[Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
Forwarding to list -walter -- Forwarded message -- From: Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 3:27 PM Subject: sugar-jhbuild To: walter.ben...@gmail.com Cc: pau...@gmail.com, rgesthui...@gmail.com, costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au, billk...@gmail.com, joel.s...@gmail.com Walter, I was wondering, would it be possible to make a live CD with Linux and sugar jhbuild and the source code for a few activities all on it and use that for teachers and students to hack and test activities? Tony From: Bill Kerr Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 8:19 PM Subject: sugar-jhbuild To: Paul T , Tony Forster , Roland Gesthuizen , "Costello, Rob R" < costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au> http://magazine.redhat.com/2007/02/23/building-the-xo-introducing-sugar/ this (old) article explains what sort of thing sugar-jhbuild is and where the jh in the name comes from - the 3 paragraphs under the 'Sugar Basics' heading this looks to me to be a better way to go than using emulators but still not easy the not easy quirkiness is confirmed by reading this: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Sugar_with_sugar-jhbuild joel told me that he was making an activity using sugar-jhbuild but ran into some buggy issues that he couldn't solve even with the help of a couple of the developers -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
Tony, As far as running Jhbuild, I would look at http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/Jhbuild It is quite a bit more up to date then the resources you are looking at. Have you seen the work that the Sugar on a Stick people are doing at http://sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick ? It is basically a live CD of Sugar running on a USB stick instead of a Live CD. This gives the user the option of saving their work. On the other hand, burning the .iso found on the SoaS page should get you a working Sugar based liveCD. Caroline Meeks is heading up this effort. thanks david On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > Forwarding to list > > -walter > > > -- Forwarded message -- > From: > Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 3:27 PM > Subject: sugar-jhbuild > To: walter.ben...@gmail.com > Cc: pau...@gmail.com, rgesthui...@gmail.com, > costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au, billk...@gmail.com, > joel.s...@gmail.com > > > Walter, > > I was wondering, would it be possible to make a live CD with Linux and > sugar jhbuild and the source code for a few activities all on it and > use that for teachers and students to hack and test activities? > > Tony > > From: Bill Kerr > Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 8:19 PM > Subject: sugar-jhbuild > To: Paul T , Tony Forster , > Roland Gesthuizen , "Costello, Rob R" < > costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au> > > > http://magazine.redhat.com/2007/02/23/building-the-xo-introducing-sugar/ > > this (old) article explains what sort of thing sugar-jhbuild is and where > the jh in the name comes from - the 3 paragraphs under the 'Sugar Basics' > heading > > this looks to me to be a better way to go than using emulators but still not > easy > > the not easy quirkiness is confirmed by reading this: > http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Sugar_with_sugar-jhbuild > > joel told me that he was making an activity using sugar-jhbuild but ran into > some buggy issues that he couldn't solve even with the help of a couple of > the developers > > > > > > > > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org > ___ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:43 AM, David Farning wrote: > Tony, > > As far as running Jhbuild, I would look at > http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/Jhbuild It is quite a bit more > up to date then the resources you are looking at. > > Have you seen the work that the Sugar on a Stick people are doing at > http://sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick ? > > It is basically a live CD of Sugar running on a USB stick instead of a > Live CD. This gives the user the option of saving their work. > > On the other hand, burning the .iso found on the SoaS page should get > you a working Sugar based liveCD. > > Caroline Meeks is heading up this effort. > > thanks > david So is sugar on a stick a suitable development environment. Could it be used as an environment for minor hacking of say, turtle art and saving changes? My understanding is that since Sugar is written in Python and Python is an interpreted language then the answer to my question might be yes. Is there anything missing from sugar on a stick that developers who use sugar-jhbuild value and use regularly? Would a developer be inconvenienced in some way by using sugar on a stick? Are some version of sugar on a stick better or worse than others for say hacking turtle art? eg. as well as the official version there is Wolfgang Rohrmoser's version. Is that equivalent? Is there any advantage to using sugar-jhbuild, instead of sugar on a stick? For educators who are not developers using sugar on a stick looks more convenient. ie. to get sugar-jhbuild you need a linux computer, git and then sort through dependency problems as they arise. Bread and butter for developers but not everyones cup of tea. There are also technical complexities involved in using emulators with the added disadvantage that they might run slow. I'm aware that some developers of other software use IDEs such as Eclipse which contain a full suite of useful tools for development. I've never used Eclipse but have used briefly similar sorts of tools (well some of them) in Smalltalk / Squeak. That is the sort of distinction