked fine.
Bring it up in a text editor on host machine, select all. Then in your simh
window you should be ok to paste.

On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 3:11 PM, Bill Cunningham 
wrote:

> I see. Forgive me but I don't know if vms has ftp or not. I'm really
> starting out with it. I found some pages for setting up phase iv but need
> to get the PAKs into openvms via simh.
>
>
> - Original Message -
> *From:* Bill Deegan 
> *To:* Bill Cunningham 
> *Sent:* Friday, February 12, 2016 6:06 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file
>
> Was thinking you could run ftp client inside vms and pull from a ftp
> server you push file to..
>
> On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 2:58 PM, Bill Cunningham 
> wrote:
>
>> I'm not sure. There's telnet that is in simh too. One might be able to do
>> something there. I tried copy and paste with X servers and it was a horror
>> story. Couldn't copy anything. How would you ftp it into vax then vms? Or
>> telnet it there if possible.
>>
>> Bill
>>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> *From:* Bill Deegan 
>> *To:* Bill Cunningham 
>> *Cc:* simh@trailing-edge.com
>> *Sent:* Friday, February 12, 2016 5:16 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file
>>
>> Can't ftp it into the vax?
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 1:46 PM, Bill Cunningham 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> - Original Message -
>>> *From:* Johnny Billquist 
>>> *To:* Bill Cunningham 
>>> *Sent:* Friday, February 12, 2016 4:42 PM
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file
>>>
>>> On 2016-02-12 22:40, Bill Cunningham wrote:
>>> > Hum. I am running in console mode. Cut and paste from one terminal
>>> > window to another? I will have to load some things. That's ok, but I
>>> was
>>> > wondering if simh was able to do this.
>>>
>>> I was just giving a suggestion. :-)
>>> I'm not aware of any really simple way of transporting bytes across the
>>> barrier. I can think of various more or less tricky ways, but no really
>>> simple ones.
>>>
>>> Sure I understand. I had in mind simh could do this though.
>>>
>>> Bill
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Simh] Sounds

[Timothe Litt]

There is a DECUS program for the -10 that also did music. 

Before the FCC mandated shielding c.a. 1990, your could also get sound
effects from the RF emissions.

I predict that SimH isn't going to emulate any of that.

The -10 also supported 1,200 CPM card readers.  The amazing thing is
that in a machine room where the fans, AC, motors & printers were
deafening, you REALLY noticed the extra noise when the card reader
started.  I wore hearing protectors...

On 12-Feb-16 18:09, Bob Supnik wrote:
> And then there was early computer music...
>
> When Applied Data Research got its PDP-7 in 1966, there was a DECUS
> program to get it to play music by toggling the lower order 4 bits of
> the MQ (and the MQ lights) to generate square waves. If you wired that
> up to an audio player, you got electronic "music" of a blatting sort,
> in four part harmony. (It really needed some analog filtering to
> flatten the square waves into curves, but that was beyond me.) Anyway,
> I spent much of my free time that summer programming as much of the
> original piano score of "Pictures at an Exhibition" as would fit into
> four parts. With the buzzing tones, the completely constant volume,
> and the coarse controls over note lengths, it sounded utterly bizarre,
> but... the computer was playing music! As was said back then, "The
> marvel is not that the bear dances well, but that the bear dances at
> all."
>
> The PDP-7 had DECtapes, and they had their own unique rhythms. DEC's
> software was poorly written and could only read a block at a time, so
> you'd hear the tape start, reverse, read, stop; rinse and repeat. A
> brilliant colleague named Avram Caspy figured out how to insert
> optimized routines underneath DEC's software (he used all 8KW extended
> memory as a buffer). With his routines, the DECtapes would start,
> reverse, and then whoosh at high speed for up to 30 blocks before
> stopping. DEC's paper tape routines were equally poor and would
> stutter-read; use of interrupts and a short circular buffer made that
> continuous and quieter as well.
>
> Another fun set of devices were the very high-speed vacuum pick card
> readers that the mainframe companies made. They would blow air through
> the card deck to separate the cards and then vacuum pick the top card,
> reading and expelling it at breakneck speed (the best readers did 1000
> cards per minute or more). Of course, when they broke, you got a
> totally different sound, as cards were blown all over the machine
> room, typically with the front-edges curled, making them unreadable.
>
> /Bob
>
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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Bill Cunningham]

