Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Tony Anderson]

Attahed is a spreadsheet inventory of the Sugar activities on ASLO. 
Except for clerical errors, this is accurate and complete as of 
mid-April, 2018. It reports on 537 activities. With a very nine 
exceptions, each activity has an xo bundle on ASLO 
(http://downloads.sugarlabs.org/activities). The first column gives the 
folder name. The fourth column is the bundle (file name).


The bundles tested on Ubuntu were built (setup.py) from the github 
repository (fifth column). There is no assurance that this bundle 
corresponds to the bundle with that name on ASLO itself. The testing on 
the XO-1.5 is not complete. This testing was done by downloading the 
bundle built on Ubuntu to the XO from the schoolserver. The ten 
activities on the Ubuntu install were not independently tested.


In Summary, the spreadsheet shows 528 sugar activities (bundles). Of 
these, 224 have repositories on github. Of these, 87 work on 0.112 on 
Ubuntu 18.04 LTS.


My assumption is that the official repository for each activity is on 
github.com/sugarlabs/. Any bundle released to ASLO is built from the 
that repository. This implies a need to get official repositories 
established for the 304 activities which do not have one. A reasonable 
first focus is on the 137 repositories that do not produce a working 
version.


These numbers need to be taken with a grain of salt. For example, 
sugar-web-activities are shown among the 304 only because of the testing 
procedure. However, with help from interested parties, the spreadsheet 
can be made more accurate. It probably needs to be put up on the 
Sugarlabs site - possibly on github. I am certainly willing to follow 
instructions in this regard.


My primary motivation is to provide an inventory of Sugar activities on 
the schoolserver which users can download and install. The school server 
view is similar to that cited by Walter. It requires only the simplest 
of html5 and javascript. The display is data driven. The primary problem 
is to know which of the activities are viable. It can be very 
discouraging to download an activity and have it return 'did not start'.


Tony

On Monday, 07 May, 2018 11:02 AM, Thomas Gilliard wrote:




On 05/06/2018 07:17 PM, Walter Bender wrote:



On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 10:00 PM Tony Anderson > wrote:


Hi, Walter

Is there a link to a description of the proposed new server? I
assume that what you mean is that a new physical server will
become host to ASLO. Naturally, I am much more interested in the
capabilities of the service than the server.

I am referring to https://aslo3-devel.sugarlabs.org (I see James 
answered you while I was typing this.)
looks like 
https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/images/thumb/2/29/SN-0.3_Offline.png/800px-SN-0.3_Offline.png

sugar network https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Network/Tutorial


It is really hard for me to see any connection between
activity.info  and an activity service
(which supplies information about activities and downloads the
bundle  on request).I assume these consistency tests are made
before a new activity version is released and is part of the
process of creating a github repository.


The database for ASLO3 is derived from the activity.info 
 files. But those data need cleaning up. This 
is why we have not gone live with the new server.


The python script can use a loop on the list of bundles:

for activity in activities:

 #use zipfile to read the activity.info
 file

 #count or test for any property

 #report (e.g. print ) result of test by activity

#report summary of loop execution


I do not have any idea of what you are referring to by a
screenshot. I certainly hope there is no intent to add a
screenshot to an activity bundle. It may be fun to revel in
storage available on a PC but the overwhelming number of our
users have XO laptops with very limited storage. This is similar
to the trend to make Sugar more dependent on the internet. For
example, sudo apt-get install sucrose is difficult to accomplish
in a room with 40 laptops and no internet, the current situation
in Rwanda with the Positivo laptop.


We use screenshots in the activity portal. They need not be included 
in the bundles.



Tony

On Monday, 07 May, 2018 09:35 AM, Walter Bender wrote:

This particular discussion was about activity.info
 because the student is working on getting
the activity server on line and cleaning up the activity.info
 files is an essential step.

I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as an
attempt to provide a separate place for Sugar activity
repositories based on download.sugarlabs.org/activities
. The number of
activities 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[James Cameron]

On Sun, May 06, 2018 at 08:02:32PM -0700, Thomas Gilliard wrote:
> 
> On 05/06/2018 07:17 PM, Walter Bender wrote:
> 
> On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 10:00 PM Tony Anderson <[1]t...@olenepal.org> 
> wrote:
> 
> Hi, Walter
> 
> Is there a link to a description of the proposed new server? I assume
> that what you mean is that a new physical server will become host to
> ASLO. Naturally, I am much more interested in the capabilities of the
> service than the server.
> 
> I am referring to https://aslo3-devel.sugarlabs.org (I see James
> answered you while I was typing this.)
> 
> looks like 
> https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/images/thumb/2/29/SN-0.3_Offline.png/800px-SN-0.3_Offline.png
> sugar network 
> https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Network/Tutorial

Yeah, good point.  Okay, so let's call Sugar Network an ASLOv1.5?  ;-)

Sugar Network could work without internet, using peer to peer bundle
transfers.  A great improvement over ALSOv1.

