Re: [Simh] Quest from 1979 on RSTS/E V06C-03 in Simh (Brett Bump)
On Sun, 30 Dec 2018, Paul Koning wrote: On Dec 30, 2018, at 4:07 PM, Brett Bump wrote: (Reply excluding photos) On Sun, 30 Dec 2018, Brett Bump wrote: Sorry Bob, that kit is a modified version which includes Paul's FORTH run time system ... With V6C? Interesting. I did that work around V9.0, though I don't remember if it was shipped with the kit at that time or only somewhat later. It doesn't do any real magic so it seems that it should work. It would be fascinating to find a copy of RSTS V5A and reconstruct the machinery (then totally undocumented and unsupported) for using additional runtime systems. It was pretty ugly but it worked well enough to enable us to run TECO in 1975 at my college. paul Yes, both your FORTH code and my Custom run-time-systems run with pretty much no issues. You can even set them as the permanent rts although you are then stuck with no CUSPS to continue (forced into Fig-Forth is cool) JOB MAX or SWAP MAX change? Any memory allocation changes? You currently have crash dump disabled. DD-MMM-YY? 23-FEB-85 12:00 PM? 12:01 FIG-FORTH V2.0+ The only thing you can do with mine is type help or shutup as V6C didn't come with CSPCOM and my rts depends on RSX CUSPS to bring it up if it is the default. I put your FORTH rts and my Custom rts's in the Kits I put up last year (V6C, V70, V72, V80 and V93). Was going to kit the rest of them but time got away from me. The V5 stuff would be interesting. The V3 code just confuses me completely and I can't make any of it run. Brett ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] Quest from 1979 on RSTS/E V06C-03 in Simh (Brett Bump)
> On Dec 30, 2018, at 4:07 PM, Brett Bump wrote: > > > (Reply excluding photos) > > On Sun, 30 Dec 2018, Brett Bump wrote: > >> >> Sorry Bob, that kit is a modified version which includes Paul's FORTH run >> time system ... With V6C? Interesting. I did that work around V9.0, though I don't remember if it was shipped with the kit at that time or only somewhat later. It doesn't do any real magic so it seems that it should work. It would be fascinating to find a copy of RSTS V5A and reconstruct the machinery (then totally undocumented and unsupported) for using additional runtime systems. It was pretty ugly but it worked well enough to enable us to run TECO in 1975 at my college. paul ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] Quest from 1979 on RSTS/E V06C-03 in Simh (Brett Bump)
(Reply excluding photos) On Sun, 30 Dec 2018, Brett Bump wrote: Sorry Bob, that kit is a modified version which includes Paul's FORTH run time system as well as my own Custom run time systems. If you follow the README.TXT file you can see the changes from a default V6C install. It's all there (but also a little extra). My run time systems were originally designed on a V8 system so a few features are missing in V6, but most of it is all the same (also the source tape is mounted so roll your own). Log into the 1,5 account with: SYSUSR Then (because there is no such animal as switching a default rts) type: CCL SW CUSTOM $` README (I think you will find there is a little more here to see) Brett PS. Most likely mailman will trim the photos I included but Bob sill see them. Enjoy and Happy New Year. On Sat, 29 Dec 2018, Robert G. Schaffrath wrote: Or you could grab the pre-genned V6C kit from: http://www.rsts.org/autoindex.php?dir=distros/RSTS_kits/=RSTS_V6C_Kit.zip I tried booting that, and it does boot, but the startup does not run. No system initialization is performed and I login as job 1 with no CCL's defined. The version at https://skn.noip.me/pdp11/rk2.dsk does boot and has all commands installed. Looking at both environments there are two things I noticed as different from the V06C-03 I was using in high school back in 1978. On our system we had control-T available that was enabled and disabled along with control-R. What was interesting was that it would show the job priority for non-privileged users. Priority display was removed in 7.0 for non-privileged users. We hackers discovered that on a slow running system, one could repeatedly hit control-C during login and abort the change from logged out priority +0 to priority -8 by LOGIN (control-T let us see that we were still at +0). That gave our teacher and the county data center where we rented access to the PDP-11/70 system fits. Eventually they wrote a "guard" program that would drop the priority of any non-privileged job found to be greater -8. The problem with that check was that some jobs legitimately got bumped to -4 priority temporarily due to the set-special-run-priority syscall. The "guard" did not recognize that and pushed jobs back down to -8. The other difference I noticed is that SYSTAT in privileged mode does not show the runburst. In privileged mode, SYSTAT had a "Pri/RB" column whereas this V06C-03 only has "Priority". That was documented in the RSTS/E manual I had bought from DEC. I have to wonder if we were running a version of V06C-03 with those additional enhancements. It definitely was not 7.0. I graduated in June 1980 and I was told they upgraded to 7.0 that summer. ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] Quest from 1979 on RSTS/E V06C-03 in Simh (Brett Bump)
