[Standards] Update XEP-377

2024-02-27 Thread em...@msavoritias.me

Hey,


JoinJabber is interested in possibly hosting an rtbl instance and 
holding domains accountable to our CoC.


With that in mind the XEP-377 seems to be inadequate. Specifically here: 
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0377.html#payload



It mentions only:

*urn:xmpp:reporting:spam*
   Used for reporting a JID that is sending unwanted messages.
*urn:xmpp:reporting:abuse*
   Used for reporting general abuse.


That is severely limiting. For example what if somebody sends hate 
speech? or transphobia? or racism? or moderation is non existent in this 
server?



One solution when i talked about was removing the limitation of being 
only two and allowing any label basically. Wdyt?



MSavoritias
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[Standards] Re: Update XEP-377

2024-02-27 Thread Matthew Wild
Hey,

Thanks for the feedback.

On Tue, 27 Feb 2024 at 11:48, em...@msavoritias.me  wrote:
> JoinJabber is interested in possibly hosting an rtbl instance and holding 
> domains accountable to our CoC.
>
> With that in mind the XEP-377 seems to be inadequate. Specifically here: 
> https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0377.html#payload
>
>
> It mentions only:
>
> urn:xmpp:reporting:spam Used for reporting a JID that is sending unwanted 
> messages. urn:xmpp:reporting:abuse Used for reporting general abuse.
>
>
> That is severely limiting. For example what if somebody sends hate speech? or 
> transphobia? or racism? or moderation is non existent in this server?
>
>
> One solution when i talked about was removing the limitation of being only 
> two and allowing any label basically. Wdyt?

Actually the XEP defines a registry for these:
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0377.html#registrar-reporting

This allows defining new reasons without needing to update the XEP.
It's also intentionally a URI, so that other URIs can be used there.

However I would also suggest considering whether using one of the
existing reasons (likely the generic 'urn:xmpp:reporting:abuse')
combined with a text description to provide the additional detail
would suffice, in the interests of interoperability.

Regards,
Matthew
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[Standards] Re: Update XEP-377

2024-02-27 Thread Sam Whited
The general idea here was that the URI is for *machines* to process, so 
it doesn't have to be exact. A machine would treat spam and generic 
abuse differently (eg. it might apply automated spem scanning to one 
message, but immediately forward the other along to a moderator).


In my view any new URI should be something that can be handled by a 
machine and that would be different than how the existing URIs are 
handled. This means they are very general in nature. Everything else 
should be handled by the description.


That being said, I'd like to make more improvements to this spec and 
think we can do a lot better, but since adoption is already low I'm 
hesitant to expand it without first figuring out how to increase adoption.


—Sam

On 2/27/24 06:59, Matthew Wild wrote:

Hey,

Thanks for the feedback.

On Tue, 27 Feb 2024 at 11:48, em...@msavoritias.me  wrote:

JoinJabber is interested in possibly hosting an rtbl instance and holding 
domains accountable to our CoC.

With that in mind the XEP-377 seems to be inadequate. Specifically here: 
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0377.html#payload


It mentions only:

urn:xmpp:reporting:spam Used for reporting a JID that is sending unwanted 
messages. urn:xmpp:reporting:abuse Used for reporting general abuse.


That is severely limiting. For example what if somebody sends hate speech? or 
transphobia? or racism? or moderation is non existent in this server?


One solution when i talked about was removing the limitation of being only two 
and allowing any label basically. Wdyt?


Actually the XEP defines a registry for these:
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0377.html#registrar-reporting

This allows defining new reasons without needing to update the XEP.
It's also intentionally a URI, so that other URIs can be used there.

However I would also suggest considering whether using one of the
existing reasons (likely the generic 'urn:xmpp:reporting:abuse')
combined with a text description to provide the additional detail
would suffice, in the interests of interoperability.

Regards,
Matthew
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--
Sam Whited
s...@samwhited.com
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