subject:"Re\: \[Sugar\-devel\] \[SoaS\] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora\-Live\-SoaS\-i686\-21

Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-28 Thread Iain Brown Douglas

I am very sorry, Peter, that I did not realise that you had applied a
patch within 75 minutes of being made aware of it. Thank you for that.

More than one could expect from the most dedicated maintainer - a pity
you did not say though!

I mistakenly thought that your reply was, Before my time, Guv, the
opportunity to test a patch was now closing, and that your point:

The question is what does it do, and why when Speak has been
working for years does it suddenly break.

was still hanging in the air.

I regret that I made my comment terse in this respect: while I have
occasionally seen the issue:
Alice I don't know what you are talking about?, whenever I tried to
chase it down it disappeared.

So I had opened up all the SoaS media I have. I compared the change logs
of Speak with the release dates of SoaS. In every examined case, prior
to the excellent Speak-48, there was a new version of Speak shortly
after each new SoaS.

This meant that, on Software update, the missing 
/usr/share/sugar/activities/Speak.activity/bot in the sugar.iso
was replaced by ~/Activities/Speak.activity/bot and the issue was not
seen.

I went straight to a hare-brained solution, instead of just reporting
what I saw.

Iain

On Thu, 2014-11-27 at 11:23 +, Peter Robinson wrote:
  Assertion, limited testing, please contradict:
  Speak, Ask robot a question is broken in SoaS 1.00 
 
 1.00? What?
 
  It has been broken for several years, but is not seen because a Software
  update has been available which provides bot/ and functionality of Ask
  robot a question.
 
 It tends to help by reporting the problem several years ago.
 Ultimately SoaS as a distribution is a complex beast with 1000s of
 moving parts. Maintaining it is not part of my dayjob and I do it in
 the little free time I have available and while I do basic runtime
 testing of all the Activities it's impossible for me to test all
 functionality hence it's vital for people to report bugs so people
 like Gonzalo and myself can investigate and ensure issues are fixed.
 
  Please can we release Speak-49 to restore Ask robot a question
  functionality in SoaS 1.00 
 
 It has been restored and will be available in the Final SoaS 21 GA release.
 
  Please can we hold back Speak-49 from the closing SoaS deadline. This
  way a Speak-49 Software update will be available to fix SoaS pro temps.
 
 That would never happen, but it's also not a problem as the issue is
 now fixed and will land in the GA release.
 
 SoaS is released as part of the Fedora release cycle. While it's not
 perfect it provides us a lot of automated process which I don't need
 to deal with. It's a give and take situation and without it I wouldn't
 have the time to deal with a release process and hence wouldn't do
 SoaS. It also enables us with zero effort to produce SoaS images that
 will run on all sorts of devices from the biggest Intel laptops to
 cheap ARM devices.
 
  I have no way of knowing how sugar-speak.spec file affects XOs, so I
  cannot propose to alter sugar-speak.spec myself.
 
 It doesn't at all.
 
 Peter


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Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-28 Thread Iain Brown Douglas

I have run (on Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4)

sudo yum upgrade --enablerepo=updates-testing sugar*

In brief testing all good, no regressions seen - brief testing only, as
this is not on a *clean* install.

Iain

On Thu, 2014-11-27 at 07:16 -0300, Gonzalo Odiard wrote:
I think the spec was fixed by peter in sugar-speak 48-2

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1167791

On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 6:12 AM, Iain Brown Douglas
i...@browndouglas.plus.com wrote:
On Tue, 2014-11-25 at 14:56 +, Iain Brown Douglas wrote:
On Tue, 2014-11-25 at 13:09 +, Peter Robinson wrote:
On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Sebastian Silva
sebast...@somosazucar.org wrote:
btw it's sneaky to remove funcionality in a .spec file,
no?

No, it's not, it happens all the time. It might be that it
breaks in
certain situations, isn't re-distributable, causes
problems the
upstream maintainer won't fix or any number of other
reasons. What
ever the reason is it's historical and not documented, I
wouldn't
assume malice. It's likely because translations or similar
were broken
at the time. I mean we are talking the heady days of
Fedora 14 when it
was removed!