-- 
James Cameron
http://quozl.netrek.org/
___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Thomas Gilliard]

On 05/06/2018 07:17 PM, Walter Bender wrote:



On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 10:00 PM Tony Anderson > wrote:


Hi, Walter

Is there a link to a description of the proposed new server? I
assume that what you mean is that a new physical server will
become host to ASLO. Naturally, I am much more interested in the
capabilities of the service than the server.

I am referring to https://aslo3-devel.sugarlabs.org (I see James 
answered you while I was typing this.)
looks like 
https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/images/thumb/2/29/SN-0.3_Offline.png/800px-SN-0.3_Offline.png

sugar network  https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Network/Tutorial


It is really hard for me to see any connection between
activity.info  and an activity service
(which supplies information about activities and downloads the
bundle  on request).I assume these consistency tests are made
before a new activity version is released and is part of the
process of creating a github repository.


The database for ASLO3 is derived from the activity.info 
 files. But those data need cleaning up. This is 
why we have not gone live with the new server.


The python script can use a loop on the list of bundles:

for activity in activities:

 #use zipfile to read the activity.info 
file

 #count or test for any property

 #report (e.g. print ) result of test by activity

#report summary of loop execution


I do not have any idea of what you are referring to by a
screenshot. I certainly hope there is no intent to add a
screenshot to an activity bundle. It may be fun to revel in
storage available on a PC but the overwhelming number of our users
have XO laptops with very limited storage. This is similar to the
trend to make Sugar more dependent on the internet. For example,
sudo apt-get install sucrose is difficult to accomplish in a room
with 40 laptops and no internet, the current situation in Rwanda
with the Positivo laptop.


We use screenshots in the activity portal. They need not be included 
in the bundles.



Tony

On Monday, 07 May, 2018 09:35 AM, Walter Bender wrote:

This particular discussion was about activity.info
 because the student is working on getting
the activity server on line and cleaning up the activity.info
 files is an essential step.

I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt
to provide a separate place for Sugar activity repositories
based on download.sugarlabs.org/activities
. The number of
activities mentioned is consistent with the current content
of ASLO. (see http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)


Yes. We have an on-going effort to migrate to a new activity
server which is both easier to maintain and a richer experience
for our users.

A simple python script can process the activity.info
 in activity bundles very quickly.
Simply download every activity bundle and then use import
zipfile to read the activity.info  file
and check it for whatever is interesting. I generally use ls
-1 *.xo > list to create a file. The python script can easily
form a list of activities from this file.


We are concerned about a number of inconsistencies with the data,
including license, summary, screen shots, etc.


___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org

http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel



--
Walter Bender
Sugar Labs
http://www.sugarlabs.org



___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel


___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[James Cameron]

I can't delete it, I don't have access.  Only Ignacio does, and he's
inactive these days.

There's also https://github.com/sugarlabs-activities which has no
people.

No, I don't want everything in one bucket.  I'd prefer GitLab over
GitHub.

The make a new ASLO does look like a NIH (not invented here) syndrome,
and my preference is to fix the old one.  And that's what I was doing.

Programmers who refuse to learn a language or tool are just limiting
themselves.

That version number convention has been changed; it happened about
eight years ago, for v0.92, in commit
c7a80a1e56e4f52e280b0b1d87643899726f6c36 by Gonzalo Odiard and Simon
Schampijer as part of ticket #2425.

http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Dotted_Activity_Versions

I'm keeping the feature.  It is useful.

Bundle deletion should be done automatically; the scenario you gave
was limited space on a laptop and download using Browse.  As you said
before; why would we keep the bundle in the Journal after installing
it?

Yes, quite capable of releasing a new Hello World, but there's no
point doing so; (a) it is a useless activity, it doesn't even say
hello to the world, just to the user (b) it is only a coding example.

Users can refer to the activity already, they don't need a bundle for
it.  Pippy and Develop have what is needed.