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018, Paul Koning wrote: On Dec 29, 2018, at 3:29 PM, Robert G. Schaffrath wrote: Or you could grab the pre-genned V6C kit from: http://www.rsts.org/autoindex.php?dir=distros/RSTS_kits/=RSTS_V6C_Kit.zip I tried booting that, and it does boot, but the startup does not run. No system initialization is performed and I login as job 1 with no CCL's defined. The version at https://skn.noip.me/pdp11/rk2.dsk does boot and has all commands installed. Looking at both environments there are two things I noticed as different from the V06C-03 I was using in high school back in 1978. On our system we had control-T available that was enabled and disabled along with control-R. ... I have to wonder if we were running a version of V06C-03 with those additional enhancements. It definitely was not 7.0. I graduated in June 1980 and I was told they upgraded to 7.0 that summer. Control/T support was an optional feature, enabled during SYSGEN, for some time. I'm fairly sure it was never an undocumented feature, but it wasn't standard originally. paul I also am not sure if the "chasing snakes" code LIGHTS.OBJ was included in the V6 distributions or not (I haven't checked). I know we always genned that in our V8 machines and it was pulled from the V9 distributions. Brett ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] Quest from 1979 on RSTS/E V06C-03 in Simh (Brett Bump)
> On Dec 29, 2018, at 3:29 PM, Robert G. Schaffrath > wrote: > > > Or you could grab the pre-genned V6C kit from: > > > > http://www.rsts.org/autoindex.php?dir=distros/RSTS_kits/=RSTS_V6C_Kit.zip > > I tried booting that, and it does boot, but the startup does not run. No > system initialization is performed and I login as job 1 with no CCL's > defined. The version at https://skn.noip.me/pdp11/rk2.dsk does boot and has > all commands installed. > > Looking at both environments there are two things I noticed as different from > the V06C-03 I was using in high school back in 1978. On our system we had > control-T available that was enabled and disabled along with control-R. ... > > I have to wonder if we were running a version of V06C-03 with those > additional enhancements. It definitely was not 7.0. I graduated in June 1980 > and I was told they upgraded to 7.0 that summer. Control/T support was an optional feature, enabled during SYSGEN, for some time. I'm fairly sure it was never an undocumented feature, but it wasn't standard originally. paul ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] Quest from 1979 on RSTS/E V06C-03 in Simh (Brett Bump)
> Or you could grab the pre-genned V6C kit from: > > http://www.rsts.org/autoindex.php?dir=distros/RSTS_kits/=RSTS_V6C_Kit.zip I tried booting that, and it does boot, but the startup does not run. No system initialization is performed and I login as job 1 with no CCL's defined. The version at https://skn.noip.me/pdp11/rk2.dsk does boot and has all commands installed. Looking at both environments there are two things I noticed as different from the V06C-03 I was using in high school back in 1978. On our system we had control-T available that was enabled and disabled along with control-R. What was interesting was that it would show the job priority for non-privileged users. Priority display was removed in 7.0 for non-privileged users. We hackers discovered that on a slow running system, one could repeatedly hit control-C during login and abort the change from logged out priority +0 to priority -8 by LOGIN (control-T let us see that we were still at +0). That gave our teacher and the county data center where we rented access to the PDP-11/70 system fits. Eventually they wrote a "guard" program that would drop the priority of any non-privileged job found to be greater -8. The problem with that check was that some jobs legitimately got bumped to -4 priority temporarily due to the set-special-run-priority syscall. The "guard" did not recognize that and pushed jobs back down to -8. The other difference I noticed is that SYSTAT in privileged mode does not show the runburst. In privileged mode, SYSTAT had a "Pri/RB" column whereas this V06C-03 only has "Priority". That was documented in the RSTS/E manual I had bought from DEC. I have to wonder if we were running a version of V06C-03 with those additional enhancements. It definitely was not 7.0. I graduated in June 1980 and I was told they upgraded to 7.0 that summer. ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
