Re: [Sursound] Ghost in Machine
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but this sounds completely normal to me. The artifacts are simply side effects of starting playback of recorded speech from the middle of a word. Is this situation going to present itself to a person using a hearing aid? I mean does the device itself act as a noise gate? -- with best wishes, John ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
Re: [Sursound] Ghost in Machine
Hi John, Thanks for writing. No, this isn't at all like playing speech from middle of a word or music. Certainly beginning a recording from a waveform that would have abrupt onset would result in a pop or click. Have you listened to the file? I deleted the first 4 s, added a 50 ms fade-in, and the impulse sound is still there. But if you begin the wav file from the beginning, there is no artifact. The impulse-like sound (more gunshot sounding--actually sound of IR itself) is quite loud sounding, though there's no noticeable change in amplitude of waveform. That's why I use loud in lieu of intense--it's perceptual. If you take the normal (dry) speech or natural speech recorded in same room where the IR was recorded, no such artifact exists. You might get a small click or pop at middle of waveform--this, again, is normal and equivalent to playing, say, a cosine wave from beginning (big click because of abrupt rise time). Please listen to file if you cand download it. Use any generic wave editor (I use Audition because of big visual and easy to use) and move cursor to various parts of file. The impulse is there--almost everywhere--but only in the processed recording. Again, many thanks for writing. Kind regards and Happy Holidays, Eric From: John Abram johnbab...@gmail.com To: Eric Carmichel e...@elcaudio.com; Surround Sound discussion group sursound@music.vt.edu Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 6:50 AM Subject: Re: [Sursound] Ghost in Machine Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but this sounds completely normal to me. The artifacts are simply side effects of starting playback of recorded speech from the middle of a word. Is this situation going to present itself to a person using a hearing aid? I mean does the device itself act as a noise gate? -- with best wishes, John -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20121215/cc43824a/attachment.html ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
[Sursound] Ghost in Machine--quick Addendum
Hi John, Again, thanks for writing. Questions and comments always make me think harder because I often realize that I didn't state my question/problem accurately. You have a good point regarding gating. This is often evident to hearing aid users if settings are too abrupt (expansion seems to work better than gating for minimizing some noise). In my case, I use recorded speech and noise stimuli in research. Hearing-loss and cochlear implant simulators are often used so that I can use normal-hearing listeners as research participants. The stimuli may sound natural to normal-hearing listeners. There's often the problem of conditioned listening/hearing (sound design for movies depends on this) versus critical listening. We expect things to sound a certain way. In the case of my auralized (better stated as processed) recordings, the artifacts aren't heard--at least not to the normal ear. But if somethng is peculiar about the recording (such as is the case of mp3 files--this relies on psychoacoustics, too), then we can't say it replicates real-world listening even if it sounds good or is very hi-fi. Actual recordings with a Soundfield mic don't present the curious artifact. Creating the physical reconstruction of a wave field at the listener's head is ideal--and why I got started on Ambisonics. My IR-processed recordings sound ok--so long as they're played from the beginning of the file. But the artifact clearly indicates there's something very unnatural about the stimuli. Although it can be ignored by normal-hearing persons, I have no idea how the hearing-impaired (to include central auditory processing, not just sensorineural loss) might perceive the wav files--even when played from the start. Anyway, everyone's input is always welcome. I hope my previous note and this post help clarify my question/concern. I'm still learning--and this means learning to formulate questions in understandable ways. I'm very appreciative of people's time and expertise. Thanks and Happy Holidays, Eric From: John Abram johnbab...@gmail.com To: Eric Carmichel e...@elcaudio.com; Surround Sound discussion group sursound@music.vt.edu Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 6:50 AM Subject: Re: [Sursound] Ghost in Machine Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but this sounds completely normal to me. The artifacts are simply side effects of starting playback of recorded speech from the middle of a word. Is this situation going to present itself to a person using a hearing aid? I mean does the device itself act as a noise gate? -- with best wishes, John -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20121215/461b8332/attachment.html ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
Re: [Sursound] Ghost in Machine
On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 08:20:49AM -0800, Eric Carmichel wrote: No, this isn't at all like playing speech from middle of a word or music. Certainly beginning a recording from a waveform that would have abrupt onset would result in a pop or click. To me it sounds as the normal reverb tail. Which you don't notice when the sound that caused it is included, as it sounds natural in that case. There may be another issue, but to determine this I'd need the 2 seconds B-format room IR you used. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
Re: [Sursound] Ghost in Machine
Hi Eric On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 08:20:49AM -0800, Eric Carmichel wrote: No, this isn't at all like playing speech from middle of a word or music. Certainly beginning a recording from a waveform that would have abrupt onset would result in a pop or click. To me it sounds as the normal reverb tail. Which you don't notice when the sound that caused it is included, as it sounds natural in that case. Sounds like that to me too. You would expect to hear the lmpulse response anyway with any sound that has a peak - Tom for instance. Of course if the T is present you don't hear it. But what I find strange is that there is a kind of low-mid sweep sound just after the bang Like a car going past outside. Most strange! best, Justin Justin Bennett van der Duynstraat 61A 2515 NG Den Haag The Netherlands +31-703893912 jus...@justinbennett.nl http:://www.justinbennett.nl NEW RELEASES AND FREE DOWNLOADS FROM http://spore.soundscaper.com ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
Re: [Sursound] Ghost in Machine
On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 07:12:35PM +0100, Justin Bennett wrote: To me it sounds as the normal reverb tail. Which you don't notice when the sound that caused it is included, as it sounds natural in that case. Sounds like that to me too. You would expect to hear the lmpulse response anyway with any sound that has a peak - Tom for instance. Of course if the T is present you don't hear it. But what I find strange is that there is a kind of low-mid sweep sound just after the bang Like a car going past outside. Most strange! Exactly the same description I gave it, very obvious on the noise example. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
Re: [Sursound] a quick tutorial video on how to create an impulse response
Hello, This tool set is great, thank you very much. Is there an email or mailing list where to ask technical questions related to these Tools? I'm testing it using the irreverence~ object for matching microphones and was wondering about the reverb effect that I get when using low smoothing values. Thanks! Hector On 2012-12-12, at 9:50 AM, Pierre Alexandre Tremblay tremb...@gmail.com wrote: Dear all Thanks to Rodrigo Constanzo we have the first video tutorial of how to use and abuse the fruit of the HIRT (the HISS Impulse Response Toolbox). This time round, it is the basic use of capturing an impulse response with some of the tools for MaxMSP. Feel free to watch it here: https://vimeo.com/55440630 The paper and all the externals are still available here: http://eprints.hud.ac.uk/14897/ Let us know what you think! p ps for those who prefer youtube, it will soon be up there too! ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
[Sursound] Plate Reverb rocks
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