Peter

2014-11-25 7:46 GMT-05:00 Sebastian Silva
sebast...@somosazucar.org:
I added Alice and Sara (spanish bot) but was not aware
it was removed.
It certainly runs quite well in spanish XO1, as
deployed in Peru.
I was not aware of responsible for the removed
functionality nor was I
aware of any bugs related to it or performance.

Please add it back
Sebastian Silva
http://somosazucar.org/

2014-11-25 7:17 GMT-05:00 Peter Robinson
pbrobin...@gmail.com:
On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Gonzalo Odiard
godi...@sugarlabs.org wrote:

On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Robinson
pbrobin...@gmail.com
wrote:

On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 4:10 PM, Gonzalo Odiard
godi...@sugarlabs.org
wrote:
You find it. I don't know why the bot directory
should be deleted.
I cc to peter, who maintain the rpm.

It goes back long before I was the maintainer and
was previously
working. The question is what does it do, and why
when Speak has been
working for years does it suddenly break.

http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/sugar-speak.git/commit/?id=438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198

Just an observation, mainly from what I learned the past few
days,
rather than memory.

Alice's brain in Speak has mysteriously appeared and
disappeared for me
in SoaS.

I just ran a SoaS Coconut CD, with Speak-29 on it. No
functioning brain.
However I am guessing at the time I used it last, Speak
would have been
updated from ASLO, and as a Stick, the brain would have
been
functioning.

Iain

That patch removes the bots functionality. Looks like
was done to make the
activity
work on systems with small memory (XO-1, probably)
cc is Sebastian, the patch author, to check if this
is still needed.

I see 438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198
removes the bots directory,
_and_ apply the patch sugar-speak-no-aiml.patch, to
remove the need of the
bots data,
but right now, we are not applying that patch, then
would be better add the
bot directory again.

I suspect it was sufficiently long ago that Seb won't
remember the reason.

Ultimately we need to just sort it out here.

Assertion, limited testing, please contradict:
Speak, Ask robot a question is broken in SoaS 1.00

It has been broken for several years, but is not seen because
a Software
update has been available which provides bot/ and
functionality of Ask
robot a question.

Please can we release Speak-49 to restore Ask robot a
question
functionality in SoaS 1.00

Please can we hold back Speak-49 from the closing SoaS
deadline. This
way a Speak-49 Software update will be available to fix SoaS

Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-28 Thread Peter Robinson

On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 1:08 PM, Iain Brown Douglas
i...@browndouglas.plus.com wrote:
I have run (on Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4)

sudo yum upgrade --enablerepo=updates-testing sugar*

In brief testing all good, no regressions seen - brief testing only, as
this is not on a *clean* install.

Brilliant, and RC1 should be announced shortly with all the fixes
incorporated too :-)

Peter

On Thu, 2014-11-27 at 07:16 -0300, Gonzalo Odiard wrote:
I think the spec was fixed by peter in sugar-speak 48-2

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1167791

Peter

Please add it back
Sebastian Silva
http://somosazucar.org/

2014-11-25 7:17 GMT-05:00 Peter Robinson
pbrobin...@gmail.com:
On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Gonzalo Odiard
godi...@sugarlabs.org wrote:

On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Robinson
pbrobin...@gmail.com
wrote:

On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 4:10 PM, Gonzalo Odiard
godi...@sugarlabs.org
wrote:
You find it. I don't know why the bot directory
should be deleted.
I cc to peter, who maintain the rpm.

It goes back long before I was the maintainer and
was previously
working. The question is what does it do, and why
when Speak has been
working for years does it suddenly break.

http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/sugar-speak.git/commit/?id=438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198

Just an observation, mainly from what I learned the past few
days,
rather than memory.

Alice's brain in Speak has mysteriously appeared and
disappeared for me
in SoaS.

Iain

I suspect it was sufficiently long ago that Seb won't
remember the reason.

Ultimately we need to just sort it out here.

Assertion, limited testing, please contradict:
Speak, Ask robot a question is broken in SoaS 1.00

It has been broken for several years, but is not seen because
a Software
update has been available which provides bot/ and
functionality of Ask
robot a question.