On Mon, May 07, 2018 at 10:23:05AM +0800, Tony Anderson wrote:
> If you believe it is trash, remove it. It is trash only in that there was no
> follow-up. You and Walter seem to want everything in one bucket. In the past
> few days I have spent a lot of time on github using search to find out if
> there is a repository for an activity. So, if you feel it is correct, delete
> the sugaractivities trash.
> 
> The list of tries to clean up ASLO shows the problem. Each attempt started
> by trashing ASLO and beginning again. What is needed is to leverage what we
> have. I believe the first step is to make an up-to-date inventory of the
> Sugar activities and their status. That is my current focus.
> 
> Never is a long time.
> 
> "Rather than stuff
> around with ASLO, we really need activity maintainers who will release
> new activity versions."
> 
> Agreed.
> 
> Version numbers are treated in Sugar as text, so you are certainly correct.
> An activity version could be 'wonderful'.
> However, the bundle browse-157.3.xo shows the version number. We could have
> myactivity-wonderful.xo.
> 
> This number by convention should be an integer incremented by a new release.
> This immediately informs the user that if the installed activity (List View)
> version number is less than the current version number on ASLO, there is a
> possible update. The original guidelines were to increment version numbers
> by 1.
> 
> Bundle deletion should never be done automatically. It requires a thoughtful
> decision. The decision to block Hello World illustrates our fundamental
> problem. We choose to 'deprecate' since it means the problem is no longer a
> problem and no further action is needed. Blocking Hello World doesn't seem
> much simpler than building a bundle by setup.py from the repository (after
> updating the version number to 7) and then installing in on ASLO. I know you
> are capable of both steps. Having a simple activity that users can refer to
> when attempting to build their own activity should be an essential part of
> our educational objective. Blocking does serve the purpose of eliminating
> the problem.
> 
> Tony
> 
> On Monday, 07 May, 2018 09:49 AM, James Cameron wrote:
> >No surprise that this meeting didn't discuss an activity server or
> >WikiPort, because (a) the questions were about a private mail (there
> >was no link), and (b) the new term WikiPort is Vipul's name for the
> >project.
> >
> >I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as trash left lying
> >around by a previous contributor.  It ruins code and text searches on
> >GitHub, because there are so many matches in the wrong place.  I've
> >had two contributors misidentify repositories because of it.
> >
> >While it would be nice to clean up ASLO, this is obviously never going
> >to happen, because we've had so many people try already, then fail.
> >ASLOv2, then ASLOv3, and we're still on ASLOv1.  I've fixed a few
> >things, 'cause I can code in PHP.  It's not hard.  Rather than stuff
> >around with ASLO, we really need activity maintainers who will release
> >new activity versions.
> >
> >You're wrong about the version numbers.  Sugar supports version
> >numbers with any number of periods separated by numbers.  Our
> >specification of version number is
> >https://developer.sugarlabs.org/sugar3/sugar3.bundle.bundleversion.html
> >
> >(For others, "real" is FORTRAN for floating point.  Both Tony and I
> >used Fortran.)
> >
> >Yes, automatic bundle deletion should be done.  Any volunteers to do
> >it?  Thought not.  https://github.com/sugarlabs/browse-activity/issues/81
> >
> >On Mon, May 07, 2018 at 09:20:08AM +0800, Tony Anderson wrote:
> >>I read the log and 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Tony Anderson]

If you believe it is trash, remove it. It is trash only in that there 
was no follow-up. You and Walter seem to want everything in one bucket. 
In the past few days I have spent a lot of time on github using search 
to find out if there is a repository for an activity. So, if you feel it 
is correct, delete the sugaractivities trash.


The list of tries to clean up ASLO shows the problem. Each attempt 
started by trashing ASLO and beginning again. What is needed is to 
leverage what we have. I believe the first step is to make an up-to-date 
inventory of the Sugar activities and their status. That is my current 
focus.


Never is a long time.

"Rather than stuff
around with ASLO, we really need activity maintainers who will release
new activity versions."

Agreed.

Version numbers are treated in Sugar as text, so you are certainly 
correct. An activity version could be 'wonderful'.
However, the bundle browse-157.3.xo shows the version number. We could 
have myactivity-wonderful.xo.


This number by convention should be an integer incremented by a new 
release. This immediately informs the user that if the installed 
activity (List View) version number is less than the current version 
number on ASLO, there is a possible update. The original guidelines were 
to increment version numbers by 1.


Bundle deletion should never be done automatically. It requires a 
thoughtful decision. The decision to block Hello World illustrates our 
fundamental problem. We choose to 'deprecate' since it means the problem 
is no longer a problem and no further action is needed. Blocking Hello 
World doesn't seem much simpler than building a bundle by setup.py from 
the repository (after updating the version number to 7) and then 
installing in on ASLO. I know you are capable of both steps. Having a 
simple activity that users can refer to when attempting to build their 
own activity should be an essential part of our educational objective. 
Blocking does serve the purpose of eliminating the problem.


Tony

On Monday, 07 May, 2018 09:49 AM, James Cameron wrote:

No surprise that this meeting didn't discuss an activity server or
WikiPort, because (a) the questions were about a private mail (there
was no link), and (b) the new term WikiPort is Vipul's name for the
project.

I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as trash left lying
around by a previous contributor.  It ruins code and text searches on
GitHub, because there are so many matches in the wrong place.  I've
had two contributors misidentify repositories because of it.

While it would be nice to clean up ASLO, this is obviously never going
to happen, because we've had so many people try already, then fail.
ASLOv2, then ASLOv3, and we're still on ASLOv1.  I've fixed a few
things, 'cause I can code in PHP.  It's not hard.  Rather than stuff
around with ASLO, we really need activity maintainers who will release
new activity versions.

You're wrong about the version numbers.  Sugar supports version
numbers with any number of periods separated by numbers.  Our
specification of version number is
https://developer.sugarlabs.org/sugar3/sugar3.bundle.bundleversion.html

(For others, "real" is FORTRAN for floating point.  Both Tony and I
used Fortran.)

Yes, automatic bundle deletion should be done.  Any volunteers to do
it?  Thought not.  https://github.com/sugarlabs/browse-activity/issues/81

On Mon, May 07, 2018 at 09:20:08AM +0800, Tony Anderson wrote:

I read the log and didn't see any discussion of either an activity server or a
WikiPort. Most of the discussion seems to focus on 'activity.info'.