Didn't work for me. Not at all. Just don't know what I'm doing probably with 
Xservers. Well I see openvms does indeed have ftp. Yeah I think your idea could 
work. But is a file I have called "dec.com" I could use @dec.com in vms to run 
attachable somehow to simh. I believe it is.

Bill

  - Original Message - 
  From: Bill Deegan 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 6:17 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  For the PAKs I just copy/pasted to get things going. That worked fine.

  Bring it up in a text editor on host machine, select all. Then in your simh 
window you should be ok to paste.



  On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 3:11 PM, Bill Cunningham  
wrote:

I see. Forgive me but I don't know if vms has ftp or not. I'm really 
starting out with it. I found some pages for setting up phase iv but need to 
get the PAKs into openvms via simh.

  - Original Message - 
  From: Bill Deegan 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 6:06 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  Was thinking you could run ftp client inside vms and pull from a ftp 
server you push file to..



  On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 2:58 PM, Bill Cunningham  
wrote:

I'm not sure. There's telnet that is in simh too. One might be able to 
do something there. I tried copy and paste with X servers and it was a horror 
story. Couldn't copy anything. How would you ftp it into vax then vms? Or 
telnet it there if possible.

Bill

  - Original Message - 
  From: Bill Deegan 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 5:16 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  Can't ftp it into the vax?



  On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 1:46 PM, Bill Cunningham 
 wrote:


  - Original Message - 
  From: Johnny Billquist 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 4:42 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  On 2016-02-12 22:40, Bill Cunningham wrote:
  > Hum. I am running in console mode. Cut and paste from one 
terminal
  > window to another? I will have to load some things. That's ok, 
but I was
  > wondering if simh was able to do this.

  I was just giving a suggestion. :-)
  I'm not aware of any really simple way of transporting bytes 
across the 
  barrier. I can think of various more or less tricky ways, but no 
really 
  simple ones.

  Sure I understand. I had in mind simh could do this though. 

  Bill


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[Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Bill Cunningham]

I thought there were directions for this but I can't find them now. I have 
a file I wish to put into openvms. I am using the vax simulator. It contains a 
bit of license information. Is there a way through simh that this file can be 
passed into a loaded openvms image? Maybe I was looking at an emulator other 
than vax. 

Bill
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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Zachary Kline]

Bill,

As far as I’m aware you’ll need to copy and paste into your terminal emulator 
of choice. This requires making some changes in sys$system:modparams.dat on the 
VMS side.
I have
min_TTY_TYPAHDSZ=2064
min_TTY_ALTYPAHD=2064
MIN_MAXBUF=12000
This will make it easier to copy and paste large blocks of text.

Hope this helps,
Zack.
> On Feb 12, 2016, at 1:36 PM, Bill Cunningham  wrote:
> 
> I thought there were directions for this but I can't find them now. I 
> have a file I wish to put into openvms. I am using the vax simulator. It 
> contains a bit of license information. Is there a way through simh that this 
> file can be passed into a loaded openvms image? Maybe I was looking at an 
> emulator other than vax.
>  
> Bill
>  
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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Bill Deegan]

Can't ftp it into the vax?