Please can we release Speak-49 to restore Ask robot a
question
functionality in SoaS 1.00

Please can we

Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-27 Thread Gonzalo Odiard

I think the spec was fixed by peter in sugar-speak 48-2

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1167791

On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 6:12 AM, Iain Brown Douglas
i...@browndouglas.plus.com wrote:

On Tue, 2014-11-25 at 14:56 +, Iain Brown Douglas wrote:
On Tue, 2014-11-25 at 13:09 +, Peter Robinson wrote:
On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Sebastian Silva
sebast...@somosazucar.org wrote:
btw it's sneaky to remove funcionality in a .spec file, no?

No, it's not, it happens all the time. It might be that it breaks in
certain situations, isn't re-distributable, causes problems the
upstream maintainer won't fix or any number of other reasons. What
ever the reason is it's historical and not documented, I wouldn't
assume malice. It's likely because translations or similar were broken
at the time. I mean we are talking the heady days of Fedora 14 when it
was removed!

Peter

2014-11-25 7:46 GMT-05:00 Sebastian Silva sebast...@somosazucar.org
:
I added Alice and Sara (spanish bot) but was not aware it was
removed.
It certainly runs quite well in spanish XO1, as deployed in Peru.
I was not aware of responsible for the removed functionality nor
was I
aware of any bugs related to it or performance.

Please add it back
Sebastian Silva
http://somosazucar.org/

2014-11-25 7:17 GMT-05:00 Peter Robinson pbrobin...@gmail.com:
On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Gonzalo Odiard
godi...@sugarlabs.org wrote:

On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Robinson
pbrobin...@gmail.com
wrote:

On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 4:10 PM, Gonzalo Odiard
godi...@sugarlabs.org
wrote:
You find it. I don't know why the bot directory should be
deleted.
I cc to peter, who maintain the rpm.

It goes back long before I was the maintainer and was previously
working. The question is what does it do, and why when Speak has
been
working for years does it suddenly break.

http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/sugar-speak.git/commit/?id=438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198

Just an observation, mainly from what I learned the past few days,
rather than memory.

Alice's brain in Speak has mysteriously appeared and disappeared for me
in SoaS.

I just ran a SoaS Coconut CD, with Speak-29 on it. No functioning brain.
However I am guessing at the time I used it last, Speak would have been
updated from ASLO, and as a Stick, the brain would have been
functioning.

Iain

That patch removes the bots functionality. Looks like was done to
make the
activity
work on systems with small memory (XO-1, probably)
cc is Sebastian, the patch author, to check if this is still
needed.

I see 438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198 removes the bots
directory,
_and_ apply the patch sugar-speak-no-aiml.patch, to remove the
need of the
bots data,
but right now, we are not applying that patch, then would be
better add the
bot directory again.

I suspect it was sufficiently long ago that Seb won't remember the
reason.

Ultimately we need to just sort it out here.

Assertion, limited testing, please contradict:
Speak, Ask robot a question is broken in SoaS 1.00

It has been broken for several years, but is not seen because a Software
update has been available which provides bot/ and functionality of Ask
robot a question.

Please can we release Speak-49 to restore Ask robot a question
functionality in SoaS 1.00

Please can we hold back Speak-49 from the closing SoaS deadline. This
way a Speak-49 Software update will be available to fix SoaS pro temps.

I have no way of knowing how sugar-speak.spec file affects XOs, so I
cannot propose to alter sugar-speak.spec myself.

Iain
Peter

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SugarLabs - Software for children learning
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-25 Thread Peter Robinson

On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 4:10 PM, Gonzalo Odiard godi...@sugarlabs.org wrote:
You find it. I don't know why the bot directory should be deleted.
I cc to peter, who maintain the rpm.

It goes back long before I was the maintainer and was previously
working. The question is what does it do, and why when Speak has been
working for years does it suddenly break.

http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/sugar-speak.git/commit/?id=438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198

Gonzalo

On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 12:02 PM, Iain Brown Douglas
i...@browndouglas.plus.com wrote:

On Mon, 2014-11-24 at 12:28 +, Iain Brown Douglas wrote:
On Sun, 2014-11-23 at 19:15 +, Iain Brown Douglas wrote:
On Sat, 2014-11-22 at 00:52 -0300, Gonzalo Odiard wrote:

The folder bot/ and its contents were not in the
Speak.activity folder.