I interpret [1]https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt to provide a
separate place for Sugar activity repositories based on download.sugarlabs.org/
activities. The number of activities mentioned is consistent with the current
content of ASLO. (see [2]http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)

A simple python script can process the activity.info in activity bundles very
quickly. Simply download every activity bundle and then use import zipfile to
read the activity.info file and check it for whatever is interesting. I
generally use ls -1 *.xo > list to create a file. The python script can easily
form a list of activities from this file.

Our primary goal must be to provide information and support for our users and
prospective users. There is no reason for a user ever to know that there is an
activity.info file or indeed an Activities folder. The original design provides
the information needed for Sugar to register and execute the activity within
the activity.py framework. In this spirit, the repository link should join the
website link on ASLO where it is visible to the user.

In the spirit of view source, wouldn't it be helpful to have documentation
giving the  user a map of Sugar and the role of the various modules? This could
start with the information in activity.py. (/usr/lib/python2.7/site-packages/
sugar3/activity/activity.py). This could lead in to James 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Walter Bender]

On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 10:00 PM Tony Anderson  wrote:

> Hi, Walter
>
> Is there a link to a description of the proposed new server? I assume that
> what you mean is that a new physical server will become host to ASLO.
> Naturally, I am much more interested in the capabilities of the service
> than the server.
>
I am referring to https://aslo3-devel.sugarlabs.org (I see James answered
you while I was typing this.)


> It is really hard for me to see any connection between activity.info and
> an activity service (which supplies information about activities and
> downloads the bundle  on request).I assume these consistency tests are made
> before a new activity version is released and is part of the process of
> creating a github repository.
>

The database for ASLO3 is derived from the activity.info files. But those
data need cleaning up. This is why we have not gone live with the new
server.

> The python script can use a loop on the list of bundles:
>
> for activity in activities:
>
>  #use zipfile to read the activity.info file
>
>  #count or test for any property
>
>  #report (e.g. print ) result of test by activity
>
> #report summary of loop execution
>
>
> I do not have any idea of what you are referring to by a screenshot. I
> certainly hope there is no intent to add a screenshot to an activity
> bundle. It may be fun to revel in storage available on a PC but the
> overwhelming number of our users have XO laptops with very limited storage.
> This is similar to the trend to make Sugar more dependent on the internet.
> For example, sudo apt-get install sucrose is difficult to accomplish in a
> room with 40 laptops and no internet, the current situation in Rwanda with
> the Positivo laptop.
>

We use screenshots in the activity portal. They need not be included in the
bundles.

>
> Tony
>
> On Monday, 07 May, 2018 09:35 AM, Walter Bender wrote:
>
> This particular discussion was about activity.info because the student is
> working on getting the activity server on line and cleaning up the
> activity.info files is an essential step.
>
>> I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt to provide
>> a separate place for Sugar activity repositories based on
>> download.sugarlabs.org/activities. The number of activities mentioned is
>> consistent with the current content of ASLO. (see
>> http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)
>>
>
> Yes. We have an on-going effort to migrate to a new activity server which
> is both easier to maintain and a richer experience for our users.
>
>> A simple python script can process the activity.info in activity bundles
>> very quickly. Simply download every activity bundle and then use import
>> zipfile to read the activity.info file and check it for whatever is
>> interesting. I generally use ls -1 *.xo > list to create a file. The python
>> script can easily form a list of activities from this file.
>>
>
> We are concerned about a number of inconsistencies with the data,
> including license, summary, screen shots, etc.
>
>
> ___
> Sugar-devel mailing list
> Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>


-- 
Walter Bender
Sugar Labs
http://www.sugarlabs.org

___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[James Cameron]

Link to proposed new service.

https://github.com/sugarlabs/aslo-v3

Already written parsing of activity.info file;

https://github.com/sugarlabs/aslo-v3/blob/272b779725cd0ca45e8008b2514e051c9b7ca1d8/aslo/api/release.py

Uses configparser module, part of Python.

Screenshots should not be in bundles; raise an issue if you find one,
and I'll remove it somehow.

Nobody should be doing apt install sucrose on a classroom of
computers.  Use proper deployment tools.  Making builds, imaging, OEM
install, that kind of thing.  This is a service we provide to our
customers at OLPC.