On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 1:46 PM, Bill Cunningham 
wrote:

>
>
> - Original Message -
> *From:* Johnny Billquist 
> *To:* Bill Cunningham 
> *Sent:* Friday, February 12, 2016 4:42 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file
>
> On 2016-02-12 22:40, Bill Cunningham wrote:
> > Hum. I am running in console mode. Cut and paste from one terminal
> > window to another? I will have to load some things. That's ok, but I was
> > wondering if simh was able to do this.
>
> I was just giving a suggestion. :-)
> I'm not aware of any really simple way of transporting bytes across the
> barrier. I can think of various more or less tricky ways, but no really
> simple ones.
>
> Sure I understand. I had in mind simh could do this though.
>
> Bill
>
>
>
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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Gene Irwin]

I usually (on rsts) just attach it time the paper tape reader and copy it
to a file.

On Fri, Feb 12, 2016, 2:16 PM Bill Deegan  wrote:

> Can't ftp it into the vax?
>
> On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 1:46 PM, Bill Cunningham 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> *From:* Johnny Billquist 
>> *To:* Bill Cunningham 
>> *Sent:* Friday, February 12, 2016 4:42 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file
>>
>> On 2016-02-12 22:40, Bill Cunningham wrote:
>> > Hum. I am running in console mode. Cut and paste from one terminal
>> > window to another? I will have to load some things. That's ok, but I was
>> > wondering if simh was able to do this.
>>
>> I was just giving a suggestion. :-)
>> I'm not aware of any really simple way of transporting bytes across the
>> barrier. I can think of various more or less tricky ways, but no really
>> simple ones.
>>
>> Sure I understand. I had in mind simh could do this though.
>>
>> Bill
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
>>
>
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[Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Bill Cunningham]

Old posts to this list from 2014 say somethings but the links are dead. I 
don't know if simh has changed since then or not. MAC address and xq0 device 
will need set up and a file can be attached in simh somehow.

Bill
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Re: [Simh] Sounds

[Bob Supnik]

And then there was early computer music...

When Applied Data Research got its PDP-7 in 1966, there was a DECUS 
program to get it to play music by toggling the lower order 4 bits of 
the MQ (and the MQ lights) to generate square waves. If you wired that 
up to an audio player, you got electronic "music" of a blatting sort, in 
four part harmony. (It really needed some analog filtering to flatten 
the square waves into curves, but that was beyond me.) Anyway, I spent 
much of my free time that summer programming as much of the original 
piano score of "Pictures at an Exhibition" as would fit into four parts. 
With the buzzing tones, the completely constant volume, and the coarse 
controls over note lengths, it sounded utterly bizarre, but... the 
computer was playing music! As was said back then, "The marvel is not 
that the bear dances well, but that the bear dances at all."


The PDP-7 had DECtapes, and they had their own unique rhythms. DEC's 
software was poorly written and could only read a block at a time, so 
you'd hear the tape start, reverse, read, stop; rinse and repeat. A 
brilliant colleague named Avram Caspy figured out how to insert 
optimized routines underneath DEC's software (he used all 8KW extended 
memory as a buffer). With his routines, the DECtapes would start, 
reverse, and then whoosh at high speed for up to 30 blocks before 
stopping. DEC's paper tape routines were equally poor and would 
stutter-read; use of interrupts and a short circular buffer made that 
continuous and quieter as well.


Another fun set of devices were the very high-speed vacuum pick card 
readers that the mainframe companies made. They would blow air through 
the card deck to separate the cards and then vacuum pick the top card, 
reading and expelling it at breakneck speed (the best readers did 1000 
cards per minute or more). Of course, when they broke, you got a totally 
different sound, as cards were blown all over the machine room, 
typically with the front-edges curled, making them unreadable.


/Bob

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Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file

[Bill Cunningham]

I see. Forgive me but I don't know if vms has ftp or not. I'm really starting 
out with it. I found some pages for setting up phase iv but need to get the 
PAKs into openvms via simh.

  - Original Message - 
  From: Bill Deegan 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 6:06 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  Was thinking you could run ftp client inside vms and pull from a ftp server 
you push file to..



  On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 2:58 PM, Bill Cunningham  
wrote:

I'm not sure. There's telnet that is in simh too. One might be able to do 
something there. I tried copy and paste with X servers and it was a horror 
story. Couldn't copy anything. How would you ftp it into vax then vms? Or 
telnet it there if possible.