I deleted /usr/share/sugar/activities/Speak.activity/
I re-installed Speak by importing speak-48.xo with a USB
stick.
Alice is now running complete with brain.

Ok, that confirms the .xo is ok,
can you uninstall the activity again, and install the activity using
the rpm?
The rpm should be named sugar-speak

Same behaviour after:

sudo rpm -evv sugar-speak-48*

then

rpmbuild --rebuild -vv sugar-speak-48-1.fc21.src.rpm

Alice: I don't know what you are talking about

Directory bot/ is again missing
from /usr/share/sugar/activities/Speak.activity/

Two attachments,

1. Speak11-Action2_attach

This is the only mention that I found of the folder bot/ in the install
logs.

I cannot explain the line

+ rm -rf .0sugar bot

Until I read sugar-speak.spec - line 32.

Iain

2. I made SpeakContentReview in case it throws any light.

As I see it the differences are:
AUTHORS
bot/
po/
*.pyo

Environment, hard drive install from Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4.iso

Iain

Gonzalo

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Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-25 Thread Peter Robinson

On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Gonzalo Odiard godi...@sugarlabs.org wrote:


 On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Robinson pbrobin...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 4:10 PM, Gonzalo Odiard godi...@sugarlabs.org
 wrote:
  You find it. I don't know why the bot directory should be deleted.
  I cc to peter, who maintain the rpm.

 It goes back long before I was  the maintainer and was previously
 working. The question is what does it do, and why when Speak has been
 working for years does it suddenly break.


 http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/sugar-speak.git/commit/?id=438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198


 That patch removes the bots functionality. Looks like was done to make the
 activity
 work on systems with small memory (XO-1, probably)
 cc is Sebastian, the patch author, to check if this is still needed.

 I see 438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198 removes the bots directory,
 _and_ apply the patch  sugar-speak-no-aiml.patch, to remove the need of the
 bots data,
 but right now, we are not applying that patch, then would be better add the
 bot directory again.

I suspect it was sufficiently long ago that Seb won't remember the reason.

Ultimately we need to just sort it out here.

Peter
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-25 Thread Sebastian Silva

I added Alice and Sara (spanish bot) but was not aware it was removed.
It certainly runs quite well in spanish XO1, as deployed in Peru.
I was not aware of responsible for the removed functionality nor was I
aware of any bugs related to it or performance.

Please add it back
Sebastian Silva
http://somosazucar.org/

2014-11-25 7:17 GMT-05:00 Peter Robinson pbrobin...@gmail.com:
On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Gonzalo Odiard godi...@sugarlabs.org
wrote:

On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Peter Robinson pbrobin...@gmail.com
wrote:

On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 4:10 PM, Gonzalo Odiard godi...@sugarlabs.org
wrote:
You find it. I don't know why the bot directory should be deleted.
I cc to peter, who maintain the rpm.

It goes back long before I was the maintainer and was previously
working. The question is what does it do, and why when Speak has been
working for years does it suddenly break.

http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/sugar-speak.git/commit/?id=438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198

That patch removes the bots functionality. Looks like was done to make the
activity
work on systems with small memory (XO-1, probably)
cc is Sebastian, the patch author, to check if this is still needed.

I see 438f3796a85556873c5e45d6ba01ccfa558ca198 removes the bots directory,
_and_ apply the patch sugar-speak-no-aiml.patch, to remove the need of the
bots data,
but right now, we are not applying that patch, then would be better add the
bot directory again.

I suspect it was sufficiently long ago that Seb won't remember the reason.

Ultimately we need to just sort it out here.

Peter
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] Testing Sugar Activities Fedora-Live-SoaS-i686-21_Beta-4

2014-11-25 Thread Sebastian Silva

btw it's sneaky to remove funcionality in a .spec file, no?
Sebastian Silva
http://somosazucar.org/

2014-11-25 7:46 GMT-05:00 Sebastian Silva sebast...@somosazucar.org:
I added Alice and Sara (spanish bot) but was not aware it was removed.
It certainly runs quite well in spanish XO1, as deployed in Peru.
I was not aware of responsible for the removed functionality nor was I
aware of any bugs related to it or performance.