Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-28 Thread Robert Collins 
On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 08:43, DaZZa wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Feb 2004, Robert Collins wrote:
> 
> > On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 01:44, Greg Wright wrote:
> > > Don't work around it, you should use your ISPs SMTP server to send out
> > > mailAOL is to be commended for this type of checking.
> >
> > What ?!?!
> >
> > If I ring a friend, I get a virtual circuit without having to ring my
> > phone companies switchboard.
> 
> Yes, but your originating phone number doesn't change every time you make
> a phone call, does it?

but a) with a silent number, the recipient doesn't know my number
anyway. And b) what about public payphones?

Rob

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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Jon Teh 
On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 10:43:23AM +1100, Jeff Allison wrote:
> On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 10:31, Jon Teh wrote:
> 
> > That's still considered a real circuit however, even if your call goes via
> > TDMA on the way to the exchange. Inter exchange circuits are fibre these days
> > all running PCM over TDMA.
> > 
> > -- Jon Teh
> I had one of those but the wheels fell off :/
>

The who what?

-- Jon Teh 
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Jeff Allison 
On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 10:31, Jon Teh wrote:

> That's still considered a real circuit however, even if your call goes via
> TDMA on the way to the exchange. Inter exchange circuits are fibre these days
> all running PCM over TDMA.
> 
> -- Jon Teh
I had one of those but the wheels fell off :/

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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Jon Teh 
On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 10:28:10AM +1100, Jeff Allison wrote:
> On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 10:17, Jon Teh wrote:
> 
> > Well, technically you get a real circuit (non-virtual), and your call
> > passes through telco switch(es), which are automatic these days. You
> > don't have a copper pair going straight from you to your friend :).
> > 
> > -- Jon Teh
> well not to my house I'm on a RIM so theres fibre involved somewhere
> 

That's still considered a real circuit however, even if your call goes via
TDMA on the way to the exchange. Inter exchange circuits are fibre these days
all running PCM over TDMA.

-- Jon Teh
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Jeff Allison 
On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 10:17, Jon Teh wrote:

> Well, technically you get a real circuit (non-virtual), and your call
> passes through telco switch(es), which are automatic these days. You
> don't have a copper pair going straight from you to your friend :).
> 
> -- Jon Teh
well not to my house I'm on a RIM so theres fibre involved somewhere

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-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeff Allison
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-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Jon Teh 
On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 07:14:13AM +1100, Robert Collins wrote:
> On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 01:44, Greg Wright wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Don't work around it, you should use your ISPs SMTP server to send out
> > mailAOL is to be commended for this type of checking.
> 
> What ?!?! 
> 
> If I ring a friend, I get a virtual circuit without having to ring my
> phone companies switchboard.
> 

Well, technically you get a real circuit (non-virtual), and your call
passes through telco switch(es), which are automatic these days. You
don't have a copper pair going straight from you to your friend :).

-- Jon Teh
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Alan L Tyree 
On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 00:35, Stewart wrote:
> 
> On 25 Feb 2004, at 11:00 PM, Jeff Waugh wrote:
> 
> > 
> >
> >> Anyone been getting these
> >>
> >> And maybe know a work around
> >
> > Use your ISP's mail relay. AOL are, fairly legitimately from my POV,
> > blocking SMTP connections from hosts determined to be dynamic or 
> > otherwise
> > impermanent (residential, yada).
> 
> They're also blocking ISP's relays unfortunately. not sure if it's been 
> fixed yet but as of last week anyone using smtp.pacific.net.au couldn't 
> get through to aol either.
> 
> i do my best for my clients but sadly i can't get /their/ clients to 
> not use AOL. ;-)
> 
Earlier this year they blocked all Optus stuff for some reason or
another. They are known to be very bloody-minded.
Alan
> ..S.
> 
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread DaZZa 
On Thu, 26 Feb 2004, Robert Collins wrote:

> On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 01:44, Greg Wright wrote:
> > Don't work around it, you should use your ISPs SMTP server to send out
> > mailAOL is to be commended for this type of checking.
>
> What ?!?!
>
> If I ring a friend, I get a virtual circuit without having to ring my
> phone companies switchboard.

Yes, but your originating phone number doesn't change every time you make
a phone call, does it?

With a dynamic IP, your originating IP address _can_ {not necessarily
does, although on dialup it's almost a given} every time you connect.

Just to carry on your analogy, and I'm shutting up now because this is
*way* OT.

DaZZa

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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread DaZZa 
On Wed, 25 Feb 2004, Jeff Allison wrote:

> Anyone been getting these
>
> And maybe know a work around
>
> From: "Mail Delivery System" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 10:45 PM
> Subject: Undelivered Mail Returned to Sender
>
>
> > This is the Postfix program at host dalston.blackshaw.dyn.dhs.org.
> >
> > I'm sorry to have to inform you that the message returned
> > below could not be delivered to one or more destinations.
> >
> > For further assistance, please send mail to 
> >
> > If you do so, please include this problem report. You can
> > delete your own text from the message returned below.
> >
> > The Postfix program
> >
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: host mailin-03.mx.aol.com[205.188.159.249] said:
> 554-:
> > (DNS:B1) AOL has determined that you are connecting directly to our
> mail
> > servers from a residential or dynamic IP. AOL
> onG'8xccepID=22b403c8ad91bb
> > 554 TRANSACTION FAILED

It's commonplace these days for mail administrators to use RBL checks on
inbound commections.