I'm inquiring about - but there may be other important distinctions that I'm not aware of - you don't know what you don't know. Our goal here is simply to put the toe in the water and be able to hack turtle art, as a starter. The blockage point identified here is a convenient way to obtain a developers environment. Known unknowns: All the things you know you don't know Unknown unknowns: All the things you don't know you don't know Errors: All the things you think you know but don't Unknown knowns: All the things you don't know you know Taboos: Dangerous, polluting or forbidden knowledge Denials: All the things too painful to know, so you don't > > > On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Walter Bender > wrote: > > Forwarding to list > > > > -walter > > > > > > -- Forwarded message -- > > From: > > Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 3:27 PM > > Subject: sugar-jhbuild > > To: walter.ben...@gmail.com > > Cc: pau...@gmail.com, rgesthui...@gmail.com, > > costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au, billk...@gmail.com, > > joel.s...@gmail.com > > > > > > Walter, > > > > I was wondering, would it be possible to make a live CD with Linux and > > sugar jhbuild and the source code for a few activities all on it and > > use that for teachers and students to hack and test activities? > > > > Tony > > > > From: Bill Kerr > > Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 8:19 PM > > Subject: sugar-jhbuild > > To: Paul T , Tony Forster , > > Roland Gesthuizen , "Costello, Rob R" < > > costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au> > > > > > > http://magazine.redhat.com/2007/02/23/building-the-xo-introducing-sugar/ > > > > this (old) article explains what sort of thing sugar-jhbuild is and where > > the jh in the name comes from - the 3 paragraphs under the 'Sugar Basics' > > heading > > > > this looks to me to be a better way to go than using emulators but still > not > > easy > > > > the not easy quirkiness is confirmed by reading this: > > http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Sugar_with_sugar-jhbuild > > > > joel told me that he was making an activity using sugar-jhbuild but ran > into > > some buggy issues that he couldn't solve even with the help of a couple > of > > the developers > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Walter Bender > > Sugar Labs > > http://www.sugarlabs.org > > ___ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 5:36 AM, Bill Kerr wrote: > So is sugar on a stick a suitable development environment. Could it be used > as an environment for minor hacking of say, turtle art and saving changes? > > My understanding is that since Sugar is written in Python and Python is an > interpreted language then the answer to my question might be yes. > > Is there anything missing from sugar on a stick that developers who use > sugar-jhbuild value and use regularly? Would a developer be inconvenienced > in some way by using sugar on a stick? For activity development sugar-jhbuild has *no* advantages at all over SoaS. Things are more complicated for core hacking, but that doesn't seem what you are looking into. Marco ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:36 PM, Bill Kerr wrote: > On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:43 AM, David Farning > wrote: >> >> Tony, >> >> As far as running Jhbuild, I would look at >> http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/Jhbuild It is quite a bit more >> up to date then the resources you are looking at. >> >> Have you seen the work that the Sugar on a Stick people are doing at >> http://sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick ? >> >> It is basically a live CD of Sugar running on a USB stick instead of a >> Live CD. This gives the user the option of saving their work. >> >> On the other hand, burning the .iso found on the SoaS page should get >> you a working Sugar based liveCD. >> >> Caroline Meeks is heading up this effort. >> >> thanks >> david > > So is sugar on a stick a suitable development environment. Could it be used > as an environment for minor hacking of say, turtle art and saving changes? SoaS is an ideal environment for learning. There is no way to damage the underlying system. All changes are saved on the USB stick. If you screw something up, you can just re-flash the USB and start with a fresh installation. It is very handy for experimentation. > My understanding is that since Sugar is written in Python and Python is an > interpreted language then the answer to my question might be yes. Yes, the user (budding developer) can hack at will on the activities. > Is there anything missing from sugar on a stick that developers who use > sugar-jhbuild value and use regularly? Would a developer be inconvenienced > in some way by using sugar on a stick? As marco pointed out, some of the core sugar pieces are written in C. Development of those portions of the stack would be harder to develop and test under sugar on a stick. Luckily, you can install jhbuild on SoaS:) The space constraints might get tight:( > Are some version of sugar on a stick better or worse than others for say > hacking turtle art? eg. as well as the official version there is Wolfgang > Rohrmoser's version. Is that equivalent? I would recommend using the official SoaS or distribution LiveCD. They are not necessarily better. But, they will have stronger support. > Is there any advantage to using sugar-jhbuild, instead of sugar on a stick? > For educators who are not developers using sugar on a stick looks more > convenient. ie. to get sugar-jhbuild you need a linux computer, git and then > sort through dependency problems as they arise. Bread and butter for > developers but not everyones cup of tea. There are also technical > complexities involved