Bill

  - Original Message - 
  From: Bill Deegan 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Cc: simh@trailing-edge.com 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 5:16 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  Can't ftp it into the vax?



  On Fri, Feb 12, 2016 at 1:46 PM, Bill Cunningham  
wrote:


  - Original Message - 
  From: Johnny Billquist 
  To: Bill Cunningham 
  Sent: Friday, February 12, 2016 4:42 PM
  Subject: Re: [Simh] vax simh and loading file


  On 2016-02-12 22:40, Bill Cunningham wrote:
  > Hum. I am running in console mode. Cut and paste from one terminal
  > window to another? I will have to load some things. That's ok, but 
I was
  > wondering if simh was able to do this.

  I was just giving a suggestion. :-)
  I'm not aware of any really simple way of transporting bytes across 
the 
  barrier. I can think of various more or less tricky ways, but no 
really 
  simple ones.

  Sure I understand. I had in mind simh could do this though. 

  Bill


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Re: [Simh] Sounds

[Johnny Billquist]

The PDP-8 did as well. Actually, with the PDP-8, the normal way was to 
tune in somewhere on the AM band, and have the radio close to the 
machine, and you'd get 4 part harmonies
I might still have a tape with recordings somewhere. But I'm sure there 
are examples on YouTube as well.


And MUSIC.SV is definitely available, as is a number of files with 
various scrores people put it.


Quite a nifty program, the PDP-8 one was.

Johnny

On 2016-02-13 00:23, Timothe Litt wrote:

There is a DECUS program for the -10 that also did music.

Before the FCC mandated shielding c.a. 1990, your could also get sound
effects from the RF emissions.

I predict that SimH isn't going to emulate any of that.

The -10 also supported 1,200 CPM card readers.  The amazing thing is
that in a machine room where the fans, AC, motors & printers were
deafening, you REALLY noticed the extra noise when the card reader
started.  I wore hearing protectors...

On 12-Feb-16 18:09, Bob Supnik wrote:

And then there was early computer music...

When Applied Data Research got its PDP-7 in 1966, there was a DECUS
program to get it to play music by toggling the lower order 4 bits of
the MQ (and the MQ lights) to generate square waves. If you wired that
up to an audio player, you got electronic "music" of a blatting sort,
in four part harmony. (It really needed some analog filtering to
flatten the square waves into curves, but that was beyond me.) Anyway,
I spent much of my free time that summer programming as much of the
original piano score of "Pictures at an Exhibition" as would fit into
four parts. With the buzzing tones, the completely constant volume,
and the coarse controls over note lengths, it sounded utterly bizarre,
but... the computer was playing music! As was said back then, "The
marvel is not that the bear dances well, but that the bear dances at
all."

The PDP-7 had DECtapes, and they had their own unique rhythms. DEC's
software was poorly written and could only read a block at a time, so
you'd hear the tape start, reverse, read, stop; rinse and repeat. A
brilliant colleague named Avram Caspy figured out how to insert
optimized routines underneath DEC's software (he used all 8KW extended
memory as a buffer). With his routines, the DECtapes would start,
reverse, and then whoosh at high speed for up to 30 blocks before
stopping. DEC's paper tape routines were equally poor and would
stutter-read; use of interrupts and a short circular buffer made that
continuous and quieter as well.

Another fun set of devices were the very high-speed vacuum pick card
readers that the mainframe companies made. They would blow air through
the card deck to separate the cards and then vacuum pick the top card,
reading and expelling it at breakneck speed (the best readers did 1000
cards per minute or more). Of course, when they broke, you got a
totally different sound, as cards were blown all over the machine
room, typically with the front-edges curled, making them unreadable.

/Bob

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  ||  on a psychedelic trip
email: b...@softjar.se ||  Reading murder books
pdp is alive! ||  tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
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