One of the RBL lists has a heading for "dial-up blocks", or IP's which are
dynamically assigned to dial up clients, or dynamic allocation IP
addresses - which means that if the email *is* spam, it can't necessarily
be tracked effectively. My mail server does exactly what AOL's does -
denies the connection.

A work around is to relay your outbound mail through your ISP's
"legitimate" mail server - that way, AOL will see it coming from a
non-dynamic IP, and accept the message.

This, of course, depends on your ISP allowing you to relay through it.

DaZZa

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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread kevin . saenz 

>
> Don't work around it, you should use your ISPs SMTP server to send out
> mailAOL is to be commended for this type of checking.

Sorry Greg I disagree with you. If you have a legit mail server with
correct DNS entries then I can not see AOHells justification.



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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Robert Collins 
On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 07:27, Howard Lowndes wrote:

> > If I ring a friend, I get a virtual circuit without having to ring my
> > phone companies switchboard.
> 
> Yes, but you get to pay for the circuit, not your friend.

If my friend is out of the house, with call forwarding, then thats not
true - we both have to pay. Also, Pacific Internet, for example, only
charge on the greater of in | out traffic down your link. Lastly, your
friend does pay a retainer to their phone company for the privilege of
receiving calls.

Rob

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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Howard Lowndes 
On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 07:14, Robert Collins wrote:
> On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 01:44, Greg Wright wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Don't work around it, you should use your ISPs SMTP server to send out
> > mailAOL is to be commended for this type of checking.
> 
> What ?!?! 
> 
> If I ring a friend, I get a virtual circuit without having to ring my
> phone companies switchboard.

Yes, but you get to pay for the circuit, not your friend.

> 
> Rob
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Robert Collins 
On Thu, 2004-02-26 at 01:44, Greg Wright wrote:

> 
> Don't work around it, you should use your ISPs SMTP server to send out
> mailAOL is to be commended for this type of checking.

What ?!?! 

If I ring a friend, I get a virtual circuit without having to ring my
phone companies switchboard.

Rob
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Greg Wright 


*** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***

On 25/02/2004 at 10:56 PM Jeff Allison wrote:

>Anyone been getting these
>
>And maybe know a work around
>


Don't work around it, you should use your ISPs SMTP server to send out
mailAOL is to be commended for this type of checking.

Regards

Greg Wright
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Stewart 
On 25 Feb 2004, at 11:00 PM, Jeff Waugh wrote:



Anyone been getting these

And maybe know a work around
Use your ISP's mail relay. AOL are, fairly legitimately from my POV,
blocking SMTP connections from hosts determined to be dynamic or 
otherwise
impermanent (residential, yada).
They're also blocking ISP's relays unfortunately. not sure if it's been 
fixed yet but as of last week anyone using smtp.pacific.net.au couldn't 
get through to aol either.

i do my best for my clients but sadly i can't get /their/ clients to 
not use AOL. ;-)

..S.

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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Chris Deigan 
It is said that Jeff Waugh wrote:
>Use your ISP's mail relay. AOL are, fairly legitimately from my POV,
>blocking SMTP connections from hosts determined to be dynamic or otherwise
>impermanent (residential, yada).

AOL is not the only one I've seen block such messages, and I won't deny
that it is a fairly legitamit way of blocking most virii spam.

 - Chris
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Re: [SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Jeff Waugh 


> Anyone been getting these
> 
> And maybe know a work around

Use your ISP's mail relay. AOL are, fairly legitimately from my POV,
blocking SMTP connections from hosts determined to be dynamic or otherwise
impermanent (residential, yada).

- Jeff

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[SLUG] AOL SUCKS

2004-02-25 Thread Jeff Allison 
Anyone been getting these

And maybe know a work around

From: "Mail Delivery System" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 10:45 PM
Subject: Undelivered Mail Returned to Sender


> This is the Postfix program at host dalston.blackshaw.dyn.dhs.org.
>
> I'm sorry to have to inform you that the message returned
> below could not be delivered to one or more destinations.
>
> For further assistance, please send mail to 
>
> If you do so, please include this problem report. You can
> delete your own text from the message returned below.
>
> The Postfix program
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: host mailin-03.mx.aol.com[205.188.159.249] said:
554-:
> (DNS:B1) AOL has determined that you are connecting directly to our
mail
> servers from a residential or dynamic IP. AOL
onG'8xccepID=22b403c8ad91bb
> 554 TRANSACTION FAILED
>
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