in using emulators with the added disadvantage that > they might run slow. > > I'm aware that some developers of other software use IDEs such as Eclipse > which contain a full suite of useful tools for development. I've never used > Eclipse but have used briefly similar sorts of tools (well some of them) in > Smalltalk / Squeak. That is the sort of distinction I'm inquiring about - > but there may be other important distinctions that I'm not aware of - you > don't know what you don't know. This is an interesting question. What editors would be available If you use SoaS? We will have to ask marco about that. The hacker editors are not going to be very good for dipping your toes in the code. david > Our goal here is simply to put the toe in the water and be able to hack > turtle art, as a starter. The blockage point identified here is a convenient > way to obtain a developers environment. > > > Known unknowns: All the things you know you don't know > Unknown unknowns: All the things you don't know you don't know > Errors: All the things you think you know but don't > Unknown knowns: All the things you don't know you know > Taboos: Dangerous, polluting or forbidden knowledge > Denials: All the things too painful to know, so you don't > > > > > >> >> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Walter Bender >> wrote: >> > Forwarding to list >> > >> > -walter >> > >> > >> > -- Forwarded message -- >> > From: >> > Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 3:27 PM >> > Subject: sugar-jhbuild >> > To: walter.ben...@gmail.com >> > Cc: pau...@gmail.com, rgesthui...@gmail.com, >> > costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au, billk...@gmail.com, >> > joel.s...@gmail.com >> > >> > >> > Walter, >> > >> > I was wondering, would it be possible to make a live CD with Linux and >> > sugar jhbuild and the source code for a few activities all on it and >> > use that for teachers and students to hack and test activities? >> > >> > Tony >> > >> > From: Bill Kerr >> > Date: Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 8:19 PM >> > Subject: sugar-jhbuild >> > To: Paul T , Tony Forster , >> > Roland Gesthuizen , "Costello, Rob R" < >> > costello.ro...@edumail.vic.gov.au> >> > >> > >> > http://magazine.redhat.com/2007/02/23/building-the-xo-introducing-sugar/ >> > >> > this (old) article explains what sort of thing sugar-jhbuild is and >> > where >> > the jh in the name comes from - the 3 paragraphs under the 'Sugar >> > Basics' >> > heading >>
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 4:26 PM, David Farning wrote: > This is an interesting question. What editors would be available If > you use SoaS? We will have to ask marco about that. The hacker > editors are not going to be very good for dipping your toes in the > code. Personally I find full IDE overkill for python (or at least, I didn't find one that provides all the cool tools that Eclipse provide for java). So I'm using gedit, which is pretty non-hacker friendly btw. Note that on SoaS you could just run an IDE/editor in GNOME, tweak/write code and run sugar in the Xephyr emulator to test. (I think the wiki has instructions on how to switch the default desktop to be GNOME). Marco ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
I find it's most effective to run Sugar in a VM or second machine (XO for example). Then I can use any editor I want (Komodo is my preference for Python) to remotely edit files over a SFTP connection. -Wade On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:37 AM, Marco Pesenti Gritti < marc...@sugarlabs.org> wrote: > On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 4:26 PM, David Farning > wrote: > > This is an interesting question. What editors would be available If > > you use SoaS? We will have to ask marco about that. The hacker > > editors are not going to be very good for dipping your toes in the > > code. > > Personally I find full IDE overkill for python (or at least, I didn't > find one that provides all the cool tools that Eclipse provide for > java). So I'm using gedit, which is pretty non-hacker friendly btw. > > Note that on SoaS you could just run an IDE/editor in GNOME, > tweak/write code and run sugar in the Xephyr emulator to test. (I > think the wiki has instructions on how to switch the default desktop > to be GNOME). > > Marco > ___ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: sugar-jhbuild
On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 5:28 PM, Wade Brainerd wrote: > I find it's most effective to run Sugar in a VM or second machine (XO for > example). Then I can use any editor I want (Komodo is my preference for > Python) to remotely edit files over a SFTP connection. Yeah, my point is that you can do the same on SoaS without the overhead of emulation or of a second machine... You do all the hacking inside GNOME and you run sugar-emulator (i.e. Xephyr). Marco ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Fwd: Sugar-jhbuild has lsb dependency but I am building on FreeBSD
-- Forwarded message -- From: outro pessoa Date: Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 1:38 AM Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-jhbuild has lsb dependency but I am building on FreeBSD To: James Cameron Everything's good. There was no source directory when I cloned the repository. On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 1:29 AM, James Cameron wrote: > On Thu, Feb 07, 2013 at 12:49:08AM -0500, outro pessoa wrote: > > I see that my problem was using gitorious in the command line. Sorry > > about that. > > Yes, Daniel gave you a clone command that required an account on > gitorious. This is probably best set up if you plan to contribute > patches, but is not necessary initially. > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