On Mon, May 07, 2018 at 10:00:02AM +0800, Tony Anderson wrote:
> Hi, Walter
> 
> Is there a link to a description of the proposed new server? I assume that 
> what
> you mean is that a new physical server will become host to ASLO. Naturally, I
> am much more interested in the capabilities of the service than the server.
> 
> It is really hard for me to see any connection between activity.info and an
> activity service (which supplies information about activities and downloads 
> the
> bundle  on request).I assume these consistency tests are made before a new
> activity version is released and is part of the process of creating a github
> repository.
> 
> The python script can use a loop on the list of bundles:
> 
> for activity in activities:
> 
>  #use zipfile to read the activity.info file
> 
>  #count or test for any property
> 
>  #report (e.g. print ) result of test by activity
> 
> #report summary of loop execution
> 
> I do not have any idea of what you are referring to by a screenshot. I
> certainly hope there is no intent to add a screenshot to an activity bundle. 
> It
> may be fun to revel in storage available on a PC but the overwhelming number 
> of
> our users have XO laptops with very limited storage. This is similar to the
> trend to make Sugar more dependent on the internet. For example, sudo apt-get
> install sucrose is difficult to accomplish in a room with 40 laptops and no
> internet, the current situation in Rwanda with the Positivo laptop.
> 
> Tony
> 
> On Monday, 07 May, 2018 09:35 AM, Walter Bender wrote:
> 
> This particular discussion was about [1]activity.info because the student
> is working on getting the activity server on line and cleaning up the [2]
> activity.info files is an essential step. 
> 
> I interpret [3]https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt to
> provide a separate place for Sugar activity repositories based on [4]
> download.sugarlabs.org/activities. The number of activities mentioned
> is consistent with the current content of ASLO. (see [5]http://
> activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)
> 
> Yes. We have an on-going effort to migrate to a new activity server which
> is both easier to maintain and a richer experience for our users.
> 
> A simple python script can process the [6]activity.info in activity
> bundles very quickly. Simply download every activity bundle and then
> use import zipfile to read the [7]activity.info file and check it for
> whatever is interesting. I generally use ls -1 *.xo > list to create a
> file. The python script can easily form a list of activities from this
> file.
> 
> We are concerned about a number of inconsistencies with the data, 
> including
> license, summary, screen shots, etc. 
> 
> References:
> 
> [1] http://activity.info/
> [2] http://activity.info/
> [3] https://github.com/sugar-activities
> [4] http://download.sugarlabs.org/activities
> [5] http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/
> [6] http://activity.info/
> [7] http://activity.info/

> ___
> Sugar-devel mailing list
> Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel


-- 
James Cameron
http://quozl.netrek.org/
___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Tony Anderson]

Hi, Walter

Is there a link to a description of the proposed new server? I assume 
that what you mean is that a new physical server will become host to 
ASLO. Naturally, I am much more interested in the capabilities of the 
service than the server.


It is really hard for me to see any connection between activity.info and 
an activity service (which supplies information about activities and 
downloads the bundle  on request).I assume these consistency tests are 
made before a new activity version is released and is part of the 
process of creating a github repository.


The python script can use a loop on the list of bundles:

for activity in activities:

 #use zipfile to read the activity.info file

 #count or test for any property

 #report (e.g. print ) result of test by activity

#report summary of loop execution


I do not have any idea of what you are referring to by a screenshot. I 
certainly hope there is no intent to add a screenshot to an activity 
bundle. It may be fun to revel in storage available on a PC but the 
overwhelming number of our users have XO laptops with very limited 
storage. This is similar to the trend to make Sugar more dependent on 
the internet. For example, sudo apt-get install sucrose is difficult to 
accomplish in a room with 40 laptops and no internet, the current 
situation in Rwanda with the Positivo laptop.


Tony

On Monday, 07 May, 2018 09:35 AM, Walter Bender wrote:
This particular discussion was about activity.info 
 because the student is working on getting the 
activity server on line and cleaning up the activity.info 
 files is an essential step.


I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt to
provide a separate place for Sugar activity repositories based on
download.sugarlabs.org/activities
. The number of
activities mentioned is consistent with the current content of
ASLO. (see http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)


Yes. We have an on-going effort to migrate to a new activity server 
which is both easier to maintain and a richer experience for our users.


A simple python script can process the activity.info
 in activity bundles very quickly. Simply
download every activity bundle and then use import zipfile to read
the activity.info  file and check it for
whatever is interesting. I generally use ls -1 *.xo > list to
create a file. The python script can easily form a list of
activities from this file.


We are concerned about a number of inconsistencies with the data, 
including license, summary, screen shots, etc.


___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[James Cameron]

No surprise that this meeting didn't discuss an activity server or
WikiPort, because (a) the questions were about a private mail (there
was no link), and (b) the new term WikiPort is Vipul's name for the
project.

I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as trash left lying
around by a previous contributor.  It ruins code and text searches on
GitHub, because there are so many matches in the wrong place.  I've
had two contributors misidentify repositories because of it.

While it would be nice to clean up ASLO, this is obviously never going
to happen, because we've had so many people try already, then fail.
ASLOv2, then ASLOv3, and we're still on ASLOv1.  I've fixed a few
things, 'cause I can code in PHP.  It's not hard.  Rather than stuff
around with ASLO, we really need activity maintainers who will release
new activity versions.

You're wrong about the version numbers.  Sugar supports version
numbers with any number of periods separated by numbers.  Our
specification of version number is
https://developer.sugarlabs.org/sugar3/sugar3.bundle.bundleversion.html

(For others, "real" is FORTRAN for floating point.  Both Tony and I
used Fortran.)

Yes, automatic bundle deletion should be done.  Any volunteers to do
it?  Thought not.  https://github.com/sugarlabs/browse-activity/issues/81

On Mon, May 07, 2018 at 09:20:08AM +0800, Tony Anderson wrote:
> I read the log and didn't see any discussion of either an activity server or a
> WikiPort. Most of the discussion seems to focus on 'activity.info'.
> 
> I interpret [1]https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt to provide a
> separate place for Sugar activity repositories based on 
> download.sugarlabs.org/
> activities. The number of activities mentioned is consistent with the current
> content of ASLO. (see [2]http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)
> 
> A simple python script can process the activity.info in activity bundles very
> quickly. Simply download every activity bundle and then use import zipfile to
> read the activity.info file and check it for whatever is interesting. I
> generally use ls -1 *.xo > list to create a file. The python script can easily
> form a list of activities from this file.
> 
> Our primary goal must be to provide information and support for our users and
> prospective users. There is no reason for a user ever to know that there is an
> activity.info file or indeed an Activities folder. The original design 
> provides
> the information needed for Sugar to register and execute the activity within
> the activity.py framework. In this spirit, the repository link should join the
> website link on ASLO where it is visible to the user.
> 
> In the spirit of view source, wouldn't it be helpful to have documentation
> giving the  user a map of Sugar and the role of the various modules? This 
> could
> start with the information in activity.py. (/usr/lib/python2.7/site-packages/
> sugar3/activity/activity.py). This could lead in to James Simmons description
> of how to make a Sugar activity. The Hello World activity could be used as
> intended - as the simplest example. The problem with the wiki pages is not the
> mark up method but the organization and content.
> 
> Our priority task is to clean up ASLO. The activity version in ASLO needs to 
> be
> released from the github repository with a meaningful version number (an
> integer not a real number). The activities need to be tested to see that they
> work in the Ubuntu 18.04 environment as well as in 13.2.9. We need to have a
> clear picture of the activities which are not working and the cause. It may be
> necessary to have different versions for Ubuntu and for 13.2.9. As well there
> may have to be different versions for the Intel processors and the Arm
> processors. ASLO needs to be modified to accommodate that need. There are
> activities which probably should be dropped. The Java activity works well but
> is not an activity. It installs Java - a one-time execution.
> 
> We also need to remember that the XO has very limited storage. It is essential
> that the installed activity not be git enabled. Currently the Browse activity
> not only downloads and installs an activity, it leaves a copy of the bundle in
> the Journal. This doubles the storage cost of an activity. It burdens our user
> with the need to switch to the Journal and erase the bundle. As developers we
> need to ask what is the effect a proposed change have on the size of the
> installed activity. Currently 13.2.9 installed on an XO-1 or on a 2GB XO-1.5
> gives the user about 300MB of available storage.
> 
> Tony
> 
> On Monday, 07 May, 2018 02:42 AM, Vipul Gupta wrote:
> 
> Hi folks, 
> 
> We are just done with our second meeting, of the project Setting up the
> activity server and WikiPort. Do refer to the logs for the updates, all
> comments and suggestions are appreciated. The blog with the updates is
> going to be uploaded soon on my blog Mixster.
>  
> Logs are here 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Walter Bender]

On Sun, May 6, 2018 at 9:20 PM Tony Anderson  wrote:

> I read the log and didn't see any discussion of either an activity server
> or a WikiPort. Most of the discussion seems to focus on 'activity.info'.
>

This particular discussion was about activity.info because the student is
working on getting the activity server on line and cleaning up the
activity.info files is an essential step.

> I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt to provide
> a separate place for Sugar activity repositories based on
> download.sugarlabs.org/activities. The number of activities mentioned is
> consistent with the current content of ASLO. (see
> http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)
>

Yes. We have an on-going effort to migrate to a new activity server which
is both easier to maintain and a richer experience for our users.

> A simple python script can process the activity.info in activity bundles
> very quickly. Simply download every activity bundle and then use import
> zipfile to read the activity.info file and check it for whatever is
> interesting. I generally use ls -1 *.xo > list to create a file. The python
> script can easily form a list of activities from this file.
>

We are concerned about a number of inconsistencies with the data, including
license, summary, screen shots, etc.

> Our primary goal must be to provide information and support for our users
> and prospective users. There is no reason for a user ever to know that
> there is an activity.info file or indeed an Activities folder. The
> original design provides the information needed for Sugar to register and
> execute the activity within the activity.py framework. In this spirit, the
> repository link should join the website link on ASLO where it is visible to
> the user.
>

Yes. That is a feature of the new ASLO.

> In the spirit of view source, wouldn't it be helpful to have documentation
> giving the  user a map of Sugar and the role of the various modules? This
> could start with the information in activity.py.
> (/usr/lib/python2.7/site-packages/sugar3/activity/activity.py). This could
> lead in to James Simmons description of how to make a Sugar activity. The
> Hello World activity could be used as intended - as the simplest example.
>

We have a number of resources that explain how to make an activity. Making
it easier to find (and maintain) those resources is a good idea.

> The problem with the wiki pages is not the mark up method but the
> organization and content.
>

The problem with wiki pages is that they represent an additional burden of
maintenance.

> Our priority task is to clean up ASLO. The activity version in ASLO needs
> to be released from the github repository with a meaningful version number
> (an integer not a real number). The activities need to be tested to see
> that they work in the Ubuntu 18.04 environment as well as in 13.2.9. We
> need to have a clear picture of the activities which are not working and
> the cause. It may be necessary to have different versions for Ubuntu and
> for 13.2.9. As well there may have to be different versions for the Intel
> processors and the Arm processors. ASLO needs to be modified to accommodate
> that need. There are activities which probably should be dropped. The Java
> activity works well but is not an activity. It installs Java - a one-time
> execution.
>

Most of these issues are already addressed in the new ASLO.

> We also need to remember that the XO has very limited storage. It is
> essential that the installed activity not be git enabled. Currently the
> Browse activity not only downloads and installs an activity, it leaves a
> copy of the bundle in the Journal. This doubles the storage cost of an
> activity. It burdens our user with the need to switch to the Journal and
> erase the bundle. As developers we need to ask what is the effect a
> proposed change have on the size of the installed activity. Currently
> 13.2.9 installed on an XO-1 or on a 2GB XO-1.5 gives the user about 300MB
> of available storage.
>

This is independent of ASLO.

> Tony
>
>
>
> On Monday, 07 May, 2018 02:42 AM, Vipul Gupta wrote:
>
> Hi folks,
>
> We are just done with our second meeting, of the project Setting up the
> activity server and WikiPort. Do refer to the logs for the updates, all
> comments and suggestions are appreciated. The blog with the updates is
> going to be uploaded soon on my blog Mixster.
>
> *Logs are here* -
> http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/sugar-meeting/meetings/2018-05-06T16:43:50
> *Tracker (updated)* -
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VdzjA-DnEBh0ntHY17ktXlp7c2pIofq8458gSCTwiSM/edit?usp=sharing
>
> Happy Contributing !!
>
> Cordially,
> Vipul Gupta
> Mixster  | Github
> 
>
>
> ___
> Sugar-devel mailing 
> listSugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.orghttp://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>
>
> 

Re: [Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Tony Anderson]

I read the log and didn't see any discussion of either an activity 
server or a WikiPort. Most of the discussion seems to focus on 
'activity.info'.


I interpret https://github.com/sugar-activities as an attempt to provide 
a separate place for Sugar activity repositories based on 
download.sugarlabs.org/activities. The number of activities mentioned is 
consistent with the current content of ASLO. (see 
http://activities.sugarlabs.org/activities/)


A simple python script can process the activity.info in activity bundles 
very quickly. Simply download every activity bundle and then use import 
zipfile to read the activity.info file and check it for whatever is 
interesting. I generally use ls -1 *.xo > list to create a file. The 
python script can easily form a list of activities from this file.


Our primary goal must be to provide information and support for our 
users and prospective users. There is no reason for a user ever to know 
that there is an activity.info file or indeed an Activities folder. The 
original design provides the information needed for Sugar to register 
and execute the activity within the activity.py framework. In this 
spirit, the repository link should join the website link on ASLO where 
it is visible to the user.


In the spirit of view source, wouldn't it be helpful to have 
documentation giving the  user a map of Sugar and the role of the 
various modules? This could start with the information in activity.py. 
(/usr/lib/python2.7/site-packages/sugar3/activity/activity.py). This 
could lead in to James Simmons description of how to make a Sugar 
activity. The Hello World activity could be used as intended - as the 
simplest example. The problem with the wiki pages is not the mark up 
method but the organization and content.


Our priority task is to clean up ASLO. The activity version in ASLO 
needs to be released from the github repository with a meaningful 
version number (an integer not a real number). The activities need to be 
tested to see that they work in the Ubuntu 18.04 environment as well as 
in 13.2.9. We need to have a clear picture of the activities which are 
not working and the cause. It may be necessary to have different 
versions for Ubuntu and for 13.2.9. As well there may have to be 
different versions for the Intel processors and the Arm processors. ASLO 
needs to be modified to accommodate that need. There are activities 
which probably should be dropped. The Java activity works well but is 
not an activity. It installs Java - a one-time execution.


We also need to remember that the XO has very limited storage. It is 
essential that the installed activity not be git enabled. Currently the 
Browse activity not only downloads and installs an activity, it leaves a 
copy of the bundle in the Journal. This doubles the storage cost of an 
activity. It burdens our user with the need to switch to the Journal and 
erase the bundle. As developers we need to ask what is the effect a 
proposed change have on the size of the installed activity. Currently 
13.2.9 installed on an XO-1 or on a 2GB XO-1.5 gives the user about 
300MB of available storage.


Tony



On Monday, 07 May, 2018 02:42 AM, Vipul Gupta wrote:

Hi folks,

We are just done with our second meeting, of the project Setting up 
the activity server and WikiPort. Do refer to the logs for the 
updates, all comments and suggestions are appreciated. The blog with 
the updates is going to be uploaded soon on my blog Mixster.


*Logs are here* - 
http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/sugar-meeting/meetings/2018-05-06T16:43:50
*Tracker (updated)* - 
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VdzjA-DnEBh0ntHY17ktXlp7c2pIofq8458gSCTwiSM/edit?usp=sharing


Happy Contributing !!

Cordially,
Vipul Gupta
Mixster  | Github 




___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel


___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel

Re: [Sugar-devel] GSoC Project: Migration of Activities wiki-pages to GitHub

[James Cameron]

Yes, we do seem to be talking to ourselves.

The goal remains, though the mentors in that meeting didn't mention
it; give them some slack, they haven't been especially heavy
contributors to Sugar Labs.  Of the three mentors present, Divyanshu,
Onuwa, and Ibiam, only Ibiam has been a recently active contributor,
and not to the Wiki, Help activity or https://help.sugarlabs.org/

Re: Hello World.  It is a coding example, has no use otherwise, so it
should not be in activities.sugarlabs.org; I've disabled it.  Version
will be incremented when a release is made.  Repository has no release
tags.  We need an activity maintainer for it.  A checklist for
maintaining an activity is here;

https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar-docs/blob/master/src/contributing.md#checklist---maintainer

Across the activity set, we have very few activity maintainers.  This
will change as the GSoC coding period begins; particularly as Yash and
Rahul begin working.

Back on topic; Rudra's project has a purpose; it is a subset of
activity maintenance, but the coding is automation that will be used
_once_.  Possibly a brain-numbing exercise, akin to road construction
during the Irish potato famine.

I've been a reviewer for the pull requests so far; four of them just
now.  Mentors, Walter, Tony, and others could help by reviewing
Rudra's pull requests as they are made rather than leaving it to me.
;-)

@Rudra, my recommendation is to set an order of work; start with the
demonstration set of activities (Fructose), because we keep these
maintained well, then work on the activities that Tony has listed as
working with Ubuntu 18.04 or Thomas has listed as working with Fedora
28.

@Rudra, also think through the whole ecosystem from coding to user,
and propose changes to your project in response to your reading of
the current mailing list thread.  We're not expecting you to be a
compliant robot, but an imaginative student.  Situation reminds me of
something I saw in the student guide;

https://google.github.io/gsocguides/student/finding-the-right-project.html

"Don’t be that person: Cut and pasting an idea from the organization page and 
turning that in as your project’s description is a big no-no. You’ll be 
expected to research and submit your own ideas about how to accomplish the 
project your way, not just state the end result."

On Sun, May 06, 2018 at 10:44:06AM +0800, Tony Anderson wrote:
> Hi, Walter
> 
> Sadly, I saw no comment in the meeting that suggests the project includes this
> goal. As you know, a common outcome to GSOC projects is that they are not
> completed in the available time. Perhaps the project could be more explicit as
> an update to the help activity than as a migration of wiki pages to github.
> 
> Tony
> 
> On Sunday, 06 May, 2018 09:55 AM, Walter Bender wrote:
> 
> On Sat, May 5, 2018 at 9:04 PM Tony Anderson <[1]t...@olenepal.org> wrote:
> 
> SugarLabs is our site to communicate with our users and prospective
> users. GitHub is our site to support SugarLabs development. In this
> meeting it is pointed out that maintaining two versions of the
> wikipages will be difficult (obvious, since we are unable to maintain
> even one). The evil word 'deprecation' was used (I would have 
> preferred
> - improved). It is logical to maintain markdown pages describing the
> technical design of an activity (such as Browse or Turtle Blocks).
> However, we need documentation for users with screenshots showing the
> intended method of use and providing challenges to show advanced
> capabilities. ASLO needs more help to enable users to make informed
> decisions on which activities to download and install.
> 
> Our current direction seems to lead to us talking only to ourselves.
> 
> Part of this effort is to update/expand/improve the Help Activity. It 
> seems
> that this would make the documentation more rather than less accessible,
> especially for our users with limited internet access.
> 
> regards.
> 
> -walter 
> 
> Tony
> 
> On Friday, 04 May, 2018 10:54 PM, divyanshu rawat wrote:
> 
> *
> Hi Everyone,
> 
> We are done with our first meeting with Rudra Sadhu and he is 
> doing
> great.
> Here are the logs of today's meeting: [2]http://
> meeting.sugarlabs.org/sugar-meeting/meetings/2018-05-04T14:17:25.
> Please share your opinions and suggestions.
> And we will be doing the next meeting on next Friday at the same
> time 1600 CET.
>
> Best
> Divyanshu
> 
> ‌
> 
> On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 10:40 PM, divyanshu rawat <[3]
> divyanshu.r46...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I will be there to attend.
> 
> On Mon, 30 Apr 2018 at 10:38 PM, Onuwa Nnachi Isaac <[4]
> matrix4u2...@gmail.com> 

[Sugar-devel] Meeting #2 of the project Setting up activity server.

[Vipul Gupta]

Hi folks,

We are just done with our second meeting, of the project Setting up the
activity server and WikiPort. Do refer to the logs for the updates, all
comments and suggestions are appreciated. The blog with the updates is
going to be uploaded soon on my blog Mixster.

*Logs are here* -
http://meeting.sugarlabs.org/sugar-meeting/meetings/2018-05-06T16:43:50
*Tracker (updated)* -
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VdzjA-DnEBh0ntHY17ktXlp7c2pIofq8458gSCTwiSM/edit?usp=sharing

Happy Contributing !!

Cordially,
Vipul Gupta
Mixster  | Github

___
Sugar-devel mailing list